Why thank you. I always thought Naxxrammas was prescription medication for severe hemarhoids. Good thing I didn't "ask my doctor"! Guess I'll have to find something else to tame my Molten Core.
I forgot about the 64bit nature of the G5. SO yeah in that case it would make more sense to compile the binary for the G5 but yeah G3 to G4 seems you would just optimize for Altivec.
Ok so I'm not sure I get this. So say you want to support features in G3, G4 and G5 chips - you have a binary that is 3 times the size with a little forking code that identifies CPU type at the beginning? That seems a bit bloated.
Woah. Slashdot has a position? I thought it was an open forum for debate. I'm pretty sure the only position we can all agree on involved Natalie Portman and hot grits.
"something that I can run NON-bleading edge games like Civ 4 and HOMM 5. Is that asking too much? I don't think so."
You'd be surprised. Since turn based games like these have moved to 3D engines they can be pretty demanding. Civ 4 runs fine for me but HOMM V occasionally gets very choppy when rotating the view on my Nvidia 6800GT. This is at 1280x1024 with 2xAA 4x Aniso. Keep in mind this same setup runs current FPS games like Prey at the same or better settings without so much as a burp.
Many application's on Windows use differing code paths depending on the processor they are running on. In general it's all x86 so the difference comes in with using instruction sets such as MMX, SSE, SSE2 etc. So if you are doing encoding and have a Pentium 4 it will use optimized code and you get better FPU performance. This is the same as a program being optimized for using a G4 vs a G3 on a Mac. The Universal Binary is not used for this. It is used to compile an application with seperate code bases for totally different CPU architectures. So you get a binary for PowerPC and one for x86 bundled in one file.
Re:Of course Dell and HP will have the same proble
on
Apple's Growing Pains
·
· Score: 1
"It may be painful to admit it, but the problems likely do stem from their use of products from Intel. Lately, things haven't been going so swell for Intel, from a technical standpoint. Between the Itanium and Pentium4 debacles, it's no wonder that people are running into problems with their newest processors."
Wow. Just wow. Let's take a look at this:
1. Apple's history of first generation hardware problems goes WAY back before the Intel switchover. 2. Intel's problems in terms of the Pentium 4 have to do with processor performance per clock speed versus AMD. This is not true of the Core series of processors. The higher clocked P4s do run hot but they don't break despite the heat. P4 chips detect overheating and drop the processor speed so that the chip doesn't fry. Try yanking a heat sink off of a P4 cpu and watch what happens. Slows to a snails pace but doesn't fry. 3. If Intel were the cause of the problem wouldn't these same problems be affecting other PC manufacturers? 4. If the Intel chip were the problem wouldn't the whole line of Macs suffer the same problems? The mini and iMac are both Core Duo based and yet there have been no major problems reported with iMacs or minis.
These problems which are affecting Macbooks and Macbook Pros have to do with the overall design of these laptops - not with the chips inside them.
Do you find it acceptable that there QA is so bad they feel the need to field test their designs on all of their early adopters? One of my coworkers who purchased the Macbook Pro when it was announced needed a motherboard replacement. Then last week we purchased one for a new employee. It died the after arrival. So now we have to wait two weeks to get a replacement in. Good thing I had an extra G4 desktop I could press into usage temporarily. I know the whole "don't by gen 1 Apple products" belief, but really I mean why is that acceptable? On the other hand we have several Intel based iMacs and have no complaints with them at all.
You can get 14 day trial versions of WoW for cheap. They have been also giving these away as promos with companies like ibuypower.com or services like fileplanet.com.
"but have no luck guessing what emotion or purpose is meant to be conveyed by the eastern works."
Now in this case you may be correct. For example my Chinese neighbors enjoy Chinese opera. From what my ears can tell, each of these operas seems to be about only one them: torturing cats. Now I'm sure to my neighbors the music of these operas conveys a wide range of emotion, for me just screetching feline abuse.
"And, as stated before, people who are looking for entertainment with depth, meaning and message are not looking for it in computer games."
