Well considering you have only made some vague unquantifiable claims about quality can you first Please name a PC game that wouldn't be better if developed to take advantage of the superior capabilities of a properly equipped console?
Kinda arbitrary huh?
Ok, how about you name a console game that you think would have made a better PC game IF it had some things that the console version could not possibly provide. This way at least I'll have a chance to know where you are coming from.
I'll give you a hint about just how far off base you are on graphics quality alone: RtCW for XBOX actually has graphical enhancements that could not be included in the PC version. In fact your PC game you just bought is likely backward compatible to TNT2 whereas every XBOX game is targetted specifically at that set of hardware. Which one do you think is being held back by technology?
Now I no spam fan (is anyone?) but the man is doing what he has to do in his eyes. This goes in line with the earlier thread about commercial skipping. Many, many posts stated that its too bad so sad for the TV networks that they can skip commercials. The technology exists so commercial skipping is both legally and morally acceptable in those poster's opinions.
I don't see a difference. This guy is just doing what is technologically possible. By the same reason, you can't be mad at him for that. Think of this little piece of what he does as spam block skipping. Same thing, the shoe is just on the other foot. And its two sizes too small. And has a 4" heel.
What does it all mean? Watch for both sides to go toe-to-toe on the technology until everyone's rights on both sides are all f'ed up. Then the government will step in further and both sides will like the outcome even less. But hey, if both sides has used reason in the first place, see a few ads, get some stuff for free, maybe we wouldn't even be talking about any of this: spam, TV, pop-ups, anything. Noone will win now.
I don't know, right now the display thing is a wash as more and more XBOX games utilize HDTV support. And 40" of TV goodness even at standard resolution kills 17" of monitor for my taste anyway. I thought it was about the gameplay and not the graphics. Or is that only certain threads?
As for controls, another wash IMHO. You don't need controls as precise when everyone else isn't cheating their arse off. And everyone else is using that controller too, so its an even playing field. Hey, everyone has the same "computer" in this case too so noone has the new ATI Uber 9000 while you are stuck with a Voodoo3.
I don't know, I see both sides. I personally just signed up for a free 2 month trial of XBOX Live and I'm pretty stoked so far. My little bro invited me to a game of RtCW while I was playing Amped 2 offline. That was amazing. And the voice, wow. Actual for reals teamwork with strangers.
The console might not be over the top yet, but everyday it inches closer. Just wait until next generation...
The obvious difference is that people have a vote about cars. The birds were not polled before the turbines were put up. How many Amish die each year from automobile accidents?
Not that I think there is anything wrong with the situation, but your comparison is so flawed I just couldnt let it go.
Guess what, not everyone in the world reads slashdot. Not everyone in the world cares what SCO does, nor has reason to. I doubt that the office manager has the slightest idea what is going on. She/he might be a damn fine office manager though. But hey, you missed out cause you are so close-minded and prejudiced.
Oh wait, close-minded, set in your ways, ivory tower and out of touch with the real world is exactly what gets one modded up on slashdot. I forgot for a second.
P.S. Please tell me the company you work for so I make sure not to send my resume. I have worked for a number of corporations and one has probably done something obscure that you don't like. I don't want to be wasting my time now knowing your position. But then again, I bet you're some college professor without a real job or real work experience. Based on your history of high-horse karma-whoring posts, I think I'm right.
Well considering that they could have had someone collect (steal back) the car, your scenario is little more than an appeal to pity.
Discovery ran a piece on these repo guys. All hollywooded up, but these were real down and dirty guys with tow trucks sneaking into driveways at night and towing cars. Hot stuff. So Onstar doesn't actually add a new threat in that arena.
PS. If you are having a baby, maybe you should continue those payments one more month until she delivers.
So Garage Games is founded by Dynamix of Tribes 2 fame, a Sierra published game. Valve also published via Sierra. Since then Garage Games has sprung up and Valve went for the whole Steam fiasco. What does Sierra do to these developers? You don't see id fleeing Activision or Epic fleeing Atari (Infogrames) even though neither is owned by the respective publisher.
