Internal Documents Show Apple Is Capable of Implementing Right to Repair Legislation (vice.com)

A leaked internal document outlines a program that looks almost exactly like the requirements of right to repair legislation that has been proposed in 20 states. From a report: As Apple continues to fight legislation that would make it easier for consumers to repair their iPhones, MacBooks, and other electronics, the company appears to be able to implement many of the requirements of the legislation, according to an internal presentation obtained by Motherboard. According to the presentation, titled "Apple Genuine Parts Repair" and dated April 2018, the company has begun to give some repair companies access to Apple diagnostic software, a wide variety of genuine Apple repair parts, repair training, and notably places no restrictions on the types of repairs that independent companies are allowed to do. The presentation notes that repair companies can "keep doing what you're doing, with ... Apple genuine parts, reliable parts supply, and Apple process and training."

This is, broadly speaking, what right to repair activists have been asking state legislators to require companies to offer for years. "This looks to me like a framework for complying with right to repair legislation," Kyle Wiens, CEO of iFixit and a prominent member of the right to repair movement, told me on the phone. "Right now, they are only offering it to a few megachains, but it seems clear to me that it would be totally possible to comply with right to repair."

Comments

It's the lack of upgrades

[WillAffleckUW]

The Apple biosystem requires you replace your devices periodically. Opening them up to repair lets you buy non-Apple components, non-Apple batteries, and makes it highly likely you won't pay $10,000 for a computer or $1000 for a phone every two years.

Can they do it? Sure.

They have no economic incentive to do so.

Re:It's the lack of upgrades

[Anonymous Coward]

The Apple biosystem requires you replace your devices periodically. Opening them up to repair lets you buy non-Apple components, non-Apple batteries, and makes it highly likely you won't pay $10,000 for a computer or $1000 for a phone every two years.

Can they do it? Sure.

They have no economic incentive to do so.

Periodically? My 2012 i7-enabled Mac Mini has an SSD drive and 16GB of RAM, and is still receiving the latest OS updates just fine, and shows no signs of slowing down. This has far more to do with repairing hardware that is still fully capable of being supported, and recognizing that 3rd party repair shops can be trained and supplied with authentic repair parts.

Hell, Apple isn't even in the business of repair work. Go ahead. Try and convince them to give you a reasonable price to repair your broken hardware. You'll be staring at a quote that's 90% the cost of new hardware.

Re:It's the lack of upgrades

[Anonymous Coward]

Then why do Apple smartphone users need to replace their phones much less frequently?

The 5s was launched In September of 2013 and still receives updates.

Are there any five and a half year old android phones that still receive manufacturer updates? Are there any that continue to get updates after even 2?

Re:It's the lack of upgrades

[Anonymous Coward]

False. Still have a iphone 5s and a 2013 macbook pro. Still getting updates. Battery life is still good.

Re:It's the lack of upgrades

[Nidi62]

Hell, Apple isn't even in the business of repair work. Go ahead. Try and convince them to give you a reasonable price to repair your broken hardware. You'll be staring at a quote that's 90% the cost of new hardware.

That....kind of proves his point. Apple doesn't want you repairing devices. If you have a 2-3 year old device and the repair cost is 80-90% of the price of a new one, most people are just going to bite the bullet and buy a new one. This is especially beneficial for iPhones where most people turn in their old device for a new one and Apple can refurbish the old device (very cheaply given how low the cost of the components really are) and resell it as a refurb or internationally for additional profit.

Re:It's the lack of upgrades

[Nidi62]

Then why do Apple smartphone users need to replace their phones much less frequently?

The 5s was launched In September of 2013 and still receives updates.

Are there any five and a half year old android phones that still receive manufacturer updates? Are there any that continue to get updates after even 2?

The 5s might still receive updates, but how many current 5s owners are the original owners of that device? Apple takes in so many trade-ins to sell as refurbs or other markets that it is in their best interest to keep them up to date. If you can sell the same device 2 or 3 times with production cost covered at the original sale and at only marginal cost after that, you're into almost pure profit.

Re:It's the lack of upgrades

[jellomizer]

Having done vendor certified repair of electronics in the past. I remember a lot of cases of bad repair jobs and people cheeping out that really put the equipment in much worse case then the original problem. A cheap ebay replacement battery, or power supply that saved the guy $20 off the part, ended up costing an addition $500 for a repair, because the power on the 3rd party device was way off, and damaged a lot of expensive components, or lacked the fuses/safety devices that would protect from further damage.
What often makes it worse is when the guy brings us the broken equipment then just lies about the fact they had replaced it with a 3rd party part, and voided warranty. What makes it worse, is the fact that we state that it isn't under warranty, and they think we just want to do this because we get paid more. While the truth is doing Warranty repair is better for the business, because the company is timely in paying and we don't need to fight to get our payments, also most of the business was B2B having to do single customer fixes, we try to lower our rates a bit just to avoid negative reviews, as we don't expect them to come back again.

