Um okay I did the "mature" thing and checked out the report. The report is two years old and compares an RC version of w2k3/IIS6 against an old version of Redhat AS/Apache thus rendering it completely useless for doing an evaluation today. Not only that but it neglects to compare against other linux distributions such as SUSE or Mandrake thus rendering the "Windows better than Linux" claims deceptive at best.
Never mind about ape shit, if I found someone doing this on our network, there would be large helpings of elephant shit and maybe some whale shit thrown in for good measure.
There are rules for accessing corporate networks and resources, you break those rules then expect to be punished for it.
Its a hell of a lot easier to parse and put into your news system if its in XML than HTML. HTML makes it look pretty, XML/RSS makes it look machine readable.
Yes, we have many (compared with western countries) pirate shops here
As I used to live in Hong Kong as a child in the mid eighties I can atest to this:). Sham Shoi Po (sp? its been that long) used to be famous for it, the police would raid one day and the shops would open up again pretty much the next. Lots of fun.
A couple of things motivate coders to work on volunteer projects:
Cool Things: You get to play with cool things that in your normal line of work you wouldn't normally get to do.
Kudos: Believe it or not some people are motivated by other things than the all mighty dollar. Some coders like to be able to say "I did that" and recieve community recognition for it.
Just to point out that the majority of work done on the linux kernel is done by volunteers, many of whom are paid to code in different areas but make their kernel contributions for free.
No, from what I have read (keeping in mind we haven't heard Tridgewells side yet) it went something like this:
Larry: Someones trying to reverse engineer us, stop it or I'll take away BitKeeper
Linus: Okay I'll have a look. Ah its Tridge, Tridge please stop doing this Larry's saying he's going to take BitKeeper away
Tridge: Okay I'll stop (This is the important bit)
Larry: He hasn't stopped, thats it no BitKeeper for you!
Without hearing Tridgewells side of things thats whats being presented, Tridgewell said he would stop and then went on a head anyway. This would be what is pissing Linus off I think.
No IE is most heavily affected by the fact that some idiot thought it would be a good idea to tie the browser directly into the OS, thus meaning a security hole in IE is a security hole in the underlying OS.
As I have said before, if your biggest problem with Firefox is popups as opposed to root access attacks through IE then really Firefox is still ahead of the game.
Having read through some of whats been written on the site you linked too, this isn't "A slightly skeptical view", this is a thinly disguised, badly written hatchet job. From accusing Linus of "hijacking" the Minix community, to bringing up his fathers membership of the communist party and more.
Linus is not perfect god knows but he's not the conniving capitalist in communist clothing that site tries to paint him as.
It is quite possible that this is what has happened, especially if Larry McVoy is making noises about legalities its not a bad idea. However I have read through the posts that Linus has made regarding this and having asked him a couple of questions myself I think Linus is starting to make a little bit more sense.
From what I can gather, he is more frustrated at the whole mess having happened in the first place when it didn't need to.
I posted a question to Linus on the realworld list and he actually replied and clarified his position.
Below is the text of his reply:
It's really neither of those.
I don't think reverse-engineering is bad. It's quite natural to be inquisitive, and all questions of "how does this work" are "reverse engineering" to some degree.
And I might have been pissed off at BitMover, except they bent ove rbackwards trying to figure out how to continue things as well as possible.
So disappointed, yes. Mainly because the whole thing seems so pointless. The tool that tridge wrote ends up being useless, and nobody won anything at all.
But hey, I'm making the best of the situation. I wrote my own tools, and as usual (conceited bastard that I am), I named the new project after myself: "git".
Linus
Thats up to him, Im just saying that before we all go off half cocked attacking Linus or Andrew we need the full story.
My own personal feelings on this are that Larry McVoy has over reacted in a major way over something that not even Microsoft has found a way to legally stop.
Just read through some of the posts and it does help explain a lot, however it still does seem as if Larry McVoy is chucking a massive Dummy Spit over something that we have yet to see how it could harm him or his company.
Sure Linus is pissed off, and I can see why, but putting ALL the blame on Andrew is not the way to go here. Larry shares part of the blame for going off the deep end without - in my opinion - just cause.
As I have said before once we hear from Andrew and get a complete picture of what exactly is going on then we can comment with more authority (or at least pretend to, this is Slashdot after all).
Look from initial reports, Andrew was not trying to reverse-engineer the whole damn system, just the free client. This would put it in section b rather than a.
Slashdot Mirror
Um okay I did the "mature" thing and checked out the report. The report is two years old and compares an RC version of w2k3/IIS6 against an old version of Redhat AS/Apache thus rendering it completely useless for doing an evaluation today. Not only that but it neglects to compare against other linux distributions such as SUSE or Mandrake thus rendering the "Windows better than Linux" claims deceptive at best.
To the proponents of "Intelligent Design" tell me this, which particular diety is your "Intelligent Designer"?
Is it the Judeo/Christian/Islamic God, Buhda, one of the Hindhu gods(theres plenty to choose from there)?
