I tried for weeks to port a small project to automake/autoconf. Shelled for a physical book. Didn't understand some things, and posted to usenet. In other words tried dilligently. In the end, I concluded that learning how the system really worked was going to take 20% of the overall project time. A lot of it seems dedicated to fixing a crufty language (make). A lot of it only applies to C/C++, not all languages. I concluded that I'd rather discard make, automake, and autoconf, and write a shell script that actually did what I needed, rather than learning how to jump through convoluted, obfuscated hoops.
> When it comes to bug fixing in a big project, you
> don't just tool around, debugging stuff in real time
>.... You look through the code to understand *why*
something isn't working they way you thought it
> would work..
Actually, this approach works pretty well in Mirai, a HUGE lisp program. Of course having source is essential too. Hyperlinked source, with the ability to talk to the interpreter, is a very sharp sword...
I wonder what would happen if the code were re-run with modern implementations of those languages? Allegro Common Lisp 4.3 is about two major releases old. And the CMU CL x86 compiler totally 0wnz it anyway, especially on numeric code.
Moderators, if you're still here: please mod this up.
> I find talking about LISP as one language compared
> to Java to be a complete joke. Whose LISP? Scheme?
> Whose version of Scheme, GNU's Guile? Is the Elisp
> in Emacs the most widely distributed
> implementation of LISP? Can Emacs be rewritten
> using Guile? What is the GUI framework for all of
> LISP? Anyone come up with a set of LISP APIs that
> are the equivalent of J2EE or Jini?
There are exactly two dialects of Lisp that have relevance to this discussion.
ANSI COMMON LISP is designed for large application development by a large team of programmers. It is the first object oriented langauge to have an ANSI standard. (circa 1990).
Scheme is a minimalist language designed for ease of learning. It is specified by R5RS.
I heard that originally the humans were to be used for CPU, not, well, BTUs. However this was cut because "americans wouldn't get it".
Now for something completely different. The matrix is an allegory for the New Testament. Morpheus, Neo, and Trinity are the holy trinity.
Morpheus = God: "you're more than just a leader to us, you're like a father to us".
Neo = Jesus: Dies and comes back to life.
Trinity = Holy Spirit: Motivates (dead) neo to believe he is The One. And her name seals the deal.
Patents are bad for (some) big businesses too
on
EU & US Patent "Syncing"
·
· Score: 4, Interesting
Too bad more big corps aren't politicized AGAINST sw patents. Back in the Iron Age IBM led the charge against sw patents, rationalizing that they could make their money in hardware if they could more easily incorporate ideas from other's software.
Today many businesses are in a similar situation, but they're not lobbying effectively in their own interest.
If you're like most serious hackers, on the standard keyboard you hit caps lock 30 times accidentally for every time intentionally. I got sick of it, and rebound caps lock to be "super".
Super is another bucky key like control or shift. The advantage of it is, that no applications (that I know of) bind to it by default, because nobody manufactures keyboards with a super key. And that's a feature!
Emacs and Window-maker are super-saavy enough to let me introduce super bindings. So for example, I've got window-maker dragging a window on Super-left-mouse, and emacs going up a line on super-k. With the caps lock right next to the home keys its easier to hit than shift, very easy on the wrists indeed.
So without further addo, here is the the file to feed to xmodmap to get this:
!! Make caps lock be super, and menu be hyper.
clear Lock
remove Lock = Caps_Lock
keysym Caps_Lock = Super_L
add Mod3 = Super_L Super_R
The chances of my vote counting are minescule. I've got more important things to do.
However, If I can convince 10, 100, 1000 people to vote for my favorite issues, then I've multiplied my voting power immensely. So, hey YOU, go vote NADER while I sit home and play video games.:)
C++'s STL isn't working, and thassa fakt, jack. (If you don't believe me, go talk to the libstc++-3 boyos)
Even C code that compiles fine in 2.7 doesn't compile in 2.95.2.
