Agreed - stability and fixes are very important. However, you can't market "bug fixes". You can market new capabilities, standards compliance, improved speed, improved security, etc. Opera is a product that a company is trying to "sell" (not in the monetary sense, in the marketing sense). New features are also (for the most part) what sucks in new users.
There has to be a fair mix of new feature development and bug fixes. I guess you are of the opinion that Opera needs to adjust their mix. Personally I think they're doing just great but I've only been using Opera since version 8 when they started working on SVG - a NEW feature;)
Btw, I think Opera's size is incredible - a 5 MB download for a complete internet suite. Firefox is something like 6 MB with no extensions. SeaMonkey is something like 13 MB and it doesn't include web feed aggregation yet (as far as I know).
I am loving the SVG implementation in the Opera 9 Previews, I update information on my blog. TP2 includes several fixes to the SVG implementation over TP1 and TP1 was a HUGE leap from Opera 8.x. Opera now covers more SVG functionality than Firefox 1.5 does, and is faster on my PC.
Opera is the new native SVG implementation to beat.
Opera and Mozilla-based browsers (Firefox, SeaMonkey, Camino, Flock) already support SVG. Konqueror has the KSVG2 plugin. Safari is in active development of their SVG support in WebKit. EvolGrafiX is actively developing their Renesis plugin. Batik is under active development.
And that's the desktop space, the mobile space is also very active.
Ah, but surely you're aware of svg:switch and feature strings, no? The SVG specification provides a mechanism to deploy fallback content from within the SVG document itself. Firefox doesn't support filters yet, so deploy filters for those implementations that do (Adobe) and something else (or nothing) for those that don't (like Firefox 1.5 and Opera 8).
This feature was put into SVG because the authors of the spec realized that no browser would be able to implement ALL features out of the gate.
FUD anyone? Did I say it supports SVG fully? No. Key things that are missing with the Firefox SVG support at this time are filters, declarative animation and some text features. Yet to say what's left is only a "few things that are in the spec" shows that you are ignorant about what the spec covers. The implementors have to start somewhere...
Opera 9 is MUCH further along in its SVG support, it now supports scripting for its SVG and is inching towards SVG Basic - Opera 9 TP1 is almost to the point of supporting all of Mozilla's supported SVG features (as well as declarative animation). Things are getting better...
SVG is similar: a well-defined standard, with LOTS of potential for the web, but yet Microsoft ignore it. Hell, Mozilla has ignored it, too. It's available for Mozilla as an add-on, but why isn't it IN there now? What about Konqueror and Safari?
Microsoft proposed their own graphical markup language (VML) that they also use in Office - but it was rejected. I guess they feel spurned.
But Mozilla has ignored SVG?!? Firefox supports SVG natively since Firefox 1.5 Alpha - it is NOT supported as an add-on. Furthermore, the SVG spec is a very complex one - it's not something that can be trivially implemented.
FYI, Safari is currently working on updating WebKit to support SVG based on Konqueror's KSVG plugin.
... so shall they become corrupt, just like the "old media". Basically they'll have a blaze of fame and then they'll become targets for other bloggers who claim they are now corrupt...
I think you also have to take into account the pace that the market is willing to accept. Currently the market is saturated with DVDs, optical disc storage for the next generation is in the works (Blu-Ray and HD-DVD), if the masses were able to use holographic storage today for mundane usage, it would actually be harmful to the economy...
It's possible I misunderstood you, but I think the problem may be that the SVG image itself is specifying the size. Look at the element and see if the width/height are being specified. Ideally, the <svg> element should state width="100%" and height="100%". Then this should allow the user agent to properly scale the SVG image inside an <object> tag by specifying the <object>'s width/height. However if the <svg> element specifies width="400px", then maybe you're stuck because the author of the SVG has stated the width is 400 pixels, end of story.
I can't remember what the behavior of the SVG or HTML spec say with respect to this when conflicts occur... Specs like CDF will help to clarify some of these issues.
Personally I think their Blog Editor tool need A LOT of work. The Blog This! feature is nice, but the Blog Editor itself is hardly "slick". Read more here.
Gates recalls. "There was this awful episode in '86 when they said 'We want GDDM graphics, not Windows graphics...which made it very incompatible with Windows and very big and complicated, and oriented toward this so-called metafile approach that for interactive interfaces isn't what you want."
