When I'm in a car, I'm thinking about the road and the scenery around the road. And if I'm driving, I'm really just not going to watch anything than the road and my mirrors. That's pretty much it. I suppose there are kooks out there that think they can drive while watching something but I think they would quickly wind up in the hospital -- either excited or not excited about the video they just watched (probably not excited if they were badly injured).
I know this is unusual in the US, but in many parts of the world it's quite common for there to be people in cars who are not actually driving the car. There's even a name for them... passengers.
Webserver. They're now basically *giving* IIS away, and the majority of sites are still Apache. They managed to push their share briefly over 30% with an enormous effort, but it's gone down again.
Web applets. They own the browser, but it hasn't given them control of the web. if 0.01% of the client side web applets out there are ActiveX I'd be very much surprised... it's been months since I've run into something that really honestly did require a Windows box running Intenet Explorer with Active Content enabled... and that was a spyware dropper.
Cellphones. Microsoft seems to be finally pushing Palm under simply because Palm has made mis-step after mis-step, at least in pure PDAs... but in cellphones the Windows Powered devices are competing with companies that actually know what they're doing... and they're getting clobbered.
----
And you can't compare Google to Netscape. Netscape had money but no income to speak of... they spent their whole life living off venture capital, because Microsoft cut off their air supply by giving away IE. Google's been profitable since 2001... Microsoft has no handle there.
I'm reminded how fine their monitor tubes are every day I look at the two support wire shadows on my screen. yes it's less than 1 pixel tall and hard to see unless you are looking at a white screen but the defect is there and on EVERY trinitron monitor.
That's not a "defect", any more than the legs on a table or the wheels on a car are a "defect", even if it'd be nicer to have tables or automobiles that floated unsupported. Until the Singularity and we're all uploaded into Cyberspace we'll have to put up with display technologies that are less than perfect.
If those lines bother you, don't buy a Trinitron.
Those lines don't bother me, but the exaggerated artifacting and aliasing on LCDs do, so I'll stick with my CRT for now.
The Excel team at Microsoft have always been a bunch of hardcore performance-and-utility fanatics, and the quality of Excel reflects that. In my opinion it's the only component of Microsoft Office that's worth anything, and I dearly wish it was available as a separate program so fat incompetant slobs like Word could be left to scrounge for users on shareware sites.
To maintain performance and compatibility, they refused to get drawn into the COM morass for many years... they interoperated with but didn't depend on COM. At one point they were even using their own compiler. Setting OOO Calc up against Excel is like comparing a donkey to a thoroughbred, and never noticing that the rest of the horses in the stable with the thoroughbred are broken down old screws.
That was my first thought. Why an expensive iPod instead of a cheap PDA? There's lots of great medical software for PalmOS or Pocket PC that you'd have access to as well..
My second thought was what idiot at slashdot changed the low-res view so the comment headers have a black background.
a strong believer in separation of presentation and document structure.
HTML today gives you that to an amazing degree. Look at the CSS Zen garden for an example. Every style on that page is a different presentation of the same content.
Or else no version of a document is modified, once published
Err, I think that's just a restatement of what I said. Again, I'm not talking about references to published documents, I'm talking about the way the document itself is created.
I'm talking about how the documents are created. Text-processing tools and editors using non-hierarchical document formats... from "typewriter-style" markup through Microsoft Word, have been a complete disaster as document creation tools every time I've run into them over the past 30 years. Any time markup can't be indefinitely nested it becomes impossible to do structural changes to a document without every change becoming a nightmare of micromanipulation of the fine details of a section to match its layout, style, and presentation to that of the new context.
Nelson's page hardly touches on presentation, and only superficially discusses markup with a reference to the old pre-CSS "bold" attribute... which was "born deprecated" in deference to "strong".
Intentionality doesnot necessarily require what you call "thought".
Intentionality, as you describe it, doesn't require anything but a simple feedback loop.
Can you write such a program ?
I have written many such programs, but not for many years, and I don't care to start over now... and there's so many examples online it would be quite redundant. As luck would have it, I've found a page that not only goes into detail about programs that demonstrate the same class of apparently "intentional" behaviour as a virus, but also includes a reference to an early movie produced using artificial life techniques.
