What possessed someone to mark the above post as 'flamebait'?
I literally read it 3 times through to find the 'flamebait' there: nada. The only moderation down, which could have had a sliver of merit would have been 'overrated' but this is ridiculous. Hopefully this gets caught in meta-moderation...
Linux has no Arabic, and I am using Windows 98 for that.
Well, funny you should mention that, since the coordinator for KDE translation mentioned to me recently that Arabic is high on the list of languages that still need to be translated to.
Your English seems to be very good, so why don't you head over to the KDE translation page and read the Translation HOWTO to see if you could help to change the situation (This would be a help to all KDE users, not just Linux).
Or, if KDE isn't your 'thing' you could look into other i18n projects in the free software community.
So we have to keep an open mind about this, and make the most out of it
Getting involved is the best way I know to 'make the most of something':-)
but just to blame are the people behind./ the people who choose what is it we see, and what we think about
Wow, and here I thought that they only choose what I see under http://slashdot.org, and that I choose what I think about. This is obviously more serious than I thought. Or did I think that because the people at Slashdot chose for me to think that?
it's not just Microsoft though, it's anything not linux slashdot IS basically the linux church of the Internet. and as in any cult/religion outsiders are not welcome to preach foreign gospel
Sure, outsiders are welcome. Otherwise who could we flame?
It comes very close to real democracy, in contrary to what most governments try to make of it...
Actually open source is more like a meritocracy, or do I suddenly have a much say as Linus, as to what goes in the next kernel? Not that I want it, mind you, I'm much more interested in working kernel that one which is voted on;-)
This is interesting in light of the German government's recent decision to consider blocking mp3 servers from the router. Now, all of a sudden, freedom means something to them?
Sigh... Why do people always assume that because a government behaves in some ways like a single entity that it in fact is? Governments are composed of many, many, individuals; they perform many, many jobs. Some people in the German government have the job of recommending the ways in which technology, specifically computers, should be used within federal offices. These ones are recommending Open Source.
Of course not. Methinks they chose Linux/BSD because of the stability and price (beer not speech). All of this without realizing that it is the freedom and openness that actually make Linux/BSD good.
Well, I understand, you probably didn't read the article, since it's a bit much for Babelfish, but you should have realised they're saying a lot more than: 'Use Linux/BSD 'cuz they're cheap!' As a matter of fact, they present a very detailed accounting of the advantages of OSS, including the key arguments of better security (through transparency) and freedom from control by any one corporation (never named, but in my opinion implied), as well as a detailed plan of how Linux and friends could be installed at all levels of the government. I don't know if this document carries any weight with the decision-makers, but it is a ringing endorsement of free(speech) software of all stripes. The authors are clearly OSS geeks.
It's not how far, it's how radical. It describes 'leaping' to a different point, without traversing the intervening space; really it's more acurately described by 'teleportation':-) I think in this case the metaphor is appropriate, even for pendantics.
Did the moderator who marked this offtopic even read the thread?
Does he/she understand what an analogy is?
Does he/she even understand what the topic is?
Moderators please put more thought into moderation, instead of just jumping the gun to get rid of those moderator points. Note that the poster in question has a default score:2 so maybe (just maybe) they are not prone to offtopic comments. Meanwhile there are many score:0's on this post, some of which deserve to be 1's.
I'm very surprised that Rob hasn't implemented Gzip::Chain for Slashdot. For those of you who don't now what that is, it's a modperl handler which gzips the output before sending it. This takes advantage of the single most unused feature of Unix Netscape, namely gunzipping pages on the fly. Given the huge amounts of text on most Slashdot pages, as well as the above-average use of Unix Netscapes by Slashdot visitors, I figure this would be a very significant improvement in speed for said users, not to mention reduced bandwidth usage. Of course, I'm not sure how much CPU time that would require on the Slashdot servers, though I assume bandwidth is more of a bottleneck.
Just a thought which I keep on meaning to mail Rob...
Today, Communicator is the only viable IMAP mail client for X. Sure, there are dozens of alleged mail agents, but they invariably have some huge glaring usability problem that turn me away.
I'm not sure what your definition of 'viable' is, but this is the first time I've seen Messenger turn up in that sentence without a negative;-) In any case, assuming you mean a graphical mail client (as opposed to one which can be run in an X-term) there's a pretty lengthy list right here. I would also be remiss if I didn't mention Pine which, though not graphical, is a very solid IMAP client (it should be since the author is one of the people to design the IMAP protocol) and allows you to configure any program you want for viewing of attachments; so unless you have to view your images inline, it works out pretty well.
i'd like to see an iso image of the ldp, and all it contains, have it be searchable, indexed, and running locally on a live webhost, etc.
