"The one challenge is how do you allow playing away from a streaming signal - perhaps you allow a limited amount of music to be recorded and played at will - sort of like the Blockbuster / Netflix send a DVD model."
I think if you check the article again, he envisions that you can save any part of any stream you want. (Kind of implied in the thought that a person doesn't want to pay twice and also in the download=stream=download idea.)
I think there might be some interesting possibilities in the answers to that question which now one seemed to want to try answer...
Q: What would happen if the big tech compamies started funding the production of copyleft music and movies and the like?
all the best,
drew http://www.ourmedia.org/node/262954 'Sayings', a novel in progress for the current nanowrimo.org competition. It is released under a Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike license. Go to town...
First, you might want to note that I never proposed that they produce their own films, but that they fund the creation of copyleft films and music.
Second, why not take a little chance and try and answer my original question? As I say, you may find some thoughts/answers to your question in the answers to mine.
Hint, it is not so much about recovering production costs as it is a possible increase in their bottom line. Right? It will not hurt if things are very indirect, will it?
I like ourmedia and have my stuff there, but they have been having reliability issues / growing pains of late. Talk to some of the people there if you have concerns. I plan on keeping my stuff with them while it works itself out and am not trying to scare anyone off, just do some checking if your situation warrants it.
"It would be different if MS was truly 'screwing' users with the prices, but they are not. Even non-server Linux distributions sell for about the same as a Home copy of MS Windows."
Go ahead and make your points, but trying to pass this off as legit will not fly. You can't properly compare the cost of a "distro" to the cost of an OS. Plus, for the distros I play with, I can legally install to a hundred machines for that price if I so choose.
This is 3.c)
c) Accompany it with the information you received as to the offer
to distribute corresponding source code. (This alternative is
allowed only for noncommercial distribution and only if you
received the program in object code or executable form with such
an offer, in accord with Subsection b above.)
"I'm not a lawyer so I'm not too clear on the GPL. I thought you could modify the software under it and release it without ever being forced to hand out the source code."
I am not a lawyer either, but I think it is more like you can modify the software under it and not distribute it and not be forced to hand out the source code.
If you hand out binaries, you have to hand out source with the binaries or on request.
Something like that. How did you come by the other idea?
"And let's be honest, none of these students is actually producing anything that's inherently valuable, we're talking high school level papers here."
If that is so, change the law so that everything does not automatically get a copyright and the problem is solved. In fact, give everything an automatic copyleft instead and the problem is still solved and we get some other benefits as well.
Now, I don't remember if I put the license in the file metadata, but I could have. You are certainly legally allowed to share that file with others without any DRM. In fact, I am not sure about that version of the license, but some have or are discussion haveing terms where putting the DRM on would make it illegal to share it while leaving it off make it legal to share it. Oops. (I think I have that broadly correct.)
So, the sharing app could look for a "shareable license" and share those files with no DRM, right?
"You are assuming that the AAA would find it in its best interest to have a low cost AutoCAD clone runnign around. First of all, lowering the cost of tools lowers the barriers to entry for new firms. Existing firms might not like that. Next, you're assuming that the tool is a significant cost for their members, worth the time and hassle of negotiating with, funding, and supporting a group of OSS programmers. Finally, you're assuming that all of this amounts to more than AutoCAD currently provides to the AAA in terms of conference sponsorships, ads in their journals, and corporate membership fees."
Funny thing is that you are assuming that I am assuming all of those things you say when in fact, I am assuming none of them.
I too have often wondered when the big boys and the industry associations would clue in to their power in this way.
Doesn't anyone think that the American Architects Association might have some pull with respect to the license terms for something like autocad? Or for funding a competitor with better terms?
"No, the contributors still maintain copyright, they just have to grant an unlimited, unrevokable, license to the project (or company) that is compatible with the planned distribution model."
Cool, so do you know of any dual license projects or companies that do it this way? Can you provide links to the agreements required of contributors?
So, if the contributors were not going to assign copyrights to the project, what rights or agreements would they have to have to allow the project to safely persue a dual license business model?
Right, perhaps I erred and should have said any Free Software project with a copyleft license.
Can you pull that off with a dual license stratgegy and no assignments?
all the best,
drew http://www.ourmedia.org/node/258456 Writing a novel in 30 days in an IRC channel? Can it be done? Come in watch in November 06. The result will be under a CC BY-SA license to boot.
"Actually, Asterisk isn't _really_ FOSS, as you have to sign a disclaimer (before you submit code to them) giving them the right to repackage it in non a FOSS way."
Not that I particularly like this practice. But wouldn't pretty much any project with a dual license strategy where one is non-free need to do this?
Slashdot Mirror
"The one challenge is how do you allow playing away from a streaming signal - perhaps you allow a limited amount of music to be recorded and played at will - sort of like the Blockbuster / Netflix send a DVD model."
