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Yellow Dog Linux Released
bondo writes "Yellow Dog Linux, the new G3 Linux distribution is now accepting orders at www.yellowdoglinux.com. " Head over to check it out.
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I don't know about the G3 (I run LinuxPPC R4 on a PowerTower Pro 225 mac clone) but it seems relatively speedy compared to its Pentium counterparts.
However, that's just processing power. The video seems to suffer somewhat, presumedly due to the lack of any kind of acceleration. I really don't know (most of my Linux experience is on the PPC).
Still, it has come a long way in the last year or so - kudos to the LinuxPPC people who are doing the lions share of the work (mklinux and yellow dog are cool too for simply existing, though!).
- Darchmare
- Axis Mutatis, http://www.axismutatis.net
- Jeff
Does the Mac linux get a bunch of extra processing done from the g3 architecture?
mkLinux actually does have a Linux kernel AFAIK, It runs that kernel on top of Mach. Basically it makes the linux kernel into a wrapper.
the base of a new Redhat (gnu? :) ) distro that will be targeted at those out there with Mac hardware.
They're covering all the bases, arn't they?
CodeWarrier Too
(on his brothers machine sans password)
Well, since I wanted to support free software anyway...
What's wrong with free software? It runs on Macs, and they already _have_ what you list, for the most part. Isn't it _good_ to start using Linux and embrace the whole free software movement? What's so useful about using linux to run proprietary x86 binaries? Can't you use Windows for that?
GOOD ONE!!! ;-D
iSKUNK!
While the video was a problem on the PowerTowers, beige Apple G3s past Rev. B (i.e., the ones with the ATI Rage Pro Turbo instead of the Rage II) have extremely good video performance. In general, I think the benchmarks are about 10-20% faster than a Pentium at the same MHz. (I'd have to double check that; I can't remember quite where I read it.) There's also a link to a report at MacCentral where ZDNet or somebody found that a 400 MHz G3 Macintosh was faster than a similarly equiped 500 MHz Pentium III. I'll post back later if I can find the exact article.
Now.. I wish WordPerfect, Glide, Quake1/2/3, Real Player and Oracle run on it..
This is a harsh reality. You are limited to FREE software only if you choose to run Linux on non-intel archs.
The YellowDog server distribution appears to available now; only the "Home" version isn't there yet.
This is good to see. It's also good to see Apple promoting Yellow Dog LINUX on their website.
Perhaps Yellow Dog will become the Redhat of the G3 PowerMAC's. (now there's a contentious statement--is that a good or bad thing?) I'd have to say that even their packaging appears to appeal to the artistic side in typical Mac customers.
Now it remains to be seen what this "Yellow Dog Desktop" looks like. Couldn't they have used KDE or Gnome or something? Perhaps it's a MAC-ish desktop?
I really have to protest what they say on their "diffs" faq-- LinuxPPC does come with support from LinuxPPC Inc.
It's with EVERY CD we sell.
Plus, people can buy support from LinuxCare.
Nice FUD, YDL.
-- haaz.
>I've often thought the solution to this is make a compiler that compiles into a pseudo machine code, which then would be compiled to a binary. This
:-?
would NOT be java, which is a stack based virtual chip.
Obfuscating the source does pretty much the same thing. Either way it sucks.
Loki Games WILL be releasing a patch for running Civ3 on LinuxPPC... it's rather trivial I am told. They could do the same with Quake at Id if they want... it's the "media" or WAD files that you're buying... and iD realized this long ago when they first supported Linux. Same thing with linuxPPC homefully..
Umm. no. :)
Think Lab. This distro comes from the fresh mountain springs of Colorado.
win95/winNT-client/winNT-server ? How about psychotomy?
I see even classic Slashdot is now pretty much unusable on dial up anymore.
One of the pages on the site says that FTP download will be available "soon".
this is an australian ditro right ??
yellow dog = dingos right ??
ah well like allen I forgot my password ( ;
---
;>
:>
1000x2000 pixel background picture? Clearly, these are Macintosh people.
---
Isn't it great?
Seriously though, I thought the page was okay but not terribly attractive. They may be Mac people, but most Mac people can design better sites than that.
(I know, I know, promoting computing stereotypes, blah blah blah).
- Darchmare
- Axis Mutatis, http://www.axismutatis.net
- Jeff
So, all you droolers who want Linux to be happening on PPC, you gotta be aggressive. Email these publishers and hound them for a PPC version. Now we have three distros, Linux is well established on this platform. We have to put on the pressure or we'll fall by the wayside. It's ridiculous that even as Linux presents an alternative to Micosoft, our hardware choices should be limited to what Windows runs on.
