I'll have to read up on it. I haven't observed any more issues with AMD64 users over anyone else - it's seemed like a fairly smooth transition so far.
People will always have trouble using their computers, but they might be talking a little louder since they're running AMD64, and thus everything wrong with their machines MUST be caused by that.
I've handled hundreds of AMD chips, and I've never had one single DOA broken one, ever. The only broken AMD CPU I have owned was an Athlon 900Mhz chip, because I fucked up and busted the chip by putting too much pressure while installing the heat-sink.
I should mention that AMD not only replaced the thing for free, they sent me a 950Mhz chip, and sent it overnight delivery, no charge.
Since then, I have been a lot more careful installing heat sinks. The Pentium 3 "flip chips" were *EXACTLY* the same as the Athlons, and you could break them just as easily.
I call bullshit on you for that FUD. And not to mention, the Athlon 64's all have a heat spreader on them now, so your point is moot.
AMD Processors have always treated me very well. I never have problems with them, and they always run how I expect them to run, plus some. Intel makes good CPU's too, and I use them as well.
I'm not sure why you weren't fired after snapping the 10th CPU? Or the 100th?
You won't find dual Athlons, but you can find Dual Opteron systems. If you build your own systems, the major motherboard vendors all sell multi-cpu Opteron boards. If you're looking for pre-fab, Sun makes them, and some others do too.
You'll get more bang for your buck with a 2-way Opteron then a 2-Way Xeon, that's for certian. And if you run Linux, you can run 64-bit versions of your distribution, squeezing more performance out of the thing (depending on the application, you can see 30% or more performance for compiling in 64-bit alone.) Not to mention, if you run 64-bit, you can access all your memory above 4GB without tricks.
But back to the point, your friend works at a small company, so he has the luxery of being able to make those descisions and make it work. Where I work, where we have well over 600 servers, over 8,000 workstations.. Going AMD is a very tough sell. Most larger companies are the same. Only a few manage to break the trend and do great things like move to Linux, or move from IE to Mozilla, etc. The rest follow pack.
It sucks, but that's the way it goes. Eventually, if/when enough people DO make changes to something like AMD processors, it gains more momentum, and more people switch, and more momentum is gained..
Most businesses go with Intel because they have always done so, and it's what most vendors like HP, Dell, and IBM push.
They might have some Opterons in their line-up, and they might be faster boxes, but when it comes to a production environment most bosses would rather go with what they've been buying and what has been working. Even if it's more expensive and doesn't run as fast.
It takes an IT manager that's well educated in the current state of technology, as well as the technical people under him or her, to stray from the straight line they've been running down for so long. I'll always be one of the guys that tries to get people to consider alternatives but I think most people know how that goes most of the time.
Athlons have always been fairly LOW latency chips, and the memory used (fast DDR memory) is low latency too.
The P4's on the other hand have used Rambus memory for awhile, although that's not really the case anymore. But when they did, they always excelled at memory THROUGHPUT because Rambus runs at high frequencies. Rambus memory however is fairly latent - it's the trade-off.
DDR2 RAM won't be "fast" until we see it in much higher speeds - DDR2-800 most likely. Of course, it will always have more latency then DDR because it uses four banks of DRAM instead of two.. I'm sure you can research all this via google if you're interested in learning more.
I'm planning on checking that out soon, it looks like a really neat feature.
The best thing though would be if I could make my GTK apps use the file dialogues from KDE, and allow me to open files as a KDE app can - over it's nifty network transparency stuff as mentioned in this article! Then, the system would be complete. Okay, almost.
It's garbage because it's off topic and very typical of a Mac zealot to say something like that.
I admit, you don't sound quite as unresonable as some Zealots, but you did post that just the same. The article nor slashdot post wasn't about usability, it was about resource transparency.
And to proclaim that KDE is "ugly and clunky compared to OS X or even windows" - such an objective thing say that you can't just preach it like it's fact. Personally, I feel too confined in OS X. It's okay I guess, and I like the shadows under the windows, but I find the interface to be unyeilding and stubborn. KDE is prettier then Windows I think, and it functions very similar to Windows. And I think the Windows UI is very usable, it works for me.