Now when the person fixes the problem them-self, and an other problem goes bad, then they will bad mouth the product, because they broke it further.

Re:It's the lack of upgrades

[Anubis IV]

The 5s might still receive updates, but how many current 5s owners are the original owners of that device?

*raises hand*

I'm still using my same iPhone 5s from 2013. I even just updated to the latest version of iOS earlier this week. The battery has never been replaced (iFixit sells a kit for $30, but I haven't bothered with it), so its charge only lasts about a day with light usage at this point. In every other regard, however, it's still doing well. It's slower than the newer devices in our household, as you'd expect, but its performance is surprisingly decent considering it's coming up on 6 years old. My previous two smartphones felt significantly more sluggish after far less time: my iPhone 3G lasted me just 2 years before its performance was rubbish, and my iPhone 4 made it just a hair further to 3 years. This one still feels snappy compared to how those two felt when I replaced them.

I do intend to upgrade this year, and I have the money set aside to do so, but the same was true last year and the year before, so we'll see what actually happens.

Re:It's the lack of upgrades

[Anonymous Coward]

That....kind of proves his point. Apple doesn't want you repairing devices.

Nice try, twisting the GP's words like that.

Apple, like many companies, really doesn't want to be BOTHERED with Repair work. It doesn't fit into their normal business workflow, short-circuits normal distribution channels, and despite making bank on the replacement hardware, is generally seen by the company as way more trouble than it is worth. In fact, I can't think of a single company that really considers their Repair services as anything more than a necessary evil, and CERTAINLY not a "Profit Center" in a classic sense of the term.

Re:It's the lack of upgrades

[DickBreath]

> They have no economic incentive to do so.

This is Apple we're talking about.

Economic incentive has NOTHING to do with it.

It's all about religious devotion. Think Different. You will buy what Apple tells you to buy. Have you made your annual pilgrimage to Apple WWDC to hear the messiah's successor and Profit, Tim Cook tell you what to think?

Re:It's the lack of upgrades

[burtosis]

iPhones upto 6 are fairly easy to work on if you are comfortable around micro flat flex connectors and tiny fastners. I replaced my battery myself with one for 2.50 usd and it's still working great. 7+ the glue and ensuring it stays waterproof starts being an issue though.

Re:It's the lack of upgrades

[Anonymous Coward]

>why would any company do that they're not running a charity

We know. We're not saying those bars are a charity.

We have a GSX account where I work. We know what apple will charge for shops-only no-consumers-allowed parts. They'll sell you a foam block or a plastic card (ie imac bevel release) and yeah buddy, they make it worthwhile to do so.

Poor, poor apple, they HATE having to "give out" entire logic boards to replace a single component. They hate getting a fat check for each one of them. It's simply impossible to document more precise repairs, I'm afraid the only fix here is to replace the entire mobo, we here at apple will dig deep and offer you one. For $1000. Woe, woe!

Re:It's the lack of upgrades

[tlhIngan]

7+ the glue and ensuring it stays waterproof starts being an issue though.

Not really, if you're a reasonably competent person, the gasket is no big deal at all.

In fact, battery replacement kits for every iPhone have it made such that really, it's a 20 minute process as long as you can be patient and read basic instructions.

Sadly, the problem is "reasonably competent". There are way too many people who can't or don't read instructions, who can't or don't want to follow them, so they're the ones that will end up cracking their screens and such.

It isn't hard, and if you're reading this, you should be able to handle it and end up with a still waterproof iPhone. It looks hard and scary, but it really isn't.

Re:It's the lack of upgrades

[Anonymous Coward]

https://www.ifixit.com/Answers/View/208552/Where+do+I+buy+the+capacitors+for+a+MacBook+Pro+logic+board

Re:It's the lack of upgrades

[burtosis]

I'd only looked at repair blogs, listened to some reviews, and not tried it myself. Maybe I'll give it a try. Plus I have a hot air rework station so that makes adhesive removal easy.

Re:It's the lack of upgrades

[omnichad]

You really think Apple sells traded phones as refurbs? I really think they probably throw them straight into a shredder. Take them off the secondary market and they'll make more money selling the newer models.

Re:It's the lack of upgrades

[guruevi]

It's not quite that bad, the spare parts for any business are higher cost than third party, partially because they have to actually stock them and partially because they require much better QC. Try to buy these spare batteries and displays from an off-brand third party, check the Amazon reviews - 15-25% one star saying it doesn't work, doesn't work well, has all sorts of flaws (dead pixels on screens or low capacity on batteries) and are more often than not simply refurbished or even stolen parts.

