Well I guess I'm not going to have the pleasure of watching you tear my post to pieces with your incisive logic. When the going gets tough the zealots get going, eh?
Can I do something like 'su - ' in a Windows console?
runas/user:administrator cmd.exe
Change 'cmd.exe' to whatever you want, or create a shortcut to the program and set it's "Run with different credentials" flag.
This has been handled over and over again: you can install apt tools on rpm machines and vice versa. And all rpms I have seen can be obtained in different distro-flavours. This is a non-issue which is completely dwarfed by the need for registry cleaners in Windows
Mwahaha. "All rpms"? That's so funny.
which MS includes because they want to embrace, extend and exterminate into that market?
Buy any computer today and you get that POS RealPlayer *and* MusicMatch. eMachines, Gateway, Dell, IBM, etc.
"An audio CD has been inserted into the DVD drive."
Here's one for you - on my laptop running RH9, I get a message saying "Would you like to mount/dev/cdrom?" That's the pinnacle of user friendly for you!!
I doubt there are many outsorced devs who have seen the entrails of the Windows or Solaris kernels or the guts of DB2.
I make a distinction between "outsorced" as in "the code monkeys in Delhi writing the examples for the docs and answering the phone" and actual hires that work as employees of these companies.
And I'll hang on to "core dev" because that was the OPs point, which I think is bogus. That stuff is too valuable and sensitive to be managed that way.
It's clear you neither care nor have a usefull answer to the problems Microsoft has made for everyone.
Of course I don't. I simply pointed out that for all your hyperbole you don't, either.
Apt-get updates work for me
I'm sure they do. They also work for me. Assuming I knew I had been rooted. It took the GNU folks a couple of months to figure it out. Or did you miss that too?
I did not notice the SSH problem, would you mind pointing it out to me?
You are free to extrapolate this and try to imagine how many instances of this are out there, but without a guru sysadmin behind the keyboard to actually notice and sound the bell.
It's not because of "market share" because free software runs most of the net. It's because free software is not using retarded "easy" autoload methods to handle content sent by strangers across the network
Heh. Most worms work through social engineering, not by vulnerabilities. You just wait until you can prove your "market share is not the reason" when Linux becomes mainstream and easy enough to use by Joe Bob. The fact that I have to set an execute bit on a Python script or ELF binary means absolutely nothing if the user is stupid and determined enough to see those cool pics of Christina Aguilera naked they got from awekeowthdl@123.com
They never made changes, they never fixed anything and their trust is broken
I could say the same thing about this or any other crack I find in Linux or any other popular package, except that it wouldn't matter because nobody uses it. But if I were to listen to people like you, I'd be inclined to believe that things like those are absolutely impossible.
This is all very interesting. What would you say then about security failures related to Linux? Or do you really believe your own spiel along the lines of "free software is perfect"?
Did you perchance notice that there were several high-profile Linux cracks in the past few months? Or did that just escape you?
The part about the ports and ISP is mighty interesting. What do you figure would have happened out there (in the real world) with the SSH vulnerabilities of a few months back if Linux had a half-decent market share? Thousands (millions!) of zombied machines. And if you think they couldn't be sending out crap, search around for that recent article about the guy that found out his server had been rooted via PHP/Apache and was being used to send spam.
But what would you have done? I just wonder about that because I figure that using Linux as your desktop OS would not necessarily translate into magically making sure that your machine is patched. Or maybe you think that free software is perfect and therefore needs no patching, eh?
You're just full of shit. Sitting there and proclaiming that "M$" is dying while making all these baseless, bogus rationalizations about how cool free software is smacks of pure and simple wishful thinking. There is a big problem out there, but you're sure as heck not helping to solve it in any meaningful way.
they lost their interface design to the company making their Office software wh then turned around and made a 2nd rate OS based on it
I find this so very funny. In fact it gets funnier every time I read it.
