Flickr offers its corporate API
to some sites, and refuses to permit it to others. Zooomr was judged
to be too much of a potential competitor, so
Zooomr users don't get to copy
the photos they've uploaded to Flickr.
Flickr ended up, after some rough comments and self-reflection, changing their minds (see the "Update:" at the bottom of the post).
I would hardly call those two sentences brilliant, or even succinct for that matter. In fact, the third sentence does not even seem grammatically correct
I've seen that segment of the comic on an online forum.
Suffice to say that text is NOT verbatim.
W/o a quick way to cycle through my tabs, w/o being to have a tab be automagically reloaded, w/o a keyboard shortcut to close the tab, I dont see why opening multiple windows and using the WinXP group programs feature isn't any better.
CTRL-PageUp and Down cycles through your tabs, CTRL-F4 closes them. The Mozilla FAQ contains a section on these shortcuts; it's worth reading through it, as well as the Help file that comes with Mozilla.
Would it be so wrong to add in what is needed so IE pages render correctly?
Since much of the point of building the browser is to render to _standards_, not to Microsoft's urges, I think it unwise for them to do so. MS needs to work with the overall web community, rather than run off and do their own thing. such activity is why they are in court today. Having said this, there are some tags, such as the infamous Marquee, that are supported in Moz. I think it unwise, but I'm not a developer.
However, I am the only user and its really anoying having to enter a password every time to save the time of entering a password.
I never have to do this. The option for encrypting one's passwords is changeable, and once off, passwords are placed where they need to go without the need to type the unencryption password.
Mouse gestures were a joke.
And, you'll note, not part of the standard Mozilla install. There are reasons for this. Being pissed at Moz for problems with mouse gestures is as silly as being pissed at IE for problems with the RealPlayer plugin.
Other issues you mention, esp. the download speed one, do make sense. But many simply take reading the Help material and other aids at hand to clear up.
does anyone do this? Whats wrong w/ burning your 'keeper' stuff to a CDR?
Offsite storage, a critical part of any real backup solution. I would do it if I could find a decent Linux solution/provider of such services. A searh on Google will reveal any number of such companies, however.
You certainly wont have room to store your apps/OS, whats the point?
Aside from the above, Apps and OS are recoverable from your original CD's plus patches -- the number of times I've reinstalled various OSes proves that. Configurations and documents, which can fit into that sized space, are not, and would be the focus for a user of such a system.
there are free hosting companies all over the net..
As someone who is shopping for a new hosting company, allow me to assure you there are no free hosts that provide 100MB. $60 is inflated -- $15-$40 would be more accurate -- but if they also avoid banners, this will be worth looking into.
Having said all that...I agree that springing this on their users with a 3 months warning period is wrong. Apple should know better; such activities are the sign of a weak company that's forgotten that customers make the rules. I know they have to make money, but making their users suffer for Apple's bad gamble is terribly short-sighted.
Hop over to the main web site at http://misterhouse.net or the sourceforge web site at http://sourceforge.net/projects/misterhouse/ -- this guy's been working on this for years. It's all done in Perl, works on *inx and Win32 platforms, with open-sourced code. Misterhouse does all the X10 stuff, can be voice driven and speaks itself, play mp3s, etc., etc.
He has a number of interfaces, including a Tk and a HTML version. This is an important point, because a lot of folks commenting mention most of this can be done, but I think Rob's point is that such a box should be accessable to the average consumer. A home-built brew isn't that, and the confluence of tech needed to make it happen is way out of the reach of the average consumer as well. Projects like Misterhouse aren't perfect, but make it a lot closer.
NOTE: Try the SourceForge site if the first one, misterhouse.net, doesn't respond, like it isn't for me.
Language design is a trade-off. He's trying to avoid instanly breaking 90% of the one-lines out there, and keep the freedom the Perl is famous for, while moving on.
As he himself states, forcing folks to "use perl 5" would break everything. Settling for "use perl 6" (and, understand that there will be ways to get around this -- note his comments about "use policy") lets us get on with the concept of coding, and not with the concept of re-coding. Going to be hard enough to re-write all these modules...
I Do know that last night while hanging out on IRC there we gobs of perople having problems with things specific to redhat.
[...] people not knowing about the -n switch for ping (if anyone at redhat reads this PLEASE FIX PING, what it does is unexpected and has sent many people looking for deeper problems in their netoworks)
You know, it's odd you mention that. I've worked on HP boxes, Sun boxes, AIX boxes, etc. And the only place where ping was different as to that -n switch was with windows, which does 4 pings and stops by it's default. I susupect what is happening is that you're seeing new Red Hat users run ping, and are suprised when it just keeps going...