Has this ever been talked about? Why do all the ex-Sierra people feel the need to change the world? Besides Steam, Valve signed a multi-title publishing deal with Activision. This makes it sound like they are no longer sold on the online distribution thing, but they still fled Sierra. Whiskey Tango Foxtrot?
Wow, thats alot of hate your spewing there partner. Lets look at your list:
ED:SR...It takes Resident Evil and changes a little bit. Not really original. Ico...The only reason this game ever gets mentioned is BECAUSE it is different. Its not very good. Kinda like new wave music. It was surely different, but who needs it now? Ikaruga...A veritcal shooter. Way to change the world. No One Lives Forever...Lets see, a FPS staring a spy. Wow, never played that before. Rez...Its a rail shooter from Sega! OMFG finally, oh wait, there was that whole Panzer Dragoon thing.
Why go on? Yes, its true that it is in fact risky to take risks so you got that right. But don't hold up arbitrary examples as innovative or original. Also, don't call people names because they buy what they like. Turns out, different people have different tastes. This is a Good Thing. Don't get mad at a business for providing to the consumer what they want either. If people want to buy a quality american football game, by god sell them one. Your hatefilled last paragraph illustrates one thing beautifully for me: The online community has no idea what's going on in the world as a whole. Turns out most people find out about games from TV or their friends, just like I did before the internet. GTA and THPS don't sell millions of copies because Gamespy likes them or some fanboy on slashdot approves. They are good games that people want.
Of course, this brings me back to the Gamecube as a whole...just because everyone on slashdot seems to defend it, doesn't mean its really successful "out there".
I don't understand the point of your post. Notice how above I wrote out USD? Its just three little letters, "GBP". Of course on slashdot even a tip is something to argue about I guess.
Being relatively young, the first time I saw TRON was on TV. Four years ago, Disney showed it at the El Capitan and I went to watch it on the giant old-school screen!
So I read your original post and couldn't resolve two movies costing 100. Then I read this and you are from the UK. I'm still having trouble resolving the number, but including at least the currency symbol would generally be a good thing. I usually do when I post in USD for ease of read.
FWIW, two movies here would be closer to equivalent to what I pay for 2MB cable than 5 times the access price so YMMV on the appeal to pity aspect.
If you expected to get paid, maybe you should have released your work under another license.
IMHO, there is nothing worse than a hypocrite. I'm not calling out specific names here because thats not the emphasis of the article, and it would also be trolling. BUT if you believe in releasing your software under the GPL or and even less restrictive license and you expect something in return outside of the license, you are a hypocrite. Give it away, or don't. I personally don't care, just pick one.
This is just one baby step on the path to Linux (OO and everything else really) one day being not free or free. As soon as a money source is found, I still personally expect things to go the way of MS. I could be wrong, but if someone out there is bitching about not getting paid already...just look out is all I'm saying.
I live in LA and I can say for certain there is no air pollution problem. Just this morning, from the top of the 405/105 interchange, I could see the lovely downtown skyline, the Hollywood sign(I couldn't read it, its not that big, but I could see it), and the mountain ranges all around.
Why should we fix anything until the alarmists and fear profiteers can prove there is even the potential for something to be broken?
Thanks for saving (?) me from a nuclear disaster. Can I please have some more nuclear plants in California now? It might help with the whole energy thing? No? Hmmm, so you've traded one potential problem for a very real one in my name then? Thanks I guess?
I love when people quote line by line rather than whole concepts.
#1) win32 is clearly not OSS at the base OS so there is no fear there. Windows wins. #2) if it is OS at the app level then they would look at it with his said "hairy eye-ball". If there was another OS solution they could go with then there is indeed another option. If not, the "hairy eye-ball" will point them to an option, either closed or open source, from which they could get an indemnity clause. For example, no matter what happens, the end user is not likely to be sued for using an Adobe product due to corporate indemnification, and even if problems arose, there are other media editing products available, just to pick an obvious example. This is from the part of the article you forgot to quote. Why did you do that?
Wow, what an inclusive/bullshit view of the world. Guess what, some things ARE better than others. Under your simple view of the things, technically Microsoft makes the best software ever written too. I mean, they have enough cash on hand to buy even EA. They must be the best, most important, smartest, most talented, group of people ever assembled.