Here's a question for you: why should a game have meaning and message? Why do you judge an entirely different form of entertainment by criteria you associate with film or music? Film and music are passive entertainments. You absorb them and if they are good reflect on them. Games are played and if good you reflect on them. Not necessarily on the meaning or message (although that does happen) but on the experience of playing them. Is Tetris less brilliant because it has no message? Does Civilization lack depth because it doesn't have a singular message? Consider, Civilization illustrates many of the changes that technology, expansion and cultural clashes have wrought upon mankind since the beginning of time. There is no single "this is good, that is bad" message. It's up to the player to take what they will from the game because being a game it is about interactivity. When someone, be it random blogger, industry expert or Roger Ebert states that games "are not highbrow" entertainment or "are not art", people bring forward examples of games that reflect other mediums. "This game is art because it has a good story". I don't think this is the right approach. A good story in a game is pointless if it renders the game non-interactive and artificially restricts action from the player. I believe games should be judged on their own merits, not compared to passive mediums (music, film, paintings whatever) that they at most only superficially resemble.
"music of all genres and categories requires an extant cultural setting and prior aesthetic vocabulary to be appreciated"
I'm going to have to disagree with you here. I don't really know much at all about classical music but I have a deep appreciation for some composers in particular Bach. I've also "turned on" a lot of my friends who would normally only listen to rock and alternative music. All it takes is getting someone to listen. The compositions speak for themselves without any sort of cultural context necessary. And THAT is why Bach was such an amazing genius.
"There's nothing to say that MS couldn't still release software to allow users to transfer saves from one xbox to another or from an xbox to a 360, though."
The smart way would have been to do this transfer through live. Upload from your old Xbox, download to your new 360.
Well, it uses buffered ECC memory which ain't cheap. I have seen that most vendors (like Dell) screw people on memory costs, often doubling the retail cost of the DIMMs if bought from a third party. Bastards!
Right. SO instead of goofy form factors why can't we have a regular desktop Mac with specs similar to an iMac? Decent performance, upgradeable video, room for 2 hard drives and 2 optical. I hate the fact that I have to either go with an non-upgradeable all in one, or buy a machine that is more power than I can afford (Mac Pro). Apple used to sell regular desktop machines back in the old days, why can't we get one now?
It doesn't state SLI support. You could add 4 cards to drive multiple monitors but that doesn't mean they will work in tandem to increase 3D performance. I would like some clarity on this issue, but since it doesn't say "SLI" or Crossfire capable, I'm assuming it isn't. Also your choice is either a low end Nvidia, a high end ATI or a workstation Nvidia card. I'd love to see options for a 7600GT or 7900 series card in there.
It doesn't state that multiple 7300s are usable in SLI mode. You can hook up 4 cards to drive multiple monitors but that doesn't mean they will work in tandem for increased 3D performance. Why are only the 7300Gts available in multiple card configuration? This is a LOW END video card. You sure wouldn't want to do quad SLI with the 7300 series that would just be silly.
The idea of wandering sunless planets is old enough at least in fiction. The book "When Worlds Collide" is about a pair of rogue sunless planets which orbit each other entering the solar system and colliding with Earth. It was written in 1932. The movie made in 1951 is not half bad either.
"Lowering resolution can only help you so much. There is more than fill-rate both one the GPU and the CPU side. PC games are designed to have the nicest graphics and good framerate on top systems. Any lower than that, you have to mess around with settings."
What I mean is that it's kind of unfair to compare a console game framerate at 480p or 720p to PC games which people frequently are running at 1280x1024 or higher (especially now as that is standard resolution on 17"-19" LCDs). Sure lowering res only goes so far, but by lowering the res and selecting lowered detail settings games like Doom 3 were playable at high frame rates on lower end cards.
"First of all, we have to see what settings you were using and how steady was your framerate. Secondly, yeah, well the 6800GT was the hottest card one could buy at the time... I doubt most people can shell $400-500 every 6 months to keep their framerate."
4x antialiasing 8x aniso at 1024x768 was steady always 60, peaking in the mid 90s. 2x antialiasing 4x aniso at 1280x1024 was how I ended up playing the game and frame rates were consistently in the 40-65 range. The card could run the game at 1600x1200 quite acceptably as well. The 6800GT was the second hottest card at the time, the 6800 Ultra was another 15-20% faster I believe. Cost wasn't mentioned in the initial post but really it's more like $400 every couple years. I'm still running the 6800GT and with the exception of a couple of games (i.e. Obliviion with HDR on for example) it still does great. I am considering upgrading but honestly I could go another year without it significantly impacting most of my gaming. Personally I like the fact that I can customize my hardware to improve performance in a game or alternately adjust video settings to make it run smoother. If a game you like has frame rate issues on a console, too bad - there isn't anything you can do about it. And some games DO have issues. It's also hard to go from playing games at higher resolutions down to 480p. They just look chunky. 720p is better but even if you avoid the expensive HDTV cost and plug it into a monitor you are dealing with less resolution than modern PC games. In the case of simulations (as the original poster mentioned), I think the higher res is important.
