OOOOhhh look, Linkin Park plays Halo 2! I'm going to preorder my copy today. No wait, I'll preorder TWO!
Bah, seriously though, from someone in advertising/marketing, this is just a bad move. I mean, celebrity endorsements are nice every now and then but people want to play video games, they don't want to sit and watch others play them instead, no matter how famous the people may be.
And I think a large number of Halo players are mature to the point where they don't let celebrity endorsements determine what products they buy.
I remember reading a marketing quote about how your product is in trouble if you need to rely on celebrity endorsements to sell it.
"Why does everyone expect thet GE can solve everything? I myself graduated in plantbiotechnology this year and we discussed some of these things in class."
Because we don't all have a degree in plant biotechnology? Sheesh, get off your high horse.
Would this be a good opportunity to use genetically modified plants? Perhaps ones that produce food quicker, or that live longer or that eat up more C02 and produce more 02?
Sorry Valve, you just lost a customer. I'm a college student (part of your prime demographic) and I am deciding to put my money elsewhere. I've been playing bf:1942/vietnam and all the mods for it for ages, and have considered buying UT2k4...and was also considering HL2, but you just changed my mind.
To the idiots in Valves marketing dept. from a fellow marketer: You FUCKED UP BIG TIME. Your game has lost its unique position in the world of good FPS. It has SERIOUS contenders for the first time in a long time, not to mention the only reason HL became big was because of CS, which was MADE BY FANS.
The same fans you have now pissed on AND off. Bad move indeed.
I suggest we use the loving caress of the/. effect to comment on her site. At least we'll keep her up at night.
Oh, and just out of curiosity, did you ever notice that the/. abbreviation visualizes the/. effect perfectly? The big line is us tipping over the little dot which is the victim. Brilliant.
Its kind of funny that the series named the spacecraft the Enterprise and has a whole backstory about the creation of it, and here we are, naming our first commercial spacecraft that. I know its just the influence of media culture, but it still is kind of ironic.
I wonder if they'll let him sit in a captains seat.
"Scotty, beam them aboard!"
"Um...sir, I'm not Scotty...and you're not even a captain....."
Wonderful, I just KNOW someone's going to be camping the fucking barret, not to mention the planes. God damn campers. I'll show them. Lets see how the army deals with TKs.
"Kids are not so picky about whether or not sneaky programs slide into their computers via these "trojans". They won't read the user agreements, just click the buttons to get to the game faster."
That brings up an interesting question. These kids would not be legally able to become bound to a contract such as a user agreement. Is there any law that can be used in this instance to attack this company for this?
Thank you for correcting me. What I should have stated was that during the trip I wrote about, it was my experience that southerners were the worst. That doesn't mean that it is fact, it means that of the tourists I met, the southerners were the worst.
Note to Mods: The following post is NOT a troll or flamebait, please read it in its entirety before you mod.
Why is it that this is even an issue? God forbid a girl ever starts playing FPS and hears the kind of language that goes on in there. Oh wait, whats that? They do play?!
Perhaps its just that they accept the language as a part of the environment they choose to remain in. The creator of this game has absolutely ZERO responsibility to this player except to provide her access to his world. Please tell me where it says in the game ToS that there will be no racism or sexism.
I personally would love to bitchslap this woman (oh god, did I just suggest I'd hit a woman?!!?!?!?) to knock some sense into her. She is paying for this game, if she doesn't like it, she can stop paying. If she can't handle the notion that in a game, people may not act according to her wishes, then perhaps she should not play games and instead just go back to real life where there are laws against hate speech.
But you know what? If this woman was the least bit intelligent and wasn't just an attention-whoring drama queen she would have realized that there is an in-game legal system where players can vote on laws that will be implemented in the game. If that many players were up in arms about it, perhaps they should've started drafting up legislation instead of building bonfires. I really have no pity for this woman because she chose to remain a victim instead of taking action.
I think it depends on the type of game. I DMed for a group once, and one of the players had been beaten up a lot when he was younger for being jewish. Another female player had been sexually abused.
When the players came across these elements in game, they took me aside on a break, or even just asked me as it happened if I could please refrain from that in the campaign, and then explained why.
Did they riot? No. Did they yell and bitch and moan? No. They asked me politely, nicely, and gave a good reason, so I respected their wishes because I wanted the game to remain fun for them.
In a game the size of ATiTD though, not everybody is going to agree, and when you get into the game, you agree to play by the game rules, which apparently include allowing historically accurate views on women. If you don't like it, nobody is forcing you to play.
Next thing you're going to tell me is that Slashdot may or may not be taking payola to publish certain stories on the front page from a certain person with the first name of Roland. Really, what is this world coming to?
I have been hoping that in the future, us Americans will not be so ignorant.
I'm a college student who was interning in London this summer and traveling Europe by myself. Did people know I was American? Well, if I opened my mouth, obviously (except when I fooled a very aggressive beggar in Amsterdam into believing I was Japanese since I've been studying it and only spoke to him with that). But for the most part, I tried to blend in. When traveling alone abroad, you do NOT want to stick out.
