How about folks just use the best products they can find from whatever company sells them and leave the politcal crap for those individuals who place politics over practicality?
The Great Depression had a full third of the workforce out of work. Thats 33% unemployment. Right now we're under 6% unemployment. Is there anything else you like to exaggerate about?
Well the more money a CEO makes the more the government gets to take away in taxes which is then used for those in society who need it (or at least partly) so its not the total moral crime you make it out to be.
You just don't want to put salary caps on anyone since that would really hurt the motivation to create wealth/companies and thus jobs for the economy. Everything is indirectly connected to something else. Nothing is an island, not even a CEO's paycheck.
Actually its the customers who keep the company running, seeing as how thats where all the money your company pays you comes from.
Also, was there something wrong with waiting till you had all the money you needed to buy the car? Did you have to lease it? (I'm assuming thats what you did)
I know you are shocked to learn what Americans tolerate in their economy but let us tell you we are equally shocked to see what Europeans tolerate in thiers as well. I have to admit I am paraphrasing an earlier poster who said something like: "You (meaning Europeans) may value job security, but we value the more important job availability". Its only fair to point out that Germany has DOUBLE DIGIT levels of unemployment. Thats a big deal. Whats the point of someone having a job if EVERYONE can't get a job?
Its very difficult to tell the average laborer of any nation that less job protections, after job protections have reached a human level of course and they are human in the US, are better for them than more protections. Companies and thus the industries they make up need to be flexible and nimble in response to changing economic conditions. When the economy slows down, companies need to trim their budges and the usual way to do that is to layoff people. There's nothing sinful about it. What would be sinful would be to keep them employed even when they aren't needed at the expense of the future health of the company. Its a matter of do you want 5%-60% of a company laid off or 100%? If you restrict the firing practices of corporations you end up with less overall economic activity and much higher rates of unemployment. Even during the lightning quick recession over here unemployment was very low and as of March 2002 its at 5.7 percent nationwide. Frankly as an American I just don't understand how Europeans can tolerate so many individuals being out of work and making the situation even worse by giving unions so much power and writing very silly anti-business laws such as the 35 hour workweek in France.
Oh and the fact that in the US most people are employed "at-will" meaning a company can fire you when it needs/wants to as long as its not discriminatory.
Well you may be appalled but our way does have its benefits. You'd have to weigh the lesser job security with the fact that since we're all at will employees most of the times, companies can respond to downturns by downsizing much quicker than your average European company can thus making our economy more nimble, responsive and flexible. Its in large part why the US has such a low national unemployment rate. (5.7% as of March 2002.).
Well what electricians do can actually be dangerous to someone's life. You don't want just anybody wiring a building or house that could overheat and cause a fire or short and ignite something.
Progammers on the other hand, overwhelmingly do not work on such life and death projects and when they do, special situational insurance is deployed to cover the risk.
I'd like to take issue with the notion that just because you love what you're doing that you'll be any good at it. You could love something very much and still suck at it. On the other hand it could be just a job to someone who nontheless is brilliant at it.
The deal with superhero's is they lead exciting complicated lives. Its Drama. People like it.
As to humans, of course humans could be easily topped out on the food chain. Homo superior could be as simple as a homo sapien genetically enginered with superior intelligence or an extremely long life span or incredible regenerative capabilities. It doesn't take something extraordinary like laser beam eyes or anything.
People work on demand because they have to not because they want to. Its not like everyone is rich or fortunate enough to own their own business or get a cushy academic job with lots of freedom.
You list a lot of things that seem to be no fault of the people themselves, but then again is that truly the case?
Plenty of people are piss poor when it comes to planning their own lives.
Plenty of people if given a million dollars would be broke the next year.
Plenty of people can figure out how to screw up a well paying job that includes all sorts of benefits others would kill for.
Plenty of people have criminal records that prevent them from getting any type of gainful employment.
Plenty of people simply expect a wonderful job and career to be waiting for them after they graduate college just because "Its supposed to be there, duh!"
Plenty of people simply do not know how to handle or react to changing times without taking it personally.
Plenty of people spend way beyond their means just to simply keep up with the Jonses.
Plenty of people are too proud or too stupid to move back in with their parents when they lose their jobs or when money is tight.
