First, I just wanted to say that the AC that posted above is not me!!! (though I enjoyed reading the post, I could have modded that funny)
Second, your speech is almost based on technical superiority of Ogg (Vorbis, OggVorbis, Ogg\Vorb, OV, OgVo... whatever, we know what we're talking about), and it seems to me that history should have taught us one lesson: Technical brilliance of a product has *nothing* to do with it's acceptance, even more to it's victory over another concurrent product.
I'd add that in the history of great battles (VCR, Word Processors...) almost invariably the worst product has always won.
I am perhaps thinking small, but your argument is:
1. Ogg is better - Argument that has proven by the past being of little if any importance in the acceptance of a product. 2. Ogg is free. Once again, maybe the odds are changing a little, but price has very little to do with a product acceptance either. 3. It's free of any licenses. There you get a point. But it's a double sided point: No license means no company investing in it either (at least for now)
But I'd say with all the billions $ that MS+Apple+Real are putting in the balance in terms of marketing, pressure (more or less legal) and whatever they know to make their media accepted, Ogg and its thousand geeks followers have a very thin chance to get any major acceptance soon.
But don't get me wrong, I'd like a lot to see that happening!
But remember something else: It took a *long* time for MP3 to get acceptance, it's not get fast with Ogg!
I'm wondering if when Ogg version 2 will be released you'll convert all your CDs into this new format or if you'll keep them on your "very old and bad" Ogg V1 format.
Industry needs to settle itself on a media, and MP3 seems to be acceptable. In 5 years, we'll have 5TB HDDs in these little devices and my 256kb MP3 collection will fit just fine into 5% of it. And we'll also have Ogg V6 which will oblige yourself to re-encode for the 6th time all of your CDs (Or you'll be blamed to be such a retard for using OggV5)
My point being, who knows if there is a need for Ogg support on these things? Certainly not a commercial need...
Actually, in France, you can buy American DVDs coded to region 1. Even though France is region 2. You can also go to "best buy" (or equivalent) and buy a multi-zone DVD player.
Zone coding is not illegal, but enforcing that a French guy would not be able to watch any other DVD that a zone 2 DVD is illegal. So we can and the market response is there: Everyone is buying multi-zone DVDs.
Totally agree with that. The only problem in your nice argument is that Open source is open... sound stupid but it really is a double sided weapon.
Let's imagine SCO is right and there is plenty of their IP in Linux...
If linux was a closed source they would not know. But Linux is Open Source, so they have an easy way of knowing. That's life. If you don't want that, don't release your code in open source.
The Linux community is about to pay the price of the GPL (assuming they are at fault, which is still to be proven).
My point is that lots of people consider this technological mess like the betamax/VHS/V2000 battle, but it has nothing to do with it.
with VCR battle, if I recorded a tv show on a betamax tape, I can only view it on a betamax vcr. And so if betamax loose, all my cassettes are to be thrown away at some point.
Here the problem is different: Whether I record a DVD-R or a DVD+R, I'll be able to read it on any player. So even if DVD-R loose the battle, all my DVD already burned are still readable on any DVD player!
Let's go the simple way: DVD-R is cheaper and has better compatibility. This is the common ground everyone agree on.
So buy one. Even (and I'm saying *even*) if they loose in the end, we're still going to find DVD-R available cheap for a while - let's say 2 years.
In two years, your 2.4x burner will be outdated by a new 32x burner, right? So you'll buy another one anyway right? What prevent you at this time to buy a DVD+R if it is the winner?
Anyways all your already burned DVD-Rs are readable everywhere, so you have nothing to loose!!!
I mean, ok, it is an alpha version, but still the window shown is not even resizable! The HTML redering is worse than HotJava, even worse than the default Java HTML renderer!!!!
What's the point of showing this ?
Unless I'm missing something of course...
Re:This begs the question....
on
Ant Farm PC
·
· Score: 1
I actually wouldn't give a couple of days for your PC to get down. Definitively.
See, ants generate an acid that has an interesting effect on electric wires... it melts plastic and you end up with all your wires naked touching each other.
