GRUB does not load/touch/know about the Windows kernel, so this is certainly not the reason. GRUB just executes the boot code (ntldr.exe) on your windows drive, which in turn loads the windows kernel.
I don't think Debian is LSB-certified. Also, location of configartion files has absolutely nothing to do with the standardization of the platform's ABI, what (as you mention) the LSB is all about. So LSB is not out to solve the aforementioned problem, AFAIK.
Package: lsb Priority: extra
The intent of this package is to provide a best current practice way of installing and running LSB packages on Debian GNU/Linux. Its presence does not imply that we believe that Debian fully complies with the Linux Standard Base, and should not be construed as a statement that Debian is LSB-compliant.
Firefox seems more idiosyncratic if you are used to IE's idiocies. Seriously--most knowledgeable people agree that Firefox is more 'correct' than IE. So if IE seems more correct, doesn't that make your way of thinking incorrect? I suppose the issues with CSS and HTML in general may be irrelevant to your problem domain. Could you provide some examples of how IE's XSLT processor works better than Firefox's? I am always curious about real-world experience relevant the IE v. Firefox war.
As the copyright office, they wouldn't want to be accused of infringment now would they. Because without an explicit note saying so, they are not allowed to copy your copyrighted note!!
Python is more purely OO then Java. Everything is an object; there are no primitive types. Java has primitives like int, float, char, etc which are not objects. Python doesn't. Just because you can program in a non-OO style doesn't mean you're still not dealing with objects.
The key here is readability.. GOTOs are impossible to read because the code jumps all over the place, while loops have well-defined and understood semantics. That a loop will become jump instructions in the compiled code is irrelevant, because thats not the code you need to read or understand. The damage BASIC causes here is that they think problems should be solved with unstructured GOTOs when really they shouldn't be. All problems can be solved without any explicit jumping. Languages (other than assembly) which dont have looping and function call constructs are toy languages which shouldn't be used for any serious programming. I suppose if you use the IF, the LABEL, and the GOTO in a structured way, code in these languages can end up understandable, but realistically the compiler should be doing the work of translating 'repeat 'PRINT "HI" 3 times' into the IF, the LABEL, and the GOTO.
'public' from a software engineering perspective means that it designed to be used by client code and that it (hopefully) has a stable client interface, not that people know its semantics.
To integrate you into slashdot we will:
* numb your mind with repeated jokes such as the classic "In Soviet Russia.."
* verbally attack your opinions until your sanity breaks
* mod down your posts so that nobody else can see them and you no longer see the point in posting
* accuse you of being a zealot and proceed to ignore your opinions
If you want to fit it, then think less! And make more jokes.. especially the really redundant ones.
Users who are neither funny nor narrow-minded or idiotic are misfits here; This is slashdot!!
Since you still are not broken in:
In Soviet Russia, code licenses YOU!
Eh? Ever read anything he (Stallman) has ever written? Teh freedom he's talking about it not just that of the _user_ but also of the _author(s)_. So basically it gives the author the same rights it gives you: you get to use the author's code and the author gets to use yours. This reciprocity is touted as more free than just *freedom means I can do anything I darn well please* (the "It's a free country" idgits also have this narrow view of freedom).
nano (the free clone of non-free pico) is much more straightforward than vi. So it moves it down on the 1337 scale and up on the is-this-even-plausible-for-a-newbie scale.
No, you learn lots about following instructions that way.
Disagree.
Yes, you are following instructions, but the point is you are actually doing it and will NOT (well, hopefully) need those instructions in the future. Unless you are the inventor, your knowledge about any technology is derived from (surprise!) other people telling you about it, whether it be explicity through instructions for a certain task, general usage information in manpages, or hints about where you've screwed up in error messages (the list goes on). Manpages may be more 'hardcore' than instructions, and error messages may be more 1337 than manpages, but you learn about the subject through the experience nonetheless.
eh? I can't tell if you are trying to make a point or are completely sarcastic.
If you are serious, then I bet you can't come up with a single useful piece of software which doesn't copy something from another. The best software just copies as much good stuff as possible and integrates it together. New ideas are (suprise!) rare; most coding done is just reimplementation of old ideas (hopefully faster/sexier/cleaner however).