Head on over to folklore.org and read the stories posted there by ex-Apple employees (which alone makes them semi-qualified in the topic) about the Jobs-Gates rivalry and dealings.
People like you like to paint Apple as a poor little garage-run company who had its candy taken away by the mean evil Corporation, who then laughed all the way to the bank.
If you read through those stories (which I repeat are written by the very people who were there) you'll see how this is just a pile of apologetic crap. "Boo-hoo, M$ is evil we're so nice and cool and we want justice"
Here's a company (Apple) that has developers who rewrite entire graphics subsystems a few weeks before "ROM freeze"; assembly gurus who can fit an entire OS into a little fucking chip, and yet is apparently petrified by the threat of Microsoft revoking the license to "SoftBASIC". A goddamn BASIC interpreter, for fuck sakes. Right.
This is a company who willingly and knowingly signed over so much shit to Microsoft for some unseen reason. A company with an army or lawyers facing another army of lawyers. Yet it's all portrayed as some slick under-the-cover last-minute backstabbing deal by the evil Mr. Gates. One morning Stevie woke up and Microsoft had (as you so succintly put it) made a second rate OS largely by stealing it from Apple and there was nothing anybody could do about it. Riiight.
Here is Steve Jobs swaggering around the Apple offices holding his crotch and chanting "here we come motherfuckers", a beacon of strength and go-get-em bravado suddenly turning into the equivalent of one of those scared blinking anime dolls, taking it in the ass every time someone from Microsoft walks in the building. Riiight.
Revisionist bullshit. Apple knew damn well what they were doing, and they did it anyway.
Oh I won't contest that Microsoft plays hardball with everyone, nope. But in the case of Apple it was mostly their own stupidity that did them in.
Other than that, I find your defense of this appaling. But then again, this is Apple, eh?
We'd be paying $4000 instead of $400 for them shiny "boxen" running Linux or BSD.
Whatever else, Microsoft Windows commoditized the PC market to the point where it was feasible for Intel to invest $4 billion instead of $4 million into R&D because they were selling 50 million CPUs instead of 5 million. AMD probably wouldn't exist, nor would all the mobo makers. There would probably be one or two graphics chip makers.
And of course, the tech boom of the 90s probably wouldn't have happened.
We better start calling then "beleaguered" to ensure they will never die.
For example, from now on we say "Sun Microsystems, the beleaguered creators of the Java programming language and the Solaris operating system, released a new... blah blah blah"
The thing tried to enter the Martian atmosphere on the wrong side of the orbital plane. It probably collided with some old American piece of hardware gliding on the left side of the orbit. Pesky brits.
lets look at this image for 1 second, lets calculate how much percentage of the screen goes to some useful usage, 30%, 35%?... And you are paying a few grand (software + hardware), for a bit more eye candy which makes you less productive? am I missing something
Yes. You can turn it off, customize it, etc. Unless you never touch it again after the first boot, but that's your choice. Did you base your entire sermon below on this screenshot of software that's 3 years away from being released?
KDE now has all sorts of integration, and gnome is heading the same way.
Like... cut 'n paste?
I do not have a single complaint or problem with linux except for less than perfect hardware support, which requires you to pay a little extra for better quality hardware.
You know, the other day I set up RH 9 on a new box with an Abit mobo. I had to compile the fucking ALSA driver in order to get sound. Would that count as a complaint? Not that I complain, mind you. Unless you compare that to, say, Windows.
In linux, I can do graphics, video animation, I can program, I can use the wonderful openoffice, I can record sound and edit sound in highest quality (with some commercial programs), and these are the very reasons why Crysler, Disney, IBM and other leading companies use linux. Not to mention the reliability, control, and power both as a server and a desktop machine.
OK now, "the wonderful open office"?? Lesse - on my laptop (again with RH9) it takes about 15 seconds to load Writer. This is a machine where MS Word takes about 1/2 second to load (and yes, I disable the MSO cache). And everything else... well, I can do all that, too. I mean, did they port Photoshop or Quark to Linux yet? Guess not. Depends what it is you want to do.
