Umm.. I can't stand KDE, but even I know when a good program raps on my head. Konqueror is the only program I use out of the KDE camp( sorry KDE people, but I just don't like the feel of KDE, but Konqueror is well worth it:-).
I do keep Mozilla around though.. Just in case Konqueror blows up on me( like when a page has DOM programming on it ).
You're so smart.. you can add. I'm so proud of you.
And yes. I run Star Office 5.2, xmms, Mozilla, and licq ALL at the same time, with NO slowdown. I don't care if you don't believe me, but it's a statement of fact. I believe it ends up swapping out about 30-40 MBs... So the *startup* is slow, but once they get started it's smooth sailing.
With everyone complaining that *just* mozilla slows down their 700 MHz, then I'm happy where I am:-P
Not to mention that maybe you just need help optimizing your stuff...
I'm running the nightly from last night and it run perfectly fine. I"m running on an AMD-300 with 64 MB. I also run xmms, licq, and Star Office 5.2 at the same time with no slowdown.
And for the Konqueror fanatics: Konqueror may be a good browser( well khtml is ), but it's nowhere in the league of Mozilla yet. If I have to wait another 6 minutes for the damn thing to start up because "I'm not running the DCOP server" at that time, then I'm gonna shoot the thing.
There's a reason I don't run KDE2 apps anymore: The DCOP server. They should at least provide the capability not to use it... but noooo... why would they want to do that
0.0 9.6 16000 6028 ? S 08:00 0:00 kdeinit: dcopserv.
And it has 7 other friends too... And guess what? it runs when you want to *any* KDE2 app.. incluing Konsole. ugh!
I just went to an X-box presentation last Wednesday where that exact question was asked.
Their answer, in short, was that they are Microsoft. They make DirectX, therefore it makes since for them to push DirectX. The Dev guy also stated that if anyone wishes to make an OpenGL subsystem for the Xbox, they are welcome to, but it won't be supported by Microsoft.
One of their exact quotes was:
"Why put our eggs in 2 baskets that are half-assed, when we can put them all in one and it be kickass." This was from the Multimedia Head of the Xbox Dev Team.
Also, they stated that it will not BSOD.. they can't afford that. That quickly got questions like: "Then what color is it?". heh, quite funny.. you had to be there I guess.
But, overall, the presentation really didn't impress me... too much "This is what 10% of the theorectical power of the Xbox will be able to do" crap.
Napster does have legal uses. Period! Distributing legal mp3's is that reason. It does not matter that it can possibly be used to violate IP laws. If that was the case, then pack up your VCR's, tape recorders, and any other recording device you own.
What? you say these all legal uses?? Well so does Napster! They both have legal and illegal uses and it is up to the user not to violate these laws.
And personally, as long as Sun distributes the source to any drivers it ships with Solaris, then they are perfectly within their right
What is it with these trolls??? Could we *not* start these stupid flame fests??? What is it with these people.
Even if don't intend on a flame fest( doubtful with that statement ), using KDE or GNOME is a personal choice, so you're gonna spark yet more tiresome dribble.
I completely disagree with you and think GNOME is better, and we can argue until we are blue in the face. It won't help because its a personal decision. And yes I used KDE2, just yesterday in fact. So let's agree to disagree, and be done with it.
Could Moderators mark this parent at -1(Flamebait, Redundant, and just plain Dumb).
I just read the GPL again. Sorry about the confusion, it seems the "system libraries" are an exception to the source distibution.
Since the Microsoft libraries do not "impose any further restrictions on the recipients' exercise of the rights granted herein". Then the GPL'd programs compiled against these libs should be okay. If MS were to start enforcing restrictions on the code, then it might be different.
The GPL is a mess. It seems excessively harsh with repect to linking. I guess that's what the LGPL and BSD licenses are for:-)
So any program compiled with GCC/G++ must be licensed under the GPL or compatible to it?? I don't think that's how it works.
Remember, the GPL does NOT extend to libraries that are considered "system libraries" which gcc/g++ libraries and the libaries that MSVC uses are considered to be( system libraries ).
