(sarcasm) BZZZZZZZZZZZZZ! Thanks for playing corporate solutions 101. Wendy, what consolation prizes has our player won? (/sarcasm)
Tried it, and it truly mangled large documents. If you want to try out some of these thing (and i REALLY recommend people do this) is to:
1) grab a bucketload of text, format it a bit, insert a bunch of images (different formats), multi-column sections, etc. Go nuts.
2) save this file a dozen times, and make some simple formatting changes on each of them.
3) create a document to call on these documents
4) print the whole sucker out (another tree.. doh!)
5) import this file into openoffice, abiword, staroffice, kword, whatever.
Now IF you can load it, that's just the first step. The next step is to print it out and check both. The final check is to view each file, side by side.
When I find an app that can do this, I'll spam slashdot (and the rest of the known world) with my findings. Until then, I'll just grumble to myself quietly in the corner.
However, MS is moving their office suite to XML - although whatever issues in understanding, interacting, levels of usage, licensing, etc are still mostly unknown. Some interesting reading:
An article on InternetNews on OASIS... with some info on what MS is already doing with XML. Light info, but it's a start.
Usual Propaganda on MSDN on the new version of Visio.. including some details on how XML is used with it.
An article on New World Fusion on how XML is used with the latest MSOffice beta.. as part of the whole.net thing. One interesting point is that Word, Excel and Access are going to support XML.. no word on Outlook and/or Powerpoint
If this is any indication of what is going to happen.. well, like the ad says, it won't happen overnight, but it will happen.
I'd love to put openoffice on my machines in my somewhat large (and unnamed for the usual reasons) organisation. We've discussed it at the executive level, and the sole reason for staying with MSOffice is *other* organisations.
We rely on communicating with government, military and corporate entities, and their standard is Office. Period.
Whilst the import functions on openoffice are very good, they have to be (from a business critical aspect) absolutely 100% compatible -- and when you're dealing with multi-chapter doc files which use 90% of Word's capability, well, from my testings inhouse, I can't guarantee that level of accuracy. Images can move around, hide text, etc.
What I've done is start a different tactic within the organisation. All documents are PDF unless they require collaboration on the document. If collaboration is required, I'm now looking into a web-based solution (via our portal). Now, this does produce new challenges, but it does break the '.doc' monopoly.
Another damn important point is XML. With MSOffice moving towards their own XML, and with movement on producing an open standard for XML documents (slashdot article | actual link), this may be the approach that ends this problem. But it's going to be some time yet.
This is going to be a slow moving issue. I recommend we all relax, keep working on this, and slow and steady will win the race... eventually.
Lets be realistic, shall we? With the amount of marketshare that Word has on the wordprocessing market, I don't think anything will cause its 'doom' anytime soon.
Yup, and nobody will ever need more than 640K.
Seriously, if you told me 10 years ago I'd be working on a free *nix environment (indeed, from a choice of free *nix environments), and this system would be a serious condentor against the product from the largest/richest IT company on the globe, I would have laughed till my sides split. Things Change! Even MS Office is moving towards XML services, so I read this more as a sign of the times.
Sure, in the next year or two, things will mostly be the same -- but we're not talking about a radical change in direction, we're talking about another small distinct one which will begin (continue?) to change that direction.
Look back ten years, where.DOC was fighting to become the standard. Today, it is the standard. What do you think will be the standard in 10 years time? That is where this party/standard is headed, and Microsoft knows it.
Good points. I think it does come down to the ethics -- as expressed in the specific law of the nation/state itself. The modding of the XBox allows a 'function expansion' to the machine. How this expansion is used SHOULD be the issue, rather than the expressing the technically innaccurate view that modded xbox == cheating pirate.
I make copies of 90% of any VCR tapes and PC games, so I can use (and thus trash) these copies and keep the 'gold' media away from exposure (spot the slashdotter who has small kids... this practice started when I spotted my 3 year old using my Diablo CD as a rollerskate). This is quite legal in my part of the globe... is this (even mostly) universal?
