To add to the other replier... in many states not only can you get poked for possession of illicit drugs, but you can also get additionally poked if you have not paid the tax on them.
Point to the EULA all you want but the fact remains that State and Federal Law trump virtually any EULA.
It is illegal for people to do many things... sure doesn't stop them from doing it though.
It's kind of like a released convict out on parole... they act extra good during that time for fear of getting sent back to prison for doing any little thing wrong but instead on the whim of their parole officer... once that time is up, everything else is fair game again.
Same goes for Microsoft... despite the claims of some... Microsoft has been being extra good over the last few years to keep the DoJ from going after them again (ie for breaking the original agreement)... once the agreement has expired, it becomes quite difficult and expensive for the DoJ to be successful against Microsoft and get a conviction even with the previous history.
Interesting arguments and if true (which I still disagree with)... your arguments will all lose much of their weight on November 12th, 2007 when the DoJ vs MS settlement expires.
You seem to be saying that it is not ok for Microsoft do to things that other companies engage in... like Google, you know the company that will pay you a buck for having someone install FireFox whose default search provider is Google.
Pathetic.
Re:That's _exactly_ what we need...
on
Explorer Destroyer
·
· Score: 3, Insightful
> Why not? I have encountered numerous banners stating "We only support windows and internet explorer", or "your operating system/browser is not supported at this time".
Why not? Because it ends up with people who employ such tactics resorting to the same tactics that they complain about so much.
So it's ok for web sites to require FireFox but the moment they say that about IE it's suddenly wrong? No... It's hypocritical.
Last I checked, FireFox and OSS was about choice and forcing people to change sure seems to disregard choice and adds to the general perception of snobbery on the OSS side.
You accuse a poster of nativity and yet you make a statement like:
> Walmart isn't about fair competition. It is about monopolistic bullying. They can and do anything they want.
We've all heard the phrase "Jack of all trades, master of none"... Did you know that it pretty well describes Wal-Mart?
Sure they've often got many lower prices than competing stores and because of their bulk buying power can command even lower prices from manufacturers... that doesn't mean that they can do it all though.
I cannot speak for you... but when I end up going into Wal-Mart looking for something I usually end up being quite disappointed because I am looking for something very specific and they do not have it. Where do I find it? A specialty store.
Believe it or not that isn't very uncommon. While a grocery store stocks plenty of general food if you are looking for a specific cut of steak for instance, likely you'll have to go to a specialty butcher to get it instead.
Why is such a thing so surprising or so bad? Wal-Mart's inability to compete fully across the board leave huge opportunities for skilled people and companies to fill in those niches.
BTW... care to define 'fair competition' for the class?
> No positive argument can be made in its defense without resorting to logical fallacies.
So you are saying that it is a logical fallacy for me to state that: "Wal-Mart is good as it provides low prices to consumers and a wide selection of products in a single place" ? Explain.
If those workers believe that they are not being paid enough they are free to leave and get a job elsewhere, possibly for what they think they are worth. Don't gripe because they pay what they have found the market will bare.
> illegally locks its cleaning crews in the store at night,
Some stores did that yes... but was it a corporate policy or corporate wide occurrence? So a couple of poorly run stores means that the entire corporation is evil?
> illegally prevents unionization attempts by workers
Preventing the formation of control of a union is not always illegal. Let's not forget that Wal-Mart owns the jobs and gets to set the terms by which the employees get them... if the owner decides that they are being taken advantage of or abused it is their right to take action to prevent it... like preventing unionization... just as it is the right of the employees to leave if they don't like the way the company does business.
I guess I will respond to all three of you trolls at once, but I do have to say that I love it when people rant on about things they know nothing about.
Yes, calculating interest on a loan is a rather simple task.
Calculating interest on loans in two different ways because of the way that the two different banks do it is a little trickier without building logic along the lines of if(loanNum == 0) in.
