After being over-exposed to OOP (clunky, temptation to make everything an object, multiple inheritence obscuring what the code is supposed to do), people are trying to find a balance between when OOP should and shouldn't be used.
Java has no multiple inheritance.
Everything except for for primitives are Objects, and unless you writ your own VM you have to make everything objects... Oh I see, you cannot grasp good design in OO? I suggest you get good at design, then your worries will fade.
A lot of people reading Slashdot are in the web industry, which is primarily text processing (though we can think up fancy names such as data mining, content management systems, etc).Don't think you've discovered anything no-one else has, the chances are they've all tried these "powerful programming tools" and discarded them as unproductive for them.
The web industry has nothing to do with text processing. If you are talking about something to do with 'streaming text content over http' then that hardly comprises the industry of web development.
Web development spans many niches, from web design to web engineering.
The whole point is, the string programming methods of web development that plagued us in ASP and to some degree in vanilla jsp, are gone, if you have been in web development for at least 5/6 years you will remember the very bad old days.
I personally don't want to go back to PERL/CGI (works for amazon though!) programming, but newer systems such as banking are complex enough that this 'text processing' isn't an issue, and we also have removed 'text processing' with elegant new systems such as Java Server Faces. Even struts and a tomcat instance will get you far.
Data Mining: data processing using sophisticated data search capabilities and statistical algorithms to discover patterns and correlations in large preexisting databases; a way to discover new meaning in data [thanks dictionary.com]
Content management, well, since I am more than a little knowledgable on what CMsystems are [1 thesis and 1 cms], or, what they are not, I can say they are not to do with web development.
Some CMS are developed with web interfaces, yes.
The following kills me, it really does:
[me-grandparent]The program isn't the code, it isn't the data, it is the design, the behaviour, the organisation, the people understanding it. All of this becomes very alien to us when we go this route.[/me]
Complete BS. You do a func spec then a tech spec. After this the implementation is down to the project manager and the developer. With the right specs the system will behave identically, no matter what language it is written in. Whether C, Java, C#, Lisp or Whitespace. The main difference is in the time-to-market and the maintenance costs (usually inversely proportional to each other).
I see the game, you take what I say, call it bullshit, then say it again will more words, as if written for an idiot. Well done, you win!
In my experience Java takes a long time to develop, but when done you can just throw more and more hardware at it. LAMP is an order of magnitude quicker to develop but when hitting hardware limitations you need more lateral thinking to overcome these.
I think you got them crossed. LAMP is based on scalable [grid] hardware, and Java is based on scalable development, not the way you just said.
Java allows you to translate development in very quick time. Of course, for specific functions there are frameworks to model you application around, that make complex applications easier to develop over and over again.
LAMP is based on PHP, hands up who wrote two PHP driven websites, admittedly without using templating *hand shoots up* right, so I am not a PHP expert, if you can discount 18 months experience, but I am a Java expert, not necessarily a development expert, I know enough to know I can go further!
Is this the first time Linus has used his 'fame' like this?
I say great work for all three of them, I have used all thier products numerously, and together, they should win awards (although the combined 'banging head against wall' linux, mysql and php have given me in the past:-):-) I forgive them!)
Patents are patently a bad idea, they illegitimise our very thoughts. I am all for protecting and incubating progress for small companies, but patents have only done the following:
Small company gets rediculous patent, Kodak buys them, and forces a settlement for publicity.
The european constitution should write that software is free from patents. Patents are supposed to bring about change, yet we see it stiffling progress at every turn!
I myself worry about patents in my own programs, and ask/. has had concerns raised.
If you need to spend millions to develop a product which to your customer does little more than the "cheap" product
Sorry I meant proprietary solutions for large organisations.
I think the level of software commodotisation will mean that a generic griddable-hybernate data CRUD solution with pluggable 'logic' blocks might become the status quo in the future, hang on, wasn't that the jist of J2EE?:-) Who knows!:-)
J2EE and hardware costs about 1% of the TOC of an application. The cost are the rooms of people administrating, developing and testing the apps, and the phone book full of contractors pulled in to help out.
I can imagine a LAMP contractor would be in short supply, yet an Oracle DBA, Java guru, J2EE guy would be already emplyed in your department happily running along listening to his free ipod or something new-geeky.
Welcome to the real world. Something costing 0 doesn't costs much less than comething costing 50k in development terms.
Commodity OS's on the desktop that people use outlook on however, can be replaced with nice linux boxes and thunderbird for no real cost overheads - because your guys should be up on all that anyway.