Nonsense. Whilst modding the box allows an opportunity to pirate, it also provides a number of different services... even to run Linux on the thing. It's only a specific type of use of this technology which is piracy. Remember when this same old argument was taken up to try to stop VCR's?
This pre-emptive 'you must be a pirate because you use this technology' argument has been dribbling from the chins of many organisations, it would be laughable if it wasn't for the fact it's being taken seriously.
I have to pipe up here, and second this recomendation. Whilst I use KDE on the desktop machines here at my work, we've moved to using xfce on our servers (where we use a WM anyway). This WM has really grown on us; it's fast, stable, and works well enough to expand its funcionality WITHOUT adding too many bells and whistles for their own sake. Do yourself a favour and take a lookskie.
Back in the BBS days, a friend of mine I was living with run his BBS from his desk. He ran out of room in the case he had (it was a pizza box sized thing) so he bolted his hard drives inside a lockable drawer, complete with reeeeally long cables. It was a sight to behold.
.. you! You have choice. Apparently that's the prize in Linux:P
Seriously, If you have the Ximian desktop, then wait. The whole point of that desktop is that it's integrated to 'their' standard, which rests upon the 'standard' of Gnome2. If you're running Ximian, then I'd advise a wait. Contact them to get an idea of timeframe for it's release.
Otherwise, I'd recommend checking out the Garnome project. It's bleeding edge, but it does allow you to compile Gnome for yourself. If you consider yourself more than a newbie (or an aspiring l33t linuxer), then you can have Gnome2 running at the best speeds for *your* machine.
I suppose the thing to remember is that Ximian Desktop is NOT Gnome2, so if Ximian is what you're aiming for, then wait.
1 husky, which *requires* walking daily. How is this a good geek pet? Well, it makes you get away from the PC! Take a walk, look at the horizen, breath some air. I used to bitch about it alot (still do) but once I get back, I've always been better for it.
2 cats, which are mostly great. The younger does make a habit of sitting on the scanner, but I can live with that.
9 frogs. What can I say.. FROGS! Like a fishtank, you can go gadget crazy also, and they don't mind if you change the habitat from time to time. You can also combine this with a love of lego. Which brings us to the next choice..
Rodents. Pick your fav. from rats through to gerbils. And this is also a great excuse to use lego. Ever thought of making their home interactive? With lego setup correctly to a lego treadmill (hehehe) your imagination is your only limitation.
I havent seen any blogs really do that good a job at some like Content Management, but writing a plugin for such wouldn't be so hard.
A blog can be a good choice to start with though, as they'll handle the whole user authentification, security (if your blog of choice DOES security), templates, etc etc etc.
As a developer of Geeklog, we do have a security system, based on the typical *nix model of users and groups, along with the ability to use these through a quasi-friendly plugin api... i say quasi friendly as I've yet to meet an api which IS friendly.
If it's a fairly open staffing/documentation setup over there, I'd recommend a wiki. PHPWiki is pretty good from experience, and now does handle user logins.
Emotions aside, my rather quick statement had little to do with 'feeling'. I understand why these clauses exist. Again, that is not the issue.
The only issue I raised is that the age of the document does not help address all the issues faced by the nation - not that the issues the document raises are invalid.
Still, this is slashdot, so I should expect knee jerk reactions:)
Not cowboys as such, but the constitution does reflect that idea. I just think something like the consitution should be an evolving document. Times have changed.
Of course, this is most likely the largest can of worms that currently exists, next to "should we clone humans" (Upside, another Einstein.. Downside, another David Hasselholf)
Strange, I remember being taught it as being "Toolkit Without An Interesting Name", back about 15ish years ago. Sort of reminds me of those Urban Myths, and how they mutate to suit the environment it's retold in.
The weblog I'm working on (geeklog) does a MD5 the password, and records the MD5 against the username. This seems to work very well. Any (rational) reason this woundn't work with Telstra also? Is this method as good as I think it is, or am I missing something?
