the type of people who would want a refund for their copy of windows is the same type of people who not buy a computer from a manufacturer.
This is true in most cases, and I won't argue. However, what happens when we want to get our hands on the latest AMD64 laptop? Our choices are limited. Generally, I just stick with buying XP home, but there has to be a better way, like opting not to buy it at all or selling it on ebay.
It's reasonable to say that this person was put in between a rock and a hard place in this situation, but theoretically the colo provider is responsible for their netblock. It's the colocation facility's fault if their netblock (or even an IP or two) ends up on a blocklist.
In this case the colocation facility is trying to transfer the blame from itself to "another one of its customers". That, to me, is irresponsible finger-pointing. The colocation provider promised uptime, and they should live up to it.
I guess I was wrong by writing "hosting provider". I should have said colo provider. The colo provider provides these customers with at least net addresses and internet connectivity. The point I was trying to make (good-of-the-many) still applies. The colocation company had harbored spammers (Even if they felt they were prudent in bringing the customer onboard), so THEY should suffer the punishment. The colo provider should lose customers because they were not diligent in checking out their customers, and ensuring they wouldn't spam.
In this situation, the colo provider would adapt by: A. Prudent checks on potential customers. A significant portion of lesser-known spammers spam by moving colo providers every time they are shut off. or B. Forcing their customers in that facility to relay through thier outbound servers. (I realize this is not exactly ideal, but it has the potential to become reality)
As far as your last paragraph, I understand your point. I'm stressing the importance and benefits of RBLs, I'm not trying to defend MAPS.
The good-of-the-many solution in the case you presented above is to leave (or at least threaten to leave) that hosting provider. This should motivate that hosting provider to be a good 'net citizen'. If a good rbl can drive away hundreds of customers from a spamming ISP, it has done its job. Its customers are gone, its funds are dried up, and it no longer has the patience to deal with rbls. If you are a customer of a spamming internet provider, you shouldn't complain about spam..you contribute funds to the place.
Now one might ask what happens when a new ISP takes that block over...We really don't know, the internet hasn't really been around long enough, but I'm sure some procedures will evolve.
Dude, you're asking this (assumed) mac fanboy to employ logic and rational. One time I had an argument with a guy who claimed that Catholocism could not be called a "religion", because it was true. I suspect that the argument I had, and the suggestion you are making will share the same fate. Besides, you're also doing this on/., you _do_ get modded down for not being an Apple fan here.
In any case, I know Mac users who do realize Apple is fallible, but they are rare and you probably won't find them on/.
If they had been smarter, they would only have redirected defunct sites instead of cnn.com and the rest of the.com TLD.
Since the traffic to cnn.com is substantially higher than a typical defunct.com, isn't it expected that they would use cnn.com? I would assume that using a defunct domain would net them so few clicks (compared to cnn.com) that it would come close to negating the motivation to hijack at all. Just wondering...
Except that there is nothing to say that the 0 day server would have to even offer the person encryption (So the person wouldn't be prompted for an invalid certificate). Unless the person actually noticed the secure symbol missing from their browser, they would never know. I doubt many people notice this missing. Even if they did notice the secure symbol missing, it's likely they would think to themselves "Well, maybe it only shows up AFTER I log in.", in a case like that, they'd be a little too late...
This is a DNS server issue, not a client issue. Suppose you visit citibank.com often. citibank.com is at 192.168.0.1 (It's an example). If the dns server you normally query has been poisened, it could potentially give you 10.0.0.1 (that's an example too). 10.0.0.1 could be a quick 0 day citibank look alike setup in korea with the sole purpose of grabbing your username,password,acct number, etc. The real citibank.com would never know that this happened, and there is a real chance the person who ran your dns server wouldn't know either. There are no 10 minute preventative measures one could do to protect themselves on this one, outside of using a known good dns resolver. Even then, you have to know the the dns server the resolver uses is good...
Harnessed the power? Not quite! We still don't have an intimate understand how a neutron breaks down! How you can even begin to claim that "we've already solved that the whole atom issue", I don't know. Leftist? Not quite. Besides, I not ignorant enough to assign myself, or anyone for that matter, to a "left side" or a "right side".
The usefulness is far from over, I suspect that many more anomalies will be discovered by these probes. If you consider anomalies useless, then there is no reason to argue with you, you don't understand science. I mean hell, who the hell needs particle accelerators, all they do is detect and measure shit while costing taxpayers lot of money that could be spent on gas, oil and legal cases for people in persistent vegetative states!
I called him Monkey Boy because of his remarkable resemblance to monkies, get over it.
