"Greek nationalist view....". "Too bad that no one outside of Greece cares...". "...peons spoke only their local Indo-European language..."
Clearly you are either a Bulgarian or F.Y.R.O.M.ian that went through a Communistic educational system. Too bad for you and your people (who of course have no connection with the Macedonians, Messinians, Spartans, Athenians, Corinthians, Trojans, Thessalians, Thracians, Epirotians, Cretans that created Greece. And from now on I will use the Greek name of Greece, "Hellas" if our fellow Slashdoters do not mind.
So, you say we Hellenes are nationalists. I prefer the term "free". Free as Leonidas and his 300 Spartans that went to fight with 1.000.000 Persians although they knew they would die. Free as the Hellenes of the Byzantine Empire that fought the Persians, the Arabs, the Russians, the Bulgarians, the Turks,the Crusaders. Free as the Hellenes that fought the Axis Powers in WWII although they knew they were outnumbered and that they would definitely lose. When in the same time, much bigger and wealthier countries had lowered their heads in front of the military power of the Nazis.
Well if to defend your country is considered nationalism then yes we are nationalists.
"Too bad, no one outside of Greece cares..." On the contrary, many many people care. For example, the people that visited Hellas during last year's Olympic Games; I 'll bet that they care. And of course the people that finance F.Y.R.O.M. -this communistic remnant of the Cold War- oh yes! They care a lot what the international public think of Hellas-Macedonia and F.Y.R.O.M.! A lot! Otherwise they would not try to falsify true history with "The Republic of Macedonia". And definitely they would not finance an artificial state which economy is based on prostitution, drug trafficking and arms smuggling.
The "...peons spoke only their local Indo-European language". Yeah right....
Anyway the above statement must be considered as progress. Few years ago, F.Y.R.O.M.ians were saying that Alexander did not speak Greek and that he was a Slav. Then they started saying that Phillip was Greek but Alexander's mother Olympias did not speak Greek since she was a...Slav. Nowadays, they are saying that both Phillip and Alexander were Greeks and spoke Greek but their soldiers were Slavs. In a few years time, F.Y.R.O.M.ians will be begging Greece to accept THEM as Greeks and send some Greek troops to protect F.Y.R.O.M. from the Albanian aggression. Guess what; we are not going to send to F.Y.R.O.M. a single soldier. Why? Because we respect this artificial state.
Good luck with your pathetic propaganda. It gave me a good laugh.
You feel that this posting is flame and that I am a troll? Go to F.Y.R.O.M. and check for yourself! But before doing this check Wikipedia for "Atlantis", "Critias" and "Timeaus". You will reach very, very interesting conclusions.
Actually there is a story call the "Elixir of Immortality" by this http://hatzinikolaou.org/ writer.
According to the story some students from an American university use a USB R.E.G. and a laptop (among other things) to check the authenticity of a "miracle".
... but Namimbia is a country while Macedonia is a -quite developed- province in Greece. And yes I know that some government has recognized the F.ormer Y.ugoslavian R.epublic O.f M.acedonia (FYROM) as "Macedonia" but I think you should check with Wikipedia and form your own opinion.
Well, I don't know when the "paradise" story took place. But I have read ("Timeus", "Crito") that when Greek philosopher Plato visited Egypt the priests told him that the Greeks had fought the people of Atlantis 10.000 years before his visit (I think you can find details in Wikipedia).
If the rumours about Atlantis are correct (misuse of advanced technology, greed) then that ancient war was not fought with spears and swords... which explains many things (Hipparchus map, the computer of Antikythira, etc.)
Well it is very difficult for me to think of any connection between Greeks and caves... BTW it seems that you have not the slightest knowledge of Plato's books. I would recommend you to read "Timeus" and "Crito". It will enhance your ability to discuss and it will improve your manners. But most important it will help you put the "tale of Eden" in its correct perspective.
