Yes that is true. Sure, there are PCs that are more expensive than macs, but you're not doing an apples-to-apples (no pun) comparison. Macs are consumer systems, so you compare them to other consumer systems. If mbps came with FireGL or Quattro cards, you could then make a comparison to like systems.
> Which graphics card in the MacBook Pro, it has two? The Dell only has one. According to Notebookcheck [notebookcheck.net] the AMD Radeon HD 6770M the MBP has is a "middle class graphics card for laptops in 2011." So while the Quadro 3000M is a pro graphics card, and has more memory the Radeon HD6770M isn't exactly a consumer graphics card like you said.
Welcome to last year. All sandy bridge intel processors come with an intel GMA 4000 graphics adapter. All sandy bridge laptops use switchable graphics. The HD6770M is not a FireGL (AMD's equivalent to the Quattro), therefore it is just a consumer graphics card - middle class consumer at that. In fact, the 6770M is an improvement over the GeForce 535M of the last generation. That 535M was (is) a real useless piece of shit.
Just as a quick comparison, the Dell XPS series allows for both higher RAM and a GF 540M graphics card. It costs about $800 less than the mbp in that configuration.
> So you know more than all the professional graphic artists and photographers do about their profession? Are you one yourself? Fact is is many of them use Macs, and only Macs. Sure others use Windows PC and others are trying out Linux PCs but you're stupid if you believe no one uses Macs.
I never said none used Macs. Many do, some don't. From what I've seen graphic designers use mac more often than not. That wasn't my claim. My claim is that mac is not everything to everyone. Workstation class machines, such as the one you pointed out, are for people who do CAD or 3D modelling. They require enterprise graphics for various reasons such as API access and rendering accuracy. You found such an enterprise system and are trying to pawn it off as the equivalent of a mac. It is not. The mac is a consumer grade machine. It just so happens that consumer-grade is all that is required for graphics artists and photographers to do their work: display color accuracy would obviously be the most important aspect to them, so using an IPS panel is a must at a professional level.
> But you didn't. You said The iMac is a desktop with zero upgrade ability. Even then though you don't look at the Mac Pro. It is just about as expandable as any system NewEgg will assemble. I do agree though you can get better components with custom built systems, no matter who the OEM is. Dell, HP, Leveno, and so on. Are you going to criticize this too?
Let's list what you can upgrade on a Newegg PC and compare it to a Mac Pro:
NewEgg PC: - switch motherboard to one with a new chipset, be that from Intel to AMD, or consumer to server - add nVidia or AMD graphics cards, even in SLI/Crossfire - change PSU to more or less powerful - switch to a case that has different characteristics, but keep all other hardware - add/remove hard drives - switch to a case that can acomodate more hard drives, keeping all other hardware - use any brand of SSD, graphics adapter - install any 3rd party expansion card such as sound cards, A-D boards, DIO boards, video capture cards, etc. - switch between consumer and server-grade CPUs - add optical drives, or floppy drives, or blu-ray drives, or even mutli-SD card reader panels - change CPU heatsinks (if you overclock, or are running in a hotter-than-usual environment) - use water cooling... plus more stuff. In short, if you can change/add/remove it, it can be done.
Mac Pro
- change to another apple motherboard - add/change Xeon CPU - add/change RAM (if compatible) - add/change HDD - add/change apple-compatible GPUs (but more expensive for same hardware). - Can add some third-party PCI cards, but most don't support apple... in short, as long as you do your work with apple parts, you can 'upgrade' a mac pro. Your options are so incredibly limited that every system builder will ROFL at you the moment you try to tell him you can upgrade your Mac Pro.
>I provide real data and all you do is talk, where is your data?
The system you found has a quattro 3000M graphics card. Do you know how insanely expensive those are? That is not a consumer graphics card, like the one in the macbook pro. Still, you get quattro graphics and twice the RAM for just $100 above the mbp price. You really never pay full price for those Dell laptops. Our regular company price on them is actually a bit lower than $2400. I should probably point out that this laptop you pointed out isn't even a consumer laptop. Apple is all about the consumer, and doesn't care about the enterprise. This is why you never see workstation grade graphics in a mac - just the regular ATI/nVidia consumer parts.
> The same applies to all other all-in-ones whether Apple, Dell, HP, or any other. The same with the Mac Mini.
