£12bn for the initial work, (estimate only, so I guess it'll cost more over time), plus, worst still, running cost of around a billion per year!. So in dollars, that's (at todays exchange rate) about $18.75 Billion setup costs, and $1.57 Billion running cost, per year!
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/10/16/interception_modernisation_analysis/
And thats just stage one... wait until they decide that other departments can then start more data mining, on this initial data trawl and initial profiling.
If they change the name from Candidates to End Of Level Boss, then more console users are likely to vote in an election, to get their favourite End Of Level Boss.
"He's got something good going, I don't see why he should waste it by leaving."
I think in the acting world, they are now trying hard to avoid typecasting, so most of them try to leave before they have become mainly known for one role. Plus by leaving sooner than expected, they (hope to) leave on a career high, which they hope, will take them onto bigger projects. Only problem is, it often doesn't work like that, and their career just stalls. But for a few, they do go onto bigger things, but almost all actors dream of that big chance. But what usually happens, is their career move ends up more like the old saying, "the grass is greener on the other side". They think they are going onto something better, but end up with far less success. It happens a lot in acting.
I think he was a very good Doctor Who. But I just hope they don't make a catastrophic mistake and cast someone so out of place, just to be different to replace him. Given they cast Catherine (moans_all_the_irritating_time) Tate, then I think they could easily kill off the success of the show. I bet if it then fails, they will try to say (as usual), it was just time for the show to end, rather than simply being caused by extremely bad judgment, like they did with Catherine Tate.
Its clear from your comment, you have no real knowledge of power seeking. So while your getting your +1 & -1 mod points, you should also ask for a +1 & -1 Boiled Frog mod. Because some people can see how power games are played, and some like you, have not been burned enough yet, so fail to see how the power games are played. Try reading some history, then you will see how throughout history, knowledge is used to gain and maintain power. While your at it, you should also try read up on the connections between PR and how big business and governments have used that to great effect, over the past nearly a century. Here's a clue, the origional name for PR was Propaganda, but Public Relations sounds so much more friendly than Propaganda, so they call it PR, but it has the same goal, as its the same thing, just with a different name.
Many of the people who seek power are relentless power seekers. They are as obsessive about the need to gain power, as many programmers are obsessive about learning some new aspect of programming. While you may not know about the obsession for power, I would hope you can however relate to the intensity of obsession, to seek something they want.
OpenID also allows more easily data mining what someone says and does on different web sites, which is a dream come true, for all data miners.
So once most people start to use OpenID, then all governments have to do, is pass a law, to either requiring them to know your OpenID, or for them get your OpenID by any other means, and then that's all they need, to workout everything you have ever said online. OpenID is one step away from removing most anonymity on the Internet. This news fits in with the other Slashdot news today, about the Internet Human Rights PR smoke screen... http://it.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1011555&cid=25554573
Plus as people in power always seek power, then what they fear most, is the loss of power. So to them, finding out what people are saying is very important. (I.e. Knowledge is power). So one of the first things the some of the ones in power will do, is use widespead usage of OpenID to allow them to finding out every political view people post about them online.
To big businesses and governments, OpenID isn't about convience of easy logins. OpenID to them, is about data mining and so it makes sense Microsoft would want to play along with that goal.
"but on the other hand", as the title says, "Is it a sensible move for a venture capital firm that depends on a healthy Open Source community to lock it out?"... then this sounds very like playing into the hands of close source software marketing. Implying effectively, Close_Source==safe, Open_Source==unsafe.... But thats just playing to the Microsoft marketing style line. Open source is still open. Plus out of all open source projects, this is a rare event, so its not a reason to be scared off from open source projects. Plus its just as bad when close source changes direction, to maintain its position of lock in.
My first thought on hearing the headline, was at last. Something good? But yeah, reading the details, its just PR. But the more I think about it, the more its likely to be actually worse than just PR.
Without any legal teeth, this near useless agreement is simply to placate and blind the masses, into believing something is being done to maintain freedom and fairness. So if anything, as it stands, its worse than not having an agreement. Because now, every time something bad is added to Big Brother, they will wave this bit of paper and say something like... "but, everyone, we are thinking of all of you. Look we signed this agreement, to say we care."... Yeah, right, and its not for their own gain, that they data mine us all and then sell us all to their highest bidder, while silencing any attempt for any news organizations to speak out against them. But then how many of the news organizations are also playing along.
