And I should say that among the members of VE2CUA (Concordia University Amateur radio), and pioneer of amateur packet radio was Norm Pearl, who's company DataRadio did the packet link between the Mars Rover and its base-station (with help from Motorola). Yeah, but I can still kick his and Bob's butt in SPAXX!
This nicely demonstrates why even something you can make a business case for won't necessarily turn a profit;).
Yeah, CC was the dot.bomber of his day. Inflated initial idea (and wrong), lousy execution, went back to the vulture caps for more funding of a wrong idea, pushed on, tossed out.
There was a good science fact article in Analog that I was rereading recently that looked at the lag between initial discovery and actual exploitation of various things. (Damn, can't find the issue.) Between 1492 and actual "use" of the new world, there was quite a delay.
And to bring it back on topic, the best views of Saturn I've had were the Voyager pictures sent hot off the dish from JPL via amateur radio slow-scan to VE2CUA. Wow...! (Kids these days just take it for granted. $Yorkshireman)
Perhaps an interesting side-topic: what games first started taking real-time into account? Zork/Dungeon?
I admit that Dungeon Keeper II is the best that I've encountered, limited experience here. (The first few times, amusing. Tonight is not a good night to put my head on a pillow! Oh wait, even Dungeon Keepers..)
Frankly, I do not want to see people writing their senators on this one though. I want to see an internet-elected system that everyone has dreamed of and then MAKE IT HAPPEN. Once we have a respected and responsible internet name counsil created along with a good base set of servers, then we simply persuade everyone to switch over.
So... Whoever has the most ICANN karma points controls the Internet? Cool! I sure hope that Funny moderation points count!
/me glances down. No, I don't think so, and I have witnesses. Stupid, I might grant you, but after a good night's sleep and a Coffee++ tommorow, I will eat you. I might use badinage, or even.. sarcasm. Sleep tight.:^)
Microsoft is as evil as any other software company out there.
Now there's a stunning leap of faith! I didn't have much concern that IBM used to control the 360/40 that Avon used for Canada west of Montreal in 1973, oh my! But Dinsdale (486/66) handles my home-security system and IP monitoring stuff, and I like to trust that sort of thing. Do you really trust eTrust or Verisign? If so, faith indeed!
Now let's get something straight -- I buy my software, and I am mainly a Windows developer at the moment, but that has changed previously, and will change again. I don't even rip the CDs that I own. I can't legally create more Windows systems on my LAN, so when Dinsdale was converted to Windows, CyberSquid will be changing to FreeBSD.
Some of my systems aren't exposed to the Internet, and will never be. What then? Call a phone number "Oh hello, I'm tranfering a licence for WinXP from one system to another, hello?" Voicemailhell or worse when I need to be running *now*? (I know, I'll have my IVR call their IVR -- oops, they removed IVR Win98 support from SAPI 5.0 for no good reason.)
he reminds me too much of the hippies that still hang-out at UC Berkeley
Bah, Berkeley, try MIT. Those who didn't learn from history, obviously failed math too. (Okay, sometimes he comes across as the Forth Furry Freak Brother (he wishes), but I am too tired to properly poke you. Poke-poke! See? Go away.
Okay, I was cheesed off at the time, and I'm running sleep-depraved. I had been ignoring the Palladium/DRM topic because it didn't concern me. Now it's slapping me in the face. My next computer will have Palladium, right?
Palladium is not DRM. Palladium is hardware enforced encryption.
I've worked with hardware enforced encrypted systems, 13 years ago. Tempest-certified hardware. Red Book, Orange Book. Alphabet agencies, I think. I got the joke when Microsoft claimed to have a B2 rated version of NT -- The slightest driver/hardware change meant a recertification, and THEY never told you why it failed. I admit that I worked on the edge of it all, and I'm not an expert. (And have no security classifications to violate.)
The idea of a trusted system is that you have a "black-box" (hardware, or reluctantly software) that is tamper-proof. (Some cards might have had a key-wipe if you opened the case wrong.) Only someone who has the master keys has access inside that black-box and "root" access to everything else.