So OS in its place. Development of enterprise critical applications in thier.
I am sorry, as much of an OS touter, I say J2EE on solaris is the current app, now, they muddied the water with this grid nonesense, I will have to see... but for now it is a weak towing of the line.
Java and Eclipse for application development under Mac. Even Java3D and many other lovely libraries, plus the L&F is full Mac, and check out Suns guide to macifying a java app.
And has a few trollish statements against Democrates. It is fine to defend your stance as a Bush voter, it is your right, but please, listen to the following:
Those who voted Bush gave thier first and only affirmative acceptance and vote of persnal merit to the actions undertaken in Iraq. Prior to this no American had given a personal vote of acceptance to the actions undertaken, if you voted Bush, then you approve of Fallujah, of the troops for oil programs, and the rest.
You voted into power the wealthiest cabinet in the history of all nations. Thier personal assets are shocking.
That is all, sorry, please mod OT, or even insightful for this thread! and don't feed the trolls.
What? Who cares about anything in your last paragraph? Java is Java if it was first, second, third or last.
Hasn't done one original thing? Well, a cross platform skinnable lightweight UI package that sits on top of a JIT bytecode compiler, that gives you binary compatibility between MFC, GTK, qt and other libraries.... that is pretty cool.
Alsom the JCP is pretty revolutionary in software development, and a very good start for originality.
Linux community never really adopted Java, it is a shame, it isn't a system programming language in terms of writing OS's (although there is an OS, blah blah) it is an application language.
Java needs more open source approval, there are awesome java based applications on freshmeat, and more added all the time.
Java is an excellent application development platform. If it is not for you then say so and move on!:-)
Your statement: Java is great... I guess, personally I think it's the worst thing to happen to systems programming since C++ makes me discredit most of what you say, sorry.
Have fun in C++ land though! I envy you!! NO I DO!! *stiffles painful laugh and then remembers C++ days and goes into shock*
He is such a jack-off it makes me think that he is an industry sleeper - someone sent to destroy all credibility of Sun.
M$ has thier own monkey boy, a semi-self-styled nut who says anything he wants, and M$ quizzically apologises for him, and does that half eye roll, well he is nuttier than squirrel shit look and hopefully get away with it.
What the fuck are they trying to prove, Linux is an OS, Java is a devleopment platform, what is the point all this rhetorical FUD? Does it make sense man?
I think not. Now to compound matters the sub blurb on this book is:
Musings of open source blah blah by an accidental revolutionary.
WTF? WHO-TF more like... Also, he is a gun nut. Just what we need. ITS GNU NOT GUN you nozz.
http://www.catb.org/~esr/guns/.
Did this make sense to anybody else? Is this Sun's take of M$ OS costs more? Is it just my sugar deprived brain thinking this is all too wierd?
So let's look at the requirements for today's corporate applications... Given these requirements, Java does not fare very well. Apparently what is needed is a language/environment that is loosely typed in order to encapsulate XML well and that can efficiently process text. It should be very well suited for specifying control flow. And it should be a thin veneer over the operating system.
So we came from string programming roots, we developed OOP and AOP, and now... now we go back to string programming because of xml parsing?
I find this a worrying trend, you have to understand, an application is state, and behaviour.
This is trying to tie an application into a 'thin veneer' over an operating system, which seems a bit worrying for an app that will cost a few million to develop in the right circles.
Be reducing all the benefits of OOP (huge and varied, numerous and wonderful) we seek to define our crowining enterprise applications with an approach from the 70's that would pioneer the use of string processing programming constructs over highly developed and structured powerful programming tools.
The program isn't the code, it isn't the data, it is the design, the behaviour, the organisation, the people understanding it. All of this becomes very alien to us when we go this route.
Humanising code is key to developing the kind of applications this company has now touted.
What is looselycoupled? Anyone read it regularly? is it a valid news source? Is this some free advertising for a fad?
I am almost tempted to read more about the LAMP, but I just have a knowing feeling it will be another 'cure all' product.
I didn't even know there was a PHP and Java flamewar going on! Where do I enlist?
No seriously, it is like comparing apples and oranges. PHP and the wonderous LAMP stack (I have just heard about it, so that is the first stumbling block for its adoption! many companies like to be fast followers) might be able to do what Java does if you look at output, it might even be quick, but that has nothing to do with the costs and development and staffing that real people with real money care about.