Of course, thoughout this you have questioned even yourself. Why post if you don't believe you opinion is valid?
Are you suggesting biggest equates to best? Wouldn't that make Britney Spears and NSync the best musicians, Titanic and Independence Day some of the best movies and the Bible the best book ever written?
Wow, makes a good case for the opposite to be true....
Thanks for the info. Now based on what you said, there are a couple counter-points.
#1 YOU DON'T HAVE TO BECOME A JEDI. Using your great pistoleer example: Be happy as a pistoleer. If you enjoyed the steps it took you to get there and the game as a pistoleer in general, stay that way. The grass isn't always greener, in life or fake life. Its worth repeating, if you aren't willing to bust arse to become a Jedi, don't worry about becoming a Jedi. I imagine it would be pretty hard to become a Jedi in Ultima Online, yet noone there is complaining how hard it is. This brings me to point #2...
#2 Becoming a Jedi should be hard as hell and generally not a good time. Though I am not a hardcore fan of the movies, most of the characters seem pretty unhappy with the situation when they decide to follow the Jedi. They leave their families and loved ones forever. They just pick up and go. This is very similar to the profession issue. You stop what you liked doing and give it up for a tough road to hoe. Great sacrifice = great rewards.
#3 Not everyone should become a Jedi. If it was easy or fun to become a Jedi, everyone would do it. The game would cease to function. It would just be stupid. Now 2 and 3 lead me to #4...
#4 All of this is very consistent with the movie portrayals of Jedi. Other game inconsistencies aside, in the time of the movies (this is the time the game is set in, correct?) Jedi are rare. Being a Jedi in general seems to be pretty miserable. One guy lives in a cave or something, another lives in some swamp. Yeah, woo, being a Jedi rocks!
Here's the deal, anything positive or desirable about being a Jedi is assigned by the individual. I do not play this game but a few guys at work do. They enjoy the game very much and have no desire to become Jedi. Turns out, the Star Wars universe can be just a pretty fun place to run around if one knows where to look.
I'd also like to thank you for perpetuating the stereotype of gamer as whiny baby who wants everything handed to them and considers themself a game design god. You should reevaluate your own priorities in the game if you think the Jedi path is too hard, and maybe in real life if this is how you present yourself in general.
Isn't having to swap at all an unacceptable compromise? I mean, if the game was bigger than oh say 8GB I guess swapping would be ok, but lets not make it alright when the game is less than 2GB.
Very true. However, to answer my own question, the recommended spec for the PC version is 1.55GB storage +635 blah blah. So either way, no love. Then there is always the small development hitch of moving to the S3TC. Maybe easy, maybe not.
Just for the record, min spec (according to ebgames.com) for GTA:VC PC is 915MB of hard disc space +635MB additional if your video card does not support DirectX texture compression. It should be obvious that the Gamecube would not support DirectX anything. This is already above the magic 1.5GB limit strictly for storage. It can be assumed that at the min spec some info streams off the disc even on PC. Has anyone done a full install of VC that can give a precise amount? It would be (presumably) extremely difficult to do GTA as a multidisc since (presumably) the map streams from the disc. There would be a point in the city where crossing the street meant switching discs. Ugh.
Its also probable there are techinical difficulties beyond pure storage. It is quite common for developers to have difficulty porting to Nintendo consoles due to their (and Sony's) significantly proprietary hardware. PS2 to XBOX is less of a problem because no "optimizing" needs to take place just to make it run.
Of course, truth be told, its still all just about cash. As in: Sony paid a bucketload to have GTA be exclusive. Rockstar eventually saw they could make more than a bucketload porting it to XBOX and got out of that deal. They obviously don't feel a Gamecube port would be profitable for whatever reason at this time.
Slashdot Mirror
Well considering you have only made some vague unquantifiable claims about quality can you first Please name a PC game that wouldn't be better if developed to take advantage of the superior capabilities of a properly equipped console?
Kinda arbitrary huh?
