The sorrow of the hardship of "growing up" into a mostly developed world.
>It would seem from the rest of your post that you are a hardline, anything-not-illegal-goes cheap-labor Republican hell-bent on defending the rights of us priveledged folks to cash in on the misery and lack of rights of others in the world.
Hmmm. I'm not sure where you get that. I simply believe in the right of businesses to conduct themselves in a manner that befits a capitalist country, and I believe in their right to economically sustain any country (be it China or otherwise) that they may choose.
>We could go further and point out how the unquestioning, God-gave-me-the-fucking-right-because-I'm-American capitalism you apparently espouse (along with most Republicans I know) is the reason we make so little progress toward attainable ends like eradicating world hunger, fighting AIDS in Africa, ensuring gender and racial equality, ending extreme poverty, and maybe even paying people a little more than so-called minimum wage.
Well, please do so. I'm intrigued on this opinion of yours that capitalism is the fault of all the world's evils, despite the clear evidence that capitalist countries are the envy of the world.
>And just for the record, I have a friend who has worked at WalMart for 10 years, and is just now working up the guts to leave.
If he's not happy, bully for him!
>He's a manager there, and they pay him less than $28,000/yr, and take $230 from each of his checks for health insurance.
Okay. Makes sense he might not be happy there then. Glad to see he's exercising his rights to find better employment. I wish him good luck on finding a better job.
>They also actively promote the idea that there are no other solid jobs out there, and that if you leave WalMart, you'll just have to come back because you'll be laid off within a year anyway.
Well, assuming your friend is more intelligent than a tree stump (clearly, he his) why, exactly, are you worried? Do you believe people are so easily convinced that they are screwed? Sounds to me like you're suggesting people working at WalMart are fickle to the extreme, which I don't believe.
>This is one of the hardest-working guys I know, and because he doesn't bitch and whine, throw tantrums and threaten to quit, he has associates working under him who make more.
Remember the capitalist mantra: WORK SMARTER, NOT HARDER. Sorry that your friend never figured out the corporate culture there. It clearly seems that he could be making far more if he were conforming to the wishes of his employers (that is, being whiny and throwing tantrums). If he doesn't wish to do that, he only needs to exercise his option to find work somewhere that doesn't require that (shouldn't be hard at all -- that's a very unusual requirement of a worker, that they throw tantrums and be whiny). Which he has done. Hallelujah! The system works!
>The point of all this is that it does make a difference whether we pay attention to human misery!
It does! That's why I want to see WalMart continue to deter it by infusing money into the Chinese economy.
>Other people in the world deserve fair pay for their work, just as much as you do, and our consumerist culture has grown the idea that what happens on the other side of the world doesn't matter, as long as I can get my new toaster for $10 less than that guy down the street is selling them.
Wrong. Our consumerist culture has realised that countries have to start somewhere, and that given time the lifestyle in China will improve along with their economy. They simply got started late and unfortunately it always takes time to play catchup.
>My wife and I seek out and buy fair-trade goods, because even if we pay a couple dollars more for them, we're supporting the producer, and that makes a difference on a worldwide scale.
Thanks. I don't normally get so outspoken on such issues, but there were way too many blatant lies (such as the existence of a Chinese "minimum wage") there that it gets my blood boiling.:-)
>Wrong. You're assuming an open availability of jobs, which doesn't exist either in the real world or any theoretical ones. The job market is terrible, especially for people who lack education or skills to get a modestly paying job (>$18000/yr).
How unusual that those who lack skills have a difficult time being useful. I don't understand why it strikes you as odd that these people are having a tough time getting a well paying job. It seems perfectly natural that those lacking skills will be without good jobs. Am I wrong to think this way? I don't think so.
>They may have no useful education or job skills to work anywhere else in their area, there may be no other employer in their area that is hiring, or Wal-Mart might be (believe it or not) the highest paying employer they can work at.
In the first case, you have to fault the job seeker for choosing to lack such skills and education (unless the job seeker is mentally handicapped, in which case we have to work on a different argument). In the second case, it's unfortunate, but at least WalMart is there to give them a job, and also in the last case, exactly how is WalMart doing people a disservice?
Seems to me in all three cases WalMart is being the "good guy". Perhaps you can point out to me how.
>Jobs being produced in third world countries and factories being built does not mean "development" is taking place, if the jobs being created do not pay a high enough wage that employees are bettering their lives through working there, or if the factories are not running cleanly enough that they are polluting the area and causing health and environmental harm to the area.
The alternative is far worse. I think you can see that for yourself. Given a choice, would you rather live in Ethiopia, where few to none are employed to produce foreign products, or in China? I think the choice is absolutely clear.
I got modded down before, so I clearly need to clarify why you're so wrong point by point.
* "Full-Time" (actually 28 hours/week) employees only gross $11,000 a year, on average.
$7.55 an hour ($11,000 / 52 / 28) is an acceptable wage for menial labour and working half days (4 hours). A full time worker (8 hour days) would make twice that amount, or $22,00 USD. Which is 58% of the US GDP. A very reasonable wage for a clerk.
Health benefits are available only after two years, but premiums are so high only 38% of employees can afford it.