Check out #8. With probes and activities like this, we observe our universe. We EXPLORE our universe. We do what mankind should be best at. There, we list 13 things that do not make sense. We should have 100,000! Instead, we're down here on earth fucking around with religion and arguing over whether Monkey Boy Bush should be president or not.
The once Dominant Super Power of Earth is a filthy, corrupt steaming mass of what it used to be. One of the most widely viewed things in the world is the super bowl! The fucking super bowl! The most degenerate form of ape sports we could come up with!
We're going fucking blow ourselves up with Nukes before we've even opened our eyes because fucks like you are too afraid to get out of the fucking crib!
To those who call things like this useless, I say FUCK YOU, go back to your fucking super bowl and your Popes funeral and let us fucking explore.
Not picking on you specifically, but ideas like that are what perpetuate our biochromatic rainbow of political ideals*.
You see: If you're a democrat, you hate guns but approve of abortion. If you're a republican, you support Tort law protecting corporations and you don't support stem cell research.
Surely America deserves YOUR opinion, not one of some entity that decides for you? Now you might say that the examples I give are wrong, or you do infact align exactly with those statements, but those are the trees, there is a whole forest in there.
Do what you like, I don't care, but at least don't spread those kinds of things to my kids.
* - Shamefully stolen from America - A citizens guide to democracy inaction.
The U.S.A.? Hahahahahaha. Hahahahahaha. Hahahahahaha.
You have to be out of your mind!
Re:Probably worth mentioning...
on
Hacking Mac OS X
·
· Score: 2, Insightful
So people have to own macs to have honest opinions of them? It couldn't be something like:
1. Person had one, but sold it. 2. Person worked on/with them at his place of employment. 3. Person used on at his friends house. 4. Person actually understands the issue at hand.
Nice attempt at invalidating his comment, should work for more gullible slashdotters.
I'd run it in a heartbeat it it wasn't in java... Seriously, I've tried, and the installation failed. Please, please please please give me a C or python client. I'd have it running on at 3+ machines with 100mbs connections.
Colorado doesn't have a proven track record of being efficient (or prudent) with anything. The city (Denver & Surrounding), county and state governments are so fucked up it makes me want to cry every time I think about it. Although EDS may deserve some of the blame, Colorado gets quite a bit just for being dumb.
Yeah, I did something about it. I moved.
Oh yeah, the big yellow pollution cloud didn't help either.
Not that I know of, but I sure hope for your sake that your neighborhood doesn't turn into a statistic. Thanks for signing that petition, btw, it's nice to see that some don't slam the doors on those people, as some of them are genuinely concerned.
Fair enough, we know who to blame. Now what do we do to fix it? Sure BoA is taking reasonable steps to avoid this happening, and I'm sure every other company this has happened to would say the same. The question is, what now? We can't stop the thieves, I can only see two maybe three possible options:
#1. Make it more difficult to steal data. I feel this is what will probably be done, but then this problem is only mitigated, not fixed. #2. Change the nature of the data. Make it useless to steal. Got your loan number/SSN/etc stolen? No big deal, it's useless now. #3. Third parties popping up, offering secure databackups, transfers, the whole 9 yards, and more importantly, accountability. I think this is already happening, but it's not an everyday thing.
Of these, I vote for #2. Anyone have any other ideas?
That's just it, TFA points out how it's _not_ just a bunch of gobbledy-gook and mumbo jumbo. To demonstrate, it gives the first paragraph from GAIM's EULA, seen here:
"GAIN Publishing offers some of the most popular software available on the Internet free of charge ("GAIN-Supported Software") in exchange for your agreement to also install GAIN AdServer software ("GAIN"), which will display Pop-Up, Pop-Under, and other types of ads on your computer based on the information we collect as stated in this Privacy Statement. We refer to consumers who have GAIN on their system as 'Subscribers.' "
The closed universe/collapse model, based on our current best understanding is dead, dead, dead. Only something very surprising about the time evolution of dark energy would seem to be able to alter this conclusion.
I'd really like to read more about this and why it's dead. Are there other plausible theories that wikipedia.org does not mention?
I wasn't trying to make a point with file systems (I personally run reiser and xfs), I was simply trying to point out to these ignorant fucks who just read marketing brochures that being acid compliant (and even, gasp, using postgres) still doesn't protect against this:
Slashdot Mirror
the type of people who would want a refund for their copy of windows is the same type of people who not buy a computer from a manufacturer.
This is true in most cases, and I won't argue. However, what happens when we want to get our hands on the latest AMD64 laptop? Our choices are limited. Generally, I just stick with buying XP home, but there has to be a better way, like opting not to buy it at all or selling it on ebay.