Yes, I fully agree. Moreover I remember an article here in/. about clubbers in the Spanish island of Majorca that were chipped in their hands in order to pay for their drinks. As far as I remember they went to the clubs wearing just their suimsuits (i.e. without currying any wallets at all). It is common knowledge that in the Majorcan clubs people like to dance, drink and also use other substances. They are not sobber enough to understand that they marked.
You are too quick in shedding your civilized manners... But yes I agree that there are people that deny your existence. As the leaders of the ethnic minorities do. As the leaders of both your slavic neighbours do. Your problem is that you have this false notion that Greeks deny your existence. Well, Greece never denied anybody's right to exist. Greece denies you the right to steal Greece's history. Furthermore, Greece has nothing to hide in it's 10,000 years of history. Don't try to tell us that we have not heard of "real" history. The whole world knows Greek history and doesn't care to listen to communist propaganda. BTW I am Greek and proud of it. I would suggest to you to find something real to be proud of. P.S. I cannot really continue this nice little chat. Me like many thousands Greeks from Macedonia are preparing to welcome the Greek soccer team that returns from Portugal with the Champions' Cup.
It is evident for all slashdoters to see how you counter master_p's arguments. Instead of using arguments of your own, you characterize every Greek as "crazy" and "anti-Macedonian"....
Well, Greeks cannot be "anti-Macedonians". You see for the civilized world Macedonians are Greeks since Macedonia is Greece. Macedonia is NOT slavic. And every Macedonian will laugh at you if you tell him that he is actually a Slav.... (BTW, we only rave for our soccer team successful games in the Euro 2004).
I am impressed by the cultural wealth of your speech. "Stupid", "Facist" etc.
Nobody asked you to bend in front of liars and facists. Every rational human being would like your people to stop bending as you did for many decades before your Communist masters.
Now, become a stable democracy, punish unlawful activities, find someting to bond the minorities that constitute F.Y.R.O.M and who knows; perhaps in two-three generations you could become part of the E.U. You could even host the Olympic Games.
BTW, stop believing the nonsense they taught you at school. Philip was Greek, Alexander was Greek as any teacher in any democratic country would assure you.
There is not such a country named as Macedonia.
Neither would be a kingdom, republic, federation, peoples republic, colony or whatever of Macedonia.
The correct term is F.Y.R.O.M which stands for FORMER YUGOSLAVIC Republic of Macedonia a remnant of the Cold War.
The term Macedonia denotes the northern part of Greece. Macedonia is Greece.
Should an artificial state has its own internet identifier (for example.fyrom) in the first place?
First of all, what you call "Macedonia" has a formal name which is Former Yugoslavic Republic of Macedonia. IMO "Macedonia" is the direct result of the breakup of Yugoslavia. For many decades after WW2 the communist regime of Yugoslavia used the term "Macedonia" to define the southern part of Yugoslavia.
Now according to macedonia.org ""Macedonians" make up 66% of "Macedonia's" population of 2 million, Albanians 23%, and Turks, Vlach, and Serbs, the rest (1994 census)"
In the past 50 years communism was the ideology that hold together the people of Yugoslavia and its constituents republics like "Macedonia".
After the breakup of Yugoslavia their politicians "sold" this story of "Macedonia" to the Albanians, Turks, Vlachs and Serbs i.e. that they are true descendants of Macedonians.
Please...
The true Macedonians were, are and will be Greeks residents of northern Greece. Aristotle the philosopher was Greek and lived in Macedonia, Greece. Philip the father of Alexander the Great was Greek and was king of Macedonia, Greece. Alexander was king of Macedonia, Greece and he became emperor of the area from Asia Minor up to the borders of present day India. (BTW he is the only conqueror still remembered by the population of Middle East as a liberator and just sovereign)
As for the internet access of the Former Yugoslavic (communist) Republic of Macedonia... Well their government should start by diminishing internet fraud and curbing the illegal activities in general in their state.
They stood on the shoulders of giants? Wow, that's a statement!