Automatic updating of interest rates based on the 2 different indexes that the rates of these loans are based off of is a little trickier.
Adding in screen scraping to the mix to allow the app to automatically know when a payment has been posted is even more so.
There is a hell of a lot of work going on behind the hood of that site and I've only mentioned a fraction of it.
Sure, I went well overboard with my design, however ASP.NET lets me do that quite easily and when you actually examine all of the work I am doing within you come to realize that it is not only useful, but necessary too, but then I haven't discussed some of the other features. With any luck this extensive design could turn into some extra cash later.
Are you saying that there exist tools for LAMP that reach the level of integration and simplicity of debugging that can be achieved with Visual Studio 2005 with an ASP.NET application that is hitting a SQL 2005 Server?
Given that I had two legitimate copies of VS 2005 Pro (one through a costume contest and one through a launch event) it was an obvious choice for me for when I found LAMP not working the way I wanted.
You mean beta software didn't act as you would have expected it? Even perhaps having a bug? Amazing! Lets just see if it still acts that way later this year when it RTMs.
Why should dynamic content be obvious? There is far more to that site than meets the eye.
The current debt image is dynamically created daily to show the current debt load based on the each loans rates and the different ways both of the banks that have these loans calculate their interest.
To solve this problem I came up with a very object oriented solution that from what I learned later is well beyond what PHP is capable of in order to make it expandable, easy to maintain and clear in terms of readability.
Not price fixing eh? What do you call it then when bulk goods are priced differently in different markets and where the end price has no relation to the cost of production, transportation or sale?
I agree... but for a different reason: I'm surprised that this was not mentioned previously by the Microsoft camp in response to the traditional OSS claim of Apache and Linux running more web servers than Windows and IIS.
Yes... Call me crazy but I love Windows, IIS, ASP.NET and MS SQL.
Granted... I have limited experience with LAMP, when I set out to build my lil beg site back in January I tried doing it with LAMP for a time because of the cost savings that I'd have from hosting on Linux... unfortunately there were plenty of behind the scenes things that I just couldn't figure out and didn't have the time or desire to spend to make it work... so I backed off and did it under a pure Microsoft side and things came together quite smoothly.
My only regret is not yet getting enough traffic to my site, as well as having my Adsense account nuked.
Companies have been practicing price fixing for years based on location.
Don't believe me? Compare your cost of cable TV to people in other local cities.
This has also been the case for years with things like software, movies and textbooks where the producer will likely lower the price in some areas and raise it on others.
This is simple economics of pricing an item at what the market will bare. Don't like spending so much on a ____? Don't buy it then!
Your theory might hold some weight if there wasn't a huge market for counterfeit hardware, and other consumer goods. In such a case both the customer and the actual product maker end up losing because the customer doesn't have the product they thought they were buying and the actual producer's name gets tarnished if there are problems.
Microsoft like many has a major interest in eliminating this counterfeiting, not just so that they can make what they think they should but also enable customers not to get ripped off by unscrupulous system makers.
There is very little in the userland side of an operating system that cannot be easily removed... likely this will be the same, they just won't provide a mechanism or instructions on how to remove it.
With some time and testing it would be possible to come up with a diff of both before and after its installation and come up with manual removal process... Sure it can be beaten, but I doubt this method is meant to be impenetrable from the l33t hax0rs of the world, instead they are trying to stop casual piracy and those who unknowingly purchases illegal copies of Windows.
Linux is POSIX-compliant? No it's not... it implements a number of things from the standard but is by no means compliant with it.
If you are going to claim that the Linux implementation makes it compliant than you should extend a similar courtesy to Microsoft's POSIX implementations.
Slashdot Mirror
To add to the other replier... in many states not only can you get poked for possession of illicit drugs, but you can also get additionally poked if you have not paid the tax on them.
Point to the EULA all you want but the fact remains that State and Federal Law trump virtually any EULA.
It is illegal for people to do many things... sure doesn't stop them from doing it though.
