Slashdot Mirror
AMD beats Intel in January sales
theGEEK wrote in
to send us a link to a story where you can read that
in January, AMD accounted for 43.9% of unit sales, to
Intel's 40.3%. For the first time, Intel is #2.
Update: 02/26 12:44 by H :It should be noted that this is only *retail*, and does not include corporate. Still, I bet things are happy at AMD today.
the K7 bus will be 200Mhz. They could go as high as 333Mhz, but they're starting at 200 to play it safe.
It might have something to do with AMD's continued success insures we have a choice in x86 PC's in the future.
Everyone likes a choice. I personally sort of like Intel with all the help it has offered the Open Source movement lately. However, I also dread the prospect of going to a Best Buy and finding only Intel based PC's available to choose from.
Choice = good.
No choice = communism.
Get the picture.
Congrats AMD! Keep up the good work.
Do not meddle in the affairs of sysadmins, for they are subtle, and quick to anger.
maybe if AMD would support the egcc, gcc, Cygnus and effort like Intel. 3D Now! isn't not supported completely with only binutils.
Acronyms are fun!
Maybe 20 years ago, while the coldwar was raging on Americans might have been taught that communism was a synonymous to bad, however now things have changed. I am currently studdieng Russia and communism in school and I would say that for the most part we have looked at it objectively. We have read a few documents by Marx however, while some of his ideas sounded sort of neat, he also wanted to brainwash peple to accomplish his ends. In practice, communism was nothing like it was stated in theory, it never went past the first phase and was a corrupt, capitalistic dictatorship. Thus, in practice, communism is synonmous with bad. Unless you have an example of a communist system that didn't fail, wasn't completely corrupt, and didn't attempt to kill diversity....
This announcement is bliss. All these years, Intel's monopoly position put them in the position where they could make PC processors obsolete just when they were about to become affordable.
Consumers, having no PC alternatives cheaper than $1,200, consistently saw the value of their investment vaporize at the exponential rate implied by Moore's law. They were getting screwed on the order of the savings & loan debacle of the 80s.
Most consumers are finally realizing there is no economic justification for all the additional power that the upper-end chips supposedly provide. AMD's expanded presence will help those buyers steer clear of Intel's forced obsolescence scam.
Waiting to buy a PII or a PIII doesn't matter. The PII is basically dead now, the PIII is taking off where the PII left off. Also remmeber this AMD announced their K6-3 or III last year it should have been out in Novvember or December, maybe even earlier. According to your reasoning then a lot of people didn't buy the K6-2 because they were just rating, so AMd % should be even higher.
The FPU in AMD is designed better, BUT its not superpipelined like the Pentiums and its offspring. That's why there is a lot of hype about the K7, its going to be more pipelined than Intel's chips.
Good points though. Why is Apple so greedy when it comes to information, I think Be would be a good boost for them.
you know, you make a good point.
I hate teh fact that intel overprices there CPU's and keeps writing that CPU specific crap in there. If your making a CPU give it braun and muscle... LONG LIVE ALPHA !!!
but your right, intel does support the linux community,and others. but there CPU's are just too expensive
Sweeet... hehe... you know you've hit the big time when you've got an icon on slashdot ;-)
It's been lingering at about $16-$18 a share for the last 3 weeks, ever since plummeting from around $32 about a month and a half ago.
Why is this? If you just read slashdot you'd think, hey AMD is the next big buy! I'll get rich!
That's what I was thinking (I didn't buy any tho) and I'm still watching the stock tread water at a little more than 10% of Intel's stock price. (From memory, plz dont shoot me if I'm off a percent)
From the rumormill, AMD has serious problems with manufacturing. They have high demand, etc, but they just can't keep up the supply of chips. I'm no expert, I'm just repeating what I've read, but the "business world" doesn't seem to give a flip about AMD -- they're content to go with the big boys until someone proves them wrong.
Not a big revelation, perhaps, but to me I'd like to see AMD's stock price rise up to about $30 or $40 at least...
For one, competition is good, and AMD and Cyrix are largely the reason you can get a decent wintel box so cheaply now.
Secondly, AMD, by virtue or nescesity, is more supportive of standards, like OpenPIC, where as Intel can use its position to foist proprietary "standards" like APIC.
Hypotheticals about Apple are irrelevant. They don't want BeOS or mac clones. Period.
So? Who is forcing anyone to buy Apple? Certainly not your boss. Or family members or friends. If they don't want BeOS or mac clones, that their decision and they will face the conciquences(if there is any).
