I was in part responding to the idea that women get to choose to work lesser hours therefore it's fair they get paid less. Many women don't work lesser hours and the roles they more frequently work in are often lower paid per hour.
The reasons for this are varied and complex, but a significant part of that is the 'higher paid' STEM roles are seen as unattainable for women more than for men - even given a broad background of socio-economic factors.
Women are more likely to be channeled into nurturing or service roles such as teaching, nursing, childcare or aged care, rather than more lucrative roles such as sales or STEM roles. At the lower end of the economy, they are more likely to be a waitress than a construction worker - guess what pays more. Yes being a construction worker may be more physically demanding - but being on your feet all day waiting tables isn't being slack either. In Australia, tradesmen are some of the best paid people, I can assure you that the 'professions' for working class women are not paid nearly as well, they are likely to be a hairdresser or beauty therapist or a masseuse.
And you can bet that the construction industry is unwelcoming to women in very similar ways that IT is. I can tell you I've experienced both first hand having started in Architecture and worked directly on building sites as well as moving into IT and working directly with programmers and other IT types from the position of doing both Tech Support and now as a Systems Analyst.
You say that programming jobs aren't lucrative - that is a relative term. They may not be paid as well as a top performing sales person or someone in finance or banking - but they generally pay better than nursing or teaching or any of the personal care professions women tend to get pushed towards.
It has been shown in many developing countries that the best way to improve your economy is to give women more money. Here's a couple of studies to get you started. It makes no sense to keep 50% of the population explicitly in underpaid roles.
Acknowledging that this is totally a 'devil's advocate' type statement, but I suspect you would find there are plenty of women, particularly single mothers from lower income households, that work more than one lower paid job that total in excess of 40 hours (and some in excess of 60 hours) just to make ends meet.
Many of these women come from backgrounds that don't value education and are not equipped for higher paid roles that would enable them to work more manageable hours at a single job rather than terrible hours at more than one job.
This is not to say there aren't guys who work terrible hours, some in more than one job. But choosing to ONLY work 40 hours is sometimes a luxury afforded to people to can afford to do so, either because the job they have is sufficiently well paid or they have someone else supporting them.
Women also frequently are expected to be the primary partner responsible for child care, to be at home and available when the kids aren't at school, 'allowing' the male partner to put in the extra hours for the greater responsibility and career opportunities that equate to higher incomes.
Much of the push these sort of initiatives promote is not about mandatory quotas when hiring but about providing equal opportunities. Currently the opportunities are not equal, women are still actively discouraged from pursuing STEM jobs and encouraged to work in lower paid, lower status, nurturing based roles. If you want to see men becoming teachers or nurses or aged care - make changes so that the roles are perceived to be as valuable to the community and the bank account as programming or sales or working on an oil rig.
A friend of mine went to school with him and was reasonably close with him growing up. He has characterised Assange as sociopathic, largely as a result of his upbringing. Nothing would surprise me at this point.
To be fair, the female body types are probably just as attainable by the average gamer - it's just that they involve a significant amount of plastic surgery and low self esteem rather than steroids and a life-changingly intensive gym regieme.
Drs who 'over service' are investigated. I had a GP a few years back who worked crazy hours in a small practice in an area that was short on Drs, she was investigated for over servicing and was told she couldn't take on any new patients.
Generally extra tests are performed by a path lab or imaging lab that isn't directly associated with the originating Drs practice - so they see no additional income from referring you beyond you going back to get the results.
I was diagnosed with cancer last year because of a Dr ordering what might have been considered an extra test (I needed a blood test because of some medication I was on, she decided to do a full work up because it seemed like a good idea at the time). If my GP had not done the extra test, it's likely I wouldn't have been diagnosed so early, would have gotten much sicker than I was and would have required chemo in addition to surgery.
