I totally agree with you. I have yet to see a window manager that even comes close to Enlightenment.
Lack of remember settings in Sawfish is a major hit toward my willingness to use it. Metacity is dumbdowncity. All the window managers that only have Send window left or right royally suck. I want to Send to X not repeatedly Send to Left/Right/Up/Down.
MORI's Field day in Oklahoma City
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Field Day 2002
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· Score: 1
I(KD5AMC) am a member of MORI and we are having a field day tomorrow. The public is welcome to join in. It will start at around 9am. You can find directions at http://www.qsl.net/mori/
Re:Binary Distros Are Dead
on
Is RPM Doomed?
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· Score: 1
I agree with your statements. It may have been something simple and may have been fixed in a newer release, but I was already not impressed with Sourcer, so I didn't feel compelled to go farther.
Re:Binary Distros Are Dead
on
Is RPM Doomed?
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· Score: 1
As for you statement about never going back, ha. I tried Sourcer before it broke up and about half way through the compile it didn't resolve some dependecy for the compile right and died. I went right back to RedHat outside of VMware.
I have thought about using Gentoo. I am not that impressed with the ideas behind it's package management(I am not talking about the parts that download source). The biggest problem I forsee with switching to Gentoo(and just about any other distribution from RedHat) is the lack of automatic support I would instantly get Alot of developers, in the since that Many provide RedHat rpms. Otherwise I have to download source and mangle that in with whatever package building solution Gentoo uses in that case. The second biggest is how many packages doesn't Gentoo include in it's emerge repository? As many as RedHat? Almost as many as RedHat? Half as many as RedHat? More than RedHat?
Re:Here's the long and short of it:
on
Gnome 2.0 RC1
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· Score: 1
Uh, viewports are a function of the window manager. I know KDE's tightly integrated window manager doesn't support them, but they have been talked about as a possible feature in future versions. As for not being it know to, I don't know where you get that idea. Metacity doesn't have them, but Metacity isn't Gnome2. There is a port of sawfish to Gnome2 in the works, as far as I know it will have viewports. Personally I think the author of Metacity is on crack, tho he seems to think everyone else is. If you really want to get down to the point it is more a matter of how well replacing the window manager works between Gnome and KDE. There are just more window managers that play nice with Gnome than there are that do with KDE, mostly because of how tightly KDE intregrates it's window manager.
Personally I can't stand any of the standard Gnome window managers with their totally clunky method of moving windows between desktops and viewports by the Send to X. I much prefer grab window and hot key. Enlighenment provides this functionality and many other very useful features I haven't found in any other window manager. I have in the past tried to get Enlightenment to work with KDE and found they don't work well together. I also found when I first tried Enlightenment and Gnome2 that they didn't work well together, but if I remember right last time I tried a Gnome2 beta they did work well together. I would have probably totally abandoned Gnome as a desktop except for two things. Mainly because of applets. They provide useful information and on panels can almost complete stay out of the way. Speaking of which, that is one nice thing about KDE, you can now have the panels totally hidden. Which I would use for my main panel. Though I would still require the option panels that showed a few pixels. The second thing, which I could probably live without, is the tasklist on the panel. There are other of getting similar functionality, but I really like the hiding ability, quick accessability, and all they provide. This is especially an issue because I like to maximize windows. I don't think I will give up that habit till monitors are Alot bigger.
Re:Here's the long and short of it:
on
Gnome 2.0 RC1
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· Score: 1
I agree with you on some points. Gnome2 seems to mostly a worthless upgrade to me. I never liked Nautilus in Gnome1 and have tried the Gnome2 version. While the Gnome2 version is alot faster the Gnome2 version still royally sucks. As for KDE3 being any better, there I disagree. As for overall power and usablibility I think Gnome 1.4 defeats Gnome2 and KDE3. I think part of the problem with Gnome2 is it is trying to be a little too much like KDE3. KDE3 did have more to show from the upgrade, but overall was just as uneventful as I see Gnome2 being. Also KDE3 still has stability issues that I didn't have in KDE 2.2. mcop seems to randomly decide to crash when closing Konqueror. I was hoping it was fixed in KDE 3.01, but doesn't seem to be. I have tried 3-4 ideas of how I might workaround the bug(cleaning out config files, etc). I am hoping KDE 3.1 will be better. I am still waiting for viewports in KDE.
This article says a patch for XFree86 is avaiable but I can find no signs of it. Nothing here, nothing on the XFree86 font list, nothing on the XFree86 main list, no patch mentioned on Bugtraq, etc. Can anyone point me to it?