So? I'm not really limiting myself to all-in-ones. Let's look at the Mac Pro. In fact, most pre-built systems have little to no upgradability. Luckily in the PC world you can just as easily have newegg assemble a solid system for you as you could just buy a Dell, except the custom build would have better components and would suite your needs exactly.
> Again, look above. Mac compare pretty fairly with Windows OEM PCs, more expensive than some but cheaper than others.
Again, no. If you spend more on a PC than a Mac, that PC will *severely* outspec the mac. You can probably find a few outliers (such as Thinkstations) that are more comparable, but even those come with more workstation grade components than any mac. Macs are vastly more expensive than any equivalent-spec consumer PC.
The iMac lets you upgrade the processor to any LGA1155 processor. You can add RAM, or change the HDD. Replacing parts like the motherboard, PSU, and screen don't count because you don't have any options. You get apple's parts, and it becomes, in effect, a repair. The moment apple changes something in the chassis, you will not be able to get new parts. Besides, I'd be willing to bet that the replacement parts cost so much that you'd be better off just buying a new system. I'm not surprised that you can modify an iMac within the apple-approved boundaries, but that's a far cry from calling up 'upgradable'.
You can't even compare this limited "upgrade" ability to a whitebox. I can actually perform any upgrade on my system - CPU, GPU, Motherboard, case, PSU, RAM, mutliple HDDs, and I can still perform the same in 5 years, because form factors are all standardized. Right now I can add a second, third, or even fourth GPU. I change out my motherboard for a LGA2011 and get a hex-core i7 or Xeon processor without changing anything else. I can choose between nVidia or AMD GPUs, Intel or AMD, Any of dozens of sound devices, video capture devices, network devices, and so on. Not only that, but the cost to me is far less. 'Whitebox' PCs (though with the innovative cases these days, that doesn't apply anymore) can satisfy a larger portion of the market than apple can. That's probably why the whitebox PC market is doing so well.
> We have no immediate plans to reprovision some or all of the Megaupload servers. This means that there is no imminent data loss for Megaupload customers.
I don't get it. Isn't the issue that megaupload customers ARE going to lose their data very soon? In that case, wouldn't the lack of reprovisioning just maintain the status quo?
If you want to whitebox a system, you have a choice: Built it yourself (which many do because they enjoy doing), or have newegg/NCIX/whoever build it for you for $50. In the end you get a better system that suites your exact needs for a good price. It's pretty unprecedented and awesome that we have an industry where you can choose every component of your product. If the car industry were like this, we'd all be a lot happier.
As for the macbook pro, and imac, and the mac mini, you're still looking at big premiums for those systems. For the iMac, it's $300 (and up), for the mbp it's $400 (and up). The iMac is a desktop with zero upgrade ability. It does double as a decoration, but there are other good all-in-ones that perform as well and cost a few hundred less for base, and thousands less when the specs are improved.
One thing I leared about apple computers: NEVER, EVER 'configure' your systems with apple hardware. The prices goes through the roof. Max out and imac, and you hit north of $3000. "Whitebox" the same computer and have it built for you and it'll cost you less than $2000, including the same 27" monitor from dell.
TL;DR; Macs are hundreds more expensive than their PC counterparts at best. They compromise expandability and flexibility for design. That's probably good for some, bad for others. This limits their market.
> 1996 calling, it wants it's mime back. I dare you to configure Dell, HP, and Leveno products so it will have similar specs to a Mac then compare prices. I did precisely that before ordering the MacBook Pro I'm typing this on
Are you in Europe somewhere? I just looked on the Dell site. An XPS 15,
http://store.apple.com/us_smb_78313/configure/MD318LL/A?... because you have to spend another $2000 to get the $1800 machine up to the same 8 GB as the xps 15". Since I have access to both these machines right now, I can also tell you that the dell monitor has better color and brightness.
So does Shaw. I get bizarre behavior with Skype (distortions, connection problems) at non-peak hours. If I run speed test at those times, both my download and upload capacity max out. It's all very annoying. I also have inside information that Shaw has had throttling equipment in for almost 10 years now, and that they do use it.
This has nothing to do with the legal system per se, as it only provide apple with the tools to do what they are doing. They could just as easily choose not to block products, but instead to try and draw royalties as MS is. Also, I don't see the S II as being a "copy" of the iphone, I see it as an improvement. Apple itself takes other products and 'improves' them, so why not samsung?
