The PS2 has 2 chips which make up the EE, open one up and take a look. This would incorporate both into a single unit plus the I/O chip (which is the PS1 single-chip-solution) onto the same die, most likely. So 3 chips to 1.
Elsewhere on the site is the PCB and schematics for the Jaguar, so just need to convert the netlist files to verilog, send them to Toshiba for fabricating, find a board maker to put it all together, a box-maker to make a pretty covering for it all, and you're all set.
I forgot to reply to the two folk that asked about the Atari chips source files, so here is the link: http://www.geocities.com/glenn_b18/jaguar/n etlist. htm It's in a custom HDL that can decode to Verilog simply. All you need to create your own Jaguar Tom and Jerry chips.
This is a logical evolution to the PS2 chip design. Those 3 chips were so integrated in function, placing them into a single unit was a logical step. It would allow for a move to $200 and eventually $100 price tags for the PS2. Likely the incentive to move design is due to Sony having recouped their investment on the 3-chip solution. Otherwise, this move would not make sence. Plus this would allow for the PS3, in 2008, to have PS2 (and PSOne) compatability.
already exists. In 1999, Hasbro, fresh from it's purchase of the Atari trademarks and intellectual property, opened up the Atari Jaguar from all patents, copyrights, and similar materials.
Yes folks, a totally public domain game console.
You can even get the code to produce your own custom chips from the Jaguar, called Tom and Jerry.
But, what's the point? Open source does not make it excellent source. PS2 having Linux does not make it a monster. It's just another feature for the PS2 to exploit.
The AmigaONE I've been familiar with for months now as a completely *BAD* implimentation of a PowerPC ATX board. It is using the MAI northbridge, one of the slowest, least comprehensive northbridges made. In short, this system would make even a Cyrix 5x86 look like a speed demon by comparison, irregardless of CPU it has.
Check out the docs. Lack any kind of I/O handling, using the CPU for every last function. End result, a dog slow system. Pass this one by fellas.
There is no working on combining hardware and software for a symbiosys with the user.
There is no attempt to make the system beyond what is popular or expected.
There isn't even the neat-o checkmark logo.
Deal with it guys, the AmigaONE is a POP board. AmigaOS 4.x is a cheap knock-off. They didn't even ship AmigaOS 3.9 with real apps, it was 70% shareware. And 30% bloatware. Amiga was about being able to run the entire system off of a floppy disk and ROM. No more, you need a CD-ROM and a 2 gig HD to even think about installing the system
People here bash BSD for not being Linux. BSD'ers bash Linux for not being BSD. But both have started out as the same thing, an open sourced UNIX derivitive or clone. Linux is the clone, BSD the derivitive.
This reminds me of MOnty Pythons Life of Brian, with the various Judean schism groups, all fighting with each other, and when one man says "stop fighting among yourselves and focus on the real enemy" they all didn't remember their real enemy, the Romans.
Our real enemy folks are people that don't know better than to choose Windows. It doesn't matter weither you win them over with Mac OS X, Linux, BSD, ATheOS, QNX, Amiga, MultiOS, TOS/GEM, or what have you, that is a victory for all of you because it hurts the Microsoft dominance. Sure, the cross-city rivalry between BSD and Linux is there, it should be there. But it should be friendly rivalry, making jokes in pubs afterhours or a friendly game of "who can install the fastest" at the local college campus installfests. For, in the end, there is more alike between us than unalike.
Ignore legal advice from slashdotters, talk to a lawyer. Typically a low-level discussion initial talk to the lawyer won't cost you a dime, and it will tell you what your options are. If you can sue, SUE! if you cannot, do what you must for Sean, because he is what's important, not some stupid school that's afraid of it's own shadow.
Yahoo:
We have material describing hatred, destruction and genocide: Good thing
We have material showing off the naked female body: bad thing
Does anyone else find this humerous?
I still run PFS Write and Professional Write, long after the company stopped supporting each.
The thing that I thought was what if the company is renting out software then suddenly decides it's not going to, for whatever reason?
What happens to the software your business needs then?
In 1997 some maintenance people put up some drywall....
