That has got to be the lamest counter argument I've ever seen.
What's even lamer is the fact that instead of trying to counter it with logic you and your cronies decided instead to mod me down. Hmm, can't stand the truth I guess.
"What I mean is, if Microsoft can no longer 'force' OEM's to put only Windows on their computers, Linux has a good chance. "
That won't make a difference if there is no compelling reason to the user to have Linux installed.
"Primarily because its free so the OEM's would love to push it. "
OEM's aren't that stupid... the Consumers have to want it.
"This can only happen if the Justice Dept. dishes out a meaningful punishment to Microsoft."
What you want is already part of the settlement the DOJ has offered.
But regardless, I hate to break this to you, but watching the past 20 years the desktop race is over. Microsoft has won, and there is no way of changing that.
But at some point the desktop and server paradigm that we currently know will go away. If someone had a vision, they would start working towards that... and be there before Microsoft realizes it. That, my friend, is how you become dominant. That is what Microsoft essentially did with the PC over the larger systems.
The report didn't take into account that in 1990 in order to run Windows you also needed to purchase DOS.
It's interesting how the report not only ignores this but tries to use it as proof that Windows costs more. In Figure 1 they note the dramatic increase in the price of Windows 95 from Windows 3.1, but they don't point out that was because Win95 included a copy of DOS.
I will encourage you to try again, but unfortunately the facts don't support your claims.
Microsoft's products have consistently offered more for less to the consumer. The company clearly proves my point that it is the value and quality of the software that dominates in the market... not the marketing.
If this were not true, Microsoft would never have failures because it could throw it's marketing budget down and dominate. But we have seen numerous failures over the years... IE2, Bob, Win CE 1.0, Money and so forth. In many cases those failures turned into canceled product lines. In other cases they came back as a new version which learned from the mistakes and complaints of the critics.
The best product ALWAYS wins in the marketplace, and I'd like to see you argue otherwise. So far you troll, er I mean argument, is unconvincing and doesn't lot address the large number of exceptions.
The success of software has little to do with marketing plans. It really has nothing to do with conspiracies, sneaking it in the door, subversion, etc. The success relies solely upon what the software does and how well it does it. If it's cool enough, it will spread by word of mouth alone.
People don't care if the source is available... People don't care if it is licensed under the GPL.
People don't care if the software is free, but it is a really nice perk. They'll pay you for software which is cool, but they'll also more than happily download it if it's free. Especially when we go back to my first point, and the software does something unique and does it well. Look at the success of Napster, Kazaa, ZoneAlarms, etc. all available as free downloads.
If the software is already good, and cool, you won't need to be subversive.
So the answer is... Write better software. Software that does things that people want to do. Or maybe that can be simplified to "Build it, and they shall come." or some other cliche.
Go back and check the price of the original DOS, the original Windows... Windows 95 and so on. The price of the OS has remained almost constant as long as I can remember.
Then if you go and compare the price of Microsoft's offerings to other comparable products in the industry you'll see software has gotten drastically cheaper because of Microsoft.
Why do the slashbot editors constantly complain about Microsoft, promote Linux...
But then get all defensive about software piracy?
Look... If you don't like Microsoft but do like Linux then USE LINUX! Sheesh, give up the hypocrisy of promoting Linux but using Windows for all your real work, it's old already. Use one or the other, but if you find Windows of value at least have the decency to pay for the product.
I have a Tissot PR50, which is their bottom of the line. Pretty basic stainless steel case with a sapphire crystal and a nice quartz movement. Bought it at the height of the dot-bomb era from a place called newwatch.com for like 40% off.:)
First watch I've ever owned that has received "nice watch" comments from women.:)
I am definately considering buying this T-Touch. Although I haven't found any dot-bombs selling it for 40% off.:)
And yet it is the strip down version implemented by 98micro which the renegade states and all the slashbots are proposing Microsoft be forced to release.
What is interesting is that this contradicts one of the other proposed constraints, that being that Microsoft can't release a version of Windows that breaks third party products. Weird how the states and slashbots haven't thought through their remedies.
My understand with Tivo is that they removed that capability without subscription last year, so as to discourage people buying it as a VCR.
I agree with the other poster. I'll buy one of these DVR devices when by itself it will replace a VCR. If I want the subscription so I can get automated TV Guide, then maybe I'll consider that as well, but if I don't want it... I don't want it...
Re:Retailers do not exempt themselves
on
Worst Buy
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· Score: 2
Yes, generally retailers will honor misprints for the first several people. But then they'll also publish a retraction, or post a notice on the door of the store. The difference here is that one person noticed this and then posted it on numerous websites "Hey Best Buy mismarked these video cards... Quick, go order one before they fix it."
So it's not as though people were upset because the product was been misprinted, they knew they were taking advantage of the store all along.
I've gotten many a bargain because of store mistakes. I once bought Visual C++ 4.0 Professional edition for $50 because it had been priced wrong. I didn't expect to get it at that price, I just pointed it out to the cashier and the manager reluctantly gave it to me. He also then went and pulled all other copies off the shelf to insure they were priced correctly.
"98micro completely removes all traces of the MS HTML engine (shdocvw.dll, and mshtml.dll). You will not have access to any of the proprietary Microsoft compressed help files, and you will not be able to run programs that rely on the MS HTML rendering engine, but many other stand-alone applications will perform better than ever. For example, you can not run Outlook Express, FrontPage, and MS Money. "
Any application which lists Internet Explorer as a dependency will not work. Like say Quicken 2002.
Out of curiousity, when you were out at that 98lite.net site did you read the disclaimer about how this would break a lot of existing applications?
And you expect to promote this to consumers? Good luck.
Re:Facts for the Less Informed
on
Worst Buy
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· Score: 2
If these laws exist, you should have absolutely no problem quoting from them.
Give it a shot, it'll make your argument more forceful so that it doesn't look like you are distorting the facts.
Re:Facts for the Less Informed
on
Worst Buy
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· Score: 2
Consumer price protection laws only deal with intentional false advertisement of product. They exempt the retailer if the ad was simply a mistake...
I'm afraid you are distorting the facts.
Re:Once money changes hands, the contract is final
on
Worst Buy
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· Score: 2
Did money actually exchange hands? I see no mention of any customers credit cards actually being billed.
Re:From the BestBuy Website:
on
Worst Buy
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· Score: 2
Do you seriously consider a pricing mistake to be the equivalent of murder?
Weird.
Re:From the BestBuy Website:
on
Worst Buy
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· Score: 2
Well there we go. Best Buy has a disclaimer that addresses this issue.
Unless someone can prove that they advertised the product fraudulently, it seems like this issue is closed.
I will point out that Best Buy in their infancy did have some problems with fraudulent advertising, and was fined several times by different government agencies in Minnesota. But that's been at least 15 years ago, and those were back when they frequently advertised things for cheap and then took them off the sales floor so as to say they were out of stock. That's called Bait and Switch, and is illegal.
Re:CORBA is too heavy & EJB is too RMI/IIOP de
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Web Services
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· Score: 2
"Sure, it's a little wasteful on the bandwidth but it's flexable. "
The bandwidth issues can be mitigated by compressing the http stream as per the HTTP 1.1 spec.
Re:Microsoft blames hype for .net woes
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Web Services
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· Score: 2
My Services has very little to do with.Net or web services. It was simply an implementation using the technology.
Your interpretation would be akin to claiming nobody is interested in using the Web because boo.com failed.
I always love when you have someone complaining about the stupid people the government hires, who then goes on the state unequivocally that "PosgreSQL[sic] can do anything Oracle can."
Which website were you trying to view? Just kind of curious what web standard they were apparently violating.
Microsoft and Netscape will never release browsers that block ads... especially Microsoft. Not because they don't listen to consumers, but rather they're afraid of being sued for anti-trust violations by the p0rn industry.
Slashdot Mirror
That has got to be the lamest counter argument I've ever seen.
What's even lamer is the fact that instead of trying to counter it with logic you and your cronies decided instead to mod me down. Hmm, can't stand the truth I guess.
"What I mean is, if Microsoft can no longer 'force' OEM's to put only Windows on their computers, Linux has a good chance. "
That won't make a difference if there is no compelling reason to the user to have Linux installed.
"Primarily because its free so the OEM's would love to push it. "
OEM's aren't that stupid... the Consumers have to want it.
"This can only happen if the Justice Dept. dishes out a meaningful punishment to Microsoft."
What you want is already part of the settlement the DOJ has offered.
But regardless, I hate to break this to you, but watching the past 20 years the desktop race is over. Microsoft has won, and there is no way of changing that.
But at some point the desktop and server paradigm that we currently know will go away. If someone had a vision, they would start working towards that... and be there before Microsoft realizes it. That, my friend, is how you become dominant. That is what Microsoft essentially did with the PC over the larger systems.
The report didn't take into account that in 1990 in order to run Windows you also needed to purchase DOS.
It's interesting how the report not only ignores this but tries to use it as proof that Windows costs more. In Figure 1 they note the dramatic increase in the price of Windows 95 from Windows 3.1, but they don't point out that was because Win95 included a copy of DOS.
I will encourage you to try again, but unfortunately the facts don't support your claims.
HA! If anything your post is a troll.
Microsoft's products have consistently offered more for less to the consumer. The company clearly proves my point that it is the value and quality of the software that dominates in the market... not the marketing.
If this were not true, Microsoft would never have failures because it could throw it's marketing budget down and dominate. But we have seen numerous failures over the years... IE2, Bob, Win CE 1.0, Money and so forth. In many cases those failures turned into canceled product lines. In other cases they came back as a new version which learned from the mistakes and complaints of the critics.
The best product ALWAYS wins in the marketplace, and I'd like to see you argue otherwise. So far you troll, er I mean argument, is unconvincing and doesn't lot address the large number of exceptions.
The success of software has little to do with marketing plans. It really has nothing to do with conspiracies, sneaking it in the door, subversion, etc. The success relies solely upon what the software does and how well it does it. If it's cool enough, it will spread by word of mouth alone.
People don't care if the source is available... People don't care if it is licensed under the GPL.
People don't care if the software is free, but it is a really nice perk. They'll pay you for software which is cool, but they'll also more than happily download it if it's free. Especially when we go back to my first point, and the software does something unique and does it well. Look at the success of Napster, Kazaa, ZoneAlarms, etc. all available as free downloads.
If the software is already good, and cool, you won't need to be subversive.
So the answer is... Write better software. Software that does things that people want to do. Or maybe that can be simplified to "Build it, and they shall come." or some other cliche.
" It has actually gotten more expensive."
Prove this statement. I dare you.
Go back and check the price of the original DOS, the original Windows... Windows 95 and so on. The price of the OS has remained almost constant as long as I can remember.
Then if you go and compare the price of Microsoft's offerings to other comparable products in the industry you'll see software has gotten drastically cheaper because of Microsoft.
Why do the slashbot editors constantly complain about Microsoft, promote Linux...
But then get all defensive about software piracy?
Look... If you don't like Microsoft but do like Linux then USE LINUX! Sheesh, give up the hypocrisy of promoting Linux but using Windows for all your real work, it's old already. Use one or the other, but if you find Windows of value at least have the decency to pay for the product.
Agreed. That Casio watch shown is about the ugliest thing I've ever seen.
I'm surprised it doesn't use red LEDs.
I'll keep my Tissot, thanks.
I have a Tissot PR50, which is their bottom of the line. Pretty basic stainless steel case with a sapphire crystal and a nice quartz movement. Bought it at the height of the dot-bomb era from a place called newwatch.com for like 40% off. :)
:)
:)
First watch I've ever owned that has received "nice watch" comments from women.
I am definately considering buying this T-Touch. Although I haven't found any dot-bombs selling it for 40% off.
And yet it is the strip down version implemented by 98micro which the renegade states and all the slashbots are proposing Microsoft be forced to release.
What is interesting is that this contradicts one of the other proposed constraints, that being that Microsoft can't release a version of Windows that breaks third party products. Weird how the states and slashbots haven't thought through their remedies.
Can you do time based recording?
My understand with Tivo is that they removed that capability without subscription last year, so as to discourage people buying it as a VCR.
I agree with the other poster. I'll buy one of these DVR devices when by itself it will replace a VCR. If I want the subscription so I can get automated TV Guide, then maybe I'll consider that as well, but if I don't want it... I don't want it...
Yes, generally retailers will honor misprints for the first several people. But then they'll also publish a retraction, or post a notice on the door of the store. The difference here is that one person noticed this and then posted it on numerous websites "Hey Best Buy mismarked these video cards... Quick, go order one before they fix it."
So it's not as though people were upset because the product was been misprinted, they knew they were taking advantage of the store all along.
I've gotten many a bargain because of store mistakes. I once bought Visual C++ 4.0 Professional edition for $50 because it had been priced wrong. I didn't expect to get it at that price, I just pointed it out to the cashier and the manager reluctantly gave it to me. He also then went and pulled all other copies off the shelf to insure they were priced correctly.
Gee, Duh. Right there from the website.
"98micro completely removes all traces of the MS HTML engine (shdocvw.dll, and mshtml.dll). You will not have access to any of the proprietary Microsoft compressed help files, and you will not be able to run programs that rely on the MS HTML rendering engine, but many other stand-alone applications will perform better than ever. For example, you can not run Outlook Express, FrontPage, and MS Money. "
Any application which lists Internet Explorer as a dependency will not work. Like say Quicken 2002.
Out of curiousity, when you were out at that 98lite.net site did you read the disclaimer about how this would break a lot of existing applications?
And you expect to promote this to consumers? Good luck.
If these laws exist, you should have absolutely no problem quoting from them.
Give it a shot, it'll make your argument more forceful so that it doesn't look like you are distorting the facts.
Consumer price protection laws only deal with intentional false advertisement of product. They exempt the retailer if the ad was simply a mistake...
I'm afraid you are distorting the facts.
Did money actually exchange hands? I see no mention of any customers credit cards actually being billed.
Do you seriously consider a pricing mistake to be the equivalent of murder?
Weird.
Well there we go. Best Buy has a disclaimer that addresses this issue.
Unless someone can prove that they advertised the product fraudulently, it seems like this issue is closed.
I will point out that Best Buy in their infancy did have some problems with fraudulent advertising, and was fined several times by different government agencies in Minnesota. But that's been at least 15 years ago, and those were back when they frequently advertised things for cheap and then took them off the sales floor so as to say they were out of stock. That's called Bait and Switch, and is illegal.
"Sure, it's a little wasteful on the bandwidth but it's flexable. "
The bandwidth issues can be mitigated by compressing the http stream as per the HTTP 1.1 spec.
My Services has very little to do with .Net or web services. It was simply an implementation using the technology.
Your interpretation would be akin to claiming nobody is interested in using the Web because boo.com failed.
I always love when you have someone complaining about the stupid people the government hires, who then goes on the state unequivocally that "PosgreSQL[sic] can do anything Oracle can."
Kind of makes you wonder...
"XUL is very cool. Need a browser with no menus of buttons, as an interface to a web-based application for a control-freak client?"
Congratulations! You have now found the joy of doing something that Microsoft developers have taken for granted for at least the past 5 years.
"Now that the browser war has been won (by the bad guys, of course),"
Weird, I thought Netscape lost the browser war.
Which website were you trying to view? Just kind of curious what web standard they were apparently violating.
Microsoft and Netscape will never release browsers that block ads... especially Microsoft. Not because they don't listen to consumers, but rather they're afraid of being sued for anti-trust violations by the p0rn industry.