Honestly if you incorparete -anything- not belonging to you without reading the license you're totally crazy.
And normally what I viewed FSF reactions to recent GPL violations in the past they made most times a compromise, and didn't force them anything related to released into the GPL, and shout gotcha, all your...babble..
Well GPL politics is genereally NOT to make this requirment. However chances to enforce such rule where there in the past the FSF decided that this is NOT the way to go.
Take in example the glibc, if it would have been GPL instead of LGPL, your stament would be true, you would no longer be allowed to develop any closed source software.
Other example is bison. The Bison parser generator included some if it's source into the output, making it automatically GPL, after this issue was discovered the FSF put in a special exception that this way bison operates does NOT put the output into a GPL license.
GCC and Gnu assembler can both also be used to compile properitary application. gcc's support libraries are also LGPL, again it would have been an easy move if they would have wanted in the past.
So rest assure this is not an issue, and pure anti-linux-FUD.
Oracle had always (at least already some yeas ago) a restriction inside the usage of their database.
They especially disallowed the use of their software to develop or to aid to develop or used in combination with development (don't remember the exact wording) os nuclear, atomic or chemic mass destruction weapons.
Did you look at the java license? Suns java VM may not be used to steer airplanes, to control nuclear plants etc.
Can't we stop writing micro$oft and write microsoft like everybody else does?
Look the honest goal of I guess 98% percent of all companies is -money-, and this is normal capitalism. The ways of each to reach this goal are then something in the middle of between remarkable or despisable.
Writing micro$oft makes the OpenSource community just look immature. I remember when this word was especially negativly highlighted on the europe patent petition from some submissions,
if it ain't difficult just don't do it in the future, and so help:)
Just thought about problem, infected users have first to -download- the patch, so they get internet connectivity again, so they can download the patch, they need before.:o)
It's the old paradigm of encrpytion, comparing the encryption and hiding method to the message length.
Even primitive XOR pads are the perfect encryption method, if they key is used only ONCE.
Same with information hiding, if you send a well hidden message once in a week, in this huge babble noise the internet provides it is nearly impossibly to detect. If you do it constantly you're can be detected of statisistics, but just imagine people could use even slashdot to communciate terrorists messages. Look at every post, the signature used can be a dictonary on predifened action to take. Man so much people myself have such a bad grammar, in his hardly to detect an unpurpose bad grammar containing a secret message. Suppose every grammar error I do, could mean a 0 and 1, 0 if I write a sentence without mismatched words, and 1 if two letters aer mismatched. Don't tell me any system of this world could scan for such things automatically. I don't say that any specialist could not decipher my message if he wants, but where does he start to look in the whole internet? In this subject there is phantasy without end, it's just the amount of "evil" messages compared to the huge bandwith the internet uses.
'cause I guess many will be generally against a central security system, no matter which OS and from which company. 'cause playing with security is no fun.
Now image such system beeing hacked? Can you really imagine what the outcome is? Today a central security server hacked means break down of our whole economy, one group of people having access to everything? Including your bank account passwords? Medical health info, etc. etc.
I would be a against it even if it's a relative secure system, but additionally imaging such info running on a windows NT or XP server just gives me the creeps.
Man, some moderators can be soooo nerving, how can something be 'overrated' if it has never been rated before? Huh? Remember some post starting with +2:/
Forecasting the weather for 1000 years? This can only be slashdot-typic journalism.
Ever heared what metrologists call the butterfly effect?
The puff a butterfly makes during flight will alter local weather a little, and this change will continue to influence in weather mechanics, until some months later this butterfly can originate an tornade on another continent. This is a very common example used in metrology.
I suppose they mean they will calculate -climate-, and this only for the next -decades-, instead of 1000 years. I remember that these climate modules also had the difficulty that very small changes in input can dramatically change the output, like the emulation cell size. It's not that the output of the simulation grows more accurate as the cell size (of sky) grows smaller, the way it is is that the output changes totally on the choosen size in a chaotic way.
You're very right, in all the encrption hipe another technology is slowly fading away from memory, -hiding- information. Yes in example you can write a text, where the first letters of each word make a new test in example.
An encrypted message is suppisios, and objectied to decyphering. But a message looking completly harmless will silently pass through the even theoritcal perfect decription/guardining system. I image that writing a program that uses a text takes it's letters and creates another perfect english text using the first letters of every word for the original text isn't too difficult to write.
Beside hiding into text you can hide also into pictures, sending an email with the playmate of the month will be completly standard, but look from every pixel in the least significant bit, well this stream will give a totally different message. Nobody and Nomachine can see the difference of a picture if just the least significant bits are changed. Same goes into.wav files, into.mp3, etc. etc.