Given the current standard HR policy of requiring a Drs certificate is you have a sick day, I would say most of my Drs visits these days are to get a note saying 'yes she really was sick' when I have a bad head cold or a migraine. I would be better off at home resting, but have to drag myself out to get a bit of paper and to be told to go home, rest, stay warm and keep up my fluids - all things I already know. Most Drs don't have time for unnecessary tests, they're too busy issuing repeat scripts and medical certs.
I wish it was just restricted to America. I saw a survey this morning from the Australian Christian Lobby looking to have Creationism added to the National Curriculum in Australia.
I despair for the current generation of children being exposed to this lunacy.
I have personally experienced this a number of times; firstly in high school back in the dim dark past of the 80s where I had teachers actively discouraging me form taking STEM classes (physics and applied maths) and telling me to do home economics instead - or just plain leave school. Later working for an IT company as an office manager, I expressed interest in joining the support team, I was offered marketing as my only option. Two jobs later I was a service tech, and later became the technical supervisor for that service centre.
I know it may be hard for you to imagine, but pockets of this still exists, and you have to be pretty resilient to keep pushing to do something where you are made so blatantly unwelcome.
Interestingly it seems to be a predominately anglo issue, most of the women I know in IT are from non-english speaking backgrounds, such as indian, asian, eastern european, where it is acceptable for them to pursue STEM careers. As a BA in a mid sized IT development house, out of 7 BAs, only 2 are female, only 2 are anglo background - with me being the only female anglo. None of the female developers or testers are anglo.
Quite a few years and jobs ago I used to be the technical supervisor of a computer service workshop. When calls came in, if I answered the phone it was not uncommon for (typically male) callers to assume I was 'merely' the receptionist, and they would ask to be put through to one of the techs. I would usually pass the call to one of my male colleagues rather than argue. It used to make me laugh when they would say the problem was too hard for them and they would have to pass it back to their supervisor - and pass the call back to me.
Everyone doesn't need to know C++ templates, but everyone needs to know how to throw together a quick script or mobile app, or will soon enough.
I doubt we will ever get to the point where 'everyone' needs to know how to throw together a mobile app. What benefit is there to a NFL linebacker in knowing how to program an app? If he needs one, the team will have someone put one together for him UNLESS he decides for himself that it's something he wants to pursue as an interest and does it in his spare time for his own benefit.
Just because the majority of people on Slashdot live in a world where IT is a highly valued profession/skillset does not mean it's even closely related to what most people do for a living. Half the people I work with couldn't put together a basic function in Excel let alone basic scripting, and there is no reason for them to ever learn - that's why we build templates for them if they have repeatable tasks requiring functions.
As someone who studied architecture at University, I can say that it is a great degree to get an all-rounded education. It includes history, law, fine arts, finance, engineering (structural and mechanical), materials science, theory of design, project management, presentation techniques and customer service. It pushed me to develop critical thinking and analytical skills while at the same time explore more creative aesthetic based design decisions.
Everybody should learn the basics in how to cook a meal from scratch and basic nutrition.
There is no reason for everyone to know how to code, anymore than everyone should know how to rebuild an engine or insert an IV line - they are core skills of specific professions. Core life skills like how to feed yourself, change a light bulb or tap washer and how the contraception/safe sex works, how to balance your cheque book (or the modern equivalent of paying your credit card) are far more important.
TISM's first concert was on 6 December 1983. The Get Fucked Concert at the Duncan McKinnon Athletics Reserve in the small suburb of Murrumbeena was considered a complete failure which caused the band to officially split up. They reformed in February 1984 and returned to their recordings. They consider every subsequent performance a "re-union gig".[1]
By 1985 the band was playing regularly around Melbourne and soon released a 10-track demo composed of selections from their recordings followed by their debut single, "Defecate on My Face" (1986), a 7" vinyl record packaged in a 12" sleeve with all four sides glued shut.
Given I had one of my previous employers try and book me to share a room with an opposite sex coworker one time, I would have said potentially sexual harassment. I can't believe they though that idea was even remotely OK.
I once had a interstate training session where the company initially booked for me to share a room with a coworker of the opposite sex - I had to complain to get them to book me in my own room. I got on with the guy well enough - but it doesn't mean I want to sleep 3 feet away from him.