"Quake 4 would be PC game. There is a fundamental difference between a game written for a specific system and a port. In this case one has to consider the OpenGL to Direct3D transition among other things."
Fair enough, although I would say it's probably more of an issue of a rushed port to an unfamiliar platform. Doom 3 was suprisingly decent on the old Xbox.
Well if you are only running at a resolution comparable to 480p or even 720p the answer would be - most of the time on a decent computer. I was running Doom 3 running at 1024x768 on the day it was released and getting framerates over 90FPS on a Nvidia 6800GT. 1280x1024 was still over 60 FPS most of the time. Now if you run it 480p which is the best you can get from Doom 3 on Xbox you get well over 100FPS. And speaking of bad framerates, I believe it is the Xbox 360 version of Quake 4 that suffers from stuttering and slowdown versus a decent PC card which runs it silky smooth. Oh yeah and the original comment was about simulations not first person shooters anyway.
Since the DMCA was passed. Since mod chips defeat copyright protection in the consoles you are in violation of the DMCA if you mod (or soft mod) your console.
Which is why I thought is was so lame that in Sin City she played a stripper with her top on. I mean the character in the graphic novels was always topless in the bar. Why couldn't she have done that in the name of preserving the artistic integrity of the source material! Surely Frank Miller could have convinced her!
"Cute graphics doesn't appeal to me, nor does choppy PC framerate."
Wow you must have a shit video card! Or do you really think 2 7900GTX cards in SLI provide crappy framerates? The PC is hands down the best platform for simulation games.
"So, basically, you can get it without having Steam but you can't actually get Portal as a standalone game."
You will need a Steam account to install the game. The Steam account does not cost you anything to setup or charge you a monthly fee but you do need to have one in order to install and play the game.
Slashdot Mirror
Why thank you. I always thought Naxxrammas was prescription medication for severe hemarhoids. Good thing I didn't "ask my doctor"! Guess I'll have to find something else to tame my Molten Core.
I forgot about the 64bit nature of the G5. SO yeah in that case it would make more sense to compile the binary for the G5 but yeah G3 to G4 seems you would just optimize for Altivec.
Ok so I'm not sure I get this. So say you want to support features in G3, G4 and G5 chips - you have a binary that is 3 times the size with a little forking code that identifies CPU type at the beginning? That seems a bit bloated.
Woah. Slashdot has a position? I thought it was an open forum for debate.
I'm pretty sure the only position we can all agree on involved Natalie Portman and hot grits.
"something that I can run NON-bleading edge games like Civ 4 and HOMM 5. Is that asking too much? I don't think so."
You'd be surprised. Since turn based games like these have moved to 3D engines they can be pretty demanding. Civ 4 runs fine for me but HOMM V occasionally gets very choppy when rotating the view on my Nvidia 6800GT. This is at 1280x1024 with 2xAA 4x Aniso. Keep in mind this same setup runs current FPS games like Prey at the same or better settings without so much as a burp.
Many application's on Windows use differing code paths depending on the processor they are running on. In general it's all x86 so the difference comes in with using instruction sets such as MMX, SSE, SSE2 etc. So if you are doing encoding and have a Pentium 4 it will use optimized code and you get better FPU performance. This is the same as a program being optimized for using a G4 vs a G3 on a Mac.
The Universal Binary is not used for this. It is used to compile an application with seperate code bases for totally different CPU architectures. So you get a binary for PowerPC and one for x86 bundled in one file.
"It may be painful to admit it, but the problems likely do stem from their use of products from Intel. Lately, things haven't been going so swell for Intel, from a technical standpoint. Between the Itanium and Pentium4 debacles, it's no wonder that people are running into problems with their newest processors."
Wow. Just wow. Let's take a look at this:
1. Apple's history of first generation hardware problems goes WAY back before the Intel switchover.
2. Intel's problems in terms of the Pentium 4 have to do with processor performance per clock speed versus AMD. This is not true of the Core series of processors. The higher clocked P4s do run hot but they don't break despite the heat. P4 chips detect overheating and drop the processor speed so that the chip doesn't fry. Try yanking a heat sink off of a P4 cpu and watch what happens. Slows to a snails pace but doesn't fry.
