AFAIK none of the SmartCache IV and SmartRAID IV products support onboard battery backup or otherwise non-volatile cache. I see what you mean though, about existing parts at the time maybe not being up to scratch.
I think this may have backfired on them though. For one thing, there were always availability problems with these memory parts owing to the fact that DPT was the only supplier - when they were out of stock, you were out of luck. Plus, the enormous expense (and the supported alternative option of fitting standard cheap non-ECC RAM SIMMs) meant that many of their otherwise excellent controllers (and they really were the "Rolls Royce" of their type) went live underspecced. Which was always a shame because if you fit the ECC cache RAM then you get end-to-end parity checking from the PCI bus all the way to the surface of the disk.
Their products were too expensive compared to the competition, and in the end Adaptec ate their lunch, then bought them out. DPT's technologies are now only found in Adaptec's high end controllers (eg. Storage Manager On ROM).
I'm not the one ranting here. If you look back over this thread and see notice just who it is that keeps shouting in capitals I think you'll see what I mean.
As to the points you raised, I've answered them elsewhere.
It's clear that you know far less about this than you think you do. Every actual point you made (in between shouting and spewing insults) is nothing but quotes from the book of gay propaganda - either fundamentally misunderstood or just plain wrong.
I'm sorry but I don't have the time to educate you.
With regard to "fighting against the inevitable", that's just wishful thinking. There's no law of physics underlying your point of view to ensure you will get your own way; and I rather think if you keep on the way you are then when the anti-gay backlash comes (and that's the only thing that really is inevitable, because no human historical trend progresses uniformly over time) it will probably turn out to be more violent and draconian than any of us would wish.
I never said they were. It's nothing to do with pedophilia. It's everything to do with wrong-headed people recruiting confused adolescents into a relatively closed subculture based on an alternative lifestyle which would deny them the chance of a normal life. The recruiters may not even be very different in age from the recruits. I have personally seen this happen twice so it's fruitless for you to deny that it happens.
Homosexuality isn't a choice, period. That isn't propaganda, that's fact.
It is rather arrogant of you to assert this as fact. And also wrong.
As to whether homosexuality is or is not a choice, I happen to believe it *is* mostly, although probably not entirely. That is to say I believe there are some predisposing neurochemical and/or neuroanatomical factors but they no more absolutely determine one's ultimate destiny than any other non-pathological innate brain structure variation.
The truth is, insufficient research has yet been done to establish the causes of homosexuality, but the gay community have been consistently guilty of selective bias when determining which scientific papers to accept. My reading of the anatomical brain studies done so far indicates that those gender-orientation related brain differences which exist are probably developmental in nature, as are the enlarged brain regions concerned with spatial mapping found in experienced taxi drivers.
What a sorry lot the human race would be if everything we were destined to become were already stamped into our brains from before birth. I prefer to believe that we possess at least the capability of free will. And it is well established that environment is critical in determining the development of the mind, anyway. I accept that congenital factors and prenatal development factors can be significant, but only fascists believe that one's character is solely determined by genetics.
Propaganda is what you get from right-wing pundits and religious leaders.
By the way, I have no interest in the ideological rantings of either "right-wing pundits" or "religious leaders". Nor political correctness nazis for that matter, nor gay activists. My opinions are based upon my personal experiences, my knowledge of psychology, neuroscience and my own reflection. I don't believe in ideologies of any kind because they place limits upon what thoughts can be spoken, and eventually upon what thoughts can be conceived. The Orwellian Newspeak of Political Correctness is the most striking example of this today. In some legislative jurisdictions, to speak out against gay values is even characterized as "Hatecrime". That's scary.
Before you go any further I'd ask you to review this thread from start to finish and see if you can determine which of us is trying to be balanced and rational and which of us simply ranting ideology and shouting in all caps (the email equivalent of foaming at the mouth, BTW). It's important that you learn the difference if you truly want to live in peace. But then again, maybe you actually prefer aggressive confrontation.
There is no such thing as explosive decompression. The blood vessels in your lungs and eyes will rupture, and your heart will cease when it can no longer maintain blood pressure. Then your corpse will slowly freeze-dry. But there is no messy explosion.
I wonder if you're ranting against all blacks because of Rap/Hip-hop/Gansta culture being forced down your throat??
A somewhat extreme image. This is inoffensive to me because nobody is legislating for positive images of urban poor black culture in schools and in the media.