Java has a huge demand in industry that is being met with huge interest in terms of capable candidates which is proven by the number of successful and *bearing in mind this isn't a flamewar!* well written open source project out there.
The level of Java competency in the industry is growing enormously as a result, which is a good thing. PHP is also good, and I like PHP, lets not get things mixed up here.
[snip = list of reasons why people choose java, which was boring even me]
Also J2EE is *the* platform for applications running for thousands of users, on machines with 90+ GB of ram, and 24 processors just to handle the data requirements.
Oracle love J2EE. Oracle is a fairly decent enterprise (not just performance, but support and board level confidence) db to say the least.
Now, LAMP might be lovely, but why even pitch it against anything, dear LAMP community, just be, don't try and compare it against anything.
FUD et al.
PS: erm, nerr nerr? u sux0r? pwned? I am loosing my touch at this internet name calling gaff, time to retire.
Yeah, I see your point, and 100,000 people sign up for half-life 2, and valv quickly buy the src for commander keen, and change the title screen then piss thier pants laughing as 100,000 CC get charged and people start the 43kb download over bit-steam (steam2 - using bit torrent!)
Hahahah, you would want pledges, but dont worry about legal binding, unless they cannot cut corners... assuming they wouldnt fsck us off, then it is a great idea.
Our motto would be:
"Support linux, I finally got my video driver working!"
> I'm willing to donate literally tens of dollars to such a cause.
Heck, make it pay-per-view and have ballmer do his sweaty monkey under oath.
Then Bill gates sqeaks out something, and Linus takes the stand and girls in the jury faint, and then storm troppers burst down the doors, and Linus is suddenly at the helm of the enterprise spooning with 7of9 and...
shit... I did it again... FOCUS damnit... just be geek at one with at a time...
Yes true, I agree, and to all the posts (which I think might be realted to the sentient rock-sucking tentaclies mentioned below! - obtuse? your reply was, I couldnt make head nor tail of it! volve it somewhat, until it can hold a knife and fork, and then maybe I will read it!) below, I say - forget something as blunt as chemistry or genetics, go lower, think about the colour green, and then decide about intelligent design.
people who talk about random chance do so [on topic as well] on thin ice, lies upon half truths upon maybes upon theories of what might have been. Many are wrong, but even truth wouldn't sway you.
They say the truth is the hardest thing to accept.
I agree with RtCW and Doom3 (sorry Johnnie) and Quake 3 is very typical, ok for a laugh, UT rocks though, UT2003 is ok, a bit like Q2 and Q3, Q2 rockd, Q3 was ok...
not played UT2k4.
I just realised - games *are* the killer app for linux.
They would bring down the price of a gaming machine by the price of an OS, and you could say look at all the educational things you get with it, like, erm, pr0n^H^H^H^Hapt-get and stuff...
By analysing the information gained from the release of the game, we now believe that:
"The killer grenade jumped the parade, and bunny hopped across to a grassy knoll where it spray pained a clan logo before shouting 'j1h4d l0l rotflmao gg' and then using an aimbot to assassinate JFK.... the final words of the killer before police emptied the munitions budget of a small state into him was: k1ll4h dropped - connection reset by peer"
The stare my girlfriend gave me when I realise I didn't take my shoes off and almost stepped on the new rugs actually caused apartments 3 floors up to have burst pipes.
Slashdot Mirror
Now I am not exactly a pro-M$ person, but to call them hacks, that is a bit harsh no?? :-) Wow, check out the cover of Head First Servlets & JSP
:-)
Hot chick alert!
Man I could pool her connections, service her ports... *public thinking alert* shit I did it again *cough* nice lass.
After being over-exposed to OOP (clunky, temptation to make everything an object, multiple inheritence obscuring what the code is supposed to do), people are trying to find a balance between when OOP should and shouldn't be used.
Java has no multiple inheritance.
Everything except for for primitives are Objects, and unless you writ your own VM you have to make everything objects... Oh I see, you cannot grasp good design in OO? I suggest you get good at design, then your worries will fade.
A lot of people reading Slashdot are in the web industry, which is primarily text processing (though we can think up fancy names such as data mining, content management systems, etc).Don't think you've discovered anything no-one else has, the chances are they've all tried these "powerful programming tools" and discarded them as unproductive for them.
The web industry has nothing to do with text processing. If you are talking about something to do with 'streaming text content over http' then that hardly comprises the industry of web development.
Web development spans many niches, from web design to web engineering.
