When DVD's were released the customer demand went through the roof, it wasn't hype and marketing. The DVD's were encrypted and the consumer didn't care. Then Windows apps worked with the studios and got access to the key's and low and behold I could play my DVD on Windows (not Linux, *BSD, etc). Other OS's *were locked out of this market*, by sheer luck a company got lazy and a person found this and we now can play DVD's on other OS's. Without this mistake we'd still be screwed, I don't think we can just assume another mistake like this will just happen again.
There is a regular consumer demand for this content, I have a demand for this content, I'd prefer not to have to use a M$ platform but I will if I have to. That is the bottom line, I *want* that content, I want it enough to use a different OS if that's my only option. I don't need it like food/water but I want it, and it'd be extremely foolish to think that the consumer won't buy it for the sole reason they can't use it on their non-M$ platform.
But that's not the real world. The reason why DIVX, etc. have failed in the past is because there was a free alternative. With *no* alternative where will they turn to? Adobe has been using DRM for quite some time, and they have not "crashed and burned" in the marketplace.
If the content providers won't release it in an alternative non-DRM format, do you think that demand is going to drop off? Obviously if there was a choice between the two the non-DRM would be picked by consumers but you are making a fatal mistake in believing consumers have a choice here; they don't (I guess other than the choice to not get what they want to have).
Let's face the facts. DRM is coming, it's going to be here no matter how much kicking and screaming people do it's going to be here. Many of the Slashdot crowd have been wringing their hands concerned with Linux/BSD/other being squeezed out of being able to view movies, listen to MP3's, etc. All they have been saying is M$ is bad because of DRM they are going to screw *US*. Well they are going to screw non MS users if we don't do something about it.
Content providers want DRM, MS probably doesn't care a bit about DRM but they realized that providers want it before they'll release their product. So they fill the niche because opensource has only been against it instead of offering their alternative. If opensource, etc doesn't want to be completely squeezed out of this market they need to offer an alternative. An alternative that can be used on any platform without cost. Content providers don't want to pay a M$ license, they just want a warm fuzzy. If we can give them a warm fuzzy without cost; it'll still be DRM but it'll be *our* DRM that won't prevent *my* OS from being able to view their content. We need to get an acceptable alternative out there before we non-M$ users completely lose any use (even a crippled DRM use) because we let M$ control the market completely.
Again you are going in two different directions. First it was about including it, then it was about how you can't uninstall it, now it's both. Pick one and stay on topic.
I've installed XP only once, but just like when I have a telnet/ftp/etc service on a Linux box I turned the message service off, It's not rocket science.
I believe every single IE security issue has been for actually *USING* it on the internet. If you don't use it you won't have a single exploit *period*.
Again they did not "force it" onto every user, no more than distro's forced/bin/bash onto us (try and uninstall it on any mainstream dist and see what happens).
I use most things because "it's there" but it's completely unrealistic to expect anybody producing an end-user OS to not include the things other OS's are already putting out, and expect them to go download them. What you are complaining about is unrealistic in the world today, maybe in happy butterfly/unicorn world but not here. There is a reason why I am using Mozilla instead of Netscape on my Linux workstation, it's because it came bundled. If you are going to apply those rules to one OS you've got to apply it to all OS's. So what you are proposing is that no Linux distro can include any webbrowser of anykind because it's bundling.
So the crux of your argument is that "I can't uninstall it". I understand that difference, but I still fail to understand why that is an issue? Does having it installed in anyway prevent the user from using anything else, does having it installed in anyway force the user to ever even using it, does having it installed do anything other than make it convenient for the user out of the box?
If it's only about "I can't uninstall it" then I'd say it's the about biggest whine about nothing I've ever heard.
Originally you were complaining that MS had included a media player in with the OS, so people weren't trying other things. Had nothing to do with uninstalling, etc. If you want to insert something completely different, don't say I'm making your point.
My point was that everybody else includes their applications to make it "out of the box ready". MS does not prevent you from trying other products, they just have one like everybody else does. So if it's a problem that MS includes a media player, why isn't it a problem for everybody else?
MS was bad in that they prevented OEM's from changing the install on computers they were sending out. But I don't think including the things their customers were wanting on the distribution like everybody else, is really that evil.
I'd figure it's significantly easier to "tune" in the delay electronically, then to physically move a microphone a millionth of an inch each time when your timing is off.
Can't say I've heard of that, best thing that I can think of is that it's possibly overheating. I've got a series 1 so I'm not exactly sure how your fan is configured (mine is basically a computer cpu fan in the back of it). Something to try would be to take the case off and put a fan on it (ambient air would not be enough to cool it properly).
