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Yet Another GNOME Article
Anonymous Coward writes "More GNOMEy in the news,
Sunday Philadelphia Inquirer Business Section, bottom fold
- fullspan artical." Mostly about Miguel. Fairly
amusing.
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Do all GNOME articles have to be announced? This is getting boring...
[snipped from said article]
Like Microsoft's ubiquitous DOS operating system and its interface, Windows, Linux and Gnome allow users to simply click on icons to write letters, play games, and surf the Internet.
[snip]
Well he may be clueless about some things but it's been a while since I've seen a reporter aknowledging that windows is STILL just a GUI for DOS...
They use a cluster of AlphaLinux computers (130 or so) to render the water shots.
Damn, my computer's been faking it!
:(
And I thought is was really responding when I was playing with it's mouse!
Still, industry analysts say de Icaza's project does pose a threat that many technology companies now recognize.
With releases like GNOME 1.0, the only thing GNOME is a threat to is itself!
uselinux@email.com
And don't get me wrong, I am looking forward to a stable GNOME release so that I can see if a transition from my KDE desktop is possible or not. If it is maybe I'll use GNOME for a while. But as long as important things, like the file manager, aren't 95% functional, I can't switch. I want to be at least as productive in GNOME as I am now in KDE, otherwise what would be the point in switching?
uselinux@email.com
I dont understand this. GNOME _never_ crashes on me!
I swear, Linux International should start a class action suit against 'Windows NT Mag' for intentionaly slandering Linux.
1) Linux was used on around 130 DEC Alphas to do water rendering.
2) SGI was used as NFS servers
3) NT was used with softimage for scene compositing.
I've heard many people (or the same person many tmies) on /. mention that the file manager for GNOME crashed easily / a lot for them. That's simply unacceptable for me.
I'd check it out for myself, but as long as the lib reqs remain huge and a pain to fetch and install, I don't have time to bother.
uselinux@email.com
So does your GNOME file manager crash?
uselinux@email.com
Now that Red Hat is interfacing to Slashdot, it's necessary to post the occasional GNOME article.
It's Miguel that is telling people Linux has no GUI other than Gnome. Look at all his quotes in previous articles.
GNOME IS NOT A WINDOW MANAGER!
Unlike KDE, gnome doesn't even have an official WM. You can use any WM with Gnome. But Gnome aware WM's work best (like E or blackbox).
Gnome is a collection of libs, design concepts, and applets that use those libs and design concepts.
When you make a Gnome app you use the gnome framework to help you quickly produce a high quality app which plays quite well with other gnome apps (and the rest of the world too!).
I dont think there actually is a lack of press on KDE. There is just a lack of /. headlines on KDE.
Alex
I heared that RedHat has hired the UDE people to merge
GNOME and UDE. This will really be a powerfull
combination since the UDE window manager is much
faster than GNOME's (It is written in assembly!!)
I know, especially since they overlooked that linux has had a GUI since X11 and the first window manager. GNOME is supposed to be an Idiot-proof enhancement to that GUI. It isn't the "first" GUI like the article states.
I don't think that there's any 'button pushing' going on. The GNOME 1.0 release during LinuxWorld was a big PR stunt that paid off for GNOME in a big way. You add that, the 'poor, third-world, Mexican kid' angle, and (maybe) the RedHat 'GNOME is our desktop of the future' noise that you've seen in alot of RedHat pieces over the last year, and that is why you're getting all these GNOME pieces.
KDE just doesn't have it. No ultra-high profile release. Written by a bunch of Germans. (Who cares? Germans build cool stuff all the time.) Only articles about SuSE might have mentioned it, and they get alot less press in the States then RedHat does. Add it all up and it makes KDE largely unknown and a boring story.
There is some good news, even for all the KDE lovers out there. When people see 'GNOME makes Linux usable for the everyday computer know-nothing', they go out and buy Linux, not GNOME. Everybody will soon be shipping both (even RedHat), so then it'll be a matter of which has better functionality, better looks, and better stability. The best desktop will be in a good position to 'win'. So, from a KDE perspective, you should look at it as a win for Linux, not just for GNOME, and certainly not as being 'bad' for KDE.
On a side note: how many people here have tried the latest GNOME release? I picked up the 1.0.3
stuff the other day and the stability is GREATLY improved. Gmc still has big problems, but the rest of it seems to be ready for prime-time. Looking back, I'd say that the buggy 1.0 release wasn't a bad idea. It definitely was not 1.0 material, but it wasn't that far off, AND it's garnered Linux ALOT of very main-stream press coverage, so in the end it was probably worth it.
