You forgot one key fact: people are stupid. If you simply remember this, many things make sense without lots of complex logic and speculation (like you just posted).
Perhaps related to the first point, we should also remember that there is often one product or implementation of something that is seized upon and becomes synonymous with it, no matter if it's the "best" or anything like that. Cases in point: Microsoft Windows, Kleenex, and the Ipod. These things are near-synonymous with the ideas they represent.
Then we have the Playstation. This little system came out at the right time with the right elements to become near-synonymous with video games. My theory is that this "transcendence", if you will, occurs when the product/implementation offers something completely new while at the same time not sucking too much. These aren't the only criteria, because if they were then the Macintosh would've destroyed the PC, so perhaps another requirement is how (and by whom) the product is marketed.
The Playstation fits this category. It arrived just as 3D graphics and CD-based media were becoming viable for console video games. The N64 failed on this front, as cartridges couldn't hold near the amount of data that CDs do.
This is also a point in time in which I see a shift in the video game industry. In America, games had mostly been seen as toys for children. Whether or not the PS was the actual thing that changed this, it is certainly the most iconic representation of it. They started running ads in places like MTV, and if I remember correctly a lot of the early ads were humorous or violent, targeting the "male 18-34" category. AKA the demographic with lots of disposable income. Another factor may have been that the old companies were associated with a "kiddie" image, and Sony was NEW and HARDC0R3 (MS seems to be trying to reach the people who enjoy thinking this).
Oh and about the Saturn: the Saturn doesn't fit into this discussion very well because Sega was doing very well at screwing themselves. It wasn't hard for Sony or Nintendo to "beat" a company that was giving itself negative points.
Fast forward to today, and Sony is still riding the wave that started ten years ago. In my opinion, not a lot has changed. The PS brought about an era in which graphics and cinema-realism bullshit were put on a pedestal.
Personally, I think this era is ending. Moore's Law was very kind during '95-99 and '99-06, however I think we're reaching a breaking point. GPUs are powerful enough that a top-end one requires a very high-resolution display to enjoy. And as cool as HDTV is, it's still not here economically or content-wise (plus it's confusing as hell). Worse, what happens 10 or 15 years from now when GPUs need a screen better than 1920x1080p? The irony is that one of the techs Moore's law doesn't apply to is screen resolutions.
Personally, I also think this is the reason Nintendo stands to do well with the Wii. If the graphical arms race was really the best way to make money, Nintendo would be all over it (they like making money, it seems). The fact that they're going off in another direction completely kind of signals that something might be wrong.
Also, I think that radically changing the controller is a good way to spark developers' imaginations. The D-Pad was a huge improvement on the joystick/paddle. The same could be said for the analog stick and shoulder trigger. But a motion-sensing controller is really something we've never seen before, at least in a general-purpose home console. I laughed out loud when I saw a video of someone fishing in the Wii Zelda, and hopefully lots of other cool things like that will surface. Games could use an injection of new ideas.
Um yeah, so this post is way too long. I think I remember now why I stopped drinking caffeine. (caffeine + ADD = this post)
Dude, it is going to be a $600 purchase - that isn't baseless FUD
I think what the GP meant is that it's impossible to be an educated consumer regarding the PS3. There is so much spin that it's really hard to make any sort of informed choice. Let's look at the major players.
Sony's being arrogant, elitist cheerleaders. Of course, they're always this way, it's just that they usually don't say much after their systems launch. We were promised the stars before (PS2 will do Toy Story!!), so it's hard to know what claims are actually true. And it doesn't help that historically, Sony hardware at launch has been, uh, less than rock-solid. I really don't want to pay $600 for a Disc Read Error three years from now.
We could talk about Nintendo and MS, but there's really no point. Then we have everyone else, and this means retailers and "the media".
As for retailers, all I've heard beyond the "no preorders yet" line is blogs quoting anonymous Gamestop workers. Even assuming the facts relayed in this article are 100% true, the conclusions given are anything but logical. This guy somehow equates "regional manager won't tell me about PS3 yet" plus "Sony and Blueray didn't impress me at our show" to mean that the launch will be a disaster. The logic here is complete bullshit, ignoring any case where the conclusion fails. For example: maybe Sony doesn't really care about EBGamestopExpo that much? Or maybe the higher-ups in Gamestop don't want store managers getting incomplete or tentative information and passing it on to customers? I find it hard to believe that this guy doesn't remember the PS2 launch. Of course, there's a significant chance he/she is 17, so maybe I'm being optimistic on their brain capacity.
