consider staff:
you need a certain number of people to ensure 24x7 service at a constant level of quality for a single server farm. yet you do not need twice as many people to cover twice as many servers. furthermore, over time, utilities and procedures will make the most commonn problems easier to deal with, and the bug fixes will make exceptions less frequent. server-maintenance staffing costs fall as the game becomes more popular and the game ages.
Not quite true. Customer Service (CS) actually gets more expensive as you get bigger, since you have to deal with more interactions between players. Most of your CS for an online game is billing and what we lovingly refer to as "babysitting" in the industry (resolving arguments, stopping harassment, etc). As you get more people, you have a constant increase in billing problems and a factorial increase in problems between players. To put it in geek terms, maintaining the same level of CS as you grow is a O(n!) problem in terms of cost. That should scare you.
Of course, many times games will let this slide. CS is seen as a cost center, and many times companies will do what they can to reduce costs. This includes things like putting up knowledge bases and having in-game volunteers help with simple issues.
Other costs grow incredibly fast as well. Once you start having a game the size of EverQuest (or even larger), you start needing a lot more than what your average co-location facility can handle. You have to essentially start your own NOC in order to maintain the level of service expected for these games. The biggest network services provider in Korea is NCSoft; NCSoft is the creator of the game Lineage, which is estimated to be at least 2x the size of EverQuest. (This information is a bit old, so it might be different now.)
But, you can cut down a lot of costs and remain profitable on the small scale. My own game, Meridian 59 has a very low overhead and remains profitable even with a fairly modest subscriber base.
Some information from someone running an online game for a living.:)
Ah, we need to update that.:) That was speaking of other international servers that were running the game from the old 3DO days.
There are servers in the US and Germany currently. My company, Near Death Studios, Inc. owns worldwide rights (purchased from 3DO) and runs the U.S. version of the game. We also have a German licensee running a German version of the game.
We've been quite busy with the game lately, updating the old software rendering engine to a more modern hardware rendering engine with neat features like dynamic lighting. You can see some of the screenshots at Warcry News, which show some nice before-and-after shots of the game with the two rendering engines.
My point still stands, however: M59 would be dead today if it were only a console game. It simply does not have the numbers to make it as profitable as larger companies prefer. The game focuses on a niche (hard-core PvP combat) that a core group of people think is lacking in other games; however, this core group is not large enough to be of notice to console publishers.
As someone running an online game, there is one thing that will set the PC apart from consoles in the online arena: niche games. I can make a reasonable (if lean) living off of running Meridian 59 for a few thousand players. There were probably more people playing Phantasy Star Online (PSO) on the Dreamcast, but that got shut down while M59 continues to live on. M59 is able to offer a serious PvP game (which is a very niche product) for a much more select audience.
One benefit of the PC is that it's easier to develop games for it on a limited budget. Console development is expensive, starting with the development kit you have to buy for the cost of the entire budget of some indie games. Therefore, most console games are very expensive to make, and selling less than 50k units is considered terrible. On the PC side of things, you can make a game that will target a few thousand players and be profitable. So, it's easier to "take risks" on the PC.
I expect to see a rise in independent games in the online medium on the PC. Our company's next project is for the PC (and hopefully Linux!) because the costs to develop the game are cheaper. A look at Puzzle Pirates shows a cool game that would never make it as a console game. It's really unfortunate, seeing as how Puzzle Pirates is a great idea and a fun game that most likely wouldn't push the millions of units to make it truly profitable on a console.
So, in summary: online PC gaming isn't dead. I expect to see the larger companies like EA follow the dollars as they always have. But for true gameplayers, things will probably look better after a short while.
The problem is that democracy doesn't really work in commercial worlds. You can get up on your high horse and complain about democracy, but the reality of the situation is that players expect the people running and profiting from the game to handle the problems.
Imagine of there were undeniable proof that 1) a deity exists, and 2) he/she/it listens to people and can be influenced by people. Do you think people would still handle their own problems? Through history we've had people lament the unfairness of the deity(ies) even without conclusive proof he/she/it/they exist.
In my own game, Meridian 59, there is an elected position in the game that allows players to give "pardons" to other players that have murdered others. This position takes a lot of effort to win, because there is always someone wishing to control that power for their own benefit. Trying to run the position and be fair to the population of the game is very hard, and completely unfun for all but a small group of people. Most people would rather have the admins interfere with the system than have to work to keep things in check.
Further, the company exists to make money. Having someone expose the underbelly of a world intended to be someplace for people to go chat and have fun isn't exactly good for business. While Ludlow is obviously doing some interesting things along the lines of reseach, he is equally obviously being confrontational in his work. There are many things he could have done that would have been beneficial to the world and not harmful to Maxis. He could have talked about the issues he found in The Sims Online without naming the exact service much as doctors refer to patient studies without including the patients' names in the studies. He could have also went to Maxis with this information before he put it on a web page.
Finally, what is Maxis supposed to do about this issue? Have a CS representative drop in and say, "I've noticed you've used the words 'penis' and/or 'vagina' or associated colloqual terms at least 5 times in the last 5 minutes. Are you having cybersex? Could I see some ID to make sure no one here is underage?" Yeah, that'll go over really well with the players.
In my own game world people murder each other all the time, sometimes to the point that groups of people will leave the game. I take no steps to prevent it. Does this make me a genocidal tyrant? Anyone who says "yes" needs to get outside more.;)
As a game developer, I find it interesting that this question comes up so often. Where's the posts about whether or not movie directors should listen to viewer feedback when creating movie or a sequel? The best we hope for is some small focus groups giving a thumbs up or down in an "advanced screening" of a movie. (Usually resulting in a hastily tacked-on "happy ending" to please the audience.) Do you think script writers really go out and look for suggestions on how to write a movie script? Do you think every bit of feedback from every movie is recorded by the big movie studios?
You could also apply this to authors and books. Wait, maybe that's a good idea; then Stephenson's fiction might actually have a satisfying ending.;)
This isn't to say that feedback isn't useful or should be completely ignored, however. But, knowing how to filter the useful from the less useful suggestions is a important (and time-consuming) thing to do.
I play games with my better half. Of course, being a game developer she's more tolerant of my gaming interests than most people might, otherwise she would have left me a long time ago.