Has the Palladium spec made it clear who will control those keys? If it's not me, and I don't control even access to the floppy drive, how do I install an operating system that I trust? (Yeah, the floppy, ports and network were locked out on a user basis, damned straight!)
So, I'm thinking of the GE Tempest PCs with fibre-optic keyboard and monitor cables, and an encryption card that tied the harddrive in knots, and hardware 6 years behind the curve and I wonder why I would buy such a thing? Why should I be forced to buy such a thing? That's where I'm coming from.
No one is forcing you, or will force you to use anything related to Palladium
Ah? Someone recently assured me on Slashdot that I would have to -- until I mentioned that I was in Canada. (And how does Palladium encryption protect terrorist data these days? I thought encryption was still classified as "munitions"?) How did that go, "That which is not maniditory will be compulsorily"? (I'm sure I'm misquoting one of the Arthur books. Someone will correct me, this is Slashdot.) Ah, you stated that Palladium is a security/encryption standard, yes? Who certified it? Is it an open standard? (I'm asking, not challenging.)
An operating system that needs to phone home to properly install.
False. Windows XP can phone home for you, or you can do it yourself. Big deal.
It still needs contact with Microsoft to be installed. Ever boostraped an install with upgrade disks recently, even legally? To get Win95 on the 486/66, I needed DOS 6.x. And then I need the Win95 CD to cram Win98 on it. Why don't I trust Microsoft to forever support a product that I bought? (I needed a slow machine for the EPROM programmer.)
That check box clicking thing got you down? Whats wrong with software that offers to keep itself current? On the one hand you say MS sucks for its security problems, and then on other hand when they design software to help reduce exploitability after a compromise is found you freak out. You cant have it both ways.
I turned off any auto-update. That's the firewall complaining that an unauthourized app is trying to access the Internet. (Microsoft isn't alone in that. Corel inhales deeply and others.) I make the decisions about upgrades, and frequently I do upgrade -- after the pioneers have caught the arrows. Mamma isn't Microsoft or RealNetworks. Unauthorized auto-upgrade software is not an option. (Perhaps I was tried too well about security?)
And now "DRM" that basically gives them a hardware blackbox that they control inside the machine I paid for?
I have no idea what you are talking about, but its definately not related to Palladium.
I have to learn more about Palladium, but perhaps you have to learn more about secured encryption/security systems? I'm too tired to go another round or make any more sense, but it was a pleasure. Night!
How the hell does screwing with my hardware stop Paypal from freezing my account? How does it stop CDNow from leaking my credit card info?
It might stop some people from cheating a networked games, but they use a bad model in the first place. (It's a bandwidth kludge, but still.)
Prediction: one month after Windows DRM ships, someone will create an Outlook attachment that will tie itself into the DRM protection such that people can't delete it or kill it. (Look at their track record and tell me that it couldn't happen.)
I think you misunderstand. They don't want to spend the time and effort to make their computers trustworthy. Busy busy busy, too much work and effort.
No, they want to make our to be computers trustworthy -- to them. Hardwired DRM would make them untrustworthy to me. ("You want to install operating system XYZ? Sorry, I can't do that Ron, it would bypass my DRM protection...")
Hell, they control their computers and websites and transaction processing. So why do they make idiot mistakes? Let them install secure operating systems that prevent those kind of fsckups first.
I'd rather hand over all my root accounts or just install BackOrifice for them than give them what amounts to hardware control.
And Microsoft is evil.
An operating system that needs to phone home to properly install.
Software that wants to auto-update. (Blocked suckers!)
And now "DRM" that basically gives them a hardware blackbox that they control inside the machine I paid for? I. Don't. Think. So. (And I still have my hand-soldered 8085 as backup.)
Usually I think RMS is a bit of a loon, but in this I agree. (My initials are RMS too, can I sue him?:^)
Thanks also. I do have two old NE2000 clones, but I haven't had them both talking on the LAN at the same time recently, but I just added a 486/66 to the LAN. (It's hard to get a machine *slow* enough to use my EPROM programmer ISA card, ha!) I don't remember if I had to use ipconfig on one to get it to work way back when.