And they don't even have to use strong encryption, the masses to filter are so great, and the systems searching for key words etc. can already been tricked with the oldest encryiption ever, the shifting alphabet. All the filters will alreay fail. The mass on information going through is simply to great. And after all it is not even yet proofed that they did use the internet for this. They could as good used SMS'es from handies, using a very primitive encryption like the letter matrixes from ~1700.
Are they forgoing it? Do these companiese have to pay them to be call their products like that, or are they just waiting to sue them afterward and capture all the profit, if they're succesful?
java itself may not be the hype of the future, but the related technology will, in one form or the other. Strong object orientation and a VM for userspace applications
I'm just thinking what must go in a mind of person that flies a 7?7 into a building with 10 thousend of persons inside.
What personal pain such a person must have gone through? What has he seen? what was done to him? what pain must a person go through to be ready to to do such act? Had he to see to watch his family die? I just can't imagine what such person went trough.
I believe to fight such attacks in future is best done in the long run to fight the causes which could raise such a pain in a person, btw: which must be highly educted, not everbody can fly a boing.
It's obvios that not the airlines pilot steered the plane, why should he? he will be dead eitherway.
At local televisoin (non US) they said most proparly they fear that the US will counterstrike on just anybody. If they will not know who it was it will be:
it just because of the great advantage of kde, a 'k'ommon environment:) That means kommon libraries where they make sense, this saves quite an amount of memory nicely on a running system, and be surprised or not kmail and knode use the same library for the same task, with the same bug.
I can run the program and step through the source code in another window. gdb can do this without graphics, altough I admit for debugging I also prefer a graphic interface like ddd.
The editor highlights my code in color, and I can expand or contract each class definition. Nearly every editor can today do syntax coloring, that includes emacs and vi, which are non GUI.
In a project window, I can see all the files available and check them in or out of source code control. > cvs -n upd | grep ?\
will in example do the same, list all files which are not in source control.
When I move my mouse over a function call, I get a popup with the list of arguments. btw. CTRL+Space will do the same, without having to wait 5 seconds. well vi can also use tags, well yes it doesn't pop, but you can let it open another windows showing the class interface definition.
I can standardize my comments and have the development tool create new classes for me with my comment scheme already in place. Standarize you comments has nothing to do with GUI, also creation of classes from a temple has also nothing to do with GUIs. You reverted only to list MSVC features:o)
If I forget a constant's name, I can call up a separate window where I can browse or search through constants defined in many modules. Yes code browsing is a matter of GUI, but having it in the same application is a matter of IDE, if I forgot a constants name but know it's value I type:
> grep -r VALUE
Make scripts are generated for me automatically. Again what does that have to do with <Gaphic <U>ser <I>nterfaces?
Automake or autoconf also generate very nice scripts automacilly.
I think you explained in another words what I was trying to say.
The advantage to point-n-click is that the options are most likely laid out for you in the open, thus not requiring the memorization of commands. With a CLI, you have to know exactly what you want do to.
It's exactly that, for doing a task the first time a GUI is definitly faster in hours. For doing a task 8 hours a day, a deticated interface is doing faster. Since the time used to learn it once is compensated in future uses.
Just look at the supermarket, imagine the chasier would have PC keyboard, and even a mourse, I wouldn't want to wait in the queue.
I took the secretary as an example, since normaly secretaries have a huge bantwith of tasks to do, but again normally they learn typing
fast with 10 fingers, a lot of programmers don't work on especially. Okay that's a value dated a little more back into time. Today you value people by their ability to solve tasks themselfs, and having a wide spread spectrum of tasks it is effectivier to have user interface for each one which are more intuativee compared to more effective interface you've to be especially trained.
Again the 'project settings' dialog for MFVC. Somebody looking the very first time at can very quickly understand how to turn on and off diverse compile options, while learing how to use makefiles takes up a weekend.
So please get off your high horse and realize that these are different tools for different purposes.
Didn't I say that? However for people that program day and day out, having to learn an dedicated interface pays off. I agree that implementing GUI software with a GUI possiblity to click components on a form. However in example I disliked in example Kdevelop because last time I looked at it, it didn't allow me to use my makefiles, it inseted to use it's autogenerated ones.
Okay the for loop was a bad one:/ Espeically I must confess, I use them very seldom sensefully directly at command line (shell scripts are something different, but this is not a CLI then per se).
