What Your Choice of Linux Distro Says about You

Slackware? by slavemowgli · 2004-10-30 03:37 · Score: 5, Interesting

No mention of Slackware? What a pity.

--
quidquid latine dictum sit altum videtur.

Re:Slackware? by glMatrixMode · 2004-10-30 03:39 · Score: 0

What does it say about them ? They're low on slack.

--
War doesn't prove who's right, just who's left.
Re:Slackware? by allden · 2004-10-30 03:40 · Score: 1

Slashdot polls give you more and better choices ;-)
Re:Slackware? by Performaman · 2004-10-30 03:42 · Score: 3, Insightful

Indeed. But it would probably be "Slackware users are no-nonsense, doctrinarial, and do most things "by the book." They take pride in theirs being the oldest Linux Distro, and shun all others as being "childish."

--

I have gas, but my car uses petrol.
Re:Slackware? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 03:43 · Score: 0

no mention of LFS either? :-(
Re:Slackware? by Yath · 2004-10-30 03:46 · Score: 0, Troll

Slackware users are libertarian (or even anarchist) control freaks. They react with hostility to any hint of a threat to their freedoms, and make do with a minimum of centralized control. They make friends slowly, and tend to keep them for a long, LONG time but can decisively say goodbye to any who betray them. They have very little tolerance for nonsense.

--
I always mod up spelling trolls.
Re:Slackware? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 03:46 · Score: 0

Typical first posters and trolls they are..

(modding this post as troll would make it funny, modding it funny would ruin it ...)
Re:Slackware? by NemoX · 2004-10-30 03:47 · Score: 2, Interesting

I was surprised about this as well. I started on Slackware, and still find it to be my favorite after taking a dip in many other waters. So, I guess the question should be "what does newsforge's choice of linux distributions say about newsforge?" :p
Re:Slackware? by TykeClone · 2004-10-30 03:49 · Score: 1

libertarian (or even anarchist) control freaks.
Aren't libertarian (or even anarchist) and control freaks mutually exclusive?

--
A fine is a tax you pay for doing wrong and a tax is a fine you pay for doing all right.
Re:Slackware? by Lumpy · 2004-10-30 03:57 · Score: 4, Insightful

that is because most journalists are frightened by Slackware. It's the oldest existing Linux distro (Yggdrasil was the very first) and as far as I am concerned the single best distro for doing what linux is supposed to.

Slackware on a machine is usually 50% or more faster than the fedora,redhat,mandrake and it makes sense where things are and where config files are insteaad of the randomized placement found in other distros. (which is the single bigest problem with linux, I dont care who is right, let's pick one filesystem layout and EVERYONE use it.)

I have tried ALL linux distros and I keep coming back to slackware. It just works.

--
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
Re:Slackware? by slavemowgli · 2004-10-30 03:57 · Score: 5, Informative

Actually, slackware isn't the oldest distro. That credit is generally given to SLS, which appeared in mid-1992; however, there also was MCC Interim Linux (available from the university of Manchester in feb 1992), and TAMU, from the Texas A&M university (about the same time).

--
quidquid latine dictum sit altum videtur.
Re:Slackware? by kristaps.kaupe · 2004-10-30 04:01 · Score: 1

Libertarian (anarchist)? Grrrrrrrrr....

- slackware user
Re:Slackware? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:02 · Score: 0

What does Netcraft say?
Re:Slackware? by Hatta · 2004-10-30 04:04 · Score: 3, Insightful

Aren't libertarian (or even anarchist) and control freaks mutually exclusive?

Nope, anarchists want control over their own destiny, and aren't willing to give up any of their personal sovreignty to anyone. They're also intelligent enough to understand basic arguments of symmetry.

--
Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
Re:Slackware? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:08 · Score: 2, Informative

Neither of them is still around in a recognizable form, though. Slackware's still around, and has deviated little from its origins.
Re:Slackware? by Jane_Dozey · 2004-10-30 04:11 · Score: 3, Informative

Oldest surviving distro then.

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Silly rabbit
Re:Slackware? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:21 · Score: 0

Slackware on a desktop means that you have a simple and clean distro, that need the user to add himself the tools and scripts to make it usable and useful. Other distros already includes many tweaks that you have to learn (and modify) if you want them to be useful.
Re:Slackware? by ctr2sprt · 2004-10-30 04:22 · Score: 1

I know. As a BSD junkie, I figured the closest to me would be Slackware and I was disappointed not to see it. Also Slack was my first Linux distro, back in, I think, the 3.0 stages.
If I were more clever, I'd produce a FreeBSD description now. But I'm not, so I'll just paraphrase what another poster has already said in reply to your article: "We don't care what's best, pick a goddamn direction and stick with it." It's the single biggest reason I steer clear of Linux now whenever I have a choice. I, too, experience a swelling of pride when the GNU awk is replaced by a less-functional non-GNU version. And I'm the guy who stands up and defends RMS whenever he demands "GNU" be added before all things open source!
Re:Slackware? by fafaforza · 2004-10-30 04:54 · Score: 1

No slackware, but they include MEPIS. What the hell is that? Did it come out in the past 3 months or something?
Re:Slackware? by syates21 · 2004-10-30 05:29 · Score: 2

50% faster?! Give me a friggin break. No general purpose, modern OS is going to be 50% faster across the board then another one on the same hardware. This is even less likely when you are basically talking about slightly different flavors of the same OS.
Re:Slackware? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:42 · Score: 0

50 percent faster because of the placement of configuration files? I don't see how this could make a difference.
Re:Slackware? by siskbc · 2004-10-30 06:01 · Score: 1

I expect that's meant to be a troll, but outside of the anarchist bit (which I disagree with) you certainly described me perfectly. And indeed, I use slack for all my linux needs. ;)
But I am writing this on a powerbook, so I'm not sure how that works out with your theory.

--
-Looking for a job as a materials chemist or multivariat
Re:Slackware? by JWSmythe · 2004-10-30 06:18 · Score: 2, Interesting

Funny, I saw the story, wanted to whine about Slack not showing up, and the first post is for Slack!

Maybe it's a bit too .... hardcore?

Every time I read a list like this, Slackware is marked as the oldest, hardest, and favorite among real administrators, hackers, and geeks who know what they're doing. No sissy graphic installer. No warm fuzzy configuration tools. You want to configure something, you just do it and know it's done right, rather than pointing and clicking, and wondering if what you just pointed & clicked did what you thought it would do.

Slackware comes with most everything, and what it doesn't have isn't a problem. Slackware users know how to compile their own stuff, beyond trying to 'emerge', 'apt-get', or whatever to let some warm-fuzzy installer script attempt it.

I use Slackware on just about everything, and those that know me know that's a *LOT* of machines. The only real exception are my AMD64 machines, that I'm still waiting for Slack to have a 64bit version. I know it'll be coming soon enough, I just can't wait. Until then, they're Gentoo. No offense to the Gentoo guys, but I feel warmer and fuzzier knowing I can get my OS installed in minutes. We have a hacked-up version of Slackware that we install on our servers that is done in 5 minutes. That's pretty hard to beat.

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Serious? Seriousness is well above my pay grade.
Re:Slackware? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 06:21 · Score: 0

A control FREAK is not someone who is dedicated to personal freedom, but who seeks to control all situations and all people in those situations. This is the opposite of an anarchist.
Re:Slackware? by LMariachi · 2004-10-30 06:23 · Score: 0, Troll

So does this mean that Slackware users are delusional paranoiacs, or is it just you?
Re:Slackware? by JWSmythe · 2004-10-30 06:28 · Score: 4, Insightful

Well, you're wrong. No offense intended.

Take a warm fuzzy distro and install it. do a 'ps -auwwx' and look at all the crap running.

Take Slackware, install it like I would (install everything, don't let anything but SSH start as services). Then recompile the kernel specifically for your platform. Compile everything you *NEED* into the kernel, and don't make anything as modules. Now boot. It'll boot faster, run faster, and be far more enjoyable.

Why start and use things that you don't need? No printer, why CUPS or lpd? No SMB network, why samba? Do you really need/want Apache, MySQL, pcmcia services (on a desktop), etc, etc, etc, if you just want a fast running machine? Nope.

Most distros have fallen into the Microsoft way of thinking. Go ahead, start up as much crap as you can. They use might use it someday (or probably won't). If it's slow, they'll buy a bigger, faster computer.

The biggest reason for me to upgrade my home machines:

1) to support more drive space for things I work on.
2) to compile things faster
and very occasionally
3) Better video support for the games I occasionally play.

Again, that's Linux. I'm not part of that Windows gaming world, where you're almost expected to be running the latest/greatest hardware (and overclocking it at that) to play your games.

--
Serious? Seriousness is well above my pay grade.
Re:Slackware? by bob+beta · 2004-10-30 06:46 · Score: 1

Yggdrasil was the first 'distro' packaged to be installed off a CD-ROM, but it was NOT the first distro. Plus, I have the first Infomagic 'UNIX' cdrom **, which had SLS on it (in additional to NetBSD and 386BSD) which is a slightly older pressed-CD product than that first white-cover-green-ink Yggdrasil release (which most people who carry on about Yggdrasil never saw in any event)

(** Predecessor of the big multi-CD 'Linux Resource' sets that Infomagic sporatically published so 'the rest of us' without the bandwidth could get our Linux fix)

--
"What's the frequency Kenneth?"
Re:Slackware? by tzanger · 2004-10-30 06:52 · Score: 3, Informative

Well, you're wrong. No offense intended.

Sorry, I'm a Slackware user (since '96) and you are the one who is wrong here.

Slackware is not 50% faster than the other distros. Sorry, there just isn't enough crap running on FC2 or Gentoo or Suse to slow down the same machine that much. And yes, I'm talking runlevel 3 or 4. I find Slackware zippier than the others, yes, but 50% faster? Give your head a shake.

Also you will find if you take the time to do the critical analysis that having everything in the kernel is not measurably faster than having a lean kernel with modules. I prefer the latter myself and have done the tests -- it's not worth the effort to compile everything into the kernel and then have a kernel that's only usable on a limited subset of machines. Build the kernel as generic as possible, modularize everything and now you have a kernel you can throw on all your machines. Or are you a Gentoo user in disguise and think that a full compiler environment is required on every machine? The package system is there for a reason. Use it. The dependency hell that all the other distros have doesn't exist on Slack, which is one of the bigger reasons I enjoy it.

I have a USB2 hdd with a development-ready version of slack9.1 and slack10.0 on it (since I have both in my environment). If I need to build something I mount it, chroot to the proper environment, build, checkinstall and now I have the package available for all my slack91 and/or slack100 machines, and I save myself the 600 or so megs I need for a proper development environment on every machine and I save myself the problem of keeping the development environments up to date on all the machines. Hell I even have a script that'll make pretty much any Perl module a Slackware package without destroying perllocal.
Re:Slackware? by junk · 2004-10-30 06:54 · Score: 1

No idea how this got modded troll, but I'm a slackware user and find that fairly accurate. I've dropped numerous long term friends for one act of betrayal.
Re:Slackware? by tzanger · 2004-10-30 06:55 · Score: 1

It's just him. The vast majority of Slack users I've run into use Slackware because it's very easy to manage if you know what you're doing and you don't have a dumbass dependency system in place to second-guess you or cause you grief if you want to make decent third-party packages.
Re:Slackware? by cetialphav · 2004-10-30 07:00 · Score: 2, Interesting

You make it sound like it is hard to stop unneeded services in all other distros but Slackware. It isn't. Everything you're mentioning is stuff you can do with any other distro. But even doing all of that doesn't result in a 50% speed boost.

My machine is a P4 2.4GHz with 1Gb of RAM. If apache and mysql are running unnecessarily, does that really slow things down? No. They are blocked on a select() call waiting for a request to spring them into action. Unless you are short on RAM, it has no impact at all.

Note that before I bought this computer I was using a P-Pro 200 with 128 Mb of RAM. The only reason I upgraded was because the current desktops (KDE and Gnome) take up so many resources it just makes everything sluggish. I could have used fvwm2 (or other things) to make things very snappy, but it really isn't worth my time. I like to spend my time using my computer, not configuring/tweaking it.

But to compare every non-Slackware distro to Microsoft is just silly.
Re:Slackware? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 07:04 · Score: 0

unused services don't eat half the CPU cycles.

you're full of shit.
Re:Slackware? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 07:20 · Score: 0

Like the gentoo zealot who wouldn't be caught dead using binaries compiled on someone else's machine even though it makes no tangible difference, to the [h]ardcore case modding freak who spends £100s on liquid cooling rigs to lower the reading given by a 0.02p on-board temperature sensor, you're the worst type of Linux advocate - a literate, misinformed ignorant who has no real idea of how computers work on a basic level -- tarring everything with their own retarded brand of logic and sounds credible doing it.

Please stop.
Re:Slackware? by pjt33 · 2004-10-30 07:22 · Score: 2, Insightful

Why start and use things that you don't need? No printer, why CUPS or lpd? No SMB network, why samba? Do you really need/want Apache, MySQL, pcmcia services (on a desktop), etc, etc, etc, if you just want a fast running machine? Nope.
That's why when I installed my Debian system I didn't tell dselect that I wanted them. Why have them cluttering up my hard drive if I never use them?
Re:Slackware? by JWSmythe · 2004-10-30 07:23 · Score: 1

> Sorry, I'm a Slackware user (since '96) and you are the one who is wrong here.

I think we're just splitting hairs here, and actually agreeing. The finer points can be argued ad nauseum, and are probably less than constructive.

I do like your idea of the USB drive. Ahh, more ideas for future playing. I've been carrying my SSH keys (and a few other things) around on a usb thumb drive for a few months now. It's been very useful. I sitll haven't managed to fill it up yet.

# df -h | grep key /dev/sdb1 250M 18M 233M 7% /mnt/key

Oh and yes, I've been a Slackware user for years. So long that I actually am not exactly sure what year I started. It was when edition 1 of "Linux Unleased" first hit the shelves and had an ancient version of Slackware bundled with it. Well, ancient now. It was modern then. I usually joke and say it was Slack 1, even though I know I'm wrong. I can't seem to find 1st edition online, but second edition came out in 1996.

--
Serious? Seriousness is well above my pay grade.
Re:Slackware? by srobert · 2004-10-30 07:27 · Score: 1

(Slackware User)^2 = LFS user
Re:Slackware? by Mad_Rain · 2004-10-30 07:27 · Score: 3, Insightful

Slackware on a machine is usually 50% or more faster than the fedora,redhat,mandrake

Please report to the following website: Gentoo Is for Ricers and join their well-informed masses.

--
"What do you think?" "I think 'What, do you think?!'"
Re:Slackware? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 07:31 · Score: 0

The finer points can be argued ad nauseum

No, they can't. And 50% is a rather big hair. What you can do, is post some benchmarks and prove to us exactly how slackware runs at twice the speed of any other common-or-garden distro.

This should be interesting, as all your points thus far have been debunked as being utter shite.
Re:Slackware? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 07:36 · Score: 0

Perhaps you're a troll, but you're dead on right in describing me. I'm posting this from a Pentium II/266 running Slackware 10, with Firefox, and your personality analysis is perfect.
Re:Slackware? by crazyphilman · 2004-10-30 07:38 · Score: 2, Informative

There's another reason you want to turn off ALL unessential services: security.

I run Slackware at my apartment, and when I installed it, the first thing I did was make sure that the only services I installed in the first place were the ones I was going to be using daily. Since I'm using the laptop as a workstation, that means I installed almost nothing except CUPS and the client for DHCP so I could hit the web from KDE.

You might also want to go into /etc/rc.d and comment out all the lines that start services you're not running, "just in case". You can always uncomment them if you change your mind later.

But, backup for your point, I have a pretty minimal set of stuff running. And, my Slackware runs like the wind on a Pentium-III, 600Mhz with 384MB Ram. Including, believe it or not, Netbeans IDE, which is a resource hog and a half. Slackware gives it plenty of room, and I didn't even recompile anything (I like kernel modules). Fedora ran like crap, by the way, and wasn't java friendly (it installed a weird C library and I couldn't get the install to work).

--
Farewell! It's been a fine buncha years!
Re:Slackware? by fire-eyes · 2004-10-30 08:03 · Score: 1, Informative

Gentoo.

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-- Note: If you don't agree with me, don't bother replying. I won't read it.
Re:Slackware? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 08:09 · Score: 0

"They have very little tolerance for nonsense."

Yet they somehow tolerate the nonsense that is the package manager in slack...
Re:Slackware? by tsa · 2004-10-30 08:11 · Score: 1

This is an uncanningly accurate description of the friend of mine who introduced me to slackware. I (well, we) still use Slackware ten years later so the description must also fit me, but I never looked at myself in this way...

--
-- Cheers!
Re:Slackware? by shadowbearer · 2004-10-30 08:35 · Score: 1

No offense to the Gentoo guys, but I feel warmer and fuzzier knowing I can get my OS installed in minutes. We have a hacked-up version of Slackware that we install on our servers that is done in 5 minutes. That's pretty hard to beat.

Works with Gentoo also, if you are installing on similar hardware. Just do it the first time (the "hacked-up" part) and make binaries, or alternatively tarzip the install. That's how I backup my installs for quick recovery. On different hw - other than a platform change - all that's really needed is a kernel reconfig/recompile. I have a generic AMD image for my machines that only requires changing the driver config for the kernel for different mobos/cards, and another for my two PII server boxes.

Anyway, I do agree about slackware - it's superb, and my second fave distro (Gentoo is my first :)

I wouldn't compare emerge with apt-get or installer scripts tho, there is a world of difference.

Cheers,
SB

--
It's old. The more humans I meet, the more I like my cats. At least they are honest.
Re:Slackware? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 08:42 · Score: 0

Also don't forget the "boot/root" images; they weren't really a distro per se but they could get you started.

SLS was my first distro; downloaded onto 5.25" floppies a my local university. Later when SLS wasn't getting regular updates just about everyone moved to Slackware (which was very similar in design) For a year or two I think Slackware had near 100% of the market.

Of course around 1995/1996 or so Slackware fell behind on updates just as some of the other distros (Debian/Redhat) started to hit critical mass. In late 1996 I couldn't pretend that Slackware was up to date anymore so I switched to Redhat 3.0.3; I'm still with RedHat 8 years later... not sure what that says about my personality though. I just don't like switching distros much, plus RH pays the salary of many of the kernel developers I respect.

Oh, and I run Debian or Yellowdog on my non-x86 machines.
Re:Slackware? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 09:14 · Score: 0

You're either full of shit, or you haven't used another distro in a decade and have no idea what you're talking about.

Take Fedora, for example. Don't want a bunch of shit running at startup? Use the 'minimal install' option and then add anything you like after. Boy, that's hard, isn't it?

And as other's have mentioned, running services that aren't doing anything take up next to no CPU time. So this 50% number you pulled out of your ass is just plain wrong.

BTW, does slack give you the option to install into a software RAID-1 setup yet?
Re:Slackware? by legirons · 2004-10-30 09:26 · Score: 1

This looks just like some attempt to poke fun at sterotypes -- "debian users always count in binary", w.t.f?!?

More entertaining by far might be something like this, aka. the "what OS are you" quiz which was previously mentioned on slashdot.
Re:Slackware? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 09:39 · Score: 0

> Well, you're wrong. No offense intended.

He may be wrong... but you, sir, are stupid... and in the morning, he'll be sober...

Go grab yourself a nice big-print full-colour EZ-read book on the fundamentals of operating systems.

Should you be able to resist the overpowering urge to colour in all the pictures with a chewed-up crayon, take a quick look at the section on "blocking I/O".

Almost all of those services you're bitching about having installed on a non LunaticWare distro are going to be running as blocked processes... and using a completely negligible amount of CPU time.

Christ, do you think customers who buy a Cray supercomputer shut the whole thing down and run it in single-user mode so as not to waste cycles on anything else? How DUMB do you think OS designers are?

Besides, *nix is for pussies. Real men use FOLKLORE or MVS.
Re:Slackware? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 09:49 · Score: 0

Somewhat amusingly if it wasn't so frightening, MCC Linux distribution was ceased when Microsoft made a large "investment" in Manchester computing :-(. That suggests that MS had identified linux as a potential threat much earlier than they publically let on.
Re:Slackware? by Glytch · 2004-10-30 10:21 · Score: 1

Troll? Oh, come on, you humourless moderator. I'm a lifelong Slackware fan and this is pretty dead-on accurate.
Re:Slackware? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 11:25 · Score: 0

50% faster is half as fast again, not twice as fast.
Re:Slackware? by The+Original+Yama · 2004-10-30 12:13 · Score: 1

The parent post is probably using Guiness Book of World Records style terminology. If so, oldest would imply that it still survives. In this case, SLS would be the earliest, since it was around beforehand yet does not exist today.

--
OLPC Australia
Re:Slackware? by ezzzD55J · 2004-10-30 12:25 · Score: 1

"Well, you're wrong. No offense intended."
No, you're wrong. All those processes you see running on other systems won't be doing a single thing unless something is asked of them. They'll even largely be swapped out so the memory can be used for cache if they don't run. (This is presuming Linuxes paging algorithm is worth its salt.)
Same story for things in the kernel you don't need, it won't be cached so will take up memory at the most (as kernel memory isn't paged). It makes zero difference for performance what is a module and what isn't.
I suppose recompiling your kernel with your CPU specified and higher optimization than a stock kernel will show performance improvement.. a few percent i would guess. But 50%? You are pulling that out of your ass.
Re:Slackware? by dildo · 2004-10-30 14:32 · Score: 5, Funny

I don't use a distro. I do everything myself. I even make my own shoes. I am a bad ass.

My first computer was a mancala, and I was so bad ass that I programmed my own version of doom using nothing but red pebbles -- and after that I wrote a C++ compiler for an analog pinball machine (you think that compiling all that crap for gentoo is a pain in the ass for your pentium 200? this thing had to do like, 6-multiball play for three months straight before KDE was finished, but now I just use it to run TCPdump on the cluster of pinball machines I've got in my house).

I'm still trying to get X-windows running on my toaster, but the video card is REALLY obscure so I may have to write the driver myself. For security, I'm using 4096-bit ssl connection between the plug and the wall, and I'm taking notes from OpenBSD by encrypting the crumbs at the bottom so some script kiddie from Finland doesn't know what kind of bread I've been eating.

