Because all digital data is a stream of bits, it can always be copied if the bit stream is accessible just before it gets converted to analog. As long as the information has to be accessible to human sensory input, it also can be captured and recorded. It matters not how fancy the encryption processes are along the way. If the entire computer including display and speakers could be put into a sealed module, accessing the bitstream would be much harder, but still not impossible.
Granted that this scenario may happen at large corporations who can afford an expensive IT dept. but at small businesses and with individuals it is much less likely. Backups are unfortunately not done as rigourosly as needed and because of storage costs, data are often erased if it is felt it is no longer needed. Some people even deliberately erase almost all communications and other data that they feel may someday be used in a court proceeding.
E-mail also aren't the only kinds of documents stored on computers. The bottom line of all this is that ephemeral digital bits can be modified much more easily than paper, film, and oldfashioned phonograph records.
...In general, it is FAR easier to forge a hand letter...
So now you find two or three or more copies of a purported e-mail and they are all slightly different because they went through various computers etc. How do you unambiguously determine which is the truthful one? Electronic bits are ephemeral creations whose arrangements can be undetectable altered with varying degrees of difficulty, ranging from trivially easy to quite difficult. Alterations of ink on paper with a true signature are much harder to mess with unless the person has a high skill in this. It does not require nearly as much skill to mess with electronic data. It is much harder to fake a film photograph undetectably than a digital version.
...If you write a note its admissable, if its electronic it should be equally admissable (and easier to get hold of)...
The problem is that electronic bits can be easily altered in such a manner that it is impossible even for the best experts to tell that this has been done. Altering a paper note in an undetectable manner is considerably more difficult.
There is no problem with trusting the computers. After all they are only machines that do what their master tell them to do. It is the people that run the computers that often are not trustworthy. MS wants to set thing up so only they and their designates can be the master of your computer. This means that if they can be trusted, then this might work. The problem is that MS is run by people and what makes anybody think that their people are more trustworthy than the average computer user? In the end it boils down to trust in people, not machines. If your car's brakes are worked on by an untrustworthy mechanic, is it the brakes or automobile maker's fault if the brakes fail and your car crashes?
Exactly, bits are bits are bits and there is no way to tell whether a collection of bits is truthful for the purpose for which it may be represented in a court room. Unless there is some kind of strong encryption/authentication system on the e-mail for example, there is no iron-clad way to determine whether either the text itself or times and autherships are true. Digital pictures can be altered, making it difficult and sometimes impossible to tell whether they are telling the truth.
That is one reason a mouse click is NOT equivalent to a signature on a piece of paper. There is still a vast difference between ephemeral electronic bits and permanent records on tangible media. Read only digital media improve this somewhat, but even say a burned CD can be copied, destroyed, its contents edited, then reburned and represented as an original archive and there would be no way to determine that this had been done. If the outcome of a case depends on electronic records then the accused could easily be framed or the guilty get free.
In a sense, CA is an island for many pests. CA is surrounded by formidable mountains and deserts which has kept certain bugs out of the state. These bugs however can be transported by people in fruits and plants they are bringing into the state. In pioneer days, before the railroads, it was challenging for people to get to CA by land.
...Think for a moment about some good movie you saw last year...
Yes, but I don't think I want to watch that movie several times. Most videos are watched maybe only once, sometimes twice, but a good piece of music gets listened to over and over until you find yourself humming the tune at odd moments. Music also is an accompanyment of other activities, such as driving a car. Most people listen to their favorite tunes over and over again, but few watch videos multiple times. Renting makes sense for video, but not for most music.
It might be nice for iTunes to offer a subscription to their music library instead of letting people listen to only 30 seconds of a song. Then if I really liked a song I could get it unlocked for 99 cents so I could listen to it ever afterwards even if I cancelled my subscription.
...with the maintenance levels of their hardware and software...
That's why we mostly use Macs here in a small business. We have no IT dept. They cost a litttle more originally than Wintel boxes, but need MUCH less total system maintenance, both hardware and software. We have not spent one red cent for nor needed to waste users time with any kind of malware protection, because there is no malware for Macs. No BSOD or OSX re-installs either. We do have a router/firewall protecting our network and for the sake of the few Wintel boxes we do have. Macs are much cheaper in the long run and "just work".