I will try to take another example 'vi'. Imagine you're used to windows only (as I was). During the first time you use a unix system you'll sooner or later dump against the editor vi. Accidently it will pop open, and you think fuck what's that for a stupid, ugly thing. And how the hell to I get it away? Well after reading some minutes a man page you discover that:q will do, and you thank haven that it's gone. However as time passes by, you don't always want to use in example kwrite, because you're currently hacking on your installation and x-windows doesn't yet boot up, so you read and learn how at least to edit, and to save a file, so you use vi as a emergency backup, it will always run, even if everything else fails. One time you'll have some minutes free you decide to look how copy&paste is done, since in some config files you feel stupid repeating every line, character by character. And so you slipped into using it. Once nearly unnoticed you'll start to edit your c source files, and you think, hey that thing has syntax coloring, not bad after all. So you use it here and there. From using it and having free minutes you'll slowely start looking for command after command. And suddendly you think, wow 'vim' is a really cool editor, I allows me to do things fast and efficient, the interface is stale and looks like hell, but it's possiblities seem to be nearly without limimts. I guess today I know 10% of it commands and it's allows me seamless editing. I used all these editors before the DOS-Borland-IDE, MSVC, ED4W, UltraEdit, KWrite, SourceNavigator, all of them were graphically more appealing, easier to learn&understand, but today I personally prefer 'vim' over all of them. Thats how an applcation you hated and wanted to go away slowly turned into one of you're most beloved tools.
However yes, as a programmer I edit plain text files all day long, hour for hour. I agree that somebody having only to edit one config file once in a weak, having to learn vi block command is over kill.
Just like I want a GUI to be able to add some numbers, I don't want to learn the interface a cashier has to use and will prefer. I don't care if it takes me 20 seconds or 3 minutes, I do it only once in a month.
That's my opinion for CLI vs. GUI
-
And please if you don't agree with click reply, don't moderate me 'OffTopic' that's definitly false since this is on the topic the thread was started.
Slashdot Mirror
Honestly if you incorparete -anything- not belonging to you without reading the license you're totally crazy.
...babble..
And normally what I viewed FSF reactions to recent GPL violations in the past they made most times a compromise, and didn't force them anything related to released into the GPL, and shout gotcha, all your
well actually I believe that this is default case, as also an EULA is subjected by copyright law.
At least the GPL has now a special allownes also to copy the GPL license itself.
Well GPL politics is genereally NOT to make this requirment. However chances to enforce such rule where there in the past the FSF decided that this is NOT the way to go.
Take in example the glibc, if it would have been GPL instead of LGPL, your stament would be true, you would no longer be allowed to develop any closed source software.
Other example is bison. The Bison parser generator included some if it's source into the output, making it automatically GPL, after this issue was discovered the FSF put in a special exception that this way bison operates does NOT put the output into a GPL license.
GCC and Gnu assembler can both also be used to compile properitary application. gcc's support libraries are also LGPL, again it would have been an easy move if they would have wanted in the past.
So rest assure this is not an issue, and pure anti-linux-FUD.
Oracle had always (at least already some yeas ago) a restriction inside the usage of their database.
:o)
They especially disallowed the use of their software to develop or to aid to develop or used in combination with development (don't remember the exact wording) os nuclear, atomic or chemic mass destruction weapons.
Did you look at the java license? Suns java VM may not be used to steer airplanes, to control nuclear plants etc.
Now argue against that
Can't we stop writing micro$oft and write microsoft like everybody else does?
:)
Look the honest goal of I guess 98% percent of all companies is -money-, and this is normal capitalism. The ways of each to reach this goal are then something in the middle of between remarkable or despisable.
Writing micro$oft makes the OpenSource community just look immature. I remember when this word was especially negativly highlighted on the europe patent petition from some submissions,
if it ain't difficult just don't do it in the future, and so help
Just thought about problem, infected users have first to -download- the patch, so they get internet connectivity again, so they can download the patch, they need before. :o)
It's like the CD-ROM drivers shipped on CD.
--
I still don't agree, but well I'll survive it :o)
:/
Didn't the mod guideliness say:
"Concentrate more on promoting than on demoting"
After all maybe it's just a little envy
It's the old paradigm of encrpytion, comparing the encryption and hiding method to the message length.
Even primitive XOR pads are the perfect encryption method, if they key is used only ONCE.
Same with information hiding, if you send a well hidden message once in a week, in this huge babble noise the internet provides it is nearly impossibly to detect. If you do it constantly you're can be detected of statisistics, but just imagine people could use even slashdot to communciate terrorists messages. Look at every post, the signature used can be a dictonary on predifened action to take. Man so much people myself have such a bad grammar, in his hardly to detect an unpurpose bad grammar containing a secret message. Suppose every grammar error I do, could mean a 0 and 1, 0 if I write a sentence without mismatched words, and 1 if two letters aer mismatched. Don't tell me any system of this world could scan for such things automatically. I don't say that any specialist could not decipher my message if he wants, but where does he start to look in the whole internet? In this subject there is phantasy without end, it's just the amount of "evil" messages compared to the huge bandwith the internet uses.