My husband and I have written, yeh gods, at least 20+ tournament modules for gaming conventions, we have a mantra when briefing GMs; "No game survives first contact with the players".
What that is supposed to mean is that while we will spend hours trying to think of examples of left of field things the players might choose to do to come up with suggested responses, the players will always think of something we couldn't in a million years have thought of. GMs need to be flexible and try an incorporate what the players think of into the narrative (like the improv rule of always saying 'yes').
My worst con game experience was a GM (who was also the module author) who would use whirlwinds (it was a Toon scenario) to put the party back on the path every time we strayed from her planned narrative. I ended up falling asleep during the session because there was no scope to explore or make an interesting decision.
Even a bad module can be fun if the GM will play along, we had a terrible multi session D&D module at one con where the GM jumped out a 3rd story window in response to how bad it was (he was a rockclimber, when we all rushed over to see if he was ok, he was hanging there by his fingertips). We hammed it up the whole way through the session and he went down to the tournament orgs and said there was no way he was GMing another session of the terrible module, except, he was absolutely doing the rest of our sessions. I particularly enjoyed the characterisations of the paladin who suffered terrible with cowardice and had lined his armour with sheepskin so he wouldn't clank and bought a ring of invisibility - every time we got into combat he would hide. Then there was the princess we rescued who was best described as having issue with personal hygiene and a bad case of verbal diarrhea.
Slashdot Mirror
I was in part responding to the idea that women get to choose to work lesser hours therefore it's fair they get paid less. Many women don't work lesser hours and the roles they more frequently work in are often lower paid per hour.
The reasons for this are varied and complex, but a significant part of that is the 'higher paid' STEM roles are seen as unattainable for women more than for men - even given a broad background of socio-economic factors.
Women are more likely to be channeled into nurturing or service roles such as teaching, nursing, childcare or aged care, rather than more lucrative roles such as sales or STEM roles. At the lower end of the economy, they are more likely to be a waitress than a construction worker - guess what pays more. Yes being a construction worker may be more physically demanding - but being on your feet all day waiting tables isn't being slack either. In Australia, tradesmen are some of the best paid people, I can assure you that the 'professions' for working class women are not paid nearly as well, they are likely to be a hairdresser or beauty therapist or a masseuse.
And you can bet that the construction industry is unwelcoming to women in very similar ways that IT is. I can tell you I've experienced both first hand having started in Architecture and worked directly on building sites as well as moving into IT and working directly with programmers and other IT types from the position of doing both Tech Support and now as a Systems Analyst.
You say that programming jobs aren't lucrative - that is a relative term. They may not be paid as well as a top performing sales person or someone in finance or banking - but they generally pay better than nursing or teaching or any of the personal care professions women tend to get pushed towards.
It has been shown in many developing countries that the best way to improve your economy is to give women more money. Here's a couple of studies to get you started. It makes no sense to keep 50% of the population explicitly in underpaid roles.
Acknowledging that this is totally a 'devil's advocate' type statement, but I suspect you would find there are plenty of women, particularly single mothers from lower income households, that work more than one lower paid job that total in excess of 40 hours (and some in excess of 60 hours) just to make ends meet.
Many of these women come from backgrounds that don't value education and are not equipped for higher paid roles that would enable them to work more manageable hours at a single job rather than terrible hours at more than one job.
This is not to say there aren't guys who work terrible hours, some in more than one job. But choosing to ONLY work 40 hours is sometimes a luxury afforded to people to can afford to do so, either because the job they have is sufficiently well paid or they have someone else supporting them.
Women also frequently are expected to be the primary partner responsible for child care, to be at home and available when the kids aren't at school, 'allowing' the male partner to put in the extra hours for the greater responsibility and career opportunities that equate to higher incomes.
