It's unfathomable to me how an IT head could be this far out of touch with his user numbers. It's unfathomable to me that you think an IT head could be in touch with their user numbers - or their actual department.
In my entire career in the IT industry Ive only ONCE worked under a CIO that was aware of anything outside of their own personal projects/agendas - And she was promptly 'moved on' for daring to suggest changes to the grossly unbalanced outsourcing contract we were stuck in.
Past a certain level, managers stop looking after those below them and start looking after those above them.
Im not so sure. Desktop apps don't have to be a headache. Since moving to c# (don't hate me, I just work here) we've added a 'self updating' component to all our new systems and the results have been great. one line bug fix? no problem, fix, test, deploy and the next time the users launch their app its all fixed. Its not all plain sailing but I think you are really overstating the problems.
Web apps are great as long as they are reasonably simple and require a lot of eyeballs. When your systems database table count gets into double figures and there are only 5-15 users for the thing, webifying the thing is just a waste of time and money. Also, Web apps are not nearly close to functionality offered by the zillions of desktop based gui widgets/control/woteva.
As always: Horses/Courses. Im always weary of anyone with to strong an opinion in anything in todays IT world, usually they are selling something.
I think maybe there's something you're overlooking: a university is not a business. Sorry, maybe some time back that was correct, but universities are now businesses. Just like health care and police.
Perhaps this will create additional incentives to switch. No, because this was never about money. Take a look at your boss, chances are he/she is a bit out of their league and are primarily interested in one thing: Conflict Avoidance.
In their eyes its a choice between paying more and more money (in such a manner that never really looks bad and can be justified by 'but its just they way its done') or installing a complete new OS/Office software suite that will have everyone up in arms because their icons have changed and the cut and paste button has moved.
Its a no brainier, 1 meek explanation to your direct superior about a few more dollars spent on "essential software" or the entire company screaming blue murder because change has happened.
Maybe because the proposed solutions to this problem represent a significant financial problem to those that are claiming that there is no problem. And those people have lots and lots of money and would rather continue having lots and lots of money thank you very much.
The "Lets both stop arguing and you sacrifice something" statement rarely goes down well.
Is this the emerging ivory tower of Google developers? While I'm happy for the guy, most of the blog sounds like "look at me, I'm developing under near-ideal conditions, why isn't everyone else?" But if you think about it, there aren't any reasons why we cant work under these conditions, or at least very close to them. Lets look at your points:
you're working with intelligent, competent, creative people "But the boss/HR keeps hiring losers" is the general cry. Well, yes, that might be true, but its also your job to let your managers know when you've got deadwood. We had a guy work briefly for us whom was gently let go for, well, blatantly lying on his CV (he said he knew stuff about computers). If I hadn't raised the issue with our managers he would still be here today. It wasn't a pleasant thing to do, but it struck me as odd that whilst everyone else in our team agreed that this guys was utterly useless and needed to go, no one wanted to start the process to actually make it happen. Has that happened in your area? Have you witnessed the introduction of uselessness and done nothing except complain bitterly amongst yourselves?
you have an effectively unlimited budget This one pisses me off. The idea of a 'budget'. I hate the whole concept of cross charging/internal billing/time=money rubbish. Programmers, even contractors like myself, have a fixed price to the company. We cost the same wether we are working on something beneficial or just playing FreeCell. There is no 'budget', there's only priorities. My number 1 biggest hate in my industry is when I'm forbidden to work on something that would actually be useful to the organisation (i.e.: fix broken programs, add much needed features, reduce workload, increase accurate data recording (NO! EXCEL IS NOT A GOOD WAY OF STORING CORPORATE DATA!!), automate processes, and, hey why not, maybe even a bit of synergy leveraging as well) and then told to waste time on some goal less unplanned directionless senior management fluff project. Limited budget is just bollocks, payroll clerks keep plonking away day after day doing their job without worrying about "limited Budgets" it should be the same for us.
you're working for a software-only company which is only successful because of its innovation, not because it has to deliver specific functionality to specific clients OK, that's a tough one, but if you (your company) cant deliver what you promised then someone has been telling porky pies or is just plain old incompetent. The developers have told fibs about what they can deliver, Marketing have told fibs about what is on offer, the project manager has told fibs during his hiring, the IT manager is that guy from the cartoons with the funny hair. Call these bad people to task or shut up because you've made *that* choice. (My pay is good enough for me to work in these conditions)
We (me to I'm afraid) have all just gotten used to working in crappy mediocre environments and just accept all the shit we deal with day to day as being part of the job. This guys piece should remind us that work doesn't actually have to be so painful.