My $0.02.
AF
(It is written in assembly!!)
An X window manager written in assembly? Uhh, yeah....
I guess that's easier if you don't need to support the mouse.
My KDE is compiled directly to machine code by my compiler (obtained from cygnus). Isn't that great? It should be as fast as UDE!
Well you should stop using that mouse and start learning the "arcane but reliable commands in the Unix computer language."
;-)
The bit about "Microsoft's ubiquitous DOS operating system and it's interface, Windows" was pretty close to the mark, though, if only by accident. I've can't help but think of Win9x as VisualDos++
-Steve
KDE has Bernd Wuebben; the guy has all the charisma of a horse's ass.
Well, while I don't think Gnome is stable enough for 1.0, I think it's close. I disagree with the bloat part. Gnome is impressive in it's efficiency. Yes it uses more resources than AnotherLevel, etc. but far less than KDE, and Gnome is also quite modular. This is not an attack on KDE, but memory footprint is a *very* valid criticism of it, and Gnome does very well here. I booted my machine with mem=12M and mem=16M today and Gnome+Netscape-communicator was still usable, though slower than with the normal 128M. I'm getting excited about Gnome, though it is not yet as stable as KDE. (Off the record, I spent half this afternoon (Sunday) playing with GTK+ themes, but don't tell anyone I said that ;-) )
The KDE people trashed Red Hat and GNOME.
They said Red Hat was taking control...
Gee thanks assholes. Now the press thinks that
we want to emulate NT perfectly, right down to
the last blue screen.
Now, be honest. GNOME kicks ass. When you trash
GNOME and Red Hat, you trash Linux. You don't
divert anyone to your preferred distribution or
desktop. You send them away.
Assembler must make it kinda hard to support on ia32, ia64, sparc, alpha, mips, palm pilot, etc.
Several posters seem amazed at the innacuracies, particularly
about Linux not using the mouse and there being no gui for Linux
(before Gnome), and also wonder why so much attention is being
focused on Gnome.
First, why the attention. Because of RedHat sponsorship - and
the mainstream takes gnote of corporate investements in RedHat.
These stories are mostly because of the big money - IBM, Netscape,
etc. Did you see these articles about RedHat before the investment
frenzy?
Regarding the inaccuracies, assuming the interview was conducted
in person (I did read the piece), certainly Miguel is sharp and
perceptive enough to pick up that the writer may be misinformed
about a few things, but does nothing to set the record straight.
Clearly the impression the writer had that Linux had no gui
until Gnome was known to Miguel. Forget KDE, Linux has had
a gui for years. Not to correct such blatant inaccuracies is
inexcusable. Certainly he is well aware of some issues, to say
the least, regarding the Gnome hype and should go out of his way
to let the interviewer know something about X and that Linux
has had such a gui for years even if it can use some improvement.
The last thing in the world we need is "newbies" rushing out to
install and use Gnome. The product is not ready, and it further
seems that Gnome has some structural flaws that can't be corrected
with bug fixes. A rewrite of much of Gnome is needed. For an
impartial review read the 6 page review (with screenshots in
detail) in the Mining Co. Linux "Forcus on Linuux" The reviewer
wanted to give kudos to Gnome but couldn't. The review also
hinted at what these structural problems might be.
The hype of Gnome by people who should gnow better and the
blatant dissing of other Linux desktop solutions (including other
GNU projects like GNUstep) by pretending to a clueless press that
these other solutions don't exist can do great damage if any of
these people ever try to use Gnome themselves anytime soon
or get the true story from others in LInux circles about what
the Linux gui really is like.
Do not blame the press for these inaccuracies. Blame the persons
being interviewed if you must blame anyone.
It's time to stop walking on eggshells with a few personalities
and hold them accountable. Joe and Jane sixpack certainly will
not use a desktop that makes Windows look stable. These cows
aren't sacred to them. Don't you think that you, Slashdotters,
have at least the critical skills of Joe Sixpack? So long as
persons are allowed to get away with spreading misinformation
they will continue to do so - that's human nature.
The AlphaLinux farm was used for the rendering. Lightwave was used on the NT boxes to do water reflection effects, as I recall. SGI was not involved at all, to my knowledge. Both Digital Unix and SGI were considered but dismissed as overly expensive.