Little did they know that they had unwittingly sealed up a critical system server behind the wall....
Was this a major concern? The system could not be rebooted incase of system crash! It could not be upgraded! You couldn't change the data in it except over the network!
Was this a problem?
No, the server ran Novell.
I did look. A handful of moviles and sound clips, but mostly utilities, shareware that that. Heck, critical necessities in today's internet culture are shareware in the CD, like the TCP stack.
The new AmigaOS will be bloatware too, or hadn't you noticed the severe bloat of AmigaOS 3.5/3.9? What used to come on 5 floppies now barely fits into a CD-ROM w/ it all compressed.
Great anti-bloat don't you think?
I agree here, with the addedd point that the Phoenix Developer Consortium are working on such a box already, using the QNX RtP OS for the operating system and a new customized/well documented hardware solution.
So cross your fingers.
You've mixed up things. AmigaOS will be running only on it's own customized hardware. The AmigaDE API layer is what you are mentioning, and it's very different from AmigaOS. AmigaDE allows binary compatability, AmigaOS does not. AmigaDE is dog-slow, AmigaOS is not.
Of course I can understand the confusion, this article is purposefully worded to mislead you.
Amiga OS is NOT, repeat, NOT coming on Sharp PDA's. the Amiga DE API layer *is* coming on Sharp PDA's. The Amiga OS is being released on new customized hardware, code-named zico, that uses matrox video cards and SBLive! Sound cards. The new hardware uses a PowerPC CPU, and will cost about as much as a G4 tower.
Way to go Amiga, make a new Macintosh. But it's nice that AmigaOS is getting an upgrade.
'81 was the year for investors to flood the market with Game consoles. (everyone remember the Colecovision, right?) '84 the year for Semiconductors (Commodore Business Machines stock did so well). '95, the year of the Web Browser. (Mosaic still is cool) '99 the year of the Internet.(pets.com, yay!) '02 the year of the All-in-one-home-console. (Goodbye Indrema, I liked you, I really did) '03 is shaping up to be the year of the PDA.
I've never had this happen to me, my office runs OS/2, AmigaOS and MacOS. (so shoot me, half of the office does video editing and gfx work) I never have had IBM knocking on my door asking about the copies of OS/2. I've never had AmigaOS send an audit notice asking if the ROM's of the systems are real or if I'd spent a few thousand making ROM's. I've never even gotten a dancing telegram from Apple saying "hey, are those iMacs all legal?".
But I can understand why companies feel a need to rattle sabres over licenses. Thing is, there is no set license in Microsoft's case, people say 'just use license X" or "hey, I've never had a problem" but the fact remains that Microsoft appears to be changing games on people in order to solidify their grasp of the market. They're hitting government agencies the hardest however I have noticed.
I can't wait for them to knock on my door and I dare them to find a copy of M$ anything running on a machine, unless they cound a single copy of M$ AmigaBasic (which we do have the license for I'd note).
For those that fear auditing, be honest, is being strong and holding-to your Windows that important? You'll see them auditing your competitors, other businessess, but not you... until they have noone left to audit, then they turn their noose in your direction. With what's happening with Microsoft, I can easily understand their mentality, they think everyone is out to cheat them of their money, period.
Ah, so you have all of your license material, no problem.... but wait, Microsoft changed the license so all of yours are no good. Your Enterprise license needs to cover everybody that might access your systems, customers included. $300,000 fine, thank you, plus $480,000 in new licenses. Next year, "Hey wait, we changed it again..." and the next and the next... it's how they'll keep making money even when you've bought it and are just using it.
Their need to be making constant money over one-time money deals appears to be taking over. This is their mindset behind.NET and it looks like it will soon be needed for every aspect of Microsoft's life. One nice thing about shrink-wrapped licenses, the guys that put them in there can invalidate them at any time, and change the rules without you being able to do a thing.
So you finally decide to drop Microsoft, but you don't see how you can. Well, let's look at the options, there are many of them.