I think if you check the article again, he envisions that you can save any part of any stream you want. (Kind of implied in the thought that a person doesn't want to pay twice and also in the download=stream=download idea.)
all the best,
drew
http://www.ourmedia.org/user/17145
'Sayings' - a nanowrimo.org novel in progress
Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike license
Plus there is alwasy this:
7 01949
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=204439&cid=16
I think there might be some interesting possibilities in the answers to that question which now one seemed to want to try answer...
Q: What would happen if the big tech compamies started funding the production of copyleft music and movies and the like?
all the best,
drew
http://www.ourmedia.org/node/262954
'Sayings', a novel in progress for the current nanowrimo.org competition.
It is released under a Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike license.
Go to town...
First, you might want to note that I never proposed that they produce their own films, but that they fund the creation of copyleft films and music.
Second, why not take a little chance and try and answer my original question? As I say, you may find some thoughts/answers to your question in the answers to mine.
Hint, it is not so much about recovering production costs as it is a possible increase in their bottom line. Right? It will not hurt if things are very indirect, will it?
all the best,
drew
http://www.ourmedia.org/node/262954
Sayings - Deterred Bahamian Novel
A work in progress.
And what evidence or reasoning do you have to support this contention of yours?
Why not give a shot at actually answering the question? It might be worth it.
all the best,
drew
http://www.ourmedia.org/node/187924
Bahamian Nonsense
And why exactly would I have to answer your question first? Perhaps, if you tried to answer mine, some answers to yours might suggest themselves?
I am assuming that you get "copyleft" mind you.
I know, I know, but I am sometimes willing to run that risk.
all the best,
drew
http://www.ourmedia.org/node/85937
Tings -Anuddah BahamiaN Novel
What would happen if the big tech compamies started funding the production of copyleft music and movies and the like?
It might make for some interesting times.
all the best,
drew
http://www.ourmedia.org/node/262954
Sayings - Deterred Bahamian Novel.
In progress, watch it being written daily in ##zotz on irc.freenode.net
And are you to get arrested for murder when you kill their in game character? (Arrested out here in the real world that is...)
p hp?topic_id=4146&forum=171&post_id=61131#forumpost 61131
all the best,
drew
Come on slashdotters, you know you want to...
http://www.nanowrimo.org/modules/newbb/viewtopic.
I like ourmedia and have my stuff there, but they have been having reliability issues / growing pains of late. Talk to some of the people there if you have concerns. I plan on keeping my stuff with them while it works itself out and am not trying to scare anyone off, just do some checking if your situation warrants it.
p hp?topic_id=4146&forum=171&post_id=61131#forumpost 61131
all the best,
drew
Come on over to NaNoWriMo and write your novel in 30 days.
Then join me in putting yours under a Creative Commons BY-SA license.
http://www.nanowrimo.org/modules/newbb/viewtopic.
"It would be different if MS was truly 'screwing' users with the prices, but they are not. Even non-server Linux distributions sell for about the same as a Home copy of MS Windows."
p hp?topic_id=4146&forum=171&post_id=61131#forumpost 61131
Go ahead and make your points, but trying to pass this off as legit will not fly. You can't properly compare the cost of a "distro" to the cost of an OS. Plus, for the distros I play with, I can legally install to a hundred machines for that price if I so choose.
all the best,
drew
Come on over to NaNoWriMo and write a novel in November. Then join me in putting it under a CC BY-SA license. (think copyleft)
http://www.nanowrimo.org/modules/newbb/viewtopic.
There is also vnc over and ssh tunnel.
p hp?topic_id=4146&forum=171&post_id=61131#forumpost 61131
all the best,
drew
Come on over to NaNoWriMo and write a novel in November. Then join me in putting it under a CC BY-SA license. (think copyleft)
http://www.nanowrimo.org/modules/newbb/viewtopic.
"Zork nostalgia, anyone?"
p hp?topic_id=4146&forum=171&post_id=61131#forumpost 61131
That's just gruesome!
all the best,
drew
http://www.nanowrimo.org/modules/newbb/viewtopic.
Come on over to NaNoWriMo and write and copyleft a novel in 30 days.
This is 3.c)
c) Accompany it with the information you received as to the offer
to distribute corresponding source code. (This alternative is
allowed only for noncommercial distribution and only if you
received the program in object code or executable form with such
an offer, in accord with Subsection b above.)
from the current GPL here:
http://www.fsf.org/licensing/licenses/gpl.txt
Do you fall within that?
all the best,
drew
"I'm not a lawyer so I'm not too clear on the GPL. I thought you could modify the software under it and release it without ever being forced to hand out the source code."
I am not a lawyer either, but I think it is more like you can modify the software under it and not distribute it and not be forced to hand out the source code.
If you hand out binaries, you have to hand out source with the binaries or on request.