Well, isn't the SSID "linksys" or some such half the time? There are probably >2 who read them but they think you are experimenting with novel and obscure ways to market Linksys products.
People may never be told that the network is insecure or that anyone driving by can connect. When someone buys is told about it and buys the needed equipment, the vendor will often set their network up. The customer is then left knowing that his/her AP and wireless adaptor can communicate, but not necessarily that someone outside of their residence can too. I mean, do you expect people buying a coordless phone to consider if someone around will be able to sit outside their house and make calls on it? It is the fault of vendors, who leave things insecure because then it Just Works (tm) saving them cash that would be spent on customer support. If Joe Sixpack bought another laptop and used his wireless card, it will only work on an insecure network because only in that case will it not need any extra configuration. IMO ignorance is an excuse in such cases, and in order for the problem to be solved in the long run, vendors need to install secured networks and keep customers aware of these issues.
Other distros are not necessarily toys for kids, if you had read my post you would have seen I find Ubuntu a very amiable distribution. Not just for kids, but for anyone who enjoys using it. I don't like the "There is only Debian" or "Real Men use Debian" mentalities either. My opinion is that if you are an ordinary computer user and also the maintainer of your computer (you know how many problems this causes in the Windows camp), then you have needs which Debian does not serve and Ubuntu would be a much better choice. As for the dependency issue with gnome-desktop-environment, this is generally a non-issue: it is just a slight quirk which happens every now-and-then because of the fine granularity of packages being released into the archive. Yes, it could be avoided by reworking the scripts which release the packages into the archive, but as I said it is a non-issue because those who use unstable are supposed to be developers who know what that means and that it will be resolved when all dependencies are released into the archive. It even explains it to you:
"Some packages could not be installed. This may mean that you have requested an impossible situation or if you are using the unstable distribution that some required packages have not yet been created or been moved out of Incoming."
Again, this is just how it works since packages are released little-by-little into unstable. But somehow I suspect you already knew this..
Also, the only reason I chose to use the world 'kiddies' in my post was to characterize the whining which often happens about Debian due to the age of its stable packages. Besides, why would "ordinary computer users" feel the need to upgrade anyway? Why would they even consider using unstable, Debian's development system? Some such users in the windows camp are still using 7-yr old Windows 98. The only updates they really need are the "Priority: high" ones to software with potential security vulnerabilities, they hardly need to update all of GNOME.
It is intriguing and irritating how many people there are who dont use Debian but complain about it. gnome-about for me reveals version 2.10.2, and things have been running smoothly for me. It may not be "all there" but its certainly not "borked."
If you watch the videos you'll see a nice anecodote about how one of the devs was complaining long ago before he was a DD, yet after it was suggested that he fix what he didn't like, he actually DID. Before you go about calling something a "joke," get your facts straight. unstable is development code and is not targetted at users (not that the adventurous can't, however, use it; I have in fact had few problems). It is not a "joke" because it serves its purpose perfectly: acting as a sort of 'entry point' for new packages and upgrades of old ones.
Last I checked, GNOME 2.8 (from Sarge) is not from the '70s. Getting the latest and greatest software released has never, ever, been a priority in Debian. Building the best possible OS is, and this means letting things stabilize in unstable and testing before being released. Debian as an organization will not, as a rule, risk a release of new and unproven code to its stable OS. So before you go ranting about how your distro r0x and such, you could do yourself a favor and try to understand the distro you love bashing. To further refute your comment:
mike@Tyr:~$ apt-cache show xserver-xorg | grep Version:
Version: 6.8.2.dfsg.1-4
Yes, this is a recent development, but it still shows a total lack of factual backing on your part. ( You don't have to run Debian to find these things out, there is packages.debian.org )
I have no idea what about Debian could make a fellow Linux-user say such things such as that the information provide about the conference are "gay write-ups" to "conceal the feeling that the Debian folks still haven't noticed that the world's moved on a bit since the 1970s." Such hostility is utterly unfounded.