I'm still waiting for that PPC Chrp PC even if it only runs linux. I guess linux is also locked up in x86/intel world and will be
even more entrenched with the new intel optimizations. gcc for PPC isn't going to be as optimised
Only runs Linux? That sound a little closed. If there is an interest in Linux for PPC then someone will make it happen. And it will.
Or I could be wrong and Linux will be X86 only. Who knows? =P
--
Now we're nothing.
It's far easier to forgive your enemy after you get even with him.
You pussies are all wrong. AMD has edged past Intel in the past with better performance. What did that prove? Intel is still king. It will take somebody cool like Nintendo, Sega, or Sony to come up with the microprocessor that will unseat Intel's dominance.
Horray!! the wintel jagernut is now part of computer history. Its now just win. People are no longer afraid that amd will be incompatible with todays windows apps. I bet the same is going to be true for the new split microsoft and linux a year or 2 down the road. I am a technical guy and I was afraid to buy the k6 2 and a half years ago becasue of compatiblities but all my fears are long gone. This is great!
Hey guys. Don't fear intel anymore, they are no longer INTEL but intel just like IBM. Intel will now be an innovator rather then a monpolist. Remember that intel is under investigation as well as microsoft for monopolistic practices. I hope that the windows source code will be available soon so we can have an amd equilivent of windows. Now since wintel is gone forever, we should focus on win. ALso go to www.zdnet.com to look up the latest anti trust case agaisnt ms. Boises has an email from hp that mentioned gateway (or vice versa. I can't remember) that stated that microsoft is selling windows cheaper for companies that ship all their computers with IE and Office rather then netscape and Lotus suite. The judge lashed out "IS THIS REALLY TRUE!!" the ms executive said "uh. Well there are alot of reasons why we sell windows cheaper to oems." The judge wants to subpeona microsoft for information on prices of windows to oems.
I believe this was the bullet in the gun to prove that ms uses monopoly practices. THis is great!! 2 monopolies being bashed on the same day.
WORD UP!
you are just defining terms, in practice however, communism was not what its definition implied. Stalin used 'capitalist' like rewards for employees who did good. There was absolutely no democracy. In the one free election Lennin had, he realized hte people didn't want communism, so he killed democracy and established a dictatorship. Wow big difference between czarist russia. THERE IS a difference between communism in theory and in practice, when Americans refer to communsim, they usually refer to it in practice.
Even in theory, Marx stated that the early phase would require a dictatorship so that they could 'weed' out the 'evil' capitalists and brainwash the rest of the population. PLEASE give me abreak.
With the P3 looking fairly disappointing from the initial benchmarks I have seen, the K6-3 and K7 could be in the right place to kill Intel in the corporate/server market which would be very good.
Intel could be pushed out into an IBM type scenario where they only make their little Email stations, etc.
Hurrah!
Chris
chris@black-sun.co.uk
something like "if if recall corectly" ?!?!?!?!
;-)))
there's a lot of TLA i don't know...
BTW TLA means "three letters abreviation", but there's more like "IMHO" or "IMNSHO" etc etc etc
PS: BTW means "by the way"
PS2: PS means post scriptum
PS3: be afraid of recursive TLA like GNU
--
"Science will win because it works." - Stephen Hawking
Well, performance is a more murky area (try the recent Tom's Hardware reviews of the PIII versus AMD. As for price: Intel PIII 450mhz is about 430 UK Pounds, and and AMD K6-2 3D-Now! 400mhz is about 120 UK pounds. I'm sure these prices equate roughly to the US ones - the major point is that AMD are much much cheaper.
--Remove SPAM from my address to mail me
"Intel has had a monopoly on the X86 market for too long!"
Think about that statement very carefully. Come on now, you can do it. What's the problem with it? Hmm? Think before you speak.
Actually, this started with the Pentium Pro....
Hmmm, AMD is #1, I guess that requires us to hate them now. BOO! HISSS! BAD AMD! Go Intel!
/ cpu-news-14.html
Still waiting for an AMD processor to beat my $95 Celeron OCed to 450MHz...
See http://www4.tomshardware.com/releases/99q1/990223
It only counts retail sales, not corporate sales, which AMD lags WAY behind in. But still, great for them!
Again, I must remind the non-US readers of /. that in the US we have been brought up to understand the word, "Communisim" as a synonym for "bad" or "bad for you/us". Witness the poster's comment:
Choice = good.
No choice = communism.