Workers then should look elsewhere for health benefits, or perhaps form something people in the USA like to call an "HMO".
Even discussing working conditions or unionization will result in retaliation and firing.
Interesting. Firing for discussing unsafe conditions is clearly illegal and I dare you to show evidence of this accusation. Oh, and unlike WalMart, *I* don't fire for discussing unionization. I take it a step further. I close down the store and therefore everyone is fired. Anyone working here knows that upon employment. WalMart employees should be happy that's all that happens.
There is "a harsh, anti-woman culture in which complaints go unanswered and the women who make them are targeted for retaliation." (Quote taken from a national class-action suit against Wal-Mart.)
A biased party made a quote against the party they hate? How blase. Allow me to make one or two for good measure, anyways:
"As Wal-Mart, we do not discriminate against anyone, including women," said Mona Williams, Wal-Mart's vice president for communications.
She noted that when Wal-Mart posted notices companywide in January inviting workers to apply to become management trainees, only 43 percent of those who expressed interest were women.
(emphasis mine)
13-16 hour days molding, assembling, and painting toys, 7 days a week; 20 hour days in the peak season.
A whole 13 hours at Christmas? And here I am working at my shop doing 24 hour days. Fuck you and the horse you rode in on. They have it good. But hey, just pretend nobody is working long hours at Christmas in North America, the wool over your eyes will keep you warm.
Workers are paid 13 cents/hour wages in China: the minimum wage is 31 cents.
The minimum wage in Shenyang, for example, is 320 yuan monthly, or 8 cents per hour if your above numbers are true.
But that's ok. Don't let the truth cloud your rhetoric.
There is no health or safety enforcement: constant headaches and nausea from chemical fumes, indoor temperatures above 100 degrees F, rampant repetitive stress disorder, no protective clothing available.
That's not unusual for any Chinese factory. It's not unusual for any developing nation. It is unfortunate and my heart bleeds for them. But denying them employment and money will only serve to exacerbate such problems through death and pestilence.
Most employees are young women or teenage girls.
It is unfortunate that in most rural areas choices are diffcult and it is believed in such areas that men are more suited to farm work than women. This leads to women working in such factories to support the financial aspect of such families.
Suppliers have to open their accounting books to Wal-Mart executives so they can cut "unnecessary expenses" like unionized worke
Impossible. WalMart does not force employees to work there. Employees' only compulsions to work there are their own personal preferences.
>2. WAL-MART'S LOW PRICES ARE THE RESULT OF HUMAN MISERY:
Wal-Mart's low prices sustain development in third world countries. Without Wal-Mart many Chinese would die. You prefer this option?
>3. WAL-MART FORCES ITS UNETHICAL PRACTICES ON ITS 65,000 SUPPLIERS:
I thought Wal-Mart didn't sell weapons. Exactly how is this force acting on them? Is this like the Luke Skywalker style force? Oh, wait, you mean it's the "market economics" force. Hmmm. Do you like the option of shopping where you like? Yeah? But you're selfish and refuse to extend that right to Wal-Mart? How hypocritical.
>4. WAL-MART DESTROYS LOCAL COMMUNITIES:
LOL. As a small business, Wal-Mart has done one major thing: Forced me to serve customers better than them. This is something you don't agree with? Shame on you.
>5. WAL-MART IS NOT ACCOUNTABLE:
They fired their accountants?
Oh, wait, you mean they don't give a shit about anything but themselves. Well, as you can see from #3, neither do you. So I can safely ignore this one.
>I researched this Spring '03, so all facts are current as of Fall '02 - Spring '03:
You need to work harder. Your points are all so easy to refute.
>Of course, there are many stipulations as to how much of a work can be copied e.g. max 20% per work
Yes, and unfortunately the librarians stick to that even when it makes no sense.
I remember needing to copy an entire map book published by the government of Canada. They wouldn't let me. Why? I already paid for the damn thing. The only reason I'm copying it and not getting a free copy from the government is that I needed a very out of date version that obviously was out of print. Stupid, stupid, stupid.
They'd probably tell me I'm only allowed to copy 20% of a linux HOWTO as well.:-(
Same sort of thing for me, but this was a book on coding in RPG.
However, rather than photocopy it, which is only good once, I scanned all 1300 pages of it. Yes, it took an entire day. Of which I enjoyed every minute. IIRC it took 2 CDs for the entire book (the different forms needed 600 dpi 256 grascales to be readable).
I figure for a language that old, the book is probably out of copyright by now.:-P
>XP is the first Windows OS to know what to do with zip files without the necessity of downloading and paying for (or stealing by cracking) WinZip, for instance. Then there is Acrobat, shockwave, realplayer, etc etc.
Close. Windows ME beat XP to the punch for that feature.
>I became a sysadmin for Microsoft run businesses (As well as a netadmin) and now I don't have to look very hard for potential employment opportunities
Try not to take this personally... but...
Being an AZ driver (HGV motorist for the overseas folks) means not needing to very look hard for potential employement opportunities, either. And the pay is good. But it certainly isn't a career to advocate.
>So basically what you're trying to say is: Money > Human Life.
No, that's not what I'm "basically" trying to say at all.