Just because your preference is MacOS doesn't mean that KDE or Gnome are worse.
My KDE desktop is clean, it's fast, and very accessable. I really don't see how I can ask for much more than that at this point? The rest is on the horizon, and with the rate that OSS progresses it won't be long before there's no more arguement against it.
That didn't take long. I was thinking that I would have to scroll down more then one page to see that garbage.
KDE is pretty damned easy to use and consistent too, it's just that not all applications are written in QT, just as not all Gnome apps are written in GTK. So, you get some apps that don't fall in line with the look and feel of the rest of the OS.
So is the way of the Linux desktop right now, and you can't single out KDE for that.
Your atari 2600 or Nintendo didn't have a magnetic and mechanical hard drive, or a mechanical DVD Drive with an optical lense, did it?
Perhaps your Tandy has floppy drives, but unlss you use them, floppy drive *sometimes* last a long time. But the same could be said about a hard drive if you never plug it in.
Not saying that the Xbox shouldn't run longer then a year, but you can't compare a device with moving parts to a device with no moving parts.
"Well, you'll find they come out a lot when new software is released.
For example, GZ posts often look like this:
I'm already emerging it. Guess the rest of you guys will have to wait... "
I see. So in rebuttal, we must post 5,000 posts in every Linux (or even not Linux) article about how the Gentoo users are still compiling something, or whatever. Rigth?
I've used Gentoo for quite awhile- it's really pretty good if you give it a chance. Compile times are only bad if you're trying to run Linux on a Pentium 233MMX chip because your Athlon 64 is too busy running Windows XP. With a new system, even X compiles in minutes, not hours.
So it's all blown out of context in one big viscious clusterfuck of a circle. Anti-Gentoo Zealot Zealots bitch about Gentoo, and the Gentoo Zealots are forced to prove Gentoo is good, and meanwhile any of the non-zealot Gentoo users are flamed when they mention it.
I've never made my Linux boxes completly unbootable. I've always put in a link to the old kernel, or something.
Actually, I can't say that - one time lilo locked up the system while installing, and that caused it to not boot. But since that was a bootloader thing, this nifty compile-at-boot thing wouldn't help anyways.
This kind of crap has always been widespread, from the times of the BBS to the times of the MMORPG's.
*Usually* the name calling, throwing a pissy fit, and the general hate comes from young boys. They have a lot of rage, and they can take it out in online games without fear of reprecussions.
I've been playing online games for many years now. Back with KALI + Descent 2, through UT and Tactical Ops, and through OU, EQ, and now EQ2. The crap's the same. It'll always be there. But in some places, it's much worse the others.
I ran some TacOps servers a couple years back, and it was a LOT of fun. We had some great kids and adults alike play on our servers, and we basically just went nuts. Marathons on single maps all night, clan wars, and everything else. But always there would be the little kidding that enter the server, do stupid shit, call people names, and eventually get banned.
There's actually a lot less of that kind of nonsense in games like Everquest. EQ's been out for awhile, and a lot of the players have been playing for years. The average age in many top guilds is in the mid-20's. While age along doesn't come close to stop people from being assholes, it does eliminate a lot of the name calling, racial slurs, and general chaos.
Hop on a UT2004 server, however, and you'll be playing with a bunch of punk 14 year old boys that have no problem calling you a *beep* beep *beep* because you killed them once out of the 25 times they killed you.
I await the games where you need to prove your age, and be at least 18 years old to play.
I still play some of the old classics, like Super Ghouls and Ghosts (SNES), the sonics (Genesis) and some not-TOO-old games like F-ZeroX (N64) and the N64 Zelda.
Not to mention the thousands of MAME titles and such..
With emulators, games will never die. The XBox is actually pretty awesome when it comes to this - all these emulators are available on a modded Xbox, for play on a full TV screen. You can even get controller adapters to hook up old Atari, Nintendo, etc controllers!
Re:+4 insightful to the guy who's never run AIX :-
on
Tiger Early Start Kit
·
· Score: 1
I've been working with Messaging for years, and even on Novell networks, most people choose to run Exchange over Groupwise.