The old saying "when in Rome....." certainly holds true. I hope that as the world becomes more globalized, that the younger Americans growing up learn to respect other countries and make an effort to learn more about them. I have to agree that southerners are the worst. And I felt absolutely ashamed to be standing in line with them at the airport. It was like I wanted to scream out "Please don't hate me just because I'm American, I made an effort to learn about and respect your country and not be a dumb tourist!!!!!!!"
But to all of us Americans who aren't dumb tourists, have heart, because I found many Europeans to be very understanding if you explain it in roughly the way I just did in this post. They will sympathize with the fact that you ARE trying to make an effort and they will respect you for the challenge that it is.
While in Florence, I was eating out at a nice restaurant, and the very nice waitress noticed me trying to order in Italian using my phrase book. She then sat down with me for a couple minutes to teach me how to properly pronounce the words, and what words I should really be using. She said she did this because she was impressed that I was trying to learn their language and not just expect them to know mine.
Got news for you chief, as someone in marketing/advertising, I can say that while there are plenty of morons in our industry who do just that, the good ones are careful about managing expectations. Why? Well, thats what determines what kind of word of mouth you're going to get, and it will ultimately determine your long term success, which any intelligent businessperson values much more than short term success. Sorry you've had bad experiences with marketing, perhaps you just need to work with some marketers who actually know how to communicate and listen to developers.
As someone in marketing/advertising, I can easily say that in this situation, it IS marketing's fault. You see, its not just their job to make appropriate claims for the product before its released, but to handle the situation if the product does not live up to claims, which so far they've been doing an absolutely abyssmal job of. I believe that Peter's apology was from himself, and not a suggestion from marketing, which pisses me off because I'll bet they didn't want to say a damn thing about their failed promises.
Oh please. I work in advertising/marketing, and this is ridiculous. Now, I will be the first to admit there are evil marketers out there who do nothing but hype hype hype to make a buck, and I will also add that I think the game publishers are EXTREMELY guilty of this.
What I disagree with you on is what you think the role of marketing is.
As a marketer, my job is to let the public know about our product. Now, ethical people like myself would not lie about a product or promise things that obviously don't have a snowballs chance of hell of making it into this version. We do not just go hog wild with everything you give us......well, not if we're good at what we do. You see, its one thing if you just want to sell a product to someone once and never see them again, and never get any customers again. But if you have any desire of getting return customers, or having them spread the good word so you get more first time customers, viral marketing (industry term for word of mouth) is ESSENTIAL. And you don't have a chance in hell of getting that unless you have a solid product that lives up to your claims.
So while not all marketers are evil, and not all of us hype the hell out of everything we touch, game companies are definitely guilty as charged. And you are dead on about people eating up the hype. Well, ignorant people who don't suspect hype at least, which unfortunately is the vast majority.
In our industry, there's two terms we use, hype and buzz. Hype is more of a negative thing for the exact reasons you describe. Buzz however is the viral marketing aspect of it, and means people are spreading the good word about your product because the product lives up to claims, and in essence, sells itself.
Insurance companies should most certainly NOT be able to access that kind of info. It starts with this, but it is an EXTREMELY slippery slope once they smell money to be made.
I mean, why stop with just how tired you might be (do you have any idea how many drivers are half asleep in the morning on the way to work?) why not also check to see if you've had alchohol or smoked weed within the past 24 hours, because you know, that might be an indicator of irresponsible behavior which in turn makes you a more dangerous driver!
Interesting point, and I'm glad you brought it up. I wonder if a wave spawning system such as in bf1942 would help fix that boredom problem? And there's no reason that everybody has to be fighting in one area, plus when you throw in archers, not everybody would be waiting in line to charge.
And I'm not saying that we absolutely need 100k people for this battle, but a couple thousand in one battle seems reasonable.
What I was referring to about the cone of fire was that it was the primary reason that Planetside drove away the vast majority of FPS gamers. People expect to be able to get headshots, and the CoF killed that. Part of the fun of playing a FPS for long enough was becoming good enough to the point where your skill could let you tear through people who were not as skilled even if they were better equipped.
While I enjoyed all his answers thoroughly, I have to give a big thank you to Mr. Stephenson for indulging us with the fight scene. I've always loved the way he describes fights, and while he didn't have the space necessary to do it full justice, it brought back a memory of Snowcrash, perhaps I should dig it up and read it again.
Slashdot Mirror
Bah, seriously though, from someone in advertising/marketing, this is just a bad move. I mean, celebrity endorsements are nice every now and then but people want to play video games, they don't want to sit and watch others play them instead, no matter how famous the people may be.
And I think a large number of Halo players are mature to the point where they don't let celebrity endorsements determine what products they buy.
I remember reading a marketing quote about how your product is in trouble if you need to rely on celebrity endorsements to sell it.
Because we don't all have a degree in plant biotechnology? Sheesh, get off your high horse.