Communisim, as the opposite of good.
i don't understand why a lot of you see AMD as the "good guys". i haven't heard of them doing anything for the alternate OS community, and i bet their suits are just as mean as intel's suits =)
who cares which one is #1, a big company is still a big company, even if its not intel or microsoft.
One of the main reasons I hate intel, is the continual form factor change AS WELL as socket changes just to screw with the competition. There is absolutely no reason for me to spend another $50-$100 on a chunk of metal to go into a landfill somewhere.
My K6-2 fast enough and overclocks nicely, but the Super 7 mobos sure have their share of BAD problems. Mine ASUS has terrible AGP support and the cache on it appears to be faulty. (Example:
Half Life works great with L2 cache OFF. You turn L2 cache on and it falls over every 15 minutes)
I just hope that the mobo manufacturers and the chip manufacturers will get their act together. I hear that AMD will be creating their own chipset for the K7.
Article says AMD has beaten Intel overall in the retail market. In the sub $1000 market, AMD has OVER 50% and Intel has like 25%
They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security
I thought Intel did away with Socket 7 because they wanted to run their L2 cache faster on their PII's?
That would just make too much sense. Intel is evil... oh wait, AMD is market leader now... AMD is evil... hissssss.
>Are they still owned by IBM? What's their market share now?
They never were owned by IBM. The chips say IBM/Cyrix because they are fabricated by IBM, since Cyrix has no fab of it's own. They've been leasing IBM fabs for some time, but the companies are distinct and, to my knowledge, IBM has had nothing to do with the design of the processors...only the production (not that fabrication is a small feet).
>Is it true that the Cyrix worked by parsing the x86 instructions on the front-end, then sending them through a RISC section?
Probably so. A number of x86 chips work internally on a RISC core, with a rather complicated translator on each side. It's rather ugly to implement, but building a modern, heavily pipe-lined processor around the x86 spec is so nasty, that many engineers have decided to implement a translation internally. I believe that my old AMD K5 was designed this way.
Also, I believe most x86 chips these days use microcode rather than straight logic to implement the more complicated functions. This can be thought of as breaking up a single, complex x86 instruction into multiple, simpler steps internally so that the ALU doesn't need to be quite so complex (and hence can run at higher clock). I've seen schematics of the K7 and it's ALU's "direct path" (strait logic) vs. it's "vector path" (microcode).
As for Cyrix...in my eyes, the only thing that keeps them relevent is the MediaGX line. I haven't really run into any fans of the MII, and most of my friends have bad tastes in their mouths from the old 686's.
--Lenny
you can even get dual celeron pc's from bemachines.com. Dunno if they OC well
Intel pays OEMs some huge amount for that 3 second "Pling Ding-ding-dang-dong" swirly bit they include in their adverts. Many OEMs probably wouldn't be able to afford TV advertising for their PCs if it wasn't for this.
Then, having gained all this customer awareness for their machines, OEMs turn around and sell AMD-based machines instead.
Is it me, or is that just plain *beautiful*?
I never see these defined anywhere.
I think National Semiconductor bought out Cyrix relatively recently (last year). If you look at this section of their website, you can confirm that.
http://news.com/News/Item/0,4,32962,00.html?st.ne. lh..ni
LART stands for "Luser Attitude Reajustment Tool." Usually :-)
in the form of a large stick. Used by sysadmins to "fix
the *real* problem."
Excuse me for being so ignorant, but I'm not
a native english-speaking person. I always
wondered what FUD meant. I know the idea being
it, but I wonder if it is an acronym or what?
That's why the K7 will require Rambus RAM. It's spec'd to 800Mhz.
Democracy
This is a system of government, where the leaders are chosen by the populace through voting. It has the advantage of generating leaders whose views at least moderately reflect the peoples', and of allowing the populace to replace a leader they don't like. The disadvantage is that showmanship is more important than actual ability or honesty for the leaders elected.
No, thats a republic.
I'm still supporting Intel for this reason: AMD's floating point unit (FPU) in their K6-2 and K6-III CPU's still suck like a vacuum cleaner. :-(
Remember, the K6 series CPU's process one FPU instruction per clock cycle, unlike the Intel CPU's, which can process multiple FPU instructions per clock cycle. That's the reason why in most modern games (Quake II, Incoming, Unreal, etc.) the Celeron 333 to 400 MHz CPU's are more than fast enough to run these games well. AMD needs to correct this problem with the K7 CPU--if the K7 can process multiple FPU instructions per clock cycle, THEN AMD has eliminated the last bottleneck that has hampered acceptance of their CPU's for high-end applications.