Perhaps more to the point, while my children may go through an unfortunate phase of putting their pants on backwards, adopting ebonics in their speech patterns etc, this won't prevent them from marrying and raising children in a home with two loving and committed biological parents present.
It's a simple dream, and a common one.
There is no single "gay subculture" any more than there's a single "straight culture".
Okay then let me be more specific.
I object to the loud promotion of that gay subculture defined by sexual promiscuity. That's quite widespread in the gay community, and I've seen it for myself. If they kept it to themselves I'd have no reason to object to it.
I object to the "activist" gay subculture which insists ever more loudly that they should be able to parade their deviant sexual practices (and associated lifestyles) in public view; that campaigns for "positive images" of gays in schools and in the media.
I also object to that element which sponsors, creates and promotes trashy science papers claiming that homosexuality is biologically determined. This has been taken as fact by many vocal gays, but the science behind it is poor and these conclusions are not universally accepted, to put it mildly. This propaganda has two purposes: to convince other gays that they have no choice and lock them into that lifestyle; and to convince confused, wavering adolescents that any signs of sexual ambiguity means they are gay, there is nothing they can do about it, and really ought to join the gang.
I have a lesser objection to the promotion of that gay subculture defined by affected "camp" behaviour. I didn't used to object to it at all, but I do now, given the way it is used by gays to advertise their status to others. It's not as if there is anything natural about it.
If you don't participate in any of the subcultures characterized here then I've no objection to you. But I think you do or else we wouldn't be having this discussion.
They work, take care of their pets, and live in a nice home [...] architects, software developers, ER nurses, and military officers. What is it about these people's "culture" that you find so offensive, pray tell??
Obvious straw man argument. I've no objection to any of those things.
You probabably, in your ignorant bigotry, mistake Will & Grace for fact.
I've never even seen it.
You don't have a right to a 'gay free' existence.
As the law is currently framed, that statement seems to be at least partly correct. But it's still controversial, and I do have hopes that these new laws will be struck down. Worried parents don't want laws that make it easier for predatory gays to recruit their sons and daughters.
Stop being so terrified of nothing. Educate yourself a bit. You obviously need it.
I don't think I do need to, and I don't want to. In fact that is what this is all about: your loud insistence that we (the straight majority) should have to "educate" ourselves through your propaganda. Well, some of us straights are quite happy with our world view as it is and while open to change in the normal way through a process of personal experience, some of us have no intention of being brainwashed or argued into submission.
I'm beginning to suspect I've been drawn into a troll so I really am going to end my participation in this thread here and now.
Protecting your karma by becoming an AC in order to stick the boot in? I would have thought it's a bit late for that.
I see that the term "reasoned debate" is for you equivalent to "torrent of invective". Not much point continuing with this under the circumstances. Let's just agree to disagree.
PS. I'm no racist; among my closest and dearest friends are an Indian, a Pakistani, an ethnic Chinese, a Ghanaian, two Jews and an Islamic Slav. I just don't like my society's culture being hijacked and perverted to serve the social agenda of a deviant minority cult. That's a long way from bigotry, by any reasonable definition.
Hmm. I'm not getting the same results. Fewer listing ites in the S400 search, and the bogus product code returns no results at all.
Results are therefore inconsistent. It resembles what you would expect if Google were constantly tweaking their index criteria in an ongoing war against fraudulent list entry submissions. So maybe they are trying to do something about it after all.
That is precisely why I'm so fed up with it. I'm sick to the back teeth of having your sort ramming your lifestyle down my throat and insisting loudly that I should agree that your way is equal to my way and "it's all good".
Well it's not and it never will be. And tolerance aside, to a parent like myself the gay subculture will always seem an unlikely but terrible danger that my children must be steered around carefully. However, I still don't go around shouting in your face or the faces of your gay buddies that You Must Accept Our Way.
I'm a libertarian by nature and I've even had some openly gay friends. But now I don't know, maybe in our enthusiasm we have let things go too far. You're too dangerous, too selfish, too vocal and powerful with your disproportionate over-representation in the media; too determined to grab control and command the direction of our culture. It looks like a Bad Thing to me, and to say that it makes me uncomfortable would be something of an understatement.