Man, C++ still aint workin super well, 2.95.2 was still choking on some of our > code, that gcc 2.7 did fine with. And its been months since they made an official release. I, for one, applaud RedHat's engineers for doing an end run around gcc's overly conservative release schedule. Otherwise I'd have to be the one applying all those patches to the cvs snapshot.
Now I have a concrete version to test against, that other developers can reproduce in their environments.
Thank you Red Hat!
Well, sometimes you maybe want to have more than
the 2gb of virtual memory that you get from
32 bit addressing minus OS taxes. I'm told my
customers often want that.
Not all OpenGL implementations are created equal! Today if you want to do *nix GL, IRIX is the platform. There are many many efforts to bring good (meaning fast) OpenGL to Linux. DRI is the free one. Xi has the most cards. Nvidia+sgi are working on one. None of them are finished. None of them run A|W without serious bugs. That statement is a guess based on the fact that I maintain the Linux OpenGL for an A|W competitor, and they shure as hell don't run MY app without bugs!
Dude, you just gots to write the code in whatever language you want. I've been developing 3d graphics in Common Lisp for over 3 years. Sometimes its too slow, othertimes its fast enough. You just got fix the too-slow parts. Parenthesis whiners: You're not the first to think this. If you just bite the bullet and learn to use emacs, they conceptually disappear. Further, they really help: parens help you write programs that write themselves. When you get really good, they can actually help you edit your code faster. If you don't understand what (lambda (x) x) is, then for crying out loud DON'T USE IT. Instead use named functions (defun identity (x) x). Nobody ever got fired for using named functions.:) Ultimately you just have to ignore the herd mentality and the silver-bullet mentality. Go with the language that suits YOUR needs. Don't be totally close minded, but if Lisp were the silver bullet it claims to be then it would have produced more than it has by now, if you get my meaning. Personally, I favor the Common Lisp environment, the rediculously high level language features, the powerful macro facility, and yes the parenthesis.
Slashdot Mirror
Right on, brother!
I tried for weeks to port a small project to automake/autoconf. Shelled for a physical book. Didn't understand some things, and posted to usenet. In other words tried dilligently. In the end, I concluded that learning how the system really worked was going to take 20% of the overall project time. A lot of it seems dedicated to fixing a crufty language (make). A lot of it only applies to C/C++, not all languages. I concluded that I'd rather discard make, automake, and autoconf, and write a shell script that actually did what I needed, rather than learning how to jump through convoluted, obfuscated hoops.
> When it comes to bug fixing in a big project, you .... You look through the code to understand *why*
> don't just tool around, debugging stuff in real time
>
something isn't working they way you thought it
> would work..
Actually, this approach works pretty well in Mirai, a HUGE lisp program. Of course having source is essential too. Hyperlinked source, with the ability to talk to the interpreter, is a very sharp sword...
I wonder what would happen if the code were re-run with modern implementations of those languages? Allegro Common Lisp 4.3 is about two major releases old. And the CMU CL x86 compiler totally 0wnz it anyway, especially on numeric code.
I'm sure Java's gotten better too.
Moderators, if you're still here: please mod this up.
> I find talking about LISP as one language compared
> to Java to be a complete joke. Whose LISP? Scheme?
> Whose version of Scheme, GNU's Guile? Is the Elisp
> in Emacs the most widely distributed
> implementation of LISP? Can Emacs be rewritten
> using Guile? What is the GUI framework for all of
> LISP? Anyone come up with a set of LISP APIs that
> are the equivalent of J2EE or Jini?
There are exactly two dialects of Lisp that have relevance to this discussion.
ANSI COMMON LISP is designed for large application development by a large team of programmers. It is the first object oriented langauge to have an ANSI standard. (circa 1990).
Scheme is a minimalist language designed for ease of learning. It is specified by R5RS.
Now for something completely different. The matrix is an allegory for the New Testament. Morpheus, Neo, and Trinity are the holy trinity.
