Bad from to reply to one's own post and all that but I just had a look at the pdf link in TFS. IMHO the director was correct to dismiss this internal lobbying effort as politically inspired nonsense, he should have gone further and sacked the fucker, either for corruption or incompetence.
My comment about the tabacoo industry was kinda "spooky", as well as being shills for the FF industry (texaco) these people are also shills for the tabacco industry (phillip morris). Accepting the OPINION of the CEI on climate is like accepting Attila the Hun's opinion on human rights. I hope the press make a big deal out of this, perhaps it will get people digging up more dirt on the CEI's un-named sponsers and their influence on past decisions.
Gore studied climate science at Harvard under Roger Revelle before switching to an art degree. Besides Gore presented the IPCC reports he did not claim to do otherwise. If you are base your opinion of ANY scientific claim on the character or authority of the messenger then you are doing it wrong.
The only problem I have with a government department quashing a psuedo-skeptical report is if they do it in secret, I don't know if this is the case since i haven't RTFA. If this guys opinion is different to every reputable science institution on the planet then he should be allowed make a fool of himself by speaking to the press provided he makes it clear he does not represent his employer.
There are only a handfull of credible scientists world wide who disagree with parts of the much maligned consensus (the only one I can think of is Dyson). This is despite the fountain of anti-science bullshit from think tanks such as the Heartland Institute. The science has prevailed over the lobbyists as it did with the tabacco industry in the 80's and countless other extrodinary claims since the time of Copurnicus.
"Which countries would you recommend in terms of freedom and privacy? Distance is not an issue, though a reasonable level of stability and provision of public services would be a bonus."
,
Let me get this straight, you want freedom AND government?
"the size of Britain as a whole doesn't have anything to do with people's ability to commute"
Well said, Autralia is almost as big as the US in area and has less people than the city of New York. During the 70's oil crisis Australia did the same as the UK and whacked an excise on petrol (38%). The papers were full of economic alarmists claiming everyone would be in the poorhouse, never happened. Same deal when Australia implemented a UHC system in the seventies, ruination they cried but it never happened. What did happen is Australians bought more economical cars and now have cheaper, more effective heath care than the US.
Interesting post. Many dogs in Queensland have learnt to lick cane toads and get high (as opposed to eating them and dropping dead). My favorite drunken animal story is about a heard of Indian elephants who broke into a a village storehouse and drank several barrels of grog, when they had finished drinking what was in the storehouse they ripped the rets of the village to bits looking for more.
I'm 50 and have smoked for 35yrs now, short term memory is screwed when stoned but when straight I don't seem to have any more "senior moments" than other non-smokers my age.
"Comparing the effect of eating poppies to the effect of smoking opium is similar to comparing the effect of eating marijuana to the effect of smoking hashish."
Joe quit the republican party and aquired his own publicist and corporate sponsers. He is doing just fine as an author, commentator, motivational speaker and proprietor of the "Securing the American Dream" think tank.
"They call it the American dream because you have to be asleep to believe it" - Carlin.
Groups like UK-FACT are fucking bullies, they deliberately pick on the little fish in the hope they can set some kind of precedent they can use as a weapon against bigger fish.
Yeah, I agree with you. The problem with cattle is that they clear forests to grow them and their feedstocks, ie: it's a land use problem not a methane problem, cows themselves have nothing to do with the current high levels of methane.
The excess methane is thought to come from peat exposed by the poleward retreat of permafrost in the N. Hemisphere. Methane sources are the least understood of the GHG sources and climate models have historically done a poor job of predicting the concentration trend.
Not picking on you personally but this whole filter thing is a beat up and always has been. The filter is NOT mandatory except for government computers (eg schools, librarys, etc). It will never be mandatory for private computers because the little game our two major parties play with this topic is far too valuable a tool for manipulating independent senators and distracting competing special interest groups, neither side wants to stop playing it.
"When a cow eats hay or corn, it's just being a middleman in that cycle. The cow would offset a number of insects, bacteria, fungus, and other animals that would be processing the carbon and releasing it into the air too."
