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Vice President Mike Pence Says Google Should Halt Dragonfly App Development (reuters.com)
On Thursday, the U.S. Vice President Mike Pence weighed in on Dragonfly, a project run by Google to build a censored search engine app for China. He said Dragonfly app would make it easier to track someone's internet searches. From a report: Pence said in a speech that business leaders are now thinking twice before entering the Chinese market "if it means turning over their intellectual property or abetting Beijing's oppression." He added, "More must follow suit. For example, Google should immediately end development of the 'Dragonfly' app that will strengthen Communist Party censorship and compromise the privacy of Chinese customers."
As long as that involves a direct order banning illegal bulk collection of data and weakening of any encryption.
It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
No government should trust them, they are inherently compromised by the Chinese government.
and apple should give info to the FBI like they do in China
rather than any principled stance. I base that on what little I can find on his voting record.
Still, the GOP has been pretty pro-surveillance (not that the Dems have been helping in that regard, even Bernie's voted on the wrong side at times). Still, he's back in line. Maybe Pence is. Does anyone have any recent discussion on Pence's stance on stuff like warrantless wiretapping?
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AHAHAHAHAHAHAH you think it's better where you live???
Uh huh, sure ... all while being required to help with US domestic spying.
This isn't a stand of principle, this is saying it's OK to be evil for us, but not for someone else.
And think they can use it to track his Handmaid's Tale fanfic pr0n searches.
"Oh my God. This is terrible. This is the end of my Presidency. I'm fucked."; ~ Donald J. Trump
Come on, let's get serious.
The USA has some problems, sure, as do every country. But China is its own level of insane. Censoring half the Web, locking away anyone who believe anything beside communist propaganda, no access to foreign media, blocking vpn websites, torturing falun gong and other religious group, it's absolute bullshit. Also messing with the stability of the region with the south China Sea claims and fucking up Hong Kong and Taiwan to try and turn them into commie States. And that's not even Co sideline the trade war and the new Chinese spy chips discovered in foreign servers.
Fuck China. I love Chinese culture but there is no culture left in China, now only brainwashing and lies.
AHAHAH? Why are you screaming?
A leader belonging to a political party who opposes government rules and Regulations on businesses.
Is trying to stop a Business from making and selling a product.
Because the customer is a country that tries to influence companies to make and not make particular products and services.
So he is either a Hypocrite because he is pushing political pressure on a business while he stands for the idea there is too much political pressure on companies.
Or he is a Hypocrite because he is trying to use political pressure to stop a company from doing an action managed by political pressures.
Or is it he is just annoyed that a LiBeRaL California company is still doing business even during a trade war. Because the Chinese Government was smarter then the Trump Administration, and counteracted tarrifs only on products sold by people who would vote for them.
If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
Yeah, keep wishing princess.
I wonder how Pence feels about technology that would allow a political leader to push instant messages onto every single cellular device, allowing citizens no ability to opt out.
But since he supported giving electro-shock to homosexuals to "cure" them, I think we have a pretty good idea.
You are welcome on my lawn.
Seriously, they just don't.
They'll happily fork all their email over to Google, let Facebook mine the everloving shit out of their lives, run everybody's tracking scripts all around the web, put an Amazon Alexa in their bedroom, and install spyware on their phones in exchange for a $0.50 discount on coffee.
Snowden came along and showed them how much was being collected of their communications, but what did they do? They went right along supporting the companies cooperating with the NSA. They went right along putting Facebook on their phones. They went right along sending unencrypted email.
And you expect them to care about Google collecting personal data about people in China's searches? They don't even care about Google strip-mining THEIR OWN searches.
Look I hate it but this horse left the barn a long time ago. People don't give a shit about privacy. Not theirs, and not some poor guy's in China.
Cant have Google do what the Gov wants to do.
http://progressquest.com/spoltog.php?name=Son+Of+Son+Of+DarkRookie
Since when is the US government against tracking of users on the internet. If that were the case they would discontinue their Facebook site.
Saudi Arabia scores considerably lower when it comes to freedom than China (by aggregate score):
https://freedomhouse.org/repor...