Ok, how about you name a console game that you think would have made a better PC game IF it had some things that the console version could not possibly provide. This way at least I'll have a chance to know where you are coming from.
I'll give you a hint about just how far off base you are on graphics quality alone: RtCW for XBOX actually has graphical enhancements that could not be included in the PC version. In fact your PC game you just bought is likely backward compatible to TNT2 whereas every XBOX game is targetted specifically at that set of hardware. Which one do you think is being held back by technology?
Hypocrisy.
Now I no spam fan (is anyone?) but the man is doing what he has to do in his eyes. This goes in line with the earlier thread about commercial skipping. Many, many posts stated that its too bad so sad for the TV networks that they can skip commercials. The technology exists so commercial skipping is both legally and morally acceptable in those poster's opinions.
I don't see a difference. This guy is just doing what is technologically possible. By the same reason, you can't be mad at him for that. Think of this little piece of what he does as spam block skipping. Same thing, the shoe is just on the other foot. And its two sizes too small. And has a 4" heel.
What does it all mean? Watch for both sides to go toe-to-toe on the technology until everyone's rights on both sides are all f'ed up. Then the government will step in further and both sides will like the outcome even less. But hey, if both sides has used reason in the first place, see a few ads, get some stuff for free, maybe we wouldn't even be talking about any of this: spam, TV, pop-ups, anything. Noone will win now.
I don't know, right now the display thing is a wash as more and more XBOX games utilize HDTV support. And 40" of TV goodness even at standard resolution kills 17" of monitor for my taste anyway. I thought it was about the gameplay and not the graphics. Or is that only certain threads?
As for controls, another wash IMHO. You don't need controls as precise when everyone else isn't cheating their arse off. And everyone else is using that controller too, so its an even playing field. Hey, everyone has the same "computer" in this case too so noone has the new ATI Uber 9000 while you are stuck with a Voodoo3.
I don't know, I see both sides. I personally just signed up for a free 2 month trial of XBOX Live and I'm pretty stoked so far. My little bro invited me to a game of RtCW while I was playing Amped 2 offline. That was amazing. And the voice, wow. Actual for reals teamwork with strangers.
The console might not be over the top yet, but everyday it inches closer. Just wait until next generation...
The obvious difference is that people have a vote about cars. The birds were not polled before the turbines were put up. How many Amish die each year from automobile accidents?
Not that I think there is anything wrong with the situation, but your comparison is so flawed I just couldnt let it go.
Guess what, not everyone in the world reads slashdot. Not everyone in the world cares what SCO does, nor has reason to. I doubt that the office manager has the slightest idea what is going on. She/he might be a damn fine office manager though. But hey, you missed out cause you are so close-minded and prejudiced.
Oh wait, close-minded, set in your ways, ivory tower and out of touch with the real world is exactly what gets one modded up on slashdot. I forgot for a second.
P.S. Please tell me the company you work for so I make sure not to send my resume. I have worked for a number of corporations and one has probably done something obscure that you don't like. I don't want to be wasting my time now knowing your position. But then again, I bet you're some college professor without a real job or real work experience. Based on your history of high-horse karma-whoring posts, I think I'm right.
Well considering that they could have had someone collect (steal back) the car, your scenario is little more than an appeal to pity.
Discovery ran a piece on these repo guys. All hollywooded up, but these were real down and dirty guys with tow trucks sneaking into driveways at night and towing cars. Hot stuff. So Onstar doesn't actually add a new threat in that arena.
PS. If you are having a baby, maybe you should continue those payments one more month until she delivers.
So Garage Games is founded by Dynamix of Tribes 2 fame, a Sierra published game. Valve also published via Sierra. Since then Garage Games has sprung up and Valve went for the whole Steam fiasco. What does Sierra do to these developers? You don't see id fleeing Activision or Epic fleeing Atari (Infogrames) even though neither is owned by the respective publisher.
Has this ever been talked about? Why do all the ex-Sierra people feel the need to change the world? Besides Steam, Valve signed a multi-title publishing deal with Activision. This makes it sound like they are no longer sold on the online distribution thing, but they still fled Sierra. Whiskey Tango Foxtrot?