I for one am now getting an OQO
Give me a break that's been vapourware for what now, 4 years? Hell, even PalmOS is better on devices. Why do you people want to run Linux in everything that has a power plug?
I do not see longhorn ever rising personally and microsoft knows it and tries postpone the release as long as it can, as it will be seen as an instant failure. So instead, microsoft invests in companies like sco to try to slow down linux.
Looks like you've got it all figured out. That proves that ESR's FUD is working, I guess.
And I for one plan to use 1ghz PCs for a long time to come, I just do not see a reason to update as each new versions of KDE and the linux kernel focus on making it run better on both older and newer hardware, and with every release, I enjoy using linux on my 400mhz laptop more and more.
That's nice. So what you're saying is that KDE 3.x runs just fine on your 400MHz laptop with all the eye candy turned on, right? Because it's KDE, so it must be magically faster than Windows? I run Windows 2000 on 450MHz machines just fine, and I'm not upgrading until I upgrade the boxes. Microsoft has EOL'ed W2K but will still continue to provide fixes for it so I'm jiggy. If I had made an investment on RH desktops on the other hand I'd be screwed!
And as someone in one of the comments said, while you spend time rewriting a program to be cleaner, someone will come up with a better, more full featured product, and that someone is linux
Yeah. You know, OO.org is better than Microsoft Office... 97. Really now, have you ever used commercial software? Or is this your first foray into "free" computing?
Can someone please tell me how there is a potential advantage to use windows?
Nope, not to you at least. You just spent half an hour typing up the worst piece of fanboi drivel I've read here in a while so don't sweat it. Nobody wants you to switch to Windows or OS X or anything else. Stick to what you know.
because I am completely lost how such a pointless, expensive, slow, unstandarized, closed standard product can be even discussed seriously as an alternative to linux.
I guess Munich should learn from you then - I mean, you installed it in your eMachines Celeron in a few days, why should a municipality have problems migrating thousands of desktops and custom apps, right?
Achtung, Herr Munchen Mayor! Ich vas perusing das Slashdotten und I see zat 'MooKore 2004' hat installieren der Linux-OS auf his mutti's machinen vit much succesieren... Vee haven been so trauben stupid mein heer!!
The problem I ultimately have is that someone has the balls|stupidity to go ahead and mod you up as something the rest of us should take into account in the context of what this article is about.
Remind me to laugh - for several hours - next time I see you whine about how "M$" is a piece of crap and everyone should use Linux because "its teh bestest!!"
Understand that you cannot have your cake and eat it. You cannot insult and ignore your users ("lusers", hahaha). You cannot claim that this stuff is the shit and is ready to take over the world and defeat evil and then turn around and use that excuse to try to explain away an obvious deficiency that your competitors do not suffer from. Volunteers? You'll excuse my french here, but holy fucking shit. What, you're going to tell me to "ask for a refund"?
If anything, you are proof that this community has a long way to go. A loooong way to go. You are exactly the type of person that "lusers" encounter out there and then use as an excuse to drop free software and stop trying to switch from commercial products. You suck.
If this is the best you can do (and woe the mods that thought you're "insightful") then just please, please shut up.
Windows XP struggles on a 1.2ghz Celeron with 128MB RAM
RAM being the key here - I run Windows XP Pro on an old Sony PIII 450 laptop with 512MB of RAM. It runs fine.
Truly, 128MB is Win98 territory. XP will feel constrained on that, better on 256 and great on 512. Given how cheap RAM is these days I can't think of a reason to havea 128MB box anymore.
If the choice is between a few hundred MHz and a few hundreg MB, always go with the RAM.
My wife's old PC with XP crashed a few months ago--bought her the PowerBook and never thought about the Windows box again
Why didn't you give her the same laptop with Linux installed on it? Is there a specific reason why you bought a Mac instead of "eating your own dogfood" and using Linux instead?