I'm trying to say people should do their jobs, and not try to do the jobs of others. As a businessman myself I know how frustrating it can be when someone else who is clearly poorly equipped to do the job tries to butt in.
>It's nice to think that what with war looming, the prospect of thousands of people being killed, all business men can think about is money. It sickens me.
Sooo, in your topsy-turvy world, would you have amnesty international manage money, and businessmen human rights departments? That'd sicken me.
Why should a businessman care about anything else other than money when they're doing their job? Their job is to manage money. It's when they're *not* managing money properly you should worry (a la Enron).
>Your inability to read my comment (I've said "Speed to fast (including "for conditions"), fatal: 149 ") + your tending to speculate wrong bring me to a conclusion: you are trolling here.
Your inability to stay on topic (we are discussing SPEEDING, not going 1 km/h in the snow) leads me to know you are trolling.
So, FYAD.
>I don't get, how speeading on poorly designed road can help to save lifes?
I don't get that either, being that none of those drivers were speeding (can you read?)
>149 is on a second place.
Your lack of comprehension is amazing. You not only can't read but also can't add.
But, I'll play along. Using my amazing powers of reading, I'll show you the chart in order of fatalities:
Driving Properly - 540 Lost Control - 171 Improper Lane Change - 103 Speed too fast - 77
Can you read? Can you? Even if we used your made up "149" number that isn't present in the stats, it's still only 3rd.
>What's really scary for me is to see traffic reports daily showing the fast speed as a reason of death or injury. People like you on the road is also what's scary for me.
What's scary to me is that people take all that so seriously. When they tell you that radiation is a reason for death/injury do you suddenly buy a HazMat suit?
People like you on the road (going slower than other traffic) scare me too. I guess we're all all driving around afraid of each other. I wonder why there's so many accidents then. Hmmm...
>That's a pure troll. Police can *NEVER* encourage people to break the law.
ROTFLMAO! I bet you even think that if you follow a police officer who is breaking the speed limit but doesn't have his/her lights on that you can't be ticketed too, right? I mean, they can't encourage you to break the law!
Pfffft. Again, you can't read. LOL. Go to your library and find the article for yourself. Remember: Wheels Section, cover article, somewhere between October and November in the Toronto Star. That can't cover much more than 8 issues. I'm not paying $2 to compensate for your decision not to read newspapers. Or phone the OPP. Tell them you plan to do 100 km/h (perferrably with a buddy) for the entire 401 in the left-lane. I'll enjoy your shock and horror when you find them telling you they'll ticket you.
>Personally, I am driving at 100 at freeways. And both me and my attorney will be happy if any police cop will try to bust me for not breaking the law.
Read and learn. It took an appeal (at *HIS* cost) to get the ticket taken off. Sure your attorney will love you for it. You know why? He knows you'll get off, but only after paying him a few thousand. HAVE FUN!
>401 (when it's not jammed)
Where you are SUPPOSED to speed (read it).
>400, Gardiner (when it's not jammed), QEW, and of course 407 - people like you are driving in average 120 (Ontario speed limit is 100),
Again, that's what the police want. FIND THE ARCTICLE. ARGH! DAMMIT! I'll just go to the library and get it for you. I'll scan it in. I have to read some boring taffic case law books anyways to defend my latest ticket (no, not for speeding, DESPITE THE FACT I SPEED I'VE NEVER HAD A SINGLE SPEEDING TICKET, because I do it within reason to suit current traffic speeds and I speed where the cops WANT me to speed). Will you be happy if you read it? It's two full pages long with many juicy quotes like "Well, we might ticket someone for doing over 130 km/h on the 401".
>Of course the road is often blocked for 20-30 minutes each time after a car accident (which most like is caused be speeding), but most of the time the traffic is moving and most of the traffic is breaking the law.
Somewhat true. Traffic accidents caused by people LIKE YOURSELF. The police aren't ticketing people like you (read abov
>Speed to fast (including "for conditions"), fatal: 149
Where do you get 149 fatalities from?
I don't grep the number 149 anywhere in there. Can you find it for me? I'm looking hard and I just can't find the damn thing.
Oh, wait, now I see. You're adding people who smash into each other at 1 km/h in the snow with people who are actually speeding. Oh. That makes no sense. Would you like to re-do your number? (I'm guessing you would).
FACT: Driving properly of one's vehicle is the leading cause of fatal accidents in Ontario. Which should cause one to question the design of Ontario roads (as a country driver, they are designed extremely poorly -- every tiny country town has a "dead man's corner").
FACT #2: Speeding is the 4th most likely cause of a fatal accident in Ontario. It is sandwiched in between "Lost Control" and "Unknown" causes.
FACT #3: Speeding is the 2nd LEAST likely "crime" to cause property damage.
FACT #4: Speeding is the 3rd LEAST likely "crime" to cause injury.
Given a choice, I'd rather a speeding driver hit me than someone failing to yield the right of way hit me. That way, it's likely to cause the least damage to my car, and I'm likely to come out of it in perfect shape if I don't die. The last thing I'd want is to live the rest of my life a vegetable.