Whose to blame, well, our bosses could certainly do their jobs a hell of a lot better, but we have to do more as well. Having a cry on/. aint going to change the world, but a one on one chat with the people that matter may go a long way to getting things started.
If only the people we need to have those one-one chats with weren't all sociopaths whose great solution to problems is to get rid of the person who reports them... sigh...
You want to fire up an Amiga then. Im pretty sure you could plug 2 mice/mouses/micee/dodads into and 'boink', a second cursor would appear on screen. Dueling pointers anyone?
It was great for playing a 2 player dungeon master style game called bloodwych (or something). Happy days indeed.
Mate your not alone. We recently did a search for mdbs over our state-wide departments fileservers and found over 2000 access databases. OVER 2000 FRICKEN DATABASES! we don't have half that number of employees. Even if only a third of those things where actually still in use, that's a lot of corporate data scattered around in impossible to get locations.
This one dude who no longer works for the organisation seems to be responsible for a lot of them, and they are all called 'TRAKKA'. Vehicle Trakka's, Correspondence Trakka's, File Trakka's, Travel Trakka. [JOKE]We had to build out own Trakka Trakka![/JOKE] Its unbelievable. Each and every one of is a terrible insight into how 'Joe Average' does his coding. Take for example the ultimate way to save the data on a form: Move forward one record, move backwards one record. The built in form logic does the save. Oh.. My.. God..
We are slowly getting back into control. We have removed access proper from peoples desktops and deployed the runtime files only. If someone wants access they have to ask for it and we try to make sure they know what they are doing.
The saddest thing is that we could fix it all. We have a small team of competent developers that could make the hurt go away. But because of 'cross billing' no section is prepared to spend money on fixing something that they perceive as not a problem. Not a problem until the data is needed and by then its to late. So we end up putting emergency band aids on these things (have to shower afterwards, feel so dirty) instead of taking the time to 'Do It Right'.
Back on topic, Joel got it 100% right: Users Just See Pixels. Just like Ive got no understanding of the complexities of my car, they have no understanding of the complexities of business applications. I don't pop the bonnet and force in another engine to make my car go twice as fast, but users think that they can do the programming equivalent to their systems. Yikes!
They want to be sure that they can slash someone's balls in two when it does not work
But the funny thing is, when things don't work and budget targets whoosh by, NOTHING HAPPENS! The big billing boys either just shrug their shoulders or bury you in blame avoidance procedure, all the while sucking money out of your business. I have yet to see a major software/service provider get seriously chewed out.
You can see the failure of this scientific method with a simple real-life example. Hypothesis: there are nine marbles in Sack A. Evidence: compare weight of sack with weight of one individual marble. Theory: There are ten marbles in Sack A. Now think outside the box: There is no foundational principle that says all marbles must weigh something.
Im not quite sure what your point is with this example, but it seems to be scoring a point for good ol science. You extrapolated a theory based on observed evidence, namely: "A bag with 1 marble in it weighs X units, therefore a bag will always contain a number marbles equal to the weight of the bag in units divided by X". The theory was tested by looking in a bag that weighed 9 units and finding it contained 4 marbles, a piece of cheese and a magical anti mass marble. The theory was proved false and you either give up in disgust or try a different approach to the universal sack theory.
Belief comes into play when there might be a sack, but no one can see it, and if they do, they cant tell anyone else whats inside, and someone says about that sack "I believe there are 10 marbles inside and you cant disprove it therefor I am correct".
It saddens me when people take advantage of those who are broad minded enough to think 'you know, Im pretty sure about why things are and how things work, but if someone is prepared to present me with evidence to the contrary, Ill update my thinking.
Loading screen games patented? Thats insane! In my c64 years there were heaps of tape games that let you while away the bordom of the 15 minute load time with some QIX or Space invaders type action. (Its been many years now, but Im quite sure that Phantom of the asteroids had one.)