Don't take this the wrong way, but it seems to me that if you're going to preach the wonders of open source one minute and tell us that you bought your wife a Powerbook the other then I find it difficult to believe that "Linux on the dektop is doable" unless I have abundant free time and mad skillz to make it work (or pay you/someone like you to do the same).
Slashdot Mirror
Thanks so very much.
This has been handled over and over again: you can install apt tools on rpm machines and vice versa. And all rpms I have seen can be obtained in different distro-flavours. This is a non-issue which is completely dwarfed by the need for registry cleaners in Windows
Mwahaha. "All rpms"? That's so funny.
which MS includes because they want to embrace, extend and exterminate into that market?
Buy any computer today and you get that POS RealPlayer *and* MusicMatch. eMachines, Gateway, Dell, IBM, etc.
"An audio CD has been inserted into the DVD drive."
Here's one for you - on my laptop running RH9, I get a message saying "Would you like to mount /dev/cdrom?" That's the pinnacle of user friendly for you!!
I make a distinction between "outsorced" as in "the code monkeys in Delhi writing the examples for the docs and answering the phone" and actual hires that work as employees of these companies.
And I'll hang on to "core dev" because that was the OPs point, which I think is bogus. That stuff is too valuable and sensitive to be managed that way.
Of course I don't. I simply pointed out that for all your hyperbole you don't, either.
Apt-get updates work for me
I'm sure they do. They also work for me. Assuming I knew I had been rooted. It took the GNU folks a couple of months to figure it out. Or did you miss that too?
I did not notice the SSH problem, would you mind pointing it out to me?
Sure, why not.
Show me yourself[...] so I think that you are full of shit.
http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/12/09/173322 1
You are free to extrapolate this and try to imagine how many instances of this are out there, but without a guru sysadmin behind the keyboard to actually notice and sound the bell.
It's not because of "market share" because free software runs most of the net. It's because free software is not using retarded "easy" autoload methods to handle content sent by strangers across the network
Heh. Most worms work through social engineering, not by vulnerabilities. You just wait until you can prove your "market share is not the reason" when Linux becomes mainstream and easy enough to use by Joe Bob. The fact that I have to set an execute bit on a Python script or ELF binary means absolutely nothing if the user is stupid and determined enough to see those cool pics of Christina Aguilera naked they got from awekeowthdl@123.com
They never made changes, they never fixed anything and their trust is broken
I could say the same thing about this or any other crack I find in Linux or any other popular package, except that it wouldn't matter because nobody uses it. But if I were to listen to people like you, I'd be inclined to believe that things like those are absolutely impossible.
Oh wow, I'm convinced.
Would you like to provide some proof that said companies outsource core dev to said countries?
Thanks.
Did you perchance notice that there were several high-profile Linux cracks in the past few months? Or did that just escape you?
The part about the ports and ISP is mighty interesting. What do you figure would have happened out there (in the real world) with the SSH vulnerabilities of a few months back if Linux had a half-decent market share? Thousands (millions!) of zombied machines. And if you think they couldn't be sending out crap, search around for that recent article about the guy that found out his server had been rooted via PHP/Apache and was being used to send spam.
But what would you have done? I just wonder about that because I figure that using Linux as your desktop OS would not necessarily translate into magically making sure that your machine is patched. Or maybe you think that free software is perfect and therefore needs no patching, eh?
You're just full of shit. Sitting there and proclaiming that "M$" is dying while making all these baseless, bogus rationalizations about how cool free software is smacks of pure and simple wishful thinking. There is a big problem out there, but you're sure as heck not helping to solve it in any meaningful way.
I find this so very funny. In fact it gets funnier every time I read it.
Head on over to folklore.org and read the stories posted there by ex-Apple employees (which alone makes them semi-qualified in the topic) about the Jobs-Gates rivalry and dealings.
People like you like to paint Apple as a poor little garage-run company who had its candy taken away by the mean evil Corporation, who then laughed all the way to the bank.