Much of the push these sort of initiatives promote is not about mandatory quotas when hiring but about providing equal opportunities. Currently the opportunities are not equal, women are still actively discouraged from pursuing STEM jobs and encouraged to work in lower paid, lower status, nurturing based roles. If you want to see men becoming teachers or nurses or aged care - make changes so that the roles are perceived to be as valuable to the community and the bank account as programming or sales or working on an oil rig.
A friend of mine went to school with him and was reasonably close with him growing up. He has characterised Assange as sociopathic, largely as a result of his upbringing. Nothing would surprise me at this point.
And despite that, an unqualified male was still selected for what was a significant public opportunity for a sign language interpreter.
To be fair, the female body types are probably just as attainable by the average gamer - it's just that they involve a significant amount of plastic surgery and low self esteem rather than steroids and a life-changingly intensive gym regieme.
Obviously they are white mice
Drs who 'over service' are investigated. I had a GP a few years back who worked crazy hours in a small practice in an area that was short on Drs, she was investigated for over servicing and was told she couldn't take on any new patients.
Generally extra tests are performed by a path lab or imaging lab that isn't directly associated with the originating Drs practice - so they see no additional income from referring you beyond you going back to get the results.
I was diagnosed with cancer last year because of a Dr ordering what might have been considered an extra test (I needed a blood test because of some medication I was on, she decided to do a full work up because it seemed like a good idea at the time). If my GP had not done the extra test, it's likely I wouldn't have been diagnosed so early, would have gotten much sicker than I was and would have required chemo in addition to surgery.
Given the current standard HR policy of requiring a Drs certificate is you have a sick day, I would say most of my Drs visits these days are to get a note saying 'yes she really was sick' when I have a bad head cold or a migraine. I would be better off at home resting, but have to drag myself out to get a bit of paper and to be told to go home, rest, stay warm and keep up my fluids - all things I already know. Most Drs don't have time for unnecessary tests, they're too busy issuing repeat scripts and medical certs.
When cooking, I find it more convenient to speak of cups than liters.
4 cups = 1 litre, not really that hard.
How can we get through to these people that religion belongs in church, and not in our schools, courts or government?
I wish it was just restricted to America. I saw a survey this morning from the Australian Christian Lobby looking to have Creationism added to the National Curriculum in Australia.
I despair for the current generation of children being exposed to this lunacy.
Have you been standing downwind form smokers - that's a serious cough you have there...
Mr Data - the original Real Doll TM
I'm sure if nursing, childcare, primary education and aged care was paid as well as IT, more guys would sign up for it.
I have personally experienced this a number of times; firstly in high school back in the dim dark past of the 80s where I had teachers actively discouraging me form taking STEM classes (physics and applied maths) and telling me to do home economics instead - or just plain leave school. Later working for an IT company as an office manager, I expressed interest in joining the support team, I was offered marketing as my only option. Two jobs later I was a service tech, and later became the technical supervisor for that service centre.
I know it may be hard for you to imagine, but pockets of this still exists, and you have to be pretty resilient to keep pushing to do something where you are made so blatantly unwelcome.
Interestingly it seems to be a predominately anglo issue, most of the women I know in IT are from non-english speaking backgrounds, such as indian, asian, eastern european, where it is acceptable for them to pursue STEM careers. As a BA in a mid sized IT development house, out of 7 BAs, only 2 are female, only 2 are anglo background - with me being the only female anglo. None of the female developers or testers are anglo.
Quite a few years and jobs ago I used to be the technical supervisor of a computer service workshop. When calls came in, if I answered the phone it was not uncommon for (typically male) callers to assume I was 'merely' the receptionist, and they would ask to be put through to one of the techs. I would usually pass the call to one of my male colleagues rather than argue. It used to make me laugh when they would say the problem was too hard for them and they would have to pass it back to their supervisor - and pass the call back to me.
I read that last paragraph as 'secret sauce' and wondered what drugs we were talking about...
Everyone doesn't need to know C++ templates, but everyone needs to know how to throw together a quick script or mobile app, or will soon enough.