The list could go on and on as I'm sure yours could. People get hired and fired on a daily basis. There is no problem here. Its how an economy works. I'm sorry you can't find anymore lifetime jobs like your friends from the Depression era but that was a long time and a different world ago. The role of business was never to provide lifetime or even extended periods of employment. Whats wrong with asking the person to manage their own financies and career as he/she moves from job to job?
Whats wrong with genetically modified foods? I understand some people with food alergies need to be wary but what about those of us who have no food alergies at all to begin with? A lot of food in the US is all ready GM, it tastes the same or better so why not eat it?
Thats this month's unemployment figures. The current rate for March 2002 is 5.7% unemployment nationwide.
When I said they would hire you, I said "should they need you". Thats the important part. If they aren't hiring you, then THEY DON'T NEED YOU. Your degree and experience are irrelevant. You feel they entitle you to something. Too bad. You also say companies shouldn't pull the rug out from under a man's feet who is providing for his family and doing a good job. Well anything else you wanna dictate to the business world? Let me review something for you; Simply being a good worker and doing whats expected of you as a family man, husband or father is not enough. If the company no longer needs you, then they no longer need you. Thats how it works. Am I supposed to buy your company's products because you need a paycheck? Because thats what it comes down to. If customers slow down in their buying, then companies contract in the workforce to cut down on costs until the economy picks up again. None of this is beyond the mose RUDIMENTARY of economics. There's no "rights or wrongs" here just life. Deal with it.
You say you got eight years in your chosen profession that you don't want to throw away? Tough shit. Some people have 15, 20, 30 years in their various professions and when those professions no longer pay off they have to change careers/fields as well. You do what you have to do to survive, and to make sure your family survives. If that means you have to go back to night school to get training in another field be it commercial trucking, waste management, transportation...etc whatever then you do so. You either do it or starve/go homeless, its up to you really. Sounds like you need a big heaping serving of humble pie.
Alright, maybe you didn't have it good during the good times. I'll give you that. But how have you managed your life since you left school? When did you decide to have kids? How much money did you have in the bank when you made that choice? Did you really expect your job to be there until you retire? I was born in 1980 and even I long ago figured out that no one remains in the same job for 25 years anymore. Why is this news to you?
You keep saying its business's fault for this situation. You make it sound like if only they didn't fire anyone, everything would be alright. Do you think companies have unlimited amounts of money? You want them to keep everyone employed even during economic downturns just to keep you in a good situation. Well thats great. What are you going to do when the entire corporation goes out of business because it was unable to cut costs when it needed to? Now instead of laying off a few hundred or a few thousand, the entire workforce now has to look for new jobs. Some comanies employ hundreds of thousands of people. Would you like to see 200,000 out of work just because no one wanted them to lay off 30,000 a year or two ago? THIS IS WHY COMPANIES LAY OFF WHEN BUSINESS SLOWS DOWN. TO STAY IN BUSINESS. Of course the shareholders and top executives continue to make a ton of money. But thats largely irrelevant. There's no point to being a shareholder or executive unless there's a large financial benefit in return. Their job is to keep the company running in the long run and that means making difficult and sometimes unpopular decisions in the short term. For the regular joe/worker bee, thats TOUGH SHIT, deal.
Now I'll respond to some of the points you made in another posting that wasn't directed to me but I saw it anyway.
It sounds like you believed in some kind of strange dream that goes like this: 'Study hard in school and graduate, get good job that will be around for my entire career while raising family in stable neighborhood, retire after 25-30 years with wonderful pension, die happy after sending all kids to college with your own money.' Am I close to what your original dream was? Or far off base? Well in any case, Men Plan GAWD Laughs! Have you never heard of economic volitility? Did you not notice there was a tech stock bubble going on for the last 5 years? Did you do anything to get ready? Do you somehow find the concept of the gentrification of neighborhoods new? I don't know why, its been going on since time began. People get better jobs they move to better neighborhoods, then others lose their jobs and have to move to worse ones. Tax bases get disrupted. Life goes on.
