Ethics be damned. It's our job to indoctrinate - errr, EDUCATE - these kids, as efficiently as possible, while wasting as much money as possible.
If we start warning parents and children that there may be consequences involved in our indoctrination courses, they may very well start questioning authority.
Revealed: secret European deals to hand over private data to America
Germany 'among countries offering intelligence' according to new claims by former US defence analyst
At least six European Union countries in addition to Britain have been colluding with the US over the mass harvesting of personal communications data,
according to a former contractor to America's National Security Agency, who said the public should not be "kept in the dark".
Wayne Madsen, a former US navy lieutenant who first worked for the NSA in 1985 and over the next 12 years held several sensitive positions within the
agency, names Denmark, the Netherlands, France, Germany, Spain and Italy as having secret deals with the US.
Madsen said the countries had "formal second and third party status" under signal intelligence (sigint) agreements that compels them to hand
over data, including mobile phone and internet information to the NSA if requested.
Under international intelligence agreements, confirmed by declassified documents, nations are categorised by the US according to their trust level. The US
is first party while the UK, Canada, Australia and New Zealand enjoy second party relationships. Germany and France have third party relationships.
In an interview published last night on the PrivacySurgeon.org blog, Madsen, who has been attacked for holding controversial views on espionage issues,
said he had decided to speak out after becoming concerned about the "half story" told by EU politicians regarding the extent of the NSA's
activities in Europe.
He said that under the agreements, which were drawn up after the second world war, the "NSA gets the lion's share" of the sigint
"take". In return, the third parties to the NSA agreements received "highly sanitised intelligence".
Madsen said he was alarmed at the "sanctimonious outcry" of political leaders who were "feigning shock" about the spying operations
while staying silent about their own arrangements with the US, and was particularly concerned that senior German politicians had accused the UK of spying
when their country had a similar third-party deal with the NSA.
Although the level of co-operation provided by other European countries to the NSA is not on the same scale as that provided by the UK, the allegations are
potentially embarrassing.
"I can't understand how Angela Merkel can keep a straight face, demanding assurances from [Barack] Obama and the UK while Germany has entered into
those exact relationships," Madsen said.
The Liberal Democrat MEP Baroness Ludford, a senior member of the European parliament's civil liberties, justice and home affairs committee, said
Madsen's allegations confirmed that the entire system for monitoring data intercept
"the 4th's ability for the government to protect our rights"
Here, we have a perception and comprehension problem. The government doesn't protect our rights. We, the people, protect our rights from the government. Government has no interest in protecting your rights. Government's primary interest is in protecting government, and to some extent, agents of the government.
I seem to hear a note of superiority. "I've been doing this all my life, and now people are suddenly doing it, and calling it by a new name."
So - why not find a hackerspace, and SHARE YOUR KNOWLEDGE?!?!?! With the set of skills that you seem to suggest that you have, you could be quite the popular go-to guy. And, funny thing about teaching - you also get the chance to learn stuff that you never realized you DIDN'T KNOW!
OMG, whatachump! Posting anonymously won't save you, dude! You're history now, too! Or - more accurately, you're NOT history anymore. You'll be disappeared soon. And, sadly for you, no one will even know who the hell you were. Sad, sad, sad. Your own parents will soon forget you, as the NSA agents brainwash them.
If you're going to save yourself, you had better head to Cuba now!
"Original US dollar holders have been dead for centuries now."
You err. The Central Bank, aka the Federal Reserve, has only existed for 99 years and 7 months now. Congress got rid of the "Greenbacks" and authorized the Federal Reserve.
Also - the dollar might be "considered one of the more stable currencies", but fiat money is still fiat money. The dollar is technically valueless, worth less than the materials used to print the note.
Yes, it is over regulated in some ways. For instance - there is a requirement that when you deposit or withdraw X amount of dollars, the government be notified. Why? WTF business is it of the government that I am shuffling around money THAT BELONGS TO ME? Suppose I'm just doing some home renovation. I went to the city, got my "building permit", tore down the stuff that's in the way, and now I'm paying the lumber supply for my new stuff. GOVERNMENT NEEDS TO KNOW? Really?
Every legislator who thought that was a good idea needs to burn in hell.
"Setting up minimal WiFi encryption on consumer wireless equipment has never been a task requiring a "capable expert.""