Wow, thats alot of hate your spewing there partner. Lets look at your list:
ED:SR...It takes Resident Evil and changes a little bit. Not really original.
Ico...The only reason this game ever gets mentioned is BECAUSE it is different. Its not very good. Kinda like new wave music. It was surely different, but who needs it now?
Ikaruga...A veritcal shooter. Way to change the world.
No One Lives Forever...Lets see, a FPS staring a spy. Wow, never played that before.
Rez...Its a rail shooter from Sega! OMFG finally, oh wait, there was that whole Panzer Dragoon thing.
Why go on? Yes, its true that it is in fact risky to take risks so you got that right. But don't hold up arbitrary examples as innovative or original. Also, don't call people names because they buy what they like. Turns out, different people have different tastes. This is a Good Thing. Don't get mad at a business for providing to the consumer what they want either. If people want to buy a quality american football game, by god sell them one. Your hatefilled last paragraph illustrates one thing beautifully for me: The online community has no idea what's going on in the world as a whole. Turns out most people find out about games from TV or their friends, just like I did before the internet. GTA and THPS don't sell millions of copies because Gamespy likes them or some fanboy on slashdot approves. They are good games that people want.
Of course, this brings me back to the Gamecube as a whole...just because everyone on slashdot seems to defend it, doesn't mean its really successful "out there".
I don't understand the point of your post. Notice how above I wrote out USD? Its just three little letters, "GBP". Of course on slashdot even a tip is something to argue about I guess.
Close-minded jackasses.
Here's one then!
Being relatively young, the first time I saw TRON was on TV. Four years ago, Disney showed it at the El Capitan and I went to watch it on the giant old-school screen!
You stand corrected.
So I read your original post and couldn't resolve two movies costing 100. Then I read this and you are from the UK. I'm still having trouble resolving the number, but including at least the currency symbol would generally be a good thing. I usually do when I post in USD for ease of read.
FWIW, two movies here would be closer to equivalent to what I pay for 2MB cable than 5 times the access price so YMMV on the appeal to pity aspect.
If you expected to get paid, maybe you should have released your work under another license.
IMHO, there is nothing worse than a hypocrite. I'm not calling out specific names here because thats not the emphasis of the article, and it would also be trolling. BUT if you believe in releasing your software under the GPL or and even less restrictive license and you expect something in return outside of the license, you are a hypocrite. Give it away, or don't. I personally don't care, just pick one.
This is just one baby step on the path to Linux (OO and everything else really) one day being not free or free. As soon as a money source is found, I still personally expect things to go the way of MS. I could be wrong, but if someone out there is bitching about not getting paid already...just look out is all I'm saying.
Hmm, I don't think PC is what anyone is looking for? How about factual accuracy? Or does that not fit on a bumper sticker?
Ah yes, nothing like pulling out the F word when one wants to make a balanced and complete point. Should be a corollary of Goodwin's Law.
Isn't that the same effect? You are a naive fool if you don't think that was the point in the first place.
I live in LA and I can say for certain there is no air pollution problem. Just this morning, from the top of the 405/105 interchange, I could see the lovely downtown skyline, the Hollywood sign(I couldn't read it, its not that big, but I could see it), and the mountain ranges all around.
Why should we fix anything until the alarmists and fear profiteers can prove there is even the potential for something to be broken?
Thanks for saving (?) me from a nuclear disaster. Can I please have some more nuclear plants in California now? It might help with the whole energy thing? No? Hmmm, so you've traded one potential problem for a very real one in my name then? Thanks I guess?
I love when people quote line by line rather than whole concepts.
#1) win32 is clearly not OSS at the base OS so there is no fear there. Windows wins.
#2) if it is OS at the app level then they would look at it with his said "hairy eye-ball". If there was another OS solution they could go with then there is indeed another option. If not, the "hairy eye-ball" will point them to an option, either closed or open source, from which they could get an indemnity clause. For example, no matter what happens, the end user is not likely to be sued for using an Adobe product due to corporate indemnification, and even if problems arose, there are other media editing products available, just to pick an obvious example. This is from the part of the article you forgot to quote. Why did you do that?