...Software is sold AS IS, under a non-transferable license,...
That is not true. I can sell *any* software I legally purchased like any other commodity to anyone I wish. I cannot keep a copy of the software for myself however. Any license "agreement" that would purport to limit my freedom in this is illegal. Software is COPYRIGHTED, and like any other copyrighted work I can sell it as I please, as long as I don't make copies thereof without the permission of the holder of the copyright.
Yes, and when I stop paying for my subcription to National Geographic, all my past issues with all their beautiful pictures disappear into thin air also.
...Can you give me a clear reason why TV is different from music now?...
Certainly!
Most videos are watched maybe only once, sometimes twice, but a good piece of music get listened to over and over until you find yourself humming the tune at odd moments. Music also is an accompanyment of other activities, such as driving a car. Video generally requires your full time attention so you can get the story line. Do you really want to pay someone FOREVER again and again, so you can listen to your repertiore of favorite songs whenever and wherever you want? Record your favorite songs from the radio for free and then they'll never cost you any more after that to listen.
...you purchased the right to listen to it for a bit...
Why purchase it when you can get it for free? It's called radio. If you record the music from the radio, it will not disappear after you turn the radio off. There is also subscription radio and you can record from that and keep the music after you cancel the subscription. Some radio station even have request programs where they will play songs you ask for if they've got them.
... I don't get why people can't pay $10 for unlimited music...
It is unlimited in the same sense as your satelite or other subscription radio service is unlimited. You get to listen to the station as long as you subscribe. It is basically an on demand Internet radio station with a recorder attached. The difference is that if you record something from the radio, the recording doesn't disappear if you cancel your subscription.
Music and video are very different. I can watch most movies once or at most twice. However I can listen to the a great piece of music many times. I can't see paying someone again and again forever to let me listen to my favorite pieces multiple number of times. Music works well as an accompanyment to other activities, such as driving a car, but video generally requires full time attention. I'd much rather rent my videos and BUY my music. I suspect that the majority of people is with me on that and so I don't think the "buy" model for music will be replaced with the "rent" model for most consumers.
...getting off local servers and desktops and onto the web...
Having critical data who knows where, on some server in cyberspace, dependent on a not always reliable, sometimes continent spanning communications system may not be so attractive to many. It has nothing to do with bandwidth, but reliability, security and accessability. Filling out forms or sending text documents is an activity millions do everyday as part of their jobs and those activities take very little bandwidth and could be and did get done quite well over a dial up connection back in 1998 and earlier. Most business users don't send massive amounts of data to require a high bandwidth connections for everybody.
If a backhoe fade or other network failure occurs users can still use all local PC programs until the problem is fixed. If the software and data reside on some distant server, then everybody can only drink coffee and chat at the water cooler.
Back in the mainframe days, computing was centralized. Then the PERSONAL computer came along and it is not likely that too many users will give up the personal part of computing.
An automobile is personal transportation. If you look at the % of people who use rapid transit (the Internet) or have more than one driver per car, especially in spread out cities in the west of the USA, then you may get an idea of the number of people who will entrust their critical data and programs to someone over whom they have no control whatsoever.
Question: Have they EVER lead technologically? It seems to me they are good copiers and are superb at marketing products that are good enough, but not great.
I am not a lawyer, but I suspect your interstate example will not hold internationally. There is likely a Federal law or Federal case law that makes your example work between two states of the our country. I doubt that any lawsuit in a French court would affect a US citizen or corporation unless that citizen shows up in France or the corporation has offices in France. A US court will NOT enforce French law unless there is a treaty or agreement concerning the issues in dispute.
Is it illegal to disconnect or disable these boxes? As far as RFID tags, a few seconds in a microwave ought to take care of them.
Until we as a society are willing to let the uninsured, smokers, druggies or those who don't wear helmets or seatbelts just die without any medical help, we need to have laws that at least coerce most people to behave responsibly. Some of course won't behave right and they make life more complicated and expensive for those who do.
...But doesnt this only effect companies in France?...