I have to agree. The wife and I went to the Hi-Tech department at Wal-Mart to get our router. We read carefully. WEP, WPA, it's all right there in the box. Or, as the geeks like to say, "Out Of the Box" or OOB. Yep - we brought that thing home, plugged it in, and it just worked, as advertised. No fuss, no muss - I have the latest, greatest security, and I didn't have to know anything!/sarcasm
NO ONE installs a toolbar unless they want to be tracked. Seriously - we haven't learned that over the past almost 20 years? Toolbars have one purposed, and one purpose only . That is to make the chump - errrr, consumer - agree to be tracked. If at some later time the chu - CONSUMER says that he doesn't want to be tracked, you surely don't expect him to be taken seriously.
Only if the ch - CONSUMER nukes from orbit then reformats might we take his request to stop tracking him seriously.
"more to the point has someone done a distributed tor like social network with client side encryptions and easy key exchanges for adding new friends?"
Yes, they have. Like Tor, it's slow. Like Tor, it draws shady characters. Worse than Tor, you'll possibly be exposed to child porn sites - it's notorious for Lolita and Pedobear crap. But, it's there.
Don't you understand that you are off topic? TFS is about an archeological find. GP in this thread remained on topic with potential archeological finds, and the burdensome regulations surrounding them. Then, you seem to have branched out into geological faults, and I handed back endangered species and environmental impact studies.
GP didn't mention what was being built, so I can't make any evaluation about safety or anything, IN THAT CASE. But, it's not uncommon in the Arklatex to find voids underground, such as he mentions. In limestone country, it's to be EXPECTED. You fill in the void, and go on. Now, if you were building a high rise, or a nuclear reactor - yeah, you're going to be a little more concerned. Building a sawmill? I built a sawmill that floats on gumbo, which in turn floats over top of a layer of limestone. (gumbo - a rather soupy mix of clay, water, and vegetable matter) Limestone is common throughout the region. Building a warehouse? Again, no problem - I built one over a couple of voids. We didn't even bother to fill in the voids, we just put a heavy-up around and across them. Oh - someone actually did look inside of those voids, and found no skulls, arrow heads, or cave drawings. Still - the voids are still there, we built right over top of them.
So, you're suggesting that there should be both a geological survey and an archeological survey? Why don't we survey for endangered species while we're at it?
Since you feel such a sense of ownership, maybe you should get your butt out there, and take care of business. In the absence of prompt action, it will be assumed that you've abandoned your claim of ownership.
If you'll read again, I didn't say they can't have a PC. I said something to the effect that "they should have sought professional help". Do you notice the subtle difference, now that I bring it to your attention?
"But the fact that you are basically proposing a fucking guild system so that only the "blessed" can install"
It would have been little different from the world we have today. The elite are the guys who make a living fixing all the stupid shit, as opposed to my vision, where the elite would have installed stuff, thereby avoiding most of the need for fixing stupid shit. Again - there's a subtle difference. I don't want the subtlety to escape you!
And, also, I added in to my post that the common user, with a little effort, could join the ranks of my elite.
"Becoming a witch doctor should have required a few semesters of genuine "Computer Science""
I realize that suggesting that kids take computer classes in high school that aren't MS-centric would be yet another fine subtlety. But, there you have it.
I do get tired of people - especially smart people - making excuses for Microsoft all the time. Again, and again, and again, they make strategic mistakes, but otherwise rational men and women jump to their defense. I might understand that crap from the uninitiates who have never experienced anything other than Windows. But, I've read enough of YOUR experience and knowledge to see that you really do know better.
In short, you're teetering closer to that demarcation line that separates rational people from shills.
Yeah, you're right and all - but I have my prejudices. Stallman's alright and all, but I don't like "Gnu/Linux". If he weren't such an arrogant old twit, he would have settled for "Linux/Gnu", and been happy with secondary placement. But, noooooo! Stallman wants primary recognition, for having done all the EASY stuff!
Alright, so almost no one agrees with me. It's still my opinion, and I'm entitled to my prejudices.
If we manage yet another year without being the most pwned OS in the world, we'll still be doing better than Windows. And, just for the sake of argument, Android is more of a fork of Linux, than it is Linux. "Linux Based" does not equate to Linux. I'll note that Cyanogen Mod makes Android systems pretty damned secure!
Hey now - you stress the "librarian" thing as if you expect librarians to be clueless. Not fair, I say. In my experience, about half of today's librarians are pretty savvy. Someone has to be administrator on library systems, after all, and in small towns, that will almost invariably be the librarian. Those little old frumpy ladies are generally pretty intelligent, and they don't make the same stupid mistakes repeatedly. Sure, some of them never really get the hang of it, but even those ladies can generally follow directions when given a rigid guideline to follow.