This isn't unique to Apple, Dell, IBM and HP all does the same on their computers. They also have a qualified tech do the work, if you have a business account, on-site next business day which adds to the cost of the 'replacement part'.

Re:It's the lack of upgrades

[guruevi]

Apple generally takes them apart for parts and recycles the metal, then all they have to do for a refurb (actually they sell those models in India as 'brand new') is put a new case and battery in it.

Re:It's the lack of upgrades

[omnichad]

That has nearly the same effect with more added evil than I could imagine up for them.

Of course it's CAPABLE, lol!

[Anonymous Coward]

This was an express strategy for revenue generation along their repair/supply chain, obviously if they wanted to make it cheap/easy to upgrade or repair your mac, THEY COULD HAVE DONE SO - at a cost of billions in profits.

I guess the story is that there are documents proving this? Gee. Kind of a duh.

Re: Of course it's CAPABLE, lol!

[Anonymous Coward]

Internal documents show that if a robber breaks into your house and decimated your Mac Pro with a tire iron Apple cannot repair it. There. fixed the headline for you

Apple says opposite

[SuperKendall]

The Apple biosystem requires you replace your devices periodically.

Apple themselves said last year they expect people to be using devices longer and longer, which is why support for older OS's has stayed through multiple OS upgrades.

Apple's ecosystem in fact does the opposite, it keeps your device working as long as possible, til eventually maybe you want an upgrade.

I do think Apple should open up all companies to be able to get apple parts and manuals. But it's not like Apple is forcing people to buy new devices.

Re:Apple says opposite

[sjames]

You mean other than charging 90% of the cost to upgrade just to deal with a crack in the screen that should be fixable for $50 or so.

Re:Apple says opposite

[Anonymous Coward]

>Apple themselves acknowledged that, despite efforts to the contrary...

Well, depends when you listened to it. As placation to shareholders, or after spinning it celebratory.

But if you want to pretend the industry was cheering as phone plateauing grew (and grows) knock yourself out. I have no delusions of stopping fanboy ones.

Re:Apple says opposite

[Anonymous Coward]

Apple themselves said last year they expect people to be using devices longer and longer, which is why support for older OS's has stayed through multiple OS upgrades.

How are you so easily fooled by them? Yes they say that users are going to be using their devices longer and longer, which is why they have pushed up the device prices so much while not offering any compelling innovation to justify is as well as vehemently opposing right-to-repair so they can charge ridiculous prices for their "repair services".

Nobody wants to buy new iphones because the new ones are no better than the previous ones, they just cost a lot more so they have to make sure they last a long time because otherwise people would end up out of Apple's ecosystem. They aren't really a technology/hardware company anymore (just look at their recent refresh announcements just done by website press release), they are a services company nickel-and-diming their customers with expensive repairs, subscription services and even now they've become so lame that it's interest payments on Apple-branded credit cards.

Re:Apple says opposite

[Anonymous Coward]

But it's not like Apple is forcing people to buy new devices.

No but they are forcing you to buy their extended warranty otherwise you'll be out $700 for a keyboard repair.

Re:Apple says opposite

[Anonymous Coward]

The per-device price rise is because there is no new innovative features, its because people who are buying new devices are only doing so because they have to which is either buy-in to the Apple ecosystem or because their current devices is lost/stolen/ruined so the approach is to gouge these people.

It is a sign that the iPhone has become commodified. Lock in with services and gouge customers on new devices and/or device repairs.

Re: Apple says opposite

[Anonymous Coward]

False. There is a repair program for the keyboard which covers the cost of repair for four (4) years from date of purchase.

College Days

[bob4u2c]

I remember almost two decades ago in my college days that the campus bookstore which sold Apple products was also an authorized Apple repair center. Having setup their network equipment (and run down computers with viruses on them), I happen to see them repair a few products in the back room. The part came with a link to a website where they could view a step by step tear down of whatever it was. The document the site had was very detailed and showed every single screw, plate, cover, etc and how exactly to remove it, and in what order everything needed to be done. I remember thinking lego instructions were not this detailed. I asked the tech how long he had been fixing Apple products, and he told me that this was his first time working on that model, but he didn't need to know, it was all in the document.

So if they had these documents that long ago, why haven't they made them public? Oh, never mind, allowing only a few repair shops added to the premium mentality which allowed them to charge more for the products, and the Apple Care plans they pushed.

Re:College Days

[Anonymous Coward]

Given the general public's ability (or lack thereof) to follow instructions, in some respects it's a way to cut down on a bazillion warranty claims coming from idiots trying to repair their own computers using said instructions and failing to do so. Even if 1 out of 10 people broke stuff/made things worse, Apple is in a no-win situation of:
1. denying warranty claims (bad vibes/publicity even if legitimate)
2. having additional repair costs (of forced to do so to avoid #1)
3. having a reputation of faulty products

I can see a manufacturer wanting to make sure people knew which end was the business end of a screwdriver before making repair manuals available to them.
If they impose certification/authorization requirements on repair technicians and parts, we're right back to where we are now.