3. If Intel were the cause of the problem wouldn't these same problems be affecting other PC manufacturers?
4. If the Intel chip were the problem wouldn't the whole line of Macs suffer the same problems? The mini and iMac are both Core Duo based and yet there have been no major problems reported with iMacs or minis.
These problems which are affecting Macbooks and Macbook Pros have to do with the overall design of these laptops - not with the chips inside them.
Do you find it acceptable that there QA is so bad they feel the need to field test their designs on all of their early adopters?
One of my coworkers who purchased the Macbook Pro when it was announced needed a motherboard replacement. Then last week we purchased one for a new employee. It died the after arrival. So now we have to wait two weeks to get a replacement in. Good thing I had an extra G4 desktop I could press into usage temporarily.
I know the whole "don't by gen 1 Apple products" belief, but really I mean why is that acceptable?
On the other hand we have several Intel based iMacs and have no complaints with them at all.
You can get 14 day trial versions of WoW for cheap. They have been also giving these away as promos with companies like ibuypower.com or services like fileplanet.com.
"but have no luck guessing what emotion or purpose is meant to be conveyed by the eastern works."
Now in this case you may be correct. For example my Chinese neighbors enjoy Chinese opera. From what my ears can tell, each of these operas seems to be about only one them: torturing cats. Now I'm sure to my neighbors the music of these operas conveys a wide range of emotion, for me just screetching feline abuse.
"And, as stated before, people who are looking for entertainment with depth, meaning and message are not looking for it in computer games."
Here's a question for you: why should a game have meaning and message? Why do you judge an entirely different form of entertainment by criteria you associate with film or music? Film and music are passive entertainments. You absorb them and if they are good reflect on them. Games are played and if good you reflect on them. Not necessarily on the meaning or message (although that does happen) but on the experience of playing them.
Is Tetris less brilliant because it has no message? Does Civilization lack depth because it doesn't have a singular message? Consider, Civilization illustrates many of the changes that technology, expansion and cultural clashes have wrought upon mankind since the beginning of time. There is no single "this is good, that is bad" message. It's up to the player to take what they will from the game because being a game it is about interactivity.
When someone, be it random blogger, industry expert or Roger Ebert states that games "are not highbrow" entertainment or "are not art", people bring forward examples of games that reflect other mediums. "This game is art because it has a good story". I don't think this is the right approach. A good story in a game is pointless if it renders the game non-interactive and artificially restricts action from the player. I believe games should be judged on their own merits, not compared to passive mediums (music, film, paintings whatever) that they at most only superficially resemble.
"music of all genres and categories requires an extant cultural setting and prior aesthetic vocabulary to be appreciated"
I'm going to have to disagree with you here. I don't really know much at all about classical music but I have a deep appreciation for some composers in particular Bach. I've also "turned on" a lot of my friends who would normally only listen to rock and alternative music. All it takes is getting someone to listen. The compositions speak for themselves without any sort of cultural context necessary. And THAT is why Bach was such an amazing genius.
"There's nothing to say that MS couldn't still release software to allow users to transfer saves from one xbox to another or from an xbox to a 360, though."
The smart way would have been to do this transfer through live. Upload from your old Xbox, download to your new 360.
Well, it uses buffered ECC memory which ain't cheap. I have seen that most vendors (like Dell) screw people on memory costs, often doubling the retail cost of the DIMMs if bought from a third party. Bastards!
Right. SO instead of goofy form factors why can't we have a regular desktop Mac with specs similar to an iMac? Decent performance, upgradeable video, room for 2 hard drives and 2 optical. I hate the fact that I have to either go with an non-upgradeable all in one, or buy a machine that is more power than I can afford (Mac Pro).
Apple used to sell regular desktop machines back in the old days, why can't we get one now?
It doesn't state SLI support. You could add 4 cards to drive multiple monitors but that doesn't mean they will work in tandem to increase 3D performance. I would like some clarity on this issue, but since it doesn't say "SLI" or Crossfire capable, I'm assuming it isn't.
Also your choice is either a low end Nvidia, a high end ATI or a workstation Nvidia card. I'd love to see options for a 7600GT or 7900 series card in there.