And before the Ubuntu fans enter combat with their notions that Ubuntu has "replaced" Debian, let me say that you betray the beliefs of your own group of developers by saying that. I do not believe that any Ubuntu dev beliefs that Ubuntu has replaced Debian. Ubuntu had been a good citizen in the community and has contributed much back to its base distro. There is a generally good relationship between the two. The idea that Ubuntu makes Debian obsolete is created by misguided Ubuntu fans and contrasts with the ideas of those in charge of Ubuntu. Ubuntu is a great OS, it has benefitted immesurably from the countless hours of work put into Debian, and I believe it will continue to benefit from that work. It is not, at least not yet, completely independent from its base. Ubuntu has put tons of work into making an easy-to-use Debian with a pretty face, and to provide the world's kiddies with the latest and greatest software. Only a select group of Ubuntu fans have declared independence from Debian. I dare say that Ubuntu and Debian are not all that different; what the users see (and complain about) has changed since the people who created Ubuntu care about addressing problems which Debian devs don't see as problems worth addressing, or that they believe need to be addressed by individuals according to their needs and not be predetermined by the distro.
This is a bit overboard in the rant department to me, but i feel it was worth it. I will come to the defense of Debian as long as I continue to see it as the best distro for me, and that may mean thourougly addressing the misguided accusations of others. Let the inevitable flameware begin (for the Xth time, where X is immesurably large).
Those L33T H4X0RS are using YOUR pipe to download PORN! They are also using bittorrent to download the latest and greatest MOVIES! Bet that got the MPAA's attention! I hope you have file & printer sharing disabled!
Sure, openness is great, but is running an open proxy for anyone in the vacinity of your residence really worth it? I mean, do you let random people come into your house and make telephone calls?
Slashdot Mirror
GRUB does not load/touch/know about the Windows kernel, so this is certainly not the reason. GRUB just executes the boot code (ntldr.exe) on your windows drive, which in turn loads the windows kernel.
That's interesting, GRUB loads glacially on my 933 (but not on my 2Ghz), I would have thought tiny LILO wouldn't have any speed problems.
Exactly. They are popular because they have excellent services, not because of FUD or questionable business practices.
I mean, I use G-mail because it rocks the competition's socks off, not because I have to or because its the only free webmail service available.
Yes, this API is called POP3. Excepts its a protocol and not an API.
I don't think Debian is LSB-certified. Also, location of configartion files has absolutely nothing to do with the standardization of the platform's ABI, what (as you mention) the LSB is all about. So LSB is not out to solve the aforementioned problem, AFAIK.
Package: lsb
Priority: extra
The intent of this package is to provide a best current practice way of installing and running LSB packages on Debian GNU/Linux. Its presence does not imply that we believe that Debian fully complies with the Linux Standard Base, and should not be construed as a statement that Debian is LSB-compliant.
Firefox seems more idiosyncratic if you are used to IE's idiocies. Seriously--most knowledgeable people agree that Firefox is more 'correct' than IE. So if IE seems more correct, doesn't that make your way of thinking incorrect? I suppose the issues with CSS and HTML in general may be irrelevant to your problem domain. Could you provide some examples of how IE's XSLT processor works better than Firefox's? I am always curious about real-world experience relevant the IE v. Firefox war.
As the copyright office, they wouldn't want to be accused of infringment now would they. Because without an explicit note saying so, they are not allowed to copy your copyrighted note!!
Python is more purely OO then Java. Everything is an object; there are no primitive types. Java has primitives like int, float, char, etc which are not objects. Python doesn't. Just because you can program in a non-OO style doesn't mean you're still not dealing with objects.
The key here is readability.. GOTOs are impossible to read because the code jumps all over the place, while loops have well-defined and understood semantics. That a loop will become jump instructions in the compiled code is irrelevant, because thats not the code you need to read or understand. The damage BASIC causes here is that they think problems should be solved with unstructured GOTOs when really they shouldn't be. All problems can be solved without any explicit jumping. Languages (other than assembly) which dont have looping and function call constructs are toy languages which shouldn't be used for any serious programming. I suppose if you use the IF, the LABEL, and the GOTO in a structured way, code in these languages can end up understandable, but realistically the compiler should be doing the work of translating 'repeat 'PRINT "HI" 3 times' into the IF, the LABEL, and the GOTO.
where do you get these great quotes?
non-programmer?