Oriented towards a metafile approach for interactive interfaces... hmm, isn't that what XAML is? Does anyone know enough about GDDM?
I was going to say the exact same thing. Outlook Web Access 2003 really impressed me when I first used it at work. It's only natural that they would use this same code to give Hotmail a much-needed face lift.
Only problem is that currently Outlook Web Access 2003 is hobbled in Firefox and completely borked in Opera. Hopefully that's being addressed with Kahuna since it's outside the corporate environment...
You also vastly underestimate the lure of money. If all customers acted like you, then telemarketers would just go to India or other developing countries or switch to automated systems.
I guess you're not privy to the automated telemarketing that I've received in Illinois. The actual message is a recording that you have to sit through. At the very end of this message is an option to be removed from the list. BUT YOU STILL HAVE TO SIT THROUGH THE MESSAGE! Now how are you going to fight that?
You may feel proud that you're visciously fighting back against the telemarketers, but in my opinion you are really only wasting your own time and energy on hate.
First, make sure you have the Fx 1.5 Beta 1 (obviously).
Now do you see these dialogs when going to my site (http://www.codedread.com/) or is it only local SVG files? If it is just local SVG files, see this bug: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30358 1 that I filed with a workaround to fix this issue. If it solves the problem, go vote for that bug!
SVG is absolutely built into Firefox 1.5 Beta. It's been there since the alphas as well. Go to http://www.codedread.com/ and see my little nav menu with the aqua buttons. Go to http://www.codedread.com/yastframe.php and play my SVG Tetris clone. These things work in IE+ASV, Fx1.0+ASV and Fx1.5. The menu slightly works in Opera 8.02 but the game does not (Opera does not support SVG scripting yet).
If you are experiencing issues it is likely due to incompatibility issues with Adobe SVG sites. Firefox is stricter so people out there need to update their content. See http://jwatt.org/svg/authoring/ for more details.
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Sorry - I just checked out of curiosity - Opera 9 TP2 download is 4 MB, not 5 MB!
Agreed - stability and fixes are very important. However, you can't market "bug fixes". You can market new capabilities, standards compliance, improved speed, improved security, etc. Opera is a product that a company is trying to "sell" (not in the monetary sense, in the marketing sense). New features are also (for the most part) what sucks in new users.
;)
There has to be a fair mix of new feature development and bug fixes. I guess you are of the opinion that Opera needs to adjust their mix. Personally I think they're doing just great but I've only been using Opera since version 8 when they started working on SVG - a NEW feature
Btw, I think Opera's size is incredible - a 5 MB download for a complete internet suite. Firefox is something like 6 MB with no extensions. SeaMonkey is something like 13 MB and it doesn't include web feed aggregation yet (as far as I know).
Use Firefox 1.5 for now...
I am loving the SVG implementation in the Opera 9 Previews, I update information on my blog. TP2 includes several fixes to the SVG implementation over TP1 and TP1 was a HUGE leap from Opera 8.x. Opera now covers more SVG functionality than Firefox 1.5 does, and is faster on my PC.
Opera is the new native SVG implementation to beat.
Hm, not with Firefox 1.5 - the "FastBack" feature was added and works great
Wouldn't that depend on how much communication happens between modules?
Opera and Mozilla-based browsers (Firefox, SeaMonkey, Camino, Flock) already support SVG.
Konqueror has the KSVG2 plugin.
Safari is in active development of their SVG support in WebKit.
EvolGrafiX is actively developing their Renesis plugin.
Batik is under active development.
And that's the desktop space, the mobile space is also very active.
Ah, but surely you're aware of svg:switch and feature strings, no? The SVG specification provides a mechanism to deploy fallback content from within the SVG document itself. Firefox doesn't support filters yet, so deploy filters for those implementations that do (Adobe) and something else (or nothing) for those that don't (like Firefox 1.5 and Opera 8).
This feature was put into SVG because the authors of the spec realized that no browser would be able to implement ALL features out of the gate.
My site has SVG navigation pane with animated buttons. I also made a version of SVG Tetris.