You'd probably get the best luck at the community forums over at http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/ they've heard just about anything and everything.
That doesn't seem right since they use the same procedure to record live tv as to record shows. What model is it (series 1/2 direct tivo, etc) does it happen to all channels or just a couple in the low range?
If Tivo didn't wipe the drive when they sold it, someone could have mucked with the settings for live tv and changed the bit rate settings.
Sorry your wrong. It's not illegal to do that at all. It's only illegal to distribute the information on how to break the access control, you can *legally* modify it to your hearts content (break encryption, add backdoors, etc)
Even in this case it's not against the DMCA until Tivo puts controls in place to specifically prevent it from happening. If Tivo had put weak encryption in place and someone found a way around it, the hacker couldn't post it to the web how to do it; but also they could not be taken to jail for just doing it.
Define pixelated, depending upon what quality the show is recorded at, you will get pixelation. If pixelation is a problem do the storage space trade off and record at the "Best" setting; a tivo will never be able to record "perfectly" from an analog source there's allways going to be some artifacts.
Sorry, but you need to get yourself back to a econ 101 class, there are so many things wrong I can't believe it's modded to positive territory.
The dollar is *intentionally* down compared to the Euro. Because the dollar is down the amount of imports into the US is down. If a product in the US costs less to create (because of a weaker dollar) than it does to make it somewhere else and ship it in, why buy the imported product? By devaluing the dollar it makes everybody else's product more expensive in the US and it also makes it more attractive to buy US goods overseas. There was a stink in Canada not too long ago about bringing their currency down, because they were losing significant amounts of money/jobs because the US were able to make it cheaper than they could.
The US has basically always ran a deficit, the US is the biggest consumer market in the world. We physically can't make enough stuff in the US for what we want to buy, so every other nation salivates at getting to the US market because their own country doesn't buy enough from them. Basically it comes down to this: a weak currency allows you to export easier, a strong currency hurts exports.
From a consumer market standpoint, the US really doesn't need the world to buy their product as much as the world needs the US to buy their product. 80% of all Canadian exports are to the US, think about what would happen to them if the US stopped buying all Canadian goods, compared to if Canada stopped buying all US goods.
Also I could be wrong, but I believe Canada is the main customer of the US not Europe.
Why do you think Sun *has* been making a fuss? History of Sun: Linux sucks Ummm... no it doesn't as bad so buy our crappy boxes Linux is great, let it replace Solaris x86 Linux sucks, use Solaris x86 Linux isn't bad use x86 but if you don't want a good os I guess you can use Linux
We have replaced maybe 4 Windows boxes with Linux boxes, but we have replaced probably close to 100 Sun/Sgi boxes with Linux intel systems. And I know we aren't the only ones with that kind of ratio. Sun is getting killed because Linux is so Unix(tm) like that porting is almost trivial. I can get hardware cheaper, I can get faster hardware, I can now afford 2 systems to make the redundant for less cost than a Sun and all I have to do is recompile? Wonder who is getting hurt here.
I just get beat over the head with it constantly. Bush is evil, Bush is bad, Clinton is great, Clinton was the best prez. It's just so irksome when they seem to be stuck in a vote "party line" mentality.
Let me remind the weak minded people just who started this assault by the Bush administration on the Constitution; someone you never hear complainst about from those people screaming about Bush & Liberty.
The Patriot Act came from the same administration that tried and failed to force the clipper chip, the COPA, successfully got the DMCA, etc through. Their version of it was actually WORSE than the current patriot act. In fact it was struck down more than once and determined unconstitutional.
Counter Terrorism and Effective Death Penalty Act of 1996 ( http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi ?dbname=104_cong_public_laws&docid=f:publ132.1 04 )
Had all the secret court where defendants were not allowed to see evidence against them, secret wiretap monitoring, deportation of foreigners for "moral turpitude", etc, etc
So blame it all on Bush, obviously the Democrats are going to protect our rights. Maybe neither one is looking out for our rights.
Nope the easiest & cheapest way to get at foreign oil would be to continue with the status quo. The price was what 1 loaf of bread for 10 barrels of crude? Keeping Iraq under the oil for food program is cheaper than any war period.
It makes him a svengali, since he was trying to read your mind about what you meant by DOS. Since every OS basically boots off a "Disk Operating System".
So tell us what exactly were you meaning by DOS if not MS-DOS? My SGI server boots from DOS, my Sun server boots from DOS, my Windows workstation boots from DOS, my Linux Laptop boots from DOS, and yes NetWare boots off of DOS too. Ill-informed indeed.
What I interpret that as: Sun is spread so thin these days with so many projects running around that they are the perverbial "jack of all trades, master of none".