It doesn't state that multiple 7300s are usable in SLI mode. You can hook up 4 cards to drive multiple monitors but that doesn't mean they will work in tandem for increased 3D performance.
Why are only the 7300Gts available in multiple card configuration? This is a LOW END video card. You sure wouldn't want to do quad SLI with the 7300 series that would just be silly.
The idea of wandering sunless planets is old enough at least in fiction. The book "When Worlds Collide" is about a pair of rogue sunless planets which orbit each other entering the solar system and colliding with Earth. It was written in 1932. The movie made in 1951 is not half bad either.
"Lowering resolution can only help you so much. There is more than fill-rate both one the GPU and the CPU side. PC games are designed to have the nicest graphics and good framerate on top systems. Any lower than that, you have to mess around with settings."
What I mean is that it's kind of unfair to compare a console game framerate at 480p or 720p to PC games which people frequently are running at 1280x1024 or higher (especially now as that is standard resolution on 17"-19" LCDs).
Sure lowering res only goes so far, but by lowering the res and selecting lowered detail settings games like Doom 3 were playable at high frame rates on lower end cards.
"First of all, we have to see what settings you were using and how steady was your framerate. Secondly, yeah, well the 6800GT was the hottest card one could buy at the time... I doubt most people can shell $400-500 every 6 months to keep their framerate."
4x antialiasing 8x aniso at 1024x768 was steady always 60, peaking in the mid 90s. 2x antialiasing 4x aniso at 1280x1024 was how I ended up playing the game and frame rates were consistently in the 40-65 range. The card could run the game at 1600x1200 quite acceptably as well.
The 6800GT was the second hottest card at the time, the 6800 Ultra was another 15-20% faster I believe.
Cost wasn't mentioned in the initial post but really it's more like $400 every couple years. I'm still running the 6800GT and with the exception of a couple of games (i.e. Obliviion with HDR on for example) it still does great. I am considering upgrading but honestly I could go another year without it significantly impacting most of my gaming.
Personally I like the fact that I can customize my hardware to improve performance in a game or alternately adjust video settings to make it run smoother. If a game you like has frame rate issues on a console, too bad - there isn't anything you can do about it. And some games DO have issues.
It's also hard to go from playing games at higher resolutions down to 480p. They just look chunky. 720p is better but even if you avoid the expensive HDTV cost and plug it into a monitor you are dealing with less resolution than modern PC games. In the case of simulations (as the original poster mentioned), I think the higher res is important.
"Quake 4 would be PC game. There is a fundamental difference between a game written for a specific system and a port. In this case one has to consider the OpenGL to Direct3D transition among other things."
Fair enough, although I would say it's probably more of an issue of a rushed port to an unfamiliar platform. Doom 3 was suprisingly decent on the old Xbox.
"Since when a PC game ran at 60fps ?"
Well if you are only running at a resolution comparable to 480p or even 720p the answer would be - most of the time on a decent computer.
I was running Doom 3 running at 1024x768 on the day it was released and getting framerates over 90FPS on a Nvidia 6800GT. 1280x1024 was still over 60 FPS most of the time. Now if you run it 480p which is the best you can get from Doom 3 on Xbox you get well over 100FPS.
And speaking of bad framerates, I believe it is the Xbox 360 version of Quake 4 that suffers from stuttering and slowdown versus a decent PC card which runs it silky smooth.
Oh yeah and the original comment was about simulations not first person shooters anyway.
Since the DMCA was passed. Since mod chips defeat copyright protection in the consoles you are in violation of the DMCA if you mod (or soft mod) your console.
Wheee!
Which is why I thought is was so lame that in Sin City she played a stripper with her top on. I mean the character in the graphic novels was always topless in the bar. Why couldn't she have done that in the name of preserving the artistic integrity of the source material! Surely Frank Miller could have convinced her!
"Cute graphics doesn't appeal to me, nor does choppy PC framerate."
Wow you must have a shit video card! Or do you really think 2 7900GTX cards in SLI provide crappy framerates? The PC is hands down the best platform for simulation games.
"So, basically, you can get it without having Steam but you can't actually get Portal as a standalone game."
You will need a Steam account to install the game. The Steam account does not cost you anything to setup or charge you a monthly fee but you do need to have one in order to install and play the game.
The Doom 3 and Quake engines use OpenGL.