FUD anyone? Did I say it supports SVG fully? No. Key things that are missing with the Firefox SVG support at this time are filters, declarative animation and some text features. Yet to say what's left is only a "few things that are in the spec" shows that you are ignorant about what the spec covers. The implementors have to start somewhere...
And if you want to get technical, no browser supports CSS 2 fully yet.
Opera 9 is MUCH further along in its SVG support, it now supports scripting for its SVG and is inching towards SVG Basic - Opera 9 TP1 is almost to the point of supporting all of Mozilla's supported SVG features (as well as declarative animation). Things are getting better...
Microsoft proposed their own graphical markup language (VML) that they also use in Office - but it was rejected. I guess they feel spurned.
But Mozilla has ignored SVG?!? Firefox supports SVG natively since Firefox 1.5 Alpha - it is NOT supported as an add-on. Furthermore, the SVG spec is a very complex one - it's not something that can be trivially implemented.
FYI, Safari is currently working on updating WebKit to support SVG based on Konqueror's KSVG plugin.
... so shall they become corrupt, just like the "old media". Basically they'll have a blaze of fame and then they'll become targets for other bloggers who claim they are now corrupt...
I think you also have to take into account the pace that the market is willing to accept. Currently the market is saturated with DVDs, optical disc storage for the next generation is in the works (Blu-Ray and HD-DVD), if the masses were able to use holographic storage today for mundane usage, it would actually be harmful to the economy...
I'm curious about how new technology is tested for its ability to hold the data for the long term... Anybody have any pointers to material here?
It's possible I misunderstood you, but I think the problem may be that the SVG image itself is specifying the size. Look at the element and see if the width/height are being specified. Ideally, the <svg> element should state width="100%" and height="100%". Then this should allow the user agent to properly scale the SVG image inside an <object> tag by specifying the <object>'s width/height. However if the <svg> element specifies width="400px", then maybe you're stuck because the author of the SVG has stated the width is 400 pixels, end of story.
I can't remember what the behavior of the SVG or HTML spec say with respect to this when conflicts occur... Specs like CDF will help to clarify some of these issues.
Personally I think their Blog Editor tool need A LOT of work. The Blog This! feature is nice, but the Blog Editor itself is hardly "slick". Read more here.
Oriented towards a metafile approach for interactive interfaces... hmm, isn't that what XAML is? Does anyone know enough about GDDM?
I was going to say the exact same thing. Outlook Web Access 2003 really impressed me when I first used it at work. It's only natural that they would use this same code to give Hotmail a much-needed face lift. Only problem is that currently Outlook Web Access 2003 is hobbled in Firefox and completely borked in Opera. Hopefully that's being addressed with Kahuna since it's outside the corporate environment...
You also vastly underestimate the lure of money. If all customers acted like you, then telemarketers would just go to India or other developing countries or switch to automated systems.
I guess you're not privy to the automated telemarketing that I've received in Illinois. The actual message is a recording that you have to sit through. At the very end of this message is an option to be removed from the list. BUT YOU STILL HAVE TO SIT THROUGH THE MESSAGE! Now how are you going to fight that?
You may feel proud that you're visciously fighting back against the telemarketers, but in my opinion you are really only wasting your own time and energy on hate.
Holy crap you need to learn what sarcasm is...
Go to about:config and make sure svg.enabled is set to true. It is in the default download but perhaps you disabled it in an earlier install?
First, make sure you have the Fx 1.5 Beta 1 (obviously). Now do you see these dialogs when going to my site (http://www.codedread.com/) or is it only local SVG files? If it is just local SVG files, see this bug: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30358 1 that I filed with a workaround to fix this issue. If it solves the problem, go vote for that bug!
SVG is absolutely built into Firefox 1.5 Beta. It's been there since the alphas as well. Go to http://www.codedread.com/ and see my little nav menu with the aqua buttons. Go to http://www.codedread.com/yastframe.php and play my SVG Tetris clone. These things work in IE+ASV, Fx1.0+ASV and Fx1.5. The menu slightly works in Opera 8.02 but the game does not (Opera does not support SVG scripting yet).
If you are experiencing issues it is likely due to incompatibility issues with Adobe SVG sites. Firefox is stricter so people out there need to update their content. See http://jwatt.org/svg/authoring/ for more details.