You accused me of bigotry and double standards. Bigotry? Ha, no! I have always tried to be tolerant and respect the rights and sensibilities of others (an attitude which your community sadly does not seem to share). As for double standards: perhaps, perhaps. But of that, I fear we are all guilty, and it is not even always wrong. Everything is *not* the same as everything else, despite the ludicrous pronouncements of cultural relativism.
The kilt as worn today (and ever since it's renaissance during Queen Victoria's reign) doesn't bear much resemblance to the belted plaid worn by Scots Highlanders in 1746. As you may guess, the earlier style of dress didn't really come with any strict rules about length, that sort of thing is pure English invention.
I was just about to start on a rant about how paid listing sites have ruined Google for all geek hardware searches, and how this A9 will surely be the same thing, when I discovered upon testing an example (thank heavens for testing!) that the problem seems to have _gone_away_now_.
I'm talking about the situation where you search for, say, "Canon S400" and all you get is a load of duplicated hits from paid listing sites like DealTime, DealsOnTheWeb, Kelkoo and so on (all claiming, ironically enough, to show the best prices for said item when in fact they are all near the top end of the scale).
I can hardly believe it but the problem seems to have more or less disappeared at some point over the last few days. I'm getting mainly genuine and relevant hits, liking direct to the retailer!
Is this just me - am I just getting lucky tonight or has anybody else noticed an improvement in the last few days?
See the other comment poster's reply regarding the Doctor's essential asexuality.
And also: yes, if you or anyone else is gay then that's fine but I don't see why I should have to be informed about it. I'm just plain sick to death of everything gay. It's just so "in your face" now, every day, all the time, from *all* the media. I'm sick to death of the incessant preaching, brainwashing, social engineering or what ever you want to call it. Enough already.
Yeah but that's been done...nobody can ever fill Roger Delgado's shoes, so it's probably wrong to try.
Instead think how much more exciting it would be to have a Doctor with a streak of cynicism in him, rather than a goody-goody stereotype.
Of course they tried that already with Colin Baker but unfortunately the actor just didn't have the screen presence required for such a portrayal to be credible. Instead he came across more like a superannuated teenage nerd.
Another candidate who was suggested last time around was Peter Cook, another famously credible cynic. Now that really would have been something. Sadly no longer possible!
Hope they don't dumb the concept down too much. It would be nice to see a more adult version. I'm thinking more along the lines of the "seventh doctor" (i.e. Sylvester McCoy era) novelizations published by Virgin a few years ago. Those were stories that really deepened the genre, they gave the Doctor a dark side and really presented him as somebody totally alien who just liked pretending to be human, for our sake.
Yes all right, what a fanboy. Guilty as charged.
On the other hand...so long as they don't make the Doctor gay. Anything but that.
For the Master, the evil one who always wanted to own the entire universe...how about Darl McBride? I'm pretty sure he'll be looking for a job by then.
Yeah, that's a measure of just how damn long it has taken the BBC to get around to this. Rickman was named as a candidate the last time we saw credible "new Dr Who series" rumours flying round Usenet. He would probably have been affordable back then:o\
I wrote to my own MEP (Geoffrey van Orden) three times in the last few weeks. I didn't even get an acknowledgement from his office that the emails had been received.
Previously I had written to Robert Sturdy, to which the only reply I got was a brusque statement of Conservative Party Policy, as dictated by their Central Office. Which is odd, because I wasn't asking what their policy was, I was in fact handing them an informed view of what it ought to be. It is almost as if they do not realize they are there to represent us, and mistakenly believe that they are there to govern. Even when they are not in government, as it happens.
I think they only have themselves to blame if they feel hard pressed by lobbyists representing the general public. If they do not give us any indication that they have heard what we are saying and have taken it on board, then they can only expect us to keep raising our voices until the message gets through. They should have talked to the FFII and tried to engage in an honest debate with us rather than trying to hide, trying to preserve their independence from a public upon whom they are *meant* to be dependent.
Slashdot Mirror
AFAIK none of the SmartCache IV and SmartRAID IV products support onboard battery backup or otherwise non-volatile cache. I see what you mean though, about existing parts at the time maybe not being up to scratch.
I think this may have backfired on them though. For one thing, there were always availability problems with these memory parts owing to the fact that DPT was the only supplier - when they were out of stock, you were out of luck. Plus, the enormous expense (and the supported alternative option of fitting standard cheap non-ECC RAM SIMMs) meant that many of their otherwise excellent controllers (and they really were the "Rolls Royce" of their type) went live underspecced. Which was always a shame because if you fit the ECC cache RAM then you get end-to-end parity checking from the PCI bus all the way to the surface of the disk.