Raymond in Mountain View, CA
Go to www.maximumpc.com or www.tomshardware.com to examine the architecture of the k7. Maximumpc interviewed the ceo of amd and he said that he was concerned about the fpu of the k6 and he made the k7 as a high end chip with plenty of fpu power. I dont know if maximumpc.com has this because it like to only show a handfull of articles online. The k7 is a generation higher then the pentium2 (oops I mean pentium3 :-)
I totally agree. It's not about major corporations vs. minor corporations. There aren't a whole hell of a lot of small companies producing chips for the x86, or any other computer for that matter. It's kind of an irrelevant point.
It's about competition. If one major company can push another major company of the top seat, this implies competition is alive and kicking. Especially if the older company has held the top spot for years, and has started selling based on name recognition rather than product. Competition brings down prices, and there isn't enough competition in certain sectors of the PC market.
As far as I've noticed AMD has been closing the gap fairly rapidly in regards to performance and popularity. The only reason intel released the celeron chips on slot 1 boards was to try to lock AMD out of the low end chip market. I wouldn't be surprised if their fear of AMD popularity was the reason behind the mediocre increase in performance from the PIII chips. Like maybe P3 was kind of a rush job.
Gateway and Compaq are big OEM's. Compaq is first on the list and Gateway is third. All of them Now sell AMD Processors in systems. Check your facts before you open your hole!!
AMD's coming can you feel it!!!
Sorry, they said %40 of _RETAIL_ sales. Big OEMs like Dell, Compaq and Micron don't even thouch AMD. I have not seen ANY good AMD box build by a good brand name quality company such as Micron (IBM and Compaq AMD based boxes blow).. K7, phft what a joke, PIII will be running at 800MHZ when they release K7 (if they do it at the cuirrent pace, K6-3 was supposed to release in December and it is out only now). And what will AMD do when Merced is out?
Dell and Micron are the only OEMS that don't sell AMD based boxes.
When Merced comes out (if ever), all AMD has to do is have it's K7 owners plop an Alpha into their motherboard. Alphas are faster now than Merced will be when it's released. Imagine how fast Alphas will be when Merced is finally released.
Merced is a piece of shit architecture. It follows in I32 architecture's footsteps. Instead of EAX, EBX we get XAX, XBX. Yay. segment:offset hell all over again. Nothing new here.
The only thing keeping Intel on top is it's top notch fabrication plants.
And I supposed you have the intel processor that is going to compete with the k7. I also doubt that intel could put a 1ghz chip out right now, because if they could i'm sure they would have all sorts of crappy adds saying how the internet is going to be so much faster with thier new pentium 3.14159. As for cranking out a 1ghz chip right now i think either motorola/ibm with the powerpc or compaq with the alpha are the only ones capable of doing it if they were really pressed to.
For most applications, the difference is a relative issue. I probally could not see the difference since I play a select few games, surf the 'net and run word processing and Role-playing applications. I'm told that for higher powered applications, the difference is minor and that the cost of the P3 is not worth the slight performance improvement.
-- Wiccan Army, 13th Airborne Division "We will not fly silently into the night"
The expensive pc's a few years back were all desiogned to be expenisive by IBM adn intel. Intel is alot softer then microsoft but it is not good for innovation in the long run. Your old 386 could of been alot cheaper if IBM and intel didn't over engineer their motherboards. In 1996 there was a computer for sale with 259 mips for only 200 bucks.
You know who it was? it was nintendo. This is because the game console wasn't overly engineered. This over engineering makes pc's slower and more expensive thanks to intels clever design to lock out competitors. The new pentium2 sockets are very expensive that we all payed for to screw amd. Intel can be a mean monster. Intel wants everything expensive on purpose so ANDY can buy a new jet. SCREW THEM ALL! I want the most bang for the buck and I am tired of corperations like microsoft and intel deciding what system I should buy. Thats up to me. I am sick of ms giving me shitty directx drivers when I want opengl. I want competition and lower prices and AMD and the new version of windows split form ms shall do just this. By the way car companies are getting pretty greed as well since you mentioned ford above. Every car I see today starts at 17,000 and the average car prive is 25 or 26000. Ten years ago I could buy a high end car for 16,000. Screw them all!! Screw all the phone companies who are charging smaller isp's 40$ a month for dsl modems because they assume the own 100% of the internet. Screw the cable companies who are now charging 80$ a month for cable with commercials (they promised no commercials) for channels I got for free for years before cable came along. Screw ford for blackmailing folks in los Angeles by forcing all of us to buy 30,000 cars for a 15 mile 2 hours aday commute because the ceo of ford doesn't want me to take public transportation and wont pay the city of la money if they build a subway or bus system. I hate capital greed!
ahh that feels alot better.