Now you want some honest advice? Get out of the technology sector. I don't think you have the stamina or will for it. You don't even sound emotionally stable. The technology sector is a constant treadmill. There's new products and technologies coming down the pipeline every 6 to 12 months and you've got to at the very least decided if they are worth learning and if so, you've got to set aside the time. All the while you've got to maintain your level of performance at your job and in your family life. Not everyone can do it. Just because you can get a degree in the field does not mean you're up to it. There are easier ways to make money in the world. Techonology can be a hobby for you, you never have to leave it completley. But no one said you have to kill yourself to stay in it. Think about it before posting a response. Think long and hard.
I know you're trying to make it sound like we're at tragic amounts of unemployment but its just not the case. The national unemployment rate is still under 6%, at last projection it was actually at 5.5%, and the tech sector unemployment rate is lower still. Be that as it may, in tough times its HARDER TO GET HIRED. Stop expecting jobs to be handed to you simply because you are qualified. What part of "Should they need you they will hire you" did you not understand?
For your friend who couldn't get the bookstore job, he told them too much. You don't tell a friggin retail manager that you have all those fancy degrees that obviously not only will make him/her feel stupid, but will highlight that you are only taking this job to pay the bills and absolutely WILL jump ship when times get better.
"Businesses have no responsibility anymore. Just hire and fire whenever they feel like it. Pay a non-living wage. Work people 60 hours a week. Cut benefits. Increase overtime (on salary of course) and make people as miserable as possible while they are there... until they are fired. This isn't just one opinion. There are thousands of people out there, many of which have been sitting unemployed for OVER A YEAR NOW. The economy is recovering. WHERE'S THE JOBS? NEWSFLASH: THERE AREN'T ANY."
Of course there are thousands of people out there who have been unemployed for a while. WE ARE A NATION OF 280 MILLION PEOPLE, HELLO!??!!?. As for corporate responsibility, just take a look over in Europe. Most European nations have strict rules/laws against massive layoffs, the unions are strong and powerful and the simple process of firing someone can be arduous at best. The result? Nearly every European has a higher rate of unemployment vs. the US. Double digit unemployment. Is that what you want? Companies that have the flexibility to contract or expand at will lead to nimble industries. Nimble industries lead to healthy and more robust economies, economies such as the one the United States has.
Now I am sorry you don't have a job. But the sky is not falling. Either change your tactice, or change your profession/field/industry, whatever. Do what you need to do to survive and when you get lucky once again this time set yourself up so that you will be financially independent sooner than later, because I am betting that at one time you had a nice phat paying techie job yet handled the money in perhaps not the most responsible mannner.
Oh shut your mouth. Business does not exist for the sole purpose of keeping you employed. They exist to profit from selling products. Should they need you they will hire you. During times of slow sales all comapnies layoff and stop hiring. You want a job? Start buying some stuff.
It is very very very easy to find websites that support your own views and beliefs on the internet. You spend perhaps one day or one week finding such websites then you bookmark them and those become your favorite sites. This is all the mental effort one has to expend. How is this any different from turning to your favorite channel on the television? If one is a conservative and watches TV all they have to do is turn on the FOXNews network. If they are online instead of in front of the tube all they have to do is enter www.foxnews.com into their browsers.
When and where does motivation to "investigate more" on the internet come from? You said the internet makes people "think more". Thats great speculation but can you back it up with any fact? A study perhaps? Or is it just anecdotal evidence? Whats even worse is the internet may simply be filled with vocal people who merely think they are more intellectually active than the TV viewing public but are actually just as mush brained.
Ranting on Slashdot, or K5 or whatever blog does not make you superior to people who watch TV. Just different.
Re:back in 1995
on
On Hacktivism
·
· Score: 2, Insightful
Responsibility? Well I'd guess you'd have to assume that porn in general is just plain bad for children. Just seeing naked people getting busy is going to mess them up right? Well not everyone agrees. So don't try to claim the moral high ground or assume we're all up there with you if you do.
How about some evidence that GM crops or hormone injected beef is actually unhealthy for you. If the governments of both the US and Europe see fit to let people eat it, then why should a group of malcontents in Europe be able to interefer in the commerce of GM/homeone injected foods in their region?
Re:Go Hacktivism, Down with TV
on
On Hacktivism
·
· Score: 1
Its kind of funny that you mention TV is possibly addictive and then in your advice you tell people to go smoke some weed.
Slashdot Mirror
How about folks just use the best products they can find from whatever company sells them and leave the politcal crap for those individuals who place politics over practicality?