Turn-based strategy is good. Heroes of Might and Magic is great (I recommend 3, but 2 is good. You'll probably find 4 in the stores, but it's a bit more complicated with less interesting gameplay than 2 or 3 had.) The upside is that you can play for a bit and then save the game without too much fuss; good for that 1 hour of play per night plan if that's wht you want. The downside is that games can take a VERY long time, especially waiting for the other to complete the turn.
Real-time strategy is also cool. My GF and I play Age of Empires 2 (with expansion). There's an option for both people to play the same civilization. A 2-on-2 game where you and your GF play one civ with a computer ally against 2 other computer enemies is a real blast. You should be able to find the game cheap, since it's a bit old. The newer version, Age of Mythology, wasn't quite as captivating. The upside the game is cheap and runs on fairly modest hardware. The downside is that there's a big jump in difficulty levels from too easy to pretty difficult, so there's a large gap in the learning curve.
You could also look at online RPGs. I'm a bit biased towards these because I run one, Meridian 59. There are several people that play together. These games are a lot of fun when you play together in the same room, chatting back and forth. In a PvP-focused game, like Meridian 59, you can coordinate your strategies easier. A friend of mine started playing M59 recently with his wife. Even though she thought she'd hate PvP, she really enjoyed the political aspects of organizing a guild. Upside: You can meet and talk to lots of interesting people. Downside: Just like any other group of people, there's idiots to deal with. Online games can also end up taking a lot of time as you want to log on and maintain friendships; it's something you have to plan to do in moderation.
Hope this was at least semi-interesting, even though it'll get lost in the crowd.;)
It's interesting to see that the online RPG market is already turning to sequels, licenses, and derivatives after less than a decade of wide-spread commercial attention. It seems that the large game publishers are falling back on what they know in order to maximize profit.
It's a bit unfortunate, because the online medium deserves a lot better than that. You can do some very cool and interesting things online that you simply cannot do with traditional single-player games. The social dimensions these games and worlds can explore are astounding.
I think that in the future we'll see the rise of more 'independent' games. My own company, Near Death Studios, runs Meridian 59, a classic game with a strong focus on PvP. We are willing to cater to the smaller market that wants meaningful PvP in their game. There are plenty of other games out there, including the rather unique A Tale In The Desert that offers an entirely non-combat world. I think that as more people are able to take bold steps in developing an indie game, you will see more options out there. My hope is that the indie games will be able to offer people more of what they want, instead of just trying to slap a license into an online world where it doesn't fit, or build a sequel of a game that should last a long time. By offering people a more focused experience, instead of pandering to a mythical "mass-market audience" for these games, the indies will hopefully show the power of the online medium.
Of course, if only it were that easy. Players have to actually support these games for them to grow. Yeah, indie games are as a rule less pretty and less polished than big-name games. But, if the gameplay is more of what you like, why not support them? The gameplay is arguably the reason why people play these games. Also, most of the smaller games can't afford big advertising budgets like the large games do. EQ has probably spent more on advertising than ATITD has spent on game development as a whole, so obviously more people are going to hear about EQ rather than ATITD. So, people need to do a bit more searching for these games. In the end, I think it's the best option to keep the online medium intersting and fun for the most people.
My crazy opinions as an indie online game developer.
I'll have to agree. I think that getting out there and playing a variety of games is better than being told what games to play.
As a professional, independent game developer, I find the lists useless. I consider myself a pretty serious gamer and a student of game history, but I barely know half the games there.
One of the biggest issues is that a lot of the older games are mostly lost to time. I played arcade games obsessively as a kid, but I only really got to play some of the classics due to the involvement some of my friends have with emulation. I didn't appreciate a game like Robotron when I was 10, and paying $1k+ (plus shipping!) to get a live machine seems a bit insane. People looking for a legal way to play these classic games are mostly out of luck.
You can say the same thing about older consoles and computers, too. Strict copyright enforcement and the ravages of time have made some classic games very hard to find and play. Finding legal copies of these games is damn near impossible.
Further, the lists focus on big-name games. Ultima is mentioned, but what about the critically acclaimed games produced by Spiderweb Software? Is the Exile series less worthy of attention just because it is "shareware" instead of being published by a large company? Why does Anarchy Online get a mention on the lists when it is widely considered to have the worst launch in history? Why doesn't Meridian 59 get a mention when it is widely considered to be a pioneer in the retail graphical online game market. Especially considering that former developers of M59 went on to work on a lot of other online games, such as UO, UO2, The Sims Online, Shadowbane, etc.
Finally, there's a lot of repeats. Do you really need to play Parappa the Rapper and Dance Dance Revolution in order to appreciate both games? Both games have to deal with music and rhythm with some differences. Yes, those differences result in different games, but even those differences can be found in other games.
I think what would be more interesting would be to pick different vital gaming elements and then provide games that provide a good example of that.
For example, using a computer game-centric list:
Game types Music and Rhythm games (DDR, Parappa, Samba De Amigo) First-person shooter (DOOM, Quake) RPG (Ultima, Might & Magic, Final Fantasy, Exile) Online RPG (Ultima Online, EverQuest, Meridian 59)
Game art styles Tile engines (Ultima 1-5, Exile) Cell-shaded (Parappa, Jet Set/Grind Radio) 2.5D (DOOM, Meridian 59) 3D (Quake, Half-Life)
Notable games Ultima 4 - introduced morality and consequences for actions in a fantasy RPG. DOOM - introduced multiplayer games to a wider audience.
I think this would be a much more useful list for distilling what people probably should be noticing about these games. Of course, there are flaws with this as well. The business side of things has obviously influenced things, for example, but which game really introduced which business model?
Actually, there are some independent online RPGs out there. We just don't get the press coverage of the larger games. We also don't have as high of production values (I.E., our art isn't as pretty as the big-name games).
My own game, Meridian 59 is a typical fantasy RPG, with a heavier focus on player vs. player combat and socialization. It has a much more interesting character advancement system which is much faster than most other games.
If you like crafting or an Egyptian setting, you might try A Tale In The Desert.
Want to express yourself creatively while playing an anthropomorphic animal? Furcadia might be your game.
It's kinda like movies. Sure you can go see the latest action flick starring The Rock(tm) advertised heavily on TV and magazines, or you could spend a bit of time reasearching for yourself and find a great indie movie. The indie MMORPGs are out there, you just gotta look a bit harder.