After setting up my first PC running Linux, I am all the more thankful about the IRQ crap I didn't have to go through on Apple hardware. Could the coming-of-age of Linux spark a move toward better hardware? Damn straight it could. Big software publishers(even Microsoft) haven't been this malleable and open to change in a long time, let's not drop the ball. Kick butt!
Basically Apple is worried a little. The big thing is Apple wants to support linux if it doesn't hurt Apple.. (Gee, not that surprising eh?) If Linux doesn't increase machine sales without hurting OS X sales then I doubt there will be any problems.
>I think I like this idea, making a distro specifically for the
>home user. But then I think about it some more, and I like the fact
>that your standard Linux distro does whatever you want it to.
Well, yes -- but the point is that the standard Linux user can't do whatever they want to. And doesn't want to have the choice.
As long as there is a commoditization of Linux from a kernel standpoint, the individual distributions must achieve some kind of unique quality to survive. And if Linux is to continue growing at an appreciable rate, it has to move beyond the sysadmin/engineer/geek market.
Don't force every distribution to be identical.
lake effect weblog
{Network engineer in Chicago--looking for work!}
Posted by OGL:
Oh yeah, I forgot to add (insert Homer Simpson drooling sound here).
yeah. Where is their download? This IS linux, isn't it?
d
"I'll whip your pretty little dog with my GNUattorney!"
...
Note that while the distribution supports iMacs, they state that their installer does not work, but an update will be "available soon."
Check out their list of supported hardware for more details.
1. Who cares?
2. This has nothing to do with Yellow Dog Linux. It uses the standard Linux kernel, not MkLinux.
Posted by OGL:
...I REALLY want one of those 400mhz G3 towers. Running Linux on my desktop...
-W.W.
The more the merrier. What I like about this distro is that it works to cement Linux on Apple. Very cool.
-Master Switch, one more element in the machine
Fortunately all i need is linux - i've got the 400MHz G3 (waiting on my extra 128mb dimm).
boy i just can't wait til i have macos, macosxserver and linux all on my box. (which is blindingly fast btw - for instance the mp3 encode time to play time ratio is 0.5 : 1)
Woo Hoo!
-- This and all my posts are in the public domain. I am a lawyer. I am not your lawyer, and this is not legal advice.
Read the GPL. Only after you've obtained a binary from them can you demand the source. They don't automatically have to distribute anything.
BTW, I really like their logo.
WAAAAAAAAA! ME TO! THAT WOULD BE SWEET!$(#@#
If the mkLinux kernel is based on the Open Group's Mach microkernel, shouldn't it be called mkMach or GNU/mkMach since it's the Linux kernel that makes up GNU/Linux?
F.O.Dobbs
Where does YDL say that LinuxPPC Inc. doesn't supply support with their distro? I don't see it. They specify six differences between the two companies/distros, and their assertions all seem right and proper. Am I missing something?
But one thing that does bother me about this page is their confusion of LinuxPPC the distro and LinuxPPC Inc. the company. ("Yellow Dog Linux, like LinuxPPC, Inc., uses the LinuxPPC kernel...").
--Tom Geller
Tom Geller
Posted by Rahikainen:
FUD or not, LinuxPPC doesn't have anything to support, except outdated product. So, logically, YDL is correct.
Don't get me wrong. I waited, erm, a dog's age for LinuxPPC to release R5. I got bored.
It appears that the profit motive has its place.
I pray that no one comes up with a Blue Daemon BSD! :-)
1000x2000 pixel background picture? Clearly, these are Macintosh people.
It appears that they haven't updated all their pages yet...perhaps it is supported now? Quote: Will Yellow Dog Linux work on my iMac? The iMac will run Yellow Dog Linux beginning with the first release in February.
As I recall, LinuxPPC runs on virtually every non-Mac PPC computer. Of course, you'd want to look into this. But I think it even runs on the old BeBoxen. Of course, I don't know where you'd buy a non-Mac PPC computer... but then there are an awful lot of things I don't know.
--Artemisia
There are is a lot of discussion of the meaning of specmarks, bytemarks, etc. Specmarks favor Pentiums, Bytemarks favor G3's--guess who uses what in their advertising. Bottom line: using anything written for the G3, the G3 will be 30 to 50% faster in terms of net throughput, clock for clock. M$ products run a Windoze emulation, and golly gee whiz your Mac is a tiny bit slower than a PC running M$ Office, etc. As clocks crank on speed, the G3/G4 series will gain further speed advantages on the Pentium family, which does not scale as well. Intel is starting to have to use expensive parts to hold the 30--50% performance disadvantage they now suffer from (full speed L@ caches, etc.)
Fine and dandy.
Now what are our options for running this (or
LinuxPPC for that matter) on NON-Apple, NON-Mac
PPC's and G3's?