The cow is more a container than a middleman since it's the bacteria inside the cows stomach producing the gasses./pedant
Here is one of my sources, note that Keppler et al's plant idea has been debunked since that article, meaning that peat is the main source of methane.
RC's opinion on cows is almost an after thought: "Agricultural emission, from rice farming and ruminant animals, is not so easy to quantify either, but we'll leave a description of that to the reader's imagination."
"False -- growing grain for cattle consumption is not carbon neutral."
Although I think AGW is a serious problem as summarised in the IPCC reports I think the cow beltch thing is a bit of a red herring, sure it takes fuel for tractors/trucks to produce/transport the feedstock for the minority of cattle that are not raised on pasture but apart from that it's a closed loop.
If you are talking about clearing forests to raise cattle then that is indeed a big problem but it's a land use problem not a cow beltch problem.
I have looked at the science over the past 3 decades and I'm certainly not sticking up for politcally inspired psuedo-skeptics here but if you have some evidence that I'm wrong can you post a link pointing out what I am missing?
"What I'm saying is that doing any specific action "to stop global warming" could have unforeseen consequences. Nature has a way of balancing things, and a sudden drop in methane production could have an effect on our climate besides "stopping global warming"".
I don't know where the notion that "when one stops shitting in ones own nest it will somehow create more shit in the nest" comes from, but I find it absurd. I also find the "cow beltch problem" absurd since (apart from sunshine) it's a closed loop, ie: Cow->Methane->CO2+H2O->Grass->Cow
Same here, unless they offer to buy a smoke off me. This leads me to think that pissing in someones pocket will elicit more cooperation than talking to either ear.
Slashdot Mirror
Bad from to reply to one's own post and all that but I just had a look at the pdf link in TFS. IMHO the director was correct to dismiss this internal lobbying effort as politically inspired nonsense, he should have gone further and sacked the fucker, either for corruption or incompetence.
My comment about the tabacoo industry was kinda "spooky", as well as being shills for the FF industry (texaco) these people are also shills for the tabacco industry (phillip morris). Accepting the OPINION of the CEI on climate is like accepting Attila the Hun's opinion on human rights. I hope the press make a big deal out of this, perhaps it will get people digging up more dirt on the CEI's un-named sponsers and their influence on past decisions.
Gore studied climate science at Harvard under Roger Revelle before switching to an art degree. Besides Gore presented the IPCC reports he did not claim to do otherwise. If you are base your opinion of ANY scientific claim on the character or authority of the messenger then you are doing it wrong.
The only problem I have with a government department quashing a psuedo-skeptical report is if they do it in secret, I don't know if this is the case since i haven't RTFA. If this guys opinion is different to every reputable science institution on the planet then he should be allowed make a fool of himself by speaking to the press provided he makes it clear he does not represent his employer.
There are only a handfull of credible scientists world wide who disagree with parts of the much maligned consensus (the only one I can think of is Dyson). This is despite the fountain of anti-science bullshit from think tanks such as the Heartland Institute. The science has prevailed over the lobbyists as it did with the tabacco industry in the 80's and countless other extrodinary claims since the time of Copurnicus.
"Which countries would you recommend in terms of freedom and privacy? Distance is not an issue, though a reasonable level of stability and provision of public services would be a bonus."
,
Let me get this straight, you want freedom AND government?
"the size of Britain as a whole doesn't have anything to do with people's ability to commute"
Well said, Autralia is almost as big as the US in area and has less people than the city of New York. During the 70's oil crisis Australia did the same as the UK and whacked an excise on petrol (38%). The papers were full of economic alarmists claiming everyone would be in the poorhouse, never happened. Same deal when Australia implemented a UHC system in the seventies, ruination they cried but it never happened. What did happen is Australians bought more economical cars and now have cheaper, more effective heath care than the US.
"And energy rationing, by this name or any other, spells death for the economy. They might as well call it the "starve and freeze" bill."
IIRC $150 a barrel didn't "spell death for the economy".
"Consumption taxes can be fair, logical, and effective. I know reducing consumption is anti-American, but tough shit."
Why is the most insightfull comment in this entire thread at 0-flamebait?
"I don't think any of this is new" said Alice while grooming herself in front of the looking glass.