It's reasonable to say that this person was put in between a rock and a hard place in this situation, but theoretically the colo provider is responsible for their netblock. It's the colocation facility's fault if their netblock (or even an IP or two) ends up on a blocklist.
In this case the colocation facility is trying to transfer the blame from itself to "another one of its customers". That, to me, is irresponsible finger-pointing. The colocation provider promised uptime, and they should live up to it.
I guess I was wrong by writing "hosting provider". I should have said colo provider.
The colo provider provides these customers with at least net addresses and internet connectivity. The point I was trying to make (good-of-the-many) still applies. The colocation company had harbored spammers (Even if they felt they were prudent in bringing the customer onboard), so THEY should suffer the punishment. The colo provider should lose customers because they were not diligent in checking out their customers, and ensuring they wouldn't spam.
In this situation, the colo provider would adapt by:
A. Prudent checks on potential customers. A significant portion of lesser-known spammers spam by moving colo providers every time they are shut off.
or
B. Forcing their customers in that facility to relay through thier outbound servers. (I realize this is not exactly ideal, but it has the potential to become reality)
As far as your last paragraph, I understand your point. I'm stressing the importance and benefits of RBLs, I'm not trying to defend MAPS.
While I don't disagree with you, I thought it'd be worthwhile to point out this post:
4 7237&tid=111&tid=187&tid=95&tid=4
http://ask.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/04/05/1
The good-of-the-many solution in the case you presented above is to leave (or at least threaten to leave) that hosting provider. This should motivate that hosting provider to be a good 'net citizen'. If a good rbl can drive away hundreds of customers from a spamming ISP, it has done its job. Its customers are gone, its funds are dried up, and it no longer has the patience to deal with rbls. If you are a customer of a spamming internet provider, you shouldn't complain about spam..you contribute funds to the place.
Now one might ask what happens when a new ISP takes that block over...We really don't know, the internet hasn't really been around long enough, but I'm sure some procedures will evolve.
Dude, you're asking this (assumed) mac fanboy to employ logic and rational. /., you _do_ get modded down for not being an Apple fan here.
/.
One time I had an argument with a guy who claimed that Catholocism could not be called a "religion", because it was true.
I suspect that the argument I had, and the suggestion you are making will share the same fate.
Besides, you're also doing this on
In any case, I know Mac users who do realize Apple is fallible, but they are rare and you probably won't find them on
That's an excellent article, thank you.
.com TLD.
.com, isn't it expected that they would use cnn.com? I would assume that using a defunct domain would net them so few clicks (compared to cnn.com) that it would come close to negating the motivation to hijack at all. Just wondering...
If they had been smarter, they would only have redirected defunct sites instead of cnn.com and the rest of the
Since the traffic to cnn.com is substantially higher than a typical defunct
Except that there is nothing to say that the 0 day server would have to even offer the person encryption (So the person wouldn't be prompted for an invalid certificate).
Unless the person actually noticed the secure symbol missing from their browser, they would never know. I doubt many people notice this missing.
Even if they did notice the secure symbol missing, it's likely they would think to themselves "Well, maybe it only shows up AFTER I log in.", in a case like that, they'd be a little too late...
This is a DNS server issue, not a client issue.
Suppose you visit citibank.com often. citibank.com is at 192.168.0.1 (It's an example). If the dns server you normally query has been poisened, it could potentially give you 10.0.0.1 (that's an example too). 10.0.0.1 could be a quick 0 day citibank look alike setup in korea with the sole purpose of grabbing your username,password,acct number, etc.
The real citibank.com would never know that this happened, and there is a real chance the person who ran your dns server wouldn't know either.
There are no 10 minute preventative measures one could do to protect themselves on this one, outside of using a known good dns resolver. Even then, you have to know the the dns server the resolver uses is good...
Harnessed the power? Not quite!
We still don't have an intimate understand how a neutron breaks down! How you can even begin to claim that "we've already solved that the whole atom issue", I don't know.
Leftist? Not quite. Besides, I not ignorant enough to assign myself, or anyone for that matter, to a "left side" or a "right side".
The usefulness is far from over, I suspect that many more anomalies will be discovered by these probes. If you consider anomalies useless, then there is no reason to argue with you, you don't understand science. I mean hell, who the hell needs particle accelerators, all they do is detect and measure shit while costing taxpayers lot of money that could be spent on gas, oil and legal cases for people in persistent vegetative states!
I called him Monkey Boy because of his remarkable resemblance to monkies, get over it.
http://www.newscientist.com/channel/space/mg185249 11.600
Check out #8. With probes and activities like this, we observe our universe. We EXPLORE our universe. We do what mankind should be best at.