Wasn't the reason UNIX was written was over a videogame?
No, UNIX already existed when Space Travel was ported to run under it. ST ran standalone on the PDP-7, and was never ported to the PDP-11.
Because Ken was now familiar with the '7 and knew he could use it as much as he wanted, the first version of Unix was written on this PDP-7. So ST came before Unix, but doing ST led him to a place in which he could write the first version of Unix.
The reason UNIX itself was written was because Bell labs was pulling out of the Multics project, so Ken wasn't able to work on his ideas about operating systems in that environment. The first version of UNIX was pretty much just a REALLY simple ancestor of the shell... enough to test the file system he was working on.
The UNIX file system was really revolutionary back in 1969 and 1970. It doesn't seem that way today, with virtually every operating system developed since 1980 or so following the UNIX model, but in the '60s and '70s it was normal to deal with files as an array of records, with each record having a type and size and internal structure that was usually (but not always) the same throughout the file. UNIX presented you with a file that had no structure. It was just an array of bytes, and any structure was imposed over this by the application. It was this concept... a kind of distillation of CTSS and the memory-mapped files of Multics... that was started bringing the UNIX environment together.
But if Bell labs hadn't needed a new computing platform to replace Multics it's doubtful it would have gone much further than that... Space Travel or no.
Perhaps it you'd RTFA, you would have known what the topic was!
TFA describes a mechanism for referencing documents. The whole structure of references and links exists outside the document, and the document itself is no longer editable once it's linked lest the byte offsets of the clinks be invalidated.
Cuba Territory: Record-breaking Hurricane Aleph, the 46th tropical storm of 2031, killed more than 400 people in the capital Guantanamo City on its way towards the Yucatan Penninsula and the state of Mexico. President-for-life Richard Cheney, speaking from an undisclosed location in the Mobile White House, declared a state of Emergency for the entire Central US between Ecuador and New Texas and updated the terror level to "goldenrod".
I suspect if Uemura had not been a *nix type and instead was a good Windows admin he could have fixed the problem without spending any money by instead properly configuring and patching the Windows servers.
Only if the necessary software upgrades were zero cost.
Also, getting the same performance out of Windows servers requires more servers. Even if you're not suffering from the higher overhead of the Windows environment you end up needing more physical hardware because of the way Windows works... it's very difficult to run Windows applications and services multi-instance, so you have to run multiple instances of Windows instead.
At one point I was running 3 large mailing lists, an alternate TLD root DNS server, two popular websites, and a Usenet server and regional hub on a 486/33 that wouldn't even boot Windows NT... not enough disk or RAM even if it had been a Pentium.
OK, it never occurred to me for a moment that you were talking about that hierarchy.
I see no rational alternative to heirarchical structure for the text itself. If you have a better design for hyperTEXT markup, please elaborate, because I've not seen a single NON-hierarchical document markup language over the past 30 years that was worth spitting on. All the ones that are actually usable, even the klunky dot-command ones like *roff, are based around nested sections.
The mistake being made in this analysis is that FreeDOS is derived from a GPLed OpenDOS, or indeed, has been derived from OpenDOS at all.
Irrelevant.
I didn't mention FreeDOS at all. And according to the FreeDOS site, the kernel they're referring to (regardless of its relationship or not to FreeDOS) is derived from a Caldera/Novell kernel that's been released as part of a GPL-ed compilation:
The kernel is a badly patched copy of the Enhanced DR-DOS kernel old version 7.01.06 without any credit to its author Udo Kuhnt who added LBA and FAT32 support and many other features to the old OpenDOS 7.01 source code and turned it into what it's now. A NEWFUNCT.TXT file taken from Udo's later version (7.01.07) is included, which doesn't correspond to the included kernel. This kernel (unlike the later 7.01.07) can't even boot off a FAT32 partition, contrary to their claim that FAT32 is supported!
There are content management systems which do this from a "content library", but they're not structured as a way for an HTTP server to do URL -> URI -> URL redirects in simply those terms.
I'm not sure that it's possible in the general case for an HTTP server to implement this, since the moved page may not be associated with the original in any way the server can know about (for example, if it's being moved because a new author is redesigning the site, and the new version is a completely new page).