I mean, women were just allowed to drive in 2018:
https://www.npr.org/2018/06/24...
But they are a favored trade partner focusing on two way oil for weapons deals.
So we arm nations that oppress their citizens more than China. In 2017, Trump signed a $110 billion military sale agreement with Saudi Arabia:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
What's this about internet censorship? Oh, Saudi Arabia used Secure Computing, a US corporation, to manage country wide internet monitoring and filtering, not just search.
But oil (and our incessant fear of Iran)...
BlameBillCosby.com
If Google doesn't build their Censor-A-Matic, some other non-US company will likely fill that niche. How is that better? The Chinese gov't will get their desired censorship engines one way or another because they want it and they control China.
Table-ized A.I.
... and compromise the privacy of Chinese customers."
WHAT ABOUT AMERICA FIRST?
It little behooves the best of us to comment on the rest of us.
they still have Most Favored Nation Status from the US...
I don't think it's that the US is any better than China, it's just that we're wealthier and so our ruling class doesn't have to bother with that sort of thing to keep the working class in line. Go back 50 years and read up on what we did to Unions though. It's the same stuff China's doing. We didn't stop doing that stuff because we became better people, we shipped the factories where that stuff happens overseas.... That didn't really solve the problem of oppression, it just moved it out of sight, out of mind.
At the end of the day we're all just people, and we're all a week's worth of food away from savagery. The best solution is always to make it so that nobody's getting to that point.
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Right moron, cause Meuler givrs Pence daily updates, Pence knows theyâ(TM)re near. The mind boggles.
Hello,
this is an adult talking,
we, the adults, can hold more than 1 thought in our highly advanced brains,
therefore it's possible to value INDIVIDUAL freedom AND freedom for Businesses and to try to find some practical(REAL-WORLD) status quo.
best regards!
You know it is the dumbasses like you is the reason why we have the term "Fake News" it is all propaganda. I've talked to a lot of people that vote democratic for years, including people voting for Bernie. All of them say that they had no influence from the "Russians" and voted Trump because they in their hearts could not vote for Hillary, and this included my own mom. My own older brother said he voted for Trump because he hated how the democrats pushed out Bernie with "Fake News"
Your Fake News is just regarded as lies and is immediately dismissed as such now. You will only get to see Trump impeached in your wet dreams.
I highly recommend Kishore Mahbubani's Long Now Foundation Talk on China. I am not the expert of eastern geo-politics that he is, so I have no idea if his thinking is correct or not, but it's very interesting.
He states that China's move to democracy is almost inevitable, but it will take a long time. He said that Chinese officials saw what happened with the collapse of communism in the Soviet Union, going briefly into democracy before Russia emerged with totalitarianism and Putin. They don't want to go down that road. But it's clear that there are many democratic reforms happening in China right now. It's not the China I grew up learning about in the 70's and 80's, and the people of that country are benefiting from those reforms.
All of that said, they are still a very long way away from what most of us would deem as acceptable when it comes to human rights. I think in 50 years though, China will look very different from both inside and outside their borders.
I'm sorry, but your opinion seems to be wrong.
Any self-respecting conservative will tell Pence to fuck off and let the free market (aka the shareholders) decide what's best for Google.
Not to mention there is a whole generation of Chinese that have no families. No brothers or sisters, aunts and uncles, or cousins. Their family is the Communist State. I urge the Chinese to overthrow the Communist Dictatorship.
You forgot Tibet, and the ongoing destruction of Tibetan Buddhism.
Fuck China. I love Chinese culture but there is no culture left in China, now only brainwashing and lies.
That was Mao's direct intention: destroy all traditional Chinese culture, along with the traditions. Everything within the state, nothing outside the state, nothing against the state. He created China's "Lost Generation", by encouraging students to kill all their teachers, then shipping all the educated youth off to farms, breaking all methods by which culture is transmitted across civilizations.
Turns out "no culture" is a bad thing, as anything beyond sociopathy must be learned, and China got a generation of short-sighted greed, pettiness, and poor impulse control (the Baby Boomers have nothing on those guys). Pretty much the opposite of how communes are supposed to work, ironically enough.