> I know the last few PCs I've bought I've insisted I receive a full boxed install media... not the OEM, but the retail one, and I pay for it. Because if you don't have this, when your Windows system needs to be rebuilt, you're probably hosed.
Why on earth are you insisting on the retail boxed media? OEM is fine as long as it's sold with a system. Not only that, but you need only buy it once, and just use the license key on the bottom (or side, or whatever) of each system when you do the restore. The key is not stored on the media, it's stored on MS servers. Those keys are already bound to the hardware.
> Good, because MS has been making it increasingly difficult to be able to do a reinstall even if you have a licensed copy.
What? How? I've been using an official Win7 ISO on people's laptops (also with Win7), and just activated it using the product key printed on the bottom of the laptop - worked every time, no hassles. I suppose you can run into that limit of 3 thing eventually, but I've found that you just don't have to reinstall the OS unless you have a hardware failure.
Win8 is going to be a tablet and desktop OS. The reset feature is just like a mobile device "reset to factory" feature. It's a consistent feature, really. Obviously, you still have the option to install from a clean source.
I agree. I've been setting up Win7 systems for various people, and with the exception of just one (who had a habit of collecting applications from around the internet), all those systems are still stable and solid. Mine, in particular, hasn't been turned off, and only restarted due to some patching, and it's still stable and solid.
However, I do like the idea of a built-in reset, especially if you can use it to rid yourself of 'crapware' on a new system with minimal effort.
Apple does their best to prevent hackintoshes. They do have legal recourse against those they discover having hackintoshes, but I doubt they really care. They probably see hackintosh users as eventual customers - after all, they actually *like* OSX.
To each their own. I personally never bother to research my apps on android, I just check the permissions. If they ask for more than I think they need, I don't install. It's that dead simple. Personally, I'm not a fan of iOS, and even when it was the most up-to-date smartphone on the market (before android), I kept trying out the phones and they kept leaving me with a "meh." feeling. iOS is not aging well, either. Too simple, and the styling is rapidly becoming passe. There is a reason why Android has beaten it.
You probably should have gotten a Nexus. My N1 is still a strong phone despite being well over a year old. Unlike the 3GS, it was able to keep up with the latest version of android without a hitch (though it won't get Android 4, but that's understandable).
I'm not sure I agree on the true free market argument, I'm pretty sure the current PC industry is as close to a free market as you can get. The free market gave us open platforms. Yes, Apple obviously is working against that (while enjoying the profits it brings to them), but Apple is not a major player in terms of market share in the PC realm, and never will be.
The trend is clear: Android will do to Apple what MS did in the OS space. I actually am one of the lucky Google Nexus owners, just recently switch from an N1 to the GN. I'm quite impressed with Android 4. I'm finding the iOS interface is just not aging well at all on the iPad and iPhone I'm using for development. I see the appeal of what Apple offers (integration), but it come at far too high a price. Plus, I'm used to cobbling together my own solutions. I have a mix MS and Linux-based stuff working quite well together, thanks mostly to the efforts of the linux community.
Are you talking just in the mobile space? It seems to me that MS is doing just fine is OS and Office sales still, despite all that has been going on. All markets are growing - not only the tablet and phone markets (which will probably be owned by android), but the mobile PC market is still in a growth phase. The other surprising growth is actually in the custom-build PC market, so you see newegg, ncix, and other online component vendors trying to expand as fast as possible.
Conversely, plenty of people I know are sick of iPhone problems and Apple's clausterphobic walled garden, and are looking at the android superphones for replacements.
The reason is because they don't have the correct leadership. If they get someone with a similar disposition to Jobs in charge, you can bet he'll practically live at MS Research, and you'll see tons of amazing stuff get productized. The problem with MS is that monkey sitting on top of it.
Mp3 players are on borrowed time, IMO. Mobile phones can handle that function admirably. An iPod touch looks and works like an iPhone, minus the cell capabilities, so why bother unless it's for someone too young to have a cell phone?
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Yes that is true. Sure, there are PCs that are more expensive than macs, but you're not doing an apples-to-apples (no pun) comparison. Macs are consumer systems, so you compare them to other consumer systems. If mbps came with FireGL or Quattro cards, you could then make a comparison to like systems.
