You want to talk about straw man? And you offer sugar, food, and caffeine? I specifically used slavery BECAUSE it was so far and away more heinous, and it proved my point perfectly!
BTW: "A straw man is a common form of argument and is an informal fallacy based on giving the impression of refuting an opponent's argument, while actually refuting an argument which was not advanced by that opponent." Your argument was that since alcohol has been around since ancient times, we wouldn't be able to legislate it out of existence. I countered, using the fact (and your own fucking words, mind you) that slavery has also been around since ancient times, but we were indeed able to legislate it out. The facts that I did not include (incorrectly thinking that you were of normal intelligence and would naturally infer them), such as the fact that slavery had a huge impact on big business, and it's demise would be detrimental to that profit, would make it even less likely to do away with, but we were STILL able to. This was not a straw-man, since I directly countered the arguments that you presented, again, using your exact words.
But OK, to use YOUR examples, how many people do you know who have gotten hopped up on sugar, Starbucks, and Big Macs, and then killed people because they were so impaired that they couldn't drive?
Jesus Christ, you are a complete and utter moron...
Alcohol is a drug, pure and simple. My point is that it's a drug that is ACCEPTED, even though it's physiological and societal impact is much more violent and detrimental than other (illegal) drugs. Period.
I think most "pro-gun" people see training requirements as an infringement of their rights...maybe an alternative is to instead offer MASSIVE tax breaks (like the Earned Income Tax Credit) for those who complete training. So you could still legally own weapons with no training, but you have very little incentive to do so. With the exception of my parents, every firearms owner I know is ex-military or law enforcement, so we are already at least somewhat proficient in basic weapons handling and marksmanship.
I don't think you are right about this... Most gun owners have already taken gun safety and handling training (think: hunter safety), which is very widely offered (if not universally offered) in every state in the US. By the NRA, BTW: the largest firearm safety advocate there is. So I don't think any incentive is needed or required to get people to take safety training. In fact, I think most "pro gun" people (myself included) are very open and accepting to more safety training; I view it as an ongoing process. You can never, ever learn enough; that's true in every facet of your life. More safety training, more target practice (which makes the shooter a safer shooter, in both their marksmanship and firearm handling techniques), etc.
And, just because a person is ex-military or LEO, doesn't necessarily mean they are more proficient with weapons than someone who is not. I know ex-military that were from the medical corps and the chaplain corps that would not know very much about firearm care or handling. So, you can't group people like that and expect each and every one of them to have the same proficiency level. Though, it does indicate that they have probably had SOME training. Almost everyone that I know (male and female) has taken hunter safety in their lifetime; though, I do live in a rural state, and just about everyone here hunts. Even my daughter-in-law has her concealed-carry permit. So you can't judge a book by it's cover.
Being raised around firearms also lends itself to safety. I don't know any kids that don't have a very healthy respect for firearms, because their parents have taught them properly. They take their kids out and TEACH them safety and respect for them, and how to handle and behave when working with them. Not that they don't lock their firearms up at home; everyone also has a gun case or safe that the kids don't have access to (because, let's face it: kids are kids, and they will do stupid things if you let them. I know this from personal experience!:) ) We don't have a gun problem in this county, we have a "respect" problem: respect for parents, respect for others, and respect for selves. That can't be legislated into being, that can't be taught in school. It has to come from home, and there are too many messed up homes and messed up kids in this country. It's a very sad thing to see.
Posting anonymously because I work for an electronic voting company.
Understandable reason for AC, but not a citation nor proof of expertise.
1) Electronic voting is a completely horrible idea. 2) Voting by "app" (or any other way) on a continual basis is also a horrible idea. 3) Compulsory voting is worse than #1 and #2.
These are all opinions. There is no proof or reasoning included to support your opinions, so your post is just a meaningless, and no more informed than the "mob mentality" group targeted earlier in the post.
There's absolutely nothing wrong with paper ballots counted by hand that Gen Y can't make worse.
Again, opinion with no clarification or substance. You seem to leave out the ability for paper ballots to be "lost", or changed, or counted incorrectly by the humans in charge of them. Paper does not prohibit the "mob mentality" problem, and it doesn't solve the influence issue, from either the voter, the handlers, or the counters.
I want people to have to put more effort into voting than the average Tinder swipe, and there's a perfectly valid case for "rational ignorance" in our political system. Those people should be able to choose not to vote.