I don't know about the other distros, but SuSE has at least a good portion of the LDP included, and if you install the whole help system, at least everything in HTML is indexed in a full-text search.
If you install dochost, and... well everything in the doc series, you end up with a pretty decent amount of documentation accessible and searchable from the default Apache start page. I'd be pretty surprised if the other distros don't have something comparable.
It seems to me, all things being equal, Bradley is canonically the stronger candidate. He has a coherent vision and a plan, something that Gore doesn't seem to have,
If you remembered Paul Tsongas, you'd realize having a coherent vision and a plan does not a stronger candidate make...
Still, it always bugged me having to write : i = i + 1 instead of i++ In Python.
*Boggle* Is this true? I'm a Perl programmer, and I have been intrigued by Python, though I haven't checked it out yet. The whitespace indentation thing was always a potential negative in my book, but... no 'i++'???? I'm stunned.
Well, you were the one saying: If you look at caucho.com, they have proof that Java servlets are faster than mod_perl. (emphasis mine)
The benchmarks I quoted (you did read the thread I linked didn't you?) were just corrections of the Perl code AFAIK. I have no clue about Java, servlets or otherwise; I was just taking issue with your 'proof', which used less than optimal mod_perl (to put it mildly). I'm assuming the authors of your 'proof' were using optimal enough Java code for you, otherwise you wouldn't have used the magic word: 'proof'. The persons who sent the corrected benchmarks merely improved the Perl and ran new benchmarks. These benchmarks are proof that the original benchmarks aren't proof, and that's the only claim I'm making.
If you look at caucho.com, they have proof that Java servlets are faster than mod_perl.
No. They have a poorly done benchmark comparing to Apache::Registry which is effectively just a hack to get legacy CGI scripts to work under mod_perl. For an explanation as well as more accurate benchmarks check out this thread in the mod_perl mailing list archive
For the lazy, here are some of the relevant results:
> These tests used httperf with persistent connections, making either > 1000 or 100 requests per connection, depending on the test. The results > on "hello" are astounding: > Test: "hello" -- displays "Hello, World" > Size: 450 bytes > httperf: 40 concurrent connections, 1000 requests/connection > Results: > mod_perl+Apache: 1600 req/sec > Resin+Apache: 500 req/sec > Resin httpd: 4600 req/sec > > Test: "bighello" -- lots of HTML + "Hello World" > Size: 23888 bytes > httperf: 40 concurrent connections, 100 requests/connection > Results: > mod_perl+Apache: 480 req/sec > Resin+Apache: 300 req/sec > Resin httpd: 280 req/sec > > Test: "database" -- query: "select NAME from DIVISION", returns 11 > rows > Size: 460 bytes > httperf: 40 concurrent connections, 100 requests/connection > Results: > mod_perl+Apache: 570 req/sec > Resin+Apache: 300 req/sec > Resin httpd: 450 req/sec
> I also tested the "file.jsp", which I renamed "fortune" in the perl > tests. With http_load, the results again show mod_perl ahead: > Resin: > 1584 fetches, 10 max parallel, 489610 bytes, in 10 seconds > 309.097 mean bytes/connection > 158.4 fetches/sec, 48961 bytes/sec > > mod_perl: > 6190 fetches, 10 max parallel, 1.98814e+06 bytes, in 10 seconds > 321.186 mean bytes/connection > 619 fetches/sec, 198814 bytes/sec
Of course, as with all benchmarks, these should be taken with a grain of salt; I'm just pointing out that for the benchmarks on the caucho homepage you'd better keep the salt shaker handy;-)
This is really no more then we currently have in most standard *nix install packages, aka,./configure, make, make install. But instead it's perl Makefile.PL, make, make install.
I think the poster above is talking about the module CPAN, which you can execute with: perl -MCPAN -e shell
This is very much like a package manager and, here I have to agree, very comfortable. Just type i.e. install foo, and foo is downloaded, compiled if necessary, tested, etc. Dependencies are taken care of too; and the shell is really nice too: you can use regexps if you don't know exactly what the package is called, and you can even read the README before you download.
That being said, I think you have a point about all the packages being at a central location. Nevertheless, I think the standardization of the module packages plays an important role too.
This is your argument? I'm sorry, but that's a really stupid argument. So I can store 3 movies on one cassette instead of two (never mind the added hassle of fast-forwarding when I just want to watch the third one); that's not enough to outweigh far superior video and sound quality, not to mention a freeze-frame which looks like a photo, and adjustable slow-motion which is completely free of any interference lines; and that's on my Beta which I still own from 1985. Of course Hi-Fi stereo was already standard on Betas by then.