LOL. That was the funniest thing I've read in a long time. Thanks.
The Great Depression had a full third of the workforce out of work. Thats 33% unemployment. Right now we're under 6% unemployment. Is there anything else you like to exaggerate about?
Well the more money a CEO makes the more the government gets to take away in taxes which is then used for those in society who need it (or at least partly) so its not the total moral crime you make it out to be.
You just don't want to put salary caps on anyone since that would really hurt the motivation to create wealth/companies and thus jobs for the economy. Everything is indirectly connected to something else. Nothing is an island, not even a CEO's paycheck.
Oh yeah thats real smart. Open yourself up to both financial litigation and criminal investigation just to get back at your boss.
Actually its the customers who keep the company running, seeing as how thats where all the money your company pays you comes from.
Also, was there something wrong with waiting till you had all the money you needed to buy the car? Did you have to lease it? (I'm assuming thats what you did)
I know you are shocked to learn what Americans tolerate in their economy but let us tell you we are equally shocked to see what Europeans tolerate in thiers as well. I have to admit I am paraphrasing an earlier poster who said something like: "You (meaning Europeans) may value job security, but we value the more important job availability". Its only fair to point out that Germany has DOUBLE DIGIT levels of unemployment. Thats a big deal. Whats the point of someone having a job if EVERYONE can't get a job?
Its very difficult to tell the average laborer of any nation that less job protections, after job protections have reached a human level of course and they are human in the US, are better for them than more protections. Companies and thus the industries they make up need to be flexible and nimble in response to changing economic conditions. When the economy slows down, companies need to trim their budges and the usual way to do that is to layoff people. There's nothing sinful about it. What would be sinful would be to keep them employed even when they aren't needed at the expense of the future health of the company. Its a matter of do you want 5%-60% of a company laid off or 100%? If you restrict the firing practices of corporations you end up with less overall economic activity and much higher rates of unemployment. Even during the lightning quick recession over here unemployment was very low and as of March 2002 its at 5.7 percent nationwide. Frankly as an American I just don't understand how Europeans can tolerate so many individuals being out of work and making the situation even worse by giving unions so much power and writing very silly anti-business laws such as the 35 hour workweek in France.
Oh and the fact that in the US most people are employed "at-will" meaning a company can fire you when it needs/wants to as long as its not discriminatory.
If Europe's problems aren't what the guy said they were then what are the real problems over there? I'm genuinely interested in knowing.
Well you may be appalled but our way does have its benefits. You'd have to weigh the lesser job security with the fact that since we're all at will employees most of the times, companies can respond to downturns by downsizing much quicker than your average European company can thus making our economy more nimble, responsive and flexible. Its in large part why the US has such a low national unemployment rate. (5.7% as of March 2002.).
Well what electricians do can actually be dangerous to someone's life. You don't want just anybody wiring a building or house that could overheat and cause a fire or short and ignite something.
Progammers on the other hand, overwhelmingly do not work on such life and death projects and when they do, special situational insurance is deployed to cover the risk.
I'd like to take issue with the notion that just because you love what you're doing that you'll be any good at it. You could love something very much and still suck at it. On the other hand it could be just a job to someone who nontheless is brilliant at it.
The deal with superhero's is they lead exciting complicated lives. Its Drama. People like it.
As to humans, of course humans could be easily topped out on the food chain. Homo superior could be as simple as a homo sapien genetically enginered with superior intelligence or an extremely long life span or incredible regenerative capabilities. It doesn't take something extraordinary like laser beam eyes or anything.
I'd take the powers over being loved and having to love any day.
People work on demand because they have to not because they want to. Its not like everyone is rich or fortunate enough to own their own business or get a cushy academic job with lots of freedom.
Yeah cause people in the rest of the world are just so much more generous than Americans.
You list a lot of things that seem to be no fault of the people themselves, but then again is that truly the case?
Plenty of people are piss poor when it comes to planning their own lives.
Plenty of people if given a million dollars would be broke the next year.
Plenty of people can figure out how to screw up a well paying job that includes all sorts of benefits others would kill for.
Plenty of people have criminal records that prevent them from getting any type of gainful employment.
Plenty of people simply expect a wonderful job and career to be waiting for them after they graduate college just because "Its supposed to be there, duh!"