Thanks a lot. Please, feel free to email me. I'd like to thank you directly
The truth is difficult to speak out because it's this: the truth. I'm glad you did.
ctibirna@gch.ulaval.ca
"The product is not ready, and it further seems that Gnome has some structural flaws that can't be corrected with bug fixes. A rewrite of much of Gnome is needed"
I hope you made such claim by looking at the code, not the review on Mining.co. And if you do looks at the codes, in what way GNOME have structural flawas that can't be corrected with bugs fixes ?
And its need rewrite ? How come ? I need you to explain since you made the claim.
gmc does crash alot for me. unfortantly that is part of gmc and not gnome-libs gnome-core and the other parts of gnome that are 1.0 I havent had the panel crash on me sense pre 1.0 releases. but I would have to say that gmc is still not any where near there yet. but with every new release of gmc i knowtice that things that crashed it beofre no longer crash it. it use to be that just copying bin files to the desktop crashed it all the time now i havent been able to get the newest version mentioned on freshmeat to crash even though I realy havent had time to try.
The Arson Smith
It's because Miguel is hispanic, which is also why most of the article focus on him rather than GNOME. Just take note of the author's hispanic-sounding name combined with his glaring lack of technical knowledge, and it's pretty clear what the raison d'etre of the article is. Young hispanic men have a stereotype which is much different from, and much more negative than that of an intelligent programmer. Articles like this exist more to break those stereotypes than to feature a particular technology. Not that there's anything wrong with that, but it shouldn't pretend to be a technical or business article and then proceed to get so many technical or business details wrong. Just lose the pretense and make it clear by the headline that the article is about Miguel.
Oh well, with the current spate of mainstreaming (read: quotas) going on in the American newspaper trade, expect to see more thinly veiled "community self-esteem" pieces like this one in the future.
Cheers,
ZicoKnows@hotmail.com
It simple. KDE is pretty much nothing but a knock-off
of the Win95 GUI. Why should anyone care about it?
Gnome on the other hand, will change people
perceptions on just what a GUI interface is supposed to
look and act like.
In other words KDE repensents the past of GUI
useage and Gnome repensents the future of the
GUI...
Or zvt for that matter...
does anyone else find this phrase disturbing?? i mean... it makes it sound like all there is out there is Windows operating systems..
Yes, I found it disturbing. I found it as disturbing as the Catholic and Protestant distinction. The phrase was used in such a way as to indicate that Windows is not only the norm, but the RIGHT way, and that Linux is something else.
Bad file manager integration into applications (actually, none at all), no internet transparency, bad division of labor into subprocesses, and let's not forget the frequent segfaulting...
Indeed, this has been going on for about a year. Reporters try Red Hat or go to them for interviews, and they hear all about GNOME and not a single word about KDE.
Perpetuates the myth that the Linux GUI is not there yet, doesn't it?
That's the biggest and most troubling problem.
Well, I'm glad to hear that Red Hat is putting some money into it. The first thing they ought to do is build a vanilla RH 5.2 system and then attempt to install GNOME as listed on yesterday's GNOME web page for Red Hat. First thing you're supposed to install is glib, only you can't because of the interdependencies with a half-dozen other RPM's. After spending 3 hours downloading the latest subsets, I was a bit disappointed (well, no, I was downright pissed, to be blunt) that neither "-ivh" nor "-Uvh" could get around the problem.
Yeah, they're right - GNOME ain't for newbies, especially those that have been around since the SLS/0.99-8 days.
grist to the GNOME fanatic's mill.
;)
The slip is showing - slow, buggy code - isn't that what they accused KDE of - looks like they copied more than they should have
Trash Redhat, trash Linux - I don't think so.
Anyway GNOME is so buggy it makes windows looks good - looks like GNOME is trashing Linux. Don't equate GNOME and Linux, Linus doesn't. Linux is stable Gnome is flaky shit.
Everyone can blame Slashdot for mutating the phrase, "Yet another, ..." into a cliche. Remember, also, to abstain from overusing the word "fairly"; it's getting FAIRLY AMUSING.
I was surprised to find that Linux "doesn't use a mouse" - odd, since I've been running Linux since 1993, and with each and every one of the GUIs I've used (OpenLook, fvwm, CDE, KDE, Blackbox, Icewm...) I've made heavy use of the mouse.