I once got my phone cut and after a couple of hours of research they found an ant farm in my phone switch... And that's bigger wires than those on a PC!!!
Whether your connection to the internet is secure or not, your MSN chat goes to redmond and when they decide to shut down the service for maintenance, you can't communicate even in your "very private" connection.
Unless it is some dedicated software made by MS...
The only reasons the open source community has been able to do what they currently do is:
The internet, great communication media.
The complexity of OS/Apps has grown slower than the power of development tools and now, writing a Unix kernel/driver/http server/mail server... or other is at hand for any geek sufficiently motivated.
That's the only reason. Since there is no way this guy is going to apprehend the topics you do in your labs in less than 5 years of hard studies (ok, 4 if he is very smart), the open source model just cannot work.
Though I agree with him on one thing: The internet is out there for you guys to share anything. But I do think you already know that!
Slashdot Mirror
I agree to that. The law should be more like:
"If you didn't receive a dime for your work in the last 5 years, it is assumed to be in the public domain"
Isn't that better? That would prevent big companies from holding millions of copyrights that they don't even know they have.
Damn! I guess I just didn't read the first sentence... Damn too tired.
:-(
Sorry about the troll then
This whole battle is stupid and one format should be enough.
Questionable quality? really? I think the quality of MP3 is now well established and certainly not questionable.
You may not like it, but that's something else...
Did you try to use it? All the people I know that have one wouldn't trade the wheel for anything else...
First, I just wanted to say that the AC that posted above is not me!!! (though I enjoyed reading the post, I could have modded that funny)
.02
Second, your speech is almost based on technical superiority of Ogg (Vorbis, OggVorbis, Ogg\Vorb, OV, OgVo... whatever, we know what we're talking about), and it seems to me that history should have taught us one lesson: Technical brilliance of a product has *nothing* to do with it's acceptance, even more to it's victory over another concurrent product.
I'd add that in the history of great battles (VCR, Word Processors...) almost invariably the worst product has always won.
My
I am perhaps thinking small, but your argument is:
1. Ogg is better - Argument that has proven by the past being of little if any importance in the acceptance of a product.
2. Ogg is free. Once again, maybe the odds are changing a little, but price has very little to do with a product acceptance either.
3. It's free of any licenses. There you get a point. But it's a double sided point: No license means no company investing in it either (at least for now)
But I'd say with all the billions $ that MS+Apple+Real are putting in the balance in terms of marketing, pressure (more or less legal) and whatever they know to make their media accepted, Ogg and its thousand geeks followers have a very thin chance to get any major acceptance soon.
But don't get me wrong, I'd like a lot to see that happening!
But remember something else: It took a *long* time for MP3 to get acceptance, it's not get fast with Ogg!
I'm wondering if when Ogg version 2 will be released you'll convert all your CDs into this new format or if you'll keep them on your "very old and bad" Ogg V1 format.
Industry needs to settle itself on a media, and MP3 seems to be acceptable. In 5 years, we'll have 5TB HDDs in these little devices and my 256kb MP3 collection will fit just fine into 5% of it.
And we'll also have Ogg V6 which will oblige yourself to re-encode for the 6th time all of your CDs (Or you'll be blamed to be such a retard for using OggV5)
My point being, who knows if there is a need for Ogg support on these things? Certainly not a commercial need...
So if I follow you, rights are not violated for *most* people.
That still leaves some with their rights violated!!
I think this is the most stupid post I've ever read...
If you think silicon and glass are the same, I'll ask you:
You want ot give your wife a ring, but diamond is too expensive. So you tell yourself:
Diamond is made of carbon!!! And put a piece of black carbon on the ring.
The reaction of your wife will be at the inverse level of insightfullness in this post...
I use a WM called OpenBox, ant it's also very minimalist...
I love it!
Actually, in France, you can buy American DVDs coded to region 1. Even though France is region 2. You can also go to "best buy" (or equivalent) and buy a multi-zone DVD player.
Zone coding is not illegal, but enforcing that a French guy would not be able to watch any other DVD that a zone 2 DVD is illegal. So we can and the market response is there: Everyone is buying multi-zone DVDs.