That said, I'm all for the concept of Right-to-Repair, [as I'm in the minority that has actually used a soldering iron to repair stuff] but I'm having trouble imagining an implementation strategy that doesn't end badly for the manufacturer. Perhaps a distinction can be made between in/out of warranty period.

Re:Mueller Report is 300 pages long!

[Dunbal]

The rest was an 84 page justification for 2 years and $10 million dollars.

Re: Mueller Report is 300 pages long!

[Dunbal]

You obviously haven't downloaded the latest NPC double-think, citizen. No collusion means collusion! Oceania has always been at peace with Eastasia and at war with Eurasia.

Re: Mueller Report is 300 pages long!

[Anonymous Coward]

Moronic refusal to acknowledge the many prison sentences of trumps people. Not proven isn't the same as exonerated. Scum like trump don't pay simple as that. Drop the disingenuity. Drop your arse licking. Nobody trusts him and nothing has changed.

Re: Mueller Report is 300 pages long!

[Anonymous Coward]

Holding politicians to account means taking shit seriously pal

But

[Big Bipper]

This doesn't mean that Apple has to make it easy to repair, think glued in batteries. As long as the costs for Apple to replace a few defective devices instead of repairing them themselves under warranty, is less than what Apple looses by not selling newer replacement products, Apple ( and other manufacturers ) have no incentive to make their products easy to repair. They just can't make it harder for others to repair than it is for themselves.

Re:But

[Anonymous Coward]

Downmodded, but you're 100% correct. I sincerely doubt any right to repair law will make any rules about the ease of repair (because, that's a recipe for legal disaster). My understanding is the basic concept will be that, with a few exceptions, if the OEM can do it, they must make the information and parts available to 3rd parties to do it to. Maybe some language about a reasonable price will be included, but that's unlikely to have much teeth. If, as you say, Apple decides to make the processes difficult for everyone, themselves included, that will probably be legally acceptable. Look at the lightning cable, for proof that able knows how to find the loopholes (I believe europe tried to force everyone into a single charging standard, but the lighting cable is still there).

Most people don't care

[Kohath]

Why are there articles every day about a topic that 90+% of everyone doesn't care about? Does anyone know who is financing the "right to repair" PR and legislative agenda?

When it comes to tractors, 99.5% of people don't care about tractor repairs. But we get stories on Slashdot and Presidential candidates pandering about it.

It's very organized and strangely manipulative. Anyone know why?

I don't care about it much one way or the other, but I'm against the government bullying people on behalf of big companies who want to prevent you from doing repairs. And I'm against the government bullying big companies into producing tools and manuals to enable you to make repairs. Neither are necessary, so government should butt out.

I'm also against being manipulated by PR bullshit.

Re:Most people don't care

[koavf]

As someone who will never own a tractor, I am concerned about it. I am also not liable to be caught up in a genocide of Southeast Asian minorities or gagged by surveillance software in Central Asia or harassed by police because of my race. Some of us care about things that don't immediately impact our lives because we care about other human beings.

Re:Most people don't care

[bob4u2c]

When it comes to tractors, 99.5% of people don't care about tractor repairs.

Count me as one of the 0.5%. I grew up on a farm, not having a working tractor meant you did the work by hand or horse. Being able to take something apart, figure out how it worked, fix it, and put it back together again is essential to a farm. So being denied that really hurts farmers and without farms your nicely packaged foods or prepared meals don't happen.

Of course this is just a learning period for farms. Once they realize that the newest tractor won't allow you to take the cover off without some tech re-certifying the computer before it works again, well lets just say they'll buy from someone else or keep the old equipment around.

This also has bigger implications in that people like to tinker with things and make them better or just different. Using DRM to stop that only hurts the US in its ability to invent and improve.

Also I can't think of one appliance or equipment I have bought in the last 15 years I haven't torn apart once just to see how it worked. I saved myself a washer repair man visit the other day. It was leaking and by taking the panels off and watching how it worked I found the source of the leak and replaced it with a $5.00 seal. If the washer had stopped working because I took a panel off, and I had to pay the company to come out and reset it. I'd be asking for my money back, and would never buy another product from them again.

Re:Most people don't care

[sjames]

People do care about the downstream effects. Expensive tractor repairs are a contributor when you wonder why your grocery bill is so damned high. It is an example of the problem faced by many in-industry and enthusiasts of electronics and IT. The target demographic of /. should be able to understand that, so the articles appear here.

As for the politicians, farmers vote. This is very much a daily concern for them.