If you ever visit Athens, in the archaelogical museum you will see the gold-plated head of a Bull consider sacred by early Greeks.
I repeat gold-plated as in "plated with gold using ELECTRICITY"
Now, can any hacker of this fine community remind me who discovered electricity?
Slashdot Mirror
Clearly you are either a Bulgarian or F.Y.R.O.M.ian that went through a Communistic educational system. Too bad for you and your people (who of course have no connection with the Macedonians, Messinians, Spartans, Athenians, Corinthians, Trojans, Thessalians, Thracians, Epirotians, Cretans that created Greece. And from now on I will use the Greek name of Greece, "Hellas" if our fellow Slashdoters do not mind.
So, you say we Hellenes are nationalists. I prefer the term "free". Free as Leonidas and his 300 Spartans that went to fight with 1.000.000 Persians although they knew they would die. Free as the Hellenes of the Byzantine Empire that fought the Persians, the Arabs, the Russians, the Bulgarians, the Turks,the Crusaders. Free as the Hellenes that fought the Axis Powers in WWII although they knew they were outnumbered and that they would definitely lose. When in the same time, much bigger and wealthier countries had lowered their heads in front of the military power of the Nazis. Well if to defend your country is considered nationalism then yes we are nationalists."Too bad, no one outside of Greece cares..." On the contrary, many many people care. For example, the people that visited Hellas during last year's Olympic Games; I 'll bet that they care. And of course the people that finance F.Y.R.O.M. -this communistic remnant of the Cold War- oh yes! They care a lot what the international public think of Hellas-Macedonia and F.Y.R.O.M.! A lot! Otherwise they would not try to falsify true history with "The Republic of Macedonia". And definitely they would not finance an artificial state which economy is based on prostitution, drug trafficking and arms smuggling.
The " ...peons spoke only their local Indo-European language". Yeah right....
Anyway the above statement must be considered as progress. Few years ago, F.Y.R.O.M.ians were saying that Alexander did not speak Greek and that he was a Slav. Then they started saying that Phillip was Greek but Alexander's mother Olympias did not speak Greek since she was a ...Slav. Nowadays, they are saying that both Phillip and Alexander were Greeks and spoke Greek but their soldiers were Slavs. In a few years time, F.Y.R.O.M.ians will be begging Greece to accept THEM as Greeks and send some Greek troops to protect F.Y.R.O.M. from the Albanian aggression. Guess what; we are not going to send to F.Y.R.O.M. a single soldier. Why? Because we respect this artificial state.
Good luck with your pathetic propaganda. It gave me a good laugh.
You feel that this posting is flame and that I am a troll? Go to F.Y.R.O.M. and check for yourself! But before doing this check Wikipedia for "Atlantis", "Critias" and "Timeaus". You will reach very, very interesting conclusions.
F.Y.I. the miracle was rather real
... but Namimbia is a country while Macedonia is a -quite developed- province in Greece. And yes I know that some government has recognized the F.ormer Y.ugoslavian R.epublic O.f M.acedonia (FYROM) as "Macedonia" but I think you should check with Wikipedia and form your own opinion.
Sorry guys but IMHO these practices will not lead to the rise of dollar. At least not for the next thousand years.
Well, I don't know when the "paradise" story took place. But I have read ("Timeus", "Crito") that when Greek philosopher Plato visited Egypt the priests told him that the Greeks had fought the people of Atlantis 10.000 years before his visit (I think you can find details in Wikipedia). If the rumours about Atlantis are correct (misuse of advanced technology, greed) then that ancient war was not fought with spears and swords... which explains many things (Hipparchus map, the computer of Antikythira, etc.)
Well it is very difficult for me to think of any connection between Greeks and caves... BTW it seems that you have not the slightest knowledge of Plato's books. I would recommend you to read "Timeus" and "Crito". It will enhance your ability to discuss and it will improve your manners. But most important it will help you put the "tale of Eden" in its correct perspective.
The place is ready and full of Japanese that have rented rooms and cubicles for their tv networks.