Unless you're talking about a different problem with the number of counts produced with a ping, then I think you'd best ask more than just Red Hat to "fix" their problem.:)
maybe what needs to happen is to replace the Konqueror rendering engine with the mozilla rendering engine. Since it is being dually licensed this may be possible. This would give Konqueror a better rendering engine.
*SIGH* This was just covered in a thread today on Slashdot. Check it out.
----Woodrow
Please define "kewl new features" in the Mozilla product.
There are, from an end-user POV, two new concepts in Mozilla (as opposed to Netscape 6, which is NOT what is being developed here -- things like AIM are added by Netscape directly):
1) The theming concept. As this entry at H2G2 point out, themes are a concequence of the development of cross-platform code. And it works. It works today -- there's a whole new app just developed by some outside dev folks, called Forumzilla, for one.
Personally, yes, I think the skins are a "gimmie", but I also see why it's important to showcase the tech _today_.
2) The IRC client. All the IRC client is, and has been, is a simple wrapper for basic TCP/IP calls, which is all that IRC basically does. It's not a replacement for MIRC or BitchX or any of those. And it's important to the dev team, too: They chat on IRC all the time, and use their own client to do so.
I'm sending $100 to the EFF today. This kind of crap has got to stop.
Hear, hear!
I also sent a letter of support to Michael, asking if he thought a letter to this company would be an aid at this point. But here's a tough question. What if their model is a micropay per wand-wave? How do we help them make money with an Open Source product in that way? It's a tough call, but I think this is the best way to honor our Open Source considerations (those who have them) while helping a company pay the hardware costs for such a device.
Ideas? I'd recommend e-mailing Michael (his address is on that site in the article) and give him your support and advice, too. I think soild, reasonable suggestions for them to make even more money work best. Companies always like to hear how they can make money, after all. *SMIRK*
With hard drive prices well under a penny a meg, who really cares about size? So IE takes up 25+ megs, and Mozilla takes up 6.
If having access to the useability of IE5 costs me a quarter's worth of HD space to have, then so be it.
The point is not for PC's but for embedded devices. For those, size DOES matter.:)
Well, for one, the Mozilla dev Term uses the IRC client. They have a weekly bug-zapping session every Tues. It's at #mozillazine on IRC server irc.mozilla.org, if you're curious. Also, note that it's a seperate team that developed the client.
And, as a side note, why do so many peoplethink that mail/news are usuless. When I'm on a new system, or borrowing someone's laptop, mail becomes extremely useful, even with the HTML-based access to my e-mail that my ISP, Earthlink/Mindspring provides. Again, I have to ask the question, "who are you people to decide what's useful for a browser client?" You are not the only bloody users, are you? There are a large number of people who do use the mail/news client from the 4.x series.
I'll second at least parts of that. I subscribed to both perl6-porters and bootstrap, and yes, perl6 was closed -- my mail to that addy bounded back (this was on the day of the announcment, by the by). Sounds like nothing but simple miscommunication; they were going to set on up and then decided not to go through with it. Bootstrap works -- I, a NOBODY in the Perl world, posted to it (look for a post by woodrow.j.hillATncmi.com, if you're curious). So I don't know why Simon can't. Maybe he should get a Hotmail account.:) I have high hopes of eventually helping out with doc-writing and the like; for now I'm just watching the interplay. By the by, sending e-mail to bootstrap-subscribe@perl.org will get folks on, if you wish.
Sure, it could be done, but why bother? Most Windows users seem to prefer non-free software. Even if it's free-beer, they seem to prefer it to be warez. So let them use Access or MS SQL Server -- if they wanted to use free software, they'd be using a free OS, right? NOT TRUE.
For my web site, have the back-end in Access, but for the new version, am converting to MySQL. The only thing Access provides me that I need is powerful spelll-checking in my forms, and I'd love to find a way to intergrate ispell w/Perl to do the same. Sometimes we have reasons for using Windows. We're new, and don't know the power of open-source. We have a company that is M$-dominated, and need to interoperate between work and home. We have a system that doesn't take to Linux well, and don't have time to configure it properly. Please don't be hard-header and a GPL-bigot in _that_ fashion. Education of the end-users out there, and improvemtn of the open-source products, ids the only sure ways to bring people to the side of free software. Your attitude will not.