Maybe I read your post incorrectly, maybe not. I just want to give librarians their due!
In my own experience, I'm pretty sure it was 98 before I found a CD writer that I could afford. It may have been 99, I'm not quite certain. I remember the day I walked into a store outside of Los Angeles on Interstate 10. I just can't precisely place the date.
As for CD readers, I had one on a 386 SX, a couple of years before Win95 was released. That was just a bit of luck - I found it at an estate sale, and the ladies didn't know the value of the thing. They gave me the whole computer, and a couple boxes of floppies and a small box of CD's for fifty bucks. Helluva bargain . . . .
And, we are right back to the point made in an earlier post. People who don't even know what an installer is, should not be installing stuff. In the long run, the clueless computer owner who wanted to install something, and didn't know how, would have saved money by going to his local computer guy, and HAVE THE SOFTWARE INSTALLED.
BMO was modded a troll above - but he makes a very valid point. Microsoft's strategy of permitting any type of autorun was flawed. Computing should have remained something of a mystery, and local witch doctors should have presided over the installation of software. Given time, more witch doctors should have been trained. Given enough time, home users should have become qualified witch doctors in their own right. Becoming a witch doctor should have required a few semesters of genuine "Computer Science" classes (as opposed to Microsoft-centric "keyboarding" classes and other such nonsense). The mistake was to hand over all the magic talismans to every untrained fool who imagined himself to be smarter than the witch doctors.
Slashdot Mirror
Ethics be damned. It's our job to indoctrinate - errr, EDUCATE - these kids, as efficiently as possible, while wasting as much money as possible.
If we start warning parents and children that there may be consequences involved in our indoctrination courses, they may very well start questioning authority.
Where would THAT get us?
http://pastebin.com/NTJvUZdJ
Deleted Article by The Guardian
Original Link: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/29/european-private-data-america
Now redirecting to: http://www.guardian.co.uk/info/2013/jun/30/taken-down
===
Revealed: secret European deals to hand over private data to America
Germany 'among countries offering intelligence' according to new claims by former US defence analyst
At least six European Union countries in addition to Britain have been colluding with the US over the mass harvesting of personal communications data,
according to a former contractor to America's National Security Agency, who said the public should not be "kept in the dark".
Wayne Madsen, a former US navy lieutenant who first worked for the NSA in 1985 and over the next 12 years held several sensitive positions within the
agency, names Denmark, the Netherlands, France, Germany, Spain and Italy as having secret deals with the US.
Madsen said the countries had "formal second and third party status" under signal intelligence (sigint) agreements that compels them to hand
over data, including mobile phone and internet information to the NSA if requested.
Under international intelligence agreements, confirmed by declassified documents, nations are categorised by the US according to their trust level. The US
is first party while the UK, Canada, Australia and New Zealand enjoy second party relationships. Germany and France have third party relationships.
In an interview published last night on the PrivacySurgeon.org blog, Madsen, who has been attacked for holding controversial views on espionage issues,
said he had decided to speak out after becoming concerned about the "half story" told by EU politicians regarding the extent of the NSA's
activities in Europe.
He said that under the agreements, which were drawn up after the second world war, the "NSA gets the lion's share" of the sigint
"take". In return, the third parties to the NSA agreements received "highly sanitised intelligence".
Madsen said he was alarmed at the "sanctimonious outcry" of political leaders who were "feigning shock" about the spying operations
while staying silent about their own arrangements with the US, and was particularly concerned that senior German politicians had accused the UK of spying
when their country had a similar third-party deal with the NSA.
Although the level of co-operation provided by other European countries to the NSA is not on the same scale as that provided by the UK, the allegations are
potentially embarrassing.
"I can't understand how Angela Merkel can keep a straight face, demanding assurances from [Barack] Obama and the UK while Germany has entered into
those exact relationships," Madsen said.
The Liberal Democrat MEP Baroness Ludford, a senior member of the European parliament's civil liberties, justice and home affairs committee, said
Madsen's allegations confirmed that the entire system for monitoring data intercept
"the 4th's ability for the government to protect our rights"
Here, we have a perception and comprehension problem. The government doesn't protect our rights. We, the people, protect our rights from the government. Government has no interest in protecting your rights. Government's primary interest is in protecting government, and to some extent, agents of the government.