The whole point is, the string programming methods of web development that plagued us in ASP and to some degree in vanilla jsp, are gone, if you have been in web development for at least 5/6 years you will remember the very bad old days.
I personally don't want to go back to PERL/CGI (works for amazon though!) programming, but newer systems such as banking are complex enough that this 'text processing' isn't an issue, and we also have removed 'text processing' with elegant new systems such as Java Server Faces. Even struts and a tomcat instance will get you far.
Data Mining: data processing using sophisticated data search capabilities and statistical algorithms to discover patterns and correlations in large preexisting databases; a way to discover new meaning in data [thanks dictionary.com]
Content management, well, since I am more than a little knowledgable on what CMsystems are [1 thesis and 1 cms], or, what they are not, I can say they are not to do with web development.
Some CMS are developed with web interfaces, yes.
The following kills me, it really does:
[me-grandparent]The program isn't the code, it isn't the data, it is the design, the behaviour, the organisation, the people understanding it. All of this becomes very alien to us when we go this route.[/me]
Complete BS. You do a func spec then a tech spec. After this the implementation is down to the project manager and the developer. With the right specs the system will behave identically, no matter what language it is written in. Whether C, Java, C#, Lisp or Whitespace. The main difference is in the time-to-market and the maintenance costs (usually inversely proportional to each other).
I see the game, you take what I say, call it bullshit, then say it again will more words, as if written for an idiot. Well done, you win!
In my experience Java takes a long time to develop, but when done you can just throw more and more hardware at it. LAMP is an order of magnitude quicker to develop but when hitting hardware limitations you need more lateral thinking to overcome these.
I think you got them crossed. LAMP is based on scalable [grid] hardware, and Java is based on scalable development, not the way you just said.
Java allows you to translate development in very quick time. Of course, for specific functions there are frameworks to model you application around, that make complex applications easier to develop over and over again.
LAMP is based on PHP, hands up who wrote two PHP driven websites, admittedly without using templating *hand shoots up* right, so I am not a PHP expert, if you can discount 18 months experience, but I am a Java expert, not necessarily a development expert, I know enough to know I can go further!
[unless you c
Linux wouldn't exist as it does today.
:-) :-) I forgive them!)
/. has had concerns raised.
Is this the first time Linus has used his 'fame' like this?
I say great work for all three of them, I have used all thier products numerously, and together, they should win awards (although the combined 'banging head against wall' linux, mysql and php have given me in the past
Patents are patently a bad idea, they illegitimise our very thoughts. I am all for protecting and incubating progress for small companies, but patents have only done the following:
Small company gets rediculous patent, Kodak buys them, and forces a settlement for publicity.
The european constitution should write that software is free from patents. Patents are supposed to bring about change, yet we see it stiffling progress at every turn!
I myself worry about patents in my own programs, and ask
OK I'll shut up.
If you need to spend millions to develop a product which to your customer does little more than the "cheap" product
:-) Who knows! :-)
Sorry I meant proprietary solutions for large organisations.
I think the level of software commodotisation will mean that a generic griddable-hybernate data CRUD solution with pluggable 'logic' blocks might become the status quo in the future, hang on, wasn't that the jist of J2EE?
True, it is hard to see valve screwing its halflife license, it has little else going for it...
At the end of the day, we run linux, we have to bend over backwards to make it happen.
J2EE and hardware costs about 1% of the TOC of an application. The cost are the rooms of people administrating, developing and testing the apps, and the phone book full of contractors pulled in to help out.
I can imagine a LAMP contractor would be in short supply, yet an Oracle DBA, Java guru, J2EE guy would be already emplyed in your department happily running along listening to his free ipod or something new-geeky.
Welcome to the real world. Something costing 0 doesn't costs much less than comething costing 50k in development terms.
Commodity OS's on the desktop that people use outlook on however, can be replaced with nice linux boxes and thunderbird for no real cost overheads - because your guys should be up on all that anyway.
So OS in its place. Development of enterprise critical applications in thier.
I am sorry, as much of an OS touter, I say J2EE on solaris is the current app, now, they muddied the water with this grid nonesense, I will have to see... but for now it is a weak towing of the line.
Mod up parent +5 Sane
Java and Eclipse for application development under Mac. Even Java3D and many other lovely libraries, plus the L&F is full Mac, and check out Suns guide to macifying a java app.
What, you wanted a drum roll?