... is a bad example of capitalism and imperialism!
..
Go bananas now, will you
send + more == money?
heheh i hear yeah, My OC'ed celeron, is at 464Mhz, 103Bus, ABIT BH-6 MB, hehe i have lan partys all the time, and i see what the amd's can do.. And the 400 can keep up, But the cpu turnaround on a AMD sucks, they had to remove that code to fit, 3dnow, while intel added more without removeing.. But all i can say is pIII here i come, i like the fpu on it, for what i need a good fpu for, hehe.. Lan party site is here have fun!
Got shack?
ShackCentral Network
Worlds best gaming network!!!
AMD, if you push the K7 into SMP systems you could
kick Intel's butt forever!!!!!
I own stock in AMD, and the K7 will much better than anything Intel will have to offer for quite a while.
Well, I may be a little biased... but I purchased the stock after being blown away by the k6-2.
- Jeff
yeah but
1) AMD has been hounding intel for several months now
2) Gateway now makes AMD pc's
3) PIII more expensive than K6-III
4) privacy problem can cost Intel
5) celerons won't have SSE while both K6-2 and K6-3 will have 3dnow!
6) this keeps them alive until the K7 which will smoke
Socket-7 is still alive
Their chips are faster and they are cheaper (celeron). So why would I want to buy AMD? Besides they also support a few open source projects while AMD does nothing. Its always great to help the little guy, but I'm not goign to buy the little guy's products if his are noticably worse than the big guy's.
Also, AMD just released a new chip. PIII isn't on the market yet.
Actually, the P3 is out now, and it's release was a complete non-event. It's only substantive improvement over P2 is clock speed. (A whopping 10%!)
That AMD has done so well amidst the P3 pre-release hype is a success in itself. Now that intel has dropped the ball with the P3, AMD has a clear path for strong K6-3 sales, until they deliver intel a resounding boot-to-the-head with the K7.
Yeah, and while you were using the Intel 386/33, I was cruising along with my AMD 386/40...
Last time I checked, Cyrix was never owned by IBM. IBM is their primary foundry (ie the people who actually make their chips). Which is why you saw people referring to the chips as IBM/Cyrix 6x86 (and M2). Cyrix is now owned by National Semiconductor.
Both AMD and Cyrix (and IDT, for that matter) are not "native" x86 chips anymore. Both quit being so at the K5/5x86 level. Instead, both are natively a RISCish chip, with a microcode layer that translates the x86 instructions to the underlying RISC architecture. It's considerably more cumbersome (from a chip designer's standpoint) than doing the translation in software (ala DEC's FX!32), but an order of magnitude faster.
Don't know about their market share, though they only target the low-end now. Cyrix has abandoned the $1000+ PC market, and is strictly interested in the "integrated" CPU, ala their MediaGX stuff. This seems a reasonable way to go, since for NCs and similar stuff, if you can integrate alot of the normal chipset and other accessories onto the main CPU, it's alot cheaper. Problem is, it crowds out die space that could otherwise be used to improve performance. Oh well, don't get 'nothing for free!
There are always four sides to every story: your side, their side, the truth, and what really happened.
If I Remember Correctly, IIRC
Intel could do it if they found it makes them more cash, but it wont. Why sell a better chip now when your competitors can match you? by doing a slow increase in speed they can maximize their profits.
How can "Compaq AMD based boxes blow" if "Big OEMs like...Compaq...don't even thouch (sic) AMD"
Its starting out at 200 Mhz with plans to raise it to 400 MHz. the first boards wil use 100 Mhz SDram because Rambus can make enough. Their is a special timing loop in the supporting chipset that allows this to work. AMD will most likely release the chip at 550 MHz although 575 or 600 is possible. I'm hoping that it will also support PCI-X, Macs have something similar.
Even if Apple does release the G3 motherboard specs to Be, I think Be would find another excuse to not develop BeOS for the PowerPC. Don't get me wrong, I love the PPC (I have 2 Macs at home and one at work), but it makes sense for Be to focus on the X86 market....for now. The PPC market is too small for them to make a dent in the whole OS market share. X86 is enourmous. They can start building a bigger user base in the X86 sector to secure a 10%-20% total OS market share before moving to other platforms like PPC. If you want a high end BeOS system, it makes better sense to get a high end K6-2 or K6-3.