There are costs to get that box on the shelves. Duplication, printing, distribution, storage, etc., all these things cost money to get a game on the shelves. In reality, most single-player games rarely make more than $10 or so per box after all expenses are figured, so that means the "free" month in most games is paid for by the "profit" from the box sale.
That said, however, box sales are still very necessary. People still go to their local game story and buy games they see there. Take as an example, my own game Meridian 59. The only time a box for the game was available was during the launch of the game in 1996. After that, the game went to an entirely downloadable client (with the option to purchase a CD that would be mailed to you for $10 or so). Needless to say that most people haven't heard of M59, but have heard of the larger games like Ultima Online, EverQuest, etc. Beyond that, having a box in the store and charging more gives the game a sense of legitimacy that you might otherwise lack. Some people hare hesitant to play M59 because you dont' get a physical box, therefore the game seems less "professional" and "legitimate". In all, you still need boxes on the shelves to attract large numbers of people.
This is also why expansions are sold in the stores, too. You need a "fresh" product on the shelves in order to draw new people to your game. Again, Meridian 59 has had a hard time attracting new people to the game in the 6 years it's been out. This is mostly due to lack of effective advertising and a lack of presence on the store shelves.
Even with some of the cool things we're doing, including a new rendering engine, it's still hard to get attention to the game, because we don't have a presence in the traditional channels for games, notably boxes on the shelves of game stores.
As for the subscriptions, it's hardly the cash cow it seems to be. Meridian 59 has a $10.95 monthly fee with no box to buy, making it far cheaper than most of the other games out there. The business is marginally profitable, but only because all the people working on the game are making approximately 20% of what they could be in other jobs. We're not bathing in large pools of cash because of the subscription income.
Some perspective on the matter from someone running one of these games, admittedly on the smaller scale.
My impression of the MMOs is that gameplay is rarely the strong point.
It depends on the game. Meridian 59, for example, strives hard to have engaging gameplay. The game focuses on PvP combat, so we have to have engaging gameplay or people will get bored. True, this gameplay is a bit different than what you might expect if you've played a lot of single-player games.
The real draw of these games is the community. You meet other people, you make friends (and sometimes enemies), you have fun chatting with people while you're playing the game. These games foster cooperation and competition between the players; becoming a millionaire isn't fun by itself in a game, it's fun because you can compare yourself to other people. (I'm not saying this is what I like or encourange in my own game, just explaining what some players think.) This interaction is what online RPGs offer above and beyond traditional single-player RPGs.
Of course, this also limits the game somewhat. The traditional gameplay of single-player RPGs isn't directly applicable to online RPGs. You can't simply go save the princess and bring peace back to the land forever more, because that would interfere with the hundreds or thousands of other people playing the game. Story and plot take on very different meanings, and it's been a challenge for people used to the traditional linear forms of storytelling to get used to the new structures needed for online games, given that you have multiple people all playing at once and the story's pace continues with or without a single individual's participation.
Just because people are willing to give something away for free doesn't mean it's not expensive. Quite a few people that read Slashdot make quite good money working on software during the day then give away their programming ability to quality Open Source projects at night. Just because I can go download GCC for free doesn't mean programmers shouldn't be paid well for their expertise.
I should have also stated that quality content is expensive. Sturgeon's law and all that. Especially since I have the audacity to expect to be able to make a living running a game, people aren't going to be falling over themselves to give me content for free in most cases. (I know this isn't strictly true, but I can't rely on people's generosity forever in a commercial game.)
So, while there is a lot of quality content out there in text MUDs (I provided a little bit to some MUDs when I was in college), you can't rely on that in the commercial world. Content is expensive in this situation.
I run a commercial graphical game, so I have some experience with this issue. (Meridian 59, the URL is just under my username.)
Content is expensive in terms of time as well as money. The amount of content required to fill all the planets they had for launch would have taken a very long time to do by hand. Hiring a thousand level editors (I'm probably being too conservative in that figure) to do it all by hand in the required amount of time wasn't feasible from a money or a management point of view.
And, $15 per month is hardly "gouging". Consider that you couldn't even see 2 movies in the theater for that price. Anyway, there are plenty of other games out there that charge less per month if it's that terrible on your pocketbook.
There are a lot of accusations that can rightfully be brought against Sony and Lucas about SWG, but these two aren't even close.
I fully encourage you to check out other online RPGs if SWG isn't your style. There's lots of them out there that cater to a variety of play styles.
The problem is that content is expensive. The hand-crafted feel of EQ's zones (and the game I work on, Meridian 59) take a long time to create. It takes specialized people with a good eye to create those cool level, to write up the quests, to create the cool items that drop off the monsters.
SWG had to go toward randomly-generated content in the world because they simply could not generate all the needed content by hand. Especially with more modern players expecting a wealth of new content at launch and on a regular basis. New games have to compete with EQ's content, which has been added to over the years.
In the end, content is expensive. Generating some of the content randomly helps create more content that doesn't feel repetitive, but it loses a bit of soul in the process.
Wow, didn't think this interview would get posted on Slashdot!
I'm the interviewee in the posted article. It's a variation on my current soapbox topic of game players supporting the independent developers. Independent developers are doing some cool things, and we need support to keep doing this.
Anyway, check out Meridian 59 if you like online RPGs but are a bit tired of the current offerings. We offer balanced PvP, great communication systems, and very flexible character creation. The game has a lot of depth from having 7 updates added to the game over 6 years. Just be patient with the newbie area, a lot of the really interesting complexity is hidden in the first part of the game in order to get online game newbies into the game easier. (There were a lot more of them 6 years ago, you know!) Make some friends, join a guild, and explore a new world.
If you're going to Gen Con Indy, stop by our booth and see the game in action. We'll be showing off the new graphical client, which is a marked improvement over the current software rendering engine.
(many Meridian59 players, paying by the hour, were racking up $30/mo with regularity)
Actually, when 3DO owned the game they were being charged by the day. The billing worked out to be no more than $30 per month.
Currently, the game goes for $10.95 per month with a free download. We've also always given away content patches for free, whereas other games will charge you for a box to keep your game current. You can find it (under new management) at http://www.meridian59.com/.
Some info from a former and current M59 developer,
More recently, two of the original programmers of Meridian 59 got the rights back from 3DO, and seem to be doing ok so far, even fixing some old bugs and adding new features.
Yep. We're located at http://www.meridian59.com/. We're even working on a new rendering engine for the game.