And I just joined them, due to OneNet falling by the wayside. I only wish I had the choice for Optus, but living in Adelaide provides a rather limited subset of options. Hell, we don't even have the Cable option over here! And word has it from a very reliable source in Optus that they simply arn't willing to roll out in Adelaide due to financial reasons.
I did a google check against my username, and it didn't show up there... which is a good thing.
You can only combat (sic) what you can. However, in many situations, this would be useful. Think of it as another option, one beyond "hitting the deck and hoping they have packed their bags". A sniper normally has a single target, and this tool could be used by a multiple of defending persons.
I just knew that innocent-looking fungus from the Mars asteroid was just lulling us all into a false sense of security! I have defined it's true plan of action!
Lull stupid monkeys into false sense of security (check)
Influence stupid monkeys by using sateration programming of lifestyle television shows and inept and lacking movie plots, to force them to use the stupid monkey computer network (check)
Spread self across stupid blue planet using the most prevelent substance on the stupid blue planet as fuel -- AOL CDs (check)
Use the global fungi network to send a pulse beacon to the ancient brotherhood of Nog from the home planet.
Invade, and eat their stupid monkey brains for brunch!
Domain names exist as a mapping function. Simple examples:
Slashdot runs on a cluster of machines, so pointing to a single IP confuses the issue.
A dialup account uses a dynamic IP, whilst a domain name (updated by the dialup) can point to that very dynamic IP, providing a seamless interaction with that machine.
Multiple domain names can point to a single IP, providing a larger range of services without lowering the number of IP addresses.
Slashdot Mirror
(sarcasm)
.. doh!)
BZZZZZZZZZZZZZ!
Thanks for playing corporate solutions 101. Wendy, what consolation prizes has our player won?
(/sarcasm)
Tried it, and it truly mangled large documents. If you want to try out some of these thing (and i REALLY recommend people do this) is to:
1) grab a bucketload of text, format it a bit, insert a bunch of images (different formats), multi-column sections, etc. Go nuts.
2) save this file a dozen times, and make some simple formatting changes on each of them.
3) create a document to call on these documents
4) print the whole sucker out (another tree
5) import this file into openoffice, abiword, staroffice, kword, whatever.
Now IF you can load it, that's just the first step. The next step is to print it out and check both. The final check is to view each file, side by side.
When I find an app that can do this, I'll spam slashdot (and the rest of the known world) with my findings. Until then, I'll just grumble to myself quietly in the corner.
However, MS is moving their office suite to XML - although whatever issues in understanding, interacting, levels of usage, licensing, etc are still mostly unknown. Some interesting reading:
- An article on InternetNews on OASIS
... with some info on what MS is already doing with XML. Light info, but it's a start.
- Usual Propaganda on MSDN on the new version of Visio
.. including some details on how XML is used with it.
- An article on New World Fusion on how XML is used with the latest MSOffice beta
.. as part of the whole .net thing. One interesting point is that Word, Excel and Access are going to support XML .. no word on Outlook and/or Powerpoint
If this is any indication of what is going to happenI'd love to put openoffice on my machines in my somewhat large (and unnamed for the usual reasons) organisation. We've discussed it at the executive level, and the sole reason for staying with MSOffice is *other* organisations.
... eventually.
We rely on communicating with government, military and corporate entities, and their standard is Office. Period.
Whilst the import functions on openoffice are very good, they have to be (from a business critical aspect) absolutely 100% compatible -- and when you're dealing with multi-chapter doc files which use 90% of Word's capability, well, from my testings inhouse, I can't guarantee that level of accuracy. Images can move around, hide text, etc.
What I've done is start a different tactic within the organisation. All documents are PDF unless they require collaboration on the document. If collaboration is required, I'm now looking into a web-based solution (via our portal). Now, this does produce new challenges, but it does break the '.doc' monopoly.