Now, this section of your post actually has some value to it and presents a fair point. Agree wholeheartedly. I don't always understand every issue on our already limited ballot system, and there should be an "N/A" selection available, showing deliberate abstinence toward making a choice, not a missed opportunity to vote, and not a chance to invalidate my vote because of an incomplete ballot.
First of all, ND has two air bases: GF and Minot. The GFAFB is the drone base, and the Minot AFB has B52's and command over what's left of the Minuteman II missiles in ND. Second, oil exploration has all but stopped, but production is ongoing with the wells already producing. Farming is a huge potential use for drones, more so than even oil (ND is in the top 5 in 23 out of 34 crops tracked by the USDA, and is the number one producer of 8 of the 34) and those could be even more productive with the new tech that's coming up. There's an entirely new field of study (Precision Ag) that is studying using new tech like drones to more productively use the land and resources.
As far as the "It gets dark too early in the Winter" argument: the reciprocal is that the summer days are longer. Both are true for all of the northern states, east to west coast, so why the disparaging remark of short daylight time in the winter season is targeted toward ND alone is beyond me. Of course, it was an AC that was making this statement, so the troll value is obviously quite high, and therefore subject to the question of accuracy.
My personal opinion is rapidly changing to "I hate winter here." I used to love the winter, but I'm slowly wanting to escape it and move to warmer climes...
Alcohol: the most abused drug in the US today... the one that has the most social impact and consequences of all drugs. And it's legal. Meanwhile, other, less impactive drugs, are either illegal or next to it.
The US is a truly fucked up country when it comes to chemical addictions and social norms.
This is such a good post. There are so many facets that anti-gunners don't seem to be able to take into consideration, especially the difference in the cultural mix in this country compared to others that they use as examples.
Well done, Noble713. Wish I had some mod points for ya.
This. If people would, say, lose their license for a year after a third penalty within a set amount of time (say, 1 year), they will comply. If they just have to pay even a high fine each time, it's not a deterrent. The penalty for continued noncompliance must be very harsh, to ensure compliance. Losing your driving privileges (not rights!) for a significant period of time is most likely harsh enough to make a difference.
And, before someone counters, I don't think it will be ignored, like DUI penalties are ignored many times. Simply for this reason: your judgment is impaired when you're cited for DUI (obviously). However, the majority of speeding is done during lucid, non-impaired times, so the speeder does indeed understand the penalty and outcome consciously.
Binary attachments are the bane of email. Email is meant to be text and text only. The kludge of MIME-encoded binary attachments should have been aborted pre-birth.
Learn to use FTP and send URLs to share files. Or freakin' Dropbox. So many headaches would be prevented if these kind of attachments were prohibited.
If you haven't already figured it out, I HATE the practice of attaching binary files. Just because people are ignorant, and their IT staffs are too lazy to teach them to use the proper tool for the job.
DOS was the operating system of Windows 3.1 GUI interface...
In fact, DOS was the operating system through Windows XP. And if you want to argue that point, delete IO.SYS and MSDOS.SYS on your XP machine and reboot...
OK, maybe a bit sarcastic, but really... A Google employee that DOESN'T know Google is most certainly in the communication business?? Come on... That's all Google is about, is communication.
You are confusing natural gas production (which provides a significant amount of North American electrical generation and home utility) with light sweet crude oil production, which is what goes into the cars people drive to work, the tractor trailers that haul their consumer goods, and the airplanes they fly in. Middle Eastern oil prices have a HUGE impact on the American economy.
No, he's not... The US could be fully independent of ALL foreign oil. Especially with the Bakken shale formations now being tapped.
And, why spend money in the ME when we could use that money more effectively making our country more independent of oil altogether, using alternative sources of energy? Advances in both wind and solar could serve our needs easily, if we would just use it! Get out of ICE and into EVs.
I never thought of this angle before; bear with me as I set it up.
Currently, roadway funding mostly comes from gasoline and diesel taxes. As EVs become more popular, those monies will begin drying up. Governments, always concerned with keeping the money flowing in, are already trying to come up with ways of replacing that revenue from EV drivers.
From the comments that I have read so far, bicyclists feel that they deserve a lane to themselves, and many cities feel that they should have one as well, where appropriate and safe, for multiple valid reasons.
So, who is paying for those lanes? Where is the funding coming from to support it? Would a government entity be more amenable to increasing and improving bike lanes if the bicyclists who use them would pony up for the creation and maintenance of the lanes, in some way, shape, or form?