Plenty of people simply do not know how to handle or react to changing times without taking it personally.
Plenty of people spend way beyond their means just to simply keep up with the Jonses.
Plenty of people are too proud or too stupid to move back in with their parents when they lose their jobs or when money is tight.
The list could go on and on as I'm sure yours could. People get hired and fired on a daily basis. There is no problem here. Its how an economy works. I'm sorry you can't find anymore lifetime jobs like your friends from the Depression era but that was a long time and a different world ago. The role of business was never to provide lifetime or even extended periods of employment. Whats wrong with asking the person to manage their own financies and career as he/she moves from job to job?
Whats wrong with genetically modified foods? I understand some people with food alergies need to be wary but what about those of us who have no food alergies at all to begin with? A lot of food in the US is all ready GM, it tastes the same or better so why not eat it?
http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.nr0.htm
Thats this month's unemployment figures. The current rate for March 2002 is 5.7% unemployment nationwide.
When I said they would hire you, I said "should they need you". Thats the important part. If they aren't hiring you, then THEY DON'T NEED YOU. Your degree and experience are irrelevant. You feel they entitle you to something. Too bad. You also say companies shouldn't pull the rug out from under a man's feet who is providing for his family and doing a good job. Well anything else you wanna dictate to the business world? Let me review something for you; Simply being a good worker and doing whats expected of you as a family man, husband or father is not enough. If the company no longer needs you, then they no longer need you. Thats how it works. Am I supposed to buy your company's products because you need a paycheck? Because thats what it comes down to. If customers slow down in their buying, then companies contract in the workforce to cut down on costs until the economy picks up again. None of this is beyond the mose RUDIMENTARY of economics. There's no "rights or wrongs" here just life. Deal with it.
You say you got eight years in your chosen profession that you don't want to throw away? Tough shit. Some people have 15, 20, 30 years in their various professions and when those professions no longer pay off they have to change careers/fields as well. You do what you have to do to survive, and to make sure your family survives. If that means you have to go back to night school to get training in another field be it commercial trucking, waste management, transportation...etc whatever then you do so. You either do it or starve/go homeless, its up to you really. Sounds like you need a big heaping serving of humble pie.
Alright, maybe you didn't have it good during the good times. I'll give you that. But how have you managed your life since you left school? When did you decide to have kids? How much money did you have in the bank when you made that choice? Did you really expect your job to be there until you retire? I was born in 1980 and even I long ago figured out that no one remains in the same job for 25 years anymore. Why is this news to you?
You keep saying its business's fault for this situation. You make it sound like if only they didn't fire anyone, everything would be alright. Do you think companies have unlimited amounts of money? You want them to keep everyone employed even during economic downturns just to keep you in a good situation. Well thats great. What are you going to do when the entire corporation goes out of business because it was unable to cut costs when it needed to? Now instead of laying off a few hundred or a few thousand, the entire workforce now has to look for new jobs. Some comanies employ hundreds of thousands of people. Would you like to see 200,000 out of work just because no one wanted them to lay off 30,000 a year or two ago? THIS IS WHY COMPANIES LAY OFF WHEN BUSINESS SLOWS DOWN. TO STAY IN BUSINESS. Of course the shareholders and top executives continue to make a ton of money. But thats largely irrelevant. There's no point to being a shareholder or executive unless there's a large financial benefit in return. Their job is to keep the company running in the long run and that means making difficult and sometimes unpopular decisions in the short term. For the regular joe/worker bee, thats TOUGH SHIT, deal.
Now I'll respond to some of the points you made in another posting that wasn't directed to me but I saw it anyway.
It sounds like you believed in some kind of strange dream that goes like this: 'Study hard in school and graduate, get good job that will be around for my entire career while raising family in stable neighborhood, retire after 25-30 years with wonderful pension, die happy after sending all kids to college with your own money.' Am I close to what your original dream was? Or far off base? Well in any case, Men Plan GAWD Laughs! Have you never heard of economic volitility? Did you not notice there was a tech stock bubble going on for the last 5 years? Did you do anything to get ready? Do you somehow find the concept of the gentrification of neighborhoods new? I don't know why, its been going on since time began. People get better jobs they move to better neighborhoods, then others lose their jobs and have to move to worse ones. Tax bases get disrupted. Life goes on.