Even when I'm not in X, I use the mouse plenty, since Linux allows you to copy and paste with the mouse even in a terminal. Then there's quake, and again, I find myself using the mouse in Linux.
In the light of all that, you can imagine what a great shock it was to find that I've been imagining all this mouse usage the past 6 years!
The above comment says that the article talks "mostly about Miguel". In fact, most GNOME articles in the mainstream press talk mostly about Miguel. The same is probably true for Linux and Linus.
Perhaps this would explain the lack of press on KDE? KDE does not seem to have a here analogous to Miguel or Linus. It would be interesting to see if a select KDE hero could improve KDE press too.
can anyone explain to me the reason why GNOME gets press as being some kind of revolution in the linux world? i'm not trying to be snide here, i actually don't understand. it was my impression that fvwm, kde, enlightenment etc all do the same thing as GNOME (they all are xwindows managers right?), so why such the hoopla for GNOME?
As little as a year or so ago, Linux (along with much other "free
software") was largely being dismissed by the main-stream tech media
as "fringe." Now not only do tech media folks take it seriously, but
non-tech popular media are talking about it as well. The editors of
/. celebrate this. Many of you that hang out here, OTOH, seem able
to do little more than flame about any flaws in such coverage.
You liked it better when Linux and related projects were ignored?
As a long-time 2nd Amendment rights supporter, I can tell you all
about bad, clueless, and dishonest press coverage. When you're in
such a position, *any* positive coverage, even if it contains
inaccuracies (providing they're not *too* damaging) is good
coverage. And cause for celebration.
Methinks some of you ought to consider how far Linux and Open Source
have come these last few months, rather than complaining about the
unfortunate mistake made here-and-there.
I'm testin' here. Don't mind me.
Rob "CmdrTaco" Malda
Pants are Optional
Pants are still optional, but recommended for you.
My psychology prof was telling us last week how a study of health stories in newspapers found that they were only like 70% factually correct. From my personal observations, I'd say that mainstream newspapers are only like 40-50% factually correct in computer/technology stories.
It doesn't even surprise me anymore.
As for why all the hoopla for GNOME, it's pretty simple. It's because for years people have been told by Microsoft and Apple that only they have the brainpower and resources to create that type of environment. Along comes a kid from Mexico and shows every sign of replicating their work and making it better at the same time, and as if that wasn't enough he's giving it away for free! Can't beat that with a stick as far as good feature stories go.
Please note that the above paragraph makes the same oversimplifications the press does specifically to show you their viewpoint.
The only real question I have is why KDE hasn't gotten the same kind of press. The license issues that made it such a pariah to many aren't even going to be on the radar screen of the mainstream press. Kinda makes you wonder if someone isn't pushing some buttons somewhere, huh?
My fault for not being clear, but this is actually the kind of thing I meant by button pushing. Someone (RH for instance) who gets a fair amount of press attention saying 'by the by, check this out'. Not anything really wrong with this, but they should probably point to both projects.
I should probably also note that I don't use either environment. I tried GNOME a while back and didn't like it, and I've never tried KDE.
I don't know if you were at LinuxWorld Expo, but the majority of desktops that I saw were KDE (and not by just a little). I just found it funny that the press is all over GNOME when KDE appears to be the desktop that most people are currently using (if they use one at all).
Posted by FascDot Killed My Previous Use:
This is WAY off-topic....
So I heard about e-conf making E configuration easy and decided to try it again (making attempt #3). I got it all down and installed. I started running it. No e-conf. Can't find it on my system anywhere. Can find many references on webpages and so forth, but no links. THEN I discover that e-conf requires GNOME. WTF? Why can't I have a simple E config editor (or at least a single document describing what to edit and how).
I swear, I want to love E, but it's getting REALLY hard.
Posted by FascDot Killed My Previous Use:
Wow! That helps a lot, thanks.
I still need some basic info, though. For instance, I need to know how to change the desktop-change quick-key from ctrl-alt-arrow to just ctrl-arrow (like fvwm). Also, how do I change the calls to external progs in the buttons/menus. And when can I have a pager?
"Even though it doesn't use a mouse and runs on arcane but reliable commands in the complex Unix computer language, Linux software last year was chosen to run 17 percent of the business computers shipped by manufacturers, up from 7 percent in 1997, according to the research firm International Data Corp." -- the author of the article
Yup, really nailed it there. I didn't realize that my mouse (with which I done cut and pasted the above) wasn't actually being used.