I'm moving forward to cyborg stuff -- I'm going to start small by getting LOGO installed on a baby tortoise, but I need to find a good wireless protocol (WEP = weak encryption protocol. ha!) to send commands to it. I don't want the NSA to know what goes on between me and my tortoise.
Re:Slackware? by Baseclass · 2004-10-30 19:25 · Score: 1

As a Slackware user I must say you've got me pegged.
If I hadn't just used up my mod points I'd mod you up.

--
^^vv<><>BA
Re:Slackware? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 19:45 · Score: 0

That's modded informative why?
Re:Slackware? by a9db0 · 2004-10-30 21:14 · Score: 1

Mepis: Take Debian Testing, add in the better bits from unstable, mix in very good hardware detection, a good graphical installer, and orient towards desktop users. Bake into a bootable CD.

It's a good distro for folks who would be the target for Knoppix, but who are better suited to a more conservative look. It is a great desktop distro for people who use computers as tools. And its base is Debian.

Full disclosure: I run Debian on my server, Mepis on my laptop, and Gentoo on my test box. I dunno if that makes me distro agnostic, or just schitzophrenic.

--
-- "Never underestimate the power of human stupidity." - R.A.H.
Re:Slackware? by Kethinov · 2004-10-30 22:13 · Score: 1

Slackware users are no-nonsense, doctrinarial, and do most things "by the book." They take pride in theirs being the oldest Linux Distro, and shun all others as being "childish."
Um, right. In order to be by the book and not childish you have to use a cryptic source distro?

Source distros don't even register as viable to me. What's the oldest binary distro? Redhat or Debian?

--
You're right, I wouldn't steal a car. But if it were possible, I sure as hell would download one!
Re:Slackware? by wobblie · 2004-10-31 00:17 · Score: 1

? debian is the anarchist distro, slackware is ruled by a secret cabal. A Cabal of slackers, but it's still a cabal!
Re:Slackware? by JWSmythe · 2004-10-31 06:25 · Score: 1

Well, security is another topic.

I used to run a P-75 as my home firewall for years. It did NAT and had an obnoxious set of firewall rules to protect itself from the outside. Besides that, it had absolutely no services that you could connect to from outside. It was very nice.

My ex-girlfriend had a Slackware firewall on a 486/25 for a long time, til the motherboard finally went. The only painful part of that was compiling kernels on like 16Mb RAM. ;)

--
Serious? Seriousness is well above my pay grade.
Re:Slackware? by JWSmythe · 2004-10-31 06:30 · Score: 1

Last time I went through installing all the distros I could was about 6 months ago.

And yes, you've been able to install Slackware onto any software raid setup you'd like for many years. Not GUI friendly, but it doesn't need to be. I can be very specific about what I wanted, and not have to wonder, "Did the GUI figure out what I was telling it?"

--
Serious? Seriousness is well above my pay grade.
Re:Slackware? by JWSmythe · 2004-10-31 06:37 · Score: 1

Ok, try this.

Start up something that'll spawn 1000 idle tasks. Each task uses up 1Mb RAM, and you only have 512Mb RAM and 128Mb swap.

It's overkill, but hopefully it will illustrate my point a little bit. Just because you're thinking "The process is idle, it doesn't hurt anything", sure, it's idle, and hopefully not hurting anything, but if you have enough of them, it can cause a problem you weren't thinking about.

Some processes don't just sit there completely idle. They aren't just waiting ... waiting ... waiting ... Sometimes they wait, then do some cleanup routine, then log something, then stat files (or whatever). That takes time. Enough of them, and you have a problem.

The majority of machines that I work on are high-load machines. I'm sorry that most readers on here are Windows users, and the extend of the rest of your experience is installing Linux on your home machine in a dual-boot setup, so you can still play your Windows video games.

But, I really don't need to defend myself. My paycheck is proof that I know what I'm talking about. If I didn't, the company would fail or I'd lose my job, and then I wouldn't have my paycheck. This paycheck has been coming in every week for many years now.

--
Serious? Seriousness is well above my pay grade.
Re:Slackware? by JWSmythe · 2004-10-31 06:45 · Score: 1

Well, I just replied to another pots, but I'll say it here so you'll see it.

You're on a system with 512Mb RAM and 128Mb Swap.

10 extra tasks running, each one using 1Mb RAM, not a big deal.

1000 extra tasks running, each one using 1Mb RAM, you've run out of memory.

I've been on Apache boxes that were pretty much in that state. They've been configured to allow too many Apache processes to run. Now even though all the tasks are sleeping, the machine is effectively unusable.

You can reach this fine line of usability without 1000 of the same task.

On my home machine right now (AMD64 3200+, 1Gb RAM, Gentoo), it's using 256Mb RAM, with 113 processes running. Of course X is a large part of that, but if I start killing off processes that I'm not really using (like Evolution, a few of these xterms, and GAIM), I could be using a bit less CPU time, and a lot less memory.

--
Serious? Seriousness is well above my pay grade.
Re:Slackware? by crazyphilman · 2004-10-31 11:17 · Score: 1

I don't think it's another topic; if you're talking about running a minimal set of services, then security has to rear its head because it's one of the best reasons to do that (besides performance, that is). It's a dual-whammy; you get a performance and a security boost.

But don't think this only matters in firewalls. Desktop computers without security built-in (whether they're behind a firewall or not) are incomplete.

--
Farewell! It's been a fine buncha years!
Re:Slackware? by ross+axe · 2004-10-31 12:02 · Score: 1

What's the oldest binary distro?

Er, Slackware.
Re:Slackware? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-31 13:22 · Score: 0

nice to see that you talk out your butt without any knowlege.

I dare you, install any distro you like mandrake, fedora, suse...

use it for 2 days, check it's speed.

then install slackware.

by DEFAULT it is 50% faster. I can get almost 100% faster after tuning it. I can run slack 10 with gnome quickly on hardware that fedora will feel like a jar of molasses on a winter morning.

next time you decide to spread the lack of knowlege you have, try getting a clue first.

Lumpy is absoutely right.

the only other distro that is close to slackware is Gentoo.
Re:Slackware? by Kethinov · 2004-10-31 17:59 · Score: 1

Slackware is a source distro.

--
You're right, I wouldn't steal a car. But if it were possible, I sure as hell would download one!
Re:Slackware? by mink · 2004-11-01 03:05 · Score: 1

Define source distro and binary distro?
To install slackware I never have to compile anything, so to me it's a binary distro. Why do you call it a source distro?

--
Well I've wrestled with reality for thirty five years doctor, and I'm happy to say I finally won out over it.
Re:Slackware? by ross+axe · 2004-11-01 15:13 · Score: 1

No, it's a binary distro. What the bloody hell's got you thinking otherwise? Yes, it comes in gzipped tar archives. You could put your porn collection in a gzipped tar archive - that wouldn't make it "source porn", would it? Yes, it comes with source code. That's a legal requirement of the GPL, last time i checked. Fact is, it comes with precompiled ELF binaries. Thus, it's a binary distro.
Re:Slackware? by amRadioHed · 2004-11-09 18:27 · Score: 1

1000 extra tasks running, each one using 1Mb RAM, you've run out of memory.
What the hell kind of insane distro's have you been using where you had anywhere near 1000 extra processes running by default?

On my Mandrake box I have all sorts of servers enabled, and KDE running with several open applications and terminals and numerous panel applet's running. I must have at least a million processes running, right? Nope, turns out I only have 142. If I count threads (we're stretching here) it's still under 300. Let's be realistic, your powers of hyperbole astound me.

--
We hope your rules and wisdom choke you / Now we are one in everlasting peace
Re:Slackware? by mgcarley · 2004-11-09 20:14 · Score: 1

I was speaking with a quiet German bloke AKA the VP of something or other (I think it was for the Linux division or something) for Novell (who is/was formerly the co-founder or something for SuSE), and he told us the other week that SuSE was the first actual distribution, released in about 1992, I think it was.

Now, we aren't just counting custom Kernels etc, but I think it was the first commercial distro...

--
Founder & COO, Hayai India (hayai.in) / USA (hayaibroadband.com) // t: @mgcarley
Re:Slackware? by JWSmythe · 2004-11-10 03:26 · Score: 1

Well, it was an arbitrary number filling our arbitrary example. I didn't install each distro to count how many processes were running to reply to a /. message.

But as you say, you have 142 processes. Now carefully go through those and figure out what doesn't really need ot be there, and kill them. You'll find your machine runs faster now.

--
Serious? Seriousness is well above my pay grade.

Don't believe everything you read. by Rahga · 2004-10-30 03:37 · Score: 5, Funny

"I use Mandrake, so that makes me suave and sophisticated."

In other news, Bud Light gets you lots of chicks. In bikinis. And twins.

Oh, well... It's a Saturday.

Re:Don't believe everything you read. by FlipmodePlaya · 2004-10-30 03:58 · Score: 1

Well, Newsforge did put it under the humor section... It wasn't meant to be a buyer's guide, or anything.
Re:Don't believe everything you read. by jZnat · 2004-10-30 03:59 · Score: 2, Funny

Don't forget about FG!

"Partucket Patriot beer; if you drink it, hot women will have sex in your backyard!"

--
'Yes, firefox is indeed greater than women. Can women block pops up for you? No. Can Firefox show you naked women? Yes.'
Re:Don't believe everything you read. by Dorothy+86 · 2004-10-30 04:27 · Score: 1

or Schmitz Gay!

--
Game Overdrive - Gaming News
Re:Don't believe everything you read. by fireboy1919 · 2004-10-30 04:32 · Score: 2, Informative

"If John Wayne had been a Linux user, he would have used Gentoo."

I don't know...could John Wayne even use a PC? He seems more like the Linspire kind of guy.
Actually, which distro is it that runs on PCs that have been shot with a rifle out of frustration?

'Cause I think that's the one John Wayne would be running.

--
Mod me down and I will become more powerful than you can possibly imagine!
Re:Don't believe everything you read. by nwbvt · 2004-10-30 05:06 · Score: 3, Funny

That really says a lot about the effectiveness of Coors Light's famous "twins" commercials. People remember the ads, but associate them with the wrong product.

--
Mathematics is made of 50 percent formulas, 50 percent proofs, and 50 percent imagination.
Re:Don't believe everything you read. by mikael · 2004-10-30 05:20 · Score: 1

In other news, Bud Light gets you lots of chicks. In bikinis. And twins.

If you drink enough bottles, every single chick you take back to your place will have a twin in the morning. And you will also have two watches on your wrist.

--
Vintage computer adverts: http://www.vintageadbrowser.com/computers-and-software-ads
Re:Don't believe everything you read. by Daniel+Dvorkin · 2004-10-30 05:20 · Score: 5, Funny

I was gonna say. Sure, if John Wayne had played a Linux user in a movie ("Well, now ... pilgrim ... looks like your kernel needs a recompilin'") he'd have played a Gentoo user. In real life, Mr. Marion Morrison wouldn't even have touched Linux; he'd have been Windows all the way.

--
The correlation between ignorance of statistics and using "correlation is not causation" as an argument is close to 1.
Re:Don't believe everything you read. by ameoba · 2004-10-30 05:52 · Score: 3, Funny

With a name like Marion Morrison, I'd think he'd own a Mac.

--
my sig's at the bottom of the page.
Re:Don't believe everything you read. by rizzo420 · 2004-10-30 06:54 · Score: 2, Funny

you're obviously not from RI... it's paWtucket

--
please me, have no regrets.
Re:Don't believe everything you read. by Bull999999 · 2004-10-30 09:49 · Score: 1

In other news, Bud Light gets you lots of chicks. In bikinis. And twins.

Yes!!! I knew that getting a keg of Bud Light for the Halloween party was a good idea.

--
1f u c4n r34d th1s u r34lly n33d t0 g37 l41d
Re:Don't believe everything you read. by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 10:11 · Score: 0

with a name like Marion Morrison he would've been a cheesy wannabe horror singer in the late 90's
Re:Don't believe everything you read. by Aetrix · 2004-10-30 12:13 · Score: 2, Funny

Oh, well... It's a Saturday.
Jeez - only total losers post on Slashdot on Saturday nights instead of going out on the town...

Oh...

--

"One touch of Darwin makes the whole world kin." George Bernard Shaw
Re:Don't believe everything you read. by cbreaker · 2004-10-30 15:03 · Score: 1

Or.. if you're an unoriginal retard that thinks he's funny, it's "the bucket."

I live in Pawtucket.

--
- It's not the Macs I hate. It's Digg users. -
Re:Don't believe everything you read. by Brandybuck · 2004-10-30 16:23 · Score: 1

"I use Mandrake, so that makes me suave and sophisticated."

I sprayed my monitor with milk and chunks of tuna caserole when I read that. To a Mandrake user, "suave" means wearing tightie whities as loungewear, and "sophisticated" means using a handful of toilet paper as a napkin.

--
Don't blame me, I didn't vote for either of them!
Re:Don't believe everything you read. by rizzo420 · 2004-10-31 09:35 · Score: 1

touchee

i live in providence. just moved from nort providence (h purposely left out).

--
please me, have no regrets.

Attention all OS X users: by BandwidthHog · 2004-10-30 03:37 · Score: 2, Funny

Please refrain from making 'lickable' jokes.

That is all.

--

Quantum materiae materietur marmota monax si marmota monax materiam possit materiari?

Re:Attention all OS X users: by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 03:54 · Score: 0

That's a totally lickable opinion.

It works...? by DogDude · 2004-10-30 03:38 · Score: 5, Interesting

What if I use the distro that I use because it's the only one that I could get to actually work?

--
I don't respond to AC's.

Re:It works...? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 03:40 · Score: 0

That means that you are not 1337, and a b1G l4m3r.
Re:It works...? by itallushrt · 2004-10-30 03:46 · Score: 1

What if I use the distro that I use because it's the only one that I could get to actually work?

Then you should probably go back to the OS that was left out of the article (WinXP).
Re:It works...? by dagur · 2004-10-30 03:55 · Score: 2, Funny

What was the problem? Couln't play mp3 files in Fedora? Installing software in Debian gave you the error "bash: rpm: command not found"?
Re:It works...? by nomadic · 2004-10-30 03:57 · Score: 5, Funny

What if I use the distro that I use because it's the only one that I could get to actually work?

Then you must enter an intense period of training to hone your installation skills. Go out now and get a copy of NetBSD and begin. After you can install that, you can return to Linux in triumph, for you will be able to install anything.
Re:It works...? by SparklingClearWit · 2004-10-30 04:03 · Score: 2, Insightful

Gosh, that's really helpful!

RIGHT THERE is the reason that business, Mom and Dad, and Joe Sixpack won't adopt OSS. The elitist - no, actually - "prick-ish" attitude that so many Linux and Unix users display.

Until this attitude is GONE, we have no chance at becoming the proud bearers of an alternative operating system.

I run FreeBSD, RedHat, Debian, WinXPPro, and Win2KPro, so I'm just a slut, since I'll use anything.
Re:It works...? by DrSkwid · 2004-10-30 04:11 · Score: 1

FreeBSD, RedHat, Debian, WinXPPro, and Win2KPro

POSIX is for weeners, use a proper OS

--
There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
Re:It works...? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:12 · Score: 0

That is true - having survived netbsd and openbsd installs on a variety of machines early in my computing career I learned more about ridiculous device naming conventions and making a terminal go than I wanted to. I could be downright serene during the most horrific linux install.
Re:It works...? by magarity · 2004-10-30 04:34 · Score: 1

No kidding! To my dismay, I discovered that Toshiba's proprietary implementation of the GeForce2Go chip is unsupported by NVidia's stock Linux drivers. So there's no way to get Linux support better than unaccellerated 800x600x8 on my laptop. I could put up with it, I suppose, but it's no fun.
Re:It works...? by SparklingClearWit · 2004-10-30 05:12 · Score: 1

Thanks for proving my point.

Cheers!
Re:It works...? by DrSkwid · 2004-10-30 05:28 · Score: 1

Likewise

--
There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
Re:It works...? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 06:33 · Score: 0

That means you aren't trying hard enough and haven't spent enough days reading endless documentation. To be truly productive at what you intend to use the OS for, it is best if you first learn how to program in C and then learn to write your own hardware drivers, which will probably also require you to learn some assembler. Then and only then will it be okay for you to begin to actually be productive after you recompile the kernel several dozen times while trying to find (and then rewrite) that one weird library that nobody seems to have laying around.

Fscking non-l333t Hand-holding L-user. It's a freaking OS and not some sort of interface to your system for you and your stinking apps to just *use*. Eesh!
Re:It works...? by torstenvl · 2004-10-30 06:40 · Score: 0, Flamebait

You know, I'm really sick of this attitude on Slashdot and in the world at large about Unix-like operating systems.

There seems to be this asenine conformity to the "You guys are so elitist, it should be easy for me" idea. This is genuinely stupid. Elitism doesn't come from being knowledgeable in a field, elitism is when you claim superiority to others. Elitism is when you insult others for being who they are. The users of Unix and Unix-like operating systems ARE computer experts and enthusiasts. Deal with it. You can join their ranks, or you can shut the fuck up. Nobody likes a whiny little Republican complaining to his skydiving instructor that he doesn't think he can do it by himself because the caviar is giving him a stomach ache, and begging for yet another tandem jump. Dive in and get messy, or go back to your silver-spoon-fed Windows world.

Suck my fscking c**k, pussy boy.
Re:It works...? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 07:19 · Score: 0

I can't even believe how much I don't get this. NetBSD, hard to isntall? God, that 15 minutes of my life must have been more difficult that I thought?!
Re:It works...? by identity0 · 2004-10-30 08:37 · Score: 1

I think you forgot the part about "training on an remote Chinese mountaintop, with the guidance of an elderly master of the ancient secret art of install-fu on a TRaSh-80."

Once you have mastered the art of installing what cannot be installed, you may return to RedHat or even Caldera and be content to know that all is vanity, all is illusion.

Go now. Enlightenment (v. 0.17) awaits.
Re:It works...? by SparklingClearWit · 2004-10-30 09:01 · Score: 0, Troll

Well, to reply in kind, you f!cking sh!tbag motherf!cker who seems like eating random cocks -

It's cocks!ckers like you who prevent more people from becoming involved with, or desiring to become Linux/Unix experts.

You'll note I never once "whined" about Linux/Unix being too hard. If it was, my network would be all Windows machines. It isn't.

I'm so glad to have found the dividing line between "enthusiasts" and "elitist prick".

Grow up, move out of Mommy's basement, and realize the real world gives this much {} of a flying fuck about your attitude towards computers or "experts".

Oh, nice comment about being a Republican - what the FUCK does that have to do with anything?

Shitsucking Assbag. I guess I was trolled, eh, scrotum sucker?

Have a nice day!
Re:It works...? by vsprintf · 2004-10-30 09:26 · Score: 1

RIGHT THERE is the reason that business, Mom and Dad, and Joe Sixpack won't adopt OSS. The elitist - no, actually - "prick-ish" attitude that so many Linux and Unix users display.

Until this attitude is GONE, we have no chance at becoming the proud bearers of an alternative operating system.

I don't think the attitude is as prevalent as you think. Slashdot is not the place to look for help with Linux. I've used Mandrake for years because when I first tried Linux, Red Hat wouldn't install but Mandrake did. Visit the Mandrake forums. N00bs don't get flamed (at least not often - there's always some rude twit with an ego in need of boosting). Generally, other users try to help as long as the question is understandable.
Re:It works...? by SparklingClearWit · 2004-10-30 09:38 · Score: 1

Thanks for being on the other side of the fence.

I'm a Linux/Unix user & advocate, myself, and I enjoy telling and teaching people about Linux, and how it can be useful or fun for them - if they want to learn it.

Your attitude is exactly the right path we need to take! Thanks for cheering me up - the other fool who responded (trolled) me got me pissed off.

Have a great weekend!
Re:It works...? by vsprintf · 2004-10-30 09:40 · Score: 1

I'm a Linux user at home and a UNIX programmer at work, and after reading that, all I can say is you're part of the problem, not the solution. Politics aside, does your mommy know you're posting to Slashdot again and using dirty words?
Re:It works...? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 11:02 · Score: 0

We're big boys on this website, so it's O.K for you to use words like "fuck", "shit", "motherfucker" and "cocksucker" without being a fucking pussy and trying to obscure one letter in case you offend someone (Who? Yourself?)
Re:It works...? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 11:05 · Score: 0

Why do you blame Linux for Toshiba and nVidia's failure to provide proper hardware support for their product?

I find this attitude that Linux and OSS developers should go out of their way to support every single little turdy peice of hardware OEM's squeeze from their cheeks and then abandon fascinating. We can't do everything. Seriously.
Re:It works...? by MobyTurbo · 2004-10-30 13:21 · Score: 1

Then you must enter an intense period of training to hone your installation skills. Go out now and get a copy of NetBSD and begin. After you can install that, you can return to Linux in triumph, for you will be able to install anything.
Actually, although it's text mode and scares some people, the NetBSD installer is actually nice and straightforward because of its simplicity. Of course, afterwards you will need to do some configuring that other free Unices do with a GUI interface, but that's what NetBSD's excellent documentation is for.
Re:It works...? by nomadic · 2004-10-30 16:48 · Score: 1

They made it easier? Last time I tried installing it was like 95 or so, and it wasn't fun.

They forgot Caldera by antifoidulus · 2004-10-30 03:38 · Score: 5, Funny

Using Caldera says that if your linux install fails, sue someone.

--
Monstar L

A distro doesn't say a damn thing about anyone by phoxix · 2004-10-30 03:38 · Score: 4, Insightful

There are plenty of hardcore code, library, kernel hackers running distros like fedora, suse, mandrake, etc

There are also plenty of totaly linux newbies using gentoo, archlinux, etc

I know that this article is a joke (not a funny one either), but these stereotypes need to come to an end.

Sunny Dubey

Re:A distro doesn't say a damn thing about anyone by Sensible+Clod · 2004-10-30 03:49 · Score: 1

Wow. How on earth is that a troll? How about this:

There are many single people who drive giant SUV's and never take them off the road, and there are 5-person families who drive Civics.

Would that also be considered a troll?

Please mod parent up, at least a little.

--

The difference between spam and poop is that you don't have to dig through septic tanks looking for real food. -- Me
Re:A distro doesn't say a damn thing about anyone by kfg · 2004-10-30 04:15 · Score: 1, Offtopic

Oh, I don't know. I think it would be pretty accurate to say that running mu on my laptop says I'm a cheap bastard who doesn't see any reason to buy a new machine so long as I can get vanilla vi to run.