Since the start of the whole web 2.0 user generated content idea became popular, some people in power have said many times, how much they hate user generated content. But then, its no wonder they do hate it, as its likely the only way the full truth is getting out these days. Plus in countries like the UK, they want to create literally Big Brother to monitor everything that is said online. While Australia wants to censor the net.... Oh sorry Big Brother, should I have also said China was bad... yeah, they are bad, but listen to our media, they constantly point only at someone else, and then look away, when its Big Brother aimed at all of us.
No wonder some people in power want to monitor, control and even at times, silence user generated content. People may actually discuss political points of view, rather than be simply spoon feed points of view, by the large news organizations, like Rupert Murdoch's group.
"Clearly wrong. I don't even understand why you attempt this claim."
I find it interesting you don't understand my point. While specific rules are different in different jobs, most jobs, in most industries, are usually very similar variations of each other. I've lost count of the number of times, different employers have said to me, that a certain aspect of how the company works, is the standard way, for that industry. (Its an excuse of course, but that is all part of the negotiating game). For example, all games industry programmers, in whatever job they go to, do not get payed overtime. Also overtime is a very expected part of the rush to meet deadlines. Excuses are given like, programmer are payed more, as compensation for the overtime. But its a total industry wide lie. Programmers in the games industry, when there wages are divided by total hours worked, often end up on a similar hourly wages, as very unskilled jobs, even sometimes as bad as jobs like shelf stacker's in supermarkets. Of course, the bosses are simply saying no payed overtime, as they don't want to pay overtime. To the bosses its simply a negotiating strategy, to say no payed overtime in the industry. Plus the bosses then also say that anyone who leaves the games industry, is suffering burnout. Its not burnout at all, its simply they are wising up the nature of how they are getting exploited. But then for all the employees years of experience, they still struggle to earn a good living in a new industry. Even leaving one industry, to go into another industry doesn't totally remove the similarities between working conditions for employees, as all employers in every industry are playing similar games, to negotiate wages down for their benefit. This is why many industries (and not just programmers) suffer from working cultures that get called a corporate cult.
Here's the link about it. Its very worth while to read the peoples replies and comments about this book towards the end of the page. There comments gives a very interesting insight. These comments are from people's own employment experiences. Its far more common than most people realize... http://www.amazon.com/Corporate-Cults-Insidious-All-Consuming-Organization/dp/0814404936/
"Cost of living would not be the same for Person A and B."
Sorry that is fundamentally flawed thinking. Person A would like the same cost of living as person B. People have to survive. That costs money. Anything beyond basic survival is an extra. Everyone has the same basic survival needs. Any money beyond this is extra. Everyone would like more money, beyond basic cost of survival, but most do not earn much beyond basic cost of survival.
As for your talk on dividend reinvestment plans, that shows you know about investments. But the point is, most people do not know, as most people are afraid of gambling what little they have on the stock market. When you can only save 1k per year, then that 1k is very important. When you can save 10k per year, then risking 1k isn't such a massive blow, as they still have 9k saved. The fewer savings someone has, the more fearful they are of loosing what little they have managed to save. Most people do not risk it. But as you do understand these kinds of investments, then I suspect your income isn't so tight, that you would fully understand how fearful people can be, about what little savings they can collect together. Which would explain why you don't see such a problem, for people to break free of having little savings.
No, but I do watch with growing horror at every step towards a world where fairness and democracy are undermined my a minority for their own gain. Democracy needs to be defended so either speak up or let it get undermined. I've seen enough, so I choose to now comment on it.
But its very interesting you would take it upon yourself to put someone down, for speaking out against the increasing unfairness in the world.
Also there has been more moves towards a global totalitarian state in just 2008 than in any other year in human history. Not enough people spoke up against the rise of the Nazis and look how that turned out. The arragance and fear of a minority of power seekers is leading us into a world where they clamp down on anyone who opposes their point of view. They are beyond fault. They make mistakes like any other human, but if no one is allowed to say they have made a mistake, then the world is heading towards a horrifically biased and uncaring world.
Up until this year, I was not interested in politics, but the more news I see, the more concerned I'm getting at the world we are creating out of fear. If you find my words troubling, then you are sticking your head in the sand and closing your mind to the way the world is going. Just trusting every action of the ones in power, will not result in a fair world. Their corrupt power seeking has been shown to be corrupting throughout history. So they need feedback so they can see where they are causing pain and suffering towards others, as these people have shown thoughout history they are more interested in improving their own position of power, than they are in considering the lives and suffering of the ones they push down, as they seek to gain ever more power over others.