Personally I agree with what he's saying, Sun has got to stop spending so much money. How can you stop spending when you are trying to do a bazillion things at once? You've got to start concentrating on key areas, firming up the area's where you have been strong it to prevent further erosion, give a sence of true direction they almost mirror SGI floating back and forth kill X86 use Linux, no use X86 instead of Linux. Sun's server market is being quickly eroded out from underneath it (same as SGI), their CPU chips are getting killed by Intel/AMD (same as SGI/MIPS), Java has been an extreme success but it doesn't give them much profit and my guess their Java div probably runs at a loss, Mad Hatter? ThinClients? when do the PROFITABLE portions start occuring? They've got to stop trying to be the end and be all and FOCUS, FOCUS on what makes them profitable today; or they won't be around tommorrow to use that technology they've made that's so cool because it won't be profitable for another 7 years. They MUST drop some of the things they are doing, they have to or they will fail under the weight of being spread so thin a simple breeze will push them over.
I think that Sun has been acting like a "corpse" in a "nitch" at the bottom of a "tech ravine". They've lost their focus, they've lost their market share, they are trying to play all fields at once and not leading any of them anymore.
Why you seem to think Microsoft with this I don't know, where you see Microsoft I see Linux. It's more of a Linux release than a Microsoft release, the analyst isn't saying Microsoft is winning he's saying Linux is killing Sun and that Linux is hurting Microsoft.
He's meaning that people aren't jumping from Microsoft to Sun but from Microsoft to Linux.
Linux is disrupting Microsoft not Sun, so he's basically complaining that Sun the so called "unix expert" should have been playing Linux a long time ago to intentionally disrupt Microsoft; instead of doing the "Linux? We don't see any benefit in that OS" dance for the longest time. If Sun would have cosied up to Linux and put out a strong message (instead of the extremely wishy-washy one they put out now) Sun could be getting all that Linux revenue at Microsoft's expense instead of Dell, HP, IBM, etc.
Just remember, there's not a conspiracy everywhere you look.
Slashdot Mirror
Again from my other post:
All I have to say is: ever tried cracking OpenPGP encryption?
When DVD's were released the customer demand went through the roof, it wasn't hype and marketing. The DVD's were encrypted and the consumer didn't care. Then Windows apps worked with the studios and got access to the key's and low and behold I could play my DVD on Windows (not Linux, *BSD, etc). Other OS's *were locked out of this market*, by sheer luck a company got lazy and a person found this and we now can play DVD's on other OS's. Without this mistake we'd still be screwed, I don't think we can just assume another mistake like this will just happen again.
There is a regular consumer demand for this content, I have a demand for this content, I'd prefer not to have to use a M$ platform but I will if I have to. That is the bottom line, I *want* that content, I want it enough to use a different OS if that's my only option. I don't need it like food/water but I want it, and it'd be extremely foolish to think that the consumer won't buy it for the sole reason they can't use it on their non-M$ platform.
All I have to say is: ever tried cracking OpenPGP encryption?
But that's not the real world. The reason why DIVX, etc. have failed in the past is because there was a free alternative. With *no* alternative where will they turn to? Adobe has been using DRM for quite some time, and they have not "crashed and burned" in the marketplace.
If the content providers won't release it in an alternative non-DRM format, do you think that demand is going to drop off? Obviously if there was a choice between the two the non-DRM would be picked by consumers but you are making a fatal mistake in believing consumers have a choice here; they don't (I guess other than the choice to not get what they want to have).
Let's face the facts. DRM is coming, it's going to be here no matter how much kicking and screaming people do it's going to be here. Many of the Slashdot crowd have been wringing their hands concerned with Linux/BSD/other being squeezed out of being able to view movies, listen to MP3's, etc. All they have been saying is M$ is bad because of DRM they are going to screw *US*. Well they are going to screw non MS users if we don't do something about it.
Content providers want DRM, MS probably doesn't care a bit about DRM but they realized that providers want it before they'll release their product. So they fill the niche because opensource has only been against it instead of offering their alternative. If opensource, etc doesn't want to be completely squeezed out of this market they need to offer an alternative. An alternative that can be used on any platform without cost. Content providers don't want to pay a M$ license, they just want a warm fuzzy. If we can give them a warm fuzzy without cost; it'll still be DRM but it'll be *our* DRM that won't prevent *my* OS from being able to view their content. We need to get an acceptable alternative out there before we non-M$ users completely lose any use (even a crippled DRM use) because we let M$ control the market completely.
Again you are going in two different directions. First it was about including it, then it was about how you can't uninstall it, now it's both. Pick one and stay on topic.