I am in no way against bike lanes and paths; I think it's a great idea and should be supported and improved, even though I'm not one (I ride on two wheels, but there's a motor between my legs). Just trying to open a discussion and floating an idea or two...
...The proper solution to Oracle, Sybase and the other enterprise software companies jacking up prices is to explore more FOSS solutions, such as ProgreSQL or NoSQL. And when Microsoft does this, explore the BSDs or Linux.
I agree wholeheartedly; however, the software industry needs to follow suit as well. There are many, many professional software packages that *require* M$ Windows as the host operating system. I harp on the ones that I need to deal with every chance I get, but there never, ever seems to be any acceptance there, even though some of them actually develop on *nix OSes and then port to M$ for the public version. Until the software industry offers versions for both M$ and *nix, your suggestion is, at best, a dream.
There's no difference in a "long gun" and a "military style" weapon except in external looks. They have the EXACT SAME capabilities. They shoot the EXACT SAME ammunition. This BS about "military style" or "assault weapon" guns is exactly that: BS. There is no difference, other than the styling of the weapon. No advantages to either when it comes to accuracy or rate of fire.
Why people cannot seem to get that through their heads is totally beyond me. It's completely illogical and, frankly, stupid.
"Tesla estimated its plant’s NOx emissions would be just.8 pounds per day". NOT 8 POUNDS, 8/10 OF A POUND. So, estimating 10 times as much is closer than your 3. In actuality, it'd be more like 30 times as much.
That's if the furnace was running at 100%, 24 hours per day. Which is probably not true, but must be considered.
Slashdot Mirror
You want to talk about straw man? And you offer sugar, food, and caffeine? I specifically used slavery BECAUSE it was so far and away more heinous, and it proved my point perfectly!
BTW: "A straw man is a common form of argument and is an informal fallacy based on giving the impression of refuting an opponent's argument, while actually refuting an argument which was not advanced by that opponent." Your argument was that since alcohol has been around since ancient times, we wouldn't be able to legislate it out of existence. I countered, using the fact (and your own fucking words, mind you) that slavery has also been around since ancient times, but we were indeed able to legislate it out. The facts that I did not include (incorrectly thinking that you were of normal intelligence and would naturally infer them), such as the fact that slavery had a huge impact on big business, and it's demise would be detrimental to that profit, would make it even less likely to do away with, but we were STILL able to. This was not a straw-man, since I directly countered the arguments that you presented, again, using your exact words.
But OK, to use YOUR examples, how many people do you know who have gotten hopped up on sugar, Starbucks, and Big Macs, and then killed people because they were so impaired that they couldn't drive?
Jesus Christ, you are a complete and utter moron...
Alcohol is a drug, pure and simple. My point is that it's a drug that is ACCEPTED, even though it's physiological and societal impact is much more violent and detrimental than other (illegal) drugs. Period.
The Google cache is an empty page... Surprise, surprise, surprise. So, the spider obviously does not have it's adblocker turned off either.
I think most "pro-gun" people see training requirements as an infringement of their rights...maybe an alternative is to instead offer MASSIVE tax breaks (like the Earned Income Tax Credit) for those who complete training. So you could still legally own weapons with no training, but you have very little incentive to do so. With the exception of my parents, every firearms owner I know is ex-military or law enforcement, so we are already at least somewhat proficient in basic weapons handling and marksmanship.
I don't think you are right about this... Most gun owners have already taken gun safety and handling training (think: hunter safety), which is very widely offered (if not universally offered) in every state in the US. By the NRA, BTW: the largest firearm safety advocate there is. So I don't think any incentive is needed or required to get people to take safety training. In fact, I think most "pro gun" people (myself included) are very open and accepting to more safety training; I view it as an ongoing process. You can never, ever learn enough; that's true in every facet of your life. More safety training, more target practice (which makes the shooter a safer shooter, in both their marksmanship and firearm handling techniques), etc.
And, just because a person is ex-military or LEO, doesn't necessarily mean they are more proficient with weapons than someone who is not. I know ex-military that were from the medical corps and the chaplain corps that would not know very much about firearm care or handling. So, you can't group people like that and expect each and every one of them to have the same proficiency level. Though, it does indicate that they have probably had SOME training. Almost everyone that I know (male and female) has taken hunter safety in their lifetime; though, I do live in a rural state, and just about everyone here hunts. Even my daughter-in-law has her concealed-carry permit. So you can't judge a book by it's cover.