To the idiots in Valves marketing dept. from a fellow marketer: You FUCKED UP BIG TIME. Your game has lost its unique position in the world of good FPS. It has SERIOUS contenders for the first time in a long time, not to mention the only reason HL became big was because of CS, which was MADE BY FANS.
The same fans you have now pissed on AND off. Bad move indeed.
Neil Stephenson eat your heart out.
Oh, and just out of curiosity, did you ever notice that the /. abbreviation visualizes the /. effect perfectly? The big line is us tipping over the little dot which is the victim. Brilliant.
I wonder if they'll let him sit in a captains seat.
"Scotty, beam them aboard!"
"Um...sir, I'm not Scotty...and you're not even a captain....."
That brings up an interesting question. These kids would not be legally able to become bound to a contract such as a user agreement. Is there any law that can be used in this instance to attack this company for this?
Why is it that this is even an issue? God forbid a girl ever starts playing FPS and hears the kind of language that goes on in there. Oh wait, whats that? They do play?!
Perhaps its just that they accept the language as a part of the environment they choose to remain in. The creator of this game has absolutely ZERO responsibility to this player except to provide her access to his world. Please tell me where it says in the game ToS that there will be no racism or sexism.
I personally would love to bitchslap this woman (oh god, did I just suggest I'd hit a woman?!!?!?!?) to knock some sense into her. She is paying for this game, if she doesn't like it, she can stop paying. If she can't handle the notion that in a game, people may not act according to her wishes, then perhaps she should not play games and instead just go back to real life where there are laws against hate speech.
But you know what? If this woman was the least bit intelligent and wasn't just an attention-whoring drama queen she would have realized that there is an in-game legal system where players can vote on laws that will be implemented in the game. If that many players were up in arms about it, perhaps they should've started drafting up legislation instead of building bonfires. I really have no pity for this woman because she chose to remain a victim instead of taking action.
When the players came across these elements in game, they took me aside on a break, or even just asked me as it happened if I could please refrain from that in the campaign, and then explained why.
Did they riot? No. Did they yell and bitch and moan? No. They asked me politely, nicely, and gave a good reason, so I respected their wishes because I wanted the game to remain fun for them.
In a game the size of ATiTD though, not everybody is going to agree, and when you get into the game, you agree to play by the game rules, which apparently include allowing historically accurate views on women. If you don't like it, nobody is forcing you to play.
I'm a college student who was interning in London this summer and traveling Europe by myself. Did people know I was American? Well, if I opened my mouth, obviously (except when I fooled a very aggressive beggar in Amsterdam into believing I was Japanese since I've been studying it and only spoke to him with that). But for the most part, I tried to blend in. When traveling alone abroad, you do NOT want to stick out.
The old saying "when in Rome....." certainly holds true. I hope that as the world becomes more globalized, that the younger Americans growing up learn to respect other countries and make an effort to learn more about them. I have to agree that southerners are the worst. And I felt absolutely ashamed to be standing in line with them at the airport. It was like I wanted to scream out "Please don't hate me just because I'm American, I made an effort to learn about and respect your country and not be a dumb tourist!!!!!!!"
But to all of us Americans who aren't dumb tourists, have heart, because I found many Europeans to be very understanding if you explain it in roughly the way I just did in this post. They will sympathize with the fact that you ARE trying to make an effort and they will respect you for the challenge that it is.
While in Florence, I was eating out at a nice restaurant, and the very nice waitress noticed me trying to order in Italian using my phrase book. She then sat down with me for a couple minutes to teach me how to properly pronounce the words, and what words I should really be using. She said she did this because she was impressed that I was trying to learn their language and not just expect them to know mine.
What I disagree with you on is what you think the role of marketing is.
As a marketer, my job is to let the public know about our product. Now, ethical people like myself would not lie about a product or promise things that obviously don't have a snowballs chance of hell of making it into this version. We do not just go hog wild with everything you give us......well, not if we're good at what we do. You see, its one thing if you just want to sell a product to someone once and never see them again, and never get any customers again. But if you have any desire of getting return customers, or having them spread the good word so you get more first time customers, viral marketing (industry term for word of mouth) is ESSENTIAL. And you don't have a chance in hell of getting that unless you have a solid product that lives up to your claims.
So while not all marketers are evil, and not all of us hype the hell out of everything we touch, game companies are definitely guilty as charged. And you are dead on about people eating up the hype. Well, ignorant people who don't suspect hype at least, which unfortunately is the vast majority.
In our industry, there's two terms we use, hype and buzz. Hype is more of a negative thing for the exact reasons you describe. Buzz however is the viral marketing aspect of it, and means people are spreading the good word about your product because the product lives up to claims, and in essence, sells itself.
I mean, why stop with just how tired you might be (do you have any idea how many drivers are half asleep in the morning on the way to work?) why not also check to see if you've had alchohol or smoked weed within the past 24 hours, because you know, that might be an indicator of irresponsible behavior which in turn makes you a more dangerous driver!
And I'm not saying that we absolutely need 100k people for this battle, but a couple thousand in one battle seems reasonable.