How 'bout an example of government protecting your rights? I just watched this several minutes ago: http://www.prisonplanet.com/shock-video-shows-police-forcibly-drawing-blood.html
I seem to hear a note of superiority. "I've been doing this all my life, and now people are suddenly doing it, and calling it by a new name."
So - why not find a hackerspace, and SHARE YOUR KNOWLEDGE?!?!?! With the set of skills that you seem to suggest that you have, you could be quite the popular go-to guy. And, funny thing about teaching - you also get the chance to learn stuff that you never realized you DIDN'T KNOW!
You never have enough sharks with lasers - NEVER! Or enough nukes in orbit. You just can't have enough!
Since the Roman Republic? Get out of here - even Ronald Reagan wasn't that old!
OMG, whatachump! Posting anonymously won't save you, dude! You're history now, too! Or - more accurately, you're NOT history anymore. You'll be disappeared soon. And, sadly for you, no one will even know who the hell you were. Sad, sad, sad. Your own parents will soon forget you, as the NSA agents brainwash them.
If you're going to save yourself, you had better head to Cuba now!
"Original US dollar holders have been dead for centuries now."
You err. The Central Bank, aka the Federal Reserve, has only existed for 99 years and 7 months now. Congress got rid of the "Greenbacks" and authorized the Federal Reserve.
Also - the dollar might be "considered one of the more stable currencies", but fiat money is still fiat money. The dollar is technically valueless, worth less than the materials used to print the note.
Yes, it is over regulated in some ways. For instance - there is a requirement that when you deposit or withdraw X amount of dollars, the government be notified. Why? WTF business is it of the government that I am shuffling around money THAT BELONGS TO ME? Suppose I'm just doing some home renovation. I went to the city, got my "building permit", tore down the stuff that's in the way, and now I'm paying the lumber supply for my new stuff. GOVERNMENT NEEDS TO KNOW? Really?
Every legislator who thought that was a good idea needs to burn in hell.
"Where does it actually end is what id like to know"
All your ass are belong to us! Set us up the BOMB!
"Setting up minimal WiFi encryption on consumer wireless equipment has never been a task requiring a "capable expert.""
I have to agree. The wife and I went to the Hi-Tech department at Wal-Mart to get our router. We read carefully. WEP, WPA, it's all right there in the box. Or, as the geeks like to say, "Out Of the Box" or OOB. Yep - we brought that thing home, plugged it in, and it just worked, as advertised. No fuss, no muss - I have the latest, greatest security, and I didn't have to know anything! /sarcasm
NO ONE installs a toolbar unless they want to be tracked. Seriously - we haven't learned that over the past almost 20 years? Toolbars have one purposed, and one purpose only . That is to make the chump - errrr, consumer - agree to be tracked. If at some later time the chu - CONSUMER says that he doesn't want to be tracked, you surely don't expect him to be taken seriously.
Only if the ch - CONSUMER nukes from orbit then reformats might we take his request to stop tracking him seriously.
How can he be accused of rape, exactly, when both women have been quoted in interviews, stating that they were NOT raped?
"Oh, no officer, he didn't rape me."
"Your honor, I'm asking that you sign a warrant of arrest for rape, because the witness states that she has not been raped."
Verizon of course. How can any network be friendly to anyone unless it's RELIABLE?
"more to the point has someone done a distributed tor like social network with client side encryptions and easy key exchanges for adding new friends?"
Yes, they have. Like Tor, it's slow. Like Tor, it draws shady characters. Worse than Tor, you'll possibly be exposed to child porn sites - it's notorious for Lolita and Pedobear crap. But, it's there.
http://www.i2p2.de/
Make of it what you will - if enough people start using it, maybe the Lolita crowd will be less visible.
*roll eyes again*
Don't you understand that you are off topic? TFS is about an archeological find. GP in this thread remained on topic with potential archeological finds, and the burdensome regulations surrounding them. Then, you seem to have branched out into geological faults, and I handed back endangered species and environmental impact studies.
GP didn't mention what was being built, so I can't make any evaluation about safety or anything, IN THAT CASE. But, it's not uncommon in the Arklatex to find voids underground, such as he mentions. In limestone country, it's to be EXPECTED. You fill in the void, and go on. Now, if you were building a high rise, or a nuclear reactor - yeah, you're going to be a little more concerned. Building a sawmill? I built a sawmill that floats on gumbo, which in turn floats over top of a layer of limestone. (gumbo - a rather soupy mix of clay, water, and vegetable matter) Limestone is common throughout the region. Building a warehouse? Again, no problem - I built one over a couple of voids. We didn't even bother to fill in the voids, we just put a heavy-up around and across them. Oh - someone actually did look inside of those voids, and found no skulls, arrow heads, or cave drawings. Still - the voids are still there, we built right over top of them.