For most users, VHS was BETTER because that was the feature that mattered.
Is this an assumption? Or is it what you preferred? I think most people who observed the decline of Beta will agree that it was the flooding of the market with VHS recorders while Sony stupidly hung on to its patent which resulted in an ever-shrinking base of Beta users (proportionately), which in turn led to fewer movie studios releasing their movies in Beta; there was also an interesting phenomenon where most retailers spouted extreme amounts of FUD along the lines of "You don't want to buy Beta, it's on its way out and will probably be dead in a year", leading to a self-fulfilling prophecy, which nonetheless took a lot longer than a year.
What's next? You're going to tell me that the Mac is better, too?
A far better analogy is MP3 vs. CD Audio:
'What's next You're going to tell me that CD Audio is better than MP3?' Ummmm... sure. It's just that MP3 allows up to 10 times as much music in the same space. Imagine if MP3 only gave you a 3 to 2 compression ratio; not too impressive right? I think we can safely assume MP3 would be a non-issue if that were the case.
GET A LIFE!
Thanks, I have one already. Can I get you one perhaps?
How can you possibly take a month to drive from Chicago to LA? Even along a secondary road like route 66 it shouldn't take more than 3 days. Can you hold off using email for that long?
Ummm... you stop and visit places on the way?
Just a theory, based on the way some people behave when they're on vacation. Or were you assuming the guy above is trying to save on the difference of a plane ticket from Europe to Chicago instead of to California?
Slashdot Mirror
My suggested moderation tip for the above post
Chris
What possessed someone to mark the above post as 'flamebait'?
I literally read it 3 times through to find the 'flamebait' there: nada. The only moderation down, which could have had a sliver of merit would have been 'overrated' but this is ridiculous. Hopefully this gets caught in meta-moderation...
Chris
Linux has no Arabic, and I am using Windows 98 for that.
:-)
Well, funny you should mention that, since the coordinator for KDE translation mentioned to me recently that Arabic is high on the list of languages that still need to be translated to.
Your English seems to be very good, so why don't you head over to the KDE translation page and read the Translation HOWTO to see if you could help to change the situation (This would be a help to all KDE users, not just Linux).
Or, if KDE isn't your 'thing' you could look into other i18n projects in the free software community.
So we have to keep an open mind about this, and make the most out of it
Getting involved is the best way I know to 'make the most of something'
Chris
but just to blame are the people behind ./ the people who choose what is it we see, and what we think about
Wow, and here I thought that they only choose what I see under http://slashdot.org, and that I choose what I think about. This is obviously more serious than I thought. Or did I think that because the people at Slashdot chose for me to think that?
it's not just Microsoft though, it's anything not linux slashdot IS basically the linux church of the Internet. and as in any cult/religion outsiders are not welcome to preach foreign gospel
Sure, outsiders are welcome. Otherwise who could we flame?
Chris
Danke. Wie du siehst ist Babelfisch nicht nötig; ich habe sowieso den Artikel gelesen, aber ich wollte schon den Artikel jemandem zeigen :-(
Anyone else? I've looked in my Netscape cache but no go.
Chris
Did anybody mirror/cache the page in question. It's dissapeared! If you follow the link now you get 'Not Found'
Chris
It comes very close to real democracy, in contrary to what most governments try to make of it ...
;-)
Actually open source is more like a meritocracy, or do I suddenly have a much say as Linus, as to what goes in the next kernel? Not that I want it, mind you, I'm much more interested in working kernel that one which is voted on
Chris
This is interesting in light of the German government's recent decision to consider blocking mp3 servers from the router. Now, all of a sudden, freedom means something to them?
Sigh... Why do people always assume that because a government behaves in some ways like a single entity that it in fact is? Governments are composed of many, many, individuals; they perform many, many jobs. Some people in the German government have the job of recommending the ways in which technology, specifically computers, should be used within federal offices. These ones are recommending Open Source.
Of course not. Methinks they chose Linux/BSD because of the stability and price (beer not speech). All of this without realizing that it is the freedom and openness that actually make Linux/BSD good.
Well, I understand, you probably didn't read the article, since it's a bit much for Babelfish, but you should have realised they're saying a lot more than: 'Use Linux/BSD 'cuz they're cheap!' As a matter of fact, they present a very detailed accounting of the advantages of OSS, including the key arguments of better security (through transparency) and freedom from control by any one corporation (never named, but in my opinion implied), as well as a detailed plan of how Linux and friends could be installed at all levels of the government. I don't know if this document carries any weight with the decision-makers, but it is a ringing endorsement of free(speech) software of all stripes. The authors are clearly OSS geeks.