>You know, I for one agree to bring 149 cop unmarked cars to highways of Ontario just to save life of 149 people. No need to mention saving 5935 people from being injured.
I bet you're all for CCD cameras on the streets too (shudder). Increased police presence causes accidents (You live in the GTA and haven't experienced E-braking on the 407 at the cop stops?).
>By the way, I am living in Ontario.
Then how come you don't know what "speed too fast" means? Scary!
>I see crazy dangerous speeding guys on the road each time.
You must live in a very different region of Ontario than me. I might, at most, see perhaps 1 driver every couple of days speeding in a dangerous way. I see far more people cutting each other off, rear-ending each other at intersections, driving *slower* than me in the left lane and running through red lights.
As a toronto resident, I assume you have read the Toronto Star Wheels edition where the police explain they will bust anyone *NOT* breaking the 401 speed limit in the left lane? It was about 3 weeks ago, I'm sure it's archived somewhere.
>Every day, every hour the traffic report on the radio saying that at least one of 7 GTA freeways is not free anymore.
How can you be from TO and see people speeding? I've been there, you aren't making any sense. The roads in TO are so blocked up with traffic its next to impossible to speed, except when nobody's using the roads (in which case it would take mucho work to kill someone).
>Do you like to be stuck in the traffic?
And then you admit what I just said?!? You're being quite confusing.
>Public sector sellers usually take cash, but don't always. I remember a friend in texas who got a speeding ticket and paid in pennies, then when he went to register his car a few months later there was a sign up saying "We do not accept small change".
It may be different in the US, but Canada enacted some form of law making it illegal to use certain amounts of change to pay for items. IIRC, you can't use more than 10 pennies to pay for anything if seller doesn't agree to take it. Probably enacted just to stop such silly things as the above!
BTW: If you do ever a parking ticket, check the books for the law. Some bylaw books around here didn't define what a "quarter", "nickel", "dime", or "penny" were. The defence is then simple: You don't carry "foreign" change from the countries of "quarter", "nickel", "dime", or "penny" so you couldn't feed the meter.
>If you're passing everyone else (or trying to by constantly bobbing and weaving lanes), you're driving too fast.
If you're NOT passing everyone else (towards the passenger side) and you're not in the curb lane, you're driving too slow. Police often give tickets for not doing this (passing people in the passing lane).
As a percentage, speeding causes 0.8% of ALL collisions. In fact, the biggest culprit for collisions is driving properly (48% of all collisions).
845 people died in collisions during 2001 in Ontario. This means, from 845 people, 6 people have died due to speeding. In comparison, driving properly causes 405 deaths each year, and following to close (generally due to slow drivers followed by angry fast drivers) 72 deaths each year. Simply installing more controlled intersections could reduce the number of deaths significantly, whereas it would take a miracle to save the 6 people who died from speeding.
To get numbers that would fit the entire US, multiply those numbers by 30.
>I don't think that anything's wrong with tracking my speed.
>But, I repeat again, if the highway speed is unreasonable low then you should use your democracy, with which you are so proud you have it, and change the speed limit signs.
Better yet, take all tickets to court. The court system of Ontario is currently so backed up, my following too close ticket will likely fall outside of the 8 month maximum, and will be thrown out on Charter grounds. It wouldn't even take 0.01% more people to fight their tickets to guarantee nobody who fights their ticket will actually have to pay.
FYI, Police in Ontario will ticket you for NOT breaking the speed limit on the 401. True story, it's happened. Only on appeal was the ticket dismissed.
>Whether or not her parents can afford to pay for whatever it takes to make her well again should not factor into the equation.
True. But shouldn't money factor into the equation if it's patching up a stuntman?
There's extremes on both sides. I know I spend more time shouting at Real TV about how those idiots filmed are wasthing my money (and being angry the idiots don't die from their stupid acts -- If anything supports the bible position against darwinism, it's Real TV) than I do seeing it being spent wisely.
Socialist healthcare has no business paying to fix self-inflicted injuries. At some point personal responsibility overtakes social responsibility.
If teachers REALLY a shit about students, they wouldn't go on strike for retirement benefits when the government trades them in for smaller class sizes (yes, unlike them, I actually read the bill).
I speak as a proud student (at the time) who ended any and all respect for teachers that day.
>You mean like morals and ethics and "Thou shalt not murder" ? Excuse me, but I think you've arrived at a conclusion without bothering to do any investigation.
Good point.
But what about morals and ethics like "Kill all the gays" or "Kill all Kafirs?"
Slashdot Mirror
>What exactly does it bleed?
The sorrow of the hardship of "growing up" into a mostly developed world.
>It would seem from the rest of your post that you are a hardline, anything-not-illegal-goes cheap-labor Republican hell-bent on defending the rights of us priveledged folks to cash in on the misery and lack of rights of others in the world.
Hmmm. I'm not sure where you get that. I simply believe in the right of businesses to conduct themselves in a manner that befits a capitalist country, and I believe in their right to economically sustain any country (be it China or otherwise) that they may choose.