KFG
Re:A distro doesn't say a damn thing about anyone by Billly+Gates · 2004-10-30 04:55 · Score: 1

I think the article is garbage and is heavily and inaccurately stereotyping but it does say alot about the users.

For example I prefer FreeBSD.

Reason being is I prefer stability and quality over cutting edgness and being in. Not to mention its much easier to customize than a Linux distro.

My own physcology applies to other things. I only buy Honda and Toyotta cars because I obsess about stability and getting the most bang for my buck. I care more about that then what looks cool or what my friends drive. I also buy only asus and other high brand components for my computer. I will not tollerate failures and look at bad components that die as defects. THe whole reason I switched to Linux and then Unix was because I want things to work and not get upset when something crashes. Most geeks say well its just a bug but I look at it as a flaw.

My distro choice above well reflects my personality.

If I wanted to play with some apache and wanted to use what everyone else used I would be using Fedora. If I wanted simplicity and a whole bunch of gui's out of the box regardless of stability or control I would pick Mandrake. If I wanted a whole bunch of apps and be the kind of guy who drives a big truck or SUV I would probably lean towards SuSE.

An artist, MacOSX. :-)

It is interesting and I do see a difference personally when going to a Unix show among the different distro users.

--
http://saveie6.com/
Re:A distro doesn't say a damn thing about anyone by phoxix · 2004-10-30 05:12 · Score: 2, Funny

I remember you, god damn you still write lots of crap on slashdot.

Remember this post of yours, and my reply ? I remember explaining basic things to you.

Sunny Dubey
Re:A distro doesn't say a damn thing about anyone by Eil · 2004-10-30 05:16 · Score: 1

Indeed, some of us use the FreeBSD distribution.
Re:A distro doesn't say a damn thing about anyone by dumeinst · 2004-10-30 05:17 · Score: 2, Insightful

God..

Trust a slashdot reader to take this shit seriously. Get a life
Re:A distro doesn't say a damn thing about anyone by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:29 · Score: 0

And I bet you're Virgo and blood type O+
Re:A distro doesn't say a damn thing about anyone by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:30 · Score: 0

FreeBSD locks up hard on boot unless I disable ACPI, and then it won't detect my hardware. BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. (nForce3)
Re:A distro doesn't say a damn thing about anyone by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 07:35 · Score: 0

there are 5-person families who drive Civics.

I wouldn't like to see them driving down the road at me all fighting for control of the wheel.
Re:A distro doesn't say a damn thing about anyone by rizzo420 · 2004-10-30 08:50 · Score: 1

what's wrong with that? i'm both those things, but i found the article highly amusing... and yes, i was nursed on a TTY.

--
please me, have no regrets.
Re:A distro doesn't say a damn thing about anyone by patrick_darcy · 2004-10-30 09:01 · Score: 1

chill
Re:A distro doesn't say a damn thing about anyone by Billly+Gates · 2004-10-30 09:41 · Score: 1

Regardless of the matter.

RPM still sucks. Its a method invented by redhat to lock you into constant upgrading since many projects like kde and gnome only have updated rpm's for distributions made in the last year and a half at the most.

Yes I stand by my older comments. Flamewar aside, Unix/Linux is not perfect and incompatiblities with each other make it hard sell to average Joes and many developers. Oracle for one only wants to make their database with Redhat advanced server because of the incompaiblities with different versions of libraries and utilities that it depends on. Support costs would be too high.

I can run a 5 year old windows but I can not run a 5 year old Linux app. Why is that?

Windows and MacOSX keep multiple versions of libraries for that reason.

--
http://saveie6.com/
Re:A distro doesn't say a damn thing about anyone by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 10:38 · Score: 0

I only buy Honda and Toyotta cars because I obsess about stability and getting the most bang for my buck.

Same here except I bought a Mustang..
At the same time my friedn had the same thought you had. His Toyota needed a transmission at ~35k miles (warranty), power steering pump at ~50k miles (out of pocket) and had problems with his front rotors (out of pocket). In that same time frame, I spent NOTHING on my Mustang. I also beat the crap out of my Mustang on a daily basis on the road and the track. I did NOTHING but replace normal wear out itmes until 125K miles when I replaced the clutch. In the last 30k miles and 6 years (I drive it a lot less now), I've replaced the water pump and alternator, about $125 total and did them myself in about 1hr each. I paid less for the car, had a much funner and faster car, and I pay way less for parts and service when I do need something fixed. Econimical and reliable.

In general, you are very right about Honda and Toyota and I do not dispute that claim! But, you can get a long term car from other companies that are cheap to maintain and will last a long time also.
Re:A distro doesn't say a damn thing about anyone by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 11:30 · Score: 0

ZOMG! The nerve of them, forcing you to upgrade to get a new version of some program! Oh Noes!

As for getting the latest KDE while still running on RedHat 6.2, thats what rpm --rebuild kde.src.rpm is for. Just be ready to build a lot of dependencies because (Shock! Horror!) newer versions of KDE uses newer libraries (Gasp!)

The nerve of open source developers! Making all these annoying versions, and splitting things up into libraries! They should all go back to just writing one version! Then it won't matter if some little support function has a bug in it whether its in a separate library or part of a 100MB /usr/bin/kde because there won't be another version!
Re:A distro doesn't say a damn thing about anyone by FuzzieNorn · 2004-10-30 13:51 · Score: 1

Because the Linux core and the open source apps are free, so you can just grab new ones, no problem.

I have several over 5-year-old commercial Linux apps on my desktop, which work fine, generally because they're either statically linked (not the best solution, but the typical Linux distribution model is to assume you have the damn source to what you're running), or they're using stable libs (by far the most common).

Uhm.. by Xeo+024 · 2004-10-30 03:39 · Score: 5, Informative

Oh please, this is just as reliable as the Which OS Are you? quiz.

Re:Uhm.. by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 03:51 · Score: 1, Funny

Damn! I and ended up as Slackware. This just confirms the fact that women see me as unattractive, unfriendly and that I have a small package.
Re:Uhm.. by coconutstudio · 2004-10-30 04:20 · Score: 1

I'm Windows XP. Am I that square? I wish I could be FreeBSD. Diehard OS that never refuses to give up.
zeia award

--
http://www.up0.com/
Re:Uhm.. by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:29 · Score: 0

I'm Windows XP. Am I that square? I wish I could be FreeBSD. Diehard OS that never refuses to give up.
In other words, you'd rather be dead than be bloated and fat? ;)
Re:Uhm.. by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:52 · Score: 0

It told me I was OS/2. Funny, I feel more like OS/400. Maybe OS/390. But not OS/2.
Re:Uhm.. by CamelSemFiltro · 2004-10-30 05:08 · Score: 1

Well to my suprise it replied "Slackware Linux". That's incredible ! It works! :)
Re:Uhm.. by Beatbyte · 2004-10-30 05:19 · Score: 1

it's a little more reliable than your sense of humor on a saturday morning ;-)

--
Get paid to code OSS
Re:Uhm.. by shiftless · 2004-10-30 08:26 · Score: 1

Damnit, I'm "Debian Linux"! Nooo!!!
Re:Uhm.. by rueba · 2004-10-30 10:28 · Score: 1

Ha! I got "Slackware Linux", which supposedly makes me l33t or something.

The strange thing is:

-I have never even seen a slackware installation.

-The only distro I have ever used is RedHat

- I use Windows XP both at home and at the office(horrors!).

In my defense, I do have dualboot on the office desktop and I ssh to a Red Hat box everyday to do the "real work" and to check my mail so I am not totally clueless in the Way Of The Penguin(tm).

--
The only reason all cover-ups appear to fail is that you never hear about the ones that succeed.
Re:Uhm.. by Reziac · 2004-10-31 06:43 · Score: 1

"You are Apple Dos. Simple and primitive with a good understanding of the common man. You're still a work in progress, but a good start."
[eyeing heap of machines that run M$DOS, DRDOS, and/or random species of Win32, and one Mandrake box]
I'm not sure, but I think I've just been insulted!!
[finds their other quiz Which File Extension are You?, tries that instead]
"You are .html -- You are versatile and improving, but you do have your limits. When you work with amateurs it can get quite ugly."
[Goes back, inserts HTML tags in post]
That's more like it!

--
~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?

The Cat in the Hat by OffTheLip · 2004-10-30 03:39 · Score: 0, Offtopic

Was red now blue.

I suppose someone.. by Tracer_Bullet82 · 2004-10-30 03:39 · Score: 1

got pissed off at the "Cult of Mac" article.

*groan*

Seriuosly, do we need this?

--

Timang tinggi tinggi
parang sudah asah
alang alang mandi
biar sampai basah

Re:I suppose someone.. by advocate_one · 2004-10-30 03:58 · Score: 1

look, it's the weekend before your election... and they want a good old fashioned distro war rather than pointless political flamewars... anything to take your minds off the drivel pouring out of the news channels on the political campaigns...

--
Donald 'Duck' Dunn: We had a band powerful enough to turn goat piss into gasoline.

Great. No Slackware. by Xpilot · 2004-10-30 03:39 · Score: 5, Funny

So I'll just make one up:

Slackware users are grumpy, bearded old Unix sysadmins who prefer things be done the "good old fashioned way", making their Linux distro stick to traditional Unix principles, through 10 feet of snow, uphill, both ways!

P.S. I'm a slackware user myself, don't flame me ;) It was tongue-in-cheek.

--
"Backups are for wimps. Real men upload their data to an FTP site and have everyone else mirror it." -- Linus Torvalds

Re:Great. No Slackware. by mrseigen · 2004-10-30 03:44 · Score: 1

But this is why I use Debian. That, and I really like upgrading things. Yup.
Re:Great. No Slackware. by kfg · 2004-10-30 04:12 · Score: 0, Offtopic

. . .through 10 feet of snow

Wearing sandals, although when it gets below 20F I do tend to add neoprene socks. Very fasionable.

KFG
Re:Great. No Slackware. by Vox+Humana · 2004-10-30 04:43 · Score: 1

Slackware users are grumpy, bearded old Unix sysadmins who prefer things be done the "good old fashioned way", making their Linux distro stick to traditional Unix principles, through 10 feet of snow, uphill, both ways!
I remember the MCC/SLS days, when people worried about this new 'Slackware' distribution that was going to dumb down and commercialize Linux.
God I feel old.
Re:Great. No Slackware. by temojen · 2004-10-30 05:07 · Score: 1

I still have my slackware floppy set...
Re:Great. No Slackware. by the_truk_stop · 2004-10-30 06:21 · Score: 1

through 10 feet of snow, uphill, both ways!
You forgot "on their hands and knees". ;)

Does Fedora count? by Sensible+Clod · 2004-10-30 03:39 · Score: 5, Funny

I don't see any mention of Fedora. Do they expect everyone to believe it's the same as Red Hat's commercial distro?

More likely, we Fedora users are just too good for words.

--

The difference between spam and poop is that you don't have to dig through septic tanks looking for real food. -- Me

Re:Does Fedora count? by casey · 2004-10-30 03:56 · Score: 1

I was a little bummed about no mention of Fedora as well.. I've got a RHEL3 box and several FC2 machines and 'RHEL3' ne 'FC2'; The way I look at it.. Fedora users are the 'oldschool' RH folks who remember the good old days of ftp installing RH4 and still believe RTFM is better support than someone on the phone with a recording of 'That is not supported'..
Re:Does Fedora count? by octothorpe · 2004-10-30 04:13 · Score: 1

Sometimes I feel like I'm just not a good enough geek because I use Fedora, I should be using Gentoo or Debian. But I work fulltime and go to grad school and I don't have time to mess with an OS that is anymore complicated than Fedora. Fedora works, is easy to configure, knows all my hardware, has lots of community support and is easy to update with Yum. When I graduate or get laid-off I'll go back to messing with Gentoo but right now I just don't have the time.
Of course I have the time to read /. !
Re:Does Fedora count? by NTmatter · 2004-10-30 05:43 · Score: 5, Funny

Full-time emplyment works quite well with gentoo, actually. When you wake up, you start compiling the results of last night's 'emerge sync' and then by the time you get home your compile should be finished and you'll sink a few minutes updating your config files. When the weekend rolls around, you'll finally have the time to use your freshly compiled system. Bonus points if you use your lunch break to check up on the status of your compile.
Re:Does Fedora count? by dn15 · 2004-10-30 06:24 · Score: 1

IMHO there's nothing wrong with using Fedora. I am a bit annoyed at these stereotypes myself, even though they are a joke.

You have to consider how the distribution is going to be used. Currently Fedora and Debian are my two favorites because they both "just work", but one does so as a desktop system while the other does as as server (if you already have some idea which packages you need and how to configure them.)

I disliked Red Hat in the past but began liking their stuff around the release of Fedora Core 1. It seems to have the most polished and consistent interface across different UI toolkits (though it'd be hard to beat a stock all-KDE setup on those terms.) I have installed some of the more geekish systems as a deskop machine, but in the end I like something that just works and for the desktop Fedora does that well (maybe that's the Mac user in me rearing its head -- my main computer is a 12" PowerBook.) Anyway, the point is we don't need to get so uptight over these things. They're different tools to match different people's working styles for different jobs.

Suse users like a *clean* desktop? by KublaiKhan · 2004-10-30 03:39 · Score: 5, Funny

Obviously, theyv'e never seen mine...the only reason that the icons even line up is because the automatic line up feature's enabled. As for my non-computer desktop....it's been declared a Superfund site, and the EPA guys will be along any time now with the hazmat suits.

I guess I'm using the wrong distro, huh?

--
In Xanadu did Kubla Khan
A stately pleasure dome decree

Re:Suse users like a *clean* desktop? by spitefulcrow · 2004-10-30 04:24 · Score: 1

Icons? I don't have any icons on my desktop.

--
Sorry, my karma just ran over your dogma.
Re:Suse users like a *clean* desktop? by zurab · 2004-10-30 06:35 · Score: 1

I have used SUSE since 6.x versions and I have 0 icons on my desktop. In fact, I disabled the "icons on desktop" feature altogether. I arranged most used application buttons (including the K menu) on the bottom panel (with transparency), and I have an auto-hiding panel at the top with the pager, taskbar, system tray and a clock. I think it's pretty clean and I personally don't like it set up any other way.

What I didn't understand was:

SUSE users ... are far less concerned about where things are kept in the filesystem than they ought to be.

That doesn't make any sense to me. I know where most things are in the filesystem. In fact when SUSE (then SuSE) pledged LSB compatibility about 5 years ago, it (version 7.0 I believe) was instantly the most compliant distro, even outdoing Debian which was second according to the LSB-FHS (filesystem hierarchy standard) tests then. I don't know that Open Group does these comparison tests now and publishes the results, but recent SUSE versions are also all LSB 1.3 certified.
Re:Suse users like a *clean* desktop? by Phroggy · 2004-10-30 09:12 · Score: 1

As for my non-computer desktop....it's been declared a Superfund site, and the EPA guys will be along any time now with the hazmat suits.

Fortunately for you, the Bush administration has cut the funding for that, so you have nothing to worry about. Fortunately for both of us, actually, since my desktop looks about the same.

And I have "snap to grid" turned off, so my Mac OS X desktop looks even more cluttered than yours. ;-)

--
$x='S24;r)>63/* h@<5+oZ)32"5cz';$me='phroggy'x$];
$x=~y+ -xz+\0-Tx+;print$_^chop$me for split'',$x;

Tagentially related ... by YetAnotherName · 2004-10-30 03:39 · Score: 2, Informative

... is BBSpot's OS Quiz.

Lisandro by Lisandro · 2004-10-30 03:40 · Score: 4, Funny

Gentoo

If John Wayne had been a Linux user, he would have used Gentoo. Gentoo users are pioneers, people who like to live close to the metal, and don't mind hurting themselves on sharp objects. Some feel that Gentoo users are simply lazy louts who always want to have a ready excuse for why they are not doing constructive things with their computer, other than compiling or recompiling the latest kernel, app, or hapless passerby. The official Gentoo motto is, "If it moves, compile it."

Paraphrasing Maddox, Gentoo users are baddases and listen to Pantera. Red Hat users get their nails done and shop for purses.

Ok, i'll shut up now :)

Re:Lisandro by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 03:45 · Score: 1, Insightful

Ah, yes. Pantera; the "NKOTB" of Metal.

This whole "news article" is just one fucked up way to incite a full on flame war. Great job, CowboyNeal.
Re:Lisandro by Rob+Riggs · 2004-10-30 03:52 · Score: 4, Funny

You misspelled "Porsches".

--
the growth in cynicism and rebellion has not been without cause
Re:Lisandro by Lisandro · 2004-10-30 03:56 · Score: 1

Touché. Mod up!
Re:Lisandro by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:04 · Score: 0

guys do not have purses we have 'man bags' i am deeply offended now. In reality i am slackware, then rh distro person.

Wha does it mean if i do LFS and create my own distro.
Re:Lisandro by Anonymous+Brave+Guy · 2004-10-30 05:16 · Score: 1

Red Hat users get their nails done and shop for purses.

Dammit, I just went to that OS quiz everyone's linking to, and it told me I'm a Red Hat user. This was the next post I saw, and I think it's confusing me with my girlfriends.

--
If you disagree, post your argument. (-1, Overrated) isn't your personal censorship tool for views you don't like.
Re:Lisandro by temojen · 2004-10-30 05:22 · Score: 1

I'm a gentoo user and I most certainly do not listen to Pantera. Rage Against the Machine, Pink Floyd, Bob Marley, Mike Oldfield, Disposable Heroes of Hiphopracy, Beethoven, and the Tea Party, but never Pantera. Pantera's just crap.
Re:Lisandro by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:32 · Score: 0

You're missing a damn fine metal band then.
Re:Lisandro by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 07:04 · Score: 0

Ah, yes. Pantera; the "NKOTB" of Metal.
No, that would be Metallica. Pantera never sold out.
Re:Lisandro by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 10:07 · Score: 0

Duh, Red Hat users have got to look good, because Red Hat users have jobs.

The article is a troll by dancedance · 2004-10-30 03:41 · Score: 4, Insightful

The entire point of the article is to piss off everyone using any of those distros.

Re:The article is a troll by bhtooefr · 2004-10-30 03:58 · Score: 1

It seemed that the author had an extreme Mandrake bias.

I'll admit, I prefer Mandrake, but I did notice that this guy was attacking other distros more than Mandrake.
Re:The article is a troll by MooseGuy529 · 2004-10-30 04:33 · Score: 2, Interesting

Repeat after me: Trolls can be funny!

Sure, it pokes fun at distros, but it's mostly fair, and it's not hateful. Enjoy it. (I run Gentoo, I agree--if it moves, compile it)

--
Tired of free iPod sigs? Subscribe to my blacklist
Re:The article is a troll by morgajel · 2004-10-30 04:56 · Score: 1

I'm a former redhat, suse, mandrake, and debian user.
I'm currently using gentoo.

I found it hillarious.

whatever floats your boat man, don't whine because they slammed you, I was slammed 5 times by it but my sense of humor and humility is still intact.

Advice: if this article pissed you off, you have issues. Get over it. it was a joke and not even that offensive of a joke.

--
Looking for Book Reviews? Check out Literary Escapism.
Re:The article is a troll by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:03 · Score: 0

In the eyes of the humour impaired. Those of us who've actually used a fair number of those distros found it funny.
Re:The article is a troll by node+3 · 2004-10-30 05:28 · Score: 2, Funny

The entire point of the article is to piss off everyone using any of those distros.

Ah, a HURD user.
Re:The article is a troll by Peter+La+Casse · 2004-10-30 06:56 · Score: 1

Advice: if this article pissed you off, you have issues.
What issues do you suppose those are? I'm curious.
Re:The article is a troll by NoOneInParticular · 2004-10-30 07:06 · Score: 1

Not sure about that, I guess that if it moves it is already compiled, but maybe: if it moves, kill it, get the blueprint and recompile it with the wrong options, making sure it never speeds again.
Re:The article is a troll by adolfojp · 2004-10-30 07:35 · Score: 1

Actually, they attacked Mandrake users by implying that they are all French. If you don't call that an insult... ;-) Just kidding.

Cheers,

Adolfo
Re:The article is a troll by morgajel · 2004-10-30 09:20 · Score: 1

perhaps a bit of over-sensitivity.

it seems like the days of super political correctness just go way to far.

my previous comment wasn't meant as a condecending stab at the original poster or anything, it was just me speaking my mind.

Hell, I wouldn't have even posted to this if I wasn't afraid I had hurt your feelings.

no hard feelings, eh?

--
Looking for Book Reviews? Check out Literary Escapism.

Some edits needed. by jZnat · 2004-10-30 03:41 · Score: 1, Funny

Debian: this user typically tends to stick with older machines and enjoys using the "unstable" versions that are actually the current version, just not tested by the developers themselves yet (because they are too busy playing UT2004 and Doom 3).

Gentoo: this user typically likes to brag about how they were able to install linux using only a bash prompt, yet they conveniently disregard the fact that they used a fully understandable documentation on how to install it that even a linux newbie could understand.

Slackware: this user likes the name, tries it out and falls in love. They enjoy the .com domain for it and will likely recommend it to all their friends, similar to that of some Firefox users.

--
'Yes, firefox is indeed greater than women. Can women block pops up for you? No. Can Firefox show you naked women? Yes.'

Re:Some edits needed. by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 03:50 · Score: 0

Hehe.. when I first tried Linux I did some attempts with Red Hat before deciding to BUY the Slackware 3.4 set, just because I liked the name .. Fell in love of course. Still using it.
Re:Some edits needed. by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 03:54 · Score: 2, Insightful

Let the flame wars begin!

Gentoo: this user typically likes to brag about how they were able to install linux using only a bash prompt, yet they conveniently disregard the fact that they used a fully understandable documentation on how to install it that even a linux newbie could understand.

I agree that the documentation is easy to follow. But I dont understand why you make it sound like a bad thing. Its wonderfull they have such good documentation. How else are you going to learn to do it the 1st time? And after that, you dont really need the install docs anymore, because you understand the process going on.
Re:Some edits needed. by jZnat · 2004-10-30 04:15 · Score: 0, Flamebait

I agree that the docs are good, but there are many elitists on the Gentoo forums that only use that as their basis for why they are 1337 h4>0rz who pwnz0r n00bl4rz when asked why they are such elitist assholes. I didn't mean to make the docs sound bad. =)

--
'Yes, firefox is indeed greater than women. Can women block pops up for you? No. Can Firefox show you naked women? Yes.'