The more they push down, the more who will speak out against the growing unfairness. A few of the current governments (UK and US) have now shown themselves to be morally corrupt. Its time to vote them out, before their growing corruption causes anymore suffering. In a democracy, we have the right to freely say what we think. We have the right to avoid pressure and manipulation designed to silence our point of view. We are suppose to democratic. We cannot be democratic, if we throw away democracy and replace it with a dictatorship. The Universal Declaration of Human Rights was created to stop this kind of behaviour. Its not my words, its their words... http://www.un.org/Overview/rights.html
"Remember, a tiger can't quit and leave the cage. We can."
I see what you are saying, but I would say that although we can leave one cage, we still must find another cage, as we don't have the money to live without a zoo cage. (Plus most cages have similar 9-5 etc.. rules). So in this sense, the cage is real, due to the need for money to survive. Which giving people with money (we need) the power to dictate rules to us.
When we are in a zoo cage, while we can choose how to solve (some/most) problems, the problems we are asked to solve and assigned are often defined by the ones with power over us/ We simply fix problems to be paid. True freedom would be that we choose the problems we wish to solve. Often in some jobs, we are not even free to solve some problems in certain ways. So while we can gain some fun from jobs, its not the same as true freedom to solve problems. That we can do, in our spare time (if we have any).
I wonder what the world would be like if everyone didn't need to work (ie. didn't need money and food/housing etc.. resources were provided to everyone). So everyone was free to be as creative as they wished (within the limits of the outer social cage). I suspect there would be a lot more open collaboration, as nothing would be hidden in the name of profit. Unfortunately I suspect the people who like power over other people, would not want such a world, as they would simply be one of the group and no longer of any extra importance than anyone else. I suspect they would always work to prevent such an open world ever completely existing, even if we could ever have such a world. They would sell the control to us, on the basis of fear (fear of people free to think and do creative things), but that fear would ultimately be driven by their need to maintain control.
I'm not sure it would be a perceived cage. I think its more that there are cages of different sizes, some with different standards of living in the cages. If you live in a good zoo, then it could be a very nice cage. But even some apparently good cages, can often turn out to be Corporate Cults, (I've worked in a few of these, unfortunately just like a lot of programmers over the years). http://www.amazon.com/Corporate-Cults-Insidious-All-Consuming-Organization/dp/0814404936
I think all societies requires an overall cage for everyone. We all must live within its boundaries and the edges of this overall cage, defines what society considers its outer accepted boundaries. But there are also nested cages within cages. These nested cages are created by some people with power over us. Our zoo keeper bosses. These zoo cages, seek to confine us to other more restricted cage boundaries. Which are for the gain of the zoo keepers and are the rules which maintainance power over us. There are some people who seek to gain power over us and not just governments. Some bosses also seek the power to dictate boundaries of accepted behaviour. This can make some cages unhappy places to be in. Unfortunately as most of us need to earn money, then we have to sit quitely in some zoo cage, otherwise our current zoo keep will throw us out and get a new zoo exibit. But then we can leave one zoo and go to another zoo. But most of us still need to live in zoos, but we can still dream of the day, we can run free from the need for any zoos.:)
"After a while you would become depressed because your money is the wrong color. man have simply not evolved to be happy. depression is clearly not a new fad. People hated their jobs in the 12th century and still do."
An alternative interpretation would be, a job acts like a cage (retricting what you can think and do) and a caged animal feels depression, at lack of freedom. So its not that people are or are not evolved to be happy, its that people are not evolved to be caged in a job.
Sounds like its time you found a new cage!:)... while its still a cage, the new surroundings may make it feel like a better cage.... that is, until you can find a way to live without the need of a cage... I'm still looking for the answer to that one, like most people.:)
I find this discussion yet annother interesting insight into the (lack of) ethics of some company bosses. I've often found to my surprise, the ethics of sales people, marketing people and bosses are at times very different from that of programmers and other workers in a company. Some time ago Slashdot discussed "Ethics in IT" and its interesting how it fits with this discussion. Here's the link, it gets interesting how much it fits this discussion, once you get to the part that discusses how some bosses lack of empathy towards others... http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=448546&cid=22377570
Some bosses have contempt for other people, so considering doing this kind unethical business behaviour, is well within their usual thinking.
"The other problem is that, once you put the mechanisms in place that endanger freedom and privacy, they will be misused."
Sadly that's very true. Unfortunately the lessons of history have not been learned by enough people. Looks like the world is seeking to repeat the mistakes of the past. Freedom and democracy are constantly undermined by a minority of people in power for their own gain. Its just a matter of time and how far we are going to let them all game the system, to push the excesses ever more unfairly in their favour. After all, its not as if they are robbing hundreds of billions of tax payers money to keep their rich lifestyles while millions risk loosing everything.