Therefore you can compile a non-GPL'd program with gcc or a GPL'd program with MSVC. To compile with Cygwin gcc for Windows however, it must be GPL'd because Cygwin isn't a "system library".
And the GPL only dictates the Source be availible. It is in the case of VNC. You could take their linux code and compile it on Windows with Cygwin I'm sure( I haven't tried ).
Re:Debian will have to find a new excuse
on
Qt Going GPL
·
· Score: 1
There is none. KDE will probably start carrying KDE now.
Actually if the Ports portion works like OpenBSD, then it would be easy to "port" this part over. The Ports just download the source, apply some patches that are specifc to the OS, compile, install, and log the installation. Assuming the source compiles on the the machine, the "Ports" would work.
The Package portion would be harder because they are Binary, and since Linux doesn't have a "BSD Compatibility Mode", this ain't gonna work. Though Linux might be able to hobble through it, I don't think Solaris or IRIX could use the binaries. So the only way to accomplish this part would be to make completely different binaries for each target OS. Too much, too soon. Ask later when(if) this system gets picked up on the BSDs.
The reason it's BSD only is because the BSDs are so close to each other with binary compatibility, unlike IRIX, Linux, and Solaris.
So to answer your question: Ports would work, Packages would NOT(yet)
Give him a break! I'm sure he knows this, and there's no point in stating the obvious.
And usually to gain *complete* control over a box you must gain root or some other super-user power/permission, directly or indirectly. Therefore his statement of "rooting a box" can be construed as correct.
root(unix) = Administrator(Win NT/2k) = normal user( Win 9x/ME ).
if you use this simple conversion his statement can again be construed as correct.
If you can state an example of having *complete* control over a box without root/Admin permissions please tell me.
I don't that's what he's saying at all. He's saying that if the two would agree on an interoperable communication system with mappings from a KDE hint to a GNOME hint, or some such it would be easier on the developer AND the end user.
KDE and GNOME can use different toolkits and be as different as they want. It's the communication interoperability that most people are complaining about. Once these standard hints( Cut&Paste. docking) were added cross-apps would be better available.
The mud slinging on both sides is pointless, and KDE has done much more in the past months. GNOME used to be my DE of choice, but with all this fighting I've given up on them both and just develop in GTK+.
During the course of discussing these tools on the mailing lists, XML-based config files were heavily discussed. I'm not sure what happened as a result of that discussion but I think Helixcode is using a layer of XML for configuration
I don't care if Mozilla or IE put proprietary "standards" in, BUT you first have to support the basics -- the STANDARDS. IE doesn't support all of the standards, therefore they should fix those *before* moving on.
At least Mozilla sticks to the standards. And if they don't then they'll be blasted too
The point is they don't *have* to tell us. It's much like a person calling on your phone and then, when you answer, hangs up, with that nice "No Data Sent" Id.
Sure it's rude, but they're nothing bad about it. At least we know where it's coming from, and you can take steps to make sure it doesn't happen anymore.
Then what's your problem?? If your network is secured then you don't have to worry about this. What they are doing is perfectly fine. It's not like they are gonna use the whole 23 bytes of ping data to adversely affect your machine or institute a DoS... you're lucky if you even see the little spike in your bandwidth, and unless you have a Port Sentry running you'll never know about it anyway
What you are calling stupid, the writers of the GPL *purposefully* put in there. They felt that if someone's program depends upon a GPL'd library then that program should also be GPL'd so that others could benefit from that work.
And there is a simple solution to your problem: Use the BSD license with BSD licensed libraries and you can put your program under any license you wish.
If I remember correctly MS has come out with a product called IIS.. Did the same company also not come out with Mail, File, DNS, and other software? These couldn't be aimed as competition could they? No company would do that...
Closed source companies have tried for a long time to dethrone Open Source packages.. the fact remains that they can't. Either because the Closed Source counterpart is much worse or because people like the fact that Open Source packages are inherently more secure because of the number of eyes that look at the source code. And many countries agree that Open Source packages are inherently more secure( China, France, USA, Canada, Astrailia, Russia, Britain, and many others )
Actually OSS can be profitable, I believe UT and Quake3 have opened their sources alot( though not completely ), and that software is still selling. People buy boxed Linux distributions, Apache, open-sourced firewall packages, and alot of other Open Source products.