Another damn important point is XML. With MSOffice moving towards their own XML, and with movement on producing an open standard for XML documents (slashdot article | actual link), this may be the approach that ends this problem. But it's going to be some time yet.
This is going to be a slow moving issue. I recommend we all relax, keep working on this, and slow and steady will win the race
- Lets be realistic, shall we? With the amount of marketshare that Word has on the wordprocessing market, I don't think anything will cause its 'doom' anytime soon.
Yup, and nobody will ever need more than 640K.Seriously, if you told me 10 years ago I'd be working on a free *nix environment (indeed, from a choice of free *nix environments), and this system would be a serious condentor against the product from the largest/richest IT company on the globe, I would have laughed till my sides split. Things Change! Even MS Office is moving towards XML services, so I read this more as a sign of the times.
Sure, in the next year or two, things will mostly be the same -- but we're not talking about a radical change in direction, we're talking about another small distinct one which will begin (continue?) to change that direction.
Look back ten years, where
Good points. I think it does come down to the ethics -- as expressed in the specific law of the nation/state itself. The modding of the XBox allows a 'function expansion' to the machine. How this expansion is used SHOULD be the issue, rather than the expressing the technically innaccurate view that modded xbox == cheating pirate.
... this practice started when I spotted my 3 year old using my Diablo CD as a rollerskate). This is quite legal in my part of the globe ... is this (even mostly) universal?
I make copies of 90% of any VCR tapes and PC games, so I can use (and thus trash) these copies and keep the 'gold' media away from exposure (spot the slashdotter who has small kids
It is MS's network, and they can do what they like. But then, in Australia, this action could come under the attention of the ACCC, the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission. Does the US have a simular group?
Nonsense. Whilst modding the box allows an opportunity to pirate, it also provides a number of different services ... even to run Linux on the thing. It's only a specific type of use of this technology which is piracy. Remember when this same old argument was taken up to try to stop VCR's?
This pre-emptive 'you must be a pirate because you use this technology' argument has been dribbling from the chins of many organisations, it would be laughable if it wasn't for the fact it's being taken seriously.
I have to pipe up here, and second this recomendation. Whilst I use KDE on the desktop machines here at my work, we've moved to using xfce on our servers (where we use a WM anyway). This WM has really grown on us; it's fast, stable, and works well enough to expand its funcionality WITHOUT adding too many bells and whistles for their own sake. Do yourself a favour and take a lookskie.
> Warning if you are using mozilla 2.1b ...
If you're using Mozilla 2.1b, can you send a copy to me?
(Sorry, couldn't resist)
Back in the BBS days, a friend of mine I was living with run his BBS from his desk. He ran out of room in the case he had (it was a pizza box sized thing) so he bolted his hard drives inside a lockable drawer, complete with reeeeally long cables. It was a sight to behold.
So where's the linux kernel hacks? (First Post?)
Seriously, If you have the Ximian desktop, then wait. The whole point of that desktop is that it's integrated to 'their' standard, which rests upon the 'standard' of Gnome2. If you're running Ximian, then I'd advise a wait. Contact them to get an idea of timeframe for it's release.
Otherwise, I'd recommend checking out the Garnome project. It's bleeding edge, but it does allow you to compile Gnome for yourself. If you consider yourself more than a newbie (or an aspiring l33t linuxer), then you can have Gnome2 running at the best speeds for *your* machine.
I suppose the thing to remember is that Ximian Desktop is NOT Gnome2, so if Ximian is what you're aiming for, then wait.
I have a few pets, which have helped my geeklife.
.. FROGS! Like a fishtank, you can go gadget crazy also, and they don't mind if you change the habitat from time to time. You can also combine this with a love of lego. Which brings us to the next choice ..
1 husky, which *requires* walking daily. How is this a good geek pet? Well, it makes you get away from the PC! Take a walk, look at the horizen, breath some air. I used to bitch about it alot (still do) but once I get back, I've always been better for it.