If you read through those stories (which I repeat are written by the very people who were there) you'll see how this is just a pile of apologetic crap. "Boo-hoo, M$ is evil we're so nice and cool and we want justice"
Here's a company (Apple) that has developers who rewrite entire graphics subsystems a few weeks before "ROM freeze"; assembly gurus who can fit an entire OS into a little fucking chip, and yet is apparently petrified by the threat of Microsoft revoking the license to "SoftBASIC". A goddamn BASIC interpreter, for fuck sakes. Right.
This is a company who willingly and knowingly signed over so much shit to Microsoft for some unseen reason. A company with an army or lawyers facing another army of lawyers. Yet it's all portrayed as some slick under-the-cover last-minute backstabbing deal by the evil Mr. Gates. One morning Stevie woke up and Microsoft had (as you so succintly put it) made a second rate OS largely by stealing it from Apple and there was nothing anybody could do about it. Riiight.
Here is Steve Jobs swaggering around the Apple offices holding his crotch and chanting "here we come motherfuckers", a beacon of strength and go-get-em bravado suddenly turning into the equivalent of one of those scared blinking anime dolls, taking it in the ass every time someone from Microsoft walks in the building. Riiight.
Revisionist bullshit. Apple knew damn well what they were doing, and they did it anyway.
Oh I won't contest that Microsoft plays hardball with everyone, nope. But in the case of Apple it was mostly their own stupidity that did them in.
Other than that, I find your defense of this appaling. But then again, this is Apple, eh?
Patriotism?
Whatever else, Microsoft Windows commoditized the PC market to the point where it was feasible for Intel to invest $4 billion instead of $4 million into R&D because they were selling 50 million CPUs instead of 5 million. AMD probably wouldn't exist, nor would all the mobo makers. There would probably be one or two graphics chip makers.
And of course, the tech boom of the 90s probably wouldn't have happened.
For example, from now on we say "Sun Microsystems, the beleaguered creators of the Java programming language and the Solaris operating system, released a new... blah blah blah"
Presto, Sun lives forever. Just like Apple.
I love your logic. So what you're saying is that Linux sucks because it's free? I mean, it hardly "works out of the box" anyway.
Be careful with your rationalizations.
And as somebody mentioned, you're exiting after the save. No vim-points for you!
(emacs zealots refrain from modding, plz)
How dare the OP mention his product "for windoze". I mean, let's punish him by... modding him down.
Nothing to do on a Friday night, eh? I'm surprised.
The thing tried to enter the Martian atmosphere on the wrong side of the orbital plane. It probably collided with some old American piece of hardware gliding on the left side of the orbit. Pesky brits.
Yes. You can turn it off, customize it, etc. Unless you never touch it again after the first boot, but that's your choice. Did you base your entire sermon below on this screenshot of software that's 3 years away from being released?
KDE now has all sorts of integration, and gnome is heading the same way.
Like... cut 'n paste?
I do not have a single complaint or problem with linux except for less than perfect hardware support, which requires you to pay a little extra for better quality hardware.
You know, the other day I set up RH 9 on a new box with an Abit mobo. I had to compile the fucking ALSA driver in order to get sound. Would that count as a complaint? Not that I complain, mind you. Unless you compare that to, say, Windows.
In linux, I can do graphics, video animation, I can program, I can use the wonderful openoffice, I can record sound and edit sound in highest quality (with some commercial programs), and these are the very reasons why Crysler, Disney, IBM and other leading companies use linux. Not to mention the reliability, control, and power both as a server and a desktop machine.
OK now, "the wonderful open office"?? Lesse - on my laptop (again with RH9) it takes about 15 seconds to load Writer. This is a machine where MS Word takes about 1/2 second to load (and yes, I disable the MSO cache). And everything else... well, I can do all that, too. I mean, did they port Photoshop or Quark to Linux yet? Guess not. Depends what it is you want to do.