'public' from a software engineering perspective means that it designed to be used by client code and that it (hopefully) has a stable client interface, not that people know its semantics.
It seems you have not been initiated.
To integrate you into slashdot we will:
* numb your mind with repeated jokes such as the classic "In Soviet Russia.."
* verbally attack your opinions until your sanity breaks
* mod down your posts so that nobody else can see them and you no longer see the point in posting
* accuse you of being a zealot and proceed to ignore your opinions
If you want to fit it, then think less! And make more jokes.. especially the really redundant ones. Users who are neither funny nor narrow-minded or idiotic are misfits here; This is slashdot!!
Since you still are not broken in:
In Soviet Russia, code licenses YOU!
Eh? Ever read anything he (Stallman) has ever written? Teh freedom he's talking about it not just that of the _user_ but also of the _author(s)_. So basically it gives the author the same rights it gives you: you get to use the author's code and the author gets to use yours. This reciprocity is touted as more free than just *freedom means I can do anything I darn well please* (the "It's a free country" idgits also have this narrow view of freedom).
I believe you mean -Os. -O9 would just be an uber vesion of -O3 which optimizes for speed, making it faster but larger (more calories).
nano (the free clone of non-free pico) is much more straightforward than vi. So it moves it down on the 1337 scale and up on the is-this-even-plausible-for-a-newbie scale.
No, you learn lots about following instructions that way.
Disagree.
Yes, you are following instructions, but the point is you are actually doing it and will NOT (well, hopefully) need those instructions in the future. Unless you are the inventor, your knowledge about any technology is derived from (surprise!) other people telling you about it, whether it be explicity through instructions for a certain task, general usage information in manpages, or hints about where you've screwed up in error messages (the list goes on). Manpages may be more 'hardcore' than instructions, and error messages may be more 1337 than manpages, but you learn about the subject through the experience nonetheless.
You hand built it by sticking a cd in your drive?
Please..
LFS is much closer to 'hand assembled' but even then you are told precisely what to do and dont really need to think.
eh? I can't tell if you are trying to make a point or are completely sarcastic.
If you are serious, then I bet you can't come up with a single useful piece of software which doesn't copy something from another. The best software just copies as much good stuff as possible and integrates it together. New ideas are (suprise!) rare; most coding done is just reimplementation of old ideas (hopefully faster/sexier/cleaner however).
Well, isn't the SSID "linksys" or some such half the time? There are probably >2 who read them but they think you are experimenting with novel and obscure ways to market Linksys products.
People may never be told that the network is insecure or that anyone driving by can connect. When someone buys is told about it and buys the needed equipment, the vendor will often set their network up. The customer is then left knowing that his/her AP and wireless adaptor can communicate, but not necessarily that someone outside of their residence can too. I mean, do you expect people buying a coordless phone to consider if someone around will be able to sit outside their house and make calls on it? It is the fault of vendors, who leave things insecure because then it Just Works (tm) saving them cash that would be spent on customer support. If Joe Sixpack bought another laptop and used his wireless card, it will only work on an insecure network because only in that case will it not need any extra configuration. IMO ignorance is an excuse in such cases, and in order for the problem to be solved in the long run, vendors need to install secured networks and keep customers aware of these issues.
Other distros are not necessarily toys for kids, if you had read my post you would have seen I find Ubuntu a very amiable distribution. Not just for kids, but for anyone who enjoys using it. I don't like the "There is only Debian" or "Real Men use Debian" mentalities either. My opinion is that if you are an ordinary computer user and also the maintainer of your computer (you know how many problems this causes in the Windows camp), then you have needs which Debian does not serve and Ubuntu would be a much better choice. As for the dependency issue with gnome-desktop-environment, this is generally a non-issue: it is just a slight quirk which happens every now-and-then because of the fine granularity of packages being released into the archive. Yes, it could be avoided by reworking the scripts which release the packages into the archive, but as I said it is a non-issue because those who use unstable are supposed to be developers who know what that means and that it will be resolved when all dependencies are released into the archive. It even explains it to you:
"Some packages could not be installed. This may mean that you have requested an impossible situation or if you are using the unstable distribution that some required packages have not yet been created or been moved out of Incoming."