Meanwhile, all over the Chinese countryside you'll find crumbling buildings that were once wonderful temples and the like, but no one cares to maintain since Mao (or at least no one with the resources).
Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
In China the free press is considered an enemy of the state. In the USA the free press is considered an enemy of the state.
This is just too hard to believe. While it's easy to believe people would vote against Clinton, it's just too much of a coincidence that so many of them just happened to pick Trump out of all the other names on the ballot.
Your mom showed wisdom in voting agisnt Hillary and in the same breath you imply she's so overwhelmingly stupid as to vote Trump? Get your story straight! You're implying she wanted to vote against corruption, and so she solved the problem by voting for even more corruption. Uh huh. Suure, that's believable. Tell us more about the weird oxymoronic situations that your mom happens to find herself in, and how people who don't believe in such far-fetched scenarios must be reading "fake news" subreddits.
Pence voted for the Patriot Act. That tells me all I have to know about his concerns over privacy.
I basically consider everyone who voted for it a criminal. I know they'll never be prosecuted for such an action but I can at least sentence them to life without my vote. This includes Hillary (but not Bernie.)
Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of congress. But then I repeat myself. -- Mark Twain
If you believe Google will only use Dragonfly in China... Now raise you hand if you think Google will use Dragonfly in other territories as well.
Do you think Google's going to develop search surveillance tech, like what's in Dragonfly, and and use it only where they are forced to?
I don't think so...
Google's involvement with catering to China's oppressive regulations only underscores their hypocrisy. They try to beat the drum of moral virtue and social justice at home, but they're willing to sell out freedom abroad to make a buck. Google, as huge as they are and as pervasive as their services have become, is missing out on a golden opportunity to take a stand and do something about real life actual tyranny but rather than risking some profit, they'd prefer to sell out abroad and just play along crying about Trump to give fools here in the US the false impression that they actually give a shit.
You mean when they got rid of serfdom and slavery in Tibet?
You aint surviving Trump's fall motherlover!
I don't believe that for a minute. Unless there's a revolution, China will keep getting more and more closed. Their leader is consolidating more and more power and they are restricting more and more media and websites. They are also spreading their influence around the world, trying to rewrite event like tianment out of your history books. They also now have high tech solutions, like facial recognition cameras everywhere to control their population, and a whole population addicted to WeChat and baidu so they are being monitor 24/u...
> determine if Pence can pardon Trump for state crimes
Why would Pence do that? Pence believes that God told him he would be President. Trump is the only one standing in the way of his destiny. Then he can bring about The Rapture that he desires.
Aww, feeling left out that we're all talking about Russian trolls? Afraid we've forgotten about hard-working Chinese trolls? Don't worry, Slashdot remembers.
DragonflyBSD is cool. I hate how Google likes to take names from other projects without even looking. Then they do some kind of shitty manuever like this and folks think "That sucks!" Well, DragonflyBSD doesn't suck. It's HAMMER file system is very functional and has cutting edge features.
it's got to do with external factors. We're all one race: human. Human beings are the same all over. What's not the same is our neighbors, food supply and natural resources. The US has two weak neighbors resulting in little risk of invasion. Is it any wonder we're more individualistic? We can afford to be since we're not under constant threat of invasion. Meanwhile China spent centuries fighting off Mongol hoards (often losing). They needed a more top/down authoritarian system with stronger connections to band together for survival.
People are people. There's nothing special about one group of them. American Exceptionalism is a myth. We're just the ones that survived WWII intact and got nukes first. If Einstein's dad got that deal in Munich to go through we might all be speaking German right now.
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You lack it. Would definitely recommend trying to obtain some.
The party thinks, basically, that Washington politicians too often force people do things, or make things illegal. Republicans generally would oppose a federal law making it a federal crime to hit your thumb with a hammer.
Most Republicans would suggest that hitting your thumb is a bad idea, and would say you shouldn't do that. I think you should avoid doing that != we should make it a federal crime.
I think this is a good idea != the federal government should force everybody to do this.