/bin/bash onto us (try and uninstall it on any mainstream dist and see what happens).
I've installed XP only once, but just like when I have a telnet/ftp/etc service on a Linux box I turned the message service off, It's not rocket science.
I believe every single IE security issue has been for actually *USING* it on the internet. If you don't use it you won't have a single exploit *period*.
Again they did not "force it" onto every user, no more than distro's forced
I use most things because "it's there" but it's completely unrealistic to expect anybody producing an end-user OS to not include the things other OS's are already putting out, and expect them to go download them. What you are complaining about is unrealistic in the world today, maybe in happy butterfly/unicorn world but not here. There is a reason why I am using Mozilla instead of Netscape on my Linux workstation, it's because it came bundled. If you are going to apply those rules to one OS you've got to apply it to all OS's. So what you are proposing is that no Linux distro can include any webbrowser of anykind because it's bundling.
So the crux of your argument is that "I can't uninstall it". I understand that difference, but I still fail to understand why that is an issue? Does having it installed in anyway prevent the user from using anything else, does having it installed in anyway force the user to ever even using it, does having it installed do anything other than make it convenient for the user out of the box?
If it's only about "I can't uninstall it" then I'd say it's the about biggest whine about nothing I've ever heard.
Actually you made a completely different point.
Originally you were complaining that MS had included a media player in with the OS, so people weren't trying other things. Had nothing to do with uninstalling, etc. If you want to insert something completely different, don't say I'm making your point.
My point was that everybody else includes their applications to make it "out of the box ready". MS does not prevent you from trying other products, they just have one like everybody else does. So if it's a problem that MS includes a media player, why isn't it a problem for everybody else?
MS was bad in that they prevented OEM's from changing the install on computers they were sending out. But I don't think including the things their customers were wanting on the distribution like everybody else, is really that evil.
Hmmm... bundling apps with the OS. Well then I guess Redhat, Suse, *BSD, etc should only have the kernel in their distributions.
I'd figure it's significantly easier to "tune" in the delay electronically, then to physically move a microphone a millionth of an inch each time when your timing is off.
Damn You
You have deciphered my cleverly hidden secret message
Can't say I've heard of that, best thing that I can think of is that it's possibly overheating. I've got a series 1 so I'm not exactly sure how your fan is configured (mine is basically a computer cpu fan in the back of it). Something to try would be to take the case off and put a fan on it (ambient air would not be enough to cool it properly).
You'd probably get the best luck at the community forums over at http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/ they've heard just about anything and everything.
Why thank you, I always like it when the grammar police come around...
FYI you much be new here I'm a frequent grammar nazi offender get used to it.
That doesn't seem right since they use the same procedure to record live tv as to record shows. What model is it (series 1/2 direct tivo, etc) does it happen to all channels or just a couple in the low range?
If Tivo didn't wipe the drive when they sold it, someone could have mucked with the settings for live tv and changed the bit rate settings.
Sorry your wrong. It's not illegal to do that at all. It's only illegal to distribute the information on how to break the access control, you can *legally* modify it to your hearts content (break encryption, add backdoors, etc)
Even in this case it's not against the DMCA until Tivo puts controls in place to specifically prevent it from happening. If Tivo had put weak encryption in place and someone found a way around it, the hacker couldn't post it to the web how to do it; but also they could not be taken to jail for just doing it.
Define pixelated, depending upon what quality the show is recorded at, you will get pixelation. If pixelation is a problem do the storage space trade off and record at the "Best" setting; a tivo will never be able to record "perfectly" from an analog source there's allways going to be some artifacts.
They actually do give out the source code, it's been available since day one; just mosey on over to their website and look for yourself.
Sorry, but you need to get yourself back to a econ 101 class, there are so many things wrong I can't believe it's modded to positive territory.
The dollar is *intentionally* down compared to the Euro. Because the dollar is down the amount of imports into the US is down. If a product in the US costs less to create (because of a weaker dollar) than it does to make it somewhere else and ship it in, why buy the imported product? By devaluing the dollar it makes everybody else's product more expensive in the US and it also makes it more attractive to buy US goods overseas. There was a stink in Canada not too long ago about bringing their currency down, because they were losing significant amounts of money/jobs because the US were able to make it cheaper than they could.
The US has basically always ran a deficit, the US is the biggest consumer market in the world. We physically can't make enough stuff in the US for what we want to buy, so every other nation salivates at getting to the US market because their own country doesn't buy enough from them. Basically it comes down to this: a weak currency allows you to export easier, a strong currency hurts exports.
From a consumer market standpoint, the US really doesn't need the world to buy their product as much as the world needs the US to buy their product. 80% of all Canadian exports are to the US, think about what would happen to them if the US stopped buying all Canadian goods, compared to if Canada stopped buying all US goods.