Let me know when you have decided and then tell me why without referring to any sort of religious text.
In any case, "morally straight", then and now, would include refraining from homosexual behavior.
Then yes, now depends on who you are talking to.
Sorry do they actually use the phrase "morally straight?"
Is that where Alexander Downer goes to relax after a hard day in the fishnets?
Sorry thats the gold coast. Adelaide is the "Really weird murder" capital of the country.
Never mind about ape shit, if I found someone doing this on our network, there would be large helpings of elephant shit and maybe some whale shit thrown in for good measure.
There are rules for accessing corporate networks and resources, you break those rules then expect to be punished for it.
Its a hell of a lot easier to parse and put into your news system if its in XML than HTML. HTML makes it look pretty, XML/RSS makes it look machine readable.
Yes, we have many (compared with western countries) pirate shops here
:). Sham Shoi Po (sp? its been that long) used to be famous for it, the police would raid one day and the shops would open up again pretty much the next. Lots of fun.
As I used to live in Hong Kong as a child in the mid eighties I can atest to this
90 Gigs of porn
So you backed everything up before blowing it away right?
What do we want!?
What ever meets our needs at the time
When do we want it?!
At a time that is convenient to both parties!!
Somehow it really doesn't have the same ring to it.
- Cool Things: You get to play with cool things that in your normal line of work you wouldn't normally get to do.
- Kudos: Believe it or not some people are motivated by other things than the all mighty dollar. Some coders like to be able to say "I did that" and recieve community recognition for it.
Just to point out that the majority of work done on the linux kernel is done by volunteers, many of whom are paid to code in different areas but make their kernel contributions for free.I have a brief Summary. Have a look if you like.
Please not I said that we had not heard from Tridgewell yet, I was going on the available information.
You've got the question round the wrong way, when did the government become a branch of Microsoft?
Not if Larry revoked the license. Revoking the license removes any restrictions imposed by said license.
No, from what I have read (keeping in mind we haven't heard Tridgewells side yet) it went something like this:
Larry: Someones trying to reverse engineer us, stop it or I'll take away BitKeeper
Linus: Okay I'll have a look. Ah its Tridge, Tridge please stop doing this Larry's saying he's going to take BitKeeper away
Tridge: Okay I'll stop (This is the important bit)
Larry: He hasn't stopped, thats it no BitKeeper for you!
Without hearing Tridgewells side of things thats whats being presented, Tridgewell said he would stop and then went on a head anyway. This would be what is pissing Linus off I think.
No IE is most heavily affected by the fact that some idiot thought it would be a good idea to tie the browser directly into the OS, thus meaning a security hole in IE is a security hole in the underlying OS.
As I have said before, if your biggest problem with Firefox is popups as opposed to root access attacks through IE then really Firefox is still ahead of the game.
Having read through some of whats been written on the site you linked too, this isn't "A slightly skeptical view", this is a thinly disguised, badly written hatchet job. From accusing Linus of "hijacking" the Minix community, to bringing up his fathers membership of the communist party and more.
Linus is not perfect god knows but he's not the conniving capitalist in communist clothing that site tries to paint him as.
Must remember to preview before posting. THe link is here.
Well my face is red
It is quite possible that this is what has happened, especially if Larry McVoy is making noises about legalities its not a bad idea. However I have read through the posts that Linus has made regarding this and having asked him a couple of questions myself I think Linus is starting to make a little bit more sense.
From what I can gather, he is more frustrated at the whole mess having happened in the first place when it didn't need to.
I posted a question to Linus on the realworld list and he actually replied and clarified his position.
Below is the text of his reply:
It's really neither of those. I don't think reverse-engineering is bad. It's quite natural to be inquisitive, and all questions of "how does this work" are "reverse engineering" to some degree. And I might have been pissed off at BitMover, except they bent ove rbackwards trying to figure out how to continue things as well as possible. So disappointed, yes. Mainly because the whole thing seems so pointless. The tool that tridge wrote ends up being useless, and nobody won anything at all. But hey, I'm making the best of the situation. I wrote my own tools, and as usual (conceited bastard that I am), I named the new project after myself: "git". Linus
Thats up to him, Im just saying that before we all go off half cocked attacking Linus or Andrew we need the full story.
My own personal feelings on this are that Larry McVoy has over reacted in a major way over something that not even Microsoft has found a way to legally stop.
Just read through some of the posts and it does help explain a lot, however it still does seem as if Larry McVoy is chucking a massive Dummy Spit over something that we have yet to see how it could harm him or his company.
Sure Linus is pissed off, and I can see why, but putting ALL the blame on Andrew is not the way to go here. Larry shares part of the blame for going off the deep end without - in my opinion - just cause.
As I have said before once we hear from Andrew and get a complete picture of what exactly is going on then we can comment with more authority (or at least pretend to, this is Slashdot after all).
Look from initial reports, Andrew was not trying to reverse-engineer the whole damn system, just the free client. This would put it in section b rather than a.