Being raised around firearms also lends itself to safety. I don't know any kids that don't have a very healthy respect for firearms, because their parents have taught them properly. They take their kids out and TEACH them safety and respect for them, and how to handle and behave when working with them. Not that they don't lock their firearms up at home; everyone also has a gun case or safe that the kids don't have access to (because, let's face it: kids are kids, and they will do stupid things if you let them. I know this from personal experience! :) ) We don't have a gun problem in this county, we have a "respect" problem: respect for parents, respect for others, and respect for selves. That can't be legislated into being, that can't be taught in school. It has to come from home, and there are too many messed up homes and messed up kids in this country. It's a very sad thing to see.
AC troll... Loser.
OK, I'm not going to let this stand:
Posting anonymously because I work for an electronic voting company.
Understandable reason for AC, but not a citation nor proof of expertise.
1) Electronic voting is a completely horrible idea.
2) Voting by "app" (or any other way) on a continual basis is also a horrible idea.
3) Compulsory voting is worse than #1 and #2.
These are all opinions. There is no proof or reasoning included to support your opinions, so your post is just a meaningless, and no more informed than the "mob mentality" group targeted earlier in the post.
There's absolutely nothing wrong with paper ballots counted by hand that Gen Y can't make worse.
Again, opinion with no clarification or substance. You seem to leave out the ability for paper ballots to be "lost", or changed, or counted incorrectly by the humans in charge of them. Paper does not prohibit the "mob mentality" problem, and it doesn't solve the influence issue, from either the voter, the handlers, or the counters.
I want people to have to put more effort into voting than the average Tinder swipe, and there's a perfectly valid case for "rational ignorance" in our political system. Those people should be able to choose not to vote.
Now, this section of your post actually has some value to it and presents a fair point. Agree wholeheartedly. I don't always understand every issue on our already limited ballot system, and there should be an "N/A" selection available, showing deliberate abstinence toward making a choice, not a missed opportunity to vote, and not a chance to invalidate my vote because of an incomplete ballot.
A couple of clarifications from a ND resident:
First of all, ND has two air bases: GF and Minot. The GFAFB is the drone base, and the Minot AFB has B52's and command over what's left of the Minuteman II missiles in ND. Second, oil exploration has all but stopped, but production is ongoing with the wells already producing. Farming is a huge potential use for drones, more so than even oil (ND is in the top 5 in 23 out of 34 crops tracked by the USDA, and is the number one producer of 8 of the 34) and those could be even more productive with the new tech that's coming up. There's an entirely new field of study (Precision Ag) that is studying using new tech like drones to more productively use the land and resources.
As far as the "It gets dark too early in the Winter" argument: the reciprocal is that the summer days are longer. Both are true for all of the northern states, east to west coast, so why the disparaging remark of short daylight time in the winter season is targeted toward ND alone is beyond me. Of course, it was an AC that was making this statement, so the troll value is obviously quite high, and therefore subject to the question of accuracy.
My personal opinion is rapidly changing to "I hate winter here." I used to love the winter, but I'm slowly wanting to escape it and move to warmer climes...
Alcohol: the most abused drug in the US today... the one that has the most social impact and consequences of all drugs. And it's legal. Meanwhile, other, less impactive drugs, are either illegal or next to it.
The US is a truly fucked up country when it comes to chemical addictions and social norms.
This is such a good post. There are so many facets that anti-gunners don't seem to be able to take into consideration, especially the difference in the cultural mix in this country compared to others that they use as examples.
Well done, Noble713. Wish I had some mod points for ya.
This. If people would, say, lose their license for a year after a third penalty within a set amount of time (say, 1 year), they will comply. If they just have to pay even a high fine each time, it's not a deterrent. The penalty for continued noncompliance must be very harsh, to ensure compliance. Losing your driving privileges (not rights!) for a significant period of time is most likely harsh enough to make a difference.
And, before someone counters, I don't think it will be ignored, like DUI penalties are ignored many times. Simply for this reason: your judgment is impaired when you're cited for DUI (obviously). However, the majority of speeding is done during lucid, non-impaired times, so the speeder does indeed understand the penalty and outcome consciously.
Binary attachments are the bane of email. Email is meant to be text and text only. The kludge of MIME-encoded binary attachments should have been aborted pre-birth.
Learn to use FTP and send URLs to share files. Or freakin' Dropbox. So many headaches would be prevented if these kind of attachments were prohibited.
