In my country, being 17 would void anything agreed or said by the guy in legal matters. MS should have contacted the parents, the only ones who can deal with these affairs. Because legally, this guy is a child. And his behaviour is... guess what. Childish.
Well, in Spain the telcos say that they'll focus in data services for 3G. But it's going to be funny how they are going to fail miserably again. Now, for GPRS, they charge around 6euro/Mb (it varies from 24 to 1.5 euro/Mb, depending on minimum usage per month). As UTMS is supposed to be faster, they'll expectedly want to charge more, which will expectedly lead to even less usage. Who the hell is going to pay even 1euro/Mb? Maybe some corps and some geeks? But not many. They are convinced they can put anything down our throats through ads, but they already failed with WAP, they are failing with GPRS and they will fail again with UTMS/3G. At our expense, through existing GSM calls: 20 cents per minute? WTF? GSM infrastructure already paid for itself years ago. But people still call and pay, so they have a healthy cow to milk while they take absurd adventures...
Unlike the corporate world, working but ugly code is hidden deeper and deeper, and people go out of their way to avoid it. False. It's like alcohol and women: there are no ugly women, just lack of alcohol. Just find and replace women with code and alcohol with pressure.
If he's wrong, all that will happen is that his distro will fail. No, what will happen is that we'll have yet another "unifying" distro that will balcanize again the linux market, which goes in the opposite direction that BP wants.
Or is it? Look at what TrollTech say here - TT don't want you using Free Qt on inhouse projects, but the GPL says you can. This makes me distrust TrollTech. Yeah! they have a record of pissing off the Open Source Community. Come on, be kind. Mail them complaining about that, maybe they correct the FAQ. After all, it's their policy that if you take it for free, you should pay the community back. If being the default desktop of UserLinux is so important to KDE, why don't they re-implement their desktop ontop of an LGLP'd toolkit? Pleaaaase. Can you spell demagogy?
Ok, name me 3 pieces of commercial software more complicated than solitaire made with gtk. If anybody can fill these 3 gaps, I'll start considering that argument of "gtk doesn't require royalties for closed source development", despite the fact that you have to use bindings to do OO programming with gtk.
UserLinux will include and install Gnome by default, and the developer effort will be geared toward GTK.
Which will kill the project from begin, because every KDE fan will actively promote any other option which doesn't make it so blatant that they will not support kde. Maybe is the "UserLinux May Go Without KDE" title of the article, but it really pissed me off the way that they have dismissed kde. Because
Why? Because GTK is royalty-free in all situations, unlike QT, and UserLinux is building a royalty-free development environment. (Again and again) quite arguable. Qt is far better that gtk (of course IMHO) in terms of development, and I think that the only thing that makes gnome a decent product is the exellence of their programmers. Non-OO GUI programming in the XXI century? Come on... Ok, you have bindings, but... So. Royalty free. 1000$ for a commercial licence is not that much to pay for if you're not going to make GPL apps. And for the distro, you get a free and much better (again IMHO) framework.
All of you folks wanking about choice should remember that a choice has been made. It is a choice to simplify at the expense of having only a single desktop. It simply happens to be a choice you don't like. Too bad. A choice has been made by Bruce Perens and redhat. Yeah, their choice, not mine. Stop whining because your favorite didn't get picked for the beauty pageant... I will whine as much as I want about a decision I don't like, thank you, Stalin.
Including both or more would dilute development efforts, not to mention confuse Harry Homeowner, who is only interested in writing docs, and playing MP3s.
And then, why include the worst of the two?;) Seriously, things are not done like that. Trying to push a standard, and starting by pissing everyone who uses one of the most used desktop is not a good way to start. Freedesktop is. Instead of "choosing", they try to integrate everyone, take everyone on board. And in order not to dilute development efforts, they work in what is agreed: interoperability. Work in common things. Most "KDE folks" are willing to throw DCOP, their tech, in favor of a common one, D-BUS. That's how things are done.
