Ok. Lets for a sec presume thats EXACTLY what Clinton was doing. What's GWB's excuse? All the reasons he gave for the war were untrue (and dont say removing Saddam cuz that wasnt the reason we were given pre-war). Somehow seems killing less then a hundred iraqi's (number pulled outta my ass) vs killing 600+ US Soldiers / maiming thousands / killing tens of thousands of Iraqi's, both essentially having shitty reasons if any. Hmm what's worse?
Just wondering how being Anti-Israeli makes someone Anti-Semetic? Kinda like if you think the Saudi Arabian Government is evil, that automatically presumes you think Islam is evil??
- Being a soldier means as much about loving war as being a firefighter does about loving fire.
Just an OT Comment, a firefighter only 'fights' fires if they break out, while a soldier can be used in an offensive war as well (plug whatever country/war you want as an example germany, US, Britain,Iraq etc etc).
I see this more of an issue of there not being a popular service to support this. Perhaps Kazaa on steroids which has anonymous usage statistics per genre allowing popular songs to bubble up? some sort of metamoderatings system perhaps;)
Two ideas
1) we need something like MoveOn.org involved, they're pretty effective at real-world slash-dottings etc. A computing law advocacy with a couple of hundred thousand if not million members should be able to make some difference.
2) Ask organizations like MoveOn.org (or moveon itself) for help in getting the word out?
After everything we've heard about Diebold in the past few months - thier ties to Bush, uncertified software, etc - does anyone really trust them
Bush?:)
ROTFLMAO
Thanks:)
SUMMARY
The following article lists the known content errors in Someone's in the Kitchen. These errors are specific to version 1.0 of Someone's in the Kitchen
Check this out (about the US being pissed out 'over OIL' against another Iraqi leader 50 odd years ago) and helping to destabilize his government
http://coat.ncf.ca/our_magazine/links/issue51/arti cles/51_20-21.pdf
Not to mention actively assassinating opposition (Democratically elected) to the Shah of Iran (Dictator;)) around the same time.
Not to mention the first incident kinda led to the chain of events which eventuaally led to the rise of Saddam (not to mention our support / supply of bio/chem weapons to Iraq when we 'liked' Saddam:)).
Bottom line being where the US/Capitalism is concerned , those with the big stick pretty much can/have beat everybody else into submission:)
The thing which pisses me off more then that is claiming to be the 'good guys':)
:)
If someone is willing to offer you a job with enough money to make travel time of two weeks vs 1 day inconsequential, well I want your goddamned job:D
Frankly, I see it as an issue like Apartheid in South Africa. Perhaps you thought Apartheid was great as long as you could make money from it. In that case, I despise you, but it's not like you could possibly care about that. But in any case, perhaps you can at least grasp, with that parallel, why some of us wouldn't go for a chance at a lot of money here.
And yet Palestinians have no vote, are now being walled out of the rest of the state and Israel rules n rocks:) Yes I know OT. The state of women in those countries (country?) is relatively recent and does not have to do with religion. Many Islamic scholars say that the whole burka / abaya thing (head to toe covering) was a cultural thing that caught on. Karen Armstrong in one of her books said something akin to it being imported from the Easten Orthodox people at the gates of Arabia (Constantinople etc). Regardless of the nit-picking, the Koran itself never mentions anythng like that, the only passage I've ever found related to that enjoins women to cover themselves 'decently'. Kinda leaves it up for grabs what the 'definition' of decently is. From some source I've read (right or wrong) nudity was quite common in Arabia prior to Islam and the passage basically meant for women to wear clothes:). Read the Koran yourself, and THEN make up your mind how crazy the religion is. oh yeah remember to read the Old / New Testament as well while your at it:).
That's something that I never understood.
america and allies have the 'right' to bear nukes (Israel:-D) while everyone else (Pakistan, Iran etc) are EVIL if they want to equal the status quo? Ok they're altering the status quo but evil? I'm pretty sure most treaties that the US touts about nuclear proliferation (CTBT) also called on the known Nuclear powers to drastically reduce and/or eliminate their Nukes but um, somehow dont see that happening:). But hey the US is 'sane' so we're allowed to keep nukes;):)
ok, (some) they're stupid insane and inhumane. Totally agree, how do you 'fix' the problem as opposed to bashing the country?
Perhaps by supporting moderates? By not undermining them by going psycho against neighbouring states? (Syria / Iran / Iraq)? By trying to counter the influence of nutty religious people?
Yes most of the Islamic world is so backwards (and yes I am a muslim) that its insanely scary.