The world is not screwed up by DRM, the US is.
IMHO, the article itself is a non-issue.
If the DRM / digital world sucks (for copyright or anything else) I believe that the market will have the right response....
Fair use not available? We will not buy!
Totally agree with that. The only problem in your nice argument is that Open source is open... sound stupid but it really is a double sided weapon.
Let's imagine SCO is right and there is plenty of their IP in Linux...
If linux was a closed source they would not know. But Linux is Open Source, so they have an easy way of knowing. That's life. If you don't want that, don't release your code in open source.
The Linux community is about to pay the price of the GPL (assuming they are at fault, which is still to be proven).
There could be many reasons (I mean other than reasons that SCO haters come up with), don't you think?
:
On the other hand, they say
The development process has no one that is ensuring that inappropriate code is not getting into Linux. All that's there is an honor system
And this is true right? How would anyone know if someone has actually copy/pasted some code from a UNIX source code available somewhere else?
Hard to say...
Stupid argument. You don't know which code they are talking about, right? If they tell you, you will know, right?
That's what a nondisclosure agreements is for!
I don't see what USB has anything to do here...
My point is that lots of people consider this technological mess like the betamax/VHS/V2000 battle, but it has nothing to do with it.
with VCR battle, if I recorded a tv show on a betamax tape, I can only view it on a betamax vcr. And so if betamax loose, all my cassettes are to be thrown away at some point.
Here the problem is different: Whether I record a DVD-R or a DVD+R, I'll be able to read it on any player. So even if DVD-R loose the battle, all my DVD already burned are still readable on any DVD player!
Exactly! Foreseeing the future is too hard for me but the nanorobots joining the Internet is defitively the way to go to run out of IPv6 !!!
Soon every one of my cells (unfortunately including braincells) will have it's own nano-robot connected to the internet so that I can reprogram them.
Might want to watch closer for viruses though...
I think the real question is: What do you care ?
.02
Let's go the simple way: DVD-R is cheaper and has better compatibility. This is the common ground everyone agree on.
So buy one. Even (and I'm saying *even*) if they loose in the end, we're still going to find DVD-R available cheap for a while - let's say 2 years.
In two years, your 2.4x burner will be outdated by a new 32x burner, right? So you'll buy another one anyway right? What prevent you at this time to buy a DVD+R if it is the winner?
Anyways all your already burned DVD-Rs are readable everywhere, so you have nothing to loose!!!
My
How could that be modded +5 ?????
I'll just tell you the support in existing DVD players for the "new" 24GB discs: 0%
Off Topic guys!! Moderate right !!
Shhhh, don't tell anyone but the UK too is not using the metric system....
This thing is a joke right?
I mean, ok, it is an alpha version, but still the window shown is not even resizable! The HTML redering is worse than HotJava, even worse than the default Java HTML renderer!!!!
What's the point of showing this ?
Unless I'm missing something of course...
I actually wouldn't give a couple of days for your PC to get down. Definitively.
See, ants generate an acid that has an interesting effect on electric wires... it melts plastic and you end up with all your wires naked touching each other.
I once got my phone cut and after a couple of hours of research they found an ant farm in my phone switch... And that's bigger wires than those on a PC!!!
Whether your connection to the internet is secure or not, your MSN chat goes to redmond and when they decide to shut down the service for maintenance, you can't communicate even in your "very private" connection.
Unless it is some dedicated software made by MS...
That's the only reason. Since there is no way this guy is going to apprehend the topics you do in your labs in less than 5 years of hard studies (ok, 4 if he is very smart), the open source model just cannot work.
Though I agree with him on one thing: The internet is out there for you guys to share anything. But I do think you already know that!
Responding to an AC is not something I do with joy -- I feel like wasting my time!
an industry without profit is an industry without incentive
So you read the "Free" in "free software" as in "no money"? No, you're wrong, it's the free in "freedom".
Example? How does Red Hat survives selling "free" software?
Read. Ask. Learn. But please, stop posting.