Something like that. How did you come by the other idea?
all the best,
drew
"If you were to make the choice between SIP and Skype for Linux, which one would you go for?"
IAX I guess...
if all of that stuff was legal down here. That is not so clear.
all the best,
drew
http://www.ourmedia.org/user/17145
Personally, I wouldn't allow my works to be sent to them aliens as they may have super advanced alien TIVOs and abuse my copyrights.
3 A%22drew%20Roberts%22)%20OR%20(collection%3A(ourme dia)%20AND%20%2Fmetadata%2Fauthor%3A(drew%20Robert s))
Then again, my copyrights will have run out by the time they see my works... Or will they still be in effect...
All except my BY-SA and GPL and other Free works that is.
all the best,
drew
http://www.archive.org/search.php?query=(creator%
"And let's be honest, none of these students is actually producing anything that's inherently valuable, we're talking high school level papers here."
If that is so, change the law so that everything does not automatically get a copyright and the problem is solved. In fact, give everything an automatic copyleft instead and the problem is still solved and we get some other benefits as well.
all the best,
drew
http://www.ourmedia.org/node/258456
Come November - watch a novel being written in real time. Before then, chat about the idea.
Dude!
Toys that explode on the store shelves! What a top notch concept!
all the best,
drew
http://www.ourmedia.org/node/258456
I meant legally too.
A %22drew%20Roberts%22
Let's say you had one of my audio files from this page:
http://www.archive.org/details/dragirl
on your device. It has this CC BY-SA license:
http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/2.0/
So you could certainly share it legally.
Now, I don't remember if I put the license in the file metadata, but I could have. You are certainly legally allowed to share that file with others without any DRM. In fact, I am not sure about that version of the license, but some have or are discussion haveing terms where putting the DRM on would make it illegal to share it while leaving it off make it legal to share it. Oops. (I think I have that broadly correct.)
So, the sharing app could look for a "shareable license" and share those files with no DRM, right?
all the best,
drew
http://www.archive.org/search.php?query=creator%3
"but do you think any player (including the iPod) can get away with allowing direct player-to-player copying without adding DRM?"
Sure, have the player look in the file itself for an appropriate CC license or similar and share those without wrapping in DRM. Doable? Not doable?
all the best,
drew
http://www.ourmedia.org/node/258456
"You are assuming that the AAA would find it in its best interest to have a low cost AutoCAD clone runnign around. First of all, lowering the cost of tools lowers the barriers to entry for new firms. Existing firms might not like that. Next, you're assuming that the tool is a significant cost for their members, worth the time and hassle of negotiating with, funding, and supporting a group of OSS programmers. Finally, you're assuming that all of this amounts to more than AutoCAD currently provides to the AAA in terms of conference sponsorships, ads in their journals, and corporate membership fees."
p hp?topic_id=33654&forum=157
Funny thing is that you are assuming that I am assuming all of those things you say when in fact, I am assuming none of them.
Care to try again?
all the best,
drew
http://www.nanowrimo.org/modules/newbb/viewtopic.
I too have often wondered when the big boys and the industry associations would clue in to their power in this way.
p hp?topic_id=33654&forum=157
Doesn't anyone think that the American Architects Association might have some pull with respect to the license terms for something like autocad? Or for funding a competitor with better terms?
all the best,
drew
http://www.nanowrimo.org/modules/newbb/viewtopic.
"No, the contributors still maintain copyright, they just have to grant an unlimited, unrevokable, license to the project (or company) that is compatible with the planned distribution model."
p hp?topic_id=33654&forum=157
Cool, so do you know of any dual license projects or companies that do it this way? Can you provide links to the agreements required of contributors?
all the best,
drew
http://www.nanowrimo.org/modules/newbb/viewtopic.
So, if the contributors were not going to assign copyrights to the project, what rights or agreements would they have to have to allow the project to safely persue a dual license business model?
all the best,
drew
http://www.ourmedia.org/node/111123
Tings a nanowrimo novel with a CC BY-SA license.
Right, perhaps I erred and should have said any Free Software project with a copyleft license.
Can you pull that off with a dual license stratgegy and no assignments?
all the best,
drew
http://www.ourmedia.org/node/258456
Writing a novel in 30 days in an IRC channel? Can it be done? Come in watch in November 06. The result will be under a CC BY-SA license to boot.
"Actually, Asterisk isn't _really_ FOSS, as you have to sign a disclaimer (before you submit code to them) giving them the right to repackage it in non a FOSS way."
p hp?topic_id=33654&forum=157
Not that I particularly like this practice. But wouldn't pretty much any project with a dual license strategy where one is non-free need to do this?
Anyone know what mysql and trolltech do?
all the best,
drew
http://www.nanowrimo.org/modules/newbb/viewtopic.
Coming to IRC this November - live novel writing...