Perhaps the VAT/GST tax initiatives your thinking of (aus/eng) dont stop tax evasion because thay where implimented on top of already complex tax stuctures instead of replacing them. They have made the tax rules even more complex which can only aid in tax evasion scams.
I cant think of one country that has gone for the 'flat tax' method in its pure form, which is a pity because it seems like a good idea. (Though valid points have been raised, I suppose business would have to contine paying tax on their yearly profits [I think here in AUS this is around 30%])
If you stop any large established system straight away, of course there will be chaos.
Take the sewer system for example, if you filled up all the pipes overnight, there would be a horrible mess and chaos. That doesn't mean we could not function without a sewer. If we returned the poo vans along side the garbage trucks, embarked on a major education campaign and did a lot of house renovations, there would be grumbling and complaints, but the old way would be gone and the new (or even older) way would be working and nothing would have to hit the fan.
Replacing any system, even over time, is a very hard task, but it can be done. A business can run without computers, but it probably wont run as efficiently or as profitably as it did with them.
I cant wait for an application like that which I can unleash at my current site. it would ruthlessly hunt down and kill the 500+ (and thats just on the file server) databases wizarded up by clueless fools and their Dummies book.
[Dont get me wrong, its a great tool, but if I find the idiot that made it a mandatory desktop application its headbutt time]
RobotRunAmok wrote: When the fifes stop tweeting, the drums stop rum-tumming, and all the clenched fists make their collective way out of the air and back into blue-jeaned pockets, small children still need new shoes, and the writers, artists, and musicians who are their moms and dads have to buy them
Uhmmm, yes, thats true. But wasnt that what the time limited monopoly was for? Cool, you wrote a song. You got 10 years to make money off it, then you will have to write a new one or you and your kiddy dont get shoes. Deal with it
Maybe the coffee hasnt kicked in yet, I kept reading this one as 'write print utter rubbish' and thinking "Well, thats the end of the arts degree at my local university... excellent"
Having to pay $10 more than you should for a Britney Spears CD isn't going to hurt the economy
Wot? Call me an economically challenged dumb-arse, but isn't that 10$ per CD is going into big ol faceless record corporations pockets? For doing sweet bugger all?
I think Id rather use my 10$ PER CD to support a local restaurant, buy something physical that is actually WORTH the money it costs, or maybe even buy more music!? Surely the money is better for the economy spread out all over the place, purchase things that its actually worth. How is paying $30 for goods worth $5 (and I'm being generous) good for the economy?
My view: 5 year IP Copyright.. for everything. You write a book, great. You have 5 years after publishing to make money of it, after that, if some publishing house can publish your book in hard cover, on quality paper for HALF THE PRICE OF WHAT I PAID FOR MY FALL TO BITS PAPER BACK that more power to them. Made a killer app, milk it for all its worth, but after 5 years anyone can burn it and do what they like.
(Offtopic I know, but....)
I read a lot of comments in slashdot moaning about "Big Business(tm) gets away with murder", "The pollies are useless corrupt vagabonds", "Something must be done", blah blah blah.
Sometimes there are more active posts like "Send a fax to this congressman", "Use this e-mail template to get your view to CEO X"
Why not go one step further? Why doesnt the America slashdot crowd get of their collective arses and form their own political party? I have only a vague idea on how the American political system works, but if MIKE MOORE can get a FICUS elected (nearly) with under 100 votes, surely a group of intelligent individuals can do the same? If nothing else, It would be a very interesting social experiment to see how the average soap box standing shashdot idealist responds to the pressures and temptations of public office.
Of course, I should be doing this myself my own country (Aussie-land) before my favourite senator bans the Internet entirely because it is responsible for BAD THINGS(tm). Ill just be quiet now and join the rest of the mice wondering why one of the others doesnt put the bell on the sleeping cat.
..I can give the license plate numbers of those bloody 'doof doof doof' cars that drive past with the windows rolled down to the RIA? They are 'sharing' their music with people that don't own it!
Come to think of it, our neighbours play their movies real loud sometimes! Those damn terrorists are 'sharing' that movie with me against my will!
Maybe all this is a blessing in disguise for those of us that JWTGTSAT! (Just want to go to sleep at ten)
Slashdot Mirror
In my entire career in the IT industry Ive only ONCE worked under a CIO that was aware of anything outside of their own personal projects/agendas - And she was promptly 'moved on' for daring to suggest changes to the grossly unbalanced outsourcing contract we were stuck in.