*unboggle*
Wow, what an inclusive/bullshit view of the world. Guess what, some things ARE better than others. Under your simple view of the things, technically Microsoft makes the best software ever written too. I mean, they have enough cash on hand to buy even EA. They must be the best, most important, smartest, most talented, group of people ever assembled.
Of course, thoughout this you have questioned even yourself. Why post if you don't believe you opinion is valid?
Are you suggesting biggest equates to best? Wouldn't that make Britney Spears and NSync the best musicians, Titanic and Independence Day some of the best movies and the Bible the best book ever written?
Wow, makes a good case for the opposite to be true....
Wow, so I guess its a question of lowered expectations. Got it now.
Thanks for the info. Now based on what you said, there are a couple counter-points.
#1 YOU DON'T HAVE TO BECOME A JEDI. Using your great pistoleer example: Be happy as a pistoleer. If you enjoyed the steps it took you to get there and the game as a pistoleer in general, stay that way. The grass isn't always greener, in life or fake life. Its worth repeating, if you aren't willing to bust arse to become a Jedi, don't worry about becoming a Jedi. I imagine it would be pretty hard to become a Jedi in Ultima Online, yet noone there is complaining how hard it is. This brings me to point #2...
#2 Becoming a Jedi should be hard as hell and generally not a good time. Though I am not a hardcore fan of the movies, most of the characters seem pretty unhappy with the situation when they decide to follow the Jedi. They leave their families and loved ones forever. They just pick up and go. This is very similar to the profession issue. You stop what you liked doing and give it up for a tough road to hoe. Great sacrifice = great rewards.
#3 Not everyone should become a Jedi. If it was easy or fun to become a Jedi, everyone would do it. The game would cease to function. It would just be stupid. Now 2 and 3 lead me to #4...
#4 All of this is very consistent with the movie portrayals of Jedi. Other game inconsistencies aside, in the time of the movies (this is the time the game is set in, correct?) Jedi are rare. Being a Jedi in general seems to be pretty miserable. One guy lives in a cave or something, another lives in some swamp. Yeah, woo, being a Jedi rocks!
Here's the deal, anything positive or desirable about being a Jedi is assigned by the individual. I do not play this game but a few guys at work do. They enjoy the game very much and have no desire to become Jedi. Turns out, the Star Wars universe can be just a pretty fun place to run around if one knows where to look.
I'd also like to thank you for perpetuating the stereotype of gamer as whiny baby who wants everything handed to them and considers themself a game design god. You should reevaluate your own priorities in the game if you think the Jedi path is too hard, and maybe in real life if this is how you present yourself in general.
Isn't having to swap at all an unacceptable compromise? I mean, if the game was bigger than oh say 8GB I guess swapping would be ok, but lets not make it alright when the game is less than 2GB.
Very true. However, to answer my own question, the recommended spec for the PC version is 1.55GB storage +635 blah blah. So either way, no love. Then there is always the small development hitch of moving to the S3TC. Maybe easy, maybe not.
Just for the record, min spec (according to ebgames.com) for GTA:VC PC is 915MB of hard disc space +635MB additional if your video card does not support DirectX texture compression. It should be obvious that the Gamecube would not support DirectX anything. This is already above the magic 1.5GB limit strictly for storage. It can be assumed that at the min spec some info streams off the disc even on PC. Has anyone done a full install of VC that can give a precise amount? It would be (presumably) extremely difficult to do GTA as a multidisc since (presumably) the map streams from the disc. There would be a point in the city where crossing the street meant switching discs. Ugh.
Its also probable there are techinical difficulties beyond pure storage. It is quite common for developers to have difficulty porting to Nintendo consoles due to their (and Sony's) significantly proprietary hardware. PS2 to XBOX is less of a problem because no "optimizing" needs to take place just to make it run.
Of course, truth be told, its still all just about cash. As in: Sony paid a bucketload to have GTA be exclusive. Rockstar eventually saw they could make more than a bucketload porting it to XBOX and got out of that deal. They obviously don't feel a Gamecube port would be profitable for whatever reason at this time.