People who seek power over others, therefore seek information to gain power over others. Its been happening for centuries, in every country. Over the past few decades its become known as "Opposition Research". Here's just a short example of how government after government, in the US from the 1940s, used "Opposition Research" to seek ways to manipulate people. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opposition_research#Opposition_research_conducted_from_the_White_House
Manipulating people (and so finding ways to apply pressure over people) is simply part of the game, when someone is seeking to gain power over someone else.
This is why total Big Brother information control is so dangerous. Its going to allow the people in power to automate ways to profile opponents and then allow them to automate ways to make life difficult for the groups which oppose the point of view of the group in power. This is why centuries ago votes were made in secret, to prevent the ones in power, from seeking to influence the voters. Yet the power seekers are forever seeking to game the system to gain ever more information on peoples opinions. Now the ones in power are building automated systems to influence people. Throughout history its been shown time and time again that the ones in power become ever more corrupt over time without any feedback on how they are behaving. Its been show so many times through history.
"Blogs shift power from broadcasters to individuals"... yes thats good, but advertisers are also using misinformation on blogs, to create so called Flogs. So how many popular blogs are really Flogs?... However many it is, they are definately trying to game the system, to get popular blogs which are really just flogs.
Advertising + Blogs + advertisers_with_no_ethics = Flogs http://adage.com/smallagency/post?article_id=113945
e.g. "Sony and agency Zipatoni have come under fire for one of their marketing tactics for the Sony PSP. Sony has added its name to a growing list of flogs [fake blogs] including McDonald's, WalMart and Lonely Girl 15, that are being called out by consumers. This isn't the first time Sony has been caught and questioned about the ethics of its marketing practices."
"For it to function you'd have to have cooperation with ALL governments around the world"
Cooperation isn't required. All they need is common ground to allow common ideas through. The common ideas are what is best for people in power and how to maintain power over the people they rule over.
All governments around the world have hierarchical power structures. People who go into political power seek power over other people, in other words, they seek to dictate terms to other people. Seeking to dictate terms to someone else means they seek to push others down below them, so they are in the position of power. The political process acts like a process of natural selection, selecting the most driven power seekers, who seek dominance over others.
Therefore on this basis, the ones in power in each country have in common the desire to seek to maintain control over their people. They do not want their people to threaten their position of power. This means bring in ways to monitor and censor any threat to their power. The people in power seek this, as a good thing, as they see their own actions as good and in their best interests.
This is why moves towards Big Brother are happening across the world, now they are gaining the technology they need, to maintain power. But then each generation of power seekers, have always sought power over people. Its just now they have the technology to do it. But the point is, that desire for power over others, has always been there, with a minority of people seeking to control the majority. In hindsight, this is why George Orwell was able to predict this kind of behaviour. Because what he was describing was human nature and not simply technology. Its not about technology, its about Psychology. No matter how technology evolves and changes, the desire to maintain power will always be there, for a minority of people, who go into a career of seeking power over others. (Either seeking political power, or if they fail at that, they go into Big Business and seek high positions of power in that area instead).
This is why cooperation isn't required. They already have common ground to seek power over others and simply need to bring in technology and ways to allow them to more easily maintain power. Any attempt to tell them they are wrong, is interpreted by them as wrong and they then label it as near terrorist like behaviour. Ironically terrorists are themselves power seekers. They seek to dominate all with their views.
But is this a Dystopia or a Utopia?... what's even more disturbing, is that a world which is free and equal is a Dystopia to people who seek power over others. They seek more power than others. They seek more money than others. They seek to be the centre of attention. So a world which is free and equal is a dystopia to the ones who seek power and their Utopia is Big Brother where they are the ones in control of Big Brother.
Its interesting how one person's Dystopia is another person's Utopia... Sadly it explains why the world is so unfair for everyone. No one will get a total utopia or a total dystopia, as the other side will not allow it. But while the people who seek power are the minority in society, (and they are put in power by the majority), this minority is now gaining the upper hand through technology, used to push the world towards their Utopia. This is why democracy is always under threat of being undermined. I had thought that as my ancestors and people like them had fought so long and hard to finally win Democracy. Then surely as we now have Democracy, we therefore much now just keep Democracy. I didn't realize there are people constantly trying to undermine Democracy for their own gain and so over time, Democracy has to be constantly defended against these people. The people trying to undermine Democracy for their own gain are almost by definition people without empathy towards others. They actually choose to violate Democracy for their own gain.