And if a company does not want to credit me if they use my code, then they MUST remove it. That's like saying to MS, "We're gonna use your threading algorithms without you knowing, and, if you happen to find out, we won't give you credit for writing the algorithms," Your arguement there is absurd.
And I believe the reason Apache and Sendmail were ported to Windows was to REPLACE MS's mail, and web software.
So far I see that your statements are completely unfounded. If you really want to debate the matter, I invite you to.
I now see why people post as Anonymous Cowards.. Because they're too cowardous to put their name to what they say... I really think we need to get rid of the AC status.
Re:AMD is just clearing out old stock
on
Athlons Sold Out
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· Score: 2
The Spitfire *is* AMD's low end chip... it's meant to compete with the Celeries( hence the Socket-A only package )
The Thunderbird *and* the Spitfire have Athlon cores so dnet's clients wouldn't be affected in the slightest bit.
I really don't expect AMD to keep the old Athlon's around.. Why would they?? the Thunderbirds and Spitfires are it's replacment.
Re:I speak for myself when I say...
on
Athlons Sold Out
·
· Score: 1
SMP shouldn't a big concern for AMD yet. The top selling "OS"( Windows 98 ) doesn't support more than one processor, therefore most of the computers will only have one processor in them anyway.
AMD will release their SMP chipset with the Thunderbird's release, then you can have AMD. Until then stick with Intel... AMD seems to have enough business right now anyway:-)
I swear, you anonymous cowards need to get a clue. Lots of people would use this encryption( besides pedophiles anyway). Think about credit card companies, and schools, and hospitals.
They all need encryption. And this helps alot!
I really think the anonymous coward status should go away!
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Umm.. I can't stand KDE, but even I know when a good program raps on my head. Konqueror is the only program I use out of the KDE camp( sorry KDE people, but I just don't like the feel of KDE, but Konqueror is well worth it :-).
I do keep Mozilla around though.. Just in case Konqueror blows up on me( like when a page has DOM programming on it ).
Umm.. the Realtek 8139 drivers work for me in with the 2.4.0test5 kernel... and I use two of them in the same machine :-P
Just say you like FreeBSD better next time.
You're so smart.. you can add. I'm so proud of you.
:-P
And yes. I run Star Office 5.2, xmms, Mozilla, and licq ALL at the same time, with NO slowdown. I don't care if you don't believe me, but it's a statement of fact. I believe it ends up swapping out about 30-40 MBs... So the *startup* is slow, but once they get started it's smooth sailing.
With everyone complaining that *just* mozilla slows down their 700 MHz, then I'm happy where I am
Not to mention that maybe you just need help optimizing your stuff...
I'm running the nightly from last night and it run perfectly fine. I"m running on an AMD-300 with 64 MB. I also run xmms, licq, and Star Office 5.2 at the same time with no slowdown.
And for the Konqueror fanatics: Konqueror may be a good browser( well khtml is ), but it's nowhere in the league of Mozilla yet. If I have to wait another 6 minutes for the damn thing to start up because "I'm not running the DCOP server" at that time, then I'm gonna shoot the thing.
There's a reason I don't run KDE2 apps anymore: The DCOP server. They should at least provide the capability not to use it... but noooo... why would they want to do that
0.0 9.6 16000 6028 ? S 08:00 0:00 kdeinit: dcopserv.
And it has 7 other friends too... And guess what? it runs when you want to *any* KDE2 app.. incluing Konsole. ugh!
I just went to an X-box presentation last Wednesday where that exact question was asked.
Their answer, in short, was that they are Microsoft. They make DirectX, therefore it makes since for them to push DirectX. The Dev guy also stated that if anyone wishes to make an OpenGL subsystem for the Xbox, they are welcome to, but it won't be supported by Microsoft.
One of their exact quotes was:
"Why put our eggs in 2 baskets that are half-assed, when we can put them all in one and it be kickass." This was from the Multimedia Head of the Xbox Dev Team.
Also, they stated that it will not BSOD.. they can't afford that. That quickly got questions like: "Then what color is it?". heh, quite funny.. you had to be there I guess.