But, Groupwise does deserve mention I suppose with it's Exchangeish features and Outlook integration, with shared calendars.
Maybe some really big shops run the Oracle stuff, but I've never seen it.
Well, although it would be great if the big graphics vendors (ATI, nVidia, etc..) worked together to make OSS video boards, it really seems very unlikely considering there's some competition in the market.
Unlike Microsoft, where there really isn't any, the ATI and nVidia rivalry is keeping things moving at an acceptable pace - just as the AMD and Intel rivalry has raised the bar in x86 performance.
We need Linux to be free of OS lock-in and to get out from under Microsoft. We don't really NEED a free and open video board, when there's competition in the market and the vendors follow what standards exist.
Even if they use some special config tools to manage the systems, even if it's not free, and even if they outright closed sourced all their own code - it's NOT pointless and it's NOT lock-in!
It's Linux. What is the biggest thing holding people to Windows? Applications. If you run your entire company off of Xandros, and run a bunch of Linux apps on it that people become dependant on - where does the lock-in happen that's implied by your use of the word Proprietary?
You could switch off of Xandros to something else fairly easily at that point. Once you're off Windows, which Xandros helps you do quite a bit more then some of the other distributions, you can then take another step onto, say, RedHat, or Mandrake, or SuSE, or whatever.
There's no lock-in, therefore there's no problem, in my opinion. I believe the core operating system and libraries need to remain open, GPL or what-not, in order to keep things going. But I don't believe that every single little aspect of the system is required to be GPL or even Open Source. I'd prefer it was GPL, for real. But it won't kill the market if it isn't.
You can choose to use it, or not. Either way, the software that runs on it will run on any Linux, and that's what seperates it from the Windows monopoly.
Actually, in Windows XP Professionsl, the Remote Desktop connection will connect you to your desktop, not create a new one. This means, whatever you had running will now be available in your session, and your desktop's console becomes locked. Once you unlock your console, you once again see the same desktop.
It's actually pretty nice, it's fast, it supports drive, sound, and serial port mapping too. Can't ask for much else.
Re:+4 insightful to the guy who's never run AIX :-
on
Tiger Early Start Kit
·
· Score: 2, Insightful
"Oh yeah, Lotus/Domino sucks just as much as MS Exchange."
I was following you, and nodding a bit, until you hit this point at the end.
Notes can do some sweet things, and back before everything was a web app, it was even more useful. The whole "everything is a database" paradigm makes for an extremely useful, extensible, and powerful system - if you design and administer the system correctly. Which, I'm afraid, most people don't seem to do. E-Mail is only a small subset of the power of Notes and Domino.
On the Exchange side, nothing could be further from the truth. Exchange, especially Exchange 2000+, has proven itself as a solid e-mail centric groupware solution. It practically runs itself after the initial setup. If using IE, the web mail is an unusually pleasant webmail experience, the system is responsive and fast, and it's filled with all sorts of great stuff you can do. I've designed and maintained Exchange systems for years and besides little silly issues that are generally easy to fix.
I've been doing messaging work for quite awhile now, including work on Unix/Linux systems - Sendmail/Postfix/etc - and honestly besides Exchange and Lotus, there's really no real competition if you want something more then plain e-mail.
Yea, me too. It's not fantastic, being VNC after all. But it works pretty well, good video quality over a slower connection too. TightVNS is stable too.
I don't listen to the radio for music, just talk radio. And I usually sit on the AM band most of the time since that's where most of it's at, and AM signals tend to reach much further then an FM signal so I can keep listening as I drive around from place to place. Most of my friends are the same way - it's either A) listen to the latest pop music junk 20 times a day, or B) listen to some decent talk radio. Hmm.
If I could listen to my favorite talk shows all the time, without signal noise/drop, wherever I went, it would be very nice.
I just don't think I'm in the car QUITE enough to justify a monthly fee for it.
Slashdot Mirror
Really?
I'll have to read up on it. I haven't observed any more issues with AMD64 users over anyone else - it's seemed like a fairly smooth transition so far.
People will always have trouble using their computers, but they might be talking a little louder since they're running AMD64, and thus everything wrong with their machines MUST be caused by that.