Here you have it. by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 03:41 · Score: 0

"Linspire provides its users more ease of use than they deserve."
Keep thinking like that...

DO NOT CLICK ON THE LINKS!!! by Vicsun · 2004-10-30 03:42 · Score: 1

they aren't really g-mail invites, if you were wondering.

Re:DO NOT CLICK ON THE LINKS!!! by Lisandro · 2004-10-30 03:43 · Score: 1

Offtopic, but i have a few if anyone's interested. Not that they're rare anymore or anything.

Hey! I'm John Wayne! by sgant · 2004-10-30 03:42 · Score: 1

John Wayne - American (on his medal of freedom)

and of course:
"Rooster Cogburn : I aim to kill you in one minute, Ned. Or see you hanged in Fort Smith at Judge Parker's convenience. What'll it be?

Ned Pepper : I call that bold talk for a one eyed fat man.

Rooster Cogburn : Fill your hands, you son of a bitch."

and:
Rooster Cogburn : You can't serve papers on a rat, baby sister. You gotta shoot him or let him be.

--

"Leo Fender was in a 'state of grace' when he designed the Stratocaster." -- Paul Reed Smith

Damn Small by loomis · 2004-10-30 03:42 · Score: 2, Funny

What if I use Damn Small Linux? Does that make me very tiny?

--
"The television is the retina of the mind's eye" - Videodrome

Re:Damn Small by jZnat · 2004-10-30 03:56 · Score: 1

If by "me" you mean "little me", then yes, you have a small penis. Better give in to those viagra spam emails; I hear they work just as advertised according to the carefully crafted consumer reviews included in every email!

--
'Yes, firefox is indeed greater than women. Can women block pops up for you? No. Can Firefox show you naked women? Yes.'
Re:Damn Small by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:55 · Score: 0

If you install gnome, it makes you a hobbit.

slackware by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 03:43 · Score: 0

Slackware :

Slackware users were abonned at birth and raised by a pack of wolves. Natural selection opperates in harmony with evolution to ensure only the strong survive amongst this group. During the interview process the interviewer was subjected to sometype of tar treatment rendering him unable to finish his report.

Re:slackware by Tsiangkun · 2004-10-30 03:47 · Score: 0, Redundant

funny.

Not a pity... by SaDan · 2004-10-30 03:43 · Score: 5, Funny

Slackware users don't need to be compared to the rest of that trash!

Oops... Did I say that out loud? ;-)

Re:Not a pity... by Analog+Anomaly · 2004-10-30 03:46 · Score: 0

Damn right! :) -slackware user
Re:Not a pity... by EvilAlien · 2004-10-30 05:15 · Score: 2, Funny

Thats right, all two of them are in a totally different league than the drooling Linux masses...

--
perl -e 'print $i=pack(c5, (41*2), sqrt(7056), (unpack(c,H)-2), oct(115), 10)'
Re:Not a pity... by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:31 · Score: 2, Interesting

true, the people that are too "1337" to go ahead and just adopt gentoo, and type "emerge xxx" instead of hunting down every last tar ball and compiling each one by hand.

if you wana be different from he "league [of] drooling Linux masses" you would build linux from scratch.

http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/

afterall the best distribution is your own.

Slackware by thinker · 2004-10-30 03:44 · Score: 1

Just a gal or guy who loves to hack.

The true spirit of *NIX.

Gentoo by toupsie · 2004-10-30 03:44 · Score: 3, Funny

I use Gentoo because I believe that an OS should be loud, obnoxious and have glass packs on the exhaust. Of course my Shuttle XPC has a "Type R" sticker on it.

--
Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government.

Re:Gentoo by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:04 · Score: 0

Of course my Shuttle XPC has a "Type R" sticker on it.
So, that gives you what? Another 50Mhz? Me, I have a Ferrari sticker on mine, I find it boosts the cpu speed by up to 300Mhz! ;)
And if you believe that, I have some nice "drainage challenged" land I'll sell you...
Re:Gentoo by tom.allender · 2004-10-30 05:26 · Score: 1

Gentoo is for ricers...

I'm using Gentoo by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 03:45 · Score: 0

And now I don't really dare to look at the article.

No need for that by CaptainZapp · 2004-10-30 03:45 · Score: 5, Interesting

Knoppix users are pushy and aggressive. It's not at all unusual for them to hand you a CD and tell you to boot from it.

What a cincidence and a true story.

One of the broad minded Windows admins in [insert major logistics company] yelled at me "Linux for President" when I passed his office before yesterday.

It turns out that one of his laptops was fuxored and no matter what he wasn't able to boot it under Windows.

Since he is broadminded and a good admin (even though he's an MCSE) he has his tools ready and one of it is Knoppix.

The laptop booted like a charm, made the partition visible, the files where saved to another laptop and Linux oughta be president.

There was really no need to push Knoppix on him.

--
ich bin der musikant

mit taschenrechner in der hand

kraftwerk

Re:No need for that by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:27 · Score: 1, Interesting

I once made a few hundred bucks in a day selling knoppix CDs on the street in Vancouver. I even explained to each person that they could download everything on the CD themselves for free if they wanted to... sold them for $10CDN each to almost everyone who came by (I also had a laptop there to demonstrate).
Re:No need for that by cbreaker · 2004-10-30 16:54 · Score: 1

Ohh yea because throwing Knoppix in a bag and only using it when Windows breaks is a really big sign of a Linux user/lover.

--
- It's not the Macs I hate. It's Digg users. -

hear hear! by clsc · 2004-10-30 03:46 · Score: 2, Interesting

sofar i've tried ubuntu, gnoppix, knoppix, suse, morphix, knoppix, slax, elearnix, dynebolic, mepis, dsl, puppy, pc linuxos, gentoo (oh, and one or two of those bsd's as well).

The moment i find one that recognizes my onboard sound i'll take it, no matter which name it's got. Untill then i'm stuck on windoze for everything that involves sound (and i do like music).

Re:hear hear! by itallushrt · 2004-10-30 03:48 · Score: 2, Insightful

sofar i've tried ubuntu, gnoppix, knoppix, suse, morphix, knoppix, slax, elearnix, dynebolic, mepis, dsl, puppy, pc linuxos, gentoo (oh, and one or two of those bsd's as well).

The moment i find one that recognizes my onboard sound i'll take it, no matter which name it's got. Untill then i'm stuck on windoze for everything that involves sound (and i do like music).

uhhh, recompile the kernel and use whichever distro you choose.
Re:hear hear! by Chrax · 2004-10-30 03:59 · Score: 2, Insightful

Either recompile the kernel or get an SB Live for $30. Either way beats using Windows.
Re:hear hear! by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:00 · Score: 0

I hate it when people say that their distro is resposible for specific hardware not being supported. It's highly unlikely that your distro has drivers that they've made and not released to anyone else. And if it's a patch, the odds are gentoo-sources have it.
Re:hear hear! by DogDude · 2004-10-30 04:07 · Score: 2, Funny

uhhh, recompile the kernel and use whichever distro you choose.

Oh, and people say there isn't support out there for Linux! Look at this pearl, this gem of wisdom... "recompile the kernel". In just 3 words, this obvsiously astute Linux expert managed to confuse, irritate, AND alienate! Wow, now that's what I call real user support; a real tight community! It's a wonder why more people aren't using Linux these days.

--
I don't respond to AC's.
Re:hear hear! by suso · 2004-10-30 04:24 · Score: 1

Well, maybe if you'd take your head out of your ass and read some documentation instead of expecting everything to be spoon fed to you, then you wouldn't have so much trouble with Linux.

It's really not that hard once you get over that hump of compiling the kernel. People end up fooling themselves into thinking that its hard, when its not. Take a deep breath and just dive in.
Re:hear hear! by masukomi · 2004-10-30 04:37 · Score: 1, Flamebait

I love linux but come on. There are certain basic things that your average computer user expects to just work. Video, Sound, Networking, and Printing.

Microsoft and Apple have both figured this out. These core things must JUST WORK. Yes you might need a specific driver for your Printer or a funky wireless card but beyond that it shouldn't be an issue. People don't want to recompile the kernel. I don't care if you think it's easy. You average user doesn't even know what compiling is. I don't want to have to spend time futzing around with the underpinnings of my os just to make the basic stuff work. Nevermind all the time I'd have to spend reading up on all the various compilations options for the kernel and what they all mean. I want to just use my computer not fix it.
Re:hear hear! by krunk7 · 2004-10-30 04:48 · Score: 1

I know this is a bit off topic, but:
What motherboard? What is your onboard sound chip?
The vast majority of onboard sound run off of the intel8x0 sound driver which I know is auto-detected by at least half of those you mentioned. . . .though some require a little fiddling in the your DE's hardware console.
Re:hear hear! by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:58 · Score: 0

I'm dying to hear what on-board chip none of those recognize. ALSA worked with every on-board and third party sound card I've owned. Your machine doesn't have a crank on one side, does it?
Re:hear hear! by Ziviyr · 2004-10-30 04:58 · Score: 2, Informative

Windows needed drivers installed for ethernet, sound, video, abuncha motherboard stuff, and a few other things.

Linux has needed alot fewer things manually set up for me.

"I want to just use my computer not fix it."

That sums up why the last time Windows puked up on me I started running off of Knoppix until I had an installed Linux going.

Especially since often the quickest fix is outright reinstalling, and I had my fill of that.

--

Someone set us up the bomb, so shine we are!
Re:hear hear! by suso · 2004-10-30 05:17 · Score: 1

I don't know why I'm bothering to reply. You've made it clear that you like to make assumptions, don't even try and judge people before you even know them.

I really don't care if Linux overtakes windows. Really. Linux's survival doesn't depend on it overtaking anything. Which is really nice. As long as people use, develop and enjoy it, it will continue on.

And i'm not pro-anybody. People should be pro-themselves.
Re:hear hear! by dleifelohcs · 2004-10-30 05:52 · Score: 2, Insightful

Parent is a troll.

Parent's Parent (Grandparent?) said he tried Gentoo. To try Gentoo, you must compile a kernel. Therefore, compiling a kernel cannot be something you can target.
Re:hear hear! by JWSmythe · 2004-10-30 06:35 · Score: 1

A hint to which sound card you had would be helpful.

# lspci -v
# cd /usr/src/linux
# make menuconfig

Device Drivers -->
Sound -->
Advanced Linux Sound Architecture -->
PCI devices -->
[Click your card here, use Help if your confused]

# make
# make modules_install
# cd arch/i386/boot
# cp bzImage /boot/vmlinuz
(if you use LILO)
# lilo
# shutdown -r now

And don't complain about the fact that you have to type a couple keystrokes. If your card is that obscure, you probably have to spend quite a while trying to find the drivers online, and then clicking more [Continue] [Next] [Yes] and [I agree] buttons than you could remember.

I like my music too. I listen to my CD's, I listen to MP3's (of CD's I own), I listen to Shoutcast (my favorite)

--
Serious? Seriousness is well above my pay grade.
Re:hear hear! by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 06:39 · Score: 0

"Oh, and people say there isn't support out there for Linux! Look at this pearl, this gem of wisdom... "recompile the kernel". In just 3 words, this obvsiously astute Linux expert managed to confuse, irritate, AND alienate! Wow, now that's what I call real user support; a real tight community! It's a wonder why more people aren't using Linux these days."

Funniest. Post. Ever.
Re:hear hear! by rizzo420 · 2004-10-30 07:03 · Score: 1

windows xp will recognize and auto-install almost all hardware now except very new stuff. linux will not. hell, a standard installation of linux won't even necessarily find some relatively common network cards.

windows is easier, hands down.

--
please me, have no regrets.
Re:hear hear! by cetialphav · 2004-10-30 07:05 · Score: 1

Well, I've compiled loads of kernels. Explain to me how recompiling the kernel will cause his on-board sound to magically start working. You don't even know what chipset it uses. It might not even be supported.
Re:hear hear! by LMariachi · 2004-10-30 07:24 · Score: 2, Insightful

To try Gentoo, you must compile a kernel.
Those must be some very special LiveCDs they offer.
Re:hear hear! by arivanov · 2004-10-30 08:35 · Score: 1

Are you sure that it will work with a recompile? There are a few chips and boards out there that cannot be made to work. I would not expect any one of them to be _on_board_ as they were mostly made in 1995-1996 and died out as Windows 95 came out. These are pre-plug-and-pray boards that require to be initialized in MS DOS. You can sometimes use some of them if you set them in SB emulation mode using the dos utility and load linux using syslinux after that. This is not a normal supported installation mode though.

--
Baker's Law: Misery no longer loves company. Nowadays it insists on it
http://www.sigsegv.cx/
Re:hear hear! by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 11:40 · Score: 0

My Dell laptop is 3 years old with an NVIDIA GeForce4 video card. WindowsXP detects it as "VGA-Compatible video" and makes me install the NVIDIA driver myself, while Slackware 10 detects it as an NVIDIA AGP card and enables everything except 3d acceleration by default. Which of those is easier?
Re:hear hear! by Zorilla · 2004-10-30 11:48 · Score: 1

I love linux but come on. There are certain basic things that your average computer user expects to just work. Video, Sound, Networking, and Printing.

Well, video and sound are optional. I've had people ask for help as to why "mah screen is got real big a few months back" (if it's XP, they won't know the difference, just that the computer's too slow when dragging windows). And, of course, sound broke on my parent's computer until I came to fix it months later by uninstalling the broken driver and letting Windows restore the one from cache would have fixed. (At least they're really good about spyware)

(Not about Linux, just a pointless rant)

--

It would be cool if it didn't suck.
Re:hear hear! by Ziviyr · 2004-10-30 14:40 · Score: 1

My friends have problems with Windows XP routinely self-destructing.

My measuring stick is W2k, which last I used it was actually pretty decent.

--

Someone set us up the bomb, so shine we are!
Re:hear hear! by Chrax · 2004-10-31 04:58 · Score: 1

What the fuck? Just because I say it beats using Windows does not make me a troll. I'm giving my opinion, as well as two viable suggestions. Slashdot moderators need to learn the difference between an opinion and a troll. Until then don't use your mod points.
Re:hear hear! by suso · 2004-10-31 06:16 · Score: 1

(Suso - you rule. By which I mean, you're a retard. Have fun living in France.)

Thanks, I will. I am a retard, have you no respect?
Re:hear hear! by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-31 09:29 · Score: 0

the problem is that you have a dell...
Re:hear hear! by rizzo420 · 2004-10-31 09:32 · Score: 1

win2k is what i use at home, it's more stable than XP, but i use XP pro at work and it's not bad. XP home is a piece of crap.

--
please me, have no regrets.
Re:hear hear! by NaDrew · 2004-11-01 11:33 · Score: 1

win2k is what i use at home, it's more stable than XP, but i use XP pro at work and it's not bad. XP home is a piece of crap.
My situation exactly, except that I've since put XPPro on my laptop and 2K is still on the server at home. My wife's Dell came with XP Home and I'm embarassed to admit it's still there. I think the entire point of XP Home is to piss off people who keep expecting the normal features of 2K or XPPro.

--
Vista:XPSP2::ME:98SE

missing option by DrStrangeLoop · 2004-10-30 03:46 · Score: 2

Slackware

Slackware users just want a lean base system and dont need any kind of package manager since they just build the stuff they need from scratch. while not the best choice for a production system imho (go FreeBSD =), Slackware is excellent for any kind of academic / system development work.

Re:missing option by iggymanz · 2004-10-30 03:52 · Score: 1

yup, slackware is for people with lots of time to kill: slackers! 8D
Re:missing option by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:08 · Score: 1, Interesting

Bah All distro users are coddled pussys.

Linux From Scratch. the real man's linux.
Re:missing option by Eudial · 2004-10-30 04:22 · Score: 2, Insightful

More like

Slackware
* Slackware is the system for old, conservative and grumpy programmers. The average user has been running his slackware system since early 1993 and will not give it up 'til his computer (literally) falls apart and there is no compatible computer left in the universe, then he will commit suicide and request to have the picture of J.R. "Bob" Dobbs and some cynical remark about humanity's being unable to RTFM engraved on his tombstone.

--
GAAH! MY PRINTER IS ON FIRE!!! PUT IT OUT! PUT IT OUT!
Re:missing option by tzanger · 2004-10-30 07:02 · Score: 1

Linux From Scratch. the real man's linux.

Only if you don't copy and paste all the commands as listed in the book like I've seen every other LFS pusher do.

Now mind you, I used LFS to create the CF-based firewalls I sell... 16M CF that contains not just the kernel and base set of tools but also OpenS/WAN and even Perl for the various scripts and XML-RPC server for the admin interface. LFS was useful in that it gave me the interdependencies in the base system but beyond that a lot of it went out the window when you used uClibc and BusyBox and discovered interestling little dlopen() inconsistencies between glibc and uClibc. :-)

What Gentoo REALLY says about you by Have+Blue · 2004-10-30 03:48 · Score: 4, Funny

http://funroll-loops.org/

Re:What Gentoo REALLY says about you by keesh · 2004-10-30 04:34 · Score: 1

Heh, what I always find funny about that is the USE flags section. Sure, most of the comments on there are from morons who're using Gentoo because they heard it was '1337, but some of the comments are actually genuinely correct...
Re:What Gentoo REALLY says about you by maw · 2004-10-30 08:38 · Score: 1

And who can let a link to that site go by without linking to The Best Bug Report Ever (tm)?

--
You're a suburbanite.

What about Ubuntu? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 03:49 · Score: 2, Funny

Does that mean you like threesomes?

multiple choice? by tverbeek · 2004-10-30 03:50 · Score: 1

Between the various Linux distros I use (Red Hat, Mandrake, Coyote, Debian), the Mac OS versions I'm running (7.0, 9.2, 10.x), the Windowses I use (mostly at work) (98SE, 2K, XP), and the FreeBSD and BeOS boxes I play with, I presumably have a case of Multiple Personality Disorder.

--
http://alternatives.rzero.com/

I must be schizoid... by advocate_one · 2004-10-30 03:52 · Score: 1

This box is Suse 9.1... the fileserver in the bedroom is Mandrake 9.2... the laptop has now got Ubuntu "Warty Warthog" on it and I'm currently downloading SimplyMEPIS to play with on the spare box...

--
Donald 'Duck' Dunn: We had a band powerful enough to turn goat piss into gasoline.

Re:I must be schizoid... by Reducer2001 · 2004-10-30 04:11 · Score: 1, Offtopic

It's Saturday. Go outside, drink beer and talk to girls!

--
When you get to hell -- tell 'em Itchy sent ya!
Re:I must be schizoid... by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 07:55 · Score: 0

I like the idea but I don't think my girlfiend would like it...

Because the poster forget by BluhDeBluh · 2004-10-30 03:54 · Score: 2, Funny

Both NewsForge and Slashdot are part of OSTG.

Re:Because the poster forget by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:03 · Score: 0

Plus, it seems the guys at OSTG can't actually spell politics. Click on '4' when the Flash loads. Nice to know the people who own Slashdot are REALLY smart.

Got Slackware Right Here by Jameth · 2004-10-30 03:54 · Score: 5, Funny

Since they didn't cover Slackware, here you go:

Slackware users are paradoxically obsessed with being cutting edge and traditional at the same time. They love to point out that their distro has all the latest programs, but explain that it's ancient installer is 'still up to the task' and that the lack of powerful package management 'leaves them in control'. Slackware users like to do things for themselves and tend to ignore what popular opinion (and logic and reason and all rational thought) says is good.

And, since they didn't include Fedora either, here's that one:

Fedora is synonymous with Red Hat, but many of its users believe that it isn't. The song of the king of the Linux street, Fedora is popular with those who want to be in the middle of the road, but leading the crowd. Unfortunately, they are actually be pushed along from behind, with the silly-hat men leading from behind. Fedora is very loyal to its customers, except when they want something that Red Hat doesn't, in which case they consider the feature risky.

Re:Got Slackware Right Here by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:03 · Score: 2, Funny

Surely you mean:
Slackware users are smart, cool, popular, interesting, reliable, funny, drop dead gorgeous and good in bed.
Re:Got Slackware Right Here by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 06:08 · Score: 0

GREAT in bed
Re:Got Slackware Right Here by JWSmythe · 2004-10-30 06:21 · Score: 1

I've been told I am, and the girls that I've known that use Slackware sure were. I guess once your talents are so high, you just excel in everything. :)

--
Serious? Seriousness is well above my pay grade.
Re:Got Slackware Right Here by jridley · 2004-10-30 06:41 · Score: 2, Informative

That sounds about right to me. I've tried the others and keep coming back to Slackware. I've been using it since it came on a fistful of floppies. I remember downloading my first copy from a friend's FTP site on a 14.4K modem.

I still don't like package management. If I have the choice, I'll download the source and compile it myself.

Slackware seems to be the only distro that actually believes you and does the right thing when you try to set up a box without a GUI. All the others I've tried install all kinds of X stuff even if you try to turn it off. I was working with Red Hat Enterprise AS 3 the other day; I said NO samba, NO bind, NO a bunch of other stuff. Needless to say, it installed samba, bind, and a bunch of other stuff anyway.
Re:Got Slackware Right Here by fbjon · 2004-10-30 10:15 · Score: 1

Sounds intriguing to me..

I started many years ago with Slackware and a 1.3 kernel. The machine was a dual-booting 486, and when it got upgraded, the Slackware part kinda fell off. Sometime later, I try RedHat, version 5.0.. 5.2 .. 7.x ... Now I've used Fedora too, and read about the compilings of Gentoooooo and the Insert-CDs of Knoppix x x x x (that's the sound of a cd-rom drive seeking :). And after all these years, I'm still a humble windows user, not using linux in any full-time way (except on my zaurus, but that doesn't count). All of those seem confusing, contrived, well-meaning but somehow lacking in sensible clarity. Slackware was fun to start with back in the days, these new things just look huge. So what should I do, should I return to my mother's womb? (by which I mean slackware, of corse) Or will I just be fooling myself?