Simply having a database mapping some symbolic reference to a URL would make it easier to move links around a hierarchy, but it seems to me that it would be just as easy to simply use that underlying symbol as the URL in the first place. Maybe I'm missing something really obvious, can you give me an example?
So why don't you tell us the reasons? [...] It was just one reason...
That's like saying the only reason UNIX was written was to test a file system.
You described how. You didn't describe why. After all, I wrote a terminal program for DOS back in 1985 because all the terminal emulators on DOS were crap, and I wasn't able to work on both the VMS and RSX systems at Ensun. Somehow I managed to avoid having that application expand into an operating system... so it seems to me that there's probably a little more involved in the creation of Linux than Linus' frustration with a terminal emulator.
No, they're not. The pages of a Wiki form a single relational table containing three columns, the first column is the name of the page, the second column is the title of the page, and the third is the text of the page... containing internal references to other pages indexed by the first column. You can access it through the index column SELECT FROM wiki WHERE page='Wiki';, or other columns like SELECT FROM wiki WHERE title LIKE '%Wiki%' OR text like '%Wiki%';. The syntax is not the same as SQL, and the operations available are far from a full SQL engine, but they are fundamentally equivalent to relational database accesses... not hierarchical ones.
you see the misfit the moment you try to link to such a thing from outside...
Um, no, I don't. Really. For example, your message can be referenced on slashdot.org by an operation completely equivalent to SELECT FROM comments WHERE sid=166183 AND cid=13864910; and yet it's simple to refer to from outside.
The OpenDOS license also doesn't seem to be GPL.
on
DrDOS Inc Breaking GPL
·
· Score: 2, Informative
GRANT. Caldera grants you a non-exclusive license to use the Software in source code form free of charge for personal, non-commercial use. The Software in source code form may also be used for commercial development purposes, provided a license is obtained from Caldera before any products or derivative works are shipped for commercial gain that utilize the Software , its components or derivative works.
For the source code license grant, you may: * use the Software on any single computer; * use the Software on a network, provided that each person accessing
the Software through the network agrees to the terms and conditions
of this license * use the Software on as many computers as needed provided that each
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contain all of the original Software's proprietary notices, marks and
license terms. * modify, translate, compile, disassemble, or create derivative works
based on the Software provided that such modifications are for
non-commercial use and that such modifications are provided back to
Caldera except for those who have obtained the right from Caldera in
writing to retain such modifications; any modification, translation,
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requires a seperate license from Caldera;
You may not:
* permit other individuals to use the Software except under the terms
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Slashdot Mirror
You forgot the "nattering nabobs of negativism".
So what does this mean? Who knows, but it seems as if the videos are really damn popular.
I know one reason... everyone who was viewing the free music videos off the iTMS suddenly had to pony up some money to keep watching.
638 megabytes for a non-GUI app?
What the hell is in there?
How much does it unpack to?
When I'm in a car, I'm thinking about the road and the scenery around the road. And if I'm driving, I'm really just not going to watch anything than the road and my mirrors. That's pretty much it. I suppose there are kooks out there that think they can drive while watching something but I think they would quickly wind up in the hospital -- either excited or not excited about the video they just watched (probably not excited if they were badly injured).
I know this is unusual in the US, but in many parts of the world it's quite common for there to be people in cars who are not actually driving the car. There's even a name for them... passengers.
How many markets has Microsoft failed in?
Webserver. They're now basically *giving* IIS away, and the majority of sites are still Apache. They managed to push their share briefly over 30% with an enormous effort, but it's gone down again.
Web applets. They own the browser, but it hasn't given them control of the web. if 0.01% of the client side web applets out there are ActiveX I'd be very much surprised... it's been months since I've run into something that really honestly did require a Windows box running Intenet Explorer with Active Content enabled... and that was a spyware dropper.
Cellphones. Microsoft seems to be finally pushing Palm under simply because Palm has made mis-step after mis-step, at least in pure PDAs... but in cellphones the Windows Powered devices are competing with companies that actually know what they're doing... and they're getting clobbered.