You have Linux, QNX, OS/2, macintosh, Solaris for starters. And I'm just bringing up industry robust OS's with a ton of software and commercial support. Are you going to say that between all four of them that they can't serve your needs? Linux, new kid, well prooven, has capabilities and networking abilities that Windows just dreams about. QNX, industry leader with 20 years experience, and in it's niche it'll take on anyone. OS/2, an oldie but a goodie, plus it's got IBM behind it, and if you're a business, nobody ever got fired for buying IBM; that it can run Windows software natively doesn't hurt either. Macintosh, formerly the art-lover, with MacOS X it's become a serious workhorse that would make Windows beg for mercy all the while having all of the applications you will ever need.
So as you can see, you have more options than just Linux.
X-Box vs Playstation2 vs Game Cube vs Indrema vs ?
on
Mario's Revenge?
·
· Score: 1
Let us consider a moment.
X-Box, monopolizing company. 26 titles when first released. Will more than likely just get ports of PC games, and not much more.
End result, a snoozer. This approach should be profitable, but why buy an X-Box when you've already got a PC?
Playstation 2, PITA to develop for, not many titles, all of the cools ones are still in development, it's getting some cool games tho.
End result, a small but solid group of fans. It's not going to die off anytime soon.
Game Cube, looks like a breeze to develop for, uses a Mac for the dev platform. Frankly, low-cost to develop for over the PSX2 (I will never call it a PS2, the PS2 is an IBM name IMHO) will give Nintendo an edge here. Also a lower-costing game machine from all accounts means easier to bring to profitability.
End result, strong market presence. Nintendo has a winner here.
Indrema, same situation as Microsoft yet not at the same time. Really an underdog machine. No name recognition, no must-have titles announced...
End result, look at the turkey here unless Indrema changes market strategy and quick.
There is still another possibility, that somewhere is another game console that might take over. Nintendo did that after the crash of '83. I see a new crash coming, thanks to Microsoft and Indrema. But a smart visionary could capitalize on it.
Slashdot Mirror
I'm the one that put in the nuclear power plant comment! 8(
The PS2 has 2 chips which make up the EE, open one up and take a look. This would incorporate both into a single unit plus the I/O chip (which is the PS1 single-chip-solution) onto the same die, most likely. So 3 chips to 1.
Elsewhere on the site is the PCB and schematics for the Jaguar, so just need to convert the netlist files to verilog, send them to Toshiba for fabricating, find a board maker to put it all together, a box-maker to make a pretty covering for it all, and you're all set.
I forgot to reply to the two folk that asked about the Atari chips source files, so here is the link:n etlist. htm
http://www.geocities.com/glenn_b18/jaguar/
It's in a custom HDL that can decode to Verilog simply. All you need to create your own Jaguar Tom and Jerry chips.
This is a logical evolution to the PS2 chip design. Those 3 chips were so integrated in function, placing them into a single unit was a logical step. It would allow for a move to $200 and eventually $100 price tags for the PS2. Likely the incentive to move design is due to Sony having recouped their investment on the 3-chip solution. Otherwise, this move would not make sence. Plus this would allow for the PS3, in 2008, to have PS2 (and PSOne) compatability.
already exists. In 1999, Hasbro, fresh from it's purchase of the Atari trademarks and intellectual property, opened up the Atari Jaguar from all patents, copyrights, and similar materials.
Yes folks, a totally public domain game console.
You can even get the code to produce your own custom chips from the Jaguar, called Tom and Jerry.
But, what's the point? Open source does not make it excellent source. PS2 having Linux does not make it a monster. It's just another feature for the PS2 to exploit.
A few flaws with that theory:
1) the 1999 Mazda pickup truck in the background
2) the mountain in the background is located in Utah
The AmigaONE I've been familiar with for months now as a completely *BAD* implimentation of a PowerPC ATX board. It is using the MAI northbridge, one of the slowest, least comprehensive northbridges made. In short, this system would make even a Cyrix 5x86 look like a speed demon by comparison, irregardless of CPU it has.
Check out the docs. Lack any kind of I/O handling, using the CPU for every last function. End result, a dog slow system. Pass this one by fellas.
At this point it is official:
The Amiga we all knew and loved is dead.