The laws of a country are only effective and binding on those within the borders of that country unless there are treaties or agreements between various countries that affect the particular issues. French courts do not have blanket jurisdiction on every issue. The French can prohibit their citizens to do business with another country in the same way that the US has and is treating Cuba. In practice, this is hard to enforce in cyberspace however.
...If a French company transacts business in the United States...
Where business is transacted is difficult to say when it comes to the Internet. Is it where the user is or where the server is or where the business is incorporated or physically present? In the "real" world, I cannot be held to the laws of a country that I have never actually set foot in. Unless two or more countries have agreements concerning some matters there is nothing that can be done. In this case, if France doesn't like what Google in California is doing, that's just too bad. If Google has servers or other property in France, then that falls under their jurisdiction.
Apple's Xserve OSX systems are a good buy since Apple doesn't charge per seat for client licenses. Also there is many Unix type software available both for free and for money. The systems are compact and easy to maintain and administer.
We were still using a Mac SE30 (from 1989) as an answering/fax machine but "upgraded" it a year ago to the present Color Classic (made in 1993) running System 7.5.1 so we could access it over the local network. The Classic running 24/7 is also used to allow an old Apple Laserwriter (which still works just fine) with only an Appletalk interface to be accessible via ethernet. The answering/fax function is provided by a DoveFaxPlus 2400baud modem. I wonder if this setup would qualify for a prize?
Copying the link to the clipboard and pasting into textedit on OSX shows the same URL, but the "a" looks diffferent than the other characters. Pasting into BBedit shows some strange added character. This is a nasty trick that will undoubtedly be used by evildoers. If an unsolicted email or any web page comes up with a window that asks for passwords or other personal info, then the only defense I can think of right now is to type the link manually into the URL window.
Slashdot Mirror
Because all digital data is a stream of bits, it can always be copied if the bit stream is accessible just before it gets converted to analog. As long as the information has to be accessible to human sensory input, it also can be captured and recorded. It matters not how fancy the encryption processes are along the way. If the entire computer including display and speakers could be put into a sealed module, accessing the bitstream would be much harder, but still not impossible.
...at IBM to your computer at MSFT...
Granted that this scenario may happen at large corporations who can afford an expensive IT dept. but at small businesses and with individuals it is much less likely. Backups are unfortunately not done as rigourosly as needed and because of storage costs, data are often erased if it is felt it is no longer needed. Some people even deliberately erase almost all communications and other data that they feel may someday be used in a court proceeding.
E-mail also aren't the only kinds of documents stored on computers. The bottom line of all this is that ephemeral digital bits can be modified much more easily than paper, film, and oldfashioned phonograph records.
...In general, it is FAR easier to forge a hand letter...
So now you find two or three or more copies of a purported e-mail and they are all slightly different because they went through various computers etc. How do you unambiguously determine which is the truthful one? Electronic bits are ephemeral creations whose arrangements can be undetectable altered with varying degrees of difficulty, ranging from trivially easy to quite difficult. Alterations of ink on paper with a true signature are much harder to mess with unless the person has a high skill in this. It does not require nearly as much skill to mess with electronic data. It is much harder to fake a film photograph undetectably than a digital version.
...If you write a note its admissable, if its electronic it should be equally admissable (and easier to get hold of)...
The problem is that electronic bits can be easily altered in such a manner that it is impossible even for the best experts to tell that this has been done. Altering a paper note in an undetectable manner is considerably more difficult.
..trusted computing...
There is no problem with trusting the computers. After all they are only machines that do what their master tell them to do. It is the people that run the computers that often are not trustworthy. MS wants to set thing up so only they and their designates can be the master of your computer. This means that if they can be trusted, then this might work. The problem is that MS is run by people and what makes anybody think that their people are more trustworthy than the average computer user? In the end it boils down to trust in people, not machines. If your car's brakes are worked on by an untrustworthy mechanic, is it the brakes or automobile maker's fault if the brakes fail and your car crashes?
...all electronic logs...