It's also nice to see their deep understanding of what GNOME is/does. (bloat, crash, not compile... uh, I mean, look pretty, provide a WIMP interface, etc... it's actually not so bad so far, for me)
Where do these people come from? I mean, is there a DeVry-type place where people can get stupidity training? Does Microsoft furnish free reporters for Linux stories like these? How many licks does it take to get to the center of a Tootsie Pop?
The world may never know...
Remember that what's inside of you doesn't matter because nobody can see it.
I do hope to see gnome improve... I think it's a great idea/concept. But calling it v1.x is a sad marketing gimmick, just in time for Linuxworld, as has been mentioned many times. ;-(
I'm sure he appreciates that. :-|
Anyway, it may be good in the long run that the press doesn't focus on a personality for KDE; that way thy may be forced to write something more substantial than "KDE/GNOME/whatever has little icons just like windows". Oh brother...
TedC
And this shows structural flaws how...?
Daniel
Hurry up and jump on the individualist bandwagon!
Funny, when I choose "Log Out", I log out...
Daniel
Hurry up and jump on the individualist bandwagon!
Gnome (and KDE, lest I be flamed by the Slashdot Horde) attempt to provide two things: first a 'consistent' look-and-feel across a wide suite of programs, and second, the "glue" utilities needed for the proverbial "normal user" (whatever that means) to do useful things on a computer. The handy little tools that don't exist in Linux because 90% of linux users (and 100% of linux developers! [ok, these may be exaggerated] ) just drop into a shell when they need to do something 'advanced' like, eg, copying a file. Yes, there are file managers out there already..the idea is to make a file manager, a search tool, a run-program tool, a cute little taskbar/launcher dock tool, a print manager, ... -- all the little things that people rely on all the time and don't notice because (someday! Not there yet) it works so well. The things that are tedious to write as a group of programs, but necessary for the system to be functional as a complete GUI. Think of it as the GNU tool suite of graphical interfaces.
Daniel
Hurry up and jump on the individualist bandwagon!
Moderate yourself!
Good judgement comes from experience, and experience comes from bad judgement.
- W. Wriston, former Citibank CEO
It's kind of neat to see the GUI effortsgetting so much press coverage. At last, this is a aspect of Linux's superiority that plan old users can understand. Hopefully the positive buzz will encourage people to give Linux a spin (especially once they see the eye candy that comes with GTK and Enlightenment! Woohoo!) No longer will we have to listen to "Linux is like Unix? Oh, I can't stand all those techie commands. I'll stick to Windowseven though I think Bill Gates is the Antichrist and want to eviscerate him on my front lawn." ;)
By the way, I'm thinking some of you will be concerned about the fact that GNOME is getting so much more publicity than KDE. I wouldn't worry too much. Th mainstream press is playing its usual game of picking up and article somewhere, going, "Hmmnn, that's interesting," getting a new interview with the article's subject, and basicall cribbing the content of the original. It's a sad ravesty of invertigative journalism, but it sems to be the norm noawadays. (I'm afraid the Internet is encouraging it, too, and detacting from real investigation as lazy writers sit on their asses in front of computers instead of going outside.) Anyway,the practical result for us is that all it takes is one artcle about KDE, and the press hounds will jump on the story and run it to death just as hard as they're unning GNOME now. Just look at all last year's articles about Linux!
Hmmmmnnn, maybe they should call them"press copycapts" instead of "Press hounds". ;)
PS: APologies for the typos, of which I'm sure there aremany. Halfway through this article my !@&*^# Sun display got munged.
Beer recipe: free! #Source
Cold pints: $2 #Product
I've compiled it on a RH 4.1 machine, and it seems to work ok. The only thing that I've seen that was flaky was midnight commander -- just as you have. I wonder if that is what everyone is griping about. Although it might be a difference between compiling it yourself and just installing the rpms.
The rest of the apps seem to work just fine. In fact, I was surprised as hell when gnumeric was able to read in an Excel 97 worksheet. It mangled a column, but other than that everything was ok.
the good ground has been paved over by suicidal maniacs
If this was written by their "tech journalist" than they need to find a new one. The inaccuracy and lack of understanding was painful.
--Lenny
I don't remeber if it was off-the-shelf-software or something in house. Anyways, I don't think Linux was used to do the actual designing (could be wrong), but it was used to do the scene generation.