There is no working on combining hardware and software for a symbiosys with the user.
There is no attempt to make the system beyond what is popular or expected.
There isn't even the neat-o checkmark logo.
Deal with it guys, the AmigaONE is a POP board. AmigaOS 4.x is a cheap knock-off. They didn't even ship AmigaOS 3.9 with real apps, it was 70% shareware. And 30% bloatware. Amiga was about being able to run the entire system off of a floppy disk and ROM. No more, you need a CD-ROM and a 2 gig HD to even think about installing the system
What did you do, license Windows NT?
People here bash BSD for not being Linux. BSD'ers bash Linux for not being BSD. But both have started out as the same thing, an open sourced UNIX derivitive or clone. Linux is the clone, BSD the derivitive. This reminds me of MOnty Pythons Life of Brian, with the various Judean schism groups, all fighting with each other, and when one man says "stop fighting among yourselves and focus on the real enemy" they all didn't remember their real enemy, the Romans. Our real enemy folks are people that don't know better than to choose Windows. It doesn't matter weither you win them over with Mac OS X, Linux, BSD, ATheOS, QNX, Amiga, MultiOS, TOS/GEM, or what have you, that is a victory for all of you because it hurts the Microsoft dominance. Sure, the cross-city rivalry between BSD and Linux is there, it should be there. But it should be friendly rivalry, making jokes in pubs afterhours or a friendly game of "who can install the fastest" at the local college campus installfests. For, in the end, there is more alike between us than unalike.
Ignore legal advice from slashdotters, talk to a lawyer. Typically a low-level discussion initial talk to the lawyer won't cost you a dime, and it will tell you what your options are. If you can sue, SUE! if you cannot, do what you must for Sean, because he is what's important, not some stupid school that's afraid of it's own shadow.
Yahoo: We have material describing hatred, destruction and genocide: Good thing We have material showing off the naked female body: bad thing Does anyone else find this humerous?
Anyone else think this sounds like a bad game of pool?
I still run PFS Write and Professional Write, long after the company stopped supporting each. The thing that I thought was what if the company is renting out software then suddenly decides it's not going to, for whatever reason? What happens to the software your business needs then?
In 1997 some maintenance people put up some drywall.... Little did they know that they had unwittingly sealed up a critical system server behind the wall.... Was this a major concern? The system could not be rebooted incase of system crash! It could not be upgraded! You couldn't change the data in it except over the network! Was this a problem? No, the server ran Novell.
I did look. A handful of moviles and sound clips, but mostly utilities, shareware that that. Heck, critical necessities in today's internet culture are shareware in the CD, like the TCP stack.
then let's use LISP then, which kicks C in the teeth when compiled.
The new AmigaOS will be bloatware too, or hadn't you noticed the severe bloat of AmigaOS 3.5/3.9? What used to come on 5 floppies now barely fits into a CD-ROM w/ it all compressed. Great anti-bloat don't you think?
Fine me the DE ASM app that'll toast a native ASM app. Hint, it cannot be done, period. So go back into hiding you Anon coward, emphysis on coward.
I agree here, with the addedd point that the Phoenix Developer Consortium are working on such a box already, using the QNX RtP OS for the operating system and a new customized/well documented hardware solution. So cross your fingers.
You've mixed up things. AmigaOS will be running only on it's own customized hardware. The AmigaDE API layer is what you are mentioning, and it's very different from AmigaOS. AmigaDE allows binary compatability, AmigaOS does not. AmigaDE is dog-slow, AmigaOS is not. Of course I can understand the confusion, this article is purposefully worded to mislead you.
Amiga OS is NOT, repeat, NOT coming on Sharp PDA's. the Amiga DE API layer *is* coming on Sharp PDA's. The Amiga OS is being released on new customized hardware, code-named zico, that uses matrox video cards and SBLive! Sound cards. The new hardware uses a PowerPC CPU, and will cost about as much as a G4 tower. Way to go Amiga, make a new Macintosh. But it's nice that AmigaOS is getting an upgrade.