The KDE folks are cranky because they want the money that is to be spent promoting and developing UserLinux to be spent on their project and not on Gnome. And from where do you get that? Maybe they just want a piece of the cake, knowing that they have a just-as-better desktop?
I already detailed some problems of solving the situation in ceuta & melilla, that is, we in Spain talk about what to do there. Do you think it would be fair for the spanish people there to say "Hey, now you live in Morocco, be happy with your new king and don't forget to shut up or you might be imprisioned". Is not that simple. But still, as I already said, they are in Morocco's territory. And for gibraltar is the same case. It is in spanish territory, yet people is not very interested or worried about it. But in gibraltar spanish and english is spoken, and UK and Spain are in the UE, so... we really don't care very much about it. Our government can say whatever they like (it's a colony in the 21st century, blah blah blah) but it's not that the people in spain want gibraltar back from england more than, say, peace in the vasque country or a better job.
The deepest tunnel currently is in Japan and is 100m below a 140m channel. Engineering a tunnel 240m down is seriously non-trivial, and Japan is seriously hooked-in when it comes to engineering. Spain and Morocco, really have no hope of pulling this off without outsourcing the whole deal.
From the spanish POV: Well, we have no experience in building tunnels under the sea, but we have a lot of experience in bulding them "under the mountain". Madrid is sorrounded by mountains and is still connected by high speed railways and a lot of highways. We've got a really steep orography in many places of Spain. Don't dismiss our engineering expertise so fast, you insensitive clod!;)
Since then, Spain has been trying to make it an independant country so that they could fish within it's territorial waters for cheap. Now THAT is a very touchy subject for your average moroccan. You know..pride, territorial integrity, yadda yadda. The government has been stalling a referendum supposed to take place there and giving incentives to Moroccans to relocate there in hopes of skewing a future vote. He he, everyone's interests are involved, including US and France, that have got licence for phosphate mines among other things... granted by Morocco, that would, of course be invalid should Sahara become independent. Of course, I take for granted that Spain has also economic interests there, but our media will not talk about it;)
A few hundred years ago, Spain conquered a couple of northern moroccan cities (sebta and imlilia a.k.a ceuta and melilla). They have been spanish ever since but Morocco still officially wants them returned (The truth is no moroccan I've ever known cares about that.) Morocco didn't even exist as a country when "we had" ceuta and melilla. But it is true that they are, indeed, in Morocco's territory. The solution is pretty hard. They are two cities full of spanish people, with spanish culture! what do you do with them, if you hand control to Morocco? Treat them like tourists? (shut up, Arzallus). So, it's hard that the situation will change. The territory they take is very small, and Morocco benefits from the close distance for commerce, etc. so it's used primarly as a Trowable politically, as there is no political will to have the affair solved.
Well, sorry to burst your bubble, but that is not going away any time soon, no matter how much you steal. (I wonder if car thieves steal because they are opposed to automobile manufacturers' business practices. Anybody know?:P) It's not that is a bubble that I have. Again, I don't want free lunch. And I'm not stealing, I'm infringing copyright. The analogy with cars would be that I steal a cd to the manufacturer (or particular), which is not exactly the same. And I don't see it as a correct behaviour in general; but think of some tea that was thrown to the sea... was it good or bad behaviour?
In Spain we have a public forum in the Senate where you can rant about anything... and they say that some senators even read it! The problem is that in my country political parties are more important that in yours, and they practice voting discipline. Which means that when you join a party it seems that you loose all opinions (at least publically) and you are not allowed to disagree to the official opinion. Which leads to reduce the direct influence of a politician you convince. Indirectly the influence affects the opinion of the whole. But it is very dissapointing to find that something a congressman has said to you is not applied in the end (and this has happened to me -in a conference at a lan party, BTW-).