Past a certain level, managers stop looking after those below them and start looking after those above them.
Im not so sure. Desktop apps don't have to be a headache. Since moving to c# (don't hate me, I just work here) we've added a 'self updating' component to all our new systems and the results have been great. one line bug fix? no problem, fix, test, deploy and the next time the users launch their app its all fixed. Its not all plain sailing but I think you are really overstating the problems.
Web apps are great as long as they are reasonably simple and require a lot of eyeballs. When your systems database table count gets into double figures and there are only 5-15 users for the thing, webifying the thing is just a waste of time and money. Also, Web apps are not nearly close to functionality offered by the zillions of desktop based gui widgets/control/woteva.
As always: Horses/Courses. Im always weary of anyone with to strong an opinion in anything in todays IT world, usually they are selling something.
Go and work for them and see for yourself.
In their eyes its a choice between paying more and more money (in such a manner that never really looks bad and can be justified by 'but its just they way its done') or installing a complete new OS/Office software suite that will have everyone up in arms because their icons have changed and the cut and paste button has moved.
Its a no brainier, 1 meek explanation to your direct superior about a few more dollars spent on "essential software" or the entire company screaming blue murder because change has happened.
I wish it wasn't so..
Maybe because the proposed solutions to this problem represent a significant financial problem to those that are claiming that there is no problem. And those people have lots and lots of money and would rather continue having lots and lots of money thank you very much.
The "Lets both stop arguing and you sacrifice something" statement rarely goes down well.
Is this the emerging ivory tower of Google developers? While I'm happy for the guy, most of the blog sounds like "look at me, I'm developing under near-ideal conditions, why isn't everyone else?"
/. aint going to change the world, but a one on one chat with the people that matter may go a long way to getting things started.
But if you think about it, there aren't any reasons why we cant work under these conditions, or at least very close to them. Lets look at your points:
you're working with intelligent, competent, creative people
"But the boss/HR keeps hiring losers" is the general cry. Well, yes, that might be true, but its also your job to let your managers know when you've got deadwood. We had a guy work briefly for us whom was gently let go for, well, blatantly lying on his CV (he said he knew stuff about computers). If I hadn't raised the issue with our managers he would still be here today. It wasn't a pleasant thing to do, but it struck me as odd that whilst everyone else in our team agreed that this guys was utterly useless and needed to go, no one wanted to start the process to actually make it happen. Has that happened in your area? Have you witnessed the introduction of uselessness and done nothing except complain bitterly amongst yourselves?
you have an effectively unlimited budget
This one pisses me off. The idea of a 'budget'. I hate the whole concept of cross charging/internal billing/time=money rubbish. Programmers, even contractors like myself, have a fixed price to the company. We cost the same wether we are working on something beneficial or just playing FreeCell. There is no 'budget', there's only priorities. My number 1 biggest hate in my industry is when I'm forbidden to work on something that would actually be useful to the organisation (i.e.: fix broken programs, add much needed features, reduce workload, increase accurate data recording (NO! EXCEL IS NOT A GOOD WAY OF STORING CORPORATE DATA!!), automate processes, and, hey why not, maybe even a bit of synergy leveraging as well) and then told to waste time on some goal less unplanned directionless senior management fluff project. Limited budget is just bollocks, payroll clerks keep plonking away day after day doing their job without worrying about "limited Budgets" it should be the same for us.
you're working for a software-only company which is only successful because of its innovation, not because it has to deliver specific functionality to specific clients
OK, that's a tough one, but if you (your company) cant deliver what you promised then someone has been telling porky pies or is just plain old incompetent. The developers have told fibs about what they can deliver, Marketing have told fibs about what is on offer, the project manager has told fibs during his hiring, the IT manager is that guy from the cartoons with the funny hair. Call these bad people to task or shut up because you've made *that* choice. (My pay is good enough for me to work in these conditions)
We (me to I'm afraid) have all just gotten used to working in crappy mediocre environments and just accept all the shit we deal with day to day as being part of the job. This guys piece should remind us that work doesn't actually have to be so painful.