...but I mean you can buy a Flash Memory Card -> PC Card adapter for about $10 and move you pics to your laptop (or if you are one of the 8 people who have a desktop with PC Card support). Or you can get a Flash Memory Reader with a USB interface for $50 these days which isn't quite a fast, but is nothing to sneeze at either...
Yes, but what if you don't have any of those handy? For example, I attend a SCA (Society for Creative Anachronism) event called Pennsic every year. All camping. I take pictures of my fellow dancers, mostly for personal use, but I put a few up on my site. 2 years ago, I took along a Mavica from work. Made it SO easy to do pictures. No need to lug a laptop with, the battery life was beyond amazing (a week of camping, and I only had to recharge once), and I lost only one floppy to the heat. I've since used a couple of high-ends digitals from Kodak and Olympus. For what I want, the Mavica beats them both hands-down.:)
Again -- some of us are using Linux (this is Slashdot). We only get the 10Mb all-in package.
Two points, teraflop: 1) Half of what he speaks of (IM, channels, Net2Phone, etc.) are not even IN the Linux download, from what I understand. But, yes, the mail/news intergration and so on are. 2) Again -- go to http://bugzilla.mozilla.org, and report it as a feature request. Let the developers know that you need the ability to use it just as an HTML browser on Linux, and I suspect you'll get somewhere.
Even better....go to http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/. There's a whole tracking system for reporting bugs on the browser, built with Open Source tools!
Yes, please, spend your valuable time doing free QA work for one of the largest companies in the world. After all, heaven knows they can't afford to hire their own QA people.
Rombuu, that's like saying we shouldn't do any work fixing the Linux kernel because Red Hat, VA Linux, etc. have LOTS of money. Let them do all the hard work! After all, they are making all the money, and money's the only thing we care about here! Not having a quality product, or showing the strength of Open Source development. It's ironic -- for a year+, people jumped up and yelled and screamed at Netscape, saying this browser was a failure for the Open Source world. Why? Because the vast majority of developers, in the early days, were paid Netscape developers. People Netscape paid to build something for the Open Source community. In the same way that Alan Cox is paid by Red Hat to do Linux dev. And now, Rombuu, you're complaining because they asked for help from the community? What's this all about, man? Open Source without a community supporting it is useless!
Where is the Solaris version? Is it coming anytime soon? Java 2 is a real pig. I thought the JVM in 4.x was bad! It also doesn't seem to be very consistent. The applet on java.sun.com wouldn't load. It looks like all the Personal Security Manager stuff is there, but it certainly does not decrypt my S/MIME mail with my certificate imported. Was this working in Mozilla when Netscape branded this release? There is no roaming access. This is a feature that I will need to have before I start using version 6. I do not want to go back to copying my preferences and bookmarks all over the place. On the website, Netscape makes reference to a CCK for version 6. Where is this? Where is the documentation? Who can I complain to about all this? AOL are you listening?
For Solaris, check out http://www.mozillazine.org/builds/ -- the Mozilla builds for Solaris are about halfway down the page. For EVERYTHING else, check out http://mozilla.bugzilla.org. The Bugzilla reporting system is designed to allow end-users to reports problems and missing features. You have to register, and you should see if others have reported the problem already. OTOH, it doesn't just drop into a black box -- it registers the bug with a specific developer, when it is worked on.
Am I missing something, or is there no uninstall? No entry in the Add/Remove programs, either...(On NT4, btw). Boy, from the rest of these posts I'm assuming it's just me, but slashdot.org has tiny tiny fonts, and most other pages (like yahoo.com, or my own geeklife.com) crash the browser. Any other NT4 users out there successfully using this? Any one who has Netscape3 and 4.7 installed having any problems?
Sounds like you have a situation. I've been using it since M13 on my machine -- in fact, I usually install the nightly builds about every other day. I'm NT4, SP5. Currently, I'm running NS 4.72, Mozilla Nightly Build from 4/3/00, and the Preview release. No crashes such as you report. Go to http://bugzilla.mozilla.org, register there, and report the problem, PLEASE. It's your way of letting them know what's wrong, so they can fix it NOW.:)
Um, IE5 works on Windows, Slowlaris, HP-UX and MacOS.
From my understanding, the Solaris port wasn't -- it was "move lots of Win32 API's over and run IE slow and buggy on top of those". If I am wrong, I am sorry.
Well, true it's not much different than the Mozilla versions. But it's not here to be different. Why reinvent the wheel they just rode in on? And, it you do a Custom install (2nd nature for me with any program, after too many years of being burned), you'll see it comes with Flash! I, for one, DON'T want to see a lot of branding. And I doubt you'll get much. Netscape/AOL itself is depending on selling Customing kits to Big Business, letting them do their own "branding"...