only a small handful of comments that actual advocate it. Like this: I don't buy music, and I "steal" it. Well, I really would "steal" it if there was something worth "stealing". I'm exercising civil disobedience, because I don't agree with most laws in my country (and in your country, if you are in the US) regarding copyright. Because they force me to abide by the law but not them. They price-fix, they commit every kind of illegal monopolistic action without me-the-society being compensated. So I call to civil disobedience because is the most harming (for them) way of sending the message that current laws are not right. And if you think of it, it is just a mini-revolution: we are being opressed by our government and have to get rid of that opression. And no, I don't want "free lunch". I only pay for what is worth to me, and if it is expensive, I don't get it even if I want it and could steal it: a canon ixus v3 or a tungsten t3, for example;)
Be serious. $2000 per developer is nothing in terms of a large company. They spend more in coffee machines. And pricing is more flexible than that; if you buy 11 - 20 licences, they cost $1240. Just imagine for a large company. And no, you don't need to update every year, it would be more reasonable to update every 2-3 years and just buy manteinance (if you see you need it, you can test it for one year after all), that is way cheaper: for 11 - 20 developers is $380 per year.
Overall cost for 3 years, with this scheme: $666 for the professional edition, $1000 for the enterprise edition, per developer per year. Believe me. That's nothing.
It is difficult to set up a market mechanism that significantly lowers everyone's payoff for defecting against cooperation. No driver licence for one month? That's what they are doing in my country for serious issues...
He doesn't even get that IBM and sun back OSS projects to some extent. Back like in producinglots of free software? Did OSS start as a "pet project"? Maybe. But now, for many, is just a tool to make money. A lot of of money. The fact that the community is also beneffited is "collateral damage" for them.
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In my country, being 17 would void anything agreed or said by the guy in legal matters. MS should have contacted the parents, the only ones who can deal with these affairs.
Because legally, this guy is a child. And his behaviour is... guess what. Childish.
Well, in Spain the telcos say that they'll focus in data services for 3G. But it's going to be funny how they are going to fail miserably again. Now, for GPRS, they charge around 6euro/Mb (it varies from 24 to 1.5 euro/Mb, depending on minimum usage per month).
As UTMS is supposed to be faster, they'll expectedly want to charge more, which will expectedly lead to even less usage.
Who the hell is going to pay even 1euro/Mb? Maybe some corps and some geeks? But not many.
They are convinced they can put anything down our throats through ads, but they already failed with WAP, they are failing with GPRS and they will fail again with UTMS/3G. At our expense, through existing GSM calls: 20 cents per minute? WTF? GSM infrastructure already paid for itself years ago. But people still call and pay, so they have a healthy cow to milk while they take absurd adventures...
Unlike the corporate world, working but ugly code is hidden deeper and deeper, and people go out of their way to avoid it.
False. It's like alcohol and women: there are no ugly women, just lack of alcohol. Just find and replace women with code and alcohol with pressure.
Mmmm... Dune?
;)...
A whole universe full of different cultures, close combat, range combat
Oh. I forgot. And Kevin J Anderson & Herbert's son to spoil it all.
If he's wrong, all that will happen is that his distro will fail.
No, what will happen is that we'll have yet another "unifying" distro that will balcanize again the linux market, which goes in the opposite direction that BP wants.
Or is it? Look at what TrollTech say here - TT don't want you using Free Qt on inhouse projects, but the GPL says you can. This makes me distrust TrollTech.
Yeah! they have a record of pissing off the Open Source Community. Come on, be kind. Mail them complaining about that, maybe they correct the FAQ. After all, it's their policy that if you take it for free, you should pay the community back.
If being the default desktop of UserLinux is so important to KDE, why don't they re-implement their desktop ontop of an LGLP'd toolkit?
Pleaaaase. Can you spell demagogy?
If anybody can fill these 3 gaps, I'll start considering that argument of "gtk doesn't require royalties for closed source development", despite the fact that you have to use bindings to do OO programming with gtk.
UserLinux will include and install Gnome by default, and the developer effort will be geared toward GTK.