But how do you counter that? How did the west rise above it? I dont know the answer. My pov would be education, research into the religion itself (how the Koran and science inter-relate - stuff like evolution etc). Maybe we could sponsor grants for stuff like that? Instead of viewing it as fanatic people , look at the real issues, religious people + backward society + Israel/Palestine conflict = BAD stuff. With sufficient effort I'm pretty sure its fixable but what needs to be understood here (the US in particular) is to compare Saudi society with what the US was 100-150 years ago? And then judge how barbaric it is? Yes that doesnt mean they're right, but that their society isnt as developed as ours (mentally younger?:))
Sorry for typing out loud?;)
Look at the american media and to a large extent public perception. Howard Dean says that the US should treat Palestine and Israel equally in order to be (I think he said appear to be) a fair broker in peace talks. He gets lambasted for being anti-semitic. Politician X says something negative about Israel and they're labelled as Anti-Semetic. Same point, Israel tries to sell the image that they represent all Jews everywhere. The message does get a lot of coverage and 'surprisingly' people in the middle east also fall prey to the same propaganda.
Israel != Judaism
Separate the religion and state and its largely fine. Islam and Judaism co-existed for over a millenia in the middle east with only a few hiccups along the way. Compare that to the West and the frequent pogroms of Jews. Only from the beginning of this century (when Zionism started gaining popularity) did the two go up against each other. If you haven't read Holy War (By Karen Armstrong) I highly recommend it. Also about Saudia and all the other 'backward' countries.
a) patience, it took the west a while to get where they are now, it'll take them a while as well
b) quit supporting dictatorships AND (equally importantly) corrupt governments and it'll go in the right general direction
c) encourage the study of Islam in the West to prevent misconceptions
d) Resolve the Israel / Palestine conflict regardless of the cost and effort. Unless that issue is resolved nothing will really work.
About your statement about the Elders of ZION
again Zionism != Judaism
factor in the marketing attempt to convert that fallacy into a tautology (sp?) and voila you understand the anti-jewish sentiment in the middle east.
Re:Best examples of heresy I can think of
on
What You Can't Say
·
· Score: 1
I agree totally but the thing is, the evidence against Bin Laden is equally flimsy or at least has been deemed too 'important' to be disclosed to 'we the people';). Since we all TRUST our government, obviously they always tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth:).
The Taliban have previously hinted they might give bin Laden up for trial in a neutral, preferably Muslim, country.
What I hate about the whole thing is that all they asked was for a trial just not in America (which they didnt trust) n they'd turn over Bin Laden, compare that with the tax dollars spent and still being spent in Afghanistan for stuff that won't really take (not getting rid of the warlords n all)
and yes I am a liberal nut:)
They've made it very grandma friendly. It connects automatically but you aren't allowed access to the web until you authenticate. When you fire up your browser (which every grandma;) trying to access aol.com would) they throw up a login screen where you enter your login and password and it redirects you to aol.com or whatever. Contrast that with having to hunt for the 'control panel', finding your network connections, then finding t-mobile and setting its WEP key
Hmm, alternatively right click on the '2 computer icon' / Available Networks / tmobile / WEP (yes the grandma crowd will be using windows:)) is much easier but still not as natural as going through whatever web browser they use.
Well ok, make that 90%?;). Though I admit during the past decade Indian cinema has improved pretty much exponentially. Exclude the blatant plagiarism;) they're doing great work (the copy of Overboard and Reservoir Dogs being two movies that I've seen, dont remember the Indian versions names ).
Tagline for Reservoir dogs: Five Total Strangers Team Up For The Perfect Crime. They Don't Know Each Other's Name. But They've Got Each Other's Number
Tagline for Kaante: 6 perfect strangers, 1 perfect crime. Now, all they have to fear is each other...
Both courtesy of IMDB:)
heh, dont mean to slam em, watch the indian versions sometime, seem pretty funny:)
I am an american, and I dont appreciate America giving aid to countries with questionable human rights records to further one agenda or the other (be it Israel over Palestine, Iraq n Turkey over the Kurds n Iran etc etc). Wish there was something I could do about where my tax dollars go, but since both the GOP n Dem's have the exact same policy;)
Slashdot Mirror
Ok. Lets for a sec presume thats EXACTLY what Clinton was doing. What's GWB's excuse? All the reasons he gave for the war were untrue (and dont say removing Saddam cuz that wasnt the reason we were given pre-war). Somehow seems killing less then a hundred iraqi's (number pulled outta my ass) vs killing 600+ US Soldiers / maiming thousands / killing tens of thousands of Iraqi's, both essentially having shitty reasons if any. Hmm what's worse?