There is a manufacturer's prefix in the MAC. Do you think some clone shop in Taiwan was going to apply to a standards organization for their illegal knock-offs? And do you think their standards were high enough to avoid dups?
That said, I'm still happy with my Taiwanese NE2000 illegal knock-off clone cards.:^) (In the older machines, of course.)
Now we all know that that cheating in online games is for the most part a Bad Thing (tm). We all remember the original Quake bots (my personal favorite was the StoogeBot) that required a certain measure of circumventing of built-in precautions.
Newbie!:^) Bots for multi-player games go back much further than that. I think the first "bot" for a multi-player trek73 descendant I ever saw/used was a paper-tape that would enter a command line at every TTY input. Limited, but gave extra speed at the right moment!
Once micro computers were available, we used them. We didn't see it as cheating -- First you built the computer, then you wrote the bot... And then you rewrote the bot because good humans were still better. (Handy for a quick de-beer break auto-pilot!)
It's almost too bad that there aren't more bots-only games. They'd have to be restricted within the games rules, and properly you would only use a bot that you had written yourself. (Try enforcing that, ha!) A very tricky problem short of locking people out of their own computers.
Kind of interesting that McGill University could claim to have one of the larger space-programs of the day.:^)
I don't think I'd buy a ticket, but could we send that boy-band wanker? (But seriously, it could be useful for getting mass into orbit that could take a high-G launch.)
On March 22, 1990, Dr. Bull was surprised at the door of his Brussels apartment. He was shot five times, in the neck and in the back of the head, with a silenced 7.65 millimeter automatic pistol. His assassin has never been found.
Maybe, maybe not. I know that in Ontario, there's a cheap test for prostate cancer. It's not covered and you have to know to request it and pay a little bit for the test.
I might start paying for it every few years -- as long as it doesn't involve latex gloves...
When they allowed some guy's tumour to be patented. (Cultures of it are used in Cancer research.)
Couldn't the guy claim prior art?:^)
It's a tricky call -- on the one hand, research is good and should be rewarded. On the other, some companies seem to be doing a bit of "gene-squating". They don't have to do research; they own the gene, and anyone who does want to do research or develop new treatments has to pay them. Human genetics as IP makes me nervous.
Slashdot Mirror
The "Comic Store Guy" really does exist. Hang around any SF or Comic convention and you'll meet dozens of him.
Sure, but it comes with a funny name, and you have to assemble it yourself with one of those little hex keys.
And I should say that among the members of VE2CUA (Concordia University Amateur radio), and pioneer of amateur packet radio was Norm Pearl, who's company DataRadio did the packet link between the Mars Rover and its base-station (with help from Motorola). Yeah, but I can still kick his and Bob's butt in SPAXX!
Yeah, CC was the dot.bomber of his day. Inflated initial idea (and wrong), lousy execution, went back to the vulture caps for more funding of a wrong idea, pushed on, tossed out.
There was a good science fact article in Analog that I was rereading recently that looked at the lag between initial discovery and actual exploitation of various things. (Damn, can't find the issue.) Between 1492 and actual "use" of the new world, there was quite a delay.
And to bring it back on topic, the best views of Saturn I've had were the Voyager pictures sent hot off the dish from JPL via amateur radio slow-scan to VE2CUA. Wow...! (Kids these days just take it for granted. $Yorkshireman)
1. sail to India directly.
2. find new world instead.
3. lose one ship.
4. Another mutinies and leaves.
5. ???
6. profit!
Perhaps an interesting side-topic: what games first started taking real-time into account? Zork/Dungeon?
I admit that Dungeon Keeper II is the best that I've encountered, limited experience here. (The first few times, amusing. Tonight is not a good night to put my head on a pillow! Oh wait, even Dungeon Keepers..)
I thought he just shot anyone who said the trains were late. It would have been much more efficient and effective...
So... Whoever has the most ICANN karma points controls the Internet? Cool! I sure hope that Funny moderation points count!