Re:Most people don't care

[Kohath]

Expensive tractor repairs are a contributor when you wonder why your grocery bill is so damned high.

Food is cheaper here and now than it has ever been anywhere for anyone.

Why would anyone believe "expensive tractor repairs" make a significant difference? Who is saying they do?

Re:Most people don't care

[koavf]

What PR firms? What talking heads? Why would I think that stories about corporate malfeasance are plants but you aren't?

Re:Most people don't care

[werepants]

This is slashdot... "News for nerds, stuff that matters".

Once upon a time, nerds were the people who were building computers in their basements, salvaging old electronics to build new creations, and generally taking shit apart to see what they could do with it. Farmers were not dissimilar in how they handled their tractors - many of those old timers with their self-taught mechanical aptitude could rig something up from loose bits around the farm to keep ancient tractors chugging away, doing useful work long after their manufacturers went out of business.

Today, many companies have realized that every repaired device that is saved from a landfill is one less potential customer, and so they've introduced artificial technical barriers (DRM and worse) to try to clamp down on this unprofitable practice. What's worse, in some cases they have sent lawyers after companies and individuals who have had the gall to try to repair devices themselves.

If I buy a device, I should be able to do whatever I damn well please with it - take it apart, put it back together, swap components out, upgrade it - whatever is within my capacity to do. If someone buys a piece of hardware, the manufacturer shouldn't get to dictate how they are allowed to use it. That's what Right to Repair is about.

Re:Most people don't care

[Anonymous Coward]

[...] It's very organized and strangely manipulative. Anyone know why? [...]

Yep. The answer: https://www.yakimawa.gov/

Re:Most people don't care

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't care about it much one way or the other, but I'm against the government bullying people on behalf of big companies who want to prevent you from doing repairs. And I'm against the government bullying big companies into producing tools and manuals to enable you to make repairs. Neither are necessary, so government should butt out.

Well, the problem we have right now, is the government is bullying people on behalf of big companies who want to prevent you from doing repairs. If you want the government to butt out, then we need to repeal DMCA. Because right now, you have a legal prohibition against repairs. It's not about tools and manuals, it's about getting sued to maintaining something that you bought. It was covered right here on slashdot nearly two decades ago, and the problem never went away. It's been in the news constantly and never stopped.

I haven't yet spotted anything in the news yet about something organized and strangely manipulative (other than Warren's announcement), but if that is starting to happen, it's easy to imagine why. People are getting fed up. It's impacting a lot of peoples' lives, wasting a lot of money, and there's nothing within the law they can do about it. People have to resort of criminal maintenance.

Criminal maintenance .. as most techies have first-hand experience with, if they've ever watched a DVDs on their own computer.

Why are there articles every day about a topic that 90+% of everyone doesn't care about?

Because this is Slashdot, a website for the 10%: techie people. And nearly all techie people care about this. Are you a techie?

When it comes to tractors, 99.5% of people don't care about tractor repairs.

Until vat-grown meat gets viable, around 100% of people are paying for this abuse, even if they don't have to deal with it directly. But on top of that, it's merely interesting that DMCA abuse has grown to the point of techies and farmers having a common enemy.

I think you're not really being manipulated, you're just finally hearing the angry screams. This issue has been front and center for a very long time. If the screams are annoying, then join in: REPEAL DMCA. That is the only thing that will make the screaming stop.

Re:Most people don't care

[hackertourist]

90% of people doesn't care about anything. That's no reason to not write about things.

Slashdot is a technology site with a readership that contains many hobbyists, tinkerers and others who tend to want to repair things rather than throw the whole thing in the trash because one $0.50 component failed. So Right to Repair legislation is of interest to many of us.

The current situation is that repairability is artificially impaired by large companies trying to force people into the wasteful habit of throwing away objects rather than repairing them. This situation was made possible by government butting out and letting "the market" develop naturally.

Nonrepairability works in favor of a small group of large companies while having a negative impact on everyone else. Insultingly high repair bills, mountains of waste, monopolies are common and unacceptable. The government is the only entity capable of changing this, so yes, government definitely should butt in on behalf of consumers, and put limits to corporate greed and assholiness.

Re:Most people don't care

[Anonymous Coward]

Are you seriously saying you think every farm in America has an extra half million dollars lying around, you stupid, stupid punk ass faggot bitch Republican traitor apologist?

Re:Most people don't care

[Anonymous Coward]

While you're right that 99% of the people don't care about the right of farmers to repair their tractors, 100% of the people who own tractors do care because when it comes time to plant or harvest their crops time is of the essence and waiting for an authorized repairman to come out then send away for the required part is a delay they can not afford.

Re:Most people don't care

[Kohath]

Slashdot is a technology site with a readership that contains many hobbyists, tinkerers and others who tend to want to repair things rather than throw the whole thing in the trash because one $0.50 component failed. So Right to Repair legislation is of interest to many of us.