Which will kill the project from begin, because every KDE fan will actively promote any other option which doesn't make it so blatant that they will not support kde. Maybe is the "UserLinux May Go Without KDE" title of the article, but it really pissed me off the way that they have dismissed kde. Because
Why? Because GTK is royalty-free in all situations, unlike QT, and UserLinux is building a royalty-free development environment.
(Again and again) quite arguable. Qt is far better that gtk (of course IMHO) in terms of development, and I think that the only thing that makes gnome a decent product is the exellence of their programmers. Non-OO GUI programming in the XXI century? Come on... Ok, you have bindings, but...
So. Royalty free. 1000$ for a commercial licence is not that much to pay for if you're not going to make GPL apps. And for the distro, you get a free and much better (again IMHO) framework.
All of you folks wanking about choice should remember that a choice has been made. It is a choice to simplify at the expense of having only a single desktop. It simply happens to be a choice you don't like. Too bad.
A choice has been made by Bruce Perens and redhat. Yeah, their choice, not mine.
Stop whining because your favorite didn't get picked for the beauty pageant...
I will whine as much as I want about a decision I don't like, thank you, Stalin.
Including both or more would dilute development efforts, not to mention confuse Harry Homeowner, who is only interested in writing docs, and playing MP3s.
And then, why include the worst of the two?
Seriously, things are not done like that. Trying to push a standard, and starting by pissing everyone who uses one of the most used desktop is not a good way to start.
Freedesktop is. Instead of "choosing", they try to integrate everyone, take everyone on board. And in order not to dilute development efforts, they work in what is agreed: interoperability. Work in common things. Most "KDE folks" are willing to throw DCOP, their tech, in favor of a common one, D-BUS. That's how things are done.
The KDE folks are cranky because they want the money that is to be spent promoting and developing UserLinux to be spent on their project and not on Gnome.
And from where do you get that?
Maybe they just want a piece of the cake, knowing that they have a just-as-better desktop?
Merriam-Webster. Purist: one who adheres strictly and often excessively to a tradition.
Me. Purist linux: something to uselessly lose your time doing something that doesn't need to be done, just for the sake of it.
I already detailed some problems of solving the situation in ceuta & melilla, that is, we in Spain talk about what to do there. Do you think it would be fair for the spanish people there to say "Hey, now you live in Morocco, be happy with your new king and don't forget to shut up or you might be imprisioned". Is not that simple. But still, as I already said, they are in Morocco's territory. ... we really don't care very much about it. Our government can say whatever they like (it's a colony in the 21st century, blah blah blah) but it's not that the people in spain want gibraltar back from england more than, say, peace in the vasque country or a better job.
And for gibraltar is the same case. It is in spanish territory, yet people is not very interested or worried about it. But in gibraltar spanish and english is spoken, and UK and Spain are in the UE, so
The deepest tunnel currently is in Japan and is 100m below a 140m channel. Engineering a tunnel 240m down is seriously non-trivial, and Japan is seriously hooked-in when it comes to engineering. Spain and Morocco, really have no hope of pulling this off without outsourcing the whole deal.
From the spanish POV: Well, we have no experience in building tunnels under the sea, but we have a lot of experience in bulding them "under the mountain". Madrid is sorrounded by mountains and is still connected by high speed railways and a lot of highways. We've got a really steep orography in many places of Spain. Don't dismiss our engineering expertise so fast, you insensitive clod!
Since then, Spain has been trying to make it an independant country so that they could fish within it's territorial waters for cheap. Now THAT is a very touchy subject for your average moroccan. You know..pride, territorial integrity, yadda yadda. The government has been stalling a referendum supposed to take place there and giving incentives to Moroccans to relocate there in hopes of skewing a future vote. ;)
He he, everyone's interests are involved, including US and France, that have got licence for phosphate mines among other things... granted by Morocco, that would, of course be invalid should Sahara become independent.