Exactly, bits are bits are bits and there is no way to tell whether a collection of bits is truthful for the purpose for which it may be represented in a court room. Unless there is some kind of strong encryption/authentication system on the e-mail for example, there is no iron-clad way to determine whether either the text itself or times and autherships are true. Digital pictures can be altered, making it difficult and sometimes impossible to tell whether they are telling the truth.
That is one reason a mouse click is NOT equivalent to a signature on a piece of paper. There is still a vast difference between ephemeral electronic bits and permanent records on tangible media. Read only digital media improve this somewhat, but even say a burned CD can be copied, destroyed, its contents edited, then reburned and represented as an original archive and there would be no way to determine that this had been done. If the outcome of a case depends on electronic records then the accused could easily be framed or the guilty get free.
...true shrink wrap EULAs have been tested in most major jurisdictions and are valid contracts...
Right! Since when can an 9 year old enter into a valid contract anywhere? He can click a mouse fine though! Bullshit!
...What sense does it make to check what pests...
In a sense, CA is an island for many pests. CA is surrounded by formidable mountains and deserts which has kept certain bugs out of the state. These bugs however can be transported by people in fruits and plants they are bringing into the state. In pioneer days, before the railroads, it was challenging for people to get to CA by land.
...Think for a moment about some good movie you saw last year...
Yes, but I don't think I want to watch that movie several times. Most videos are watched maybe only once, sometimes twice, but a good piece of music gets listened to over and over until you find yourself humming the tune at odd moments. Music also is an accompanyment of other activities, such as driving a car. Most people listen to their favorite tunes over and over again, but few watch videos multiple times. Renting makes sense for video, but not for most music.
It might be nice for iTunes to offer a subscription to their music library instead of letting people listen to only 30 seconds of a song. Then if I really liked a song I could get it unlocked for 99 cents so I could listen to it ever afterwards even if I cancelled my subscription.
...with the maintenance levels of their hardware and software...
That's why we mostly use Macs here in a small business. We have no IT dept. They cost a litttle more originally than Wintel boxes, but need MUCH less total system maintenance, both hardware and software. We have not spent one red cent for nor needed to waste users time with any kind of malware protection, because there is no malware for Macs. No BSOD or OSX re-installs either. We do have a router/firewall protecting our network and for the sake of the few Wintel boxes we do have. Macs are much cheaper in the long run and "just work".
...Software is sold AS IS, under a non-transferable license, ...
That is not true. I can sell *any* software I legally purchased like any other commodity to anyone I wish. I cannot keep a copy of the software for myself however. Any license "agreement" that would purport to limit my freedom in this is illegal. Software is COPYRIGHTED, and like any other copyrighted work I can sell it as I please, as long as I don't make copies thereof without the permission of the holder of the copyright.
...But, you know, when you stop paying those,...
Yes, and when I stop paying for my subcription to National Geographic, all my past issues with all their beautiful pictures disappear into thin air also.
...Can you give me a clear reason why TV is different from music now?...
Certainly!
Most videos are watched maybe only once, sometimes twice, but a good piece of music get listened to over and over until you find yourself humming the tune at odd moments. Music also is an accompanyment of other activities, such as driving a car. Video generally requires your full time attention so you can get the story line. Do you really want to pay someone FOREVER again and again, so you can listen to your repertiore of favorite songs whenever and wherever you want? Record your favorite songs from the radio for free and then they'll never cost you any more after that to listen.
...you purchased the right to listen to it for a bit...
Why purchase it when you can get it for free? It's called radio. If you record the music from the radio, it will not disappear after you turn the radio off. There is also subscription radio and you can record from that and keep the music after you cancel the subscription. Some radio station even have request programs where they will play songs you ask for if they've got them.
... I don't get why people can't pay $10 for unlimited music...
It is unlimited in the same sense as your satelite or other subscription radio service is unlimited. You get to listen to the station as long as you subscribe. It is basically an on demand Internet radio station with a recorder attached. The difference is that if you record something from the radio, the recording doesn't disappear if you cancel your subscription.
Music and video are very different. I can watch most movies once or at most twice. However I can listen to the a great piece of music many times. I can't see paying someone again and again forever to let me listen to my favorite pieces multiple number of times. Music works well as an accompanyment to other activities, such as driving a car, but video generally requires full time attention. I'd much rather rent my videos and BUY my music. I suspect that the majority of people is with me on that and so I don't think the "buy" model for music will be replaced with the "rent" model for most consumers.