Chris
That attitude is short sighted and elitist
;-)
you forgot: ironic, sarcastic, and funny
Don't take everything so seriously...
Chris
How far did you say a quantum leap was?
:-)
It's not how far, it's how radical. It describes 'leaping' to a different point, without traversing the intervening space; really it's more acurately described by 'teleportation'
I think in this case the metaphor is appropriate, even for pendantics.
Chris
Did the moderator who marked this offtopic even read the thread?
Does he/she understand what an analogy is?
Does he/she even understand what the topic is?
Moderators please put more thought into moderation, instead of just jumping the gun to get rid of those moderator points. Note that the poster in question has a default score:2 so maybe (just maybe) they are not prone to offtopic comments. Meanwhile there are many score:0's on this post, some of which deserve to be 1's.
In other words:
Have you read the moderation guidelines?
Chris
Why... I do believe you have found the perfect analogy for his comparison!
Chris
I'm very surprised that Rob hasn't implemented Gzip::Chain for Slashdot. For those of you who don't now what that is, it's a modperl handler which gzips the output before sending it. This takes advantage of the single most unused feature of Unix Netscape, namely gunzipping pages on the fly. Given the huge amounts of text on most Slashdot pages, as well as the above-average use of Unix Netscapes by Slashdot visitors, I figure this would be a very significant improvement in speed for said users, not to mention reduced bandwidth usage. Of course, I'm not sure how much CPU time that would require on the Slashdot servers, though I assume bandwidth is more of a bottleneck.
Just a thought which I keep on meaning to mail Rob...
Chris
Today, Communicator is the only viable IMAP mail client for X. Sure, there are dozens of alleged mail agents, but they invariably have some huge glaring usability problem that turn me away.
;-) In any case, assuming you mean a graphical mail client (as opposed to one which can be run in an X-term) there's a pretty lengthy list right here. I would also be remiss if I didn't mention Pine which, though not graphical, is a very solid IMAP client (it should be since the author is one of the people to design the IMAP protocol) and allows you to configure any program you want for viewing of attachments; so unless you have to view your images inline, it works out pretty well.
I'm not sure what your definition of 'viable' is, but this is the first time I've seen Messenger turn up in that sentence without a negative
Chris
i'd like to see an iso image of the ldp, and all it contains, have it be searchable, indexed, and running locally on a live webhost, etc.
I don't know about the other distros, but SuSE has at least a good portion of the LDP included, and if you install the whole help system, at least everything in HTML is indexed in a full-text search.
If you install dochost, and... well everything in the doc series, you end up with a pretty decent amount of documentation accessible and searchable from the default Apache start page. I'd be pretty surprised if the other distros don't have something comparable.
Chris
It seems to me, all things being equal, Bradley is canonically the stronger candidate. He has a coherent vision and a plan, something that Gore doesn't seem to have,
If you remembered Paul Tsongas, you'd realize having a coherent vision and a plan does not a stronger candidate make...
Chris
All porn DVD's are region free
And where's the moderator with the courage to mark this 'informative'?
Chris
Still, it always bugged me having to write : i = i + 1 instead of i++ In Python.
*Boggle* Is this true? I'm a Perl programmer, and I have been intrigued by Python, though I haven't checked it out yet. The whitespace indentation thing was always a potential negative in my book, but... no 'i++'???? I'm stunned.
Chris
Well, you were the one saying:
If you look at caucho.com, they have proof that Java servlets are faster than mod_perl. (emphasis mine)
The benchmarks I quoted (you did read the thread I linked didn't you?) were just corrections of the Perl code AFAIK. I have no clue about Java, servlets or otherwise; I was just taking issue with your 'proof', which used less than optimal mod_perl (to put it mildly). I'm assuming the authors of your 'proof' were using optimal enough Java code for you, otherwise you wouldn't have used the magic word: 'proof'. The persons who sent the corrected benchmarks merely improved the Perl and ran new benchmarks. These benchmarks are proof that the original benchmarks aren't proof, and that's the only claim I'm making.
Chris
If you look at caucho.com, they have proof that Java servlets are faster than mod_perl.