>We could go further and point out how the unquestioning, God-gave-me-the-fucking-right-because-I'm-American capitalism you apparently espouse (along with most Republicans I know) is the reason we make so little progress toward attainable ends like eradicating world hunger, fighting AIDS in Africa, ensuring gender and racial equality, ending extreme poverty, and maybe even paying people a little more than so-called minimum wage.
Well, please do so. I'm intrigued on this opinion of yours that capitalism is the fault of all the world's evils, despite the clear evidence that capitalist countries are the envy of the world.
>And just for the record, I have a friend who has worked at WalMart for 10 years, and is just now working up the guts to leave.
If he's not happy, bully for him!
>He's a manager there, and they pay him less than $28,000/yr, and take $230 from each of his checks for health insurance.
Okay. Makes sense he might not be happy there then. Glad to see he's exercising his rights to find better employment. I wish him good luck on finding a better job.
>They also actively promote the idea that there are no other solid jobs out there, and that if you leave WalMart, you'll just have to come back because you'll be laid off within a year anyway.
Well, assuming your friend is more intelligent than a tree stump (clearly, he his) why, exactly, are you worried? Do you believe people are so easily convinced that they are screwed? Sounds to me like you're suggesting people working at WalMart are fickle to the extreme, which I don't believe.
>This is one of the hardest-working guys I know, and because he doesn't bitch and whine, throw tantrums and threaten to quit, he has associates working under him who make more.
Remember the capitalist mantra: WORK SMARTER, NOT HARDER. Sorry that your friend never figured out the corporate culture there. It clearly seems that he could be making far more if he were conforming to the wishes of his employers (that is, being whiny and throwing tantrums). If he doesn't wish to do that, he only needs to exercise his option to find work somewhere that doesn't require that (shouldn't be hard at all -- that's a very unusual requirement of a worker, that they throw tantrums and be whiny). Which he has done. Hallelujah! The system works!
>The point of all this is that it does make a difference whether we pay attention to human misery!
It does! That's why I want to see WalMart continue to deter it by infusing money into the Chinese economy.
>Other people in the world deserve fair pay for their work, just as much as you do, and our consumerist culture has grown the idea that what happens on the other side of the world doesn't matter, as long as I can get my new toaster for $10 less than that guy down the street is selling them.
Wrong. Our consumerist culture has realised that countries have to start somewhere, and that given time the lifestyle in China will improve along with their economy. They simply got started late and unfortunately it always takes time to play catchup.
>My wife and I seek out and buy fair-trade goods, because even if we pay a couple dollars more for them, we're supporting the producer, and that makes a difference on a worldwide scale.
Good for you! Consumers, such a
>I'll add you as a friend at least. Nice reading.
:-)
Thanks. I don't normally get so outspoken on such issues, but there were way too many blatant lies (such as the existence of a Chinese "minimum wage") there that it gets my blood boiling.
>Wrong. You're assuming an open availability of jobs, which doesn't exist either in the real world or any theoretical ones. The job market is terrible, especially for people who lack education or skills to get a modestly paying job (>$18000/yr).
How unusual that those who lack skills have a difficult time being useful. I don't understand why it strikes you as odd that these people are having a tough time getting a well paying job. It seems perfectly natural that those lacking skills will be without good jobs. Am I wrong to think this way? I don't think so.
>They may have no useful education or job skills to work anywhere else in their area, there may be no other employer in their area that is hiring, or Wal-Mart might be (believe it or not) the highest paying employer they can work at.
In the first case, you have to fault the job seeker for choosing to lack such skills and education (unless the job seeker is mentally handicapped, in which case we have to work on a different argument). In the second case, it's unfortunate, but at least WalMart is there to give them a job, and also in the last case, exactly how is WalMart doing people a disservice?
Seems to me in all three cases WalMart is being the "good guy". Perhaps you can point out to me how.
>Jobs being produced in third world countries and factories being built does not mean "development" is taking place, if the jobs being created do not pay a high enough wage that employees are bettering their lives through working there, or if the factories are not running cleanly enough that they are polluting the area and causing health and environmental harm to the area.
The alternative is far worse. I think you can see that for yourself. Given a choice, would you rather live in Ethiopia, where few to none are employed to produce foreign products, or in China? I think the choice is absolutely clear.
Is this all you have for me?
* "Full-Time" (actually 28 hours/week) employees only gross $11,000 a year, on average.
$7.55 an hour ($11,000 / 52 / 28) is an acceptable wage for menial labour and working half days (4 hours). A full time worker (8 hour days) would make twice that amount, or $22,00 USD. Which is 58% of the US GDP. A very reasonable wage for a clerk.
Health benefits are available only after two years, but premiums are so high only 38% of employees can afford it.
Workers then should look elsewhere for health benefits, or perhaps form something people in the USA like to call an "HMO".
Even discussing working conditions or unionization will result in retaliation and firing.
Interesting. Firing for discussing unsafe conditions is clearly illegal and I dare you to show evidence of this accusation. Oh, and unlike WalMart, *I* don't fire for discussing unionization. I take it a step further. I close down the store and therefore everyone is fired. Anyone working here knows that upon employment. WalMart employees should be happy that's all that happens.
There is "a harsh, anti-woman culture in which complaints go unanswered and the women who make them are targeted for retaliation." (Quote taken from a national class-action suit against Wal-Mart.)