Morpheus = God: "you're more than just a leader to us, you're like a father to us".
Neo = Jesus: Dies and comes back to life.
Trinity = Holy Spirit: Motivates (dead) neo to believe he is The One. And her name seals the deal.
Too bad more big corps aren't politicized AGAINST sw patents. Back in the Iron Age IBM led the charge against sw patents, rationalizing that they could make their money in hardware if they could more easily incorporate ideas from other's software. Today many businesses are in a similar situation, but they're not lobbying effectively in their own interest.
Forget Open, remember Free.
It IS a good enough reason -- good enough for RMS. Free Software aint always better, but is IS always free-er.
Super is another bucky key like control or shift. The advantage of it is, that no applications (that I know of) bind to it by default, because nobody manufactures keyboards with a super key. And that's a feature!
Emacs and Window-maker are super-saavy enough to let me introduce super bindings. So for example, I've got window-maker dragging a window on Super-left-mouse, and emacs going up a line on super-k. With the caps lock right next to the home keys its easier to hit than shift, very easy on the wrists indeed.
So without further addo, here is the the file to feed to xmodmap to get this:
!! Make caps lock be super, and menu be hyper. clear Lock remove Lock = Caps_Lock keysym Caps_Lock = Super_L add Mod3 = Super_L Super_R
Sorry for dumb question, but does it work with Starcraft?
I wrote some code to run life on 3d surfaces. http://www.speakeasy.org/~morse/life
The chances of my vote counting are minescule. I've got more important things to do.
However, If I can convince 10, 100, 1000 people to vote for my favorite issues, then I've multiplied my voting power immensely. So, hey YOU, go vote NADER while I sit home and play video games. :)
C++'s STL isn't working, and thassa fakt, jack. (If you don't believe me, go talk to the libstc++-3 boyos)
Even C code that compiles fine in 2.7 doesn't compile in 2.95.2.
Man, C++ still aint workin super well, 2.95.2 was still choking on some of our > code, that gcc 2.7 did fine with. And its been months since they made an official release. I, for one, applaud RedHat's engineers for doing an end run around gcc's overly conservative release schedule. Otherwise I'd have to be the one applying all those patches to the cvs snapshot. Now I have a concrete version to test against, that other developers can reproduce in their environments. Thank you Red Hat!
Well, sometimes you maybe want to have more than the 2gb of virtual memory that you get from 32 bit addressing minus OS taxes. I'm told my customers often want that.
Not all OpenGL implementations are created equal! Today if you want to do *nix GL, IRIX is the platform. There are many many efforts to bring good (meaning fast) OpenGL to Linux. DRI is the free one. Xi has the most cards. Nvidia+sgi are working on one. None of them are finished. None of them run A|W without serious bugs. That statement is a guess based on the fact that I maintain the Linux OpenGL for an A|W competitor, and they shure as hell don't run MY app without bugs!
Forget wireframe, I want to see that other dude's password through those damn "**********"s. :)
Dude, you just gots to write the code in whatever language you want. I've been developing 3d graphics in Common Lisp for over 3 years. Sometimes its too slow, othertimes its fast enough. You just got fix the too-slow parts. Parenthesis whiners: You're not the first to think this. If you just bite the bullet and learn to use emacs, they conceptually disappear. Further, they really help: parens help you write programs that write themselves. When you get really good, they can actually help you edit your code faster. If you don't understand what (lambda (x) x) is, then for crying out loud DON'T USE IT. Instead use named functions (defun identity (x) x). Nobody ever got fired for using named functions. :) Ultimately you just have to ignore the herd mentality and the silver-bullet mentality. Go with the language that suits YOUR needs. Don't be totally close minded, but if Lisp were the silver bullet it claims to be then it would have produced more than it has by now, if you get my meaning. Personally, I favor the Common Lisp environment, the rediculously high level language features, the powerful macro facility, and yes the parenthesis.