The trick is to stay small enough to be self-supporting until you can grow normally. I love Meridian, so we've taken steps to make sure it'll be around for a long time.:)
Meridian 59 happens to be alive and doing pretty good these days for a reasonably aged online RPG. My company, Near Death Studios, Inc. bought M59 from 3DO in November of 2001. It's been relaunched and we're even looking to make the game a bit prettier.
Check out the Official Meridian 59 Page for more info if you're curious about the game. It's a very nicely balanced PvP game with a skill-based system using a DOOM-type engine. Check out our Work in Progress page to see some work we're doing on the new rendering engine.
Personally, I'm saddened by the news because I know some of my friends and former co-workers are out of a job now.:( I wish all displaced by this news the best of luck finding new employment, especially in the Bay Area.
If a MMORPG just had a monthly fee, and a freely distributable/downloadable ISO, their increased sales would more than make up for the loss in revenue associated with ditching a retail box.
You are wrong. Retail boxes give a lot more exposure to the game than a simple download client will. People will see the game at the local EB or Best Buy and pick it up because they haven't seen the ads in other places.
I know from experience, because I run a smaller PvP-focused game, Meridian 59 that does not have the coverage that other games do. The game is a bit older (which translates to "stable" and "balanced"), but does not have the interest that a game in the stores does. While we have a reasonably sized playerbase, not requiring a box purchase in a store hasn't really gained us many more customers.
This isn't only a case of marketing, IMHO. Most online RPG players do not spend their time online looking at web sites looking for ads and reviews. Most people will pick up a game they see in the store and/or one that their friends recommend to them.
Even beyond this, the box sale generates income for the developer. Even if they make $10-15 profit from the box, this is equivalent of 1-2 months of profit from subscriptions per player. This helps offset initial development costs up front and fund more advertising efforts. Money up front is always worth more than money to be paid later.
As for free trials, this can be tricky for some games. Meridian 59 does not offer a free trial of the game on the PvP servers, since it could be very disruptive to other customers. Players coming in and building quick random PKer characters could drive away more customers than it draws.
My view on things,
Re:How does a website spend $80mln?
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Salon Asks for Help
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· Score: 1, Redundant
The great benefit the Internet was supposed to bring was the complete de-emphasis of physical location.
I'll tell you that's simply not the case because of all the things that do depend on physical location. The biggest example is taxes.
I'm the co-founder of a small company that runs an online RPG, Meridian 59. We're a "virtual" company with people that live in both California (specifically the Bay Area) and Connecticut. Because of this arrangement, I get to do over twice the amount of paperwork for taxes. Since we pay people wages, we have to register in both states for various payroll tax reporting.
On top of this, since we have workers in both states we're considered to be "doing business" in both states, so we're subject to the Sales and Use taxes for each state. When we sold some CDs containing our game, we had to report total sales and break down the sales that happened in each state in order to pay the proper taxes on them. As CFO (in addition to being a programmer), this took a non-trivial amount of my time to collect and organize this information, and to fill out the appropriate form.
Finally, there's no substitute for face-to-face contact. Building a small business is about building relationships with people; there's only so much you can do over Trillian or even a phone call.
As for the SF Bay Area, it's not so simple. Yes, it's stupid expensive to live out here. But, when you consider that there are two major cities, one of which is known to be one of the few cultural centers in the US, you realize what you are paying for. Also, there's a strong concentration of truly clueful technical people out here, especially ones that have the required skills for game development. Two of the people that are working with us (on the cheap, I might add) I met around here due to our shared interests.
I agree that a company needs to control its costs and that the excess of the Dot-Com era ruined some people, but location isn't necessarily something you want to skimp on.
Some insight on the matter,
Location still matters, even with the Internet.
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Salon Asks for Help
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· Score: 5, Insightful
The great benefit the Internet was supposed to bring was the complete de-emphasis of physical location.
I'll tell you that's simply not the case because of all the things that do depend on physical location. The biggest example is taxes.
I'm the co-founder of a small company that runs an online RPG, Meridian 59. We're a "virtual" company with people that live in both California (specifically the Bay Area) and Connecticut. Because of this arrangement, I get to do over twice the amount of paperwork for taxes. Since we pay people wages, we have to register in both states for various payroll tax reporting.
On top of this, since we have workers in both states, we're considered to be "doing business" in both states, so we're subject to the Sales and Use taxes for each state. When we sold some CDs containing the installation of our game, we had to report total sales and break down the sales that happened in each state in order to pay the proper taxes on them. As CFO, this took a non-trivial amount of my time to collect and organize this information, and to fill out the appropriate form.
Finally, there's no substitute for face-to-face contact. Building a small business is about building relationships with people; there's only so much you can do over Trillian or even a phone call.
As for the SF Bay Area, it's not so simple. Yes, it's stupid expensive to live out here. But, when you consider that there are two major cities, one of which is known to be one of the few cultural centers in the US, you realize what you are paying for. Also, there's a strong concentration of truly clueful technical people out here, especially ones that have the required skills for game development. Two of the people that are working with us (on the cheap, I might add) I met around here due to our shared interests.
Some insight on the matter,
My game, Meridian 59 has quite a few developer created memorials to players that have passed on while playing the game. A few of them have very important gameplay functions, and as such the people they memorialize are actively remembered.
I think it's pretty cool people can come together to remember a good friend like that, myself. Too many people consider "online" to be the equivalent of "not real". Sure the game and the killing may not be real, but the friendships you make are just as real as the people you make them with.
Brian "Psychochild" Green
Co-Founder, Near Death Studios, Inc.
Page 3 is the really juicy part. He's against silly patents (mentions one-click) and is also against software patents. He feels corporations are robbing citizens of rights in order to protect intellectual property. He writes in favor of fair use of IP ("priceless" paradies and all that). He also talks about government endorsement for the "open-source movement".
Sister Machine Gun (SMG) recently broke away from TVT after a bit of falling out. Unfortunately, SMG's music is not exactly categorizable (hard rock, jazz, and "industrial" all mixed into one fun batch), and the frontman Chris Randall does a lot of interesting stuff (including some "electronic" music under the name "Micronaut").
They're probably best known for their song "Burn" which was on the Mortal Kombat movie soundtrack. Micronaut also had some MP3 favorites over at MP3.com in the "electronica" section, including "Northern Style Kung Fu".