Now you want some honest advice? Get out of the technology sector. I don't think you have the stamina or will for it. You don't even sound emotionally stable. The technology sector is a constant treadmill. There's new products and technologies coming down the pipeline every 6 to 12 months and you've got to at the very least decided if they are worth learning and if so, you've got to set aside the time. All the while you've got to maintain your level of performance at your job and in your family life. Not everyone can do it. Just because you can get a degree in the field does not mean you're up to it. There are easier ways to make money in the world. Techonology can be a hobby for you, you never have to leave it completley. But no one said you have to kill yourself to stay in it. Think about it before posting a response. Think long and hard.
I know you're trying to make it sound like we're at tragic amounts of unemployment but its just not the case. The national unemployment rate is still under 6%, at last projection it was actually at 5.5%, and the tech sector unemployment rate is lower still. Be that as it may, in tough times its HARDER TO GET HIRED. Stop expecting jobs to be handed to you simply because you are qualified. What part of "Should they need you they will hire you" did you not understand?
For your friend who couldn't get the bookstore job, he told them too much. You don't tell a friggin retail manager that you have all those fancy degrees that obviously not only will make him/her feel stupid, but will highlight that you are only taking this job to pay the bills and absolutely WILL jump ship when times get better.
"Businesses have no responsibility anymore. Just hire and fire whenever they feel like it. Pay a non-living wage. Work people 60 hours a week. Cut benefits. Increase overtime (on salary of course) and make people as miserable as possible while they are there... until they are fired.
This isn't just one opinion. There are thousands of people out there, many of which have been sitting unemployed for OVER A YEAR NOW. The economy is recovering. WHERE'S THE JOBS? NEWSFLASH: THERE AREN'T ANY."
Of course there are thousands of people out there who have been unemployed for a while. WE ARE A NATION OF 280 MILLION PEOPLE, HELLO!??!!?. As for corporate responsibility, just take a look over in Europe. Most European nations have strict rules/laws against massive layoffs, the unions are strong and powerful and the simple process of firing someone can be arduous at best. The result? Nearly every European has a higher rate of unemployment vs. the US. Double digit unemployment. Is that what you want? Companies that have the flexibility to contract or expand at will lead to nimble industries. Nimble industries lead to healthy and more robust economies, economies such as the one the United States has.
Now I am sorry you don't have a job. But the sky is not falling. Either change your tactice, or change your profession/field/industry, whatever. Do what you need to do to survive and when you get lucky once again this time set yourself up so that you will be financially independent sooner than later, because I am betting that at one time you had a nice phat paying techie job yet handled the money in perhaps not the most responsible mannner.
Oh shut your mouth. Business does not exist for the sole purpose of keeping you employed. They exist to profit from selling products. Should they need you they will hire you. During times of slow sales all comapnies layoff and stop hiring. You want a job? Start buying some stuff.
It is very very very easy to find websites that support your own views and beliefs on the internet. You spend perhaps one day or one week finding such websites then you bookmark them and those become your favorite sites. This is all the mental effort one has to expend. How is this any different from turning to your favorite channel on the television? If one is a conservative and watches TV all they have to do is turn on the FOXNews network. If they are online instead of in front of the tube all they have to do is enter www.foxnews.com into their browsers.
When and where does motivation to "investigate more" on the internet come from? You said the internet makes people "think more". Thats great speculation but can you back it up with any fact? A study perhaps? Or is it just anecdotal evidence? Whats even worse is the internet may simply be filled with vocal people who merely think they are more intellectually active than the TV viewing public but are actually just as mush brained.
Ranting on Slashdot, or K5 or whatever blog does not make you superior to people who watch TV. Just different.
100,000 per bomb isn't enough anymore.
Responsibility? Well I'd guess you'd have to assume that porn in general is just plain bad for children. Just seeing naked people getting busy is going to mess them up right? Well not everyone agrees. So don't try to claim the moral high ground or assume we're all up there with you if you do.
How about some evidence that GM crops or hormone injected beef is actually unhealthy for you. If the governments of both the US and Europe see fit to let people eat it, then why should a group of malcontents in Europe be able to interefer in the commerce of GM/homeone injected foods in their region?
Its kind of funny that you mention TV is possibly addictive and then in your advice you tell people to go smoke some weed.