Microsoft is as evil as any other software company out there.
Now there's a stunning leap of faith! I didn't have much concern that IBM used to control the 360/40 that Avon used for Canada west of Montreal in 1973, oh my! But Dinsdale (486/66) handles my home-security system and IP monitoring stuff, and I like to trust that sort of thing. Do you really trust eTrust or Verisign? If so, faith indeed!
Now let's get something straight -- I buy my software, and I am mainly a Windows developer at the moment, but that has changed previously, and will change again. I don't even rip the CDs that I own. I can't legally create more Windows systems on my LAN, so when Dinsdale was converted to Windows, CyberSquid will be changing to FreeBSD.
Some of my systems aren't exposed to the Internet, and will never be. What then? Call a phone number "Oh hello, I'm tranfering a licence for WinXP from one system to another, hello?" Voicemailhell or worse when I need to be running *now*? (I know, I'll have my IVR call their IVR -- oops, they removed IVR Win98 support from SAPI 5.0 for no good reason.)
he reminds me too much of the hippies that still hang-out at UC Berkeley
Bah, Berkeley, try MIT. Those who didn't learn from history, obviously failed math too. (Okay, sometimes he comes across as the Forth Furry Freak Brother (he wishes), but I am too tired to properly poke you. Poke-poke! See? Go away.
Palladium is not DRM. Palladium is hardware enforced encryption.
I've worked with hardware enforced encrypted systems, 13 years ago. Tempest-certified hardware. Red Book, Orange Book. Alphabet agencies, I think. I got the joke when Microsoft claimed to have a B2 rated version of NT -- The slightest driver/hardware change meant a recertification, and THEY never told you why it failed. I admit that I worked on the edge of it all, and I'm not an expert. (And have no security classifications to violate.)
The idea of a trusted system is that you have a "black-box" (hardware, or reluctantly software) that is tamper-proof. (Some cards might have had a key-wipe if you opened the case wrong.) Only someone who has the master keys has access inside that black-box and "root" access to everything else.
Has the Palladium spec made it clear who will control those keys? If it's not me, and I don't control even access to the floppy drive, how do I install an operating system that I trust? (Yeah, the floppy, ports and network were locked out on a user basis, damned straight!)
So, I'm thinking of the GE Tempest PCs with fibre-optic keyboard and monitor cables, and an encryption card that tied the harddrive in knots, and hardware 6 years behind the curve and I wonder why I would buy such a thing? Why should I be forced to buy such a thing? That's where I'm coming from.
No one is forcing you, or will force you to use anything related to Palladium
Ah? Someone recently assured me on Slashdot that I would have to -- until I mentioned that I was in Canada. (And how does Palladium encryption protect terrorist data these days? I thought encryption was still classified as "munitions"?) How did that go, "That which is not maniditory will be compulsorily"? (I'm sure I'm misquoting one of the Arthur books. Someone will correct me, this is Slashdot.) Ah, you stated that Palladium is a security/encryption standard, yes? Who certified it? Is it an open standard? (I'm asking, not challenging.)
An operating system that needs to phone home to properly install.
False. Windows XP can phone home for you, or you can do it yourself. Big deal.
It still needs contact with Microsoft to be installed. Ever boostraped an install with upgrade disks recently, even legally? To get Win95 on the 486/66, I needed DOS 6.x. And then I need the Win95 CD to cram Win98 on it. Why don't I trust Microsoft to forever support a product that I bought? (I needed a slow machine for the EPROM programmer.)
That check box clicking thing got you down? Whats wrong with software that offers to keep itself current? On the one hand you say MS sucks for its security problems, and then on other hand when they design software to help reduce exploitability after a compromise is found you freak out. You cant have it both ways.
I turned off any auto-update. That's the firewall complaining that an unauthourized app is trying to access the Internet. (Microsoft isn't alone in that. Corel inhales deeply and others.) I make the decisions about upgrades, and frequently I do upgrade -- after the pioneers have caught the arrows. Mamma isn't Microsoft or RealNetworks. Unauthorized auto-upgrade software is not an option. (Perhaps I was tried too well about security?)