It's kind of like a released convict out on parole... they act extra good during that time for fear of getting sent back to prison for doing any little thing wrong but instead on the whim of their parole officer... once that time is up, everything else is fair game again.
Same goes for Microsoft... despite the claims of some... Microsoft has been being extra good over the last few years to keep the DoJ from going after them again (ie for breaking the original agreement)... once the agreement has expired, it becomes quite difficult and expensive for the DoJ to be successful against Microsoft and get a conviction even with the previous history.
Interesting arguments and if true (which I still disagree with)... your arguments will all lose much of their weight on November 12th, 2007 when the DoJ vs MS settlement expires.
That shall be an interesting day.
FireFox may not be a Google product however Google will pay you for having other people install it.
You seem to be saying that it is not ok for Microsoft do to things that other companies engage in... like Google, you know the company that will pay you a buck for having someone install FireFox whose default search provider is Google.
Pathetic.
> Why not? I have encountered numerous banners stating "We only support windows and internet explorer", or "your operating system/browser is not supported at this time".
Why not? Because it ends up with people who employ such tactics resorting to the same tactics that they complain about so much.
So it's ok for web sites to require FireFox but the moment they say that about IE it's suddenly wrong? No... It's hypocritical.
Last I checked, FireFox and OSS was about choice and forcing people to change sure seems to disregard choice and adds to the general perception of snobbery on the OSS side.
Such? Grrr.
Such it Blue!... errr Suck it Sony!
Granted we shouldn't be taking pleasure in the legal issues of such a large company... it is nice to see their business model faltering even more.
First the rootkit now this, the question in my mind is now: "What will be next?"
You accuse a poster of nativity and yet you make a statement like:
> Walmart isn't about fair competition. It is about monopolistic bullying. They can and do anything they want.
We've all heard the phrase "Jack of all trades, master of none"... Did you know that it pretty well describes Wal-Mart?
Sure they've often got many lower prices than competing stores and because of their bulk buying power can command even lower prices from manufacturers... that doesn't mean that they can do it all though.
I cannot speak for you... but when I end up going into Wal-Mart looking for something I usually end up being quite disappointed because I am looking for something very specific and they do not have it. Where do I find it? A specialty store.
Believe it or not that isn't very uncommon. While a grocery store stocks plenty of general food if you are looking for a specific cut of steak for instance, likely you'll have to go to a specialty butcher to get it instead.
Why is such a thing so surprising or so bad? Wal-Mart's inability to compete fully across the board leave huge opportunities for skilled people and companies to fill in those niches.
BTW... care to define 'fair competition' for the class?
> No positive argument can be made in its defense without resorting to logical fallacies.
So you are saying that it is a logical fallacy for me to state that: "Wal-Mart is good as it provides low prices to consumers and a wide selection of products in a single place" ? Explain.
> A corporation that underpays its workers,
If those workers believe that they are not being paid enough they are free to leave and get a job elsewhere, possibly for what they think they are worth. Don't gripe because they pay what they have found the market will bare.
> illegally locks its cleaning crews in the store at night,
Some stores did that yes... but was it a corporate policy or corporate wide occurrence? So a couple of poorly run stores means that the entire corporation is evil?
> illegally prevents unionization attempts by workers
Preventing the formation of control of a union is not always illegal. Let's not forget that Wal-Mart owns the jobs and gets to set the terms by which the employees get them... if the owner decides that they are being taken advantage of or abused it is their right to take action to prevent it... like preventing unionization... just as it is the right of the employees to leave if they don't like the way the company does business.
I'm forced to agree with the grandparent... care to name specific gripes about Wal-Mart?
I guess I will respond to all three of you trolls at once, but I do have to say that I love it when people rant on about things they know nothing about.
Yes, calculating interest on a loan is a rather simple task.
Calculating interest on loans in two different ways because of the way that the two different banks do it is a little trickier without building logic along the lines of if(loanNum == 0) in.