> Which graphics card in the MacBook Pro, it has two? The Dell only has one. According to Notebookcheck [notebookcheck.net] the AMD Radeon HD 6770M the MBP has is a "middle class graphics card for laptops in 2011." So while the Quadro 3000M is a pro graphics card, and has more memory the Radeon HD6770M isn't exactly a consumer graphics card like you said.
Welcome to last year. All sandy bridge intel processors come with an intel GMA 4000 graphics adapter. All sandy bridge laptops use switchable graphics. The HD6770M is not a FireGL (AMD's equivalent to the Quattro), therefore it is just a consumer graphics card - middle class consumer at that. In fact, the 6770M is an improvement over the GeForce 535M of the last generation. That 535M was (is) a real useless piece of shit.
Just as a quick comparison, the Dell XPS series allows for both higher RAM and a GF 540M graphics card. It costs about $800 less than the mbp in that configuration.
> So you know more than all the professional graphic artists and photographers do about their profession? Are you one yourself? Fact is is many of them use Macs, and only Macs. Sure others use Windows PC and others are trying out Linux PCs but you're stupid if you believe no one uses Macs.
I never said none used Macs. Many do, some don't. From what I've seen graphic designers use mac more often than not. That wasn't my claim. My claim is that mac is not everything to everyone. Workstation class machines, such as the one you pointed out, are for people who do CAD or 3D modelling. They require enterprise graphics for various reasons such as API access and rendering accuracy. You found such an enterprise system and are trying to pawn it off as the equivalent of a mac. It is not. The mac is a consumer grade machine. It just so happens that consumer-grade is all that is required for graphics artists and photographers to do their work: display color accuracy would obviously be the most important aspect to them, so using an IPS panel is a must at a professional level.
> But you didn't. You said The iMac is a desktop with zero upgrade ability. Even then though you don't look at the Mac Pro. It is just about as expandable as any system NewEgg will assemble. I do agree though you can get better components with custom built systems, no matter who the OEM is. Dell, HP, Leveno, and so on. Are you going to criticize this too?
Let's list what you can upgrade on a Newegg PC and compare it to a Mac Pro:
NewEgg PC: ... plus more stuff. In short, if you can change/add/remove it, it can be done.
- switch motherboard to one with a new chipset, be that from Intel to AMD, or consumer to server
- add nVidia or AMD graphics cards, even in SLI/Crossfire
- change PSU to more or less powerful
- switch to a case that has different characteristics, but keep all other hardware
- add/remove hard drives
- switch to a case that can acomodate more hard drives, keeping all other hardware
- use any brand of SSD, graphics adapter
- install any 3rd party expansion card such as sound cards, A-D boards, DIO boards, video capture cards, etc.
- switch between consumer and server-grade CPUs
- add optical drives, or floppy drives, or blu-ray drives, or even mutli-SD card reader panels
- change CPU heatsinks (if you overclock, or are running in a hotter-than-usual environment)
- use water cooling
Mac Pro
- change to another apple motherboard .. in short, as long as you do your work with apple parts, you can 'upgrade' a mac pro. Your options are so incredibly limited that every system builder will ROFL at you the moment you try to tell him you can upgrade your Mac Pro.
- add/change Xeon CPU
- add/change RAM (if compatible)
- add/change HDD
- add/change apple-compatible GPUs (but more expensive for same hardware).
- Can add some third-party PCI cards, but most don't support apple.
>I provide real data and all you do is talk, where is your data?
Really? You
The system you found has a quattro 3000M graphics card. Do you know how insanely expensive those are? That is not a consumer graphics card, like the one in the macbook pro. Still, you get quattro graphics and twice the RAM for just $100 above the mbp price. You really never pay full price for those Dell laptops. Our regular company price on them is actually a bit lower than $2400. I should probably point out that this laptop you pointed out isn't even a consumer laptop. Apple is all about the consumer, and doesn't care about the enterprise. This is why you never see workstation grade graphics in a mac - just the regular ATI/nVidia consumer parts.
> The same applies to all other all-in-ones whether Apple, Dell, HP, or any other. The same with the Mac Mini.
So? I'm not really limiting myself to all-in-ones. Let's look at the Mac Pro. In fact, most pre-built systems have little to no upgradability. Luckily in the PC world you can just as easily have newegg assemble a solid system for you as you could just buy a Dell, except the custom build would have better components and would suite your needs exactly.