SMG recently independantly released a CD, [R]evolution, which is pretty cool. The prices are pretty reasonable for quality of the CD. They've started pressing their own CDs for the fans.
Check out the site. They're fans of MP3's so, you can listen to a nice selection before you put your hard earned money down.
BTW, the live shows are not to be missed. Unfortunately, they're in Chicago and I'm in the Bay Area....
Slashdot Mirror
Not quite true. Customer Service (CS) actually gets more expensive as you get bigger, since you have to deal with more interactions between players. Most of your CS for an online game is billing and what we lovingly refer to as "babysitting" in the industry (resolving arguments, stopping harassment, etc). As you get more people, you have a constant increase in billing problems and a factorial increase in problems between players. To put it in geek terms, maintaining the same level of CS as you grow is a O(n!) problem in terms of cost. That should scare you.
Of course, many times games will let this slide. CS is seen as a cost center, and many times companies will do what they can to reduce costs. This includes things like putting up knowledge bases and having in-game volunteers help with simple issues.
Other costs grow incredibly fast as well. Once you start having a game the size of EverQuest (or even larger), you start needing a lot more than what your average co-location facility can handle. You have to essentially start your own NOC in order to maintain the level of service expected for these games. The biggest network services provider in Korea is NCSoft; NCSoft is the creator of the game Lineage, which is estimated to be at least 2x the size of EverQuest. (This information is a bit old, so it might be different now.)
But, you can cut down a lot of costs and remain profitable on the small scale. My own game, Meridian 59 has a very low overhead and remains profitable even with a fairly modest subscriber base.
Some information from someone running an online game for a living.
Ah, we need to update that. :) That was speaking of other international servers that were running the game from the old 3DO days.
There are servers in the US and Germany currently. My company, Near Death Studios, Inc. owns worldwide rights (purchased from 3DO) and runs the U.S. version of the game. We also have a German licensee running a German version of the game.
We've been quite busy with the game lately, updating the old software rendering engine to a more modern hardware rendering engine with neat features like dynamic lighting. You can see some of the screenshots at Warcry News, which show some nice before-and-after shots of the game with the two rendering engines.
My point still stands, however: M59 would be dead today if it were only a console game. It simply does not have the numbers to make it as profitable as larger companies prefer. The game focuses on a niche (hard-core PvP combat) that a core group of people think is lacking in other games; however, this core group is not large enough to be of notice to console publishers.
My further thoughts,
As someone running an online game, there is one thing that will set the PC apart from consoles in the online arena: niche games. I can make a reasonable (if lean) living off of running Meridian 59 for a few thousand players. There were probably more people playing Phantasy Star Online (PSO) on the Dreamcast, but that got shut down while M59 continues to live on. M59 is able to offer a serious PvP game (which is a very niche product) for a much more select audience.
One benefit of the PC is that it's easier to develop games for it on a limited budget. Console development is expensive, starting with the development kit you have to buy for the cost of the entire budget of some indie games. Therefore, most console games are very expensive to make, and selling less than 50k units is considered terrible. On the PC side of things, you can make a game that will target a few thousand players and be profitable. So, it's easier to "take risks" on the PC.
I expect to see a rise in independent games in the online medium on the PC. Our company's next project is for the PC (and hopefully Linux!) because the costs to develop the game are cheaper. A look at Puzzle Pirates shows a cool game that would never make it as a console game. It's really unfortunate, seeing as how Puzzle Pirates is a great idea and a fun game that most likely wouldn't push the millions of units to make it truly profitable on a console.
So, in summary: online PC gaming isn't dead. I expect to see the larger companies like EA follow the dollars as they always have. But for true gameplayers, things will probably look better after a short while.
My thoughts,
The problem is that democracy doesn't really work in commercial worlds. You can get up on your high horse and complain about democracy, but the reality of the situation is that players expect the people running and profiting from the game to handle the problems.
;)
Imagine of there were undeniable proof that 1) a deity exists, and 2) he/she/it listens to people and can be influenced by people. Do you think people would still handle their own problems? Through history we've had people lament the unfairness of the deity(ies) even without conclusive proof he/she/it/they exist.
In my own game, Meridian 59, there is an elected position in the game that allows players to give "pardons" to other players that have murdered others. This position takes a lot of effort to win, because there is always someone wishing to control that power for their own benefit. Trying to run the position and be fair to the population of the game is very hard, and completely unfun for all but a small group of people. Most people would rather have the admins interfere with the system than have to work to keep things in check.
Further, the company exists to make money. Having someone expose the underbelly of a world intended to be someplace for people to go chat and have fun isn't exactly good for business. While Ludlow is obviously doing some interesting things along the lines of reseach, he is equally obviously being confrontational in his work. There are many things he could have done that would have been beneficial to the world and not harmful to Maxis. He could have talked about the issues he found in The Sims Online without naming the exact service much as doctors refer to patient studies without including the patients' names in the studies. He could have also went to Maxis with this information before he put it on a web page.
Finally, what is Maxis supposed to do about this issue? Have a CS representative drop in and say, "I've noticed you've used the words 'penis' and/or 'vagina' or associated colloqual terms at least 5 times in the last 5 minutes. Are you having cybersex? Could I see some ID to make sure no one here is underage?" Yeah, that'll go over really well with the players.
In my own game world people murder each other all the time, sometimes to the point that groups of people will leave the game. I take no steps to prevent it. Does this make me a genocidal tyrant? Anyone who says "yes" needs to get outside more.
My opinion on the matter,
As a game developer, I find it interesting that this question comes up so often. Where's the posts about whether or not movie directors should listen to viewer feedback when creating movie or a sequel? The best we hope for is some small focus groups giving a thumbs up or down in an "advanced screening" of a movie. (Usually resulting in a hastily tacked-on "happy ending" to please the audience.) Do you think script writers really go out and look for suggestions on how to write a movie script? Do you think every bit of feedback from every movie is recorded by the big movie studios?
;)
You could also apply this to authors and books. Wait, maybe that's a good idea; then Stephenson's fiction might actually have a satisfying ending.
This isn't to say that feedback isn't useful or should be completely ignored, however. But, knowing how to filter the useful from the less useful suggestions is a important (and time-consuming) thing to do.
My thoughts,
I play games with my better half. Of course, being a game developer she's more tolerant of my gaming interests than most people might, otherwise she would have left me a long time ago.