--
True confidence comes not from realising you are as good as your peers, but that your peers are as bad as you are.
Re:Got Slackware Right Here by ezzzD55J · 2004-10-30 12:32 · Score: 1

GREAT in bed
I've been told I am
Doesn't mean he was right.
Re:Got Slackware Right Here by elbobo · 2004-10-30 16:35 · Score: 1

I regularly do X-less Debian installs from tiny netinst CD images. A base Debian install includes just the bare essentials and nothing more. I guess you haven't tried Debian.
Re:Got Slackware Right Here by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 20:18 · Score: 0

So what should I do, should I return to my mother's womb?
Shouldn't take long, she's just upstairs.
Re:Got Slackware Right Here by Kethinov · 2004-10-30 22:20 · Score: 1

All the Debian installs I've done have been as simple as:

1. boot livecd
2. partition and install base system
3. install grub
4. reboot
5. boot debian
6. get terminal
7. ???
8. profit!!!

Done. Want X? Install it. Don't want X? Don't install it.

IMHO Debian is the best OS for Linux servers. As a desktop its a bit more sketchy though. I use it, but you have to run unstable and even experimental packages to get any kind of desktop system that's up to date. But it works. So it's my distro. I use none other.

--
You're right, I wouldn't steal a car. But if it were possible, I sure as hell would download one!
Re:Got Slackware Right Here by JWSmythe · 2004-10-31 07:16 · Score: 1

Great comeback. Very creative. You're still in 3rd grade, right?

--
Serious? Seriousness is well above my pay grade.
Re:Got Slackware Right Here by jridley · 2004-11-02 01:57 · Score: 1

Yeah, Debian is good. I should probably use it, but I've just gotten so used to where Slackware puts things. Right or wrong, it's what I know.

If I have to learn anything very new, I'll probably buy a mac and learn BSD.
Re:Got Slackware Right Here by elbobo · 2004-11-02 02:08 · Score: 1

I know the feeling. Even though I'm impressed with where other distributions have got themselves to, I can't settle into any other than Debian because I just don't know where to find important files in them.

I went the same way and ended up in OS X. Debian still on the servers though.

Not informative, not funny, whee... by sultanoslack · 2004-10-30 03:57 · Score: 5, Informative

Uhm, this isn't really news and isn't even really decent humor.

If you want something informative, there's the old reliable Distro Watch and if you want something funny, try:

Funroll Loops
Fedora fun
[add your link here]

The article is a joke!!!!!oneone11!11! by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 03:58 · Score: 0

If you didn't notice that yourself you really should work on not taking everything so seriously, least of all what distro you use.

Read the first post after the article by Gothmolly · 2004-10-30 03:58 · Score: 1

Funny to see the obligatory "Debian is great and sucks less than it used to and has a cool package tool!!111!" post.

--
I want to delete my account but Slashdot doesn't allow it.

you my friedfeind are a true AOL by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 03:59 · Score: 0

Duh

Sure by Sivar · 2004-10-30 03:59 · Score: 4, Funny

I had opened the link in a new tab and was about to read it, and then I caught the "I use Mandrake, so that makes me suave and sophisticated." part, which instantly removed any faith I may have had in the test. ;-)

--
Computer Science is no more about computers than astronomy is about telescopes. --E. W. Dijkstra

Re:Sure by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 12:05 · Score: 0

So, you're Mandrake user, eh?

A non-distro specific answer by j0e_average · 2004-10-30 03:59 · Score: 3, Insightful

Stereotypes aside, the fact that I've chosen a linux distro should say something loud and clear:

1. I HAVE A CHOICE.
2.I DO NOT HAVE TO CONFORM TO THE SCHEMES/STANDARDS/LICENSING SET BY REDMOND.
3. I GET TO USE MY COMPUTER IN THE MANNER I SEE FIT.

If these choices are important to you too, then consider becoming a member of the EFF and supporting your favorite distro by purchasing a copy once a year or so. There's lots of software projects that could use help as well!

Re:A non-distro specific answer by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:11 · Score: 0

FYI: A new kernel patch is available that fixes that pesky stuck capslock bug.
Re:A non-distro specific answer by suso · 2004-10-30 04:30 · Score: 1

Stuck capslock? I haven't heard about this. Please, do tell.
Re:A non-distro specific answer by NotoriousQ · 2004-10-30 04:48 · Score: 1

Caps Lock? There is such a key. You mean it is not just a second Ctrl.

Weird...

--
badness 10000
Re:A non-distro specific answer by Yottabyte84 · 2004-10-30 06:34 · Score: 1

xmodmap -e 'remove Lock = Caps_Lock'

Re:SuSE and Red Hat for me... by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:01 · Score: 0

I don't have 2 days to compile from source. They should really make a graphical installer (well they actually do but it's only half the install and it's stage3 so what's the point?)

So you don't want to compile from source but want a graphical installer to do a stage 1 install?

P.S.: I really doubt it would take anywhere to 2 days to install gentoo on a machine that runs these tremendously complex things you are boasting about. 2 hours would be more accurate.

Slackware should have gentoo description.. by Man+in+Spandex · 2004-10-30 04:07 · Score: 2, Insightful

and I'm talking about this part:
If John Wayne had been a Linux user, he would have used Gentoo. Gentoo users are pioneers, people who like to live close to the metal, and don't mind hurting themselves on sharp objects.

I'll bet my last dollar that a lot of gentoo users, if they used slackware, would hurt themself more than on gentoo. Some people use emerge without knowing wtf its doing and if you give them a real distro, they're gonna be lost and go back to gentoo or a distro with an easy package manager. I have nothing against package managers.

Slackware is the pure thing. You actually learn out of it. Of course when you're done learning and you are sick of it, then ok you can go to gentoo or something like debian sarge but nowadays, it's not true that every gentoo user knows how gentoo and/or portage works.

Re:Slackware should have gentoo description.. by 2057 · 2004-10-30 04:31 · Score: 1

This guy is 100% correct....I hate gentoo people who say we are hardcore because they can type on the CLI...How many gentoo users actually compile something themselves without emerge?!

--
For The Best Jazz/Hip-hop fusion > COlD DUCK
Re:Slackware should have gentoo description.. by polyp2000 · 2004-10-30 05:13 · Score: 1

Missing Description

* Slackware users

If Jim Carey had been a Linux user, he would have used Slackware.Like Jim Carey's films Slackware users always remain the same, performing the same tried and trusted techniques time and time again. Like gentoo users they like to live close to the metal, but are loath to try new things or anything that tries to do things differently. Many feel that Slackware users are simply trying to be hardcore for the sake of being hardcore. Many slackware users have been noted for saying "I dont use a gui -it just gets in the way" even when using might actually make them more productive. And dont even think about discussing emacs or vi. They always want to have the same routine even if it might not be the best. The official Slackware motto is, "If your not using slackware you dont know shit"...

--
Electronic Music Made Using Linux http://soundcloud.com/polyp
Re:Slackware should have gentoo description.. by Man+in+Spandex · 2004-10-30 05:35 · Score: 1

Official Moto? Really? who made it official?

Slackware has always been one of the best distros to learn the ins and outs of how linux functions in general. Say what you must about slackware users trying to be hardcore but being so-called "hardcore" is all about effiency. Why should one use KDE when he has all the tools he needs in Enlightenment or Fluxbox?

Nothing's stopping a user from running KDE or Gnome. If slackware was about being hardcore without gui, then you wouldn't see tools like xwmconfig to make it easy for anybody to switch from window managers/DE or cd's with full packages n source of kde, gnome, xfce flux and more or sites like Linuxpackages.net for easy upgrades of packages.
Re:Slackware should have gentoo description.. by arcanumas · 2004-10-30 05:42 · Score: 2, Insightful

I am using Gentoo mainly because i ended up installing by hand a lot of software and got tired of fixing problems that may arise from that. Gentoo does this exact thing _very_ easy. You don't have to meddel with every possible ./configure option, or know which options break which other options because the ebuild maintainers do that for you.
I don't have to know that installing wkWidgets with unicode support may break other existing programs that rely on the non-unicode library, and that i actually have to make 2 versions of it. the ebuilds do that for you. So, if you need (for whatever reason, be it an actuall need , a hobby, or you just want the bleeding edge versions of programms) to install from source, then Gentoo makes it extremely easy. there are quite a few other things i like about Gentoo (great documentation, very active and friendly community (and very newbie friendly)). Portage is _very_ customizabl.
The /etc directory is currently maintained with diffs of old and new versions that let's you select which changes youwant to keep and which to throw out. (so you don't looose your modifications to configuration files if these are replaced, nor do you loose the additions to to new configuration files if these are discarded. Sure, it's not very sophisticated yet, but it works great and it's improving.)

so , why am i saying this? Because there is a trend here on Slashdot (and other sites like the 'Gentoo is Rice' guy) that Gentoo is only for idiots and theres nothing Good about it.
This is wrong.
I admit that there are things that are wrong with Gentoo (eg. Not enough dependecny checking when removing packages, people misuse compiler flags and end up with fucked up systems , etc etc) .
Gentoo is certainly not fit for _all_ situations, but it is an excellent distro, provided that you need what it offers.
I mean, isn't it that it's all about? Different distros for different needs?
Gentoo get's it's bad name because a lot of people think it's gonna make them '1337' to use it. But dismissing it as stupid is insulting to all the rest of us who don't think that a distro makes you cool and we just use it because we like what it offers.
So , please stop bashing Gentoo people. There are idiots in all distros. (not to mention anything about the incrasing number of 'snobish' neophytes who claim that they have used Slackware since the dawn of time, which apparently means two months ago, and it's the choice of the experienced gurus).

--
Slashdot Sig. version 0.1alpha. Use at your own risk.
Re:Slackware should have gentoo description.. by VB · 2004-10-30 05:56 · Score: 1

Some slack users aren't necessarily trying to remain the same, but merely recognize that once their tool is installed, secured, configured and being used it makes no sense to make changes that do not add value. There's absolutely nothing sexy about a web-server. The web-sites that run on it might be hugely sexy, but that's the job of the content creator and the substance of the content.

The server should never get in the way of distributing that content, and Slack does and always has done this job reliably and securely. Low maintenance tool; that's it. I hope the distro continues to evolve, despite it's absense from this "poll."

Now, if you want sexy: G5 Mac running Pro-Tools TDM system. That's sexy as hell!

--
www.dedserius.com
VB != VisualBasic

They both also... by ThomasFlip · 2004-10-30 04:09 · Score: 1

leave you bloated

--
If the dollar is an "I owe you nothing", then the Euro is a "Who owes you nothing." - Doug Casey

wtf was that... by Thelonious+Monk · 2004-10-30 04:11 · Score: 1

That was the stupidest thing i've read. I wouldn't normally just leave it at that, but fuck, just read the article yourself and see. THANKS FOR WASTING MY TIME /. !!@#@!$%!!

SLS was actually first by Skapare · 2004-10-30 04:13 · Score: 1

SLS (Softlanding Linux System) was the first. And it led to both Slackware and Debian.

--
now we need to go OSS in diesel cars

Re:SLS was actually first by moorcito · 2004-10-30 05:19 · Score: 2, Informative

Now I know I'm a complete bitch and everything, but since when where X and TCP/IP features of the GNU/Linux system?

Since the moment that they were featured in the first comprehensive Linux distribution.

All Linux distributions have features that were not necessiarly created by Stallman or the creators of the distro, but that doesn't make them any less of a feature.
Re:SLS was actually first by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 11:09 · Score: 0

Well, X isn't, but TCP/IP has been since.. well, since the kernel got a TCP/IP stack! Call it X/GNU/Linux if you want to bitch =P

Rggggghhhh.... by gaijin99 · 2004-10-30 04:13 · Score: 1

That quiz bugs me, it keeps saying that I'm Amiga OS.

--
"Mission Accomplished" -- George W. Bush May 1, 2003

Re:Rggggghhhh.... by Kompressor · 2004-10-30 04:51 · Score: 1

Could be worse. I got OS/2 Warp. Plagued by hatred for my backstabbing brother? WHAaat?

--
kmem russian roulette: Aquillar> dd if=/dev/urandom of=/dev/kmem bs=1 count=1 seek=$RANDOM

Debian comments are a touch off by debrain · 2004-10-30 04:13 · Score: 5, Insightful

The people I know who use Debian, myself included, have less patience for crap that doesn't work. Though harder to install, unlike the other distros, you only ever have to do it once.

Tongue in cheek or no, the myth that Debian is behind other distros has continually been dispelled. Debian/Unstable is consistently ahead of other distros. What other distros besides Debian, and maybe Gentoo, currently include Kernel 2.6.8, KDE 3.3.0, and Firefox RC1?

Debian users simply loathe frigging around with the basics of their system, an experience all too common with some other distros. We prefer to spend our time frigging around on Slashdot, et al. Or advocating free software.

Re:Debian comments are a touch off by Teppich · 2004-10-30 04:26 · Score: 2, Insightful

Speaking of crap: how come that both, woody and sarge, do not include a ssh-server per default, but both got an inetd running after installation?
Re:Debian comments are a touch off by djcapelis · 2004-10-30 05:19 · Score: 1

My install of gentoo (~x86) includes 2.6.10-mm2, KDE 3.3.1 and Firefox RC1.

See Debian is behind! ;)

(Gentoo-dev-sources is still back on 2.6.9-r1)

--
I touch computers in naughty places
Re:Debian comments are a touch off by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:19 · Score: 0

> What other distros besides Debian, and maybe
> Gentoo, currently include Kernel 2.6.8, KDE 3.3.0,
> and Firefox RC1

How about every other distro's unstable repository?
Re:Debian comments are a touch off by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:53 · Score: 0

How about every other distro's unstable repository?

You mean the one that doesn't come with the distibution and requires the latest official version?
Re:Debian comments are a touch off by thopkins · 2004-10-30 08:06 · Score: 1

Is it really that hard to remove the startup script links for inetd and apt-get install ssh?
Re:Debian comments are a touch off by anno1a · 2004-10-30 10:09 · Score: 1

But of course, on the larger projects Debian is always way behind. A very real example is X.org which Debian won't include until the next stable Debian has been released. Most other distros will have changed at that point. The same goes for XFree (which took forever to be updated to 4.0) and for KDE. Probably a lot of other programs too. Personally I don't care, but a lot of people out there do.

In general Debian is very up to date, but on the larger projects with large version changes, Debian tend to get way behind. That's where people get the impression that Debian in general is behind.

--
------- I fumbled my registration and I now must suffer

SuSE by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:14 · Score: 0

i'm guessing the author of this article really doesn't know what they are talking about.

if a general broad statement is made about an os, suse for example about the placement of files i would like an explaination of what specifically they mean.

there is many standards,opinions and other ways of doing things. init scripts in /sbin vs /etc/rc.d, xinetd vs inetd /opt vs /usr/local etc.. etc..

not to mention, you didn't even mention that yast is probably just as easy as click and run and twice as sexy ..

'msft core fonts' right in the online update, how cool is that?

Re:SuSE by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:29 · Score: 0

There's this thing...it's sooooo freaking cool...I'm sure you've heard of this thing but just in case you haven't.....it's called....a SENSE OF HUMOR....you really should go get one simply because they are so damn cool!

YES! by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:16 · Score: 0

This is definitely a wedge devised by Micro$oft to devide us! Do not give in to it!

What does BSD say about you? by Xenu+Xenu+Xenu · 2004-10-30 04:16 · Score: 1

Closet necrophiliac?

Star Trek + Linux by starseeker · 2004-10-30 04:17 · Score: 4, Funny

I think it would be more fun to pick a Star Trek race for each user to assume at a convention.

Mandrake - Humans. Like it simple and straightforward, but can be badass at need and gets things done.

Redhat - Vulcans. People may not like them, but they do a lot of things right and everyone owes them.

Debian - Romulans. Tough, but strangely elegant. Deserve more respect than they get.

Gentoo - Klingons. Never do it the easy way if there is a hard way - it makes one stronger!

If any MacOSX guys wander in, they get to be the tribbles. Soft, cuddly, and relatively harmless.

Windows users unlucky enough to stray in - the Borg, of course. The one common enemy of everybody else in the room.

--
"I object to doing things that computers can do." -- Olin Shivers, lispers.org

Re:Star Trek + Linux by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:44 · Score: 1, Funny

I would have pegged the Windows as Ferengi -- I see MS and the Rules of Acquisition as a natural fit, not to mention the complete lack of ethics
Re:Star Trek + Linux by Burning1 · 2004-10-30 04:57 · Score: 1

I'm looking forward to a Trouble with Tribbles borg epesode...
Re:Star Trek + Linux by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:42 · Score: 1, Funny

Nah, I think SCO ~= Ferengi, except SCO is even more annoying.
Re:Star Trek + Linux by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:51 · Score: 0

Wow... truly a twisted concept! Thanks for the laugh, what a great mental image.

Heh. I don't think the Borg would have a chance!
Re:Star Trek + Linux by zenmojodaddy · 2004-10-30 05:54 · Score: 1

No, no, no! Slackware = Vulcans. Been around forever, totally logical, slight air of superiority.

Actually, scratch that. At least Vulcans mate at least once every seven years.
Re:Star Trek + Linux by thephotoman · 2004-10-30 07:17 · Score: 1

If that's your paradigm, I'd plug the Ubuntu userx as more Bajoran. Maybe Trill, but I don't know how that would work. Linspire? They're the Cardassians. Evil on occasion, cast out by everyone, yet they have their good moments.

--
Haec merda tauri est. Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.
Re:Star Trek + Linux by fireboy1919 · 2004-10-30 07:27 · Score: 1

you've never seen the Linux kernel until you've read it in the original Klingon.

--
Mod me down and I will become more powerful than you can possibly imagine!
Re:Star Trek + Linux by julesh · 2004-10-30 07:34 · Score: 1

Gentoo - Klingons. ...
MacOSX [...] tribbles

Does this mean Gentoo users really _really_ despise OSX?
Re:Star Trek + Linux by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 08:13 · Score: 0

Jesus fucking Christ. That post was the nerdiest thing ever written. Merely being exposed to it could cause a reader to lose all social skills. It's the VX-Gas of nerd postings.
Re:Star Trek + Linux by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 11:22 · Score: 0

"If any MacOSX guys wander in, they get to be the tribbles. Soft, cuddly, and relatively harmless."

Soft?

Mac OS X users may be swaggering, overbearing, tin-plated dictators with delusions of godhood, but they're not soft.
Re:Star Trek + Linux by michaeldot · 2004-10-30 12:28 · Score: 1

Actually, Mac OS X would be the cross-bred time-travelers from the 29th century with technology light years ahead of the 21st-24th century schmucks who still think digital watches and 2D interfaces are a pretty neat idea.
Re:Star Trek + Linux by toddestan · 2004-10-30 14:08 · Score: 1

Does this mean Gentoo users really _really_ despise OSX?

Yes.
Re:Star Trek + Linux by michaeldot · 2004-10-30 16:26 · Score: 1

Does this mean OS X users are really _really_ oblivious to being despised? Yes.
Re:Star Trek + Linux by Fringex · 2004-10-30 17:53 · Score: 1

Resistance is futile!!! We the collective of Microsoft will consume your computers.

Are ya sure OSX wouldn't be the Borg? After all they are the ones that come in cubes.
Re:Star Trek + Linux by Reziac · 2004-10-31 06:59 · Score: 1

Strange you should mention that... look what I found while researching another response:

http://internet.ggu.edu/law_library/Greenberg/Inte rnetOnlineSp01.htm

--
~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?

Psst! You forgot the disclaimer: by Vintermann · 2004-10-30 04:19 · Score: 2, Funny

Newsforge is owned by etc...

--
xkcd is not in the sudoers file. This incident will be reported.

Libertarians vs. control freaks by Alwin+Henseler · 2004-10-30 04:21 · Score: 0, Flamebait

Aren't libertarian (or even anarchist) and control freaks mutually exclusive?

No, the freedom you have is directly related to how much you are in control of your own affairs. The more you are, makes you more of a free person. Give others more chance to manipulate your affairs, and you are less free (read: screwed).

So it just depends on who is in control, and the freedom comes with that. Less power to the government = more power to the people = free people. I'm not promoting anarchism here, but generally I prefer authorities to have just enough power/money/means to do what needs to be done, and wouldn't be done otherwise (like building roads), but no more. The less, the better.

Where's the Slack in here? Does a home-built Linux system count?
BTW. real control freaks are no fun...

Re:Libertarians vs. control freaks by Dutch_Cap · 2004-10-30 05:39 · Score: 2, Informative

"Less power to the government = more power to the people = free people."

Fot the sake of accuracy and nitpicking, it should be pointed out that traditionally anarchy is not only opposed to the state but also to capitalism, because capitalism creates inequality which creates unfreedom.
Re:Libertarians vs. control freaks by jlar · 2004-10-30 06:08 · Score: 3, Insightful

"Less power to the government = more power to the people = free people."

That is a gross oversimplification. From your statement it seems like it is only the government which limits the freedom of the people.

In fact one of the most important uses (in my opinion) of government power is to prevent a limitation in the freedom of people by restricting actions from other people and organisations that try to limit this freedom.

An example could be pollution. The government (through regulatory bodies) limits the freedom of people and industry to pollute my neighbourhood. That is a limitation in their freedom but it is done to protect our right to avoid pollution (breathing unpolluted air and so on).

My point is that your freedom to swing your arms in the air ends where my nose begins - and that it is the duty of our government to enforce the rules securing that (the rules are of course passed by the legislative body).
Re:Libertarians vs. control freaks by jazman_777 · 2004-10-30 07:08 · Score: 1

because capitalism creates inequality which creates unfreedom.
Inequality is the natural state of the world. No two people are the same, whether in their physical attributes, intellectual abilities, or motivations and drives. Most people are willing to acknowledge that, except for those Procrusteans who want to slaughter millions in defiance of nature.

--
Slashdot: Failed Car Analogies. Amateur Lawyering. Anecdote Battles.
Re:Libertarians vs. control freaks by lightknight · 2004-10-30 08:55 · Score: 3, Insightful

Inequality is unfreedom? Is "unfreedom" a word? You know, there might be a reason why a (frictionless system) breaks down into such equalities: some people are better at giving other people what they want better than others.

For instance, I frequent Chilies, and I love their food (from the choices to the results). It's not Le Bec Fin, but it's a decent place to grab a bite to eat (average $16-22). Contrast that with any number of diners out there, lacking in business. Foods not terribly good, prices are ok, not much of an atmosphere. You see, Chilies gives people what they want, and so they grow($$$). What you argue is that they should all grow, equally. It's so a antithetical to...life, that you would have to redesign the universe from the ground up to support it.