Pence said Google shouldn't help with human rights abuseses in China. He did not propose a federal law making it illegal to provide services in China.
This is as opposed to Democrats, who don't so much make that distinction. Democrats are more keen on the government forcing you to do whatever Nancy Pelosi wants you to do.
The difference is that China normally contains their level of insane within their own nation, and doesn't export it. US on the other hand exports their level of insane and destabilizes many parts of the world. Which nation has caused more suffering to the world over the last few decades?
When this Administration does something good, I find myself deeply confused. Was it an accident? Did Pence and Trump fight and this was Pence's way of getting revenge? Did Pence fight with his wife and come to work flustered? Did Pence accidentally drink regular instead of decaf coffee and get all chippy?
And then I think, "No, this is another Trump Copenhagen moment." He will eventually release a statement saying that, "In a recent statement I left out a word. Google should immediately not end development of the 'Dragonfly' app. They should not end development. I think that clears that up."
We then parse the new statement, coming to a mind-boggling array of different and often contradictory explanations. The result being that we are all still confused, but a different kind of confused!
Sorry you got to provide more evidence than just "What about Tibet!". I mean actual analysis, and not simply some crap from outlets like HRW or RFA. But the getting rid of serfdom and slavery is true. Even the Dalai Lama admits there was much in the previous Tibetan society that needed to change.
Sure thing Vlad. If you expect any of us to believe anyone actually voted for Trump you just reveal yourself to be yet another Russian troll.
Fact: Nobody actually voted for Trump because that would be so stupid. Anything you see suggesting Trump is the POTUS is just Russian propoganda fake news amplified by Russian trolls.
As little as 100 years ago we had all the problems China had except mass surveillance, and the only reason we didn't have that is that telecom didn't really exist 100 years ago. Workers were barely paid and worked 60+ hours a week and if you complained you were murdered. This is all pretty well documented. What changed was after WWII American workers had solidarity. Just about everyone fought or lost someone in the war. Plus losing several million working age men helped thin the herd.
But what did _not_ change is human nature. We're no more or less human than the Chinese. That goes for all the flaws everybody has. We're not better than than Chinese, and if we're not careful then as soon as money gets a bit tighter the ruling elite will come down on the working class. The real one, e.g. the billionaire class, not the "elites" Fox News talks about in the form of scientists, teachers and professors...
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why in the name of God do people forget America's history so easily? It's not like it's hard to find out in a post internet age. Do we really need to cling to that happy world were Columbus discovered America, George Washington didn't own slaves and the railroads weren't built in conditions worse than slave labor? What do we think that'll get us?
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the Dems have some stinkers in their party (Pelosi & Schumer especially) but there's a core there that's salvageable. I can't say the same for the GOP.
That's not blind hate either. I've got pretty solid evidence to back it up. I can't name a single GOP candidate who refuses corporate PAC money. They killed Net Neutrality first chance they got. Their health care system almost killed a buddy of mine who's type-I diabetic (they took away his insulin, literally because they didn't want to pay for it, and he only got it back when Obamacare kicked in and Obama threatened to pull the old people's Medicare money if Medicaid wasn't funded). Their pointless wars have left my country in massive debt. And they just let PR twist in the wind for politics.
Over and over again the GOP screws me and mine. The Dems occasionally stand up for me and mine when they're not getting bought off by mega corps. The GOP is objectively in favor of the mega corps every step of the way. I'm sorry man, but there comes a time when you need to face facts. Both sides are not the same. One is objectively worse. And as funny as the "Vote Cthulhu" bumper sticker is it's not really a sound voting strategy...
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while also following the Trump party line of blaming the local government.
We're talking about an island of 3 million vs the United States Government. The US Gov'ts response should have dwarfed any mistakes made by local staff. It didn't because, well, we put people in charge who don't believe in government. So they screw it up. Badly. The only reason they didn't screw up in Florida is that's a swing state and nobody fucks with a swing state, so their usual chronyism gets put on the back burner.
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I hate Chinese on a racial basis alone. Those slanty rice eyes and rice bowl haircuts and the ching chong chung lingo turn my stomach.