I agree, "Where is the source tarball?". The commands mentioned in the README on the download page don't work because of a lack of CVSROOT. Even with the CVS working I wonder if I am getting what has been released today or that plus new patchs. A nice pre-made tarball is nice. Just drop it in the right directory, modify the spec file, and try to compile a rpm.
If you check out the mailing list you will see the two required changes to make Galeon 1.2.2 compile and run just fine against Mozilla 1.0RC3. The changes are a simple hack instead of a elegant fix, but is simpler and works.
After looking it over again, maybe recompiling qt isn't so hard. I uninstalled a few packages I didn't need and then found the remaining packages were ones I already need to rebuild.
I am rebuilding kde3 from rawhide source rpms because rawhide is compiled against libpng-1.2 and RedHat 7.3 is compiled against libpng-1.0. I also tried setting environment variables to get rpm to use gcc3 and g++3 while building but found it wouldn't work because the qt-3.0.3 that I have installed is compiled with gcc 2.96 and so I would have to recompile qt-3.0.3 and probabbly a dozen other packages that are compiled against it. kdebase has taken long enough, don't want to spend days recompiling something I just use for konqueror.
Check out Protozilla. It is a project over at mozdev.org that lets you use mailto to other mail clients, in my case evolution. It is planned to be included into Mozilla in the future, but probably not till after 1.0 because of the api havoc Mozilla is still going through.
Totally agree with you. I have read one other comment that mentioned this. I think they just want to guage us like cell phones instead of fixing it in much simpler ways, IF it is even really problem which I doubt.
At 500 times a day that is about once every 3 minutes. Not like in takes but a few bytes each time. It only be noticable to the user if it was a 10mbit network and every client it the server on the minute and wasn't randomized at all. On a 100mbit network it shouldn't be noticable unless there are just way to may people on the same network. I normally set my to 2 minutes, but then again, I run the server I use for e-mail. No it isn't on my lan.
Actually, I would say just the opposite. KDE needs Gnome's panel and Gnome needs KDE's file manager. Gnome has Alot better and wider variety of panel applets. Konqueror is alot better file manager than Nautilus. I do admit it does crash randomly, about once every few days of use.
This is a beta, not intended for general use. So they will leave out anything they feel like as little sense as it makes.
ok, on to the real answer, and to stop ranting.
They can't make up their mind, 3.0.4 or 3.1.
So they decided to play the wait and see game till offical release time. They seem to have no trouble picking 3.0.4 for the update to 7.2, so why couldn't they just use that instead of leaving people hanging till offical release?
I agree 100%. I even submitted a bug report about it. I got a very upsetting, WONTFIX response back. Use the rpm from 7.2, works just fine. You will also need fnlib from 7.2. If you are like me and love econf, get enlightenment-conf from 6.2 also.
I wonder when someone will reverse enigeer up2date and make an open source up2date server. So you could just pay $60 to redhat to download the update full speed, then turn around and at as a server to your lan to update all the others. The source is avaiable for rhn_register and up2date, both GPL, so it wouldn't be that hard.
1. It's lack/bad hack of a security console.
You have to open something like the javascript console which yets Mozilla's interface bleed through to then use Mozilla's security interface. I would really think if you were going to release 1.0, you would have the basic functionality of a security console finished.
2. The current sites certificate is unavaiable for examination.
Go to random website that you are about to dish your CC number out to and you want to look at their website certificate to see if they used a CA or their certificate got replaced by crackers, or whatever, you can't.
3. Not easy to turn on encryption for passwords.
You have to go dig through the mailing list and find the prefs.js setting to turn it on. When you do have it on the dialog for it I think comes from Mozilla instead of Galeon and is functional but looks bad. I will say that Mozilla requires you to do the same thing for certain features, but then they state the offically supported ones like pop-up prevention on the release notes page.
4. Lack of a Socks proxy line in the Proxy section.
Many people use Socks proxies for a number of reasons. Mozilla has a line for Socks, and Galeon's proxy section seems to have the same layout as Mozilla's, except it is missing Socks.
Galeon adds it own features that are very nice, but I would think they would want to make sure to have all the basic functionality of Mozilla, but with their goal of a simple interface before they start adding new features. Which they seem to not have to done.
Redhat 7.2 RPMS
on
KDE 2.2.2
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· Score: 2, Informative
You can't directly install the Redhat 7.2 KDE 2.2.2 rpms. Redhat 7.2 comes with libxsl 1.0.1 and KDE 2.2.2 requires libxsl 1.0.7. There has been no offical update of libxsl. But you an go get the libxsl 1.0.7 rpm from rawhide and it also requires a new libxml2 rpm from rawhide.
Slashdot Mirror
I totally agree with you. I have yet to see a window manager that even comes close to Enlightenment.