I don't know about free. Anything but free. This is government admiting they expect widespread monitoring of communications. For example, in the case of the UK, that means all business data will be scanned along with peoples emails, so it makes sense that governments and companies with international offices, are going to be worried their internal email documents are going to be intercepted.
"Coherent arguments against filtering also greatly welcome."
I would start with Article 12 from this... http://www.un.org/Overview/rights.html
i.e. "Article 12 : No one shall be subjected to arbitrary interference with his privacy, family, home or correspondence, nor to attacks upon his honour and reputation. Everyone has the right to the protection of the law against such interference or attacks."
Its interesting how so called free countries are rushing towards censorship, control and out right Big Brother, faster than so called bad countries. The power seekers in each country seem to be treating technology as their dream come true. They can use it to fight for powers previous generations of power seeking leaders couldn't have dreamed possible.
I don't need a spliff. Thats clearly your thought, so I'll leave that to you, to help you cope with your thoughts. But then suppression of thoughts never lasts. Eventually the truth breaks through, no matter how hard you try to suppress it. So no matter how hard you try to hide from the truth and laugh it off, it always gets found and learned in the end. But then you already know that.
"What a load of vague, existential rubbish."
That totally sums up your own post. Your flawed argument, is so weak and vague, its laughable.
Its a fact that some people do seek power other others. Its a fact that some people seek more attention than others. Its a fact there are reoccurring patterns of behaviour in human nature. Its a fact that Cluster B disorders do exist. HPD and NPD are recognised behaviour patterns. Learn about them or close your mind to them. Be a fool if you wish, as you'll only have yourself to blame, in the long run, if you choose to remain so close minded. Or try learning about Cluster B disorders and history before you stick your head in the sand and say nothing is happening. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Histrionic_personality_disorder http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissistic_personality_disorder
Some of the ones who seek power, choose to undermine democracy for their own gain. Almost by definition they are choosing to show a lack of empathy to others. That is why democracy and freedom need to be defended. If nothing is happening, then what do you call the Slashdot news article today about monitoring all communications?. If this was 50 years ago, people would have been utterly shocked at this news. Now we are suppose to just accept it?... Past power seekers could never have dreamed of having this kind of power, yet we are suppose to just trust the current power seekers, when they have already shown they will abuse the law. They even used anti-terror laws against Iceland. Iceland are not terrorists. They have shown how they will abuse the law, even the laws they write!... yet you want us to just keep trusting them, as they grab ever more power?!
"1. Everyone in power is corrupt and has a disorder that caused them to get there."
No, not all people in power, but there is a disproportionate amount of them, that seek higher levels of power. Politics acts a natural selection process, acting on the ones seeking to fight for power over others.
"2. We can never trust those in power because to get there they had to have this disorder and became corrupt as a part of the process."
No, but many of them do bias power in their favor at the expense of fairness. The process of seeking power over someone else, in other words, the power to dictate terms to someone else, means that person seeks to push others lower than them.
You show very extreme thinking. Taking things to extremes and then thinking the extreme must be wrong. Its not so extreme. Its far more subtle.
"Where do you people come from? I'll tell me what makes me sick. It's the people like yourself who see ghosts around every corner"
Its blind fools like you, who let these people get away with it all, for so long that, when its finally bad enough for even you to see, then by that time, its too late to stop them. The harm by then, is already done. Try reading some history, if you fail to see the nature of power seeking. I can assure you many of the most successful politicians definitely study political history. They study for years to learn how to gain power and influence over others.
"Face the facts, there will always be corruption and abuse of power. But there will ALSO always be those who don't, or simply through checks and balances mitigate the abuse of power."
Yes there will always be corruption and abuse of power. Thats why people need to defend democracy and stop these people undermining it for their own gain. Also who writes the laws?... they do. The ones who seek power, generation after generation make the laws and decide what we consider right and wrong... in law. They make the laws and choose which laws to change.
"As a people it's our responsibility to speak out (wow amazing that you can even post like this in such a corrupt abusive country isn't it?)"
We can post now, yes. But not in the future, the way its heading, not without repercussions. Freedom and democracy are getting undermined almost continously these days.
"imaginary vast conspiracies"
Be a fool, you'll only have yourself to blame, in the long run. Or try learning about Cluster B disorders and history before you stick your head in the sand and say nothings is happening. If nothing is happening, then what do you call this Slashdot news article?. If this was 50 years ago, people would have been utterly shocked at this news. Now we are suppose to just accept it?... Past power seekers could never have dreamed of having this kind of power, yet we are suppose to just trust the current power seekers, when they have already shown they will abuse the law. They even used anti-terror laws against Iceland. Iceland are not terrorists. They have shown how they will abuse the law, even the laws they write!... yet you want us to just keep trusting them, as they grab ever more power?!