The rights given to you are simple: no matter how much property you accumulate (from nothing to a lot), you have the same rights to it. Live for yourself, and the universe will take care of itself.

Lastly, while capitalism achieves inequality (with some people rich, and some people poor), and socialism does create equality, it's not in the manner that you think. Socialism, after a run of many years, creates equality by MAKING EVERYONE POOR. The U.S.S.R (putting aside the political figures) may have been one of the most equal states to ever exist, but I doubt the people saw it as that.

--
I am John Hurt.
Re:Libertarians vs. control freaks by sp0rk173 · 2004-10-30 09:12 · Score: 0, Troll

So, in Sweden and Canada, is everyone poor? And how do you define poor - is it aquisition of capital, or quality of living?

Not saying you're completely wrong, just wondering what your views are on these two cases that seem to be outliers, according to your model.
Re:Libertarians vs. control freaks by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 10:54 · Score: 0

Mod this informative. No, insightful. And mod me indecisive.
Re:Libertarians vs. control freaks by lightknight · 2004-10-30 12:18 · Score: 1

Sweden and Canada have not implemented all of the policies of the USSR nor in the same force (unless Sweden/Canada has a KGB element I am unaware of).

Quality of living and acquisition of capital are two sides of the same coin. What we have seen in Europe is a tradeoff-> capital for quality of living. Removing capital from the industry does not (really) affect the industry of today. The machines you see in factories are already or almost paid off. And you can create a lot of equality and raise the standard of living with that capital (that should have gone into the industry).

The problem is this: the industry is dynamic. It's always changing and upgrading. At some point, those machines will need upgrading. A company needs capital to buy new machines, employ more workers, expand into new markets.

This would all be dandy is everyone (i.e. every government was doing it). But they aren't. Instead, you have a little something called (overseas) competition. And those overseas companies will begin to eat their cake. The Japanese come up with better methods for making cars, cars that people want. The Big 3 American automakers futz around with unions, believing that people will buy their cars no matter what. They wake up one day and find half the market gone to the Japanese. They try to get back in the game by upgrading their machines, pushing their people. But they've grown weak with lack of competition, money taxed away to support quality of living. They cannot compete.

These companies generate less money, which means less money for "quality of living" taxing. Which starts a cycle downwards (people crying out that their "quality of living" is being affected, higher taxes).

Basically, capitalism works because of two things: it works even in part (the US is more capitalist than many other nations, hence it does better, but it would by no means be classified as an example of capitalism), and it has an incentive program, built in.

How many times have you heard people say that Socialism works, it's just the implementation that failed? Well guess what! Capitalism works, and even partial implementations work as well. You know you're on the right track when an engine can be feed very lean fuel, and it can still fire.

--
I am John Hurt.
Re:Libertarians vs. control freaks by sp0rk173 · 2004-10-30 13:33 · Score: 1

Sweden and Canada have not implemented all of the policies of the USSR nor in the same force (unless Sweden/Canada has a KGB element I am unaware of).

I think you missed my question, though I appreciate the response inspite of my being modded down -1 troll for reasons I don't quite grasp. Anyhoo. Canada and Sweden are often held up as examples of Socialism working, while the USSR should, in my opinion, be held up as an example of Communism being spoiled by dictatorial woes. Of course, name a communist country that hasn't existed under a dictator, heh. My question was, In Sweden and Canada, are average, everyday people equalized by being poor, as you pointed out happens under a Socialist system? To again quote the sentence I'm taking question with: "Socialism, after a run of many years, creates equality by MAKING EVERYONE POOR."

To be fair to you in follow-up, do you think Sweden and Canada, being democratic, socialist systems, will suffer the same fate as the soviet union, or will their kind of socialism prove sustainable?
Re:Libertarians vs. control freaks by lightknight · 2004-10-30 14:19 · Score: 1

I personally think that Socialism is unsustainable (and hence Canada and Sweden will have trouble). Keep in mind that Canada and Sweden are not full on Socialism (as it has been defined), simply that their socialistic elements eclipse their capitalistic elements.

To paraphrase the BOFH:
BOFH: "The red light was the router which you bet me would not run on a three-phase powers supply"
PFY: "And it didn't?"
BOFH: "No, it did, but not for very long. About a minute and thirty seconds."
PFY: "That's hardly fair!"
BOFH: "Fair is fair."

Socialism works, but for only so long.

Think of capital as credit: you work (under capitalism) for a long time to build up great credit (pay for everything upfront, no or little debt). Then you quit your job (change capitalistic institutions over to socialism). Then you go wild, buying everything in sight (beginnings of socialism). Your credit eventually runs out, the bill comes, and you have no job (end of socialism).

I doubt Canada will be able to sustain itself (the cracks are beginning to show with the healthcare system), and Sweden I need to read a little more about. On the topic of healthcare systems, Canada is in a unique position: the country has told pharamcuticals it can and will violate their patents if they do not sell their drugs at manufacturing costs (i.e. the US ends up eating the R&D). The number of students entering med school is dropping, while the existing doctors are being lured away by the US.

When the gears finally stop (if the country doesn't swing back), the country has no money and very bad policies (which means no one wants to invest). It isn't until they remove those policies that capital starts flooding back in.

As it stands, I understand why a lot of people like socialism. And I understand why capitalism is often equated with corportism. I like neither, but understand them both: as an ultra-capitalist, I believe that whether I fall or rise, it is of my own accord, and I do not owe anything to anyone (nor do I want anyones help). That means I do not want the people (socialism) standing in my way, nor do I want companies (who happened to have the ear of a senator, corportism) standing in my way.

Socialists are often disillusioned with corportism, and believe that capitalism and corportism are one and the same. Corportists profess to be capitalists for just the same reason. I will not help you out, but nor will I keep you down. Standards of human conduct aside (if you're bleeding, I'll try to stop it, call and ambulance, etc. Or if you make me a decent business offer, I might lend you some money, etc.).

--
I am John Hurt.
Re:Libertarians vs. control freaks by raju1kabir · 2004-10-30 18:10 · Score: 0, Offtopic

For instance, I frequent Chilies, and I love their food (from the choices to the results).

You love the results? Blocked arteries and a figure like a walrus?

Lastly, while capitalism achieves inequality (with some people rich, and some people poor), and socialism does create equality, it's not in the manner that you think. Socialism, after a run of many years, creates equality by MAKING EVERYONE POOR. The U.S.S.R (putting aside the political figures) may have been one of the most equal states to ever exist, but I doubt the people saw it as that.

The USSR was a totalitarian dictatorship that happened to use the word "socialism" a lot in its mission statement. Holding it up as the pinnacle of socialist achievement is like holding up the Democratic People's Republic of Korea (hint: that's the one in the north) as the pinnacle of democracy.

There is no shortage of states to the left of the USA that provide higher quality of life by any reasonable measure except adding up everyone's income and dividing by the population count (which is a pretty useless measure, as would become clear to anyone who saw my $10 million/year and your mom's-basement libertarian $12,500/year and heard us claim to be, on average, the two richest guys in the bar).

--
"Patriotism is your conviction that this country is superior to all other countries because you were born in it." -- GBS
Re:Libertarians vs. control freaks by lightknight · 2004-10-30 19:42 · Score: 1

"You love the results? Blocked arteries and a figure like a walrus?"

6'2", 180lbs, work out every other day. My friends complain I do not eat enough (and they eat organic food all the time, somehow managing to put on more weight than me). Let's see, organic tofu salad, or filet mignon smothered in royal blue stilton cheese, hmm...

"The USSR was a totalitarian dictatorship that happened to use the word "socialism" a lot in its mission statement."

No, they called themselves Communists, but never managed to get out of the Socialism phase.

"Holding it up as the pinnacle of socialist achievement is like holding up the Democratic People's Republic of Korea (hint: that's the one in the north) as the pinnacle of democracy."

I'm not holding it up as a pinnacle of Socialism, nor am I holding up the US as a pinnacle of Capitalism. Reread my comments.

"There is no shortage of states to the left of the USA that provide higher quality of life by any reasonable measure except adding up everyone's income and dividing by the population count (which is a pretty useless measure, as would become clear to anyone who saw my $10 million/year and your mom's-basement libertarian $12,500/year and heard us claim to be, on average, the two richest guys in the bar)."

This time, in english, without personal attacks. I'd love to reply, but I do not understand what you're saying.

--
I am John Hurt.
Re:Libertarians vs. control freaks by lightknight · 2004-10-30 19:45 · Score: 1

On a side note, I'm reading an interesting article from the University of Vienna which strengthens my arguments. Perhaps you should give it a read, and get back to me:

http://homepage.univie.ac.at/Papers.Econ/RePEc/v ie /viennp/vie0305.pdf

--
I am John Hurt.
Re:Libertarians vs. control freaks by raju1kabir · 2004-10-30 19:59 · Score: 1

"There is no shortage of states to the left of the USA that provide higher quality of life by any reasonable measure except adding up everyone's income and dividing by the population count (which is a pretty useless measure, as would become clear to anyone who saw my $10 million/year and your mom's-basement libertarian $12,500/year and heard us claim to be, on average, the two richest guys in the bar)."

This time, in english, without personal attacks. I'd love to reply, but I do not understand what you're saying.

Many states to the left of the USA have higher quality of life.

"Quality of life" is a subjective term. Therefore my statement above contains inherent subjectivity. I freely admit this.

A common rebuttal to my statement above is that average income is higher in the USA.

However, the income gap in the USA is quite wide. Therefore the mean is a misleading indicator.

Does that help? There's actually a lot of interesting ground in the quality of life discussion, but I don't think I have the patience to do it all in single-clause sentences.

On a side note, I'm reading an interesting article from the University of Vienna which strengthens my arguments. Perhaps you should give it a read, and get back to me:

I skimmed it. I'm not here to defend the USSR and its lackey governments, or their hopeless economic system, nor have I claimed to be, so this seems to me like a 44-page strawman argument.

--
"Patriotism is your conviction that this country is superior to all other countries because you were born in it." -- GBS
Re:Libertarians vs. control freaks by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 20:52 · Score: 0

I believe that whether I fall or rise, it is of my own accord, and I do not owe anything to anyone (nor do I want anyones help).
Hint: Don't tell your mother that; it'll break her heart. Or am I to assume that you just sprang from the earth one day, fully formed and ready to do everything all by yourself?
Re:Libertarians vs. control freaks by Dutch_Cap · 2004-10-31 04:49 · Score: 1

Late response, but what the heck..

"Is "unfreedom" a word?"

Probably not, but you know what I mean, right?

"What you argue is that they should all grow, equally. It's so a antithetical to...life, that you would have to redesign the universe from the ground up to support it."

Where did I argue that? First of all I was only trying to clarify the Anarchist's view which is not necessarily my own. Second, you seem to assume that said view implicitly contains arguments put forward by state socialists (eg communists, anarchism is also referred to as libertarian socialism).

When anarchists talk about "equality" they don't mean mathemaical, == equality. No one wants everyone to be exactly the same, not even communists. "Equality" in a political context usually refers to a more abstract notion, which is perhaps better expressed by the Dutch word "gelijkwaardigheid", which more or less translates to "equally-worthyness". In the view of most anarchists this equality should be expressed in equality (== in this case) of power. Anarchists believe an equal division of power will lead to the greatest amount of freedom for all.

The biggest gripe anarchists have with capitalism is that it puts the means of production and land into the hands of a small elite. The majority of the people will thus have to sell their labour and freedom to make money for people who don't do anything except own things.

Anarchists are thus opposed to property. They make a distinction between "property" and "personal posessions", though. People should be able to have personal posessions like combs, tvs, cars, a house. No one should own land or means of production, though. Such things should be used communally.

"Lastly, while capitalism achieves inequality (with some people rich, and some people poor), and socialism does create equality, it's not in the manner that you think. Socialism, after a run of many years, creates equality by MAKING EVERYONE POOR. The U.S.S.R (putting aside the political figures) may have been one of the most equal states to ever exist, but I doubt the people saw it as that."

First of all, you are once again referring to state socialism, which is most definetely worse than our current system of capitalism. Bakunin, an anarchist who lived around the same time as Marx, already predicted that Marx's state socialism would lead to an unworkable bureaucracy. State socialism is also called state capitalism by anarchists, because it's a lot like capitalism except the state is the only employer, which is even worse than non-state capitalism.

Anyway, if you want a more thorough explanation of anarchist opposition to capitalism go to www.anarchistfaq.org and read the section called "Why do anarchists oppose capitalism". It's a long read, but maybe you'll find it interesting. The site seems to be offline right now, but hopefully it'll be up by the time you read this.

Gentoo, and its uses by gaijin99 · 2004-10-30 04:22 · Score: 1

There's no doubt that a great many Gentoo users just like the pseudo-133t aspect. But, as was pointed out earlier, the installation is pretty easy if you follow the instructions.

Personally, I see Gentoo as a great learning distro. I used a variety of distros, started with RedHat, tried SuSE, Debian, and wound up with Mandrake just because I liked its default desktop settings better than RedHat's. After a few months of using Linux, I wanted to learn more about how to make it work. Linux From Scratch seemed nifty, but a bit *too* badass at the time. So I tried Gentoo.

If you aren't a Linux expert, and you want to learn more about what goes on inside, Gentoo can be a great tool. Of course, you have to approach it that way if you want to learn anything; I'm certain that its possible to install Gentoo and come out of the experience knowing no more than you did when you started. Personally, I'm going to give LFS a shot here in a couple of months.

--
"Mission Accomplished" -- George W. Bush May 1, 2003

Re:Gentoo, and its uses by wertarbyte · 2004-10-30 04:48 · Score: 1

There's no doubt that a great many Gentoo users just like the pseudo-133t aspect. But, as was pointed out earlier, the installation is pretty easy if you follow the instructions.

I agree, Gentoo got the geek-factor Debian used to have.

Personally, I see Gentoo as a great learning distro.

Yes, a learning distro. Although the concept is interesting from an academic point of view, it sucks in real life. We got WLAN at our university, so laptops are really common here; I run Debian, another student runs Gentoo. "Hey, look, there's a shiny new program, and it also has a debian package" - "It also has a ebuild" 60 seconds later apt-get has installed the program on my notebook, while his emerge, make and gcc are sucking the juice out of his battery until we can test the software. "Hm, this program sucks, I'll remove it" - "Doesn't matter here, my power just went out"

--
Life is just nature's way of keeping meat fresh.
Re:Gentoo, and its uses by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 07:52 · Score: 0

No way, gentoo is so fast and debian so slow that the gentoo user will be able to compile everything before you open a terminal simulator in your debian.
Re:Gentoo, and its uses by wertarbyte · 2004-10-30 09:19 · Score: 1

No way, gentoo is so fast and debian so slow that the gentoo user will be able to compile everything before you open a terminal simulator in your debian.

Gentoo user. q.e.d.

--
Life is just nature's way of keeping meat fresh.

What Your Choice of BSD Distro Says about You by HenryKoren · 2004-10-30 04:24 · Score: 5, Funny

OpenBSD - You are a paranoid schizophrenic and you think everyone is out to get you. You consider your pores security holes

NetBSD - You take solace in the fact your operating system can run on playstation2 and dreamcast and is thus superior.

m0n0wall - You are the Calista Flockhart of the BSD world. You like to keep your base at six megabytes because anything more would be bloated.

Dragonfly BSD - You are a rebel without a clue. You are against the status quo establishment and all the conformist sheep that follow it. Anybody who questions your judgment can go fork themselves.

FreeBSD-CURRENT - You are a crusader, living on the bleeding edge of the Open Source revolution. You build worlds, merge masters, and slay kernel panic modes with nothing more than an UPDATAING file to defend you.

FreeBSD-STABLE - You are a corporate whore... caring more about production, stability, and uptime than any reasonable person. Your if it ain't broke don't fix it mentality makes OS developers ponder the true purpose and meaning of their life quests.

--
To blog is sublime

Re:What Your Choice of BSD Distro Says about You by doon · 2004-10-30 04:43 · Score: 1

Lol. Damn that list is great... What if you are like me.

Firewall@home - OpenBSD
FileServer@home - FreeBSD-Current
Dreamcast@home - Netbsd (I suck at video games)
Workstation@home (FreeBSD-Current,OpenBSD,Beos,Slackware) (can't make up my mind) :)
(honorable mentions @ home - Octane and O2 running IRIX, Netra with Solaris on 1 drive, OpenBSD on the other).

Laptop1 - OSX
Laptop2 - OpenBSD

Server Farms @ work (30+ FreeBSD-stable boxes)

Guess I need therapy..

--
To E-mail me, replace the first period in my domain with an @
Re:What Your Choice of BSD Distro Says about You by HenryKoren · 2004-10-30 04:53 · Score: 1

To think I once considered myself a daemon-worshiping zealot.... I got nothing on you buddy! :-D

--
To blog is sublime
Re:What Your Choice of BSD Distro Says about You by doon · 2004-10-30 05:37 · Score: 1

Forgot about the tattoo on My Leg

They're coming to take me away.. HaHa, HeHe. They're comging to take me away...

--
To E-mail me, replace the first period in my domain with an @
Re:What Your Choice of BSD Distro Says about You by HenryKoren · 2004-10-30 08:07 · Score: 1

Doon... Nice Daemon and Hash-Bang tats! You are an oficial BSD gangster. Once you get a BSD beat-down, there's no getting out. You also proved my point about OpenBSD users being a tad essentric. Don't worry, the nice men in white coats will be here for us soon!
Oh and how could I forget...
OS X - You are a metrosexual. You are a wolf in sheeps clothing. Beneath your cool stylish exterior lies a firey daemon!
the "state of the demon" address has nothing on me! Haha!!
No disresect to my Linux homies now. Didn't mean to encroach on your "turf" here. Nothing but love for my fellow POSIX gangsters.

--
To blog is sublime

Re:"Trolling with the truth" remix... by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:27 · Score: 0

Windows 2000 - A little more rugged than the Windows XP user and probably gets laid more frequently.

Debian FUD by wertarbyte · 2004-10-30 04:29 · Score: 2, Insightful

Debian users take pride in the fact that their distribution is always several releases behind the latest version of the kernel, but makes up for that by being more difficult to install and use.

This is the usual FUD you encounter when discussing Debian. Neither is Debian several versions behind the kernel (yes, stable is somehow old right now, but there is Sarge or backports.org), nor is it difficult to install and use. Debian (I'm talking about the new Installer used for Sarge) has a real nice installation process, making it easy to install straight from network. The package system is clearly one of the best, installing additional software has never been easier: "apt-get install foobar", and through the magical wonders of the internet you get foobar right on your system, including any libraries it depends on. This is a major advantage over other systems where you have to browse through endless lists of packages, interactivly selecting the right package and installing it. The package system is most flexible, so you can get your packages from several sources, really nice for example if you use Debian Stable and backports.org (this project adapts recent software for the Stable branch). I'd say that Debian is the best distribution for newbies, since heliping others is so easy: You acan easily transfer example configurations, you can offer commandline examples for certain jobs, no need to tell someone where to click and what do look for in those fancy colourful dialogs.

And remember: The best distribution for newbies is always the one your more experienced friends use.

--
Life is just nature's way of keeping meat fresh.

Re:Debian FUD by bedessen · 2004-10-31 18:06 · Score: 1

FUD indeed.

Configure yum.conf with your closest redhat/fedora/mandrake mirrors, and then try "yum install foobar" for the exact same effect. This is hardly something unique to Debian.

Signed,
A Debian user who isn't afraid to admit that automatic dependency resolution should be taken for granted in all the major distros.

recompile the kernel by clsc · 2004-10-30 04:31 · Score: 1

Hey, are you BS'ing me here? That was about the last thing i'd think of myself. Like, say "Q: i've got problems with my car stereo - A: Get a new engine"

If that's the answer to my problem, i'll just go and do it, but believe me, i've been reading through all kinds of forums for months and trying all kinds of sh*t to solve that problem. That problem, btw, is also the reason why i've tried a whole lot of distro's that i otherwise perhaps wouldn't have tried, so the problem did give me plenty of good experiences although i haven't solved it yet.

All in all, for the distros that i've tried (including the bsd's), i'd say: They're very similar. Same, same, only different.

Re:recompile the kernel by JamesTRexx · 2004-10-30 05:31 · Score: 1

In my case, I just looked at the hardware list of FreeBSD, found my soundcard, the read through the multimedia section of the (excellent) handbook. Had it up and running in no time.
So I suggest you check harware lists before trying a distro. Could be that your card has no support, as I have with a Terratec of mine. (the only reason why that pc runs W2K)

--
home
Re:recompile the kernel by Karzz1 · 2004-10-30 06:16 · Score: 1

Off topic I know, but what kind of sound card is it exactly? I have only ever encountered one that wasn't supported by either the kernel developers or the manufacturer in one way or another and that was several years ago (it was some aureal vortex card as I recall). I believe that card is now supported in the kernel, but alas, I no longer have the card to try it out.

--
Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master.
Re:recompile the kernel by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 11:25 · Score: 0

I don't know if it is now, but I do remember when it wasn't. I replaced it with an old SB16 ISA card that worked perfectly and with better sound than the damn vortex did on Windows.

The Duke? by barks · 2004-10-30 04:32 · Score: 2, Funny

John Wayne sould use Gentoo?!

Right on! High fives around...drinks on the house!

--

Some aim to please, I aim to tease.

"International men of software" all use Mandrake? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:33 · Score: 2, Funny

"Suave and sufisticated" indeed. Yes, it is really all true. Those of us who use Mandrake prefer our Bordeaux wines, fast Renaults, and even to spend time outside the computer room, frolicking with our women along the Sein! Yes, Mandrake is definately for those who intend to make it into the "next generation"!

But it was a shame they did not include the "huggers" of the new Ubanto distro. I wonder what the author would have made of that!

Bar pickups got a lot more complex by GMFTatsujin · 2004-10-30 04:38 · Score: 4, Funny

Single White Gentoo-Using Male seeks chique Mandrake-Using Female for late-night RPGing...

So, what, now instead of knowing that my Sun Sign is Leo with Mercury in ascention, I instead have to be able to recite my USE flags with /etc/portage/package.mask?

Re:Bar pickups got a lot more complex by djcapelis · 2004-10-30 05:23 · Score: 3, Interesting

You sun sign is probably not what you think it is, the chart that most of the world uses contains only 12 signs and is 3000 years old.