> Again, look above. Mac compare pretty fairly with Windows OEM PCs, more expensive than some but cheaper than others.
Again, no. If you spend more on a PC than a Mac, that PC will *severely* outspec the mac. You can probably find a few outliers (such as Thinkstations) that are more comparable, but even those come with more workstation grade components than any mac. Macs are vastly more expensive than any equivalent-spec consumer PC.
The iMac lets you upgrade the processor to any LGA1155 processor. You can add RAM, or change the HDD. Replacing parts like the motherboard, PSU, and screen don't count because you don't have any options. You get apple's parts, and it becomes, in effect, a repair. The moment apple changes something in the chassis, you will not be able to get new parts. Besides, I'd be willing to bet that the replacement parts cost so much that you'd be better off just buying a new system. I'm not surprised that you can modify an iMac within the apple-approved boundaries, but that's a far cry from calling up 'upgradable'.
You can't even compare this limited "upgrade" ability to a whitebox. I can actually perform any upgrade on my system - CPU, GPU, Motherboard, case, PSU, RAM, mutliple HDDs, and I can still perform the same in 5 years, because form factors are all standardized. Right now I can add a second, third, or even fourth GPU. I change out my motherboard for a LGA2011 and get a hex-core i7 or Xeon processor without changing anything else. I can choose between nVidia or AMD GPUs, Intel or AMD, Any of dozens of sound devices, video capture devices, network devices, and so on. Not only that, but the cost to me is far less. 'Whitebox' PCs (though with the innovative cases these days, that doesn't apply anymore) can satisfy a larger portion of the market than apple can. That's probably why the whitebox PC market is doing so well.
> We have no immediate plans to reprovision some or all of the Megaupload servers. This means that there is no imminent data loss for Megaupload customers.
I don't get it. Isn't the issue that megaupload customers ARE going to lose their data very soon? In that case, wouldn't the lack of reprovisioning just maintain the status quo?
If you want to whitebox a system, you have a choice: Built it yourself (which many do because they enjoy doing), or have newegg/NCIX/whoever build it for you for $50. In the end you get a better system that suites your exact needs for a good price. It's pretty unprecedented and awesome that we have an industry where you can choose every component of your product. If the car industry were like this, we'd all be a lot happier.
As for the macbook pro, and imac, and the mac mini, you're still looking at big premiums for those systems. For the iMac, it's $300 (and up), for the mbp it's $400 (and up). The iMac is a desktop with zero upgrade ability. It does double as a decoration, but there are other good all-in-ones that perform as well and cost a few hundred less for base, and thousands less when the specs are improved.
One thing I leared about apple computers: NEVER, EVER 'configure' your systems with apple hardware. The prices goes through the roof. Max out and imac, and you hit north of $3000. "Whitebox" the same computer and have it built for you and it'll cost you less than $2000, including the same 27" monitor from dell.
TL;DR; Macs are hundreds more expensive than their PC counterparts at best. They compromise expandability and flexibility for design. That's probably good for some, bad for others. This limits their market.
> 1996 calling, it wants it's mime back. I dare you to configure Dell, HP, and Leveno products so it will have similar specs to a Mac then compare prices. I did precisely that before ordering the MacBook Pro I'm typing this on
Are you in Europe somewhere? I just looked on the Dell site. An XPS 15,
http://configure.us.dell.com/dellstore/config.aspx?oc=mndodq4z&c=us&l=en&s=dhs&cs=19&model_id=xps-l502x
is $1300. The same-speced mbp is $2000
http://store.apple.com/us_smb_78313/configure/MD318LL/A? ... because you have to spend another $2000 to get the $1800 machine up to the same 8 GB as the xps 15". Since I have access to both these machines right now, I can also tell you that the dell monitor has better color and brightness.
So does Shaw. I get bizarre behavior with Skype (distortions, connection problems) at non-peak hours. If I run speed test at those times, both my download and upload capacity max out. It's all very annoying. I also have inside information that Shaw has had throttling equipment in for almost 10 years now, and that they do use it.
This has nothing to do with the legal system per se, as it only provide apple with the tools to do what they are doing. They could just as easily choose not to block products, but instead to try and draw royalties as MS is. Also, I don't see the S II as being a "copy" of the iphone, I see it as an improvement. Apple itself takes other products and 'improves' them, so why not samsung?