Hmm. Rob's test message gets a score of 2, and my follow-up message teasing him get's the hell moderated out of it. Oh well, guess one of the moderators is having a bad day or somthing.
;) I love slashdot, no where else can I get all my linux AND starwars news!
Anyways, cool to see Rob occasionally post alongside the unwassed masses.
.... and won't be any time soon.
---
---
we stand in life at midnight, we are always on the threshold of a new dawn.
Wrong. "fvwm" and Enlightenment are window managers; KDE and Gnome are collections of a bunch of pieces of software, including:
People can argue about whether that stuff is useful, but it's difficult to argue that it's not there....
See the What is KDE? document and the GNOME User's Guide for more details.
Bruce
Bruce Perens.
Seeing how well it worked out, both technically and financially, their competitors are gearing up now to do likewise. (I couldn't possibly say who I heard that from. :-)
"The question of whether machines can think is no more interesting than [] whether submarines can swim" - Dijkstra
A friend in the computer graphics industry tells me that a lot of their main commercial tools are starting to get ported to Linux now.
It wasn't just the effect of Titanic; the industry is well aware of the worldwide trend towards Linux, and their artists and designers curse the lousiness of W95 and NT as a professional platform every bit as strongly as do software engineers.
"The question of whether machines can think is no more interesting than [] whether submarines can swim" - Dijkstra
It's totally inconsistent. Like choosing "log out" from enlightenmant menu and nothing happening. Doh! Or choosing "log out from the panel, and having the panel quit, but the wm stays running.
There are huge numbers of UI inconsistencies like this. You've just been running Linux so long you don't notice.
Gnome sure is pretty, but it isn't even close to being ready for daily use. Most of the applets and other programs are not even close to 1.0, the libs are about the only things that's ready.
support gun control: take guns from cops
Linux is the system of choice for serious computer operators, de Icaza said, recalling that even the special effects in the movie Titanic were created with Linux-powered computers. ok, so you mean they used blender instead of the other tools you can get on SGI's and NT????
---
I feel that it is an honor you posted to my msg :) Keep up the good work!
---
they should try gnome first before slamming NT :/
---
Here's some info, if you're interested:
http://www.linuxjournal.com/issue46/2494.html
"During the work on Titanic the facility had approximately 350 SGI CPUs, 200 DEC Alpha CPUs and 5 terabytes of disk all connected by a 100Mbps or faster network. "
does anyone else find this phrase disturbing?? i mean... it makes it sound like all there is out there is Windows operating systems... this, for some reason, really bothers me... i use windows a lot and am just beginning with linux and this really bothers me... :-/
:-)
:-)
BTW - for anyone who read my last messages about my modem - i fixed it! had an irq conflict even though isapnp was setting it to what it shoulda been it was still wrong... used setserial and BOOM, fixed
8Complex
PS: if anyone knows a program that makes it simple to use, create, and edit Enlightenment themes, please mail me
hmm...i thought being called a hacker was one of the best things you could be called.
Other than that and the thing about Linux not using a mouse (definitely needs to lay off the glue sniffing), a pretty fair article.
btw, are we really up to 12 million already?
Just lose the pretense and make it clear by the headline :)
While that may satisfy the techies who look at the article to find info about technical stuff, (by warning them that there's none there) it will also lose some of the stereotype breaking effectiveness if they titled the article "Hey look, there's a really smart hispanic guy over here!" - that would instantly limit the article's audience to people who already wanted to know about really smart hispanic guys. Instead, they make it a 'technical' article, and insert technobable from their file (which is only 7 or 8 years old) and then they can attract a much wider audience, which serves the purpose of getting their message out to more people. Lots of corporate non-techies read tech articles like that one so they can 'keep up' with technology, and they're the ones who that article is really aimed at - it brings things into their non-tech perspective, and sneaks in the anti-stereotyping as a sideline. Plus, the article did originate in Mexico City, so it's also only natural that they'd want to highlight major contributions originating in their own country.
Anyhow, even if it's not the most technically correct article, it's still good to see linux/gnome/free software/etc... in a positive light. More articles like that will encourage managers and educators to take a look into Linux and free software, when they ordinarily wouldn't have even thought of it otherwise. I can see some North American schools installing linux and forcing the Gym teacher to learn/teach it, just so they can stay 'ahead of the mexican schools'. (Yes, gym teacher. That's what my school did when they needed a new computer teacher. Apparently it was cheaper/easier to move an existing teacher and hire a new gym teacher than to hire someone with some technical knowlege. And no, he didn't have any experience in computers before that, it was kinda fun to watch him trying to log in after we put a password on his account other than just 'enter'.)