Then there's the media. I really have nothing to say here, save that any "analyst" who thinks a PS3 costs $900 to manufacture should be hanged on Wall St. as a warning to not be stupid.
Yeah, cause the retailers hate MS too now. Which is why they're praising the HD-DVD format over the relatively unprepared Blu-Ray showings.
Yeah dude, there's like dozens of news stories every week about how all retailers love HDDVD and hate Blueray. I wonder how anyone will be able to buy Blueray, I mean 'cuz all the retailers hate it so much there's no way in hell they'll stock it.
If consoles historically had their own intergrated monitor and company X made a killing off of selling a console that output to TV instead and then in response, Company Y also made a console outputting to the TV, then I would most certainly accuse Company Y of copying.
This makes sense, because your entire argument is fucking stupid. Human beings, like many other animals, imitate behaviors. Nature itself makes "copies" of stuff through reproduction. Pointing out how some corporation is doing something similar to another corporation by saying ZOMG COPYING is unnecessary and stupid. If some of the parties involved here were being deceitful, then maybe I'd support people that were ticked off about it. In this case, however, you just sound like a 7-year-old. Get over it.
As for Japanese developers, the number is certainly growing. Namco, makers of the Xenosaga series, is working on a 360 RPG called Eternal Sonata. From Software (published by Ubisoft), just released Enchanted Arms recently (which I'm playing through, and it's decent so far). And the big news is that Mistwalker Studios is making a number of exclusive titles for the 360, Blue Dragon and Lost Oddysey. And then you've got all your traditional Japanese developers (Capcom, Konami, and even Square-Enix) with a slew of other titles, although they're not RPGs.
So you have 4 Japanese RPGs. Congratulations. Also, I like how you sneak some extra companies in at the end to try and strengthen your argument. You almost had me. Except oh wait we're talking about RPGs.
If Blue Dragon was a 360 launch title in Japan, then you'd certainly have many more system owners than the pitiful number now.
This looks like a fact, yet something's missing. Oh yeah, any evidence.
My gut feel (sic) is that there will be a lot of disgruntled wanna-be PS3 owners, (sic) who didn't get a chance to buy the console. (Remember, it is in EXTREMELY short supply, especially in Japan) Many of them will opt for a Wii, although there are probably a number of Sakaguchi fans that will opt for a 360 just to check out his latest creation. (FYI, Sakaguchi = creator of Final Fantasy, head of Mistwalker Studios)
My gut feeling is that you're full of crap. Speculation is great, but it helps to have some evidence to back up your assertions. You have none.
Well, some games are designed to prevent this kind of stuff. I play Guild Wars (not a "real" MMO, but hey), and one thing I like is that you don't have to play hours and hours to get some uber-rare drop to get that extra 5% defense. The only real "scoreboard" consists of the top guilds in the world based on their rating from Guild vs. Guild battles. The neat thing is that it's pretty hard to powerlevel an event that requires close teamwork between 8 people.
This is unrelated to the above, but I think the main problem really boils down to respect. Based on my experience, many people will not respect others if given the chance. In the real world, there are consequences for being an asshole. Online, the consequences drop to almost nothing.
Yeah, right. Next you'll be saying that Microsoft "copied" other console makers with the Xbox because it outputs to a TV. Oh, and everybody is copying Ralph Baer because their game machines need electricity. Shit, he should sue somebody.
You have taught me a great lesson, sir. Anyone who uses an idea that has been thought of before is simply "copying". There's no possible way they could be inventive or smart, and they are obviously "worried" about their "competition". They never ever ever would add something for any other reason.
Why? Because all the nerds on the Internet are bitching and whining? Well, I have some news for ya: whiny bloggers do not reflect the opinion of the world at large. Unless there are some actual polls that suggest the average* gamer is pissed about the PS3, I refuse to buy into any of the FUD posted on slashdot every other day.
* By "average", I mean the average opinion of all people who buy video games. I don't mean "people who respond to polls from a video game magazine" or any other BS like that.