Again, this is just how it works since packages are released little-by-little into unstable. But somehow I suspect you already knew this..
Also, the only reason I chose to use the world 'kiddies' in my post was to characterize the whining which often happens about Debian due to the age of its stable packages. Besides, why would "ordinary computer users" feel the need to upgrade anyway? Why would they even consider using unstable, Debian's development system? Some such users in the windows camp are still using 7-yr old Windows 98. The only updates they really need are the "Priority: high" ones to software with potential security vulnerabilities, they hardly need to update all of GNOME.
Of course this can work if you have adequate precautions, and it seems you have.
Good luck to you then!
It is intriguing and irritating how many people there are who dont use Debian but complain about it. gnome-about for me reveals version 2.10.2, and things have been running smoothly for me. It may not be "all there" but its certainly not "borked."
If you watch the videos you'll see a nice anecodote about how one of the devs was complaining long ago before he was a DD, yet after it was suggested that he fix what he didn't like, he actually DID. Before you go about calling something a "joke," get your facts straight. unstable is development code and is not targetted at users (not that the adventurous can't, however, use it; I have in fact had few problems). It is not a "joke" because it serves its purpose perfectly: acting as a sort of 'entry point' for new packages and upgrades of old ones.
Last I checked, GNOME 2.8 (from Sarge) is not from the '70s. Getting the latest and greatest software released has never, ever, been a priority in Debian. Building the best possible OS is, and this means letting things stabilize in unstable and testing before being released. Debian as an organization will not, as a rule, risk a release of new and unproven code to its stable OS. So before you go ranting about how your distro r0x and such, you could do yourself a favor and try to understand the distro you love bashing. To further refute your comment:
mike@Tyr:~$ apt-cache show xserver-xorg | grep Version:
Version: 6.8.2.dfsg.1-4
Yes, this is a recent development, but it still shows a total lack of factual backing on your part. ( You don't have to run Debian to find these things out, there is packages.debian.org )
I have no idea what about Debian could make a fellow Linux-user say such things such as that the information provide about the conference are "gay write-ups" to "conceal the feeling that the Debian folks still haven't noticed that the world's moved on a bit since the 1970s." Such hostility is utterly unfounded.
And before the Ubuntu fans enter combat with their notions that Ubuntu has "replaced" Debian, let me say that you betray the beliefs of your own group of developers by saying that. I do not believe that any Ubuntu dev beliefs that Ubuntu has replaced Debian. Ubuntu had been a good citizen in the community and has contributed much back to its base distro. There is a generally good relationship between the two. The idea that Ubuntu makes Debian obsolete is created by misguided Ubuntu fans and contrasts with the ideas of those in charge of Ubuntu. Ubuntu is a great OS, it has benefitted immesurably from the countless hours of work put into Debian, and I believe it will continue to benefit from that work. It is not, at least not yet, completely independent from its base. Ubuntu has put tons of work into making an easy-to-use Debian with a pretty face, and to provide the world's kiddies with the latest and greatest software. Only a select group of Ubuntu fans have declared independence from Debian. I dare say that Ubuntu and Debian are not all that different; what the users see (and complain about) has changed since the people who created Ubuntu care about addressing problems which Debian devs don't see as problems worth addressing, or that they believe need to be addressed by individuals according to their needs and not be predetermined by the distro.
This is a bit overboard in the rant department to me, but i feel it was worth it. I will come to the defense of Debian as long as I continue to see it as the best distro for me, and that may mean thourougly addressing the misguided accusations of others. Let the inevitable flameware begin (for the Xth time, where X is immesurably large).
LOL...
Those L33T H4X0RS are using YOUR pipe to download PORN! They are also using bittorrent to download the latest and greatest MOVIES! Bet that got the MPAA's attention! I hope you have file & printer sharing disabled!
Sure, openness is great, but is running an open proxy for anyone in the vacinity of your residence really worth it? I mean, do you let random people come into your house and make telephone calls?
I was under the impression that software liability was nonexistant. If not what's with all those disclaimers?