I've handled hundreds of AMD chips, and I've never had one single DOA broken one, ever. The only broken AMD CPU I have owned was an Athlon 900Mhz chip, because I fucked up and busted the chip by putting too much pressure while installing the heat-sink.
I should mention that AMD not only replaced the thing for free, they sent me a 950Mhz chip, and sent it overnight delivery, no charge.
Since then, I have been a lot more careful installing heat sinks. The Pentium 3 "flip chips" were *EXACTLY* the same as the Athlons, and you could break them just as easily.
I call bullshit on you for that FUD. And not to mention, the Athlon 64's all have a heat spreader on them now, so your point is moot.
AMD Processors have always treated me very well. I never have problems with them, and they always run how I expect them to run, plus some. Intel makes good CPU's too, and I use them as well.
I'm not sure why you weren't fired after snapping the 10th CPU? Or the 100th?
You won't find dual Athlons, but you can find Dual Opteron systems. If you build your own systems, the major motherboard vendors all sell multi-cpu Opteron boards. If you're looking for pre-fab, Sun makes them, and some others do too.
You'll get more bang for your buck with a 2-way Opteron then a 2-Way Xeon, that's for certian. And if you run Linux, you can run 64-bit versions of your distribution, squeezing more performance out of the thing (depending on the application, you can see 30% or more performance for compiling in 64-bit alone.) Not to mention, if you run 64-bit, you can access all your memory above 4GB without tricks.
But back to the point, your friend works at a small company, so he has the luxery of being able to make those descisions and make it work. Where I work, where we have well over 600 servers, over 8,000 workstations.. Going AMD is a very tough sell. Most larger companies are the same. Only a few manage to break the trend and do great things like move to Linux, or move from IE to Mozilla, etc. The rest follow pack.
It sucks, but that's the way it goes. Eventually, if/when enough people DO make changes to something like AMD processors, it gains more momentum, and more people switch, and more momentum is gained..
Most businesses go with Intel because they have always done so, and it's what most vendors like HP, Dell, and IBM push.
They might have some Opterons in their line-up, and they might be faster boxes, but when it comes to a production environment most bosses would rather go with what they've been buying and what has been working. Even if it's more expensive and doesn't run as fast.
It takes an IT manager that's well educated in the current state of technology, as well as the technical people under him or her, to stray from the straight line they've been running down for so long. I'll always be one of the guys that tries to get people to consider alternatives but I think most people know how that goes most of the time.
Athlons have always been fairly LOW latency chips, and the memory used (fast DDR memory) is low latency too.
The P4's on the other hand have used Rambus memory for awhile, although that's not really the case anymore. But when they did, they always excelled at memory THROUGHPUT because Rambus runs at high frequencies. Rambus memory however is fairly latent - it's the trade-off.
DDR2 RAM won't be "fast" until we see it in much higher speeds - DDR2-800 most likely. Of course, it will always have more latency then DDR because it uses four banks of DRAM instead of two.. I'm sure you can research all this via google if you're interested in learning more.
Ohh yea because throwing Knoppix in a bag and only using it when Windows breaks is a really big sign of a Linux user/lover.
"The Incompatible Timesharing System?"
TITS?
Or.. if you're an unoriginal retard that thinks he's funny, it's "the bucket."
I live in Pawtucket.
I'm planning on checking that out soon, it looks like a really neat feature.
The best thing though would be if I could make my GTK apps use the file dialogues from KDE, and allow me to open files as a KDE app can - over it's nifty network transparency stuff as mentioned in this article! Then, the system would be complete. Okay, almost.
It's garbage because it's off topic and very typical of a Mac zealot to say something like that.
I admit, you don't sound quite as unresonable as some Zealots, but you did post that just the same. The article nor slashdot post wasn't about usability, it was about resource transparency.
And to proclaim that KDE is "ugly and clunky compared to OS X or even windows" - such an objective thing say that you can't just preach it like it's fact. Personally, I feel too confined in OS X. It's okay I guess, and I like the shadows under the windows, but I find the interface to be unyeilding and stubborn. KDE is prettier then Windows I think, and it functions very similar to Windows. And I think the Windows UI is very usable, it works for me.