When I was in HS a freind of mine sold a younger kid a bag of "magic" mushrooms he bought at the supermarket.
Interesting post. Many dogs in Queensland have learnt to lick cane toads and get high (as opposed to eating them and dropping dead). My favorite drunken animal story is about a heard of Indian elephants who broke into a a village storehouse and drank several barrels of grog, when they had finished drinking what was in the storehouse they ripped the rets of the village to bits looking for more.
I'm 50 and have smoked for 35yrs now, short term memory is screwed when stoned but when straight I don't seem to have any more "senior moments" than other non-smokers my age.
"Comparing the effect of eating poppies to the effect of smoking opium is similar to comparing the effect of eating marijuana to the effect of smoking hashish."
Cookie moster loves COOKIEEES.
Joe quit the republican party and aquired his own publicist and corporate sponsers. He is doing just fine as an author, commentator, motivational speaker and proprietor of the "Securing the American Dream" think tank.
"They call it the American dream because you have to be asleep to believe it" - Carlin.
Groups like UK-FACT are fucking bullies, they deliberately pick on the little fish in the hope they can set some kind of precedent they can use as a weapon against bigger fish.
Yeah, I agree with you. The problem with cattle is that they clear forests to grow them and their feedstocks, ie: it's a land use problem not a methane problem, cows themselves have nothing to do with the current high levels of methane.
The excess methane is thought to come from peat exposed by the poleward retreat of permafrost in the N. Hemisphere. Methane sources are the least understood of the GHG sources and climate models have historically done a poor job of predicting the concentration trend.
"There is only one Solar System in the entire galaxy."
Rubbish, there is a google ad that keeps appearing on slashdot offering "1000 free solar systems"?
"The world has gone mad."
When was it ever sane?
Not picking on you personally but this whole filter thing is a beat up and always has been. The filter is NOT mandatory except for government computers (eg schools, librarys, etc). It will never be mandatory for private computers because the little game our two major parties play with this topic is far too valuable a tool for manipulating independent senators and distracting competing special interest groups, neither side wants to stop playing it.
"When a cow eats hay or corn, it's just being a middleman in that cycle. The cow would offset a number of insects, bacteria, fungus, and other animals that would be processing the carbon and releasing it into the air too."
/pedant
The cow is more a container than a middleman since it's the bacteria inside the cows stomach producing the gasses.
Here is one of my sources, note that Keppler et al's plant idea has been debunked since that article, meaning that peat is the main source of methane.
RC's opinion on cows is almost an after thought: "Agricultural emission, from rice farming and ruminant animals, is not so easy to quantify either, but we'll leave a description of that to the reader's imagination."
That makes sense. Thanks for clearing it up.
"False -- growing grain for cattle consumption is not carbon neutral."
Although I think AGW is a serious problem as summarised in the IPCC reports I think the cow beltch thing is a bit of a red herring, sure it takes fuel for tractors/trucks to produce/transport the feedstock for the minority of cattle that are not raised on pasture but apart from that it's a closed loop.
If you are talking about clearing forests to raise cattle then that is indeed a big problem but it's a land use problem not a cow beltch problem.
I have looked at the science over the past 3 decades and I'm certainly not sticking up for politcally inspired psuedo-skeptics here but if you have some evidence that I'm wrong can you post a link pointing out what I am missing?
"What I'm saying is that doing any specific action "to stop global warming" could have unforeseen consequences. Nature has a way of balancing things, and a sudden drop in methane production could have an effect on our climate besides "stopping global warming"".
I don't know where the notion that "when one stops shitting in ones own nest it will somehow create more shit in the nest" comes from, but I find it absurd. I also find the "cow beltch problem" absurd since (apart from sunshine) it's a closed loop, ie: Cow->Methane->CO2+H2O->Grass->Cow
...because I can't believe I'm in full agreement with one of your posts on GHG's.
What wine do you recommend for red salmon?
Same here, unless they offer to buy a smoke off me. This leads me to think that pissing in someones pocket will elicit more cooperation than talking to either ear.
LMFAO - I love the irony of creationists who call me a fool, you are giving me similar belly-laughs.