'cause I guess many will be generally against a central security system, no matter which OS and from which company. 'cause playing with security is no fun.
Now image such system beeing hacked? Can you really imagine what the outcome is? Today a central security server hacked means break down of our whole economy, one group of people having access to everything? Including your bank account passwords? Medical health info, etc. etc.
I would be a against it even if it's a relative secure system, but additionally imaging such info running on a windows NT or XP server just gives me the creeps.
Exactly you can predict climate, but not wheater, what's is wheater but actually the spike periods?
Man, some moderators can be soooo nerving, how can something be 'overrated' if it has never been rated before? Huh? Remember some post starting with +2 :/
Forecasting the weather for 1000 years? This can only be slashdot-typic journalism.
Ever heared what metrologists call the butterfly effect?
The puff a butterfly makes during flight will alter local weather a little, and this change will continue to influence in weather mechanics, until some months later this butterfly can originate an tornade on another continent. This is a very common example used in metrology.
I suppose they mean they will calculate -climate-, and this only for the next -decades-, instead of 1000 years. I remember that these climate modules also had the difficulty that very small changes in input can dramatically change the output, like the emulation cell size. It's not that the output of the simulation grows more accurate as the cell size (of sky) grows smaller, the way it is is that the output changes totally on the choosen size in a chaotic way.
You're very right, in all the encrption hipe another technology is slowly fading away from memory, -hiding- information. Yes in example you can write a text, where the first letters of each word make a new test in example.
.wav files, into .mp3, etc. etc.
An encrypted message is suppisios, and objectied to decyphering. But a message looking completly harmless will silently pass through the even theoritcal perfect decription/guardining system. I image that writing a program that uses a text takes it's letters and creates another perfect english text using the first letters of every word for the original text isn't too difficult to write.
Beside hiding into text you can hide also into pictures, sending an email with the playmate of the month will be completly standard, but look from every pixel in the least significant bit, well this stream will give a totally different message. Nobody and Nomachine can see the difference of a picture if just the least significant bits are changed. Same goes into
And they don't even have to use strong encryption, the masses to filter are so great, and the systems searching for key words etc. can already been tricked with the oldest encryiption ever, the shifting alphabet. All the filters will alreay fail. The mass on information going through is simply to great. And after all it is not even yet proofed that they did use the internet for this. They could as good used SMS'es from handies, using a very primitive encryption like the letter matrixes from ~1700.
Isn't 'Ultima' a trademark from Origin/EA?
Are they forgoing it? Do these companiese have to pay them to be call their products like that, or are they just waiting to sue them afterward and capture all the profit, if they're succesful?
Isn't the freenet not also a decentral file sharing network?
I miss it in this comparison.
No,
java itself may not be the hype of the future, but the related technology will, in one form or the other. Strong object orientation and a VM for userspace applications
Isn't .net/c# seen in a large scale already a java fork?
For all who blame other religions think of the cristian holy crusades! How many people were killed in the past in the name of our god?
I'm just thinking what must go in a mind of person that flies a 7?7 into a building with 10 thousend of persons inside.
What personal pain such a person must have gone through? What has he seen? what was done to him? what pain must a person go through to be ready to to do such act? Had he to see to watch his family die? I just can't imagine what such person went trough.
I believe to fight such attacks in future is best done in the long run to fight the causes which could raise such a pain in a person, btw: which must be highly educted, not everbody can fly a boing.
It's obvios that not the airlines pilot steered the plane, why should he? he will be dead eitherway.
At local televisoin (non US) they said most proparly they fear that the US will counterstrike on just anybody. If they will not know who it was it will be:
Where is the next best target?
it just because of the great advantage of kde, a 'k'ommon environment :) That means kommon libraries where they make sense, this saves quite an amount of memory nicely on a running system, and be surprised or not kmail and knode use the same library for the same task, with the same bug.
-1 troll
knode (0.4)
The kde news reader now orders incoming messages false. All new messages after the billenium are ordered older than the ones from before.
Let me guess, you use MSVC, right? :)
:o)
However that's all not necessarly GUI releated.
I can run the program and step through the source code in another window.
gdb can do this without graphics, altough I admit for debugging I also prefer a graphic interface like ddd.
The editor highlights my code in color, and I can expand or contract each class definition.