But, overall, the presentation really didn't impress me... too much "This is what 10% of the theorectical power of the Xbox will be able to do" crap.
Well.. that's my bit for now.
That's funny... seeing how all these people seem to having trouble running mozilla on their machines.
I run Star Office 5.2, Mozilla, licq, xmms, 3 rxvts all at the same time.. with NO slow down.. and you know what my machine is?? A PoS!!!
350 K6-2, 64 MB RAM...running Debian woody.
I'm sorry but you people who can't run Mozilla BY ITSELF need a little help.
How many times do we have to go through this...
Napster does have legal uses. Period! Distributing legal mp3's is that reason. It does not matter that it can possibly be used to violate IP laws. If that was the case, then pack up your VCR's, tape recorders, and any other recording device you own.
What? you say these all legal uses?? Well so does Napster! They both have legal and illegal uses and it is up to the user not to violate these laws.
And personally, as long as Sun distributes the source to any drivers it ships with Solaris, then they are perfectly within their right
Just because Bruce says Sun isn't in violation, does that make it so?? Bruce can be wrong sometimes too. He is, afterall, human.
Before I believe *anything* people say they'll have to explain it to me and in great detail, including Bruce.
What is it with these trolls??? Could we *not* start these stupid flame fests??? What is it with these people.
Even if don't intend on a flame fest( doubtful with that statement ), using KDE or GNOME is a personal choice, so you're gonna spark yet more tiresome dribble.
I completely disagree with you and think GNOME is better, and we can argue until we are blue in the face. It won't help because its a personal decision. And yes I used KDE2, just yesterday in fact. So let's agree to disagree, and be done with it.
Could Moderators mark this parent at -1(Flamebait, Redundant, and just plain Dumb).
Thank You!
I just read the GPL again. Sorry about the confusion, it seems the "system libraries" are an exception to the source distibution.
:-)
Since the Microsoft libraries do not "impose any further restrictions on the recipients' exercise of the rights granted herein". Then the GPL'd programs compiled against these libs should be okay. If MS were to start enforcing restrictions on the code, then it might be different.
The GPL is a mess. It seems excessively harsh with repect to linking. I guess that's what the LGPL and BSD licenses are for
So any program compiled with GCC/G++ must be licensed under the GPL or compatible to it?? I don't think that's how it works.
Remember, the GPL does NOT extend to libraries that are considered "system libraries" which gcc/g++ libraries and the libaries that MSVC uses are considered to be( system libraries ).
Therefore you can compile a non-GPL'd program with gcc or a GPL'd program with MSVC. To compile with Cygwin gcc for Windows however, it must be GPL'd because Cygwin isn't a "system library".
And the GPL only dictates the Source be availible. It is in the case of VNC. You could take their linux code and compile it on Windows with Cygwin I'm sure( I haven't tried ).
There is none. KDE will probably start carrying KDE now.
Actually if the Ports portion works like OpenBSD, then it would be easy to "port" this part over. The Ports just download the source, apply some patches that are specifc to the OS, compile, install, and log the installation. Assuming the source compiles on the the machine, the "Ports" would work.
The Package portion would be harder because they are Binary, and since Linux doesn't have a "BSD Compatibility Mode", this ain't gonna work. Though Linux might be able to hobble through it, I don't think Solaris or IRIX could use the binaries. So the only way to accomplish this part would be to make completely different binaries for each target OS. Too much, too soon. Ask later when(if) this system gets picked up on the BSDs.
The reason it's BSD only is because the BSDs are so close to each other with binary compatibility, unlike IRIX, Linux, and Solaris.
So to answer your question: Ports would work, Packages would NOT(yet)
Give him a break! I'm sure he knows this, and there's no point in stating the obvious.
And usually to gain *complete* control over a box you must gain root or some other super-user power/permission, directly or indirectly. Therefore his statement of "rooting a box" can be construed as correct.
root(unix) = Administrator(Win NT/2k) = normal user( Win 9x/ME ).
if you use this simple conversion his statement can again be construed as correct.
If you can state an example of having *complete* control over a box without root/Admin permissions please tell me.