Motorola Yellowknife? Any others?
1) Where's the download? I'm curious to see what's in the distribution.
2) I noticed their "Gone Home" distribution - designed "specifically for home use." I think I like this idea, making a distro specifically for the home user. But then I think about it some more, and I like the fact that your standard Linux distro does whatever you want it to. ("It's a server!" *smack* "It's a client" *smack* "It's a server!" - sorry, Chinatown flashbacks...)
I guess I'd rather see an install that gracefully handles a home user or a commercial/power user. I'd be disappointed to see anything start a win95/winNT-client/winNT-server type dichotomy (trichotomy?) in the Linux distros. Of course, you can add whatever capabilities you want after the install, so I suppose it's no biggie.
Why? LinuxPPC has been around for a while now, I don't see how "Yellow Dog Linux" is going to make them any more worried than they might be already...
might have the people over at apple a little worried about their precious server OS.
my other penis is a vagina
This is a harsh reality. You are limited to FREE software only if you choose to run Linux on non-intel archs.
I've often thought the solution to this is make a compiler that compiles into a pseudo machine code, which then would be compiled to a binary. This would NOT be java, which is a stack based virtual chip. I was once thinking of doing this as a part time job, but the amount of work to do it was enormous, and the payoff potential small - so I cast this idea into the public domain.
Basically, this is a code obstifucator but the generated code would have the possibility of being executed on virtual machine. C, Pascal, Fortran, whatever would compile to this virtual architecture instead of a native one. The virtual machine code would be optimized so that it could compile for a variety of chips (not optimized to run as interpreted code) and it would be language independant.
So? Stupid or good idea? Plus, no more legacy Intel architecture. I like THAT idea, not to mention drivers could be written more portably. The trade off is, of course, speed. It would not be possible to make the compiled pseudo code quite as fast as directly compiled code.
400 Mhz G3 tower... Running OS8.5 now, it is so damn fast it's not even funny. I'm getting a trial copy of OSX Server, never tried a mac Linux yet, I'm a bit worried about not being able to run bianary stuff ( StarOffice, Word Perfect, other things I need...)
On the supported hardware, it even looks like they are doing a separate distribution for the iMac, which isn't ready yet.
----
Open mind, insert foot.
I don't think Apple is really worried about that. Really, the only thing that they are pushing OS X Server for is the netboot capability. Since Yellow Dog Linux does not have the software for netbooting iMacs and G3s, I don't think they really care. Remember: Apple receives most of their profits from hardware sales. They may be using Linux as a stepping stone to help get people used to their upcoming BSD UNIX based OS.
-Sol
http://www.yellowdoglinux.com/s upport/faq_diff.html
the only thing i'd like to add is that the current version of linuxppc, R4, is glibc1 based whereas YDL is glibc2. hopefully, linuxppc will get their act together now and put out R5 which will have glibc2 stuff.
-l
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Han: Chewie here tells me you're looking for passage to the Linux system.
Ben: Yes, indeed. If it's a fast chip.
Han: Fast chip? You've never heard of the PowerPC G3?
Ben: Should I have?
Han: It's the chip that made the Kessel Run in less than 12 parsecs!
Ben: d00d!!!! That'd make a rad Be0wu1f cluster!!!!!
OSX is not targeted at the desktop market (notice how there's been NO word about the blue box which runs all current mac apps?), nor is it aimed at the technical server market. Apple isn't stupid, they know if they tried to throw OSX Server against something like Linux, Solaris, NT Server, whatever, it would fail. It is targeted at their core markets - education and desktop publishing. And it will sell there. We just ordered several new G3's with OS X to run public mac labs, because with the new netboot capabilites, it it unbelieably efficient and capable for running a network. It's not competing with linux, although I think it has the balls to.
their post on www.linuxtoday.com says that the ftp
sites will have ydl soon.
580mhz all the way.
boot from CD into KDE. Pdisk and install from KDE.
While I wonder what it provides over LinuxPPC, it looks to be a Linux distro designed for MacOS users who want more things "pre-configured".
:)
I guess it's a good alternative to Mac OS X Server in some ways (price!
-Stu
Hee hee... page looked fine to ME! :-D
:-/
.ISO or 600 meg stuffit file to build an HFS CD on my work PC (T1!)..
Lest I be OT... I *am* looking forward to this distro. I would like to try it out, but there doesn't look like there's any FTP site to download it. Hmm... I'll have to wait for the next MacWorld and just try the LinuxPPC version.
Is YDL just not redistributable?? Or they have no bandwidth. Ideally I'd need an
You mean like the blue (its more a teal really) box sitting next to me? ;)
Hehehe - i love it! Too bad they don't support the Blue and White G3s yet. Hopefully soon - this article got my hopes up.