Just because your preference is MacOS doesn't mean that KDE or Gnome are worse.
My KDE desktop is clean, it's fast, and very accessable. I really don't see how I can ask for much more than that at this point? The rest is on the horizon, and with the rate that OSS progresses it won't be long before there's no more arguement against it.
That didn't take long. I was thinking that I would have to scroll down more then one page to see that garbage.
KDE is pretty damned easy to use and consistent too, it's just that not all applications are written in QT, just as not all Gnome apps are written in GTK. So, you get some apps that don't fall in line with the look and feel of the rest of the OS.
So is the way of the Linux desktop right now, and you can't single out KDE for that.
Your atari 2600 or Nintendo didn't have a magnetic and mechanical hard drive, or a mechanical DVD Drive with an optical lense, did it?
Perhaps your Tandy has floppy drives, but unlss you use them, floppy drive *sometimes* last a long time. But the same could be said about a hard drive if you never plug it in.
Not saying that the Xbox shouldn't run longer then a year, but you can't compare a device with moving parts to a device with no moving parts.
"Well, you'll find they come out a lot when new software is released.
For example, GZ posts often look like this:
I'm already emerging it. Guess the rest of you guys will have to wait... "
I see. So in rebuttal, we must post 5,000 posts in every Linux (or even not Linux) article about how the Gentoo users are still compiling something, or whatever. Rigth?
I've used Gentoo for quite awhile- it's really pretty good if you give it a chance. Compile times are only bad if you're trying to run Linux on a Pentium 233MMX chip because your Athlon 64 is too busy running Windows XP. With a new system, even X compiles in minutes, not hours.
So it's all blown out of context in one big viscious clusterfuck of a circle. Anti-Gentoo Zealot Zealots bitch about Gentoo, and the Gentoo Zealots are forced to prove Gentoo is good, and meanwhile any of the non-zealot Gentoo users are flamed when they mention it.
Good job!
" I ordered 10 for x86 and 5 for PPC :) "
WTF? You know you can order one of each and make copies right?
Instead, you go and order 15 CD's, costing them more money, and probably contributing to the end where they finally say "okay, no more free CD's."
I've never made my Linux boxes completly unbootable. I've always put in a link to the old kernel, or something.
Actually, I can't say that - one time lilo locked up the system while installing, and that caused it to not boot. But since that was a bootloader thing, this nifty compile-at-boot thing wouldn't help anyways.
The README says it needs some of the binaries and headers on the linux kernel, so you have to pre-compile these first.
I guess this could have some limited use somewhere, perhaps, but I can't really see how if you need some precompiled stuff.
This kind of crap has always been widespread, from the times of the BBS to the times of the MMORPG's.
*Usually* the name calling, throwing a pissy fit, and the general hate comes from young boys. They have a lot of rage, and they can take it out in online games without fear of reprecussions.
I've been playing online games for many years now. Back with KALI + Descent 2, through UT and Tactical Ops, and through OU, EQ, and now EQ2. The crap's the same. It'll always be there. But in some places, it's much worse the others.
I ran some TacOps servers a couple years back, and it was a LOT of fun. We had some great kids and adults alike play on our servers, and we basically just went nuts. Marathons on single maps all night, clan wars, and everything else. But always there would be the little kidding that enter the server, do stupid shit, call people names, and eventually get banned.
There's actually a lot less of that kind of nonsense in games like Everquest. EQ's been out for awhile, and a lot of the players have been playing for years. The average age in many top guilds is in the mid-20's. While age along doesn't come close to stop people from being assholes, it does eliminate a lot of the name calling, racial slurs, and general chaos.
Hop on a UT2004 server, however, and you'll be playing with a bunch of punk 14 year old boys that have no problem calling you a *beep* beep *beep* because you killed them once out of the 25 times they killed you.
I await the games where you need to prove your age, and be at least 18 years old to play.
You can run an emulator for free.
I still play some of the old classics, like Super Ghouls and Ghosts (SNES), the sonics (Genesis) and some not-TOO-old games like F-ZeroX (N64) and the N64 Zelda.