Whose to blame, well, our bosses could certainly do their jobs a hell of a lot better, but we have to do more as well. Having a cry on
If only the people we need to have those one-one chats with weren't all sociopaths whose great solution to problems is to get rid of the person who reports them... sigh...
You want to fire up an Amiga then. Im pretty sure you could plug 2 mice/mouses/micee/dodads into and 'boink', a second cursor would appear on screen. Dueling pointers anyone?
It was great for playing a 2 player dungeon master style game called bloodwych (or something). Happy days indeed.
Very true,
But Isn't one of great rallying cries for the anit Linux movement: 'Its To Hard To Install'?
Mate your not alone. We recently did a search for mdbs over our state-wide departments fileservers and found over 2000 access databases. OVER 2000 FRICKEN DATABASES! we don't have half that number of employees. Even if only a third of those things where actually still in use, that's a lot of corporate data scattered around in impossible to get locations.
This one dude who no longer works for the organisation seems to be responsible for a lot of them, and they are all called 'TRAKKA'. Vehicle Trakka's, Correspondence Trakka's, File Trakka's, Travel Trakka. [JOKE]We had to build out own Trakka Trakka![/JOKE] Its unbelievable. Each and every one of is a terrible insight into how 'Joe Average' does his coding. Take for example the ultimate way to save the data on a form: Move forward one record, move backwards one record. The built in form logic does the save. Oh.. My.. God..
We are slowly getting back into control. We have removed access proper from peoples desktops and deployed the runtime files only. If someone wants access they have to ask for it and we try to make sure they know what they are doing.
The saddest thing is that we could fix it all. We have a small team of competent developers that could make the hurt go away. But because of 'cross billing' no section is prepared to spend money on fixing something that they perceive as not a problem. Not a problem until the data is needed and by then its to late. So we end up putting emergency band aids on these things (have to shower afterwards, feel so dirty) instead of taking the time to 'Do It Right'.
Back on topic, Joel got it 100% right: Users Just See Pixels. Just like Ive got no understanding of the complexities of my car, they have no understanding of the complexities of business applications. I don't pop the bonnet and force in another engine to make my car go twice as fast, but users think that they can do the programming equivalent to their systems. Yikes!
Visual C++ is not just Visual Basic with a different programming language component. I wish it were, or I wish they had a product like that.
That would be C#
Iraq keeps having peaceful elections.
I just did a quick Google search on Iraq, election and violence.
This is obviously a new meaning to the word 'peaceful' that has yet to make it to the dictionaries.
They want to be sure that they can slash someone's balls in two when it does not work
But the funny thing is, when things don't work and budget targets whoosh by, NOTHING HAPPENS! The big billing boys either just shrug their shoulders or bury you in blame avoidance procedure, all the while sucking money out of your business. I have yet to see a major software/service provider get seriously chewed out.
t's just good business sense. If you could cripple your competitors' OSes while acquiring things you wanted, wouldn't you do it?
No.
Im not quite sure what your point is with this example, but it seems to be scoring a point for good ol science. You extrapolated a theory based on observed evidence, namely: "A bag with 1 marble in it weighs X units, therefore a bag will always contain a number marbles equal to the weight of the bag in units divided by X". The theory was tested by looking in a bag that weighed 9 units and finding it contained 4 marbles, a piece of cheese and a magical anti mass marble. The theory was proved false and you either give up in disgust or try a different approach to the universal sack theory.
Belief comes into play when there might be a sack, but no one can see it, and if they do, they cant tell anyone else whats inside, and someone says about that sack "I believe there are 10 marbles inside and you cant disprove it therefor I am correct".
It saddens me when people take advantage of those who are broad minded enough to think 'you know, Im pretty sure about why things are and how things work, but if someone is prepared to present me with evidence to the contrary, Ill update my thinking.
Loading screen games patented? Thats insane! In my c64 years there were heaps of tape games that let you while away the bordom of the 15 minute load time with some QIX or Space invaders type action. (Its been many years now, but Im quite sure that Phantom of the asteroids had one.)
Ah yes, good ol real heat, much better than that artificial heat those cheaper restaurants use...
Perhaps the VAT/GST tax initiatives your thinking of (aus/eng) dont stop tax evasion because thay where implimented on top of already complex tax stuctures instead of replacing them. They have made the tax rules even more complex which can only aid in tax evasion scams.