FIRST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
:P
Damn, I forgot to log in anonymously
(For the clue-deficient, this is a joke)
--
Paranoid
Paranoid
Bwaahahahahaa.
does anyone else find this phrase disturbing?
:)
Umm, no. I'm actually proud of that phrase. I consider linux good (but not, of course, the only) proof that there is Life After Microsoft. Everything commercialized about computers tends to piss me off (including web banners).
And good show about yer serial port. When I installed linux 1.4 years ago, it took me two weeks to figure out how to get the dang thing to dial. Though Red Hat had a nifty GUI tool to make this easier, it wasn't clearly marked, and then of course theres the problem of making the GUI work (which I succeeded in one week later). I've since learned a lot and ditched the dialup. The learning curve is steep but I have no problem with accepting that, seeing how powerful the system as a whole can be
--
Paranoid
Paranoid
Bwaahahahahaa.
Well, I would assume that GNOME has some sort of list of credits, names and emails of significant contributors. A list of those can be found exactly.
They cover topics related to politics and stuff like that because they just haven't used Unix or Linux.
Is there any other way to maintain a web server?
(I know linux is free, but the hardware isn't)
besides, there are times when they are useful.
The Gnome panel has a pager that works with enlightenment, so as soon as you install gnome and run the panel (inserting "exec gnome-session" in your executable (i.e. "chmod +x ~/.xinitrc, once it exists) ~/.xinitrc file, immediately after the "#! /bin/sh" line (the # must be the first character on the first line)).
They laughed at Einstein. They laughed at the Wright Brothers. But they also laughed at Bozo the Clown. -- C. Sagan
GMC is going to get rewritten. It does have some internal problems.
gnome-terminal (and the zvt library it is based on) works fine. People have complained about it but I have not seen a substantial explanation of the problem yet.
But you do know exactly how many have write access to the CVS tree. That is probably where the number came from.
The part about DOS having icons you click on was interesting. Not only do we have to live down the myth that Linux is all commandline-based, we have to fight the myth that DOS is graphical!
I've been using GNOME (compiled using pgcc from source RPMS) since 1.0 came out. I've been using Enlightenment pre-0.15 or whatever it was that came out then too. Neither has crashed on me yet. At all. Nothing, I repeat, nothing, has crashed on me yet. Ok, the mini-commander applet has been a bit flaky, but that's fine. What are terminals for anyway?
As I recall, the tools they used were on that platform. Probably SoftImage and friends.
iSKUNK!
Rob has posted! Let this day be remembered :-)
(Slashdot sysadmin, and only four posts in the last so many weeks? Guess the blurb on Wired was a bit off *grin*)
iSKUNK!
Just a suggestion...
i've been faithfully using it for a few months now, and was very surprised when it went 1.0. it still has a very alpha feel to it.
probably going to have to mentally append 'alpha' to any gnome release for the next 6 months.
okay, 237 + miguel makes 238 programmers working on GNOME. I thought that it was impossible to find out how many people actually contribute code to free software projects.
-?-
Why not tell the word processing and solitaire playing public that there is a way for them to do just what they need, with out shelling out the $ for Windows?
Even my parents are interested in Linux, and they don't have a damn clue about programming, they just want to check their email, play some games, and write some letters. They're tickled to know that they won't have to pay $100+ for the next upgrade to Windows!
And yes, I'm sure the non-technical thinking might change as people in general get more comfortable with Linux, but that may take years. Remember how long it's taken for just 50% of Americans to have a computer at home? And that's with the "user-friendly" interfacs of Windows and the Macintosh.
Ive been using E, for two weeks, (been waiting a long time for .15 to come out (didnt like all the bugs in .14). I am MORE than satisfied with new .15..it is my understanding that e was written with gnome in mind. e-conf and esd(the E sound Daemon) were both written to work with gnome. That is why they appear with gnome in the mirror sites and not with the E distrobution. Makes sense, and gnome just atakes a bit of d/lin .. look at http://www.gnome.org ..there are step by step instructions... the only thing i do use in regards is panel, because it is so handy and configurable.
/usr/local/enlightement/bin and run eesh, and type 'help'...
btw, you can use eesh to set everything manually just like in e-conf. in a term look in
Scott
--respon in email if you care, i wont see this again.