Hopefully, in a couple of years, they can once again diverge onto the PPC(and other) platforms. Saying that you refuse to buy a Mac is not the answer. If a company wanted to, they could make their own PPC CHiRP motherboard and bundle BeOS with it. There is no reason a PPC motherboard has to be more expensive than a Intel mobo.
--
Now we're nothing.
It's far easier to forgive your enemy after you get even with him.
Sorry, they said %40 of _RETAIL_ sales. Big OEMs like Dell, Compaq and Micron don't even thouch AMD. I have not seen ANY good AMD box build by a good brand name quality company such as Micron (IBM and Compaq AMD based boxes blow).. K7, phft what a joke, PIII will be running at 800MHZ when they release K7 (if they do it at the cuirrent pace, K6-3 was supposed to release in December and it is out only now). And what will AMD do when Merced is out?
It means 'If I Recall Correctly' :)
Josh
Statement I make : There is no God.
God smites unbelievers. I am not smitten,
therefore there is no God.
..immigration to Burma?
<^>_<(ô ô)>_<^>
Any of you own stock in AMD? If not, this doesn't affect you. The way I see it, most buyers have probably been waiting to see what the PIII is gonna do. So Intel's sales slowed down while people wait to see whether or not they should go with PIII or PII. Also, AMD just released a new chip. PIII isn't on the market yet. I doubt we'll see this trend continue except for the occasional instance like this one.
Big freakin deal. AMD will always trail behind Intel. I'm all for more speed for less money, and all that, but AMD's performance isn't where I want it (Integer vs. Floating Point) and Intel's is. Too bad the PPC is so inaccessable outside of Apple. I think their floating point is better than Intel's. But I refuse to buy a Mac, unless Apple releases G3 and G4 motherboard specs to Be.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
I run BeOS. The rules don't apply.
(besides, he smites believers too, just look at Job)
Well, that just makes me want to jump right in and be a believer! Hallelujah!
If anything keeps me awake at night, its people with guns and little fish symbols on their cars.
And by this logic, the correct definition of "hacker" is...
I think I'll take cover now O:).
It should be noted that the article stated that AMD outsold Intel in PCs below $1000. Over $1000, Intel still has the market lead. Even Cyrix beat Intel in the sub-$800 PC market though. Hopefully the K6-3 and K7, coupled with poor Intel P3 sales (due to an order of magnitude more of market hype than chip performance), will allow AMD to gain some ground in the above $1000 PC market too. Go AMD! I haven't used an Intel processor or MB chipset since my 386-33 in '93!
"That AMD has done so well amidst the P3 pre-release hype is a success in itself. Now that intel has dropped the ball with the P3, AMD has a
clear path for strong K6-3 sales, until they deliver intel a resounding boot-to-the-head with the K7."
K6-3 isn't a pre-release and also it's 3 freakin' percent! When the PIII is released AMD will go under again. Also don't forget who has more $$$ comming in from there chips even if AMD outsells intel by 3 percent intel still made more $$$, and the $$$ is what counts!
There is for SMP and other high-end things, but not for a regular 128K cache Celery :) :)
A Socket-7 Celery would be tres cool.
Actually if it weren't for the P6 (PPro) generation we'd have about 15 trillion variants of the Pentium (I) - probably things like 500mhz PMMX chips
First the microsoft ones and now the intel ones. First off. Mercedes should of come out 2 years ago and it had internally inside intel. Why is that? Because the performance sucks! Alpha is better and mercedes is slow, way too expensive and has a funny experimental chip designed called long write instruction set computing. This was suposed to make the chip alot faster but istead made the engineers life very difficult and it also is making the chip very expensive. Alpha and ultra sparc are already faster then merced and thats why its not released and microsoft is punishing intel by delaying NT for merced becasue intel supported redhat. Merced is the windows 2000 of chips, slow a total complex mess and upgrading the future line of mercedes chips will be hell. ITs dead. Intel should just give up.
THe pentium3 is NOT A NEW CHIP! ITS A PENTIUM2 WITH A NEW MMX KATMAI THAT WAS JUST RENAMED PENTIUM3. THATS IT! THE PENTIUM# IS ONLY 5% FASTER! THE SPEED DIFFERENCE WAS CLOCK SPEED AND NOT NEW CHIP DESIGN!