----
And you can't compare Google to Netscape. Netscape had money but no income to speak of... they spent their whole life living off venture capital, because Microsoft cut off their air supply by giving away IE. Google's been profitable since 2001... Microsoft has no handle there.
That just makes the sheep-like behaviour of the people who buy the whole of Office despite its complete lack of buddha-nature even more depressing.
I'm reminded how fine their monitor tubes are every day I look at the two support wire shadows on my screen. yes it's less than 1 pixel tall and hard to see unless you are looking at a white screen but the defect is there and on EVERY trinitron monitor.
That's not a "defect", any more than the legs on a table or the wheels on a car are a "defect", even if it'd be nicer to have tables or automobiles that floated unsupported. Until the Singularity and we're all uploaded into Cyberspace we'll have to put up with display technologies that are less than perfect.
If those lines bother you, don't buy a Trinitron.
Those lines don't bother me, but the exaggerated artifacting and aliasing on LCDs do, so I'll stick with my CRT for now.
The Excel team at Microsoft have always been a bunch of hardcore performance-and-utility fanatics, and the quality of Excel reflects that. In my opinion it's the only component of Microsoft Office that's worth anything, and I dearly wish it was available as a separate program so fat incompetant slobs like Word could be left to scrounge for users on shareware sites.
To maintain performance and compatibility, they refused to get drawn into the COM morass for many years... they interoperated with but didn't depend on COM. At one point they were even using their own compiler. Setting OOO Calc up against Excel is like comparing a donkey to a thoroughbred, and never noticing that the rest of the horses in the stable with the thoroughbred are broken down old screws.
That was my first thought. Why an expensive iPod instead of a cheap PDA? There's lots of great medical software for PalmOS or Pocket PC that you'd have access to as well..
My second thought was what idiot at slashdot changed the low-res view so the comment headers have a black background.
But that's a digression...
a strong believer in separation of presentation and document structure.
HTML today gives you that to an amazing degree. Look at the CSS Zen garden for an example. Every style on that page is a different presentation of the same content.
Or else no version of a document is modified, once published
Err, I think that's just a restatement of what I said. Again, I'm not talking about references to published documents, I'm talking about the way the document itself is created.
I'm talking about how the documents are created. Text-processing tools and editors using non-hierarchical document formats... from "typewriter-style" markup through Microsoft Word, have been a complete disaster as document creation tools every time I've run into them over the past 30 years. Any time markup can't be indefinitely nested it becomes impossible to do structural changes to a document without every change becoming a nightmare of micromanipulation of the fine details of a section to match its layout, style, and presentation to that of the new context.
Nelson's page hardly touches on presentation, and only superficially discusses markup with a reference to the old pre-CSS "bold" attribute... which was "born deprecated" in deference to "strong".
That would be why the documents themselves, as is repeatedly spelled out in detail, are never actually modified under this scheme.
Intentionality doesnot necessarily require what you call "thought".
Intentionality, as you describe it, doesn't require anything but a simple feedback loop.
Can you write such a program ?
I have written many such programs, but not for many years, and I don't care to start over now... and there's so many examples online it would be quite redundant. As luck would have it, I've found a page that not only goes into detail about programs that demonstrate the same class of apparently "intentional" behaviour as a virus, but also includes a reference to an early movie produced using artificial life techniques.
where can he still find a PC with even 16MB RAM?
Embedded systems often have less than that.
No, UNIX already existed when Space Travel was ported to run under it. ST ran standalone on the PDP-7, and was never ported to the PDP-11.
The reason UNIX itself was written was because Bell labs was pulling out of the Multics project, so Ken wasn't able to work on his ideas about operating systems in that environment. The first version of UNIX was pretty much just a REALLY simple ancestor of the shell... enough to test the file system he was working on.
The UNIX file system was really revolutionary back in 1969 and 1970. It doesn't seem that way today, with virtually every operating system developed since 1980 or so following the UNIX model, but in the '60s and '70s it was normal to deal with files as an array of records, with each record having a type and size and internal structure that was usually (but not always) the same throughout the file. UNIX presented you with a file that had no structure. It was just an array of bytes, and any structure was imposed over this by the application. It was this concept... a kind of distillation of CTSS and the memory-mapped files of Multics... that was started bringing the UNIX environment together.