I don't that's what he's saying at all. He's saying that if the two would agree on an interoperable communication system with mappings from a KDE hint to a GNOME hint, or some such it would be easier on the developer AND the end user.
KDE and GNOME can use different toolkits and be as different as they want. It's the communication interoperability that most people are complaining about. Once these standard hints( Cut&Paste. docking) were added cross-apps would be better available.
The mud slinging on both sides is pointless, and KDE has done much more in the past months. GNOME used to be my DE of choice, but with all this fighting I've given up on them both and just develop in GTK+.
During the course of discussing these tools on the mailing lists, XML-based config files were heavily discussed. I'm not sure what happened as a result of that discussion but I think Helixcode is using a layer of XML for configuration
I don't care if Mozilla or IE put proprietary "standards" in, BUT you first have to support the basics -- the STANDARDS. IE doesn't support all of the standards, therefore they should fix those *before* moving on.
At least Mozilla sticks to the standards. And if they don't then they'll be blasted too
The point is they don't *have* to tell us. It's much like a person calling on your phone and then, when you answer, hangs up, with that nice "No Data Sent" Id.
Sure it's rude, but they're nothing bad about it. At least we know where it's coming from, and you can take steps to make sure it doesn't happen anymore.
Then what's your problem?? If your network is secured then you don't have to worry about this. What they are doing is perfectly fine. It's not like they are gonna use the whole 23 bytes of ping data to adversely affect your machine or institute a DoS... you're lucky if you even see the little spike in your bandwidth, and unless you have a Port Sentry running you'll never know about it anyway
What you are calling stupid, the writers of the GPL *purposefully* put in there. They felt that if someone's program depends upon a GPL'd library then that program should also be GPL'd so that others could benefit from that work.
And there is a simple solution to your problem:
Use the BSD license with BSD licensed libraries and you can put your program under any license you wish.
You're right... I guess he got me a little riled up...
:-)
AC's are important for some things afterall
If I remember correctly MS has come out with a product called IIS.. Did the same company also not come out with Mail, File, DNS, and other software? These couldn't be aimed as competition could they? No company would do that...
Closed source companies have tried for a long time to dethrone Open Source packages.. the fact remains that they can't. Either because the Closed Source counterpart is much worse or because people like the fact that Open Source packages are inherently more secure because of the number of eyes that look at the source code. And many countries agree that Open Source packages are inherently more secure( China, France, USA, Canada, Astrailia, Russia, Britain, and many others )
Actually OSS can be profitable, I believe UT and Quake3 have opened their sources alot( though not completely ), and that software is still selling. People buy boxed Linux distributions, Apache, open-sourced firewall packages, and alot of other Open Source products.
And if a company does not want to credit me if they use my code, then they MUST remove it. That's like saying to MS, "We're gonna use your threading algorithms without you knowing, and, if you happen to find out, we won't give you credit for writing the algorithms," Your arguement there is absurd.
And I believe the reason Apache and Sendmail were ported to Windows was to REPLACE MS's mail, and web software.
So far I see that your statements are completely unfounded. If you really want to debate the matter, I invite you to.
I now see why people post as Anonymous Cowards.. Because they're too cowardous to put their name to what they say... I really think we need to get rid of the AC status.
The Spitfire *is* AMD's low end chip... it's meant to compete with the Celeries( hence the Socket-A only package )
The Thunderbird *and* the Spitfire have Athlon cores so dnet's clients wouldn't be affected in the slightest bit.
I really don't expect AMD to keep the old Athlon's around.. Why would they?? the Thunderbirds and Spitfires are it's replacment.
SMP shouldn't a big concern for AMD yet. The top selling "OS"( Windows 98 ) doesn't support more than one processor, therefore most of the computers will only have one processor in them anyway.
:-)
AMD will release their SMP chipset with the Thunderbird's release, then you can have AMD. Until then stick with Intel... AMD seems to have enough business right now anyway
I swear, you anonymous cowards need to get a clue. Lots of people would use this encryption( besides pedophiles anyway). Think about credit card companies, and schools, and hospitals.
They all need encryption. And this helps alot!
I really think the anonymous coward status should go away!