I think that a difference between the Xbox and the 360 is that this time around Microsoft is getting a lot of 3rd party support for RPGs for their system
Oblivion? Um yeah, Bethesda totally didn't support the Xbox. And Bioshock is super different from the type of games the Xbox gets already (not really). As for the Japanesse developers making RPGs for the 360, I would not call the support "a lot". Compared to the Xbox, maybe, but not compared to other systems.
Who do you think the police will be stopping more often? a. Fat, ugly, old women b. Attractive young women
Your point is good (and also creepy), but I think there's a more general case. It's probably this way in other places too, but in the US, law enforcement generally falls hardest on the lower classes.
For example, who's more likely to get convicted of drug offenses: an inner-city black man, or a rich white kid?
I have also spent at least $300 on the iTunes music store. My Daughters have purchased much more than that. Why would I want to buy another almost $300 music player and re-purchase all those tunes?
Sorry bud, but you (and your daughters) never "purchased" those songs. You simply entered into a contract where you get to listen to some encrypted audio files until the DRM or Apple decide to screw you over. There's somewhat of a difference.
So by your logic, learning to play an instrument means always playing the same physical instrument with the same physical accessories (strings, pick, bow, reed, etc). Seriously dude, if you can't logically separate one from the other, then yes, it will screw up your "real" playing. However, learning to overcome this will improve your "real" musicianship.
Slashdot Mirror
QT is about $3300 per seat, if you want to develop something you hold the rights too (sic)
Sorry about failing GPL 101. Next time try reading the license.
That should be read as "Sony will drop the price to Wal-Mart, or else."
Bear in mind that this is one of the very few [corporations] whose position on price really matters.
Do you honestly think that Wal-Mart can play this card? 400,000 units is not a lot, and I'm pretty sure other stores could sell those just fine.
You forgot one key fact: people are stupid. If you simply remember this, many things make sense without lots of complex logic and speculation (like you just posted).
Perhaps related to the first point, we should also remember that there is often one product or implementation of something that is seized upon and becomes synonymous with it, no matter if it's the "best" or anything like that. Cases in point: Microsoft Windows, Kleenex, and the Ipod. These things are near-synonymous with the ideas they represent.
Then we have the Playstation. This little system came out at the right time with the right elements to become near-synonymous with video games. My theory is that this "transcendence", if you will, occurs when the product/implementation offers something completely new while at the same time not sucking too much. These aren't the only criteria, because if they were then the Macintosh would've destroyed the PC, so perhaps another requirement is how (and by whom) the product is marketed.
The Playstation fits this category. It arrived just as 3D graphics and CD-based media were becoming viable for console video games. The N64 failed on this front, as cartridges couldn't hold near the amount of data that CDs do.
This is also a point in time in which I see a shift in the video game industry. In America, games had mostly been seen as toys for children. Whether or not the PS was the actual thing that changed this, it is certainly the most iconic representation of it. They started running ads in places like MTV, and if I remember correctly a lot of the early ads were humorous or violent, targeting the "male 18-34" category. AKA the demographic with lots of disposable income. Another factor may have been that the old companies were associated with a "kiddie" image, and Sony was NEW and HARDC0R3 (MS seems to be trying to reach the people who enjoy thinking this).
Oh and about the Saturn: the Saturn doesn't fit into this discussion very well because Sega was doing very well at screwing themselves. It wasn't hard for Sony or Nintendo to "beat" a company that was giving itself negative points.
Fast forward to today, and Sony is still riding the wave that started ten years ago. In my opinion, not a lot has changed. The PS brought about an era in which graphics and cinema-realism bullshit were put on a pedestal.
Personally, I think this era is ending. Moore's Law was very kind during '95-99 and '99-06, however I think we're reaching a breaking point. GPUs are powerful enough that a top-end one requires a very high-resolution display to enjoy. And as cool as HDTV is, it's still not here economically or content-wise (plus it's confusing as hell). Worse, what happens 10 or 15 years from now when GPUs need a screen better than 1920x1080p? The irony is that one of the techs Moore's law doesn't apply to is screen resolutions.
Personally, I also think this is the reason Nintendo stands to do well with the Wii. If the graphical arms race was really the best way to make money, Nintendo would be all over it (they like making money, it seems). The fact that they're going off in another direction completely kind of signals that something might be wrong.