Of course, I take for granted that Spain has also economic interests there, but our media will not talk about it
A few hundred years ago, Spain conquered a couple of northern moroccan cities (sebta and imlilia a.k.a ceuta and melilla). They have been spanish ever since but Morocco still officially wants them returned (The truth is no moroccan I've ever known cares about that.)
Morocco didn't even exist as a country when "we had" ceuta and melilla. But it is true that they are, indeed, in Morocco's territory. The solution is pretty hard. They are two cities full of spanish people, with spanish culture! what do you do with them, if you hand control to Morocco? Treat them like tourists? (shut up, Arzallus). So, it's hard that the situation will change. The territory they take is very small, and Morocco benefits from the close distance for commerce, etc. so it's used primarly as a Trowable politically, as there is no political will to have the affair solved.
Er... not language-geography zealoting, but Greenland is not a country, is part of Denmark.
Yeah, that little coutry that looks like a funny hat on Germany. Not yet? Yes! the one that Bluetooth was king of!
It's just that socialism only works based on good will, which is not the case in government, but it is the case in free software.
Well, sorry to burst your bubble, but that is not going away any time soon, no matter how much you steal. (I wonder if car thieves steal because they are opposed to automobile manufacturers' business practices. Anybody know? :P)
It's not that is a bubble that I have. Again, I don't want free lunch. And I'm not stealing, I'm infringing copyright. The analogy with cars would be that I steal a cd to the manufacturer (or particular), which is not exactly the same. And I don't see it as a correct behaviour in general; but think of some tea that was thrown to the sea... was it good or bad behaviour?
In Spain we have a public forum in the Senate where you can rant about anything... and they say that some senators even read it!
The problem is that in my country political parties are more important that in yours, and they practice voting discipline. Which means that when you join a party it seems that you loose all opinions (at least publically) and you are not allowed to disagree to the official opinion. Which leads to reduce the direct influence of a politician you convince. Indirectly the influence affects the opinion of the whole. But it is very dissapointing to find that something a congressman has said to you is not applied in the end (and this has happened to me -in a conference at a lan party, BTW-).
only a small handful of comments that actual advocate it. ;)
Like this:
I don't buy music, and I "steal" it. Well, I really would "steal" it if there was something worth "stealing". I'm exercising civil disobedience, because I don't agree with most laws in my country (and in your country, if you are in the US) regarding copyright. Because they force me to abide by the law but not them. They price-fix, they commit every kind of illegal monopolistic action without me-the-society being compensated.
So I call to civil disobedience because is the most harming (for them) way of sending the message that current laws are not right. And if you think of it, it is just a mini-revolution: we are being opressed by our government and have to get rid of that opression.
And no, I don't want "free lunch". I only pay for what is worth to me, and if it is expensive, I don't get it even if I want it and could steal it: a canon ixus v3 or a tungsten t3, for example
They were not voted on, we didn't elect them. The President didn't appoint them.
Right, but they appointed the president, they are the great electors.
Be serious. $2000 per developer is nothing in terms of a large company. They spend more in coffee machines. And pricing is more flexible than that; if you buy 11 - 20 licences, they cost $1240. Just imagine for a large company. And no, you don't need to update every year, it would be more reasonable to update every 2-3 years and just buy manteinance (if you see you need it, you can test it for one year after all), that is way cheaper: for 11 - 20 developers is $380 per year.
Overall cost for 3 years, with this scheme: $666 for the professional edition, $1000 for the enterprise edition, per developer per year. Believe me. That's nothing.
It is difficult to set up a market mechanism that significantly lowers everyone's payoff for defecting against cooperation.
No driver licence for one month? That's what they are doing in my country for serious issues...
He doesn't even get that IBM and sun back OSS projects to some extent.
Back like in producing lots of free software?
Did OSS start as a "pet project"? Maybe. But now, for many, is just a tool to make money. A lot of of money. The fact that the community is also beneffited is "collateral damage" for them.