2 cats, which are mostly great. The younger does make a habit of sitting on the scanner, but I can live with that.
9 frogs. What can I say
Rodents. Pick your fav. from rats through to gerbils. And this is also a great excuse to use lego. Ever thought of making their home interactive? With lego setup correctly to a lego treadmill (hehehe) your imagination is your only limitation.
I havent seen any blogs really do that good a job at some like Content Management, but writing a plugin for such wouldn't be so hard.
... i say quasi friendly as I've yet to meet an api which IS friendly.
A blog can be a good choice to start with though, as they'll handle the whole user authentification, security (if your blog of choice DOES security), templates, etc etc etc.
As a developer of Geeklog, we do have a security system, based on the typical *nix model of users and groups, along with the ability to use these through a quasi-friendly plugin api
If it's a fairly open staffing/documentation setup over there, I'd recommend a wiki. PHPWiki is pretty good from experience, and now does handle user logins.
I just prefer to reply to them on Slashdot ;)
... why, that must mean all takeaway places are like that ...
...
You know I once got really bad service and food from a takeaway once
By your post, you didn't 'grok' the whole thing. By your post, it's good you didn't return.
May you find what you're looking for
Well, in the SCA, a Troll is two heavy fighters working as one (well, you hope so) with a left and right arm linked.
... much more fun :)
M'lord, if you wish to troll, why not wrap yourself in armour and jump on the field
(sigh)
:)
Emotions aside, my rather quick statement had little to do with 'feeling'. I understand why these clauses exist. Again, that is not the issue.
The only issue I raised is that the age of the document does not help address all the issues faced by the nation - not that the issues the document raises are invalid.
Still, this is slashdot, so I should expect knee jerk reactions
Not cowboys as such, but the constitution does reflect that idea. I just think something like the consitution should be an evolving document. Times have changed.
.. Downside, another David Hasselholf)
Of course, this is most likely the largest can of worms that currently exists, next to "should we clone humans" (Upside, another Einstein
Dear God .. I just 'rm -rf /home/shared/beta' .. I'm going to Hauge now, for sure!
Strange, I remember being taught it as being "Toolkit Without An Interesting Name", back about 15ish years ago. Sort of reminds me of those Urban Myths, and how they mutate to suit the environment it's retold in.
I love the statement our foreign minister Downer said in a press conference, "... there has been no SIGNIFICANT breech of protocol ..."
Oh, and I apologise to the shaved monkeys.
Load two shotguns, one with solid shot, one with buck shot .... :)
And I just joined them, due to OneNet falling by the wayside. I only wish I had the choice for Optus, but living in Adelaide provides a rather limited subset of options. Hell, we don't even have the Cable option over here! And word has it from a very reliable source in Optus that they simply arn't willing to roll out in Adelaide due to financial reasons.
I did a google check against my username, and it didn't show up there ... which is a good thing.
--
McCarrum!
--
McCarrum!
- Lull stupid monkeys into false sense of security (check)
- Influence stupid monkeys by using sateration programming of lifestyle television shows and inept and lacking movie plots, to force them to use the stupid monkey computer network (check)
- Spread self across stupid blue planet using the most prevelent substance on the stupid blue planet as fuel -- AOL CDs (check)
- Use the global fungi network to send a pulse beacon to the ancient brotherhood of Nog from the home planet.
- Invade, and eat their stupid monkey brains for brunch!
Why can't you all just SEE?!--
McCarrum!
Domain names exist as a mapping function. Simple examples:
- Slashdot runs on a cluster of machines, so pointing to a single IP confuses the issue.
- A dialup account uses a dynamic IP, whilst a domain name (updated by the dialup) can point to that very dynamic IP, providing a seamless interaction with that machine.
- Multiple domain names can point to a single IP, providing a larger range of services without lowering the number of IP addresses.
There are plenty of other examples, I'm sure.Hope this clue helped.
--
McCarrum!