I cant think of one country that has gone for the 'flat tax' method in its pure form, which is a pity because it seems like a good idea. (Though valid points have been raised, I suppose business would have to contine paying tax on their yearly profits [I think here in AUS this is around 30%])
Here in AUS a few of us are trying to put together a political party to voice the concerns of the IT world.
We want to be more than screaming chickens and are doing something about it.
But we need more members.
http://www.neteffect.org.au/
The best part is that we are in our infancy and you CAN make a difference.
Funny, but a bit unfair.
If you stop any large established system straight away, of course there will be chaos.
Take the sewer system for example, if you filled up all the pipes overnight, there would be a horrible mess and chaos. That doesn't mean we could not function without a sewer. If we returned the poo vans along side the garbage trucks, embarked on a major education campaign and did a lot of house renovations, there would be grumbling and complaints, but the old way would be gone and the new (or even older) way would be working and nothing would have to hit the fan.
Replacing any system, even over time, is a very hard task, but it can be done. A business can run without computers, but it probably wont run as efficiently or as profitably as it did with them.
Access Killer? Right on!
I cant wait for an application like that which I can unleash at my current site. it would ruthlessly hunt down and kill the 500+ (and thats just on the file server) databases wizarded up by clueless fools and their Dummies book.
[Dont get me wrong, its a great tool, but if I find the idiot that made it a mandatory desktop application its headbutt time]
RobotRunAmok wrote: When the fifes stop tweeting, the drums stop rum-tumming, and all the clenched fists make their collective way out of the air and back into blue-jeaned pockets, small children still need new shoes, and the writers, artists, and musicians who are their moms and dads have to buy them
Uhmmm, yes, thats true. But wasnt that what the time limited monopoly was for? Cool, you wrote a song. You got 10 years to make money off it, then you will have to write a new one or you and your kiddy dont get shoes. Deal with it
Maybe the coffee hasnt kicked in yet, I kept reading this one as 'write print utter rubbish' and thinking "Well, thats the end of the arts degree at my local university... excellent"
Having to pay $10 more than you should for a Britney Spears CD isn't going to hurt the economy
Wot? Call me an economically challenged dumb-arse, but isn't that 10$ per CD is going into big ol faceless record corporations pockets? For doing sweet bugger all?
I think Id rather use my 10$ PER CD to support a local restaurant, buy something physical that is actually WORTH the money it costs, or maybe even buy more music!? Surely the money is better for the economy spread out all over the place, purchase things that its actually worth. How is paying $30 for goods worth $5 (and I'm being generous) good for the economy?
My view: 5 year IP Copyright.. for everything. You write a book, great. You have 5 years after publishing to make money of it, after that, if some publishing house can publish your book in hard cover, on quality paper for HALF THE PRICE OF WHAT I PAID FOR MY FALL TO BITS PAPER BACK that more power to them. Made a killer app, milk it for all its worth, but after 5 years anyone can burn it and do what they like.
(Offtopic I know, but....)
I read a lot of comments in slashdot moaning about "Big Business(tm) gets away with murder", "The pollies are useless corrupt vagabonds", "Something must be done", blah blah blah.
Sometimes there are more active posts like "Send a fax to this congressman", "Use this e-mail template to get your view to CEO X"
Why not go one step further? Why doesnt the America slashdot crowd get of their collective arses and form their own political party? I have only a vague idea on how the American political system works, but if MIKE MOORE can get a FICUS elected (nearly) with under 100 votes, surely a group of intelligent individuals can do the same? If nothing else, It would be a very interesting social experiment to see how the average soap box standing shashdot idealist responds to the pressures and temptations of public office.
Of course, I should be doing this myself my own country (Aussie-land) before my favourite senator bans the Internet entirely because it is responsible for BAD THINGS(tm). Ill just be quiet now and join the rest of the mice wondering why one of the others doesnt put the bell on the sleeping cat.
..I can give the license plate numbers of those bloody 'doof doof doof' cars that drive past with the windows rolled down to the RIA? They are 'sharing' their music with people that don't own it!
Come to think of it, our neighbours play their movies real loud sometimes! Those damn terrorists are 'sharing' that movie with me against my will!
Maybe all this is a blessing in disguise for those of us that JWTGTSAT! (Just want to go to sleep at ten)