Also, I think that radically changing the controller is a good way to spark developers' imaginations. The D-Pad was a huge improvement on the joystick/paddle. The same could be said for the analog stick and shoulder trigger. But a motion-sensing controller is really something we've never seen before, at least in a general-purpose home console. I laughed out loud when I saw a video of someone fishing in the Wii Zelda, and hopefully lots of other cool things like that will surface. Games could use an injection of new ideas.
Um yeah, so this post is way too long. I think I remember now why I stopped drinking caffeine. (caffeine + ADD = this post)
Dude, it is going to be a $600 purchase - that isn't baseless FUD
I think what the GP meant is that it's impossible to be an educated consumer regarding the PS3. There is so much spin that it's really hard to make any sort of informed choice. Let's look at the major players.
Sony's being arrogant, elitist cheerleaders. Of course, they're always this way, it's just that they usually don't say much after their systems launch. We were promised the stars before (PS2 will do Toy Story!!), so it's hard to know what claims are actually true. And it doesn't help that historically, Sony hardware at launch has been, uh, less than rock-solid. I really don't want to pay $600 for a Disc Read Error three years from now.
We could talk about Nintendo and MS, but there's really no point. Then we have everyone else, and this means retailers and "the media".
As for retailers, all I've heard beyond the "no preorders yet" line is blogs quoting anonymous Gamestop workers. Even assuming the facts relayed in this article are 100% true, the conclusions given are anything but logical. This guy somehow equates "regional manager won't tell me about PS3 yet" plus "Sony and Blueray didn't impress me at our show" to mean that the launch will be a disaster. The logic here is complete bullshit, ignoring any case where the conclusion fails. For example: maybe Sony doesn't really care about EBGamestopExpo that much? Or maybe the higher-ups in Gamestop don't want store managers getting incomplete or tentative information and passing it on to customers? I find it hard to believe that this guy doesn't remember the PS2 launch. Of course, there's a significant chance he/she is 17, so maybe I'm being optimistic on their brain capacity.
Then there's the media. I really have nothing to say here, save that any "analyst" who thinks a PS3 costs $900 to manufacture should be hanged on Wall St. as a warning to not be stupid.
Yeah, cause the retailers hate MS too now. Which is why they're praising the HD-DVD format over the relatively unprepared Blu-Ray showings.
Yeah dude, there's like dozens of news stories every week about how all retailers love HDDVD and hate Blueray. I wonder how anyone will be able to buy Blueray, I mean 'cuz all the retailers hate it so much there's no way in hell they'll stock it.
Thanks for all the references and links to back up your assertions. Oh wait.
Qt does not cost $3300 per seat. You can download it and use it for Free. Oh wait, you meant "proprietary licensing". Right.
Aanyway, maybe expensive because it's good? I haven't used it myself, but I've heard it's rather good stuff.
If consoles historically had their own intergrated monitor and company X made a killing off of selling a console that output to TV instead and then in response, Company Y also made a console outputting to the TV, then I would most certainly accuse Company Y of copying.
This makes sense, because your entire argument is fucking stupid. Human beings, like many other animals, imitate behaviors. Nature itself makes "copies" of stuff through reproduction. Pointing out how some corporation is doing something similar to another corporation by saying ZOMG COPYING is unnecessary and stupid. If some of the parties involved here were being deceitful, then maybe I'd support people that were ticked off about it. In this case, however, you just sound like a 7-year-old. Get over it.
Yeah, sure. Because uber-nerds are looked up to by all casual gamers, and listen to their every word. That's totally logical.
Bethesda is supporting MS and the Xbox. Morrowind came out for the Xbox
Um.
As for Japanese developers, the number is certainly growing. Namco, makers of the Xenosaga series, is working on a 360 RPG called Eternal Sonata. From Software (published by Ubisoft), just released Enchanted Arms recently (which I'm playing through, and it's decent so far). And the big news is that Mistwalker Studios is making a number of exclusive titles for the 360, Blue Dragon and Lost Oddysey. And then you've got all your traditional Japanese developers (Capcom, Konami, and even Square-Enix) with a slew of other titles, although they're not RPGs.