;)
Turn-based strategy is good. Heroes of Might and Magic is great (I recommend 3, but 2 is good. You'll probably find 4 in the stores, but it's a bit more complicated with less interesting gameplay than 2 or 3 had.) The upside is that you can play for a bit and then save the game without too much fuss; good for that 1 hour of play per night plan if that's wht you want. The downside is that games can take a VERY long time, especially waiting for the other to complete the turn.
Real-time strategy is also cool. My GF and I play Age of Empires 2 (with expansion). There's an option for both people to play the same civilization. A 2-on-2 game where you and your GF play one civ with a computer ally against 2 other computer enemies is a real blast. You should be able to find the game cheap, since it's a bit old. The newer version, Age of Mythology, wasn't quite as captivating. The upside the game is cheap and runs on fairly modest hardware. The downside is that there's a big jump in difficulty levels from too easy to pretty difficult, so there's a large gap in the learning curve.
You could also look at online RPGs. I'm a bit biased towards these because I run one, Meridian 59. There are several people that play together. These games are a lot of fun when you play together in the same room, chatting back and forth. In a PvP-focused game, like Meridian 59, you can coordinate your strategies easier. A friend of mine started playing M59 recently with his wife. Even though she thought she'd hate PvP, she really enjoyed the political aspects of organizing a guild. Upside: You can meet and talk to lots of interesting people. Downside: Just like any other group of people, there's idiots to deal with. Online games can also end up taking a lot of time as you want to log on and maintain friendships; it's something you have to plan to do in moderation.
Hope this was at least semi-interesting, even though it'll get lost in the crowd.
It's interesting to see that the online RPG market is already turning to sequels, licenses, and derivatives after less than a decade of wide-spread commercial attention. It seems that the large game publishers are falling back on what they know in order to maximize profit.
It's a bit unfortunate, because the online medium deserves a lot better than that. You can do some very cool and interesting things online that you simply cannot do with traditional single-player games. The social dimensions these games and worlds can explore are astounding.
I think that in the future we'll see the rise of more 'independent' games. My own company, Near Death Studios, runs Meridian 59, a classic game with a strong focus on PvP. We are willing to cater to the smaller market that wants meaningful PvP in their game. There are plenty of other games out there, including the rather unique A Tale In The Desert that offers an entirely non-combat world. I think that as more people are able to take bold steps in developing an indie game, you will see more options out there. My hope is that the indie games will be able to offer people more of what they want, instead of just trying to slap a license into an online world where it doesn't fit, or build a sequel of a game that should last a long time. By offering people a more focused experience, instead of pandering to a mythical "mass-market audience" for these games, the indies will hopefully show the power of the online medium.
Of course, if only it were that easy. Players have to actually support these games for them to grow. Yeah, indie games are as a rule less pretty and less polished than big-name games. But, if the gameplay is more of what you like, why not support them? The gameplay is arguably the reason why people play these games. Also, most of the smaller games can't afford big advertising budgets like the large games do. EQ has probably spent more on advertising than ATITD has spent on game development as a whole, so obviously more people are going to hear about EQ rather than ATITD. So, people need to do a bit more searching for these games. In the end, I think it's the best option to keep the online medium intersting and fun for the most people.
My crazy opinions as an indie online game developer.
What is wrong with exploring for yourself?
I'll have to agree. I think that getting out there and playing a variety of games is better than being told what games to play.
As a professional, independent game developer, I find the lists useless. I consider myself a pretty serious gamer and a student of game history, but I barely know half the games there.
One of the biggest issues is that a lot of the older games are mostly lost to time. I played arcade games obsessively as a kid, but I only really got to play some of the classics due to the involvement some of my friends have with emulation. I didn't appreciate a game like Robotron when I was 10, and paying $1k+ (plus shipping!) to get a live machine seems a bit insane. People looking for a legal way to play these classic games are mostly out of luck.
You can say the same thing about older consoles and computers, too. Strict copyright enforcement and the ravages of time have made some classic games very hard to find and play. Finding legal copies of these games is damn near impossible.
Further, the lists focus on big-name games. Ultima is mentioned, but what about the critically acclaimed games produced by Spiderweb Software? Is the Exile series less worthy of attention just because it is "shareware" instead of being published by a large company? Why does Anarchy Online get a mention on the lists when it is widely considered to have the worst launch in history? Why doesn't Meridian 59 get a mention when it is widely considered to be a pioneer in the retail graphical online game market. Especially considering that former developers of M59 went on to work on a lot of other online games, such as UO, UO2, The Sims Online, Shadowbane, etc.
Finally, there's a lot of repeats. Do you really need to play Parappa the Rapper and Dance Dance Revolution in order to appreciate both games? Both games have to deal with music and rhythm with some differences. Yes, those differences result in different games, but even those differences can be found in other games.
I think what would be more interesting would be to pick different vital gaming elements and then provide games that provide a good example of that.
For example, using a computer game-centric list:
Game types
Music and Rhythm games (DDR, Parappa, Samba De Amigo)
First-person shooter (DOOM, Quake)
RPG (Ultima, Might & Magic, Final Fantasy, Exile)
Online RPG (Ultima Online, EverQuest, Meridian 59)
Game art styles
Tile engines (Ultima 1-5, Exile)
Cell-shaded (Parappa, Jet Set/Grind Radio)
2.5D (DOOM, Meridian 59)
3D (Quake, Half-Life)
Notable games
Ultima 4 - introduced morality and consequences for actions in a fantasy RPG.
DOOM - introduced multiplayer games to a wider audience.
I think this would be a much more useful list for distilling what people probably should be noticing about these games. Of course, there are flaws with this as well. The business side of things has obviously influenced things, for example, but which game really introduced which business model?
My opinion,
Actually, there are some independent online RPGs out there. We just don't get the press coverage of the larger games. We also don't have as high of production values (I.E., our art isn't as pretty as the big-name games).
My own game, Meridian 59 is a typical fantasy RPG, with a heavier focus on player vs. player combat and socialization. It has a much more interesting character advancement system which is much faster than most other games.
If you like crafting or an Egyptian setting, you might try A Tale In The Desert.
If you like puzzles and pirates, try out Yohoho! Puzzle Pirates.
Want to express yourself creatively while playing an anthropomorphic animal? Furcadia might be your game.