Just wondering how being Anti-Israeli makes someone Anti-Semetic? Kinda like if you think the Saudi Arabian Government is evil, that automatically presumes you think Islam is evil??
- Being a soldier means as much about loving war as being a firefighter does about loving fire. Just an OT Comment, a firefighter only 'fights' fires if they break out, while a soldier can be used in an offensive war as well (plug whatever country/war you want as an example germany, US, Britain,Iraq etc etc).
I see this more of an issue of there not being a popular service to support this. Perhaps Kazaa on steroids which has anonymous usage statistics per genre allowing popular songs to bubble up? some sort of metamoderatings system perhaps ;)
ROTFL. I can actually picture a couple of my female friends make that exact argument (the puppy part :))
Not if the same act netted them 601+ million? (minus costs obviously :))
BlueSpoon 10 grams In-Ear Image courtesy of Google Groups :D
Two ideas 1) we need something like MoveOn.org involved, they're pretty effective at real-world slash-dottings etc. A computing law advocacy with a couple of hundred thousand if not million members should be able to make some difference. 2) Ask organizations like MoveOn.org (or moveon itself) for help in getting the word out?
How about a tilt and swivel mounting on the wall? Horizontal for TV, Vertical for mirror mode
After everything we've heard about Diebold in the past few months - thier ties to Bush, uncertified software, etc - does anyone really trust them :)
Bush?
ROTFLMAO Thanks :)
SUMMARY
The following article lists the known content errors in Someone's in the Kitchen. These errors are specific to version 1.0 of Someone's in the Kitchen
hehehe wish I had some points. Haven't laughed this hard in um, many posts? ;)
Check this out (about the US being pissed out 'over OIL' against another Iraqi leader 50 odd years ago) and helping to destabilize his government http://coat.ncf.ca/our_magazine/links/issue51/arti cles/51_20-21.pdf
Not to mention actively assassinating opposition (Democratically elected) to the Shah of Iran (Dictator ;)) around the same time.
Not to mention the first incident kinda led to the chain of events which eventuaally led to the rise of Saddam (not to mention our support / supply of bio/chem weapons to Iraq when we 'liked' Saddam :)).
Bottom line being where the US/Capitalism is concerned , those with the big stick pretty much can/have beat everybody else into submission :)
The thing which pisses me off more then that is claiming to be the 'good guys' :)
:) If someone is willing to offer you a job with enough money to make travel time of two weeks vs 1 day inconsequential, well :D
I want your goddamned job
Frankly, I see it as an issue like Apartheid in South Africa. Perhaps you thought Apartheid was great as long as you could make money from it. In that case, I despise you, but it's not like you could possibly care about that. But in any case, perhaps you can at least grasp, with that parallel, why some of us wouldn't go for a chance at a lot of money here. And yet Palestinians have no vote, are now being walled out of the rest of the state and Israel rules n rocks :) Yes I know OT. The state of women in those countries (country?) is relatively recent and does not have to do with religion. Many Islamic scholars say that the whole burka / abaya thing (head to toe covering) was a cultural thing that caught on. Karen Armstrong in one of her books said something akin to it being imported from the Easten Orthodox people at the gates of Arabia (Constantinople etc). Regardless of the nit-picking, the Koran itself never mentions anythng like that, the only passage I've ever found related to that enjoins women to cover themselves 'decently'. Kinda leaves it up for grabs what the 'definition' of decently is. From some source I've read (right or wrong) nudity was quite common in Arabia prior to Islam and the passage basically meant for women to wear clothes :). Read the Koran yourself, and THEN make up your mind how crazy the religion is. oh yeah remember to read the Old / New Testament as well while your at it :).
As we are for what Bush does (deaths of any Iraqi's :)) and the deaths of Palestinians by weapons paid for by us Tax payers :)
Step 1) Answer your Question Step 2) ??? Step 3) World Peace :)
Step 4) Profit? ;)
That's something that I never understood. america and allies have the 'right' to bear nukes (Israel :-D) while everyone else (Pakistan, Iran etc) are EVIL if they want to equal the status quo? Ok they're altering the status quo but evil? I'm pretty sure most treaties that the US touts about nuclear proliferation (CTBT) also called on the known Nuclear powers to drastically reduce and/or eliminate their Nukes but um, somehow dont see that happening :). But hey the US is 'sane' so we're allowed to keep nukes ;):)
ok, (some) they're stupid insane and inhumane. Totally agree, how do you 'fix' the problem as opposed to bashing the country? Perhaps by supporting moderates? By not undermining them by going psycho against neighbouring states? (Syria / Iran / Iraq)? By trying to counter the influence of nutty religious people? :))
Sorry for typing out loud? ;)
Yes most of the Islamic world is so backwards (and yes I am a muslim) that its insanely scary. But how do you counter that? How did the west rise above it? I dont know the answer. My pov would be education, research into the religion itself (how the Koran and science inter-relate - stuff like evolution etc). Maybe we could sponsor grants for stuff like that?