The actual chart includes all 13 signs and accounts for the slight wobble that causes the chart to shift by about 1 day every 87 years.

Look up 13th sign on google for more information.

--
I touch computers in naughty places

I'll bite by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:38 · Score: 0

it's ancient installer is 'still up to the task' and that the lack of powerful package management 'leaves them in control'.

You say this as if it's a bad thing... or somehow amusing. Fact is I don't want a package management tool deciding where a library lives or what version I should be running. The slackware package manager is simple for core libs, it works and I much prefer it to some desktop RPM bogosity.

Slackware users like to do things for themselves and tend to ignore what popular opinion (and logic and reason and all rational thought) says is good.

I compile software myself because it needs patching or compiling with specific options to do what I ask of it. This is kind of the fucking point behind choosing an F/OSS platform, that we ('I' on my personal machines) get to customize the software we use. Logic and reason therefore dictate that if you want somebody to provide binary only packages, STFU and use windows.

Re:I'll bite by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:48 · Score: 0

My, my...we're a testy little booger, aren't we?
Re:I'll bite by sosegumu · 2004-10-30 04:54 · Score: 1

Uhmmm...I think that it was supposed to be a joke.

--
It's easier to wear the spandex than to do the crunches. --David Lee Roth
Re:I'll bite by Jameth · 2004-10-30 05:15 · Score: 2, Funny

In case you were wondering, I am a Slackware user. And, if you had read the fucking article you would have realized that all of the distro-archetypes were comedic and sarcastic, you moron.
Re:I'll bite by bob+beta · 2004-10-30 06:42 · Score: 0, Troll

And, if you had read the fucking article you would have realized that all of the distro-archetypes were comedic and sarcastic, you moron.

Ooooh. But now you're angry, eh?

Or are you being 'nuanced and ironic'?

heh

--
"What's the frequency Kenneth?"

debian rulez :D (no offence inteded)... by l3v1 · 2004-10-30 04:39 · Score: 1

...just note that 3 of those distros are debian or debian-based (debian, knoppix, mepis) :) and that very many others are not even mentioned, although I would've liked to see how F/O/NBSD people are described :)

--
I am putting myself to the fullest possible use, which is all I can think that any conscious entity can ever hope to do.

Re:How about FreeBSD ? by hugo_pt · 2004-10-30 04:39 · Score: 1

lol they mod him flamebait for talking about FreeBSD on a linux discussion.. I've never seen someone modding Linux flamebait for being refered on a FreeBSD discussion.

Oh well.

What your choice REALLY means... by bwoodring · 2004-10-30 04:39 · Score: 5, Funny

Mandrake: You're a nerd
Red Hat: You're a nerd
Suse: You're a nerd
Debian: You're a nerd
Slackware: You're a nerd
Knoppix: You're a nerd
Gentoo: You're a nerd

BONUS!!!!

FreeBSD: You're a nerd
OpenBSD: You're a nerd
Solaris: You're a nerd

Re:What your choice REALLY means... by The+MESMERIC · 2004-10-30 04:52 · Score: 1

hahaha
Re:What your choice REALLY means... by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:21 · Score: 0

Windows: You're a sheep who likes pain
OS X: You like shiny things
Re:What your choice REALLY means... by passion · 2004-10-30 07:46 · Score: 1

OK, so you're dressed up as a.... huge nerd?

--
- passion
Re:What your choice REALLY means... by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 08:07 · Score: 0

FreeBSD: You're a nerd
OpenBSD: You're a nerd

A dead nerd.

No, it's Stallone that uses Slakware! by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:40 · Score: 0

Everyone knows this! A rough and crude distro capable of heavy computation. You may still be able to "lug" it around on overwieight floppies like a volcan cannon, but it may save your buddies behinds one day.

Debian by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:42 · Score: 0

About six months ago we switched to Debian from RH 7.3. My only regrate we did not do it sooner, administration is so much easier with Debian.

We expected Debian to be very stable and, so far, it did not let us down. One+ month non-stop, no reboots, on relatively heavy loaded server with "hot" package upgrades - nice!

Re:Debian by mcalwell · 2004-10-30 05:43 · Score: 1

I can't believe he said that Debian is hard to use and miles behind. Just how difficult is "apt-get whatever"? The very stable 'unstable' release is pretty much up to date, and many cutting edge packages (eg XFCE 4.2 beta out now (amazing, try it)) has its own deb packages and sources.list url. I can't imagine why I'd switch.
Re:debian by InfiniteWisdom · 2004-10-30 10:53 · Score: 1

Don't forget:

* Its extremely easy to get more than machine using the same set of packages:
machine1# dpkg --get-selections > file
copy file to machine2

machine2# dpkg --set-selections file
machine2# apt-get install
Re:debian by MobyTurbo · 2004-10-30 13:38 · Score: 2, Informative

I just want things to work without the need of manually changing LD_LIBRARY_PATH or using a distro that comes with a beta version of gcc (redhat).
Red Hat (and Fedora) haven't come with a beta version of gcc for years, ever since RH 8.0 came with gcc 3.2 instead of 2.96. Your criticism is a bit out of date.
Re:debian by gmhowell · 2004-10-30 15:47 · Score: 1

It also seems that we are an overly sensitive bunch...

--
Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. -John Lennon
Re:debian by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 22:15 · Score: 0

Is for the xxxxx BSD set that haven the time to code the missing drivers

Slow day... by Liquid+Len · 2004-10-30 04:46 · Score: 1

Boy, I wonder how this kind of crap can make it to the front page of Slashdot. Kinds of remind me of those phoney tests in teen magazines...
Way to feed trolls, man...

Re:Slow day... by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:24 · Score: 0

Here's a troll for ya...

do you see what Bush has done to this country? His war of fear against americans has even affected slashdotters and his propaganda machine has been so efficient that the people who used to be able to discern between reality and fantasy are now trapped in a universe of terror and fear of their own, completely unable to detect even the slightest traces of humor. They are so wound up in their own self preservation that when something funny comes up and bites off their head, they still refuse to see it. It doesn't stop there though. Not only do they refuse to see humor, but they feel the need to announce to the world that they cannot see humor. Oh but that's not all. They also feel so self-important that they think others will actually care about their terror-pity-party they're throwing for themselves and they post some rant about how horrible and evil the humor piece was all the while not realizing that it actually was humor.

How was that? :)

Mandrake - Gentoo. "Mandrake Expatriate Syndrome" by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:51 · Score: 0

Don't forget this one.
The mandrake/gentoo connection

Fun and lighthearted by polyp2000 · 2004-10-30 04:52 · Score: 3, Interesting

Thats a nice fun and lighthearted article for a saturday afternoon. Makes a change from all the serious stuff!

I wonder though what about people who use multiple different distributions? For example :- I've got a couple of higher spec machines I use for gentoo- but I also run Xandros (Open Circulation Ed.) on this laptop (which is for family use) and I've got my mother running Libranet on her aging K6.

I suppose technically speaking Xandros and Libranet are Debian based - but so is Linspire - Where does this leave me?

Im in a twisted state of being neither here nor there help me ... please!!!!

Nick ...

--
Electronic Music Made Using Linux http://soundcloud.com/polyp

heres how you do it by cosmol · 2004-10-30 04:54 · Score: 1

Don't try to install different distributions to get random hardware to work, that's the windows way. Figure out what the hardware is and make sure your kernel has support for it compiled in, or you have a module for it.

in your situation:
run 'lspci'
find the line that corresponds to your soundcard.
go to http://www.alsa-project.org/alsa-doc/ and follow the instructions

Re:heres how you do it by clsc · 2004-10-30 06:46 · Score: 1

well, thanks. Been there, done that, still no sound. As for "follow the instructions" that's simply not possible as those that are there has missing steps, but i've tried just about anything i could think of.

For the curious, it's an "intel AC97 i810" - so it's widely supported, including on "more than half of the distro's i listed above". Also, i can get the system speaker to go "beep" on me, so there's obviously something working, but i just can't get the freaking external speakers to say anything at all. I did say that i've spent a few months on this didn't i?

sheesh... some of the others responding here seems to think that you'd be a total jerk if you'd ever experience a problem with linux you can't solve.

Well, back on topic...
Re:heres how you do it by phasm42 · 2004-10-30 07:05 · Score: 1

Don't know if you've checked into this, but does your mobo's sound happen to output digital sound (as opposed to regular analong sound)? Some newer onboard sound cards may default to digital output (requiring digital speakers). I just changed computers at work, and the new mobo (transplanted out of a Gateway) including onboard sound which didn't seem to work after installing the drivers, which I think is due to digital output, so I just stuck another sound card in and used it. I'd like to mention that I know nothing about sound cards under Linux (I use Linux on servers only), but this might be something to check into.

--
"No one likes working in a hamster wheel, and your shop smells of cedar shavings from here." - TaleSpinner
Re:heres how you do it by phasm42 · 2004-10-30 07:07 · Score: 1

Forgot to mention that some cards (I think SBLive) can switch between digital and analog output, which could help explain why it works under Windows and not Linux. Maybe the Linux driver defaults to digital output. But this is all speculation anyway.

--
"No one likes working in a hamster wheel, and your shop smells of cedar shavings from here." - TaleSpinner
Re:heres how you do it by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 11:00 · Score: 0

Did you check lsmod and the boot logs to see if the driver was being loded? Did you open a mixer and check the levels? Can you play an audio CD via. the analogue connector?
Re:heres how you do it by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 21:07 · Score: 0

Just one question. Some KDE-distros (if not all) mutes the sound by default, and you need to use the sound mixer to turn it on.

Have you tried this? I have read that a lot of people have this problem, and it's understandable since the sound really should be on by default.

In real enterprise production world by ToasterTester · 2004-10-30 04:54 · Score: 1

After selling your soul to get the CIO to buy into Linux you can only use RedHat because you can get a support contact. If we can't sue someone when things go wrong, we can't use their product.

Then in businesses without the mind numbing CIO/CTO suits you will find Debian. Debian has more of a server focus than the other Linux's and is easy to keep patched so security suits are happy.

Then in the background you have the BSD SA's running around setting up firewalls, routers, and other network monitoring boxes feeding packets to all the servers in the data center.

Okay, okay everyone has a Knoppix CD in their bag of tricks to fix things. But the whiny Knoppix chahuahua dude in desktop support has got to go.

Long live the Gentoo empire! by fireboy1919 · 2004-10-30 04:56 · Score: 5, Funny

To accept binaries is dishonorable.
He whose distro is not compiled from source will never enter the halls of Stovakor.

Any ko'tal who cannot compile his apps to brings dishonor upon his family, and is a weak piece of baktag.

We do not allow the weak to live.

--
Mod me down and I will become more powerful than you can possibly imagine!

Re:Long live the Gentoo empire! by Reziac · 2004-10-31 06:57 · Score: 1

You have no honour -- you just made me spit gak all over my monitor. For that, you will die!!

--
~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?

Translation in Klingon? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 04:59 · Score: 0

Can we get that mental patient to translate it in Klingon?

Re:"International men of software" all use Mandrak by The+MESMERIC · 2004-10-30 05:02 · Score: 1

It's Ubuntu!
And you get 2 chicks included in the package.

In other words, Linuxista are POSEURS!!!!! by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:06 · Score: 0, Troll

OSX and Windows people just want to get work done. Zealots only use Linux for image. Linux is only able to exist due to the framework of real work done by the Windows/OSX sector. In other words, it's a flippant luxury for diddling, equivalent to why diamonds are a big commodity in the USA, but in East Timor they have no cachet.

To recap:

Linux = status symbol

Windows/OSX = tools for real work

It Is Pretty Sweet, I Think by 6800 · 2004-10-30 05:08 · Score: 2, Insightful

I did enjoy the analysis and, somehow, it did seem to hit home, like reading the explainations on a Chinese Restaurant place matt of the year you were born, with just a smitherene of truth. In my case I started with slackware (not mentioned), changed to redhat from 1.x to 7.2 (bought 8 but never installed it for real use) but after buying a new nvidia chipset MB at home and being given a new intel chipset gateway at work to load, at the time Mandrake was the only distro that came close to working right and supporting the devices. So the newer kid on the block (mandrake) became the suave dominator and when redhat did it's turnaround in the big customer direction, I began to forget about them and fumora, well I tried it. Of course Mandrake ain't perfect and all have a ways to go. But the real Truth is I carry a live linux cd, Knoppix or one of it's derivitives for various uses. Long live knoppix!!!

Re:"Trolling with the truth" remix... by The+MESMERIC · 2004-10-30 05:11 · Score: 0, Flamebait

I have to admit I used to get laid more often when using Windows .. how come? :(
Mac users get laid too - but probably by the same sex.

Windows = promiscuous
Mac = camp
Linux = sexless.

debian zealotry *yawn* by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:16 · Score: 0

Must have been written by a debian zealot. The conspicuous absence of the venerable slackware distribution says it all. Bias.

I thought newsforge was better than that. *shock*

Re:debian zealotry *yawn* by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:18 · Score: 1, Interesting

There's this thing....it's sooooo freaking cool....I'm sure you've heard of this thing but just in case you haven't......it's called.....a SENSE OF HUMOR.....you really should go get one simply because they are so damn cool!
Re:debian zealotry *yawn* by DerelictMan · 2004-10-30 07:23 · Score: 1

There's this thing....it's sooooo freaking cool....I'm sure you've heard of this thing but just in case you haven't......it's called.....a SENSE OF HUMOR.....you really should go get one simply because they are so damn cool!
gnu:/root# apt-get install sense-of-humor Reading Package Lists... Done Building Dependency Tree... Done E: Couldn't find package sense-of-humor
Oh well, guess it hasn't been Debianized yet...
Re:debian zealotry *yawn* by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 22:12 · Score: 0

parking attendents dont have a sense of humour
it more than their job is worth

Re:"International men of software" all use Mandrak by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:16 · Score: 0

whoah you forgot to add that one of them was a lesbian and the man evidently queer.

Re:SuSE and Red Hat for me... by Thaidog · 2004-10-30 05:17 · Score: 0, Troll

Yes.

PS I'm not boasting jackass.

--

||| I still can't believe Parkay's not butter.

Debian by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:17 · Score: 0

I picked Debian as a total noob because it was the only distribution I could find that has a boot floppy network install.

Not a wonderful distro for beginners. It's a little overwhelming. But the people are nice, and the packaging system rocks.

Re:Swaret, eh? by happyemoticon · 2004-10-30 05:24 · Score: 2, Informative

Swaret and pkgtool are damn fine things, and I'll challenge you to show me how they come up short. I mean, I do kind of long for those sweet, sweet ebuilds of gentoo, but i can just type in

swaret --install tuxracer

or

swaret --upgrade

and that is that. Oh yeah, and you can also point out that Slackware users don't need or want wizards and guis; we'll take a swarm of xterms, thank you.

Ted Bundy by Donny+Smith · 2004-10-30 05:24 · Score: 1

As I use multiple distros, I guess that makes me a Linux equivalent of Ted Bundy or someone with the split personality.

Re:"International men of software" all use Mandrak by The+MESMERIC · 2004-10-30 05:27 · Score: 1

how do you know?
oh ok don't tell me - I too wouldnt be able to keep still among such company :)

As an APPLE user... by ylikone · 2004-10-30 05:29 · Score: 1

The fact that I've chosen a MAC should say something loud and clear:

1. I AM RICH
2. I like to be elitist
3. I also hate redmond

As far as that linux "freedom" thing goes, I'm sure it's overrated.

/not actually an apple user

--
Meh.

biased by opweirdisntit · 2004-10-30 05:33 · Score: 1

lol that seems so biased LOL Mandrake = polished = suave LOL :) My god...

seriously... by ylikone · 2004-10-30 05:39 · Score: 2, Funny

debian: you value freedom overall
gentoo: you value a fast/ultra-tweaked system
slackware: you value conventional standards
knoppix: you value the ability to upgrade by just burning a new cd
linspire: you value being able to get stuff done without any dirty work
mandrake: you value being able to get stuff done without much dirty work
suse: you value the ability to get stuff done without much dirty work, and you hate the french
redhat: you value supporting the "big" distro
fedora: can't afford redhat, you value being a guinea pig for the "big" distro or are too scared to try anything new
caldera: you're a f****** idiot!

--
Meh.

cygwin? by BaconLT · 2004-10-30 05:43 · Score: 1

Well... I feign to ask what they would say about cygwin users.

--
Who mediates your information?

Re:cygwin? by multipartmixed · 2004-10-30 06:49 · Score: 1

> I feign to ask what they would say about cygwin users.

We are UNIX geeks who quite frankly, suck at using Windows, so when we're using our wives' machines, install Cygwin so that we can actually get things done (e.g. find files, use an editor, compile programs, run scripts, ssh/sftp). When we need to get a LOT of work done, we fire up Knoppix and X over our desktops from work.

--

Do daemons dream of electric sleep()?

What Your Choice of Linux Distro Says about You by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:43 · Score: 0

It says you are a geek with too much free time and no real usage for your computer. Otherwise, you would be using Windows or a real Unix that works.

oops, almost forgot by ylikone · 2004-10-30 05:45 · Score: 1

OSX: you value being more compatible with business and microsoft, you think you have freedom but you're still just a deluded corporate slave

--
Meh.

Typical by asciiRider · 2004-10-30 05:48 · Score: 1

Nothing under Redhat about folks wanting to use at home what they will be expected to -know- at work...

I look at my home experience as training for work -

Re:Typical by 6800 · 2004-10-30 06:45 · Score: 1

Actually, I find it goes both ways :-)

OS X and Windows Users by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 05:57 · Score: 1, Funny

OS X - you are liberal, rich, snobby, and/or gay.

Windows - you are a newbie, brainwashed (think Borg), and/or have a life outsife of computers.

Different distros for different people by davidwr · 2004-10-30 06:09 · Score: 2, Insightful

I chose Suse because it's reasonably popular, it's configuration and updates were relatively easy, and, unlike Fedora/RedHat you download (almost) the same CD that's "paid-for" box, then buy a license later if you need corporate support.

I used to use Red Hat 9 and earlier, for the same reasons. Unfortunately, now that RH9 is no longer getting official vendor updates, it no longer meets my criteria.

For demos and "instant linux," I prefer Knoppix, although SuSE's live CD is okay.

I haven't tried it, but something along the lines of LinSpire would be good for Windows98 converts.

For special-purpose configurations, such as firewalls, I'll use a CURRENTLY SUPPORTED, FREQUENTLY UPDATED/EASY-TO-UPDATE distro that's designed for that purpose.

I guess this means I'm a nerd, I'm a nerd, and I'm a nerd.

--
Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.

Suse users prefer by pair-a-noyd · 2004-10-30 06:09 · Score: 1

the *one distro* that works straight out of the box.

Suse users prefer to be productive.
Suse users understand that it's more important to USE your computer than to do battle with your computer..

flame on baby......

Re:Suse users prefer by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 11:19 · Score: 0

Just use it? Where is the fun in that?
Re:Suse users prefer by pair-a-noyd · 2004-10-30 11:22 · Score: 1

Ah, you must be a Mandrake user...

Gentoo motto by eelke_klein · 2004-10-30 06:11 · Score: 1

The official Gentoo motto is, "If it moves, compile it."

It ain't, its: "If it moves, emerge it."

Suave and Sophisticated Bruce by pipingguy · 2004-10-30 06:20 · Score: 1

Geeks-only stuff:

"Smart, suave and sophisticated" is a partial line said by Eric Idle(?) during a live Monty Python show in New York.

"Bruce, bring out the words!"

It was a part of their Philosopher's Song routine.

I use gentoo because it is easy by SmallFurryCreature · 2004-10-30 06:20 · Score: 1

Sure you can make jokes about "if it was hard to write it should be hard to use" and such BUT I will ask you one very simple question.

Exactly how many race cars are automatics? None? Thank you very much.

You see there are two kind of people in this world. Those who know computers and those who don't.

First the last group. If you don't know anything about computers then good for you. Use whatever can get you through what you need to do with the minimal of difficulty. Best if you let people who know handle the complicated stuff so you can get on with your job. Power/control/flexibilty/cutting edge are to these people just fancy words for complicated/hard to learn/confusing/constantly changing. And they are right, not everyone needs to be a genius computer user. Micheal Schumacher has said more then ones that he knowns nothing about cars. Seems able to drive them pretty fast despite of it.

HOWEVER, not everyone knowns or doesn't want to know anything about computers. I and others like me know how things work and to us "easy to use" OS'es like Windows quickly become actually difficult to use. I can change the network settings of a linux machine far far faster then I can on a windows machine. I can secure a linux machine far far easier then a windows machine.

Not because linux is easier, it isn't, but because unlike windows Linux isn't dumbing me down either. Once you have climbed the learning curve then linux puts you in complete control. With windows there is always that "wizard" bit where someone in redmond is deciding what you can and cannot do.

A simple example. Most file systems both on linux and windows as default record the last time a file is accessed. This can be a problem if for some reason files are accessed a lot. Windows has a design feature wich causes the file explorer to access each file in a directory your viewing to get its info. Nice except if your on a slow drive with a few thousand files.

So on both linux and windows you can turn of this "last access" timestamp. Now I have for you an excersise. How do you turn it off in linux? Easy, edit fstab and add the word "noatime" to the mount options. Next is the windows method. Good luck.

Is the windows one easier? Perhaps, but it sure as hell isn't in the place you expected is it? Not anywhere near the GUI for managing your filesystems. Last time I used it was a dos command and a pretty arcana one at that.

Gentoo is "harder" to use then other linux distros. Well until you get past the learning curve. One big problem I have always had is that a lot of linux programs you install from source (because no rpm is available) need the header files of something else. Both Red-Hat and Suse and Mandrake had me trying to find the sources only to find that during the install, to save space, they were not included.

With gentoo, the sources are always there.

Just makes adding a new piece of software so much easier. If you know what your doing.

And that is why I use Gentoo. It allows me to use the skills I have learned. Unlike windows were I am often stuck.

--

MMO Quests are like orgasms:

You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.