It's kinda like movies. Sure you can go see the latest action flick starring The Rock(tm) advertised heavily on TV and magazines, or you could spend a bit of time reasearching for yourself and find a great indie movie. The indie MMORPGs are out there, you just gotta look a bit harder.
I am not a monkey! I prefer the term game developer, you insenstive clod!
Not quite.
There are costs to get that box on the shelves. Duplication, printing, distribution, storage, etc., all these things cost money to get a game on the shelves. In reality, most single-player games rarely make more than $10 or so per box after all expenses are figured, so that means the "free" month in most games is paid for by the "profit" from the box sale.
That said, however, box sales are still very necessary. People still go to their local game story and buy games they see there. Take as an example, my own game Meridian 59. The only time a box for the game was available was during the launch of the game in 1996. After that, the game went to an entirely downloadable client (with the option to purchase a CD that would be mailed to you for $10 or so). Needless to say that most people haven't heard of M59, but have heard of the larger games like Ultima Online, EverQuest, etc. Beyond that, having a box in the store and charging more gives the game a sense of legitimacy that you might otherwise lack. Some people hare hesitant to play M59 because you dont' get a physical box, therefore the game seems less "professional" and "legitimate". In all, you still need boxes on the shelves to attract large numbers of people.
This is also why expansions are sold in the stores, too. You need a "fresh" product on the shelves in order to draw new people to your game. Again, Meridian 59 has had a hard time attracting new people to the game in the 6 years it's been out. This is mostly due to lack of effective advertising and a lack of presence on the store shelves.
Even with some of the cool things we're doing, including a new rendering engine, it's still hard to get attention to the game, because we don't have a presence in the traditional channels for games, notably boxes on the shelves of game stores.
As for the subscriptions, it's hardly the cash cow it seems to be. Meridian 59 has a $10.95 monthly fee with no box to buy, making it far cheaper than most of the other games out there. The business is marginally profitable, but only because all the people working on the game are making approximately 20% of what they could be in other jobs. We're not bathing in large pools of cash because of the subscription income.
Some perspective on the matter from someone running one of these games, admittedly on the smaller scale.
It depends on the game. Meridian 59, for example, strives hard to have engaging gameplay. The game focuses on PvP combat, so we have to have engaging gameplay or people will get bored. True, this gameplay is a bit different than what you might expect if you've played a lot of single-player games.
The real draw of these games is the community. You meet other people, you make friends (and sometimes enemies), you have fun chatting with people while you're playing the game. These games foster cooperation and competition between the players; becoming a millionaire isn't fun by itself in a game, it's fun because you can compare yourself to other people. (I'm not saying this is what I like or encourange in my own game, just explaining what some players think.) This interaction is what online RPGs offer above and beyond traditional single-player RPGs.
Of course, this also limits the game somewhat. The traditional gameplay of single-player RPGs isn't directly applicable to online RPGs. You can't simply go save the princess and bring peace back to the land forever more, because that would interfere with the hundreds or thousands of other people playing the game. Story and plot take on very different meanings, and it's been a challenge for people used to the traditional linear forms of storytelling to get used to the new structures needed for online games, given that you have multiple people all playing at once and the story's pace continues with or without a single individual's participation.
Some insight from a designer,
Just because people are willing to give something away for free doesn't mean it's not expensive. Quite a few people that read Slashdot make quite good money working on software during the day then give away their programming ability to quality Open Source projects at night. Just because I can go download GCC for free doesn't mean programmers shouldn't be paid well for their expertise.
I should have also stated that quality content is expensive. Sturgeon's law and all that. Especially since I have the audacity to expect to be able to make a living running a game, people aren't going to be falling over themselves to give me content for free in most cases. (I know this isn't strictly true, but I can't rely on people's generosity forever in a commercial game.)
So, while there is a lot of quality content out there in text MUDs (I provided a little bit to some MUDs when I was in college), you can't rely on that in the commercial world. Content is expensive in this situation.
I run a commercial graphical game, so I have some experience with this issue. (Meridian 59, the URL is just under my username.)
My experiences,
Content is expensive in terms of time as well as money. The amount of content required to fill all the planets they had for launch would have taken a very long time to do by hand. Hiring a thousand level editors (I'm probably being too conservative in that figure) to do it all by hand in the required amount of time wasn't feasible from a money or a management point of view.
And, $15 per month is hardly "gouging". Consider that you couldn't even see 2 movies in the theater for that price. Anyway, there are plenty of other games out there that charge less per month if it's that terrible on your pocketbook.
There are a lot of accusations that can rightfully be brought against Sony and Lucas about SWG, but these two aren't even close.
I fully encourage you to check out other online RPGs if SWG isn't your style. There's lots of them out there that cater to a variety of play styles.
My thoughts,
The problem is that content is expensive. The hand-crafted feel of EQ's zones (and the game I work on, Meridian 59) take a long time to create. It takes specialized people with a good eye to create those cool level, to write up the quests, to create the cool items that drop off the monsters.
SWG had to go toward randomly-generated content in the world because they simply could not generate all the needed content by hand. Especially with more modern players expecting a wealth of new content at launch and on a regular basis. New games have to compete with EQ's content, which has been added to over the years.
In the end, content is expensive. Generating some of the content randomly helps create more content that doesn't feel repetitive, but it loses a bit of soul in the process.
My view on things,
Wow, didn't think this interview would get posted on Slashdot!
I'm the interviewee in the posted article. It's a variation on my current soapbox topic of game players supporting the independent developers. Independent developers are doing some cool things, and we need support to keep doing this.
Anyway, check out Meridian 59 if you like online RPGs but are a bit tired of the current offerings. We offer balanced PvP, great communication systems, and very flexible character creation. The game has a lot of depth from having 7 updates added to the game over 6 years. Just be patient with the newbie area, a lot of the really interesting complexity is hidden in the first part of the game in order to get online game newbies into the game easier. (There were a lot more of them 6 years ago, you know!) Make some friends, join a guild, and explore a new world.
If you're going to Gen Con Indy, stop by our booth and see the game in action. We'll be showing off the new graphical client, which is a marked improvement over the current software rendering engine.
See you in the game!
Actually, when 3DO owned the game they were being charged by the day. The billing worked out to be no more than $30 per month.
Currently, the game goes for $10.95 per month with a free download. We've also always given away content patches for free, whereas other games will charge you for a box to keep your game current. You can find it (under new management) at http://www.meridian59.com/.