You are too quick in shedding your civilized manners... But yes I agree that there are people that deny your existence. As the leaders of the ethnic minorities do. As the leaders of both your slavic neighbours do. Your problem is that you have this false notion that Greeks deny your existence. Well, Greece never denied anybody's right to exist. Greece denies you the right to steal Greece's history. Furthermore, Greece has nothing to hide in it's 10,000 years of history. Don't try to tell us that we have not heard of "real" history. The whole world knows Greek history and doesn't care to listen to communist propaganda. BTW I am Greek and proud of it. I would suggest to you to find something real to be proud of. P.S. I cannot really continue this nice little chat. Me like many thousands Greeks from Macedonia are preparing to welcome the Greek soccer team that returns from Portugal with the Champions' Cup.
It is evident for all slashdoters to see how you counter master_p's arguments. Instead of using arguments of your own, you characterize every Greek as "crazy" and "anti-Macedonian".... Well, Greeks cannot be "anti-Macedonians". You see for the civilized world Macedonians are Greeks since Macedonia is Greece. Macedonia is NOT slavic. And every Macedonian will laugh at you if you tell him that he is actually a Slav.... (BTW, we only rave for our soccer team successful games in the Euro 2004).
I am impressed by the cultural wealth of your speech. "Stupid", "Facist" etc. Nobody asked you to bend in front of liars and facists. Every rational human being would like your people to stop bending as you did for many decades before your Communist masters. Now, become a stable democracy, punish unlawful activities, find someting to bond the minorities that constitute F.Y.R.O.M and who knows; perhaps in two-three generations you could become part of the E.U. You could even host the Olympic Games. BTW, stop believing the nonsense they taught you at school. Philip was Greek, Alexander was Greek as any teacher in any democratic country would assure you.
Slavic "knyaz"? Could you be more specific mr. Anonymous Coward?
There is not such a country named as Macedonia. Neither would be a kingdom, republic, federation, peoples republic, colony or whatever of Macedonia. The correct term is F.Y.R.O.M which stands for FORMER YUGOSLAVIC Republic of Macedonia a remnant of the Cold War. The term Macedonia denotes the northern part of Greece. Macedonia is Greece.
Should an artificial state has its own internet identifier (for example .fyrom) in the first place?
First of all, what you call "Macedonia" has a formal name which is Former Yugoslavic Republic of Macedonia. IMO "Macedonia" is the direct result of the breakup of Yugoslavia. For many decades after WW2 the communist regime of Yugoslavia used the term "Macedonia" to define the southern part of Yugoslavia.
Now according to macedonia.org ""Macedonians" make up 66% of "Macedonia's" population of 2 million, Albanians 23%, and Turks, Vlach, and Serbs, the rest (1994 census)"
In the past 50 years communism was the ideology that hold together the people of Yugoslavia and its constituents republics like "Macedonia".
After the breakup of Yugoslavia their politicians "sold" this story of "Macedonia" to the Albanians, Turks, Vlachs and Serbs i.e. that they are true descendants of Macedonians.
Please...
The true Macedonians were, are and will be Greeks residents of northern Greece. Aristotle the philosopher was Greek and lived in Macedonia, Greece. Philip the father of Alexander the Great was Greek and was king of Macedonia, Greece. Alexander was king of Macedonia, Greece and he became emperor of the area from Asia Minor up to the borders of present day India. (BTW he is the only conqueror still remembered by the population of Middle East as a liberator and just sovereign)
As for the internet access of the Former Yugoslavic (communist) Republic of Macedonia... Well their government should start by diminishing internet fraud and curbing the illegal activities in general in their state.
They stood on the shoulders of giants? Wow, that's a statement! If you ever visit Athens, in the archaelogical museum you will see the gold-plated head of a Bull consider sacred by early Greeks. I repeat gold-plated as in "plated with gold using ELECTRICITY" Now, can any hacker of this fine community remind me who discovered electricity?