;-)
No. They have a poorly done benchmark comparing to Apache::Registry which is effectively just a hack to get legacy CGI scripts to work under mod_perl. For an explanation as well as more accurate benchmarks check out this thread in the mod_perl mailing list archive
For the lazy, here are some of the relevant results:
> These tests used httperf with persistent connections, making either
> 1000 or 100 requests per connection, depending on the test. The results
> on "hello" are astounding:
> Test: "hello" -- displays "Hello, World"
> Size: 450 bytes
> httperf: 40 concurrent connections, 1000 requests/connection
> Results:
> mod_perl+Apache: 1600 req/sec
> Resin+Apache: 500 req/sec
> Resin httpd: 4600 req/sec
>
> Test: "bighello" -- lots of HTML + "Hello World"
> Size: 23888 bytes
> httperf: 40 concurrent connections, 100 requests/connection
> Results:
> mod_perl+Apache: 480 req/sec
> Resin+Apache: 300 req/sec
> Resin httpd: 280 req/sec
>
> Test: "database" -- query: "select NAME from DIVISION", returns 11
> rows
> Size: 460 bytes
> httperf: 40 concurrent connections, 100 requests/connection
> Results:
> mod_perl+Apache: 570 req/sec
> Resin+Apache: 300 req/sec
> Resin httpd: 450 req/sec
> I also tested the "file.jsp", which I renamed "fortune" in the perl
> tests. With http_load, the results again show mod_perl ahead:
> Resin:
> 1584 fetches, 10 max parallel, 489610 bytes, in 10 seconds
> 309.097 mean bytes/connection
> 158.4 fetches/sec, 48961 bytes/sec
>
> mod_perl:
> 6190 fetches, 10 max parallel, 1.98814e+06 bytes, in 10 seconds
> 321.186 mean bytes/connection
> 619 fetches/sec, 198814 bytes/sec
Of course, as with all benchmarks, these should be taken with a grain of salt; I'm just pointing out that for the benchmarks on the caucho homepage you'd better keep the salt shaker handy
Chris
This is really no more then we currently have in most standard *nix install packages, aka, ./configure, make, make install. But instead it's perl Makefile.PL, make, make install.
I think the poster above is talking about the module CPAN, which you can execute with: perl -MCPAN -e shell
This is very much like a package manager and, here I have to agree, very comfortable. Just type i.e. install foo, and foo is downloaded, compiled if necessary, tested, etc. Dependencies are taken care of too; and the shell is really nice too: you can use regexps if you don't know exactly what the package is called, and you can even read the README before you download.
That being said, I think you have a point about all the packages being at a central location. Nevertheless, I think the standardization of the module packages plays an important role too.
Chris
Windows 2000 is SHIT. It's shit with over 65000 BUGS in it. If I want buggy shit I'll look in a stable for it.
;-)
Maybe that's what they mean, when they say Windows 2000 is more stable than Sun...
Chris
VHS stored 6 hours on a tape, Beta 4 and change.
This is your argument? I'm sorry, but that's a really stupid argument. So I can store 3 movies on one cassette instead of two (never mind the added hassle of fast-forwarding when I just want to watch the third one); that's not enough to outweigh far superior video and sound quality, not to mention a freeze-frame which looks like a photo, and adjustable slow-motion which is completely free of any interference lines; and that's on my Beta which I still own from 1985. Of course Hi-Fi stereo was already standard on Betas by then.
For most users, VHS was BETTER because that was the feature that mattered.
Is this an assumption? Or is it what you preferred? I think most people who observed the decline of Beta will agree that it was the flooding of the market with VHS recorders while Sony stupidly hung on to its patent which resulted in an ever-shrinking base of Beta users (proportionately), which in turn led to fewer movie studios releasing their movies in Beta; there was also an interesting phenomenon where most retailers spouted extreme amounts of FUD along the lines of "You don't want to buy Beta, it's on its way out and will probably be dead in a year", leading to a self-fulfilling prophecy, which nonetheless took a lot longer than a year.
What's next? You're going to tell me that the Mac is better, too?
A far better analogy is MP3 vs. CD Audio:
'What's next You're going to tell me that CD Audio is better than MP3?' Ummmm... sure. It's just that MP3 allows up to 10 times as much music in the same space. Imagine if MP3 only gave you a 3 to 2 compression ratio; not too impressive right? I think we can safely assume MP3 would be a non-issue if that were the case.
GET A LIFE!
Thanks, I have one already. Can I get you one perhaps?
Chris
Beta provided better image and sound capabilities, and was the choice of alot of TV Studios throughout the 80's.
Beta is still the choice of many TV studios. Beta is not dead, it's just limited to professional use.
How can you possibly take a month to drive from Chicago to LA? Even along a secondary road like route 66 it shouldn't take more than 3 days. Can you hold off using email for that long?
Ummm... you stop and visit places on the way?
Just a theory, based on the way some people behave when they're on vacation. Or were you assuming the guy above is trying to save on the difference of a plane ticket from Europe to Chicago instead of to California?
Chris