That explains why some fraction of Slashdot readers care. How does that become "right to repair" legislation "has been proposed in 20 states"? Does that sort of effort happen without money and centralized organization?

Re:Most people don't care

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm against the government bullying people on behalf of big companies who want to prevent you from doing repairs.

User lockout is stopped by regulation. Want to fix your own DVD player or root your own phone? Not if we can help it.

I'm not opining on companies being forced to "produce" tools and documents (that they already have) I'm opining on artificial user barriers.

Which is shitty enough to draw criticism without molemen pulling the strings. I suppose forcing radium out of children's toys was financed by Big Safety's PR team?

Where do you draw the line? Is there an agenda for every complaint of a shitty situation? Every post on the internet that whined about something?

Re:Most people don't care

[Anonymous Coward]

Right. Farmers get paid little for their crops. Where the expenses come in are the middlemen who buy, ship, process and distribute the food to markets,

Re:Most people don't care

[Solandri]

When it comes to tractors, 99.5% of people don't care about tractor repairs. But we get stories on Slashdot and Presidential candidates pandering about it.

I can guarantee you that 99.5% of tractor owners care about tractor repairs. The percentage is probably a bit lower for John Deere tractor owners because the ones who care most self-selected themselves out of the sample by not buying a John Deere because of the repair issues, even though they really wanted one.

Anyway, Apple products are highlighted for right to repair because they're high-profile. The biggest right-to-repair issue is refilling ink cartridges. If you buy replacement ink cartridges from the printer manufacturer (as the chips in many cartridges force you to do), you're paying on the order of $1000 per gallon of ink. It's ludicrous, and only made possible by vendor encrypted lock-in whose only purpose is to prevent you from messing around with the internals of YOUR printer. Right to repair makes that type of lock-in illegal. So anyone who's ever grumbled about high ink cartridge costs cares about right-to-repair.

Re:Most people don't care

[sjames]

So you figure costs to a producer DON'T figure into the cost of a product? I don't know where you went to school, but you should demand a refund.

Re:Most people don't care

[Kohath]

User lockout is stopped by regulation. Want to fix your own DVD player or root your own phone? Not if we can help it.

I'm not opining on companies being forced to "produce" tools and documents (that they already have) I'm opining on artificial user barriers.

Which is shitty enough to draw criticism without molemen pulling the strings.

Criticism isn't "legislation proposed in 20 states". Are there molemen?

I suppose forcing radium out of children's toys was financed by Big Safety's PR team?

I'm not 90 years old, so I have limited knowledge of this story. Why bring it up?

Where do you draw the line?

"Where do you draw the line?" is a question that presumes a perfect answer that fits every problem. I don't believe in such answers. I think people should mostly draw their own lines at their own discretion instead of having some mediocre government bureaucrats decide for them.

Is there an agenda for every complaint of a shitty situation? Every post on the internet that whined about something?

I'm only asking if there is an agenda for this. And if so, who? And why?

Re:Most people don't care

[Anonymous Coward]

The internet that you knew is dead. If you think this is bad, take a look at reddit. I would imagine that the majority of influential accounts are controlled by governments or corporations, including, in some cases, reddit itself. It looks like a thread on usenet if you squint, but the difference is 80% of the non-censored content is actual state- or corporate-sponsored shilling and/or propaganda. The people are gone, shadowbanned into oblivion. The internet you see now is a false deceiver internet. It was erected in front, and the real internet has been slowly torn down. This continues to this day. Google is the most powerful tool to destroy the internet. Control the eye of the world, and you control the people of the world.

Re:Most people don't care

[Kohath]

So you figure costs to a producer DON'T figure into the cost of a product? I don't know where you went to school, but you should demand a refund.

This response is just dumb. Even children know the difference between an amount that's big enough to matter and an amount that's too small to care about. Animals know it too.

Re:Most people don't care

[Kohath]

What PR firms? What talking heads?

That's my original question. Does anyone know?

Re:Most people don't care

[sjames]

I guess you haven't seen the cost of farm equipment lately.

Re:Most people don't care

[Kohath]

For a $2 loaf of bread, how much of that $2 do you the think is "tractor repairs"?

Re:Most people don't care

[Anonymous Coward]

Why are there articles every day about a topic that 90+% of everyone doesn't care about?

Most articles here fit that description. You think anybody really gives a shit about the Linux desktop or Windows telemetry or Android bootloaders?

When it comes to tractors, 99.5% of people don't care about tractor repairs.

But 99.5% of people require things that are directly impacted by the inability to repair those tractors so it's in everybody's interest to back the right to repair.