A biased party made a quote against the party they hate? How blase. Allow me to make one or two for good measure, anyways:
(emphasis mine)
13-16 hour days molding, assembling, and painting toys, 7 days a week; 20 hour days in the peak season.
A whole 13 hours at Christmas? And here I am working at my shop doing 24 hour days. Fuck you and the horse you rode in on. They have it good. But hey, just pretend nobody is working long hours at Christmas in North America, the wool over your eyes will keep you warm.
Workers are paid 13 cents/hour wages in China: the minimum wage is 31 cents.
Incorrect. There is no minimum wage in China. However, individual Chinese cities have elected to enact minimum wage standards.
The minimum wage in Shenyang, for example, is 320 yuan monthly, or 8 cents per hour if your above numbers are true.
But that's ok. Don't let the truth cloud your rhetoric.
There is no health or safety enforcement: constant headaches and nausea from chemical fumes, indoor temperatures above 100 degrees F, rampant repetitive stress disorder, no protective clothing available.
That's not unusual for any Chinese factory. It's not unusual for any developing nation. It is unfortunate and my heart bleeds for them. But denying them employment and money will only serve to exacerbate such problems through death and pestilence.
Most employees are young women or teenage girls.
It is unfortunate that in most rural areas choices are diffcult and it is believed in such areas that men are more suited to farm work than women. This leads to women working in such factories to support the financial aspect of such families.
Suppliers have to open their accounting books to Wal-Mart executives so they can cut "unnecessary expenses" like unionized worke
>1. AMERICAN WAL-MART EMPLOYEES ARE EXPLOITED:
Impossible. WalMart does not force employees to work there. Employees' only compulsions to work there are their own personal preferences.
>2. WAL-MART'S LOW PRICES ARE THE RESULT OF HUMAN MISERY:
Wal-Mart's low prices sustain development in third world countries. Without Wal-Mart many Chinese would die. You prefer this option?
>3. WAL-MART FORCES ITS UNETHICAL PRACTICES ON ITS 65,000 SUPPLIERS:
I thought Wal-Mart didn't sell weapons. Exactly how is this force acting on them? Is this like the Luke Skywalker style force? Oh, wait, you mean it's the "market economics" force. Hmmm. Do you like the option of shopping where you like? Yeah? But you're selfish and refuse to extend that right to Wal-Mart? How hypocritical.
>4. WAL-MART DESTROYS LOCAL COMMUNITIES:
LOL. As a small business, Wal-Mart has done one major thing: Forced me to serve customers better than them. This is something you don't agree with? Shame on you.
>5. WAL-MART IS NOT ACCOUNTABLE:
They fired their accountants?
Oh, wait, you mean they don't give a shit about anything but themselves. Well, as you can see from #3, neither do you. So I can safely ignore this one.
>I researched this Spring '03, so all facts are current as of Fall '02 - Spring '03:
You need to work harder. Your points are all so easy to refute.
>Of course, there are many stipulations as to how much of a work can be copied e.g. max 20% per work
:-(
Yes, and unfortunately the librarians stick to that even when it makes no sense.
I remember needing to copy an entire map book published by the government of Canada. They wouldn't let me. Why? I already paid for the damn thing. The only reason I'm copying it and not getting a free copy from the government is that I needed a very out of date version that obviously was out of print. Stupid, stupid, stupid.
They'd probably tell me I'm only allowed to copy 20% of a linux HOWTO as well.
Same sort of thing for me, but this was a book on coding in RPG.
:-P
However, rather than photocopy it, which is only good once, I scanned all 1300 pages of it. Yes, it took an entire day. Of which I enjoyed every minute. IIRC it took 2 CDs for the entire book (the different forms needed 600 dpi 256 grascales to be readable).
I figure for a language that old, the book is probably out of copyright by now.
>XP is the first Windows OS to know what to do with zip files without the necessity of downloading and paying for (or stealing by cracking) WinZip, for instance. Then there is Acrobat, shockwave, realplayer, etc etc.
Close. Windows ME beat XP to the punch for that feature.
No?
Then don't do the same thing for your HVAC system.
>I became a sysadmin for Microsoft run businesses (As well as a netadmin) and now I don't have to look very hard for potential employment opportunities
Try not to take this personally... but...
Being an AZ driver (HGV motorist for the overseas folks) means not needing to very look hard for potential employement opportunities, either. And the pay is good. But it certainly isn't a career to advocate.
Just my two cents.
>So basically what you're trying to say is: Money > Human Life.
No, that's not what I'm "basically" trying to say at all.
I'm trying to say people should do their jobs, and not try to do the jobs of others. As a businessman myself I know how frustrating it can be when someone else who is clearly poorly equipped to do the job tries to butt in.
Hope that clears it up.
>It's nice to think that what with war looming, the prospect of thousands of people being killed, all business men can think about is money. It sickens me.
Sooo, in your topsy-turvy world, would you have amnesty international manage money, and businessmen human rights departments? That'd sicken me.
Why should a businessman care about anything else other than money when they're doing their job? Their job is to manage money. It's when they're *not* managing money properly you should worry (a la Enron).