Instead of viewing it as fanatic people , look at the real issues, religious people + backward society + Israel/Palestine conflict = BAD stuff. With sufficient effort I'm pretty sure its fixable but what needs to be understood here (the US in particular) is to compare Saudi society with what the US was 100-150 years ago? And then judge how barbaric it is? Yes that doesnt mean they're right, but that their society isnt as developed as ours (mentally younger?
Look at the american media and to a large extent public perception. Howard Dean says that the US should treat Palestine and Israel equally in order to be (I think he said appear to be) a fair broker in peace talks. He gets lambasted for being anti-semitic. Politician X says something negative about Israel and they're labelled as Anti-Semetic. Same point, Israel tries to sell the image that they represent all Jews everywhere. The message does get a lot of coverage and 'surprisingly' people in the middle east also fall prey to the same propaganda. Israel != Judaism Separate the religion and state and its largely fine. Islam and Judaism co-existed for over a millenia in the middle east with only a few hiccups along the way. Compare that to the West and the frequent pogroms of Jews. Only from the beginning of this century (when Zionism started gaining popularity) did the two go up against each other. If you haven't read Holy War (By Karen Armstrong) I highly recommend it. Also about Saudia and all the other 'backward' countries. a) patience, it took the west a while to get where they are now, it'll take them a while as well b) quit supporting dictatorships AND (equally importantly) corrupt governments and it'll go in the right general direction c) encourage the study of Islam in the West to prevent misconceptions d) Resolve the Israel / Palestine conflict regardless of the cost and effort. Unless that issue is resolved nothing will really work. About your statement about the Elders of ZION again Zionism != Judaism factor in the marketing attempt to convert that fallacy into a tautology (sp?) and voila you understand the anti-jewish sentiment in the middle east.
I agree totally but the thing is, the evidence against Bin Laden is equally flimsy or at least has been deemed too 'important' to be disclosed to 'we the people' ;). Since we all TRUST our government, obviously they always tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth :).
The Taliban have previously hinted they might give bin Laden up for trial in a neutral, preferably Muslim, country.
What I hate about the whole thing is that all they asked was for a trial just not in America (which they didnt trust) n they'd turn over Bin Laden, compare that with the tax dollars spent and still being spent in Afghanistan for stuff that won't really take (not getting rid of the warlords n all)
and yes I am a liberal nut :)
How do you kill off Kazaa's access. Seems to be a pretty persistent bugger tunneling through HTTP when you close off its default port.
They've made it very grandma friendly. It connects automatically but you aren't allowed access to the web until you authenticate. When you fire up your browser (which every grandma ;) trying to access aol.com would) they throw up a login screen where you enter your login and password and it redirects you to aol.com or whatever. Contrast that with having to hunt for the 'control panel', finding your network connections, then finding t-mobile and setting its WEP key
Hmm, alternatively right click on the '2 computer icon' / Available Networks / tmobile / WEP (yes the grandma crowd will be using windows :)) is much easier but still not as natural as going through whatever web browser they use.
Well ok, make that 90%? ;). Though I admit during the past decade Indian cinema has improved pretty much exponentially. Exclude the blatant plagiarism ;) they're doing great work (the copy of Overboard and Reservoir Dogs being two movies that I've seen, dont remember the Indian versions names ). :)
heh, dont mean to slam em, watch the indian versions sometime, seem pretty funny :)
Tagline for Reservoir dogs: Five Total Strangers Team Up For The Perfect Crime. They Don't Know Each Other's Name. But They've Got Each Other's Number
Tagline for Kaante: 6 perfect strangers, 1 perfect crime. Now, all they have to fear is each other... Both courtesy of IMDB
I am an american, and I dont appreciate America giving aid to countries with questionable human rights records to further one agenda or the other (be it Israel over Palestine, Iraq n Turkey over the Kurds n Iran etc etc). Wish there was something I could do about where my tax dollars go, but since both the GOP n Dem's have the exact same policy ;)