But if Bell labs hadn't needed a new computing platform to replace Multics it's doubtful it would have gone much further than that... Space Travel or no.
Perhaps it you'd RTFA, you would have known what the topic was!
TFA describes a mechanism for referencing documents. The whole structure of references and links exists outside the document, and the document itself is no longer editable once it's linked lest the byte offsets of the clinks be invalidated.
Cuba Territory: Record-breaking Hurricane Aleph, the 46th tropical storm of 2031, killed more than 400 people in the capital Guantanamo City on its way towards the Yucatan Penninsula and the state of Mexico. President-for-life Richard Cheney, speaking from an undisclosed location in the Mobile White House, declared a state of Emergency for the entire Central US between Ecuador and New Texas and updated the terror level to "goldenrod".
PWC-Japan's IT manager isn't going to save any money in the end
How do you figure that?
I suspect if Uemura had not been a *nix type and instead was a good Windows admin he could have fixed the problem without spending any money by instead properly configuring and patching the Windows servers.
Only if the necessary software upgrades were zero cost.
Also, getting the same performance out of Windows servers requires more servers. Even if you're not suffering from the higher overhead of the Windows environment you end up needing more physical hardware because of the way Windows works... it's very difficult to run Windows applications and services multi-instance, so you have to run multiple instances of Windows instead.
At one point I was running 3 large mailing lists, an alternate TLD root DNS server, two popular websites, and a Usenet server and regional hub on a 486/33 that wouldn't even boot Windows NT... not enough disk or RAM even if it had been a Pentium.
No, its definition.
OK, it never occurred to me for a moment that you were talking about that hierarchy.
I see no rational alternative to heirarchical structure for the text itself. If you have a better design for hyperTEXT markup, please elaborate, because I've not seen a single NON-hierarchical document markup language over the past 30 years that was worth spitting on. All the ones that are actually usable, even the klunky dot-command ones like *roff, are based around nested sections.
Irrelevant.
I didn't mention FreeDOS at all. And according to the FreeDOS site, the kernel they're referring to (regardless of its relationship or not to FreeDOS) is derived from a Caldera/Novell kernel that's been released as part of a GPL-ed compilation:
There are content management systems which do this from a "content library", but they're not structured as a way for an HTTP server to do URL -> URI -> URL redirects in simply those terms.
I'm not sure that it's possible in the general case for an HTTP server to implement this, since the moved page may not be associated with the original in any way the server can know about (for example, if it's being moved because a new author is redesigning the site, and the new version is a completely new page).
Simply having a database mapping some symbolic reference to a URL would make it easier to move links around a hierarchy, but it seems to me that it would be just as easy to simply use that underlying symbol as the URL in the first place. Maybe I'm missing something really obvious, can you give me an example?
So why don't you tell us the reasons? [...] It was just one reason...
:)
That's like saying the only reason UNIX was written was to test a file system.
You described how. You didn't describe why. After all, I wrote a terminal program for DOS back in 1985 because all the terminal emulators on DOS were crap, and I wasn't able to work on both the VMS and RSX systems at Ensun. Somehow I managed to avoid having that application expand into an operating system... so it seems to me that there's probably a little more involved in the creation of Linux than Linus' frustration with a terminal emulator.
Or maybe I simply have more self-control.
Yes it is, look at its definition.
HyperText Markup Language?
The pages [of a wiki] are still hierarchical.
No, they're not. The pages of a Wiki form a single relational table containing three columns, the first column is the name of the page, the second column is the title of the page, and the third is the text of the page... containing internal references to other pages indexed by the first column. You can access it through the index column SELECT FROM wiki WHERE page='Wiki';, or other columns like SELECT FROM wiki WHERE title LIKE '%Wiki%' OR text like '%Wiki%';. The syntax is not the same as SQL, and the operations available are far from a full SQL engine, but they are fundamentally equivalent to relational database accesses... not hierarchical ones.
you see the misfit the moment you try to link to such a thing from outside...
Um, no, I don't. Really. For example, your message can be referenced on slashdot.org by an operation completely equivalent to SELECT FROM comments WHERE sid=166183 AND cid=13864910; and yet it's simple to refer to from outside.