Re:I use gentoo because it is easy by LMariachi · 2004-10-30 07:09 · Score: 1

Exactly how many race cars are automatics? None? Thank you very much.
Yeah, wrong. Ever heard of Powerglide? Torqueflite? Probably not, since they weren't in the same display case as your Type-R sticker. Most dragster classes (and some circle track) use automatic transmissions. And I believe Formula 1/Indy cars have "clutchless" paddle-shifters, which is like a semiautomatic.
You see there are two kind of people in this world. Those who know computers and those who don't.
Funny, it's the same way with cars!
Re:I use gentoo because it is easy by chemguru · 2004-10-30 09:35 · Score: 1

And I believe Formula 1/Indy cars have "clutchless" paddle-shifters, which is like a semiautomatic.

This is getting WAY off topic...

But, F1/IRL/CART are not 'clutchless'. They use electronically controlled hydraulic clutch systems that are MUCH faster than a human could 'clutch && shift && release'. They are considered semi-automatic because during hard acceleration, the on-board computers automatically engage the clutch and shift into the next higher gear. The driver STILL has control of gear selection.

Drag transmissions were designed with the same idea in mind; human clutch interaction is too slow. Thus, a clutchless transmission was designed. This 'automatic' transmission is NOTHING like a standard 'daily driver' automatic transmission the parent was referring to.

It's still a good comparison of using a 'hard'linux (having internal knowledge of what's going on) vs windows (only having knowledge of what to enter in a 'gui wizard'). (ALL) Racecar mechanics/designers know the internals and design accordingly to the application.

--
--Chemguru
Re:I use gentoo because it is easy by LMariachi · 2004-10-30 11:25 · Score: 1

Yeah, that's why I put "clutchless" in quotes. A lot of those auto drag trannys (hee hee) were originally designed for daily drivers, though. Not the ones in Top Fuel/Funny Car, but muscle car classes.
(Another thing re: grandparent post: I'm sure Michael Schumacher knows more about the internals of a car than most folks; when he says he doesn't it's in relation to the top automotive engineers he's surrounded by on a daily basis.)
But yes, way OT.

Accuracy in Reporting! by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 06:34 · Score: 5, Funny

Slackware: You have an old-school stick up your arse. Doesn't that chafe?

Debian: You are like Ayn Rand: you insist that everything in your system be internally consistent, at the expense of nobody else being able to understand you.

Red Hat: You want to be Microsoft, except without the jackboots and the viruses. Well ... maybe the jackboots.

SuSE: You remember how fascist and self-righteous the Novell administrator for your high school was? Surprise -- that's you!

Knoppix: You're good at getting Windows users to try Linux. But hey -- they're Windows users.

Mepis: You sound like a child talking about urinating.

Fedora: You eat Nike cheeseburgers and wear McDonald's sneakers, to show that you are not a corporate whore.

Linspire: You are root. All the time. Isn't that k3wl? Here, have a virus!

Re:Accuracy in Reporting! by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 19:11 · Score: 0

Hey, I am proud to be a Debian user under LVM! GRUB rocks!!! Long life to Debian!

But hey... I sometimes hate packaging dependencies... maybe I should try that Slackware thing... I don't see that since this 7.0 version... long time no see...

We need a poll! by hey! · 2004-10-30 06:47 · Score: 1

OK, so Mandrake users are suave, arrogant francophiles and Gentoo users are cowboys.

We need a poll of Gentoo and Mandrake users to see if there is a difference on who they support in the presidential race. Are you: Mandrake/Kerry, Mandrake/Bush, Gentoo/Kerry or Gentoo/Bush.

We'll ignore Cobb and Badarnik for the time being, since Cobb supporters are probably Debian and I have know idea what distro the Libs are apt to use.

--
Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.

Re:We need a poll! by thegnu · 2004-11-05 08:55 · Score: 1

I have know idea what distro the Libs are apt to use.
Arch Linux.
I voted for Kerry though.

--
Please stop stalking me, bro.

FEDORA will never take off!!! by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 06:50 · Score: 0

...at least not in Brazil.

Fedor = stink/stench in portuguese.

If some kid said "Fedora Core" I'd think he was saying "Stink! RUN!" and so I did.

The hell? by jcuervo · 2004-10-30 06:51 · Score: 1

Where the fuck is Slackware?

I can't believe they made a list of distributions without including the first distribution.

--
Assume I was drunk when I posted this.

What being Joe Barr means to Linux. by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 06:52 · Score: 0

Not that anyone should take what Mr. Barr has to say very seriously.

From: Joe Barr [joe@pjprimer.com]
Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 1999 8:02 AM
To: sales@mindcraft.com
Subject: Industry Scum

Hey, Mindcraft

I am writing an article about asslicking whores in the industry.

You know the sort, they bend over for folks like Bill Gates by
producing totally false "benchmarks" based on liess, mistests,
biased hardware and software, and scores of other unethical,
deceiptful, dishonest, duplicitous means.

Like your reviews of NT vs Novell and Linux. Classic cases of
professional prostitution.

Cock sucking the geeks in Redmond.

The question for you maggots, whores, whatever you prefer to be
called, is: how much does it cost to buy one of your benchmarks?

tHANKS,

Joe Barr The Dweebspeak Primer

Red Hat user... which version? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 06:54 · Score: 0

What does it mean if you're using, say, Red Hat 8?

I don't think it means what they claim for Red Hat... actually, I think it means I'm a lazy sod who hasn't bothered upgrading for ages.

Gentoo is for Ricers by ryen · 2004-10-30 06:55 · Score: 1

"I use Gentoo because I'm a speed freak - I can't stand the thought that some of my packages might not be running as fast as they could be."

Gentoo is for Ricers

I hardly can understand what I read by apankrat · 2004-10-30 06:58 · Score: 2, Funny

I hardly can understand what I read, leave alone believing it.

SUSE * If you like beer, horns, or green eggs, you'll like SUSE. The recent acquisition of SUSE by Novell is similar to Vince Lombardi's Green Bay Packers adopting the West Coast offense...

"Green eggs" ? "Bay Packers" ? "Coast offense" ? Huh ?!

--
3.243F6A8885A308D313

Re:I hardly can understand what I read by swv3752 · 2004-10-30 12:02 · Score: 1

Dr Seuss, Football team, style of play of football.

Crawl out for m under your rock and try living a little. I don care to watch sports, but even I know who the Green Bay Packers are.

--
Just a Tuna in the Sea of Life
Re:I hardly can understand what I read by apankrat · 2004-10-30 13:37 · Score: 1

Dude, I'm in Canada. I couldn't care less for a football :)

--
3.243F6A8885A308D313
Re:I hardly can understand what I read by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 14:16 · Score: 0

I don care to watch sports, but even I know who the Green Bay Packers are.
...and I'm sure you know that their home stadium is called Lambert Field.

it proves one thing by Mantorp · 2004-10-30 07:12 · Score: 1

a large number of the people commenting on the story seemed offended, I think it proves they have no sense of humor.

Go Win 98!!!

Beats /. by arvindn · 2004-10-30 07:12 · Score: 1

newsforge.com has the most immature bunch of knee-jerk readers. Ever. About a hundred times worse than slashdot. The story is clearly humor and says so right at the top, yet half the responses are from inflamed posters who took it seriously. Sheesh. (Disclaimer: I'm not an unbiased observer since I've written a few articles for newsforge.)

At last I fear no more for my love of Mandrake!!! by adolfojp · 2004-10-30 07:32 · Score: 1

It was quite funny though... although we are all not french! I gulp my cheap beer with pride!

Oh, by the way, urpmi and apt-get distros are the only ones that I recommend for desktop use. I consider a decent package manager to be a requirement instead of a nice feature.

Cheers,

Adolfo

BOOYEAH by Feztaa · 2004-10-30 07:40 · Score: 2, Interesting

I use Fedora, according to this, that makes me a conformist.

I never thought I'd live to see the day that using linux makes a person a "conformist". I suppose that makes linux mainstream.

Three words... by cliffiecee · 2004-10-30 07:48 · Score: 1

Linux.
from.
scratch.

And another thing... .rpm? .deb? Pfft! I got your package management scheme right here.

Not a flame ... by kitzilla · 2004-10-30 07:50 · Score: 1

... nor a troll. But what a useless article. What's next? "Make love the SUSE way?"

--
This is my post. There are many others like it. If you don't like what you read here, go try one of the others.

I know, I know by ZxCv · 2004-10-30 08:01 · Score: 0, Troll

The fact that I've chosen a MAC should say something loud and clear:

That you are better at manipulating the properties of your network card than the average schmoe?

--

Perl - $Just @when->$you ${thought} s/yn/tax/ &couldn\'t %get $worse;

I'm not on the list... by codermarc · 2004-10-30 08:13 · Score: 1

I use Windows, and sometimes OS X, so I guess that makes me an artsy snobby jack ass? =P

Joe Barr by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 08:21 · Score: 0

By: Joe Barr -> crap

BSD high quality is the joke by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 08:28 · Score: 0

The joke is he wouldn't want to install anything else after NetBSD because it works on the most hardware, not that it's a difficult install.

Anyway, the hidden joke in the article is where they got serious and put a link to "OpenBSD 3.6 released" at the end.

So, where's the Linux Distro that says nothing? by Gigantic1 · 2004-10-30 08:34 · Score: 1

Hey...I don't want an OS that makes a lifestyle or political statement - just one that helps me make a living without wasting my time learning to be a Geek.

Does that Linux Distro exist?

debian by sewagemaster · 2004-10-30 08:34 · Score: 4, Insightful

"This distribution is popular with those who always count in binary, and are politically correct in a free software kind of way. Many are suspected of having been nursed on a TTY. Debian users take pride in the fact that their distribution is always several releases behind the latest version of the kernel, but makes up for that by being more difficult to install and use."

uh... no....

I use debian because it takes zero effort to upgrade packages - no BS, and if there's a change in the default /etc files, i have the option of keeping my old config or use the new package maintener's version. Unlike rpms, the debian packaging system doesnt just dump the files. it checks more than that.

I dont ever have to download ISOs and reinstall the OS from scratch.

There's also a lot less crap installed on my machine than distros like Mandrake or Redhat.

I dont have to worry about rpm packages breaking my system. Packages aren't outdated because I'm running unstable...

I actually find it quite easy to install with their newest installer

i'd rather spend time getting work done than wasting time configuring my system and updating broken packages. I don't want to read packages of documentation from linuxdoc. I just want things to work without the need of manually changing LD_LIBRARY_PATH or using a distro that comes with a beta version of gcc (redhat).

--
my blog

Debian hard to install? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 08:40 · Score: 1, Informative

If easy means you can not read anything presented to you on the screen and mindlessly click "Next", then yes Debian is hard to install. If easy means you don't have to do much to get it to detect fairly common ethernet cards and even IDE RAID controllers, then Debian is easy to install and the others are sometimes harder.

Shit my profile doesn't match by SpaghettiPattern · 2004-10-30 09:07 · Score: 1

Shit my profile doesn't match. I'll switch distro instantly.

--

I hadn't the slightest objection to his spending his time planning massacres for the bourgeoisie... (P.G. Wodehouse)

What your distro choice REALLY says about you by Glonoinha · 2004-10-30 09:11 · Score: 4, Funny

Debian - Nerd

Gentoo - Nerd

Knoppix - Nerd

Linspire - Nerd that shops at Walmart

Mandrake - Nerd

MEPIS - Nerd

Red Hat - Nerd

Slackware - Nerd

SUSE - Nerd

--
Glonoinha the MebiByte Slayer

Re:What your distro choice REALLY says about you by Feyr · 2004-10-30 09:26 · Score: 2, Interesting

i think you nailed it right on the head!

or at least this list is less biased than the one in the article
Re:What your distro choice REALLY says about you by Blano · 2004-10-30 12:57 · Score: 1

I will stick with Panther - best of both worlds - excellent desktop and Unix underneath -- and X11 to run some other cool apps. It definitely is not perfect - but the best desktop plus nerd tools I have found in 13 years.
Re:What your distro choice REALLY says about you by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 15:38 · Score: 0

Ditto.

As a Debian user, I don't find it at all difficult to use. I find the distrobution very clean, and easy to make clean. As a person who is naturally not very organized (who has time to put things in a file cabinet, or buy a file cabinet for that matter, this goes in the STACK), I like to have my OS clean up for me which debian does even when you compile kernels. I'm also NOT all that proficient at Linux in my own opinion, but have little to no trouble with Debian. Either Debian is easier than the author is making things out to be, or Linux in general isn't as hard as everyone claims.
Re:What your distro choice REALLY says about you by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 18:22 · Score: 0

HA! HA! You are steve jobs BI-OTCH!
Re:What your distro choice REALLY says about you by Hognoxious · 2004-10-30 20:34 · Score: 1

I would say Red Hat - Nerd that wears a suit, but otherwise, spot on!

--
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."

POSIX by cbr2702 · 2004-10-30 09:24 · Score: 1

What do you mean by proper OS? The Incompatible Timesharing System? Linux, BSD, OSX, NT (2k, XP), are all POSIX compliant.

--

This post written under Gentoo-linux with an SCO IP license.

Re:POSIX by cbreaker · 2004-10-30 15:05 · Score: 1

"The Incompatible Timesharing System?"

TITS?

--
- It's not the Macs I hate. It's Digg users. -
Re:POSIX by DrSkwid · 2004-10-31 04:16 · Score: 1

Can you think of any OSes that are *not* posix ?

hint

--
There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter

I use mandrake.... by Alex · 2004-10-30 09:34 · Score: 1

"I use Mandrake, so that makes me suave and sophisticated."

Not a cheese eating surrender monkey ???

Alex

My distro by techster3599 · 2004-10-30 10:27 · Score: 1

If it's a distro, boot from it, don't install it, just use it

If *BSDs were religions by identity0 · 2004-10-30 10:40 · Score: 1

If *BSDs were religions -

OpenBSD - Concerned that your fringe religion was becoming too currupted by temptation(and also because you were kicked out), you've decided to start your own cult.

It has its own armed compound straddling the border of Montana and Canada - Montana for the guns, Canada for the drugs. Your cult memebers obsessively analyze the compound's perimiter for weakness, knowing that evil "scripture kiddies" will try to get in and destroy your land of purity. None have gotten through for seven years. You know also that the government is out to get you, so every time a black helicopter flies near, a burst of gunfire warns them away.

Your followers are fanatical to the extreme and will bite the hand off of anyone who dares to say that their license is not free. Five times a day, they face in the direction of the holy land and chant, "There is no BSD but OpenBSD. There is no freedom but the BSD license. May God strike down the abominations of the GPL."

NetBSD - The fringe religion that OpenBSD came from. Like Unitarians, you don't really stand for anything, choosing to accomodate any processsor family that needs a kernel. Your quiet, hippieish ways does not create the devotion of the other BSDs, and your religion is doomed to be obscure forever. Your followers don't go out of their way to castigate the GPL heretics or the Windows infidels, choosing to "live and let live". If the Rapture comes and the BSD Daemon comes forth to cast judgement upon the geeks of the world, he will say unto NetBSD users, "Oh, are you still here? I, uh, guess you're saved". Hallelujah!

FreeBSD - A dead religion, which no one practices anymore. Netcraft confirms it.

slackware again by dalpeh · 2004-10-30 11:04 · Score: 1

Another Slackware user beeping in.
I am a bit put off that it was left off the list, but then again rightly so, Patrick does not care what other folk think and does not bend over backwards to please. He does what is good for the distro. If all the other folk out there want to use a lesser distro (all the ones listed have been used or considered by the company I work for: FACT; folk in the decision making places in my company make bad ones), then that is their choice. I just felt like writing in to show support for Slack and let the other Slack users that you are not alone. ;->

--
forgivness is easier to get than permission

Re:"Trolling with the truth" remix... by Anton+Anatopopov · 2004-10-30 11:05 · Score: 0

I think the fact that someone actually cares about something as mundane, commoditized and ultimately interchangable as an operating system, marks them out as slightly wierd.

I mean, some people treat their choice of OS as though their life depended on it. The reason you get laid more when you use windows is that girls don't like nerds, they like real men, and what OS is a real man going to use? - That's right, the one that came with the PC...

Errr.... by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 11:11 · Score: 0

Shouldn't that be "Linus for President?"

Then again, there's that crazy "native-born" clause in our constitution forbidding him from holding such office, but...

Re:Errr.... by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-31 01:03 · Score: 0

I'm sure they'll remove that clause for President Schwarzenegger, so Linus won't have any trouble after that. And Linus is a good 30 years younger so there's plenty of time in this future timeline for the Open Source Revolution to run its course and overthrow Ahnold's reign of terror.

They left out HURD! by moosesocks · 2004-10-30 13:36 · Score: 1

GNU Hurd: This section will be completed once there is an actual HURD user to base it upon.

--
-- If you try to fail and succeed, which have you done? - Uli's moose

Re:They left out HURD! by dalpeh · 2004-10-30 16:51 · Score: 1

it did say linux distro
I used GNU/Hurd a while , got x windows to work and the cd rom drive, network is better now I read. Still a tough cookie to use, very debian like though in all the pkg admin.

--
forgivness is easier to get than permission

You Miss The Point by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 14:18 · Score: 0

...you cretin.

You care if the market starts moving to Linux/Unix/whatever? THEN IT HAD BETTER SUPPORT GENERIC HARDWARE.

No big secret, that's why Windows rules. IT JUST WORKS.

You malodorous, toffy-nosed PERVERT!

Re:You Miss The Point by jack_csk · 2004-10-30 17:01 · Score: 1

I see it the other way. Linux is already doing a great job on hardware support, if you compare it to the *BSD. It is those device manufactuers who keep the specifications from the developers. I would say, when more and more people start jumping on the Linux bandwagon, hardware manufacturers would include device drivers (Linux kernel module, etc) or open their specifications.

That site is logically inept. by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 14:24 · Score: 0

There are some things that one could validly criticize Gentoo about, using good old logic and solid reasoning.

Instead, that site bashes Gentoo with ridicule, and in so doing only appeals to those who cannot reason for themselves and who therefore enjoy the herd mentality within basher peer groups. Any old minority will do for bashing ... it's such a good feeling.

Nothing new there I guess. There have always been morons in the world, and the Linux world is no exception. The author of that site is one.

To be serious for a moment by metamatic · 2004-10-30 14:57 · Score: 1

I run Gentoo and Debian, as well as OS X.

What that says about me is I don't enjoy wiping my OS and reinstalling every six months to a year, I like it being really easy to keep up to date with patches, and I don't like long and painful software installations.

--
GCHQ Quantum Insert installed. If only our tongues were made of glass, how much more careful we would be when we speak

What's a desktop? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 15:12 · Score: 0

Desktop? What's a desktop? I too use SuSE, for a couple years it was RedHat, and I *never* even see my desktop! I keep so many application windows open and in such large dimensions that they hardly let the desktop show through.

Mandrake on an 133MHz Pentium by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 15:14 · Score: 0

And until a year ago, I had a Pentium (not II, not III, but an original Pentium), 133 MHz running Mandrake. My poor baby only have 80MB of RAM. I ran KDE on it no less. Yeah, it took forever and then some to boot. Starting apps was a bit slow. But the response was faster than any Windows box I've ever used once they were running.

Please mod up! by Mad_Rain · 2004-10-30 16:11 · Score: 1

Of course, now someone will mod you up for being insightful - just because they hadn't considered encypting their toaster crumbs for their privacy yet. :)

--
"What do you think?" "I think 'What, do you think?!'"

If you use BSD... by tqft · 2004-10-30 17:23 · Score: 1

does that mean you are dying?

--
The Singularity is closer than you think
Quant

No 'multiple choice' questions? by Andr0s · 2004-10-30 17:29 · Score: 0

Seriously, very few Linux-oriented people I know are hardcore in for only one distro. Though I admit I don't know enough of them anyway, I still think that test should've been multi-option. I, for one, can't stop toying with various distros, new or old, as the fancy strikes me.

Perhaps that makes me Pushy, aggressive, suave, timid, meek, middle of the road John Wayne with love of beer (duh), horns (?) and green eggs (?!?). I wonder, though, how come Debian users get no personality stereotype beyond 'politically correct in a free software kind of way' (aren't all the Linux users such?)

--
'...computers in the future may have only 1000 vacuum tubes and perhaps weigh 1.5 tons...' Popular Mechanics, 03/49'

oh i get it by ewe2 · 2004-10-30 18:23 · Score: 1

none of them use Windows!

--
insecurity asks the wrong question irritation gives the wrong answer

what about yellow dog users? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-30 19:35 · Score: 0

well, what about 'em?

Re:"Trolling with the truth" remix... by The+MESMERIC · 2004-10-30 23:57 · Score: 0

yeah but these days

very cheap PCs come with Linux

very camp PCs come with Panther OS

very mundande PC come with .. yeah you've guessed it.

methinks youre trolling by clsc · 2004-10-31 01:45 · Score: 1

if you'd bothered to read my post mentioning the kernel issue, i stated the that was not the first thing i'd have thought of. eod.

didn't have to recompile by clsc · 2004-10-31 01:48 · Score: 1

i solved the issue without recompiling. It simply wasn't necessary. I got just a little too provoked by some of the "me-knows-all" posters here, so i tried "everything and then some" just one more time, and somehow i got it right this time.

Badly configured systems are always slow by billstewart · 2004-10-31 11:15 · Score: 1

512MB RAM and only 128MB swap? Either that's because you don't have a big enough disk drive (which is odd, because by the time 512MB RAM was affordable, 40GB disk drives were also affordable, and you could afford to blow an extra $2 on a gig or two on swap if you needed it), or you don't have enough swap space configured for the applications you're running. Of course, it used to be that Unix systems recommended having more swap space than RAM (originally 2-3x more), but even though that's no longer necessary, you still should have enough for what you're doing.

Meanwhile, if you're actually using the RAM for active applications, then get enough RAM. If you're on an old PC, that's a separate issue - that 486 or pentium133 motherboard might not have enough room to add more, or the price of old-style RAM may be high enough that it's cheaper to just get a new motherboard, so if you want to keep using the machine, you need to tune your distro appropriately, and maybe Slackware or Debian is the right answer, or maybe just running Blackbox or IceWM instead of the latest Gnome-bloatware is enough to do the job. (X itself doesn't need to be bloated - it ran just fine on a 386 with 8MB RAM :-)

--

Bill Stewart
New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks

They use Macs. by thegnu · 2004-11-05 08:40 · Score: 1

Yep. And don't like Debian, apparently, or they wouldn't be installing YDL.

*har har har*

--
Please stop stalking me, bro.

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What Your Choice of Linux Distro Says about You

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