So you have 4 Japanese RPGs. Congratulations. Also, I like how you sneak some extra companies in at the end to try and strengthen your argument. You almost had me. Except oh wait we're talking about RPGs.
If Blue Dragon was a 360 launch title in Japan, then you'd certainly have many more system owners than the pitiful number now.
This looks like a fact, yet something's missing. Oh yeah, any evidence.
My gut feel (sic) is that there will be a lot of disgruntled wanna-be PS3 owners, (sic) who didn't get a chance to buy the console. (Remember, it is in EXTREMELY short supply, especially in Japan) Many of them will opt for a Wii, although there are probably a number of Sakaguchi fans that will opt for a 360 just to check out his latest creation. (FYI, Sakaguchi = creator of Final Fantasy, head of Mistwalker Studios)
My gut feeling is that you're full of crap. Speculation is great, but it helps to have some evidence to back up your assertions. You have none.
Well, some games are designed to prevent this kind of stuff. I play Guild Wars (not a "real" MMO, but hey), and one thing I like is that you don't have to play hours and hours to get some uber-rare drop to get that extra 5% defense. The only real "scoreboard" consists of the top guilds in the world based on their rating from Guild vs. Guild battles. The neat thing is that it's pretty hard to powerlevel an event that requires close teamwork between 8 people.
This is unrelated to the above, but I think the main problem really boils down to respect. Based on my experience, many people will not respect others if given the chance. In the real world, there are consequences for being an asshole. Online, the consequences drop to almost nothing.
Yeah, right. Next you'll be saying that Microsoft "copied" other console makers with the Xbox because it outputs to a TV. Oh, and everybody is copying Ralph Baer because their game machines need electricity. Shit, he should sue somebody.
You have taught me a great lesson, sir. Anyone who uses an idea that has been thought of before is simply "copying". There's no possible way they could be inventive or smart, and they are obviously "worried" about their "competition". They never ever ever would add something for any other reason.
Why? Because all the nerds on the Internet are bitching and whining? Well, I have some news for ya: whiny bloggers do not reflect the opinion of the world at large. Unless there are some actual polls that suggest the average* gamer is pissed about the PS3, I refuse to buy into any of the FUD posted on slashdot every other day.
* By "average", I mean the average opinion of all people who buy video games. I don't mean "people who respond to polls from a video game magazine" or any other BS like that.
I think that a difference between the Xbox and the 360 is that this time around Microsoft is getting a lot of 3rd party support for RPGs for their system
Oblivion? Um yeah, Bethesda totally didn't support the Xbox. And Bioshock is super different from the type of games the Xbox gets already (not really). As for the Japanesse developers making RPGs for the 360, I would not call the support "a lot". Compared to the Xbox, maybe, but not compared to other systems.
yeah, I was too lazy to look it up to make sure.
We have a paper trail.
Who do you think the police will be stopping more often?
a. Fat, ugly, old women
b. Attractive young women
Your point is good (and also creepy), but I think there's a more general case. It's probably this way in other places too, but in the US, law enforcement generally falls hardest on the lower classes.
For example, who's more likely to get convicted of drug offenses: an inner-city black man, or a rich white kid?
gzip is also more suitable for compressing streams
oh. i guess that's why they call it a "stream compressor"
I have also spent at least $300 on the iTunes music store. My Daughters have purchased much more than that. Why would I want to buy another almost $300 music player and re-purchase all those tunes?
Sorry bud, but you (and your daughters) never "purchased" those songs. You simply entered into a contract where you get to listen to some encrypted audio files until the DRM or Apple decide to screw you over. There's somewhat of a difference.
By your logic, your post here makes sense. Go back and read my post again, this time invoking comprehend().
Thanks for providing references for all your assertions. Oh wait.
Yay for not understanding software bundling and/or humor.
So by your logic, learning to play an instrument means always playing the same physical instrument with the same physical accessories (strings, pick, bow, reed, etc). Seriously dude, if you can't logically separate one from the other, then yes, it will screw up your "real" playing. However, learning to overcome this will improve your "real" musicianship.
It is really all about timing, not actual guitar skill.
Oh, see when I play "real" instruments, I'm always thinking about my timing. I guess I've been doing it wrong all these years...
I know how you feel. I love going to Klan rallies, but I never hurt black people.