Their products were too expensive compared to the competition, and in the end Adaptec ate their lunch, then bought them out. DPT's technologies are now only found in Adaptec's high end controllers (eg. Storage Manager On ROM).
I wouldn't benefit from it. My eyes are already shot to hell from...er...looking at all the porn...
...has got to be ECC cache memory for DPT SmartCache/SmartRAID IV SCSI host adapters.
;o)
A single 16MB ECC SIMM (part no. SM4000/16) still costs a smidgeon under $1000. It's not just because they're EOL'd - they were always expensive.
This was just downright mendacious profiteering on DPT's part. I see no reason why they couldn't have designed for standard ECC memory.
If anybody knows where these SIMMs can be had at a more down-to-earth price point, do let me know
I'm not the one ranting here. If you look back over this thread and see notice just who it is that keeps shouting in capitals I think you'll see what I mean.
As to the points you raised, I've answered them elsewhere.
It's clear that you know far less about this than you think you do. Every actual point you made (in between shouting and spewing insults) is nothing but quotes from the book of gay propaganda - either fundamentally misunderstood or just plain wrong.
I'm sorry but I don't have the time to educate you.
With regard to "fighting against the inevitable", that's just wishful thinking. There's no law of physics underlying your point of view to ensure you will get your own way; and I rather think if you keep on the way you are then when the anti-gay backlash comes (and that's the only thing that really is inevitable, because no human historical trend progresses uniformly over time) it will probably turn out to be more violent and draconian than any of us would wish.
I never said they were. It's nothing to do with pedophilia. It's everything to do with wrong-headed people recruiting confused adolescents into a relatively closed subculture based on an alternative lifestyle which would deny them the chance of a normal life. The recruiters may not even be very different in age from the recruits. I have personally seen this happen twice so it's fruitless for you to deny that it happens.
Homosexuality isn't a choice, period. That isn't propaganda, that's fact.
It is rather arrogant of you to assert this as fact. And also wrong.As to whether homosexuality is or is not a choice, I happen to believe it *is* mostly, although probably not entirely. That is to say I believe there are some predisposing neurochemical and/or neuroanatomical factors but they no more absolutely determine one's ultimate destiny than any other non-pathological innate brain structure variation.
The truth is, insufficient research has yet been done to establish the causes of homosexuality, but the gay community have been consistently guilty of selective bias when determining which scientific papers to accept. My reading of the anatomical brain studies done so far indicates that those gender-orientation related brain differences which exist are probably developmental in nature, as are the enlarged brain regions concerned with spatial mapping found in experienced taxi drivers.
What a sorry lot the human race would be if everything we were destined to become were already stamped into our brains from before birth. I prefer to believe that we possess at least the capability of free will. And it is well established that environment is critical in determining the development of the mind, anyway. I accept that congenital factors and prenatal development factors can be significant, but only fascists believe that one's character is solely determined by genetics.
Propaganda is what you get from right-wing pundits and religious leaders.
By the way, I have no interest in the ideological rantings of either "right-wing pundits" or "religious leaders". Nor political correctness nazis for that matter, nor gay activists. My opinions are based upon my personal experiences, my knowledge of psychology, neuroscience and my own reflection. I don't believe in ideologies of any kind because they place limits upon what thoughts can be spoken, and eventually upon what thoughts can be conceived. The Orwellian Newspeak of Political Correctness is the most striking example of this today. In some legislative jurisdictions, to speak out against gay values is even characterized as "Hatecrime". That's scary.
Before you go any further I'd ask you to review this thread from start to finish and see if you can determine which of us is trying to be balanced and rational and which of us simply ranting ideology and shouting in all caps (the email equivalent of foaming at the mouth, BTW). It's important that you learn the difference if you truly want to live in peace. But then again, maybe you actually prefer aggressive confrontation.
Too bad you'll have to die and be reincarnated as a non-nerd before you ever even get *near* a chick like that.
There is another way...
There is no such thing as explosive decompression. The blood vessels in your lungs and eyes will rupture, and your heart will cease when it can no longer maintain blood pressure. Then your corpse will slowly freeze-dry. But there is no messy explosion.
Heh heh!
I predict the parent will reach Score:5, Funny. Why is nobody taking bets?