Not to mention the thousands of MAME titles and such..
With emulators, games will never die. The XBox is actually pretty awesome when it comes to this - all these emulators are available on a modded Xbox, for play on a full TV screen. You can even get controller adapters to hook up old Atari, Nintendo, etc controllers!
I've been working with Messaging for years, and even on Novell networks, most people choose to run Exchange over Groupwise.
But, Groupwise does deserve mention I suppose with it's Exchangeish features and Outlook integration, with shared calendars.
Maybe some really big shops run the Oracle stuff, but I've never seen it.
Well, although it would be great if the big graphics vendors (ATI, nVidia, etc..) worked together to make OSS video boards, it really seems very unlikely considering there's some competition in the market.
Unlike Microsoft, where there really isn't any, the ATI and nVidia rivalry is keeping things moving at an acceptable pace - just as the AMD and Intel rivalry has raised the bar in x86 performance.
We need Linux to be free of OS lock-in and to get out from under Microsoft. We don't really NEED a free and open video board, when there's competition in the market and the vendors follow what standards exist.
Even if they use some special config tools to manage the systems, even if it's not free, and even if they outright closed sourced all their own code - it's NOT pointless and it's NOT lock-in!
It's Linux. What is the biggest thing holding people to Windows? Applications. If you run your entire company off of Xandros, and run a bunch of Linux apps on it that people become dependant on - where does the lock-in happen that's implied by your use of the word Proprietary?
You could switch off of Xandros to something else fairly easily at that point. Once you're off Windows, which Xandros helps you do quite a bit more then some of the other distributions, you can then take another step onto, say, RedHat, or Mandrake, or SuSE, or whatever.
There's no lock-in, therefore there's no problem, in my opinion. I believe the core operating system and libraries need to remain open, GPL or what-not, in order to keep things going. But I don't believe that every single little aspect of the system is required to be GPL or even Open Source. I'd prefer it was GPL, for real. But it won't kill the market if it isn't.
You can choose to use it, or not. Either way, the software that runs on it will run on any Linux, and that's what seperates it from the Windows monopoly.
Actually, in Windows XP Professionsl, the Remote Desktop connection will connect you to your desktop, not create a new one. This means, whatever you had running will now be available in your session, and your desktop's console becomes locked. Once you unlock your console, you once again see the same desktop.
It's actually pretty nice, it's fast, it supports drive, sound, and serial port mapping too. Can't ask for much else.
"Oh yeah, Lotus/Domino sucks just as much as MS Exchange."
I was following you, and nodding a bit, until you hit this point at the end.
Notes can do some sweet things, and back before everything was a web app, it was even more useful. The whole "everything is a database" paradigm makes for an extremely useful, extensible, and powerful system - if you design and administer the system correctly. Which, I'm afraid, most people don't seem to do. E-Mail is only a small subset of the power of Notes and Domino.
On the Exchange side, nothing could be further from the truth. Exchange, especially Exchange 2000+, has proven itself as a solid e-mail centric groupware solution. It practically runs itself after the initial setup. If using IE, the web mail is an unusually pleasant webmail experience, the system is responsive and fast, and it's filled with all sorts of great stuff you can do. I've designed and maintained Exchange systems for years and besides little silly issues that are generally easy to fix.
I've been doing messaging work for quite awhile now, including work on Unix/Linux systems - Sendmail/Postfix/etc - and honestly besides Exchange and Lotus, there's really no real competition if you want something more then plain e-mail.
At any rate..
Yea, me too. It's not fantastic, being VNC after all. But it works pretty well, good video quality over a slower connection too. TightVNS is stable too.
I don't listen to the radio for music, just talk radio. And I usually sit on the AM band most of the time since that's where most of it's at, and AM signals tend to reach much further then an FM signal so I can keep listening as I drive around from place to place. Most of my friends are the same way - it's either A) listen to the latest pop music junk 20 times a day, or B) listen to some decent talk radio. Hmm.
If I could listen to my favorite talk shows all the time, without signal noise/drop, wherever I went, it would be very nice.
I just don't think I'm in the car QUITE enough to justify a monthly fee for it.