I fear the world we are heading towards. I know just how much contempt and harm Cluster B Personality Disorders are capable of inflicting on others, as they seek to dominate. Unfortunately most people don't understand Personality Disorders, even though everyone one of us meets people with these disorders many times and suffer the consequences. Some Cluster B Personality Disorders are very dangerous people. The thought that they will gain so much power, that no one can tell them they are wrong, for fear of repercussions, is a very frightening thought.
Terrorists are themselves power seekers. They also seek to dominate. Look how far they are prepared to go, to get their views becoming the most dominate in the world. Most of us who don't seek power, are caught up in this power struggle, just as people like us have been harmed throughout history, as the ones who seek power, seek to be the ones who lead everyone.
I've never been interested in politics until really this year, but the changes I've seen even this year have shown me, if we fail to make a stand soon against the power seekers, then we will never be able to make a stand against them again, because in a few years, all forms of communications are going to be monitored and they will use it to control us all.
p.s. if you don't want read that, then here's one bit of it...
"Most people don't realize the game people in power are playing. People in power are not so interested in individuals. The ones in power are interested in adding everyone to different lists so they can then control and profiling groups of people, so they can then use divide and conquer tactics, to break groups of people up. The goal is that the fragmented groups cannot then stand and oppose the point of view of the ones in power. That is why they data mine. The lessons of history have not been learned by enough people. Looks like the world is seeking to repeat the mistakes of the past. Freedom and democracy are constantly undermined by a minority of people in power for their own gain. Its just a matter of time and how far we are going to let them all game the system to push the excesses ever more unfairly in their favor."
Slashdot Mirror
"How much will this cost in cash terms anyway?"
£12bn for the initial work, (estimate only, so I guess it'll cost more over time), plus, worst still, running cost of around a billion per year!. So in dollars, that's (at todays exchange rate) about $18.75 Billion setup costs, and $1.57 Billion running cost, per year! http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/10/16/interception_modernisation_analysis/
And thats just stage one... wait until they decide that other departments can then start more data mining, on this initial data trawl and initial profiling.
If they change the name from Candidates to End Of Level Boss, then more console users are likely to vote in an election, to get their favourite End Of Level Boss.
"He's got something good going, I don't see why he should waste it by leaving."
I think in the acting world, they are now trying hard to avoid typecasting, so most of them try to leave before they have become mainly known for one role. Plus by leaving sooner than expected, they (hope to) leave on a career high, which they hope, will take them onto bigger projects. Only problem is, it often doesn't work like that, and their career just stalls. But for a few, they do go onto bigger things, but almost all actors dream of that big chance. But what usually happens, is their career move ends up more like the old saying, "the grass is greener on the other side". They think they are going onto something better, but end up with far less success. It happens a lot in acting.
I think he was a very good Doctor Who. But I just hope they don't make a catastrophic mistake and cast someone so out of place, just to be different to replace him. Given they cast Catherine (moans_all_the_irritating_time) Tate, then I think they could easily kill off the success of the show. I bet if it then fails, they will try to say (as usual), it was just time for the show to end, rather than simply being caused by extremely bad judgment, like they did with Catherine Tate.
"Can we get +1 and -1 Paranoid mods"
Its clear from your comment, you have no real knowledge of power seeking. So while your getting your +1 & -1 mod points, you should also ask for a +1 & -1 Boiled Frog mod. Because some people can see how power games are played, and some like you, have not been burned enough yet, so fail to see how the power games are played. Try reading some history, then you will see how throughout history, knowledge is used to gain and maintain power. While your at it, you should also try read up on the connections between PR and how big business and governments have used that to great effect, over the past nearly a century. Here's a clue, the origional name for PR was Propaganda, but Public Relations sounds so much more friendly than Propaganda, so they call it PR, but it has the same goal, as its the same thing, just with a different name.
Many of the people who seek power are relentless power seekers. They are as obsessive about the need to gain power, as many programmers are obsessive about learning some new aspect of programming. While you may not know about the obsession for power, I would hope you can however relate to the intensity of obsession, to seek something they want.
OpenID also allows more easily data mining what someone says and does on different web sites, which is a dream come true, for all data miners.