'81 was the year for investors to flood the market with Game consoles. (everyone remember the Colecovision, right?) '84 the year for Semiconductors (Commodore Business Machines stock did so well). '95, the year of the Web Browser. (Mosaic still is cool) '99 the year of the Internet.(pets.com, yay!) '02 the year of the All-in-one-home-console. (Goodbye Indrema, I liked you, I really did) '03 is shaping up to be the year of the PDA.
I've never had this happen to me, my office runs OS/2, AmigaOS and MacOS. (so shoot me, half of the office does video editing and gfx work) I never have had IBM knocking on my door asking about the copies of OS/2. I've never had AmigaOS send an audit notice asking if the ROM's of the systems are real or if I'd spent a few thousand making ROM's. I've never even gotten a dancing telegram from Apple saying "hey, are those iMacs all legal?".
.NET and it looks like it will soon be needed for every aspect of Microsoft's life. One nice thing about shrink-wrapped licenses, the guys that put them in there can invalidate them at any time, and change the rules without you being able to do a thing.
But I can understand why companies feel a need to rattle sabres over licenses. Thing is, there is no set license in Microsoft's case, people say 'just use license X" or "hey, I've never had a problem" but the fact remains that Microsoft appears to be changing games on people in order to solidify their grasp of the market. They're hitting government agencies the hardest however I have noticed.
I can't wait for them to knock on my door and I dare them to find a copy of M$ anything running on a machine, unless they cound a single copy of M$ AmigaBasic (which we do have the license for I'd note).
For those that fear auditing, be honest, is being strong and holding-to your Windows that important? You'll see them auditing your competitors, other businessess, but not you... until they have noone left to audit, then they turn their noose in your direction. With what's happening with Microsoft, I can easily understand their mentality, they think everyone is out to cheat them of their money, period.
Ah, so you have all of your license material, no problem.... but wait, Microsoft changed the license so all of yours are no good. Your Enterprise license needs to cover everybody that might access your systems, customers included. $300,000 fine, thank you, plus $480,000 in new licenses. Next year, "Hey wait, we changed it again..." and the next and the next... it's how they'll keep making money even when you've bought it and are just using it.
Their need to be making constant money over one-time money deals appears to be taking over. This is their mindset behind
So you finally decide to drop Microsoft, but you don't see how you can. Well, let's look at the options, there are many of them.
You have Linux, QNX, OS/2, macintosh, Solaris for starters. And I'm just bringing up industry robust OS's with a ton of software and commercial support. Are you going to say that between all four of them that they can't serve your needs? Linux, new kid, well prooven, has capabilities and networking abilities that Windows just dreams about. QNX, industry leader with 20 years experience, and in it's niche it'll take on anyone. OS/2, an oldie but a goodie, plus it's got IBM behind it, and if you're a business, nobody ever got fired for buying IBM; that it can run Windows software natively doesn't hurt either. Macintosh, formerly the art-lover, with MacOS X it's become a serious workhorse that would make Windows beg for mercy all the while having all of the applications you will ever need.
So as you can see, you have more options than just Linux.
Let us consider a moment.
X-Box, monopolizing company. 26 titles when first released. Will more than likely just get ports of PC games, and not much more.
End result, a snoozer. This approach should be profitable, but why buy an X-Box when you've already got a PC?
Playstation 2, PITA to develop for, not many titles, all of the cools ones are still in development, it's getting some cool games tho.
End result, a small but solid group of fans. It's not going to die off anytime soon.
Game Cube, looks like a breeze to develop for, uses a Mac for the dev platform. Frankly, low-cost to develop for over the PSX2 (I will never call it a PS2, the PS2 is an IBM name IMHO) will give Nintendo an edge here. Also a lower-costing game machine from all accounts means easier to bring to profitability.
End result, strong market presence. Nintendo has a winner here.
Indrema, same situation as Microsoft yet not at the same time. Really an underdog machine. No name recognition, no must-have titles announced...
End result, look at the turkey here unless Indrema changes market strategy and quick.
There is still another possibility, that somewhere is another game console that might take over. Nintendo did that after the crash of '83. I see a new crash coming, thanks to Microsoft and Indrema. But a smart visionary could capitalize on it.