Also I could be wrong, but I believe Canada is the main customer of the US not Europe.
Why do you think Sun *has* been making a fuss? History of Sun:
Linux sucks
Ummm... no it doesn't as bad so buy our crappy boxes
Linux is great, let it replace Solaris x86
Linux sucks, use Solaris x86
Linux isn't bad use x86 but if you don't want a good os I guess you can use Linux
We have replaced maybe 4 Windows boxes with Linux boxes, but we have replaced probably close to 100 Sun/Sgi boxes with Linux intel systems. And I know we aren't the only ones with that kind of ratio. Sun is getting killed because Linux is so Unix(tm) like that porting is almost trivial. I can get hardware cheaper, I can get faster hardware, I can now afford 2 systems to make the redundant for less cost than a Sun and all I have to do is recompile? Wonder who is getting hurt here.
I just get beat over the head with it constantly. Bush is evil, Bush is bad, Clinton is great, Clinton was the best prez. It's just so irksome when they seem to be stuck in a vote "party line" mentality.
Let me remind the weak minded people just who started this assault by the Bush administration on the Constitution; someone you never hear complainst about from those people screaming about Bush & Liberty.
i ?dbname=104_cong_public_laws&docid=f:publ132.1 04 )
The Patriot Act came from the same administration that tried and failed to force the clipper chip, the COPA, successfully got the DMCA, etc through. Their version of it was actually WORSE than the current patriot act. In fact it was struck down more than once and determined unconstitutional.
Counter Terrorism and Effective Death Penalty Act of 1996 ( http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cg
Had all the secret court where defendants were not allowed to see evidence against them, secret wiretap monitoring, deportation of foreigners for "moral turpitude", etc, etc
So blame it all on Bush, obviously the Democrats are going to protect our rights. Maybe neither one is looking out for our rights.
Nope the easiest & cheapest way to get at foreign oil would be to continue with the status quo. The price was what 1 loaf of bread for 10 barrels of crude? Keeping Iraq under the oil for food program is cheaper than any war period.
It makes him a svengali, since he was trying to read your mind about what you meant by DOS. Since every OS basically boots off a "Disk Operating System".
So tell us what exactly were you meaning by DOS if not MS-DOS? My SGI server boots from DOS, my Sun server boots from DOS, my Windows workstation boots from DOS, my Linux Laptop boots from DOS, and yes NetWare boots off of DOS too. Ill-informed indeed.
What I interpret that as: Sun is spread so thin these days with so many projects running around that they are the perverbial "jack of all trades, master of none".
Personally I agree with what he's saying, Sun has got to stop spending so much money. How can you stop spending when you are trying to do a bazillion things at once? You've got to start concentrating on key areas, firming up the area's where you have been strong it to prevent further erosion, give a sence of true direction they almost mirror SGI floating back and forth kill X86 use Linux, no use X86 instead of Linux. Sun's server market is being quickly eroded out from underneath it (same as SGI), their CPU chips are getting killed by Intel/AMD (same as SGI/MIPS), Java has been an extreme success but it doesn't give them much profit and my guess their Java div probably runs at a loss, Mad Hatter? ThinClients? when do the PROFITABLE portions start occuring? They've got to stop trying to be the end and be all and FOCUS, FOCUS on what makes them profitable today; or they won't be around tommorrow to use that technology they've made that's so cool because it won't be profitable for another 7 years. They MUST drop some of the things they are doing, they have to or they will fail under the weight of being spread so thin a simple breeze will push them over.
I think that Sun has been acting like a "corpse" in a "nitch" at the bottom of a "tech ravine". They've lost their focus, they've lost their market share, they are trying to play all fields at once and not leading any of them anymore.
Why you seem to think Microsoft with this I don't know, where you see Microsoft I see Linux. It's more of a Linux release than a Microsoft release, the analyst isn't saying Microsoft is winning he's saying Linux is killing Sun and that Linux is hurting Microsoft.
He's meaning that people aren't jumping from Microsoft to Sun but from Microsoft to Linux.
Linux is disrupting Microsoft not Sun, so he's basically complaining that Sun the so called "unix expert" should have been playing Linux a long time ago to intentionally disrupt Microsoft; instead of doing the "Linux? We don't see any benefit in that OS" dance for the longest time. If Sun would have cosied up to Linux and put out a strong message (instead of the extremely wishy-washy one they put out now) Sun could be getting all that Linux revenue at Microsoft's expense instead of Dell, HP, IBM, etc.
Just remember, there's not a conspiracy everywhere you look.