So once most people start to use OpenID, then all governments have to do, is pass a law, to either requiring them to know your OpenID, or for them get your OpenID by any other means, and then that's all they need, to workout everything you have ever said online. OpenID is one step away from removing most anonymity on the Internet. This news fits in with the other Slashdot news today, about the Internet Human Rights PR smoke screen...
http://it.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1011555&cid=25554573
Plus as people in power always seek power, then what they fear most, is the loss of power. So to them, finding out what people are saying is very important. (I.e. Knowledge is power). So one of the first things the some of the ones in power will do, is use widespead usage of OpenID to allow them to finding out every political view people post about them online.
To big businesses and governments, OpenID isn't about convience of easy logins. OpenID to them, is about data mining and so it makes sense Microsoft would want to play along with that goal.
"but on the other hand", as the title says, "Is it a sensible move for a venture capital firm that depends on a healthy Open Source community to lock it out?" ... then this sounds very like playing into the hands of close source software marketing. Implying effectively, Close_Source==safe, Open_Source==unsafe.... But thats just playing to the Microsoft marketing style line. Open source is still open. Plus out of all open source projects, this is a rare event, so its not a reason to be scared off from open source projects. Plus its just as bad when close source changes direction, to maintain its position of lock in.
"I think we all now what this agreement is: PR "
... Yeah, right, and its not for their own gain, that they data mine us all and then sell us all to their highest bidder, while silencing any attempt for any news organizations to speak out against them. But then how many of the news organizations are also playing along.
... Oh sorry Big Brother, should I have also said China was bad... yeah, they are bad, but listen to our media, they constantly point only at someone else, and then look away, when its Big Brother aimed at all of us.
My first thought on hearing the headline, was at last. Something good? But yeah, reading the details, its just PR. But the more I think about it, the more its likely to be actually worse than just PR.
Without any legal teeth, this near useless agreement is simply to placate and blind the masses, into believing something is being done to maintain freedom and fairness. So if anything, as it stands, its worse than not having an agreement. Because now, every time something bad is added to Big Brother, they will wave this bit of paper and say something like... "but, everyone, we are thinking of all of you. Look we signed this agreement, to say we care."
Since the start of the whole web 2.0 user generated content idea became popular, some people in power have said many times, how much they hate user generated content. But then, its no wonder they do hate it, as its likely the only way the full truth is getting out these days. Plus in countries like the UK, they want to create literally Big Brother to monitor everything that is said online. While Australia wants to censor the net.
No wonder some people in power want to monitor, control and even at times, silence user generated content. People may actually discuss political points of view, rather than be simply spoon feed points of view, by the large news organizations, like Rupert Murdoch's group.
"Clearly wrong. I don't even understand why you attempt this claim."
I find it interesting you don't understand my point. While specific rules are different in different jobs, most jobs, in most industries, are usually very similar variations of each other. I've lost count of the number of times, different employers have said to me, that a certain aspect of how the company works, is the standard way, for that industry. (Its an excuse of course, but that is all part of the negotiating game). For example, all games industry programmers, in whatever job they go to, do not get payed overtime. Also overtime is a very expected part of the rush to meet deadlines. Excuses are given like, programmer are payed more, as compensation for the overtime. But its a total industry wide lie. Programmers in the games industry, when there wages are divided by total hours worked, often end up on a similar hourly wages, as very unskilled jobs, even sometimes as bad as jobs like shelf stacker's in supermarkets. Of course, the bosses are simply saying no payed overtime, as they don't want to pay overtime. To the bosses its simply a negotiating strategy, to say no payed overtime in the industry. Plus the bosses then also say that anyone who leaves the games industry, is suffering burnout. Its not burnout at all, its simply they are wising up the nature of how they are getting exploited. But then for all the employees years of experience, they still struggle to earn a good living in a new industry. Even leaving one industry, to go into another industry doesn't totally remove the similarities between working conditions for employees, as all employers in every industry are playing similar games, to negotiate wages down for their benefit. This is why many industries (and not just programmers) suffer from working cultures that get called a corporate cult.
Here's the link about it. Its very worth while to read the peoples replies and comments about this book towards the end of the page. There comments gives a very interesting insight. These comments are from people's own employment experiences. Its far more common than most people realize...
http://www.amazon.com/Corporate-Cults-Insidious-All-Consuming-Organization/dp/0814404936/
"Cost of living would not be the same for Person A and B."
Sorry that is fundamentally flawed thinking. Person A would like the same cost of living as person B. People have to survive. That costs money. Anything beyond basic survival is an extra. Everyone has the same basic survival needs. Any money beyond this is extra. Everyone would like more money, beyond basic cost of survival, but most do not earn much beyond basic cost of survival.