I doubt we will ever get to the point where 'everyone' needs to know how to throw together a mobile app. What benefit is there to a NFL linebacker in knowing how to program an app? If he needs one, the team will have someone put one together for him UNLESS he decides for himself that it's something he wants to pursue as an interest and does it in his spare time for his own benefit.
Just because the majority of people on Slashdot live in a world where IT is a highly valued profession/skillset does not mean it's even closely related to what most people do for a living. Half the people I work with couldn't put together a basic function in Excel let alone basic scripting, and there is no reason for them to ever learn - that's why we build templates for them if they have repeatable tasks requiring functions.
As someone who studied architecture at University, I can say that it is a great degree to get an all-rounded education. It includes history, law, fine arts, finance, engineering (structural and mechanical), materials science, theory of design, project management, presentation techniques and customer service. It pushed me to develop critical thinking and analytical skills while at the same time explore more creative aesthetic based design decisions.
Everybody should learn the basics in how to cook a meal from scratch and basic nutrition.
There is no reason for everyone to know how to code, anymore than everyone should know how to rebuild an engine or insert an IV line - they are core skills of specific professions. Core life skills like how to feed yourself, change a light bulb or tap washer and how the contraception/safe sex works, how to balance your cheque book (or the modern equivalent of paying your credit card) are far more important.
Um, woosh... based on the post subject line, his claim was speculative, not real world today factual.
Australia has their own anarchist songsters called TISM, possibly their best known album was Great Trucking Songs of the Renaissance.
TISM's first concert was on 6 December 1983. The Get Fucked Concert at the Duncan McKinnon Athletics Reserve in the small suburb of Murrumbeena was considered a complete failure which caused the band to officially split up. They reformed in February 1984 and returned to their recordings. They consider every subsequent performance a "re-union gig".[1] By 1985 the band was playing regularly around Melbourne and soon released a 10-track demo composed of selections from their recordings followed by their debut single, "Defecate on My Face" (1986), a 7" vinyl record packaged in a 12" sleeve with all four sides glued shut.
Given I had one of my previous employers try and book me to share a room with an opposite sex coworker one time, I would have said potentially sexual harassment. I can't believe they though that idea was even remotely OK.
I once had a interstate training session where the company initially booked for me to share a room with a coworker of the opposite sex - I had to complain to get them to book me in my own room. I got on with the guy well enough - but it doesn't mean I want to sleep 3 feet away from him.
My husband and I have written, yeh gods, at least 20+ tournament modules for gaming conventions, we have a mantra when briefing GMs; "No game survives first contact with the players".
What that is supposed to mean is that while we will spend hours trying to think of examples of left of field things the players might choose to do to come up with suggested responses, the players will always think of something we couldn't in a million years have thought of. GMs need to be flexible and try an incorporate what the players think of into the narrative (like the improv rule of always saying 'yes').
My worst con game experience was a GM (who was also the module author) who would use whirlwinds (it was a Toon scenario) to put the party back on the path every time we strayed from her planned narrative. I ended up falling asleep during the session because there was no scope to explore or make an interesting decision.
Even a bad module can be fun if the GM will play along, we had a terrible multi session D&D module at one con where the GM jumped out a 3rd story window in response to how bad it was (he was a rockclimber, when we all rushed over to see if he was ok, he was hanging there by his fingertips). We hammed it up the whole way through the session and he went down to the tournament orgs and said there was no way he was GMing another session of the terrible module, except, he was absolutely doing the rest of our sessions. I particularly enjoyed the characterisations of the paladin who suffered terrible with cowardice and had lined his armour with sheepskin so he wouldn't clank and bought a ring of invisibility - every time we got into combat he would hide. Then there was the princess we rescued who was best described as having issue with personal hygiene and a bad case of verbal diarrhea.
Everyone keeps mentioning Star Trek, I'm disappointed no-one has mentioned the telepathic rocks from Blake 7 who could move to follow the sun.
Now all we need to do is find a telepath and get them to Mars to ask the rock what it wants.