I suppose MS could just start a lot of lawsuits against android instead, and start blocking android-based products...
> I know the last few PCs I've bought I've insisted I receive a full boxed install media ... not the OEM, but the retail one, and I pay for it. Because if you don't have this, when your Windows system needs to be rebuilt, you're probably hosed.
Why on earth are you insisting on the retail boxed media? OEM is fine as long as it's sold with a system. Not only that, but you need only buy it once, and just use the license key on the bottom (or side, or whatever) of each system when you do the restore. The key is not stored on the media, it's stored on MS servers. Those keys are already bound to the hardware.
> Good, because MS has been making it increasingly difficult to be able to do a reinstall even if you have a licensed copy.
What? How? I've been using an official Win7 ISO on people's laptops (also with Win7), and just activated it using the product key printed on the bottom of the laptop - worked every time, no hassles. I suppose you can run into that limit of 3 thing eventually, but I've found that you just don't have to reinstall the OS unless you have a hardware failure.
You can also bet the MS will provide the tools to the public to generate your own image.
Win8 is going to be a tablet and desktop OS. The reset feature is just like a mobile device "reset to factory" feature. It's a consistent feature, really. Obviously, you still have the option to install from a clean source.
I agree. I've been setting up Win7 systems for various people, and with the exception of just one (who had a habit of collecting applications from around the internet), all those systems are still stable and solid. Mine, in particular, hasn't been turned off, and only restarted due to some patching, and it's still stable and solid.
However, I do like the idea of a built-in reset, especially if you can use it to rid yourself of 'crapware' on a new system with minimal effort.
They prevent you from virtualizing OSX on anything other than OSX Server on Apple hardware.
Fuck. Them.
Apple does their best to prevent hackintoshes. They do have legal recourse against those they discover having hackintoshes, but I doubt they really care. They probably see hackintosh users as eventual customers - after all, they actually *like* OSX.
To each their own. I personally never bother to research my apps on android, I just check the permissions. If they ask for more than I think they need, I don't install. It's that dead simple. Personally, I'm not a fan of iOS, and even when it was the most up-to-date smartphone on the market (before android), I kept trying out the phones and they kept leaving me with a "meh." feeling. iOS is not aging well, either. Too simple, and the styling is rapidly becoming passe. There is a reason why Android has beaten it.
You probably should have gotten a Nexus. My N1 is still a strong phone despite being well over a year old. Unlike the 3GS, it was able to keep up with the latest version of android without a hitch (though it won't get Android 4, but that's understandable).
I'm not sure I agree on the true free market argument, I'm pretty sure the current PC industry is as close to a free market as you can get. The free market gave us open platforms. Yes, Apple obviously is working against that (while enjoying the profits it brings to them), but Apple is not a major player in terms of market share in the PC realm, and never will be.
The trend is clear: Android will do to Apple what MS did in the OS space. I actually am one of the lucky Google Nexus owners, just recently switch from an N1 to the GN. I'm quite impressed with Android 4. I'm finding the iOS interface is just not aging well at all on the iPad and iPhone I'm using for development. I see the appeal of what Apple offers (integration), but it come at far too high a price. Plus, I'm used to cobbling together my own solutions. I have a mix MS and Linux-based stuff working quite well together, thanks mostly to the efforts of the linux community.
Are you talking just in the mobile space? It seems to me that MS is doing just fine is OS and Office sales still, despite all that has been going on. All markets are growing - not only the tablet and phone markets (which will probably be owned by android), but the mobile PC market is still in a growth phase. The other surprising growth is actually in the custom-build PC market, so you see newegg, ncix, and other online component vendors trying to expand as fast as possible.
Conversely, plenty of people I know are sick of iPhone problems and Apple's clausterphobic walled garden, and are looking at the android superphones for replacements.
The reason is because they don't have the correct leadership. If they get someone with a similar disposition to Jobs in charge, you can bet he'll practically live at MS Research, and you'll see tons of amazing stuff get productized. The problem with MS is that monkey sitting on top of it.
Mp3 players are on borrowed time, IMO. Mobile phones can handle that function admirably. An iPod touch looks and works like an iPhone, minus the cell capabilities, so why bother unless it's for someone too young to have a cell phone?