Slashdot Mirror
Flickr ended up, after some rough comments and self-reflection, changing their minds (see the "Update:" at the bottom of the post).
Since much of the point of building the browser is to render to _standards_, not to Microsoft's urges, I think it unwise for them to do so. MS needs to work with the overall web community, rather than run off and do their own thing. such activity is why they are in court today.
Having said this, there are some tags, such as the infamous Marquee, that are supported in Moz. I think it unwise, but I'm not a developer.
I never have to do this. The option for encrypting one's passwords is changeable, and once off, passwords are placed where they need to go without the need to type the unencryption password.
And, you'll note, not part of the standard Mozilla install. There are reasons for this. Being pissed at Moz for problems with mouse gestures is as silly as being pissed at IE for problems with the RealPlayer plugin.
Other issues you mention, esp. the download speed one, do make sense. But many simply take reading the Help material and other aids at hand to clear up.
Having said all that...I agree that springing this on their users with a 3 months warning period is wrong. Apple should know better; such activities are the sign of a weak company that's forgotten that customers make the rules. I know they have to make money, but making their users suffer for Apple's bad gamble is terribly short-sighted.
...if he called Linux a virus.
Hop over to the main web site at http://misterhouse.net or the sourceforge web site at http://sourceforge.net/projects/misterhouse/ -- this guy's been working on this for years. It's all done in Perl, works on *inx and Win32 platforms, with open-sourced code. Misterhouse does all the X10 stuff, can be voice driven and speaks itself, play mp3s, etc., etc.
He has a number of interfaces, including a Tk and a HTML version. This is an important point, because a lot of folks commenting mention most of this can be done, but I think Rob's point is that such a box should be accessable to the average consumer. A home-built brew isn't that, and the confluence of tech needed to make it happen is way out of the reach of the average consumer as well. Projects like Misterhouse aren't perfect, but make it a lot closer.
NOTE: Try the SourceForge site if the first one, misterhouse.net, doesn't respond, like it isn't for me.Did you catch Larry's explaination as to why?
Language design is a trade-off. He's trying to avoid instanly breaking 90% of the one-lines out there, and keep the freedom the Perl is famous for, while moving on.
As he himself states, forcing folks to "use perl 5" would break everything. Settling for "use perl 6" (and, understand that there will be ways to get around this -- note his comments about "use policy") lets us get on with the concept of coding, and not with the concept of re-coding. Going to be hard enough to re-write all these modules...
----Woodrow
You know, it's odd you mention that. I've worked on HP boxes, Sun boxes, AIX boxes, etc. And the only place where ping was different as to that -n switch was with windows, which does 4 pings and stops by it's default. I susupect what is happening is that you're seeing new Red Hat users run ping, and are suprised when it just keeps going...
Unless you're talking about a different problem with the number of counts produced with a ping, then I think you'd best ask more than just Red Hat to "fix" their problem. :)
----Woodrow
Please define "kewl new features" in the Mozilla product.
There are, from an end-user POV, two new concepts in Mozilla (as opposed to Netscape 6, which is NOT what is being developed here -- things like AIM are added by Netscape directly):
1) The theming concept. As this entry at H2G2 point out, themes are a concequence of the development of cross-platform code. And it works. It works today -- there's a whole new app just developed by some outside dev folks, called Forumzilla, for one. Personally, yes, I think the skins are a "gimmie", but I also see why it's important to showcase the tech _today_.
2) The IRC client. All the IRC client is, and has been, is a simple wrapper for basic TCP/IP calls, which is all that IRC basically does. It's not a replacement for MIRC or BitchX or any of those. And it's important to the dev team, too: They chat on IRC all the time, and use their own client to do so.
Just wanted to hopefully clear that up.
----Woodrow
From klund:
Hear, hear!I also sent a letter of support to Michael, asking if he thought a letter to this company would be an aid at this point. But here's a tough question. What if their model is a micropay per wand-wave? How do we help them make money with an Open Source product in that way? It's a tough call, but I think this is the best way to honor our Open Source considerations (those who have them) while helping a company pay the hardware costs for such a device.
Ideas? I'd recommend e-mailing Michael (his address is on that site in the article) and give him your support and advice, too. I think soild, reasonable suggestions for them to make even more money work best. Companies always like to hear how they can make money, after all. *SMIRK*
----Woodrow[Written with today's M17 branch build, baby!]
Well, for one, the Mozilla dev Term uses the IRC client. They have a weekly bug-zapping session every Tues. It's at #mozillazine on IRC server irc.mozilla.org, if you're curious.