Some info from a former and current M59 developer,
Yep. We're located at http://www.meridian59.com/. We're even working on a new rendering engine for the game.
The trick is to stay small enough to be self-supporting until you can grow normally. I love Meridian, so we've taken steps to make sure it'll be around for a long time. :)
My thoughts,
Brian "Psychochild" Green
Check out the Official Meridian 59 Page for more info if you're curious about the game. It's a very nicely balanced PvP game with a skill-based system using a DOOM-type engine. Check out our Work in Progress page to see some work we're doing on the new rendering engine.
Personally, I'm saddened by the news because I know some of my friends and former co-workers are out of a job now. :( I wish all displaced by this news the best of luck finding new employment, especially in the Bay Area.
Take care,
You are wrong. Retail boxes give a lot more exposure to the game than a simple download client will. People will see the game at the local EB or Best Buy and pick it up because they haven't seen the ads in other places.
I know from experience, because I run a smaller PvP-focused game, Meridian 59 that does not have the coverage that other games do. The game is a bit older (which translates to "stable" and "balanced"), but does not have the interest that a game in the stores does. While we have a reasonably sized playerbase, not requiring a box purchase in a store hasn't really gained us many more customers.
This isn't only a case of marketing, IMHO. Most online RPG players do not spend their time online looking at web sites looking for ads and reviews. Most people will pick up a game they see in the store and/or one that their friends recommend to them.
Even beyond this, the box sale generates income for the developer. Even if they make $10-15 profit from the box, this is equivalent of 1-2 months of profit from subscriptions per player. This helps offset initial development costs up front and fund more advertising efforts. Money up front is always worth more than money to be paid later.
As for free trials, this can be tricky for some games. Meridian 59 does not offer a free trial of the game on the PvP servers, since it could be very disruptive to other customers. Players coming in and building quick random PKer characters could drive away more customers than it draws.
My view on things,
I'm the co-founder of a small company that runs an online RPG, Meridian 59. We're a "virtual" company with people that live in both California (specifically the Bay Area) and Connecticut. Because of this arrangement, I get to do over twice the amount of paperwork for taxes. Since we pay people wages, we have to register in both states for various payroll tax reporting.
On top of this, since we have workers in both states we're considered to be "doing business" in both states, so we're subject to the Sales and Use taxes for each state. When we sold some CDs containing our game, we had to report total sales and break down the sales that happened in each state in order to pay the proper taxes on them. As CFO (in addition to being a programmer), this took a non-trivial amount of my time to collect and organize this information, and to fill out the appropriate form.
Finally, there's no substitute for face-to-face contact. Building a small business is about building relationships with people; there's only so much you can do over Trillian or even a phone call.
As for the SF Bay Area, it's not so simple. Yes, it's stupid expensive to live out here. But, when you consider that there are two major cities, one of which is known to be one of the few cultural centers in the US, you realize what you are paying for. Also, there's a strong concentration of truly clueful technical people out here, especially ones that have the required skills for game development. Two of the people that are working with us (on the cheap, I might add) I met around here due to our shared interests.
I agree that a company needs to control its costs and that the excess of the Dot-Com era ruined some people, but location isn't necessarily something you want to skimp on.
Some insight on the matter,
I'll tell you that's simply not the case because of all the things that do depend on physical location. The biggest example is taxes. I'm the co-founder of a small company that runs an online RPG, Meridian 59. We're a "virtual" company with people that live in both California (specifically the Bay Area) and Connecticut. Because of this arrangement, I get to do over twice the amount of paperwork for taxes. Since we pay people wages, we have to register in both states for various payroll tax reporting. On top of this, since we have workers in both states, we're considered to be "doing business" in both states, so we're subject to the Sales and Use taxes for each state. When we sold some CDs containing the installation of our game, we had to report total sales and break down the sales that happened in each state in order to pay the proper taxes on them. As CFO, this took a non-trivial amount of my time to collect and organize this information, and to fill out the appropriate form. Finally, there's no substitute for face-to-face contact. Building a small business is about building relationships with people; there's only so much you can do over Trillian or even a phone call. As for the SF Bay Area, it's not so simple. Yes, it's stupid expensive to live out here. But, when you consider that there are two major cities, one of which is known to be one of the few cultural centers in the US, you realize what you are paying for. Also, there's a strong concentration of truly clueful technical people out here, especially ones that have the required skills for game development. Two of the people that are working with us (on the cheap, I might add) I met around here due to our shared interests. Some insight on the matter,
I think it's pretty cool people can come together to remember a good friend like that, myself. Too many people consider "online" to be the equivalent of "not real". Sure the game and the killing may not be real, but the friendships you make are just as real as the people you make them with.
Brian "Psychochild" Green
Co-Founder, Near Death Studios, Inc.
Wired News (http://www.wired.com/) has a little debate going between Nader and Reed Hundt (Gore adviser and former FCC chairman). In one of the last articles, "Al Isn't Net's Best Friend" (http://www.wired.com/news/politics/0,1283,39295,0 0.html) Nader talked about technology issues and the 'net.
Page 3 is the really juicy part. He's against silly patents (mentions one-click) and is also against software patents. He feels corporations are robbing citizens of rights in order to protect intellectual property. He writes in favor of fair use of IP ("priceless" paradies and all that). He also talks about government endorsement for the "open-source movement".
An interesting read, IMHO.
-Psychochild
http://www.smg.org/
Sister Machine Gun (SMG) recently broke away from TVT after a bit of falling out. Unfortunately, SMG's music is not exactly categorizable (hard rock, jazz, and "industrial" all mixed into one fun batch), and the frontman Chris Randall does a lot of interesting stuff (including some "electronic" music under the name "Micronaut").
They're probably best known for their song "Burn" which was on the Mortal Kombat movie soundtrack. Micronaut also had some MP3 favorites over at MP3.com in the "electronica" section, including "Northern Style Kung Fu".
SMG recently independantly released a CD, [R]evolution, which is pretty cool. The prices are pretty reasonable for quality of the CD. They've started pressing their own CDs for the fans.
Check out the site. They're fans of MP3's so, you can listen to a nice selection before you put your hard earned money down.
BTW, the live shows are not to be missed. Unfortunately, they're in Chicago and I'm in the Bay Area....
Just advertising for my favorite band.
-Psychochild