And has a few trollish statements against Democrates. It is fine to defend your stance as a Bush voter, it is your right, but please, listen to the following:
Those who voted Bush gave thier first and only affirmative acceptance and vote of persnal merit to the actions undertaken in Iraq. Prior to this no American had given a personal vote of acceptance to the actions undertaken, if you voted Bush, then you approve of Fallujah, of the troops for oil programs, and the rest.
You voted into power the wealthiest cabinet in the history of all nations. Thier personal assets are shocking.
That is all, sorry, please mod OT, or even insightful for this thread! and don't feed the trolls.
What? Who cares about anything in your last paragraph? Java is Java if it was first, second, third or last.
:-)
Hasn't done one original thing? Well, a cross platform skinnable lightweight UI package that sits on top of a JIT bytecode compiler, that gives you binary compatibility between MFC, GTK, qt and other libraries.... that is pretty cool.
Alsom the JCP is pretty revolutionary in software development, and a very good start for originality.
Linux community never really adopted Java, it is a shame, it isn't a system programming language in terms of writing OS's (although there is an OS, blah blah) it is an application language.
Java needs more open source approval, there are awesome java based applications on freshmeat, and more added all the time.
Java is an excellent application development platform. If it is not for you then say so and move on!
Your statement: Java is great... I guess, personally I think it's the worst thing to happen to systems programming since C++ makes me discredit most of what you say, sorry.
Have fun in C++ land though! I envy you!! NO I DO!! *stiffles painful laugh and then remembers C++ days and goes into shock*
Of that pony-tailed oik Schwartz.
He is such a jack-off it makes me think that he is an industry sleeper - someone sent to destroy all credibility of Sun.
M$ has thier own monkey boy, a semi-self-styled nut who says anything he wants, and M$ quizzically apologises for him, and does that half eye roll, well he is nuttier than squirrel shit look and hopefully get away with it.
What the fuck are they trying to prove, Linux is an OS, Java is a devleopment platform, what is the point all this rhetorical FUD? Does it make sense man?
I think not. Now to compound matters the sub blurb on this book is:
Musings of open source blah blah by an accidental revolutionary.
WTF? WHO-TF more like... Also, he is a gun nut. Just what we need. ITS GNU NOT GUN you nozz.
http://www.catb.org/~esr/guns/.
Did this make sense to anybody else? Is this Sun's take of M$ OS costs more? Is it just my sugar deprived brain thinking this is all too wierd?
and the wireless is neat
If there was an open SDK for developing apps for it, people could come up with some pretty neat stuff to run on this
a wifi beowulf cluster of linux handhelds! ph33r the p3nguin...
So let's look at the requirements for today's corporate applications ... Given these requirements, Java does not fare very well. Apparently what is needed is a language/environment that is loosely typed in order to encapsulate XML well and that can efficiently process text. It should be very well suited for specifying control flow. And it should be a thin veneer over the operating system.
So we came from string programming roots, we developed OOP and AOP, and now... now we go back to string programming because of xml parsing?
I find this a worrying trend, you have to understand, an application is state, and behaviour.
This is trying to tie an application into a 'thin veneer' over an operating system, which seems a bit worrying for an app that will cost a few million to develop in the right circles.
Be reducing all the benefits of OOP (huge and varied, numerous and wonderful) we seek to define our crowining enterprise applications with an approach from the 70's that would pioneer the use of string processing programming constructs over highly developed and structured powerful programming tools.
The program isn't the code, it isn't the data, it is the design, the behaviour, the organisation, the people understanding it. All of this becomes very alien to us when we go this route.
Humanising code is key to developing the kind of applications this company has now touted.
What is looselycoupled? Anyone read it regularly? is it a valid news source? Is this some free advertising for a fad?
I am almost tempted to read more about the LAMP, but I just have a knowing feeling it will be another 'cure all' product.
Yep, tick tick, oops, missed one, back to step 1.
I didn't even know there was a PHP and Java flamewar going on! Where do I enlist?
No seriously, it is like comparing apples and oranges. PHP and the wonderous LAMP stack (I have just heard about it, so that is the first stumbling block for its adoption! many companies like to be fast followers) might be able to do what Java does if you look at output, it might even be quick, but that has nothing to do with the costs and development and staffing that real people with real money care about.
Java has a huge demand in industry that is being met with huge interest in terms of capable candidates which is proven by the number of successful and *bearing in mind this isn't a flamewar!* well written open source project out there.
The level of Java competency in the industry is growing enormously as a result, which is a good thing. PHP is also good, and I like PHP, lets not get things mixed up here.