Also, note that it's a seperate team that developed the client.
And, as a side note, why do so many peoplethink that mail/news are usuless. When I'm on a new system, or borrowing someone's laptop, mail becomes extremely useful, even with the HTML-based access to my e-mail that my ISP, Earthlink/Mindspring provides. Again, I have to ask the question, "who are you people to decide what's useful for a browser client?" You are not the only bloody users, are you? There are a large number of people who do use the mail/news client from the 4.x series.
----Woodrow
I'll second at least parts of that. :)
I subscribed to both perl6-porters and bootstrap, and yes, perl6 was closed -- my mail to that addy bounded back (this was on the day of the announcment, by the by). Sounds like nothing but simple miscommunication; they were going to set on up and then decided not to go through with it.
Bootstrap works -- I, a NOBODY in the Perl world, posted to it (look for a post by woodrow.j.hillATncmi.com, if you're curious). So I don't know why Simon can't. Maybe he should get a Hotmail account.
I have high hopes of eventually helping out with doc-writing and the like; for now I'm just watching the interplay.
By the by, sending e-mail to bootstrap-subscribe@perl.org will get folks on, if you wish.
----Woodrow
For example, I attend a SCA (Society for Creative Anachronism) event called Pennsic every year. All camping. I take pictures of my fellow dancers, mostly for personal use, but I put a few up on my site.
2 years ago, I took along a Mavica from work. Made it SO easy to do pictures. No need to lug a laptop with, the battery life was beyond amazing (a week of camping, and I only had to recharge once), and I lost only one floppy to the heat.
I've since used a couple of high-ends digitals from Kodak and Olympus. For what I want, the Mavica beats them both hands-down.
Two points, teraflop:
1) Half of what he speaks of (IM, channels, Net2Phone, etc.) are not even IN the Linux download, from what I understand. But, yes, the mail/news intergration and so on are.
2) Again -- go to http://bugzilla.mozilla.org, and report it as a feature request. Let the developers know that you need the ability to use it just as an HTML browser on Linux, and I suspect you'll get somewhere.
Rombuu, that's like saying we shouldn't do any work fixing the Linux kernel because Red Hat, VA Linux, etc. have LOTS of money. Let them do all the hard work! After all, they are making all the money, and money's the only thing we care about here! Not having a quality product, or showing the strength of Open Source development.
It's ironic -- for a year+, people jumped up and yelled and screamed at Netscape, saying this browser was a failure for the Open Source world. Why? Because the vast majority of developers, in the early days, were paid Netscape developers. People Netscape paid to build something for the Open Source community. In the same way that Alan Cox is paid by Red Hat to do Linux dev.
And now, Rombuu, you're complaining because they asked for help from the community? What's this all about, man? Open Source without a community supporting it is useless!
Still faster than Netscape on solaris. :)
Fair 'enuff. You have the right of this issue.
For Solaris, check out http://www.mozillazine.org/builds/ -- the Mozilla builds for Solaris are about halfway down the page.
For EVERYTHING else, check out http://mozilla.bugzilla.org. The Bugzilla reporting system is designed to allow end-users to reports problems and missing features. You have to register, and you should see if others have reported the problem already. OTOH, it doesn't just drop into a black box -- it registers the bug with a specific developer, when it is worked on.
Sounds like you have a situation. I've been using it since M13 on my machine -- in fact, I usually install the nightly builds about every other day. I'm NT4, SP5.
Currently, I'm running NS 4.72, Mozilla Nightly Build from 4/3/00, and the Preview release. No crashes such as you report.
Go to http://bugzilla.mozilla.org, register there, and report the problem, PLEASE. It's your way of letting them know what's wrong, so they can fix it NOW.
Again -- Choose Custom. Download only the browser. Simple.
It's all plug-in-like pieces from there.
From my understanding, the Solaris port wasn't -- it was "move lots of Win32 API's over and run IE slow and buggy on top of those".
If I am wrong, I am sorry.
Well, true it's not much different than the Mozilla versions. But it's not here to be different. Why reinvent the wheel they just rode in on?
And, it you do a Custom install (2nd nature for me with any program, after too many years of being burned), you'll see it comes with Flash!
I, for one, DON'T want to see a lot of branding. And I doubt you'll get much. Netscape/AOL itself is depending on selling Customing kits to Big Business, letting them do their own "branding"...
Also, it works on MacOS and (more importantly) Linux x86 -- making it a cross-platform solution, something MS has yet to do.