INTEL RENAMED IT PENTIUM# BECAUSE THE K& IS A LEVEL AHEAD OF THE PENTIUM2. Intel marketing executive "hmm the k7 is a generation higher then our pentium2. WHat do we do! I know lets rename our pentium2's pentium3's to fool our consumers and trolls at slashdot.org. LEts also boast the clock speed and the consumer will just see the mhz speed and think our chips will be faster."
hehe. Here are some facts. The p3 will be at 800mhz and function almost twice as slow as the k7 at 700mhz and the fpu will be 3 times faster. Remember the power macinstosh's several years back. THe 66 mhz powerpc processors outperformed the pentium75's. Same is true for the new k7. Did you know that todays computer sppeds are dependent on memory speeds and io speeds and not cpu! this is because todays ram for cheap pc's only can transmit 200 to 300 million bits per second. THis is because of bus bandwith and the amount of bits the memory can pump. At 200 mhz the new faster memory in the new amd motherboards can transmitt up to 3.2 billion bits per second with a 2oo mhz speed. The k7 will leave the pentium2 (oops I mean pentium3.) in the dust.
hmmm
renamed pentium2 tp pentium3 at 800 mhz
k7 (new chip generation) at 700 mhz
pentium3 can't handle a mmx instructio and a fpu instrustion at the same time
k7 can handle a mmx or 3dnow instruction and a fpu instruciotn at the same time.
Pentium3 can handle up to 200-300 million bits per second at 100mhz.
k7 can handle up to 3.2 billion bits per second at 200mhz
pentium3 has a mediocre fpu
the k7 fpu is three times faster and otpimized for graphics.
both have smp. Now. Which is better?
Neither a kid's game system nor a PC can do the work of a true workstation. Go to http://www.spec.org for performance figures for PCs, workstations, and servers. Go to, oh, http://www.sgi.com for information on what a really good rendering box can do, and how much it costs. Go to http://www.3dlabs.com for information on what a really good graphics card (the kind used in rendering boxes) can do. Vastly more powerful than a game box or a PC, and vastly more expensive, due to demand and the economies of small-run production.
You complain about lack of ability to connect an ethernet card to the N but then complain that computers need to be cheaper by getting rid of the exact thing that lets you plug in an ethernet [or dozens of other peripheral] card from any of hundreds of manufacturers. You make good Friday reading.
I bet you're also pissed at PCs that are only pusing 8 million polys a second [Voodoo 3] when the Playstation 2's hype is saying it's going to do 55 million. Can you say... bullshit. The specs don't live up to the performance. But since all you do is games anyway, buy a game machine and give up slashdot... that is of course unless the PS2 can connect you to the internet.
From what I read, their next processor, the M3 (Jalapeno core) will rival the K7; although there is little hype about this new CPU (scheduled to appear later this year), there are a few places on the web that have some info about it (such as http://www.cpusite.demon.nl/f uture/tech.html#jalapeno). The M3 should be an interesting alternative to the k7 or PIII.
I heard it scales up from 200 mhz to 400 mhz.
(slightly off topic)
I have a Cyrix box at home that runs just fine.
Are they still owned by IBM? What's their market share now?
Is it true that the Cyrix worked by parsing the x86 instructions on the front-end, then sending them through a RISC section?
What the hell does IIRC mean?
Wasted CPU cycles is all you are going to be getting with the PIII. Thats all you get now compared to the K6-III (except when running Quake).
K7 - 200 Mhz Bus that is going to SCREAM
well Microsoft isn't _exactly_ as bad as North Korea.
If I Recall Correctly it means, well, "If I Recall Correctly"! =P
--
Now we're nothing.
It's far easier to forgive your enemy after you get even with him.
400MHz K6-2s are about $20 more than 400MHz Celerons, but slower ones are neck-and-neck. And Celerons are stuck at 66MHz FSB for now (Intel wants to pretend there's a reason to buy a PII), while a good Socket 7 motherboard (if you don't already have one) is about $30 cheaper and supports 100MHz FSB.
AMD's is outselling Intel based on low end PC's where the margins are thin. Intel is still dominant at the fat end of the profit margin. Still, I'm sure it must really spook Intel, the company built by Andy "Only the paranoid survive" Grove.
Btw, first!
I haven't OC'ed yet, but will ;-)
I also had to upgrade to 3.3.3 XFree86 to be able
to use it but that was no sweat. Linux doesn't take full advantage of the card, but I dual boot to win95 to be able to play tribes. THAT is incredible.
OK, I'm going to make fun of this!