Lack of remember settings in Sawfish is a major hit toward my willingness to use it. Metacity is dumbdowncity. All the window managers that only have Send window left or right royally suck. I want to Send to X not repeatedly Send to Left/Right/Up/Down.
I(KD5AMC) am a member of MORI and we are having a field day tomorrow. The public is welcome to join in. It will start at around 9am. You can find directions at http://www.qsl.net/mori/
I agree with your statements. It may have been something simple and may have been fixed in a newer release, but I was already not impressed with Sourcer, so I didn't feel compelled to go farther.
As for you statement about never going back, ha. I tried Sourcer before it broke up and about half way through the compile it didn't resolve some dependecy for the compile right and died. I went right back to RedHat outside of VMware.
I have thought about using Gentoo. I am not that impressed with the ideas behind it's package management(I am not talking about the parts that download source). The biggest problem I forsee with switching to Gentoo(and just about any other distribution from RedHat) is the lack of automatic support I would instantly get Alot of developers, in the since that Many provide RedHat rpms. Otherwise I have to download source and mangle that in with whatever package building solution Gentoo uses in that case. The second biggest is how many packages doesn't Gentoo include in it's emerge repository? As many as RedHat? Almost as many as RedHat? Half as many as RedHat? More than RedHat?
Uh, viewports are a function of the window manager. I know KDE's tightly integrated window manager doesn't support them, but they have been talked about as a possible feature in future versions. As for not being it know to, I don't know where you get that idea. Metacity doesn't have them, but Metacity isn't Gnome2. There is a port of sawfish to Gnome2 in the works, as far as I know it will have viewports. Personally I think the author of Metacity is on crack, tho he seems to think everyone else is. If you really want to get down to the point it is more a matter of how well replacing the window manager works between Gnome and KDE. There are just more window managers that play nice with Gnome than there are that do with KDE, mostly because of how tightly KDE intregrates it's window manager.
Personally I can't stand any of the standard Gnome window managers with their totally clunky method of moving windows between desktops and viewports by the Send to X. I much prefer grab window and hot key. Enlighenment provides this functionality and many other very useful features I haven't found in any other window manager. I have in the past tried to get Enlightenment to work with KDE and found they don't work well together. I also found when I first tried Enlightenment and Gnome2 that they didn't work well together, but if I remember right last time I tried a Gnome2 beta they did work well together. I would have probably totally abandoned Gnome as a desktop except for two things. Mainly because of applets. They provide useful information and on panels can almost complete stay out of the way. Speaking of which, that is one nice thing about KDE, you can now have the panels totally hidden. Which I would use for my main panel. Though I would still require the option panels that showed a few pixels. The second thing, which I could probably live without, is the tasklist on the panel. There are other of getting similar functionality, but I really like the hiding ability, quick accessability, and all they provide. This is especially an issue because I like to maximize windows. I don't think I will give up that habit till monitors are Alot bigger.
I agree with you on some points. Gnome2 seems to mostly a worthless upgrade to me. I never liked Nautilus in Gnome1 and have tried the Gnome2 version. While the Gnome2 version is alot faster the Gnome2 version still royally sucks. As for KDE3 being any better, there I disagree. As for overall power and usablibility I think Gnome 1.4 defeats Gnome2 and KDE3. I think part of the problem with Gnome2 is it is trying to be a little too much like KDE3. KDE3 did have more to show from the upgrade, but overall was just as uneventful as I see Gnome2 being. Also KDE3 still has stability issues that I didn't have in KDE 2.2. mcop seems to randomly decide to crash when closing Konqueror. I was hoping it was fixed in KDE 3.01, but doesn't seem to be. I have tried 3-4 ideas of how I might workaround the bug(cleaning out config files, etc). I am hoping KDE 3.1 will be better. I am still waiting for viewports in KDE.
This article says a patch for XFree86 is avaiable but I can find no signs of it. Nothing here, nothing on the XFree86 font list, nothing on the XFree86 main list, no patch mentioned on Bugtraq, etc. Can anyone point me to it?
I agree, "Where is the source tarball?". The commands mentioned in the README on the download page don't work because of a lack of CVSROOT. Even with the CVS working I wonder if I am getting what has been released today or that plus new patchs. A nice pre-made tarball is nice. Just drop it in the right directory, modify the spec file, and try to compile a rpm.
If you check out the mailing list you will see the two required changes to make Galeon 1.2.2 compile and run just fine against Mozilla 1.0RC3. The changes are a simple hack instead of a elegant fix, but is simpler and works.
Well in hindsight, compiling qt-3.0.3 with gcc3/g++3 is a mess.