If it's good enough for Apple, it should be good enough for you! :-)
(Actually, the reason for metal is to pass FCC laws)
>Your inability to read my comment (I've said "Speed to fast (including "for conditions"), fatal: 149 ") + your tending to speculate wrong bring me to a conclusion: you are trolling here.
Your inability to stay on topic (we are discussing SPEEDING, not going 1 km/h in the snow) leads me to know you are trolling.
So, FYAD.
>I don't get, how speeading on poorly designed road can help to save lifes?
I don't get that either, being that none of those drivers were speeding (can you read?)
>149 is on a second place.
Your lack of comprehension is amazing. You not only can't read but also can't add.
But, I'll play along. Using my amazing powers of reading, I'll show you the chart in order of fatalities:
Driving Properly - 540
Lost Control - 171
Improper Lane Change - 103
Speed too fast - 77
Can you read? Can you? Even if we used your made up "149" number that isn't present in the stats, it's still only 3rd.
>What's really scary for me is to see traffic reports daily showing the fast speed as a reason of death or injury. People like you on the road is also what's scary for me.
What's scary to me is that people take all that so seriously. When they tell you that radiation is a reason for death/injury do you suddenly buy a HazMat suit?
People like you on the road (going slower than other traffic) scare me too. I guess we're all all driving around afraid of each other. I wonder why there's so many accidents then. Hmmm...
>That's a pure troll. Police can *NEVER* encourage people to break the law.
ROTFLMAO! I bet you even think that if you follow a police officer who is breaking the speed limit but doesn't have his/her lights on that you can't be ticketed too, right? I mean, they can't encourage you to break the law!
Pfffft. Again, you can't read. LOL. Go to your library and find the article for yourself. Remember: Wheels Section, cover article, somewhere between October and November in the Toronto Star. That can't cover much more than 8 issues. I'm not paying $2 to compensate for your decision not to read newspapers. Or phone the OPP. Tell them you plan to do 100 km/h (perferrably with a buddy) for the entire 401 in the left-lane. I'll enjoy your shock and horror when you find them telling you they'll ticket you.
Oh wait, here's some evidence. Now shove that on your bridge, troll.
>Personally, I am driving at 100 at freeways. And both me and my attorney will be happy if any police cop will try to bust me for not breaking the law.
Read and learn. It took an appeal (at *HIS* cost) to get the ticket taken off. Sure your attorney will love you for it. You know why? He knows you'll get off, but only after paying him a few thousand. HAVE FUN!
>401 (when it's not jammed)
Where you are SUPPOSED to speed (read it).
>400, Gardiner (when it's not jammed), QEW, and of course 407 - people like you are driving in average 120 (Ontario speed limit is 100),
Again, that's what the police want. FIND THE ARCTICLE. ARGH! DAMMIT! I'll just go to the library and get it for you. I'll scan it in. I have to read some boring taffic case law books anyways to defend my latest ticket (no, not for speeding, DESPITE THE FACT I SPEED I'VE NEVER HAD A SINGLE SPEEDING TICKET, because I do it within reason to suit current traffic speeds and I speed where the cops WANT me to speed). Will you be happy if you read it? It's two full pages long with many juicy quotes like "Well, we might ticket someone for doing over 130 km/h on the 401".
>Of course the road is often blocked for 20-30 minutes each time after a car accident (which most like is caused be speeding), but most of the time the traffic is moving and most of the traffic is breaking the law.
Somewhat true. Traffic accidents caused by people LIKE YOURSELF. The police aren't ticketing people like you (read abov
>Speed to fast (including "for conditions"), fatal: 149
Where do you get 149 fatalities from?
I don't grep the number 149 anywhere in there. Can you find it for me? I'm looking hard and I just can't find the damn thing.
Oh, wait, now I see. You're adding people who smash into each other at 1 km/h in the snow with people who are actually speeding. Oh. That makes no sense. Would you like to re-do your number? (I'm guessing you would).
FACT: Driving properly of one's vehicle is the leading cause of fatal accidents in Ontario. Which should cause one to question the design of Ontario roads (as a country driver, they are designed extremely poorly -- every tiny country town has a "dead man's corner").
FACT #2: Speeding is the 4th most likely cause of a fatal accident in Ontario. It is sandwiched in between "Lost Control" and "Unknown" causes.
FACT #3: Speeding is the 2nd LEAST likely "crime" to cause property damage.
FACT #4: Speeding is the 3rd LEAST likely "crime" to cause injury.
Given a choice, I'd rather a speeding driver hit me than someone failing to yield the right of way hit me. That way, it's likely to cause the least damage to my car, and I'm likely to come out of it in perfect shape if I don't die. The last thing I'd want is to live the rest of my life a vegetable.
>You know, I for one agree to bring 149 cop unmarked cars to highways of Ontario just to save life of 149 people. No need to mention saving 5935 people from being injured.
I bet you're all for CCD cameras on the streets too (shudder). Increased police presence causes accidents (You live in the GTA and haven't experienced E-braking on the 407 at the cop stops?).
>By the way, I am living in Ontario.
Then how come you don't know what "speed too fast" means? Scary!