There, we list 13 things that do not make sense. We should have 100,000! Instead, we're down here on earth fucking around with religion and arguing over whether Monkey Boy Bush should be president or not.
The once Dominant Super Power of Earth is a filthy, corrupt steaming mass of what it used to be.
One of the most widely viewed things in the world is the super bowl! The fucking super bowl! The most degenerate form of ape sports we could come up with!
We're going fucking blow ourselves up with Nukes before we've even opened our eyes because fucks like you are too afraid to get out of the fucking crib!
To those who call things like this useless, I say FUCK YOU, go back to your fucking super bowl and your Popes funeral and let us fucking explore.
Not picking on you specifically, but ideas like that are what perpetuate our biochromatic rainbow of political ideals*.
You see:
If you're a democrat, you hate guns but approve of abortion.
If you're a republican, you support Tort law protecting corporations and you don't support stem cell research.
Surely America deserves YOUR opinion, not one of some entity that decides for you? Now you might say that the examples I give are wrong, or you do infact align exactly with those statements, but those are the trees, there is a whole forest in there.
Do what you like, I don't care, but at least don't spread those kinds of things to my kids.
* - Shamefully stolen from America - A citizens guide to democracy inaction.
This is ridiculous.
Will a mod with balls please mod this back up?
These guys are _NOT_ trolling.
The American "liberal" is not infallible.
Quit using gnome, try xfce.
here
Which government?
The U.S.A.? Hahahahahaha. Hahahahahaha. Hahahahahaha.
You have to be out of your mind!
So people have to own macs to have honest opinions of them?
It couldn't be something like:
1. Person had one, but sold it.
2. Person worked on/with them at his place of employment.
3. Person used on at his friends house.
4. Person actually understands the issue at hand.
Nice attempt at invalidating his comment, should work for more gullible slashdotters.
n00b...
I'd run it in a heartbeat it it wasn't in java...
Seriously, I've tried, and the installation failed.
Please, please please please give me a C or python client. I'd have it running on at 3+ machines with 100mbs connections.
Colorado doesn't have a proven track record of being efficient (or prudent) with anything. The city (Denver & Surrounding), county and state governments are so fucked up it makes me want to cry every time I think about it. Although EDS may deserve some of the blame, Colorado gets quite a bit just for being dumb.
Yeah, I did something about it. I moved.
Oh yeah, the big yellow pollution cloud didn't help
either.
Not that I know of, but I sure hope for your sake that your neighborhood doesn't turn into a statistic.
Thanks for signing that petition, btw, it's nice to see that some don't slam the doors on those people, as some of them are genuinely concerned.
Fair enough, we know who to blame.
Now what do we do to fix it? Sure BoA is taking reasonable steps to avoid this happening, and I'm sure every other company this has happened to would say the same. The question is, what now?
We can't stop the thieves, I can only see two maybe three possible options:
#1. Make it more difficult to steal data. I feel this is what will probably be done, but then this problem is only mitigated, not fixed.
#2. Change the nature of the data. Make it useless to steal. Got your loan number/SSN/etc stolen? No big deal, it's useless now.
#3. Third parties popping up, offering secure databackups, transfers, the whole 9 yards, and more importantly, accountability. I think this is already happening, but it's not an everyday thing.
Of these, I vote for #2. Anyone have any other ideas?
That's just it, TFA points out how it's _not_ just a bunch of gobbledy-gook and mumbo jumbo. To demonstrate, it gives the first paragraph from GAIM's EULA, seen here:
"GAIN Publishing offers some of the most popular software available on the Internet free of charge ("GAIN-Supported Software") in exchange for your agreement to also install GAIN AdServer software ("GAIN"), which will display Pop-Up, Pop-Under, and other types of ads on your computer based on the information we collect as stated in this Privacy Statement. We refer to consumers who have GAIN on their system as 'Subscribers.' "
You, sir, have made my week.
Thanks.
The closed universe/collapse model, based on our current best understanding is dead, dead, dead. Only something very surprising about the time evolution of dark energy would seem to be able to alter this conclusion.
I'd really like to read more about this and why it's dead. Are there other plausible theories that wikipedia.org does not mention?
I wasn't trying to make a point with file systems (I personally run reiser and xfs), I was simply trying to point out to these ignorant fucks who just read marketing brochures that being acid compliant (and even, gasp, using postgres) still doesn't protect against this:
7 50780
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=140219&cid=11
But, considering they're mostly ACs, it's probably just the same guy and he doesn't have enough balls to put his name behind it.
Yes, They'd just use a strand of creeper!