Nearly every editor can today do syntax coloring, that includes emacs and vi, which are non GUI.
In a project window, I can see all the files available and check them in or out of source code control.
> cvs -n upd | grep ?\
will in example do the same, list all files which are not in source control.
When I move my mouse over a function call, I get a popup with the list of arguments.
btw. CTRL+Space will do the same, without having to wait 5 seconds. well vi can also use tags, well yes it doesn't pop, but you can let it open another windows showing the class interface definition.
I can standardize my comments and have the development tool create new classes for me with my comment scheme already in place.
Standarize you comments has nothing to do with GUI, also creation of classes from a temple has also nothing to do with GUIs. You reverted only to list MSVC features
If I forget a constant's name, I can call up a separate window where I can browse or search through constants defined in many modules.
Yes code browsing is a matter of GUI, but having it in the same application is a matter of IDE, if I forgot a constants name but know it's value I type:
> grep -r VALUE
Make scripts are generated for me automatically.
Again what does that have to do with <Gaphic <U>ser <I>nterfaces?
Automake or autoconf also generate very nice scripts automacilly.
I think you explained in another words what I was trying to say.
:/ Espeically I must confess, I use them very seldom sensefully directly at command line (shell scripts are something different, but this is not a CLI then per se).
:q will do, and you thank haven that it's gone. However as time passes by, you don't always want to use in example kwrite, because you're currently hacking on your installation and x-windows doesn't yet boot up, so you read and learn how at least to edit, and to save a file, so you use vi as a emergency backup, it will always run, even if everything else fails. One time you'll have some minutes free you decide to look how copy&paste is done, since in some config files you feel stupid repeating every line, character by character. And so you slipped into using it. Once nearly unnoticed you'll start to edit your c source files, and you think, hey that thing has syntax coloring, not bad after all. So you use it here and there. From using it and having free minutes you'll slowely start looking for command after command. And suddendly you think, wow 'vim' is a really cool editor, I allows me to do things fast and efficient, the interface is stale and looks like hell, but it's possiblities seem to be nearly without limimts. I guess today I know 10% of it commands and it's allows me seamless editing. I used all these editors before the DOS-Borland-IDE, MSVC, ED4W, UltraEdit, KWrite, SourceNavigator, all of them were graphically more appealing, easier to learn&understand, but today I personally prefer 'vim' over all of them. Thats how an applcation you hated and wanted to go away slowly turned into one of you're most beloved tools.
The advantage to point-n-click is that the options are most likely laid out for you in the open, thus not requiring the memorization of commands. With a CLI, you have to know exactly what you want do to.
It's exactly that, for doing a task the first time a GUI is definitly faster in hours. For doing a task 8 hours a day, a deticated interface is doing faster. Since the time used to learn it once is compensated in future uses.
Just look at the supermarket, imagine the chasier would have PC keyboard, and even a mourse, I wouldn't want to wait in the queue.
I took the secretary as an example, since normaly secretaries have a huge bantwith of tasks to do, but again normally they learn typing
fast with 10 fingers, a lot of programmers don't work on especially. Okay that's a value dated a little more back into time. Today you value people by their ability to solve tasks themselfs, and having a wide spread spectrum of tasks it is effectivier to have user interface for each one which are more intuativee compared to more effective interface you've to be especially trained.
Again the 'project settings' dialog for MFVC. Somebody looking the very first time at can very quickly understand how to turn on and off diverse compile options, while learing how to use makefiles takes up a weekend.
So please get off your high horse and realize that these are different tools for different purposes.
Didn't I say that? However for people that program day and day out, having to learn an dedicated interface pays off. I agree that implementing GUI software with a GUI possiblity to click components on a form. However in example I disliked in example Kdevelop because last time I looked at it, it didn't allow me to use my makefiles, it inseted to use it's autogenerated ones.
Okay the for loop was a bad one
I will try to take another example 'vi'. Imagine you're used to windows only (as I was). During the first time you use a unix system you'll sooner or later dump against the editor vi. Accidently it will pop open, and you think fuck what's that for a stupid, ugly thing. And how the hell to I get it away? Well after reading some minutes a man page you discover that
However yes, as a programmer I edit plain text files all day long, hour for hour. I agree that somebody having only to edit one config file once in a weak, having to learn vi block command is over kill.
Just like I want a GUI to be able to add some numbers, I don't want to learn the interface a cashier has to use and will prefer. I don't care if it takes me 20 seconds or 3 minutes, I do it only once in a month.
That's my opinion for CLI vs. GUI
-
And please if you don't agree with click reply, don't moderate me 'OffTopic' that's definitly false since this is on the topic the thread was started.