And now "DRM" that basically gives them a hardware blackbox that they control inside the machine I paid for? I have no idea what you are talking about, but its definately not related to Palladium.
I have to learn more about Palladium, but perhaps you have to learn more about secured encryption/security systems? I'm too tired to go another round or make any more sense, but it was a pleasure. Night!
How the hell does screwing with my hardware stop Paypal from freezing my account? How does it stop CDNow from leaking my credit card info?
It might stop some people from cheating a networked games, but they use a bad model in the first place. (It's a bandwidth kludge, but still.)
Prediction: one month after Windows DRM ships, someone will create an Outlook attachment that will tie itself into the DRM protection such that people can't delete it or kill it. (Look at their track record and tell me that it couldn't happen.)
Off, flame off for now.
No, they want to make our to be computers trustworthy -- to them. Hardwired DRM would make them untrustworthy to me. ("You want to install operating system XYZ? Sorry, I can't do that Ron, it would bypass my DRM protection...")
Hell, they control their computers and websites and transaction processing. So why do they make idiot mistakes? Let them install secure operating systems that prevent those kind of fsckups first.
I'd rather hand over all my root accounts or just install BackOrifice for them than give them what amounts to hardware control.
And Microsoft is evil.
An operating system that needs to phone home to properly install.
Software that wants to auto-update. (Blocked suckers!)
And now "DRM" that basically gives them a hardware blackbox that they control inside the machine I paid for? I. Don't. Think. So. (And I still have my hand-soldered 8085 as backup.)
Usually I think RMS is a bit of a loon, but in this I agree. (My initials are RMS too, can I sue him? :^)
Or Simpsons fan: Die Bart Die!
I'll keep that in mind as a possible problem.
That said, I'm still happy with my Taiwanese NE2000 illegal knock-off clone cards. :^) (In the older machines, of course.)
Newbie! :^) Bots for multi-player games go back much further than that. I think the first "bot" for a multi-player trek73 descendant I ever saw/used was a paper-tape that would enter a command line at every TTY input. Limited, but gave extra speed at the right moment!
Once micro computers were available, we used them. We didn't see it as cheating -- First you built the computer, then you wrote the bot... And then you rewrote the bot because good humans were still better. (Handy for a quick de-beer break auto-pilot!)
It's almost too bad that there aren't more bots-only games. They'd have to be restricted within the games rules, and properly you would only use a bot that you had written yourself. (Try enforcing that, ha!) A very tricky problem short of locking people out of their own computers.
And hi to Montreal Space/Spaxx gang!
Intel said they canceled that "feature". *gasp*! You mean they lied?
Too bad Gerald Bull didn't fire pumpkins instead of working for Saddam. A "Babylon Cannon" capable of orbital pumpkin delivery!
Like this one: Man builds gun to fire pumpkin a mile If that isn't a geeky story, what is?
If we want to find out if this rock is really Earth's little brother, couldn't we get it on that TV show that does the blood / DNA tests?
Maybe the RIAA will send lawyers to it long before any humans get there?
I don't think I'd buy a ticket, but could we send that boy-band wanker? (But seriously, it could be useful for getting mass into orbit that could take a high-G launch.)
On March 22, 1990, Dr. Bull was surprised at the door of his Brussels apartment. He was shot five times, in the neck and in the back of the head, with a silenced 7.65 millimeter automatic pistol. His assassin has never been found.
Gee, I wonder who could have done that?
Yes, John Norman's Gor. The first 3 or so books were Barsoom pastiches (in the style of), then John Norman started to go really weirdly B&D.
I might start paying for it every few years -- as long as it doesn't involve latex gloves...
Couldn't the guy claim prior art? :^)
It's a tricky call -- on the one hand, research is good and should be rewarded. On the other, some companies seem to be doing a bit of "gene-squating". They don't have to do research; they own the gene, and anyone who does want to do research or develop new treatments has to pay them. Human genetics as IP makes me nervous.