If you haven't already figured it out, I HATE the practice of attaching binary files. Just because people are ignorant, and their IT staffs are too lazy to teach them to use the proper tool for the job.
DOS was the operating system of Windows 3.1 GUI interface...
In fact, DOS was the operating system through Windows XP. And if you want to argue that point, delete IO.SYS and MSDOS.SYS on your XP machine and reboot...
So, his comment is not out of line at all.
They were the worst SINCE Jar-Jar.
FTFY - in-universe chronology.
Um, bullshit, have you ever heard of "Google Fiber"? You work there and you don't know about this yet? They make a really big deal about it...
Here:
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=google+fi...
https://fiber.google.com/about...
Or, how about:
https://mail.google.com/
OK, maybe a bit sarcastic, but really... A Google employee that DOESN'T know Google is most certainly in the communication business?? Come on... That's all Google is about, is communication.
You are confusing natural gas production (which provides a significant amount of North American electrical generation and home utility) with light sweet crude oil production, which is what goes into the cars people drive to work, the tractor trailers that haul their consumer goods, and the airplanes they fly in. Middle Eastern oil prices have a HUGE impact on the American economy.
No, he's not... The US could be fully independent of ALL foreign oil. Especially with the Bakken shale formations now being tapped.
And, why spend money in the ME when we could use that money more effectively making our country more independent of oil altogether, using alternative sources of energy? Advances in both wind and solar could serve our needs easily, if we would just use it! Get out of ICE and into EVs.
Rearden metal
Awesome answer.... Should not have AC'd it.
I never thought of this angle before; bear with me as I set it up.
Currently, roadway funding mostly comes from gasoline and diesel taxes. As EVs become more popular, those monies will begin drying up. Governments, always concerned with keeping the money flowing in, are already trying to come up with ways of replacing that revenue from EV drivers.
From the comments that I have read so far, bicyclists feel that they deserve a lane to themselves, and many cities feel that they should have one as well, where appropriate and safe, for multiple valid reasons.
So, who is paying for those lanes? Where is the funding coming from to support it? Would a government entity be more amenable to increasing and improving bike lanes if the bicyclists who use them would pony up for the creation and maintenance of the lanes, in some way, shape, or form?
I am in no way against bike lanes and paths; I think it's a great idea and should be supported and improved, even though I'm not one (I ride on two wheels, but there's a motor between my legs). Just trying to open a discussion and floating an idea or two...
...The proper solution to Oracle, Sybase and the other enterprise software companies jacking up prices is to explore more FOSS solutions, such as ProgreSQL or NoSQL. And when Microsoft does this, explore the BSDs or Linux.
I agree wholeheartedly; however, the software industry needs to follow suit as well. There are many, many professional software packages that *require* M$ Windows as the host operating system. I harp on the ones that I need to deal with every chance I get, but there never, ever seems to be any acceptance there, even though some of them actually develop on *nix OSes and then port to M$ for the public version. Until the software industry offers versions for both M$ and *nix, your suggestion is, at best, a dream.
However, his response was logical, concise, and was void of insults and name-calling. So, you are completely and totally incorrect on your assessment.
Go away, AC, if you cannot use logic or avoid injecting your bias into what you read.
There's no difference in a "long gun" and a "military style" weapon except in external looks. They have the EXACT SAME capabilities. They shoot the EXACT SAME ammunition. This BS about "military style" or "assault weapon" guns is exactly that: BS. There is no difference, other than the styling of the weapon. No advantages to either when it comes to accuracy or rate of fire.
Why people cannot seem to get that through their heads is totally beyond me. It's completely illogical and, frankly, stupid.
"Thud" indeed...
... to AI solutions like Siri.
Good lord, don't use Siri as a shining example of "novel"!!! Use Deep Blue or Watson!
You're giving AI a bad name using Siri as an example!
Logical and well stated. Wish I had mod points.
How about death multipliers? That sounds fun! More bang for the buck!
Or death divisors? Splitting the load between multiple death dealers should make it more efficient, and again, fun!
RTFA:
"Tesla estimated its plant’s NOx emissions would be just .8 pounds per day". NOT 8 POUNDS, 8/10 OF A POUND. So, estimating 10 times as much is closer than your 3. In actuality, it'd be more like 30 times as much.
That's if the furnace was running at 100%, 24 hours per day. Which is probably not true, but must be considered.
Fucking dumbass AC.
Just doesn't work on the "Sheldon"s: those that do not understand the concept of sarcasm...