I for one am now getting an OQO
Give me a break that's been vapourware for what now, 4 years? Hell, even PalmOS is better on devices. Why do you people want to run Linux in everything that has a power plug?
I do not see longhorn ever rising personally and microsoft knows it and tries postpone the release as long as it can, as it will be seen as an instant failure. So instead, microsoft invests in companies like sco to try to slow down linux.
Looks like you've got it all figured out. That proves that ESR's FUD is working, I guess.
And I for one plan to use 1ghz PCs for a long time to come, I just do not see a reason to update as each new versions of KDE and the linux kernel focus on making it run better on both older and newer hardware, and with every release, I enjoy using linux on my 400mhz laptop more and more.
That's nice. So what you're saying is that KDE 3.x runs just fine on your 400MHz laptop with all the eye candy turned on, right? Because it's KDE, so it must be magically faster than Windows? I run Windows 2000 on 450MHz machines just fine, and I'm not upgrading until I upgrade the boxes. Microsoft has EOL'ed W2K but will still continue to provide fixes for it so I'm jiggy. If I had made an investment on RH desktops on the other hand I'd be screwed!
And as someone in one of the comments said, while you spend time rewriting a program to be cleaner, someone will come up with a better, more full featured product, and that someone is linux
Yeah. You know, OO.org is better than Microsoft Office... 97. Really now, have you ever used commercial software? Or is this your first foray into "free" computing?
Can someone please tell me how there is a potential advantage to use windows?
Nope, not to you at least. You just spent half an hour typing up the worst piece of fanboi drivel I've read here in a while so don't sweat it. Nobody wants you to switch to Windows or OS X or anything else. Stick to what you know.
because I am completely lost how such a pointless, expensive, slow, unstandarized, closed standard product can be even discussed seriously as an alternative to linux.
I think the
No facts, no reasons, no nothing. Just "OH LOOK EVERYONE M$ IS AT IT AGAIN!! KILL KILL!!!"
Achtung, Herr Munchen Mayor! Ich vas perusing das Slashdotten und I see zat 'MooKore 2004' hat installieren der Linux-OS auf his mutti's machinen vit much succesieren... Vee haven been so trauben stupid mein heer!!
The problem I ultimately have is that someone has the balls|stupidity to go ahead and mod you up as something the rest of us should take into account in the context of what this article is about.
Understand that you cannot have your cake and eat it. You cannot insult and ignore your users ("lusers", hahaha). You cannot claim that this stuff is the shit and is ready to take over the world and defeat evil and then turn around and use that excuse to try to explain away an obvious deficiency that your competitors do not suffer from. Volunteers? You'll excuse my french here, but holy fucking shit. What, you're going to tell me to "ask for a refund"?
If anything, you are proof that this community has a long way to go. A loooong way to go. You are exactly the type of person that "lusers" encounter out there and then use as an excuse to drop free software and stop trying to switch from commercial products. You suck.
If this is the best you can do (and woe the mods that thought you're "insightful") then just please, please shut up.
Yay!
The MSNBC article fully credits the WP. What's your problem?
RAM being the key here - I run Windows XP Pro on an old Sony PIII 450 laptop with 512MB of RAM. It runs fine.
Truly, 128MB is Win98 territory. XP will feel constrained on that, better on 256 and great on 512. Given how cheap RAM is these days I can't think of a reason to havea 128MB box anymore.
If the choice is between a few hundred MHz and a few hundreg MB, always go with the RAM.
Why didn't you give her the same laptop with Linux installed on it? Is there a specific reason why you bought a Mac instead of "eating your own dogfood" and using Linux instead?
Don't take this the wrong way, but it seems to me that if you're going to preach the wonders of open source one minute and tell us that you bought your wife a Powerbook the other then I find it difficult to believe that "Linux on the dektop is doable" unless I have abundant free time and mad skillz to make it work (or pay you/someone like you to do the same).
That sounds like switching from Photoshop to the Gimp. I don't think this thing is quite ready for primetime.