>I see crazy dangerous speeding guys on the road each time.
You must live in a very different region of Ontario than me. I might, at most, see perhaps 1 driver every couple of days speeding in a dangerous way. I see far more people cutting each other off, rear-ending each other at intersections, driving *slower* than me in the left lane and running through red lights.
As a toronto resident, I assume you have read the Toronto Star Wheels edition where the police explain they will bust anyone *NOT* breaking the 401 speed limit in the left lane? It was about 3 weeks ago, I'm sure it's archived somewhere.
>Every day, every hour the traffic report on the radio saying that at least one of 7 GTA freeways is not free anymore.
How can you be from TO and see people speeding? I've been there, you aren't making any sense. The roads in TO are so blocked up with traffic its next to impossible to speed, except when nobody's using the roads (in which case it would take mucho work to kill someone).
>Do you like to be stuck in the traffic?
And then you admit what I just said?!? You're being quite confusing.
>Public sector sellers usually take cash, but don't always. I remember a friend in texas who got a speeding ticket and paid in pennies, then when he went to register his car a few months later there was a sign up saying "We do not accept small change".
It may be different in the US, but Canada enacted some form of law making it illegal to use certain amounts of change to pay for items. IIRC, you can't use more than 10 pennies to pay for anything if seller doesn't agree to take it. Probably enacted just to stop such silly things as the above!
BTW: If you do ever a parking ticket, check the books for the law. Some bylaw books around here didn't define what a "quarter", "nickel", "dime", or "penny" were. The defence is then simple: You don't carry "foreign" change from the countries of "quarter", "nickel", "dime", or "penny" so you couldn't feed the meter.
>If you're passing everyone else (or trying to by constantly bobbing and weaving lanes), you're driving too fast.
If you're NOT passing everyone else (towards the passenger side) and you're not in the curb lane, you're driving too slow. Police often give tickets for not doing this (passing people in the passing lane).
>No need to mention that many people are dead from speeding.
Incorrect. If you would refer to some data, for example, the Ontario Annual Safety Report, you'll see the following extremely helpful data:
Apparent Driver Action by Class of Collision 2001
Total Collisions: 419,937
Speeding: 3,353
As a percentage, speeding causes 0.8% of ALL collisions. In fact, the biggest culprit for collisions is driving properly (48% of all collisions).
845 people died in collisions during 2001 in Ontario. This means, from 845 people, 6 people have died due to speeding. In comparison, driving properly causes 405 deaths each year, and following to close (generally due to slow drivers followed by angry fast drivers) 72 deaths each year. Simply installing more controlled intersections could reduce the number of deaths significantly, whereas it would take a miracle to save the 6 people who died from speeding.
To get numbers that would fit the entire US, multiply those numbers by 30.
>I don't think that anything's wrong with tracking my speed.
I do. Photo radar kills.
>But, I repeat again, if the highway speed is unreasonable low then you should use your democracy, with which you are so proud you have it, and change the speed limit signs.
Better yet, take all tickets to court. The court system of Ontario is currently so backed up, my following too close ticket will likely fall outside of the 8 month maximum, and will be thrown out on Charter grounds. It wouldn't even take 0.01% more people to fight their tickets to guarantee nobody who fights their ticket will actually have to pay.
FYI, Police in Ontario will ticket you for NOT breaking the speed limit on the 401. True story, it's happened. Only on appeal was the ticket dismissed.
>What happens in 10 years when all toll highways are EZ-Pass and people can't switch back to cash?
I might be wrong, but I am pretty sure it's law that any form of legal tender must be accepted for government services.
I'm also relatively sure that any private sector seller must accept legal tender as a method of payment also. But I may be wrong.
(legal tender, of course, being cash)
>Add to that I live in canada, so I can't purchase music with these services (yes I tried).
Don't worry about it then. In Canada you can just copy your neighbours CD collection. Don't forget to let the RIAA know you're exercising your rights.
Have fun!
>Whether or not her parents can afford to pay for whatever it takes to make her well again should not factor into the equation.
True. But shouldn't money factor into the equation if it's patching up a stuntman?
There's extremes on both sides. I know I spend more time shouting at Real TV about how those idiots filmed are wasthing my money (and being angry the idiots don't die from their stupid acts -- If anything supports the bible position against darwinism, it's Real TV) than I do seeing it being spent wisely.
Socialist healthcare has no business paying to fix self-inflicted injuries. At some point personal responsibility overtakes social responsibility.
No, fuck you very much.
If teachers REALLY a shit about students, they wouldn't go on strike for retirement benefits when the government trades them in for smaller class sizes (yes, unlike them, I actually read the bill).
I speak as a proud student (at the time) who ended any and all respect for teachers that day.
>What if the life-threatening situation occurs at the theater, like a heart attack?
You know, even those drive in theaters out in the country have land-lines.
>but I know the thing will work and NEVER crash.
Unless you need to divide numbers.
>You mean like morals and ethics and "Thou shalt not murder" ? Excuse me, but I think you've arrived at a conclusion without bothering to do any investigation.
Good point.
But what about morals and ethics like "Kill all the gays" or "Kill all Kafirs?"