I don't care about it much one way or the other, but I'm against the government bullying people on behalf of big companies who want to prevent you from doing repairs. And I'm against the government bullying big companies into producing tools and manuals to enable you to make repairs. Neither are necessary, so government should butt out.

And despite all the stories about the tractor repairs you still have no idea about the issue. It's not either one of the issues you describe there, it is about the manufacturer not putting in intentional blocks to prevent you from repairing the product yourself. If I want to void the warranty on a tractor by replacing the gearbox on it myself that's my choice, it's not up to the manufacturer to decide whether I'm allowed to do that or not.

Re: Most people don't care

[Anonymous Coward]

Ok lets turn it aroind. Lets assume there is a conspiracy to promote right to repair. Can you imagine a group that would benefit from this? A group that couldnt promote it out in the open? So, not the greens or repair companies bit someone who needs to be undisclosed.

Re:Most people don't care

[sjames]

More than should be.

Re:Most people don't care

[guruevi]

You may care but you obviously don't understand the issues at hand which is typical for people on your side of the aisle. There is ALWAYS more than a binary cause and solution to the problem.

Re:Most people don't care

[koavf]

And how is that "obvious"? Do you care to say anything substantial other than glib, driveby criticism?

Re:Most people don't care

[Anonymous Coward]

Kohath's entire problem with this is based in his anti-government confirmation bias. He is so indoctrinated that it's the lens thru which he views every topic. "Is it liberal or conservative"? Why would he bother to learn what it's about after deciding he's against it already? What baffles me is how much response such a troll post has garnered.

Re:Most people don't care

[Anonymous Coward]

citation for your statistic, the 99.5% one.

Even if farmers only account for less than 0.5% of the population, there are other people involved in that supply chain that have a vested interest in farmers keeping their costs low.

Then there are all the technical people interested as companies have been soft-locking features and their struggles could set legal precedence on soft-locking that will affect the rest of us.

As for WHY you should really be interested, well it comes down to the price of your food, Companies are using monopolistic tactics to force these farmers into using a company repair service at a much higher price even though historically farmers have always been able to repair their own machine...

"And I'm against the government bullying big companies into producing tools and manuals to enable you to make repairs."

and now we see where the actual issue comes from, you seem to believe that corporations are equal with individuals. That in itself is amusing as in this case it has no effect on you but i am sure that you are glad that the FDA exists to tell grocery stores to pull product that was tainted at a supplier.

The cognitive dissidence is real, Go back to sticking your head in the sand lemming. You are the useful idiot that corporations love.

Still trying to maintain control

[PhrostyMcByte]

keep doing what you're doing, with ... Apple genuine parts, reliable parts supply, and Apple process and training.

Having an option to get genuine parts would be great, but I fully expect an aftermarket to be created with much cheaper options.

Re:Still trying to maintain control

[magzteel]

keep doing what you're doing, with ... Apple genuine parts, reliable parts supply, and Apple process and training.

Having an option to get genuine parts would be great, but I fully expect an aftermarket to be created with much cheaper options.

I used to buy IPhone batteries on Amazon until I started worrying a knock-off might set my house on fire

Re:Still trying to maintain control

[Anonymous Coward]

This is the rub. These authorized Apple repair centers will only use genuine apple parts, meaning they will have to pay whatever apple charges them for the parts. There no possibility for a 3-rd party replacement part, which can undersell Apple because Apple's mark-up on their repair parts is part of their business strategy. Just like HP doesn't want you to use 3vrd party replacement ink cartridges because the money is in selling new cartridges. A true Right-to-repair law would allow the manufacture of commodity replacement parts.

Repair's lifetime nearing its end in phones

[Krishnoid]

"Right now, they are only offering it to a few megachains, but it seems clear to me that it would be totally possible to comply with right to repair."

Up until a couple product releases from now, when "repair" becomes an obsolete concept. Seems like Apple would do its best to keep moving towards making its phones less openable in the interest of making them more waterproof.

Nobody cares that you don't care, lying faggot.

[Anonymous Coward]

We support right to repair, it makes perfect sense. Your crybaby faggot shit doesn't matter at all Kobitch. We'll do it anyway, you don't get a say. You're just an uneducated child anyway lol. Run along now.

Find some real problems to cry your little eyes out over.

Eh, what's it matter?

[nightfire-unique]

My question is: why does it matter?

Either they obey the law (once right-to-repair legislation is passed), or they suffer the consequences and risk bankruptcy and shareholder lawsuits. Pretty simple stuff, really.

what about return part pricing and cpu + ram + MB

[Joe_Dragon]

what about return part pricing and cpu + ram + MB + Storage as one unit in the imac pro even when cpu and ram is an socket.

Re: Mueller Report is 300 pages long!

[Anonymous Coward]

I love your crybaby faggot "white victimstance" lol... did you get tricked into cutting your balls off, GOP incels? Thanks Obama.