...getting off local servers and desktops and onto the web...
Having critical data who knows where, on some server in cyberspace, dependent on a not always reliable, sometimes continent spanning communications system may not be so attractive to many. It has nothing to do with bandwidth, but reliability, security and accessability. Filling out forms or sending text documents is an activity millions do everyday as part of their jobs and those activities take very little bandwidth and could be and did get done quite well over a dial up connection back in 1998 and earlier. Most business users don't send massive amounts of data to require a high bandwidth connections for everybody.
If a backhoe fade or other network failure occurs users can still use all local PC programs until the problem is fixed. If the software and data reside on some distant server, then everybody can only drink coffee and chat at the water cooler.
Back in the mainframe days, computing was centralized. Then the PERSONAL computer came along and it is not likely that too many users will give up the personal part of computing.
An automobile is personal transportation. If you look at the % of people who use rapid transit (the Internet) or have more than one driver per car, especially in spread out cities in the west of the USA, then you may get an idea of the number of people who will entrust their critical data and programs to someone over whom they have no control whatsoever.
...they don't lead technologically...
Question: Have they EVER lead technologically? It seems to me they are good copiers and are superb at marketing products that are good enough, but not great.
I am not a lawyer, but I suspect your interstate example will not hold internationally. There is likely a Federal law or Federal case law that makes your example work between two states of the our country. I doubt that any lawsuit in a French court would affect a US citizen or corporation unless that citizen shows up in France or the corporation has offices in France. A US court will NOT enforce French law unless there is a treaty or agreement concerning the issues in dispute.
...have "black boxes" installed in them...
Is it illegal to disconnect or disable these boxes? As far as RFID tags, a few seconds in a microwave ought to take care of them.
Until we as a society are willing to let the uninsured, smokers, druggies or those who don't wear helmets or seatbelts just die without any medical help, we need to have laws that at least coerce most people to behave responsibly. Some of course won't behave right and they make life more complicated and expensive for those who do.
...But doesnt this only effect companies in France?...
The laws of a country are only effective and binding on those within the borders of that country unless there are treaties or agreements between various countries that affect the particular issues. French courts do not have blanket jurisdiction on every issue. The French can prohibit their citizens to do business with another country in the same way that the US has and is treating Cuba. In practice, this is hard to enforce in cyberspace however.
...If a French company transacts business in the United States...
Where business is transacted is difficult to say when it comes to the Internet. Is it where the user is or where the server is or where the business is incorporated or physically present? In the "real" world, I cannot be held to the laws of a country that I have never actually set foot in. Unless two or more countries have agreements concerning some matters there is nothing that can be done. In this case, if France doesn't like what Google in California is doing, that's just too bad. If Google has servers or other property in France, then that falls under their jurisdiction.
...Carly Fiorina had a private fleet of jets to fly herself and senior executives around...
I read in our paper today the Carly got fired by the directors! Maybe her extravagance was part of the reason.
...MS client access licenses...
Apple's Xserve OSX systems are a good buy since Apple doesn't charge per seat for client licenses. Also there is many Unix type software available both for free and for money. The systems are compact and easy to maintain and administer.
We were still using a Mac SE30 (from 1989) as an answering/fax machine but "upgraded" it a year ago to the present Color Classic (made in 1993) running System 7.5.1 so we could access it over the local network. The Classic running 24/7 is also used to allow an old Apple Laserwriter (which still works just fine) with only an Appletalk interface to be accessible via ethernet. The answering/fax function is provided by a DoveFaxPlus 2400baud modem. I wonder if this setup would qualify for a prize?
Copying the link to the clipboard and pasting into textedit on OSX shows the same URL, but the "a" looks diffferent than the other characters. Pasting into BBedit shows some strange added character. This is a nasty trick that will undoubtedly be used by evildoers. If an unsolicted email or any web page comes up with a window that asks for passwords or other personal info, then the only defense I can think of right now is to type the link manually into the URL window.