*roll eyes*
So, you're suggesting that there should be both a geological survey and an archeological survey? Why don't we survey for endangered species while we're at it?
"(which belongs to us all)"
Since you feel such a sense of ownership, maybe you should get your butt out there, and take care of business. In the absence of prompt action, it will be assumed that you've abandoned your claim of ownership.
Those subversive open source alternatives! They keep cropping up - regimes around the world are going to have to ban open source!
Yo, fellow douchebaggery guy!
If you'll read again, I didn't say they can't have a PC. I said something to the effect that "they should have sought professional help". Do you notice the subtle difference, now that I bring it to your attention?
"But the fact that you are basically proposing a fucking guild system so that only the "blessed" can install"
It would have been little different from the world we have today. The elite are the guys who make a living fixing all the stupid shit, as opposed to my vision, where the elite would have installed stuff, thereby avoiding most of the need for fixing stupid shit. Again - there's a subtle difference. I don't want the subtlety to escape you!
And, also, I added in to my post that the common user, with a little effort, could join the ranks of my elite.
"Becoming a witch doctor should have required a few semesters of genuine "Computer Science""
I realize that suggesting that kids take computer classes in high school that aren't MS-centric would be yet another fine subtlety. But, there you have it.
I do get tired of people - especially smart people - making excuses for Microsoft all the time. Again, and again, and again, they make strategic mistakes, but otherwise rational men and women jump to their defense. I might understand that crap from the uninitiates who have never experienced anything other than Windows. But, I've read enough of YOUR experience and knowledge to see that you really do know better.
In short, you're teetering closer to that demarcation line that separates rational people from shills.
Yeah, you're right and all - but I have my prejudices. Stallman's alright and all, but I don't like "Gnu/Linux". If he weren't such an arrogant old twit, he would have settled for "Linux/Gnu", and been happy with secondary placement. But, noooooo! Stallman wants primary recognition, for having done all the EASY stuff!
Alright, so almost no one agrees with me. It's still my opinion, and I'm entitled to my prejudices.
If we manage yet another year without being the most pwned OS in the world, we'll still be doing better than Windows. And, just for the sake of argument, Android is more of a fork of Linux, than it is Linux. "Linux Based" does not equate to Linux. I'll note that Cyanogen Mod makes Android systems pretty damned secure!
Hey now - you stress the "librarian" thing as if you expect librarians to be clueless. Not fair, I say. In my experience, about half of today's librarians are pretty savvy. Someone has to be administrator on library systems, after all, and in small towns, that will almost invariably be the librarian. Those little old frumpy ladies are generally pretty intelligent, and they don't make the same stupid mistakes repeatedly. Sure, some of them never really get the hang of it, but even those ladies can generally follow directions when given a rigid guideline to follow.
Maybe I read your post incorrectly, maybe not. I just want to give librarians their due!
In my own experience, I'm pretty sure it was 98 before I found a CD writer that I could afford. It may have been 99, I'm not quite certain. I remember the day I walked into a store outside of Los Angeles on Interstate 10. I just can't precisely place the date.
As for CD readers, I had one on a 386 SX, a couple of years before Win95 was released. That was just a bit of luck - I found it at an estate sale, and the ladies didn't know the value of the thing. They gave me the whole computer, and a couple boxes of floppies and a small box of CD's for fifty bucks. Helluva bargain . . . .
And, we are right back to the point made in an earlier post. People who don't even know what an installer is, should not be installing stuff. In the long run, the clueless computer owner who wanted to install something, and didn't know how, would have saved money by going to his local computer guy, and HAVE THE SOFTWARE INSTALLED.
BMO was modded a troll above - but he makes a very valid point. Microsoft's strategy of permitting any type of autorun was flawed. Computing should have remained something of a mystery, and local witch doctors should have presided over the installation of software. Given time, more witch doctors should have been trained. Given enough time, home users should have become qualified witch doctors in their own right. Becoming a witch doctor should have required a few semesters of genuine "Computer Science" classes (as opposed to Microsoft-centric "keyboarding" classes and other such nonsense). The mistake was to hand over all the magic talismans to every untrained fool who imagined himself to be smarter than the witch doctors.