Re:Mueller Report is 300 pages long!

[DickBreath]

Not a single complete sentence in 84 pages you say? That sounds like the president wrote it.

Nobody cares that you don't care, Kohath faggot

[Anonymous Coward]

Nobody asked you. We support right to repair, it makes perfect sense. Your crybaby faggot shit doesn't matter at all Kobitch. We'll do it anyway, you don't get a say. You're just an uneducated child anyway lol. Run along now.

Find some real problems to cry your little eyes out over.

Re: Mueller Report is 300 pages long!

[Scroatzilla]

Cookie-cutter denial, the up and coming new Orange Man Bad outrage. :)

Re: Mueller Report is 300 pages long!

[Anonymous Coward]

Umadbro? In reality what probably happened is Russia and Trump were both willing to collude. There was evidence the Russians were gearing up to interfere in the election and sow discord before Trump declared anyway, but when Trump saw the chance Russia figured why not? I would bet at some point Putin or one of his close operatives met Trump and realized that he is a complete moron loose cannon that he couldn't actually manipulate effectively (because hes stupid) and just figured, an idiot is better than Hillary Clinton. At that point I don't think they actively colluded, but Russia just ran their own interference because Trump's campaign was such a mess they couldn't have coordinated effectively with them anyway.

As much as I dislike Trump, Mueller probably did not find evidence of collusion that would meet the prosecution standard to indict him. Doesn't really change the fact that we have a moron in office that is woefully unqualified for the position he holds, but is surprisingly effective at what amounts to misdirection from the things the GOP wants to happen under the radar. The media has been in a near frenzy like state since he became a serious contender for the nomination, and it just plays into the GOPs hands. They don't need an effective president to do what they want. Since when do they care about Democracy in action with the massive amount of gerrymandering and other bullshit tactics they have totally embraced to shove their ideas on everyone else?

The base problem is that the media executives only care about ratings and profits and the journalists have fallen for his trap. Trump's idiotic clickbait worthy headlines serve to drive traffic and engagement to these sites even though most of the shit is the same old grand-standing crap that really doesn't matter. The journalists become outraged at the mere idea of many of these things and then get drawn in to a pointless fight while the GOP proceeds to gut thousands of other regulations that do matter.

Bottom line, they basically backed their way into a situation that is actually beneficial to them much like Trump's campaign backed into a situation where the Russians clearly did help them, but not as a coordinated effort. Oh and by the way, there was evidence on at least 9 different state voting systems that they were breached. Georgia even went so far as to 'accidentally' delete the system backups after the main system crashed after the security and forensics teams confirmed they had been breached by a nation state actor (it was near unanimous that Russia was that nation state). Due to the poor security auditing of the systems however, they have no idea if any votes were actually changed and my suspicion is they said they weren't to avoid eroding confidence in the election outcomes.

Re: Mueller Report is 300 pages long!

[Killall -9 Bash]

You can't read.

THE RUSSIANS WERE NOT TRYING TO HELP TRUMP. They were trying to create division. Their plan both succeeded, and was pointless. The effect of Russia's social media campaign paled in comparison to the naturally occurring division.

If Russia was trying to get Trump elected, why did they run anti Trump and pro Clinton ads and stories? THINK ABOUT IT.

And while you're thinking about that, wonder when's the last time a president was elected with 49% of the vote, and wasn't called "lame duck". Have you heard anyone call Trump a lame duck? Even once???

Maybe "lame duck" doesn't fit the narrative.... since Trump can't be lame duck and Hitler at the same time. Or maybe every news agency got a call from the FBI. Maybe they were told "The Russians are trying to fuck with our democracy. They want a weak president. Don't give them what they want."

Re: Mueller Report is 300 pages long!

[Anonymous Coward]

Keep sucking Feminism's clit. It will return the favor. One day. It promises.

Re: Mueller Report is 300 pages long!

[cyber-vandal]

Mueller said that there was no evidence of collusion after a thorough 18 month investigation. If you have evidence there was collusion then you'd better let him know as soon as you can.

Re: Mueller Report is 300 pages long!

[ImprovOmega]

What he specifically said was there was insufficient evidence to bring a charge of conspiracy against the folks involved in the Trump campaign. Which just means it would be a waste of time to try and prosecute, not that there was no evidence at all. Plenty of cases have some evidence implicating someone but that evidence is insufficient to prove guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. Reasonable doubt is a fairly highly legal bar to get over.

Re: Mueller Report is 300 pages long!

[cyber-vandal]

No what he specifically said was there was no evidence of collusion and insufficient evidence to bring a charge of obstruction of justice. Let it go.

Re: Mueller Report is 300 pages long!

[Anonymous Coward]

Your whining is getting even more strident. Try to relax.