A somewhat extreme image. This is inoffensive to me because nobody is legislating for positive images of urban poor black culture in schools and in the media.
Perhaps more to the point, while my children may go through an unfortunate phase of putting their pants on backwards, adopting ebonics in their speech patterns etc, this won't prevent them from marrying and raising children in a home with two loving and committed biological parents present.
It's a simple dream, and a common one.
There is no single "gay subculture" any more than there's a single "straight culture".
Okay then let me be more specific.
I object to the loud promotion of that gay subculture defined by sexual promiscuity. That's quite widespread in the gay community, and I've seen it for myself. If they kept it to themselves I'd have no reason to object to it.
I object to the "activist" gay subculture which insists ever more loudly that they should be able to parade their deviant sexual practices (and associated lifestyles) in public view; that campaigns for "positive images" of gays in schools and in the media.
I also object to that element which sponsors, creates and promotes trashy science papers claiming that homosexuality is biologically determined. This has been taken as fact by many vocal gays, but the science behind it is poor and these conclusions are not universally accepted, to put it mildly. This propaganda has two purposes: to convince other gays that they have no choice and lock them into that lifestyle; and to convince confused, wavering adolescents that any signs of sexual ambiguity means they are gay, there is nothing they can do about it, and really ought to join the gang.
I have a lesser objection to the promotion of that gay subculture defined by affected "camp" behaviour. I didn't used to object to it at all, but I do now, given the way it is used by gays to advertise their status to others. It's not as if there is anything natural about it.
If you don't participate in any of the subcultures characterized here then I've no objection to you. But I think you do or else we wouldn't be having this discussion.
They work, take care of their pets, and live in a nice home [...] architects, software developers, ER nurses, and military officers. What is it about these people's "culture" that you find so offensive, pray tell??
Obvious straw man argument. I've no objection to any of those things.
You probabably, in your ignorant bigotry, mistake Will & Grace for fact.
I've never even seen it.
You don't have a right to a 'gay free' existence.
As the law is currently framed, that statement seems to be at least partly correct. But it's still controversial, and I do have hopes that these new laws will be struck down. Worried parents don't want laws that make it easier for predatory gays to recruit their sons and daughters.
Stop being so terrified of nothing. Educate yourself a bit. You obviously need it.
I don't think I do need to, and I don't want to. In fact that is what this is all about: your loud insistence that we (the straight majority) should have to "educate" ourselves through your propaganda. Well, some of us straights are quite happy with our world view as it is and while open to change in the normal way through a process of personal experience, some of us have no intention of being brainwashed or argued into submission.
I'm beginning to suspect I've been drawn into a troll so I really am going to end my participation in this thread here and now.
(wipes spittle from eye)
Protecting your karma by becoming an AC in order to stick the boot in? I would have thought it's a bit late for that.
I see that the term "reasoned debate" is for you equivalent to "torrent of invective". Not much point continuing with this under the circumstances. Let's just agree to disagree.
PS. I'm no racist; among my closest and dearest friends are an Indian, a Pakistani, an ethnic Chinese, a Ghanaian, two Jews and an Islamic Slav. I just don't like my society's culture being hijacked and perverted to serve the social agenda of a deviant minority cult. That's a long way from bigotry, by any reasonable definition.
Hmm. I'm not getting the same results. Fewer listing ites in the S400 search, and the bogus product code returns no results at all.
Results are therefore inconsistent. It resembles what you would expect if Google were constantly tweaking their index criteria in an ongoing war against fraudulent list entry submissions. So maybe they are trying to do something about it after all.
That is precisely why I'm so fed up with it. I'm sick to the back teeth of having your sort ramming your lifestyle down my throat and insisting loudly that I should agree that your way is equal to my way and "it's all good".
Well it's not and it never will be. And tolerance aside, to a parent like myself the gay subculture will always seem an unlikely but terrible danger that my children must be steered around carefully. However, I still don't go around shouting in your face or the faces of your gay buddies that You Must Accept Our Way.
I'm a libertarian by nature and I've even had some openly gay friends. But now I don't know, maybe in our enthusiasm we have let things go too far. You're too dangerous, too selfish, too vocal and powerful with your disproportionate over-representation in the media; too determined to grab control and command the direction of our culture. It looks like a Bad Thing to me, and to say that it makes me uncomfortable would be something of an understatement.