[snip = list of reasons why people choose java, which was boring even me]
Also J2EE is *the* platform for applications running for thousands of users, on machines with 90+ GB of ram, and 24 processors just to handle the data requirements.
Oracle love J2EE. Oracle is a fairly decent enterprise (not just performance, but support and board level confidence) db to say the least.
Now, LAMP might be lovely, but why even pitch it against anything, dear LAMP community, just be, don't try and compare it against anything.
FUD et al.
PS: erm, nerr nerr? u sux0r? pwned? I am loosing my touch at this internet name calling gaff, time to retire.
Wouldn't it be great to burn off all those alpine be-stickered cars at traffic lights and be socially conscious?
When can I order one. Internet hype at its best, the segway had a huge impact, this slides by.
This seems to be the best buy, I want one, heck, two, with corn-based body work coated with that new anti-scratch/mark polymer.
Please. Oh, and 802.11g and IrDA ports, a SD slot and *must resist gadget urge*...
Yeah, I see your point, and 100,000 people sign up for half-life 2, and valv quickly buy the src for commander keen, and change the title screen then piss thier pants laughing as 100,000 CC get charged and people start the 43kb download over bit-steam (steam2 - using bit torrent!)
Hahahah, you would want pledges, but dont worry about legal binding, unless they cannot cut corners... assuming they wouldnt fsck us off, then it is a great idea.
Our motto would be:
"Support linux, I finally got my video driver working!"
haha just joking!
> I'm willing to donate literally tens of dollars to such a cause.
Heck, make it pay-per-view and have ballmer do his sweaty monkey under oath.
Then Bill gates sqeaks out something, and Linus takes the stand and girls in the jury faint, and then storm troppers burst down the doors, and Linus is suddenly at the helm of the enterprise spooning with 7of9 and...
shit... I did it again... FOCUS damnit... just be geek at one with at a time...
That is why melting points are given at sea level pressure right? They change as pressure drops - does it boil into a gas? explode? shrink down?
interesting to know, I think space stations expose waste to the vacuum which 'dries' it before it is expelled (or retained, keep space tidy!)
Yes true, I agree, and to all the posts (which I think might be realted to the sentient rock-sucking tentaclies mentioned below! - obtuse? your reply was, I couldnt make head nor tail of it! volve it somewhat, until it can hold a knife and fork, and then maybe I will read it!) below, I say - forget something as blunt as chemistry or genetics, go lower, think about the colour green, and then decide about intelligent design.
people who talk about random chance do so [on topic as well] on thin ice, lies upon half truths upon maybes upon theories of what might have been. Many are wrong, but even truth wouldn't sway you.
They say the truth is the hardest thing to accept.
I agree with RtCW and Doom3 (sorry Johnnie) and Quake 3 is very typical, ok for a laugh, UT rocks though, UT2003 is ok, a bit like Q2 and Q3, Q2 rockd, Q3 was ok...
not played UT2k4.
I just realised - games *are* the killer app for linux.
They would bring down the price of a gaming machine by the price of an OS, and you could say look at all the educational things you get with it, like, erm, pr0n^H^H^H^Hapt-get and stuff...
By analysing the information gained from the release of the game, we now believe that:
"The killer grenade jumped the parade, and bunny hopped across to a grassy knoll where it spray pained a clan logo before shouting 'j1h4d l0l rotflmao gg' and then using an aimbot to assassinate JFK.... the final words of the killer before police emptied the munitions budget of a small state into him was: k1ll4h dropped - connection reset by peer"
Games.
I take a 10 minute break every 1 hour, but I spend it on /. :-( /. - bad for your health :-(
It was set inside 'Black Mesa' a research institute, that no doubt had all sorts of radioactive nastiness being carried around by cool looking robots.
,\
Plus the developers thought, wow, sounds like a cool name for a game.
Throw a symbol of the 11th letter of the Greek alphabet around and you have a top notch game.
Unreal Tournament 2003 ...
Unreal Tournament 2004
Quake 3
Doom 3
Postal 2
Return to Castle Wolfenstein
Medal of Honor: Allied Assault
more here...
Half Life 2?
Go on Valve!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'd buy it!
I think this is the most bizzarre of all!
h2o also contracts when heated above its melting point.
Is this solely due to air and crystalisation upon freezing or does put h2o do this in a vacuum?
Who knows! not me! I never lost control...
The stare my girlfriend gave me when I realise I didn't take my shoes off and almost stepped on the new rugs actually caused apartments 3 floors up to have burst pipes.
Now that is cold.