Communism is a religion, by many believed to be founded by Karl Marx and Friedriech Engels. It is based on the Article of Faith that all units of homo sapien sapien are equal. Two things are worth to note: The first is that no implementor of Communism has gotten it quite right, all of them seem to get stuck on the second stage "the dictatorship of the proletariat". The other is that the Faith of Communism spreads, like bacteria, through division.
Capitalism is a theory of resource management that builds on assigning a Value to every Resource so they can be properly distributed. This value is proportional to the pop count and inversely relational to resource contention. As every object necessary for the production of resources has a Capitalistic Value and no other forces than this Value is used to decide how to distribute, Capitalism gives a very simple model. It too has two characteristics worth of notice: The one being that while the system isn't complicated it becomes highly complex and thus tuning and optimization becomes hard. Proponents of Capitalism claim that it is so perfect that both tuning and optimization is unnecessary. The other is that all simple systems that try to solve complicated problems have a tendency to result in misfeatures such as unfairness.
Democracy is a method of rule-management based on statistics. It has been implemented in many ways, the data collection criteria has varied widely between implementations. The first implementors used a very simple algorithm, later implementors opted for more complex schemes. Democracy's main drawback is that it isn't Perfect, the prime advantage is that it is Fair to the statistical material[1]. It is usually kept only because all alternative rule-management systems tend to be less favorable to the statistical material.
Dictatorship is a rule-management system sometimes believed to be based on the belief that rules are best made by a single entity, the Dictator. In reality it is a rule-management system where the implementor ended up with too many resources under direct control, i.e. to coarse grained locking. Sometimes this state is necessary, such cases exist although seldom heard of and are, if successful, called Benevolent Dictatorships.
Socialism is a resource management philosophy that mixes Communism and Capitalism and some in-house features. Theoretically it could give the higher base performance of Capitalism together with Communism's better fairness. It is very hard to get right because C&C doesn't MiX well. It also gives up any hope of Perfectibility to gain Implementability.
BWZ Is a sometimes speaker of hot air. It is adviced that you don't mind him too much when he is hot air speaking...
Notes:
1. It is not fair to anything but the statistical material.
Has it ever occurred to you that God might be a committee?
Has it ever occurred to you that God might be a committee?
--- Jubal Harshaw
No one said intel was going to sit idle, but what they have planned isn't going to hold a candle to the K7 (if AMD ever gets the K7 outta the factory and into my new motherboard) The K7 will really mix shit up, and I can't wait, maybe intel does have some kind of super processor waiting in the wings, but i doubt it. They have delayed merced enough, and now it seems it won't even perform all that great compared to what else is going to be around.
From www.pricewatch.com:
Intel P3-450 = $500
AMD K6-3 450 = $475
AMD's price is ridiculous, when it only excels the P3-450 in Win98 Office benchmarks (www.tomshardware.com). What is AMD thinking? The Celeron is definitely a much better deal for low-price systems. AMD will never make any sales with that price.
I'm still waiting for a non-Apple G3 that's a real computer-not an industrial motherboard. I guess linuxppc doesn't have a market for it's own desktops
But I refuse to buy a Mac, unless Apple releases G3 and G4 motherboard specs to Be.
^ ~~^~
I've always said Apple is like an ex girlfriend, sure they look good but there is bad relationship dynamics. Compared to Jobs, Gates is a benevolant dictator.
^~~^~^^~~^~^~^~^^~^^~^~^~~^^^~^^~~^~~~
NINTENDO?!?! HAHAH! a) Games for N aren't made on an N for a reason, N suck for anything other than games. b) N makes I look like angels. Consoles get sold at a loss because N makes money on all games sold. Imagine the cost for all software going up by $5 and it going to I... then you'd have rather cheap PCs.
If you manage to get through high-school and not flunk out for playing too many video games, please get rid of your media shaped prejudices and start baseing your prejudices on who is actually trying to screw you the most, instead of who is merely trying to put out a better product with some rather difficult constraints.
BTW, if you have any idea of how much an actual workstation costs [i.e. HP, IBM, Sun] you wouldn't be complaining about over-engineered motherboards in PCs.
Actually, the article on the k6-3 posted a few days ago said that amd currently has the fastest x86 processor. Just barely, but still marks a new era for non-intel types.
I did my part. Bought a K62-350, w/ASUS MB, ASUS TNT card and some RAM this week!
No replacement for displacement.
Dave T.
The author of the article must not be interested in a machine that has a monitor larger than 17". It would take me a matter of 5 minutes to find a computer that was over $2500. (SCSI Adaptor, HDD, CD, etc..)
how much do amd chips cost compared to intel? and do they perform better/worse/the same in linux?