After looking it over again, maybe recompiling qt isn't so hard. I uninstalled a few packages I didn't need and then found the remaining packages were ones I already need to rebuild.
I am rebuilding kde3 from rawhide source rpms because rawhide is compiled against libpng-1.2 and RedHat 7.3 is compiled against libpng-1.0. I also tried setting environment variables to get rpm to use gcc3 and g++3 while building but found it wouldn't work because the qt-3.0.3 that I have installed is compiled with gcc 2.96 and so I would have to recompile qt-3.0.3 and probabbly a dozen other packages that are compiled against it. kdebase has taken long enough, don't want to spend days recompiling something I just use for konqueror.
Check out Protozilla. It is a project over at mozdev.org that lets you use mailto to other mail clients, in my case evolution. It is planned to be included into Mozilla in the future, but probably not till after 1.0 because of the api havoc Mozilla is still going through.
Totally agree with you. I have read one other comment that mentioned this. I think they just want to guage us like cell phones instead of fixing it in much simpler ways, IF it is even really problem which I doubt.
At 500 times a day that is about once every 3 minutes. Not like in takes but a few bytes each time. It only be noticable to the user if it was a 10mbit network and every client it the server on the minute and wasn't randomized at all. On a 100mbit network it shouldn't be noticable unless there are just way to may people on the same network. I normally set my to 2 minutes, but then again, I run the server I use for e-mail. No it isn't on my lan.
Actually, I would say just the opposite. KDE needs Gnome's panel and Gnome needs KDE's file manager. Gnome has Alot better and wider variety of panel applets. Konqueror is alot better file manager than Nautilus. I do admit it does crash randomly, about once every few days of use.
I think the basic rationale is this:
This is a beta, not intended for general use. So they will leave out anything they feel like as little sense as it makes.
ok, on to the real answer, and to stop ranting.
They can't make up their mind, 3.0.4 or 3.1.
So they decided to play the wait and see game till offical release time. They seem to have no trouble picking 3.0.4 for the update to 7.2, so why couldn't they just use that instead of leaving people hanging till offical release?
Download the gcc3-3.0.4 updates to 7.2 and use them.
. 4-1.i386.rpm
gcc3-3.0.4-1.i386.rpm
libgcc-3.0.4-1.i386.rpm libstdc++3-devel-3.0.4-1.i386.rpm
libstdc++3-3.0
gcc3-c++-3.0.4-1.i386.rpm
I agree 100%. I even submitted a bug report about it. I got a very upsetting, WONTFIX response back. Use the rpm from 7.2, works just fine. You will also need fnlib from 7.2. If you are like me and love econf, get enlightenment-conf from 6.2 also.
Yeah, I saw that Dell article myself. Whats even odder is that it seems to have been removed from my cache/history mysteriously.
hahha, I just went and did a search and found "Current" on freshmeat. Looks like someone already beat me to the idea :)
I wonder when someone will reverse enigeer up2date and make an open source up2date server. So you could just pay $60 to redhat to download the update full speed, then turn around and at as a server to your lan to update all the others. The source is avaiable for rhn_register and up2date, both GPL, so it wouldn't be that hard.
1. It's lack/bad hack of a security console.
You have to open something like the javascript console which yets Mozilla's interface bleed through to then use Mozilla's security interface. I would really think if you were going to release 1.0, you would have the basic functionality of a security console finished.
2. The current sites certificate is unavaiable for examination.
Go to random website that you are about to dish your CC number out to and you want to look at their website certificate to see if they used a CA or their certificate got replaced by crackers, or whatever, you can't.
3. Not easy to turn on encryption for passwords.
You have to go dig through the mailing list and find the prefs.js setting to turn it on. When you do have it on the dialog for it I think comes from Mozilla instead of Galeon and is functional but looks bad. I will say that Mozilla requires you to do the same thing for certain features, but then they state the offically supported ones like pop-up prevention on the release notes page.
4. Lack of a Socks proxy line in the Proxy section.
Many people use Socks proxies for a number of reasons. Mozilla has a line for Socks, and Galeon's proxy section seems to have the same layout as Mozilla's, except it is missing Socks.
Galeon adds it own features that are very nice, but I would think they would want to make sure to have all the basic functionality of Mozilla, but with their goal of a simple interface before they start adding new features. Which they seem to not have to done.
You can't directly install the Redhat 7.2 KDE 2.2.2 rpms. Redhat 7.2 comes with libxsl 1.0.1 and KDE 2.2.2 requires libxsl 1.0.7. There has been no offical update of libxsl. But you an go get the libxsl 1.0.7 rpm from rawhide and it also requires a new libxml2 rpm from rawhide.
That would hurt.