You accused me of bigotry and double standards. Bigotry? Ha, no! I have always tried to be tolerant and respect the rights and sensibilities of others (an attitude which your community sadly does not seem to share). As for double standards: perhaps, perhaps. But of that, I fear we are all guilty, and it is not even always wrong. Everything is *not* the same as everything else, despite the ludicrous pronouncements of cultural relativism.
In fact the Scots often didn't bother covering their arses at all. In earlier times, a big leather bag of shot handily hung over their balls was all they needed, as William Sacheverell, Governor of the Isle of Man, noted in 1688.
Now also known as Mrs Richard Dawkins. Yes, *that* Richard Dawkins.
So did I. And so did Richard Dawkins. He married her, the lucky sod.
Bush: "There is no spoon...there is no spoon...there is no... OW!"
I was just about to start on a rant about how paid listing sites have ruined Google for all geek hardware searches, and how this A9 will surely be the same thing, when I discovered upon testing an example (thank heavens for testing!) that the problem seems to have _gone_away_now_.
I'm talking about the situation where you search for, say, "Canon S400" and all you get is a load of duplicated hits from paid listing sites like DealTime, DealsOnTheWeb, Kelkoo and so on (all claiming, ironically enough, to show the best prices for said item when in fact they are all near the top end of the scale).
I can hardly believe it but the problem seems to have more or less disappeared at some point over the last few days. I'm getting mainly genuine and relevant hits, liking direct to the retailer!
Is this just me - am I just getting lucky tonight or has anybody else noticed an improvement in the last few days?
See the other comment poster's reply regarding the Doctor's essential asexuality.
And also: yes, if you or anyone else is gay then that's fine but I don't see why I should have to be informed about it. I'm just plain sick to death of everything gay. It's just so "in your face" now, every day, all the time, from *all* the media. I'm sick to death of the incessant preaching, brainwashing, social engineering or what ever you want to call it. Enough already.
Yeah but that's been done...nobody can ever fill Roger Delgado's shoes, so it's probably wrong to try.
Instead think how much more exciting it would be to have a Doctor with a streak of cynicism in him, rather than a goody-goody stereotype.
Of course they tried that already with Colin Baker but unfortunately the actor just didn't have the screen presence required for such a portrayal to be credible. Instead he came across more like a superannuated teenage nerd.
Another candidate who was suggested last time around was Peter Cook, another famously credible cynic. Now that really would have been something. Sadly no longer possible!
Hope they don't dumb the concept down too much. It would be nice to see a more adult version. I'm thinking more along the lines of the "seventh doctor" (i.e. Sylvester McCoy era) novelizations published by Virgin a few years ago. Those were stories that really deepened the genre, they gave the Doctor a dark side and really presented him as somebody totally alien who just liked pretending to be human, for our sake.
Yes all right, what a fanboy. Guilty as charged.
On the other hand...so long as they don't make the Doctor gay. Anything but that.
For the Master, the evil one who always wanted to own the entire universe...how about Darl McBride? I'm pretty sure he'll be looking for a job by then.
Yeah, that's a measure of just how damn long it has taken the BBC to get around to this. Rickman was named as a candidate the last time we saw credible "new Dr Who series" rumours flying round Usenet. He would probably have been affordable back then :o\
As for The Master, how about...Graham Norton?
:D
No - Alan Rickman for Dr Who!!
xine also plays it just fine on my linux box. I didn't have to do anything special, it just worked.
Mind you, I did install it using apt-get which took care of any dependencies (i.e. installing all supporting codec libs) automatically.
that was clever - now google.com.au is slashdotted as well!
I wrote to my own MEP (Geoffrey van Orden) three times in the last few weeks. I didn't even get an acknowledgement from his office that the emails had been received.
Previously I had written to Robert Sturdy, to which the only reply I got was a brusque statement of Conservative Party Policy, as dictated by their Central Office. Which is odd, because I wasn't asking what their policy was, I was in fact handing them an informed view of what it ought to be. It is almost as if they do not realize they are there to represent us, and mistakenly believe that they are there to govern. Even when they are not in government, as it happens.
I think they only have themselves to blame if they feel hard pressed by lobbyists representing the general public. If they do not give us any indication that they have heard what we are saying and have taken it on board, then they can only expect us to keep raising our voices until the message gets through. They should have talked to the FFII and tried to engage in an honest debate with us rather than trying to hide, trying to preserve their independence from a public upon whom they are *meant* to be dependent.