As for your talk on dividend reinvestment plans, that shows you know about investments. But the point is, most people do not know, as most people are afraid of gambling what little they have on the stock market. When you can only save 1k per year, then that 1k is very important. When you can save 10k per year, then risking 1k isn't such a massive blow, as they still have 9k saved. The fewer savings someone has, the more fearful they are of loosing what little they have managed to save. Most people do not risk it. But as you do understand these kinds of investments, then I suspect your income isn't so tight, that you would fully understand how fearful people can be, about what little savings they can collect together. Which would explain why you don't see such a problem, for people to break free of having little savings.
No, but I do watch with growing horror at every step towards a world where fairness and democracy are undermined my a minority for their own gain. Democracy needs to be defended so either speak up or let it get undermined. I've seen enough, so I choose to now comment on it.
But its very interesting you would take it upon yourself to put someone down, for speaking out against the increasing unfairness in the world.
Also there has been more moves towards a global totalitarian state in just 2008 than in any other year in human history. Not enough people spoke up against the rise of the Nazis and look how that turned out. The arragance and fear of a minority of power seekers is leading us into a world where they clamp down on anyone who opposes their point of view. They are beyond fault. They make mistakes like any other human, but if no one is allowed to say they have made a mistake, then the world is heading towards a horrifically biased and uncaring world.
Up until this year, I was not interested in politics, but the more news I see, the more concerned I'm getting at the world we are creating out of fear. If you find my words troubling, then you are sticking your head in the sand and closing your mind to the way the world is going. Just trusting every action of the ones in power, will not result in a fair world. Their corrupt power seeking has been shown to be corrupting throughout history. So they need feedback so they can see where they are causing pain and suffering towards others, as these people have shown thoughout history they are more interested in improving their own position of power, than they are in considering the lives and suffering of the ones they push down, as they seek to gain ever more power over others.
The more they push down, the more who will speak out against the growing unfairness. A few of the current governments (UK and US) have now shown themselves to be morally corrupt. Its time to vote them out, before their growing corruption causes anymore suffering. In a democracy, we have the right to freely say what we think. We have the right to avoid pressure and manipulation designed to silence our point of view. We are suppose to democratic. We cannot be democratic, if we throw away democracy and replace it with a dictatorship. The Universal Declaration of Human Rights was created to stop this kind of behaviour. Its not my words, its their words...
http://www.un.org/Overview/rights.html
"Remember, a tiger can't quit and leave the cage. We can."
I see what you are saying, but I would say that although we can leave one cage, we still must find another cage, as we don't have the money to live without a zoo cage. (Plus most cages have similar 9-5 etc.. rules). So in this sense, the cage is real, due to the need for money to survive. Which giving people with money (we need) the power to dictate rules to us.
When we are in a zoo cage, while we can choose how to solve (some/most) problems, the problems we are asked to solve and assigned are often defined by the ones with power over us/ We simply fix problems to be paid. True freedom would be that we choose the problems we wish to solve. Often in some jobs, we are not even free to solve some problems in certain ways. So while we can gain some fun from jobs, its not the same as true freedom to solve problems. That we can do, in our spare time (if we have any).
I wonder what the world would be like if everyone didn't need to work (ie. didn't need money and food/housing etc.. resources were provided to everyone). So everyone was free to be as creative as they wished (within the limits of the outer social cage). I suspect there would be a lot more open collaboration, as nothing would be hidden in the name of profit. Unfortunately I suspect the people who like power over other people, would not want such a world, as they would simply be one of the group and no longer of any extra importance than anyone else. I suspect they would always work to prevent such an open world ever completely existing, even if we could ever have such a world. They would sell the control to us, on the basis of fear (fear of people free to think and do creative things), but that fear would ultimately be driven by their need to maintain control.
I'm not sure it would be a perceived cage. I think its more that there are cages of different sizes, some with different standards of living in the cages. If you live in a good zoo, then it could be a very nice cage. But even some apparently good cages, can often turn out to be Corporate Cults, (I've worked in a few of these, unfortunately just like a lot of programmers over the years).
:)
http://www.amazon.com/Corporate-Cults-Insidious-All-Consuming-Organization/dp/0814404936
I think all societies requires an overall cage for everyone. We all must live within its boundaries and the edges of this overall cage, defines what society considers its outer accepted boundaries. But there are also nested cages within cages. These nested cages are created by some people with power over us. Our zoo keeper bosses. These zoo cages, seek to confine us to other more restricted cage boundaries. Which are for the gain of the zoo keepers and are the rules which maintainance power over us. There are some people who seek to gain power over us and not just governments. Some bosses also seek the power to dictate boundaries of accepted behaviour. This can make some cages unhappy places to be in. Unfortunately as most of us need to earn money, then