Automatic updating of interest rates based on the 2 different indexes that the rates of these loans are based off of is a little trickier.
Adding in screen scraping to the mix to allow the app to automatically know when a payment has been posted is even more so.
There is a hell of a lot of work going on behind the hood of that site and I've only mentioned a fraction of it.
Sure, I went well overboard with my design, however ASP.NET lets me do that quite easily and when you actually examine all of the work I am doing within you come to realize that it is not only useful, but necessary too, but then I haven't discussed some of the other features. With any luck this extensive design could turn into some extra cash later.
You have completely missed my quite clear point and as a result I am not going to continue this debate.
WAMP doesn't do ASP.NET very well, nor does a high end development tool like Visual Studio 2005 integrate well with it.
Are you saying that there exist tools for LAMP that reach the level of integration and simplicity of debugging that can be achieved with Visual Studio 2005 with an ASP.NET application that is hitting a SQL 2005 Server?
Given that I had two legitimate copies of VS 2005 Pro (one through a costume contest and one through a launch event) it was an obvious choice for me for when I found LAMP not working the way I wanted.
You mean beta software didn't act as you would have expected it? Even perhaps having a bug? Amazing! Lets just see if it still acts that way later this year when it RTMs.
Why should dynamic content be obvious? There is far more to that site than meets the eye.
The current debt image is dynamically created daily to show the current debt load based on the each loans rates and the different ways both of the banks that have these loans calculate their interest.
To solve this problem I came up with a very object oriented solution that from what I learned later is well beyond what PHP is capable of in order to make it expandable, easy to maintain and clear in terms of readability.
Not price fixing eh? What do you call it then when bulk goods are priced differently in different markets and where the end price has no relation to the cost of production, transportation or sale?
I agree... but for a different reason: I'm surprised that this was not mentioned previously by the Microsoft camp in response to the traditional OSS claim of Apache and Linux running more web servers than Windows and IIS.
Yes... Call me crazy but I love Windows, IIS, ASP.NET and MS SQL.
Granted... I have limited experience with LAMP, when I set out to build my lil beg site back in January I tried doing it with LAMP for a time because of the cost savings that I'd have from hosting on Linux... unfortunately there were plenty of behind the scenes things that I just couldn't figure out and didn't have the time or desire to spend to make it work... so I backed off and did it under a pure Microsoft side and things came together quite smoothly.
My only regret is not yet getting enough traffic to my site, as well as having my Adsense account nuked.
Companies have been practicing price fixing for years based on location.
Don't believe me? Compare your cost of cable TV to people in other local cities.
This has also been the case for years with things like software, movies and textbooks where the producer will likely lower the price in some areas and raise it on others.
This is simple economics of pricing an item at what the market will bare. Don't like spending so much on a ____? Don't buy it then!
Sorry... but you are quite wrong.
Your theory might hold some weight if there wasn't a huge market for counterfeit hardware, and other consumer goods. In such a case both the customer and the actual product maker end up losing because the customer doesn't have the product they thought they were buying and the actual producer's name gets tarnished if there are problems.
Microsoft like many has a major interest in eliminating this counterfeiting, not just so that they can make what they think they should but also enable customers not to get ripped off by unscrupulous system makers.
There is very little in the userland side of an operating system that cannot be easily removed... likely this will be the same, they just won't provide a mechanism or instructions on how to remove it.
With some time and testing it would be possible to come up with a diff of both before and after its installation and come up with manual removal process... Sure it can be beaten, but I doubt this method is meant to be impenetrable from the l33t hax0rs of the world, instead they are trying to stop casual piracy and those who unknowingly purchases illegal copies of Windows.
Linux is POSIX-compliant? No it's not... it implements a number of things from the standard but is by no means compliant with it.
If you are going to claim that the Linux implementation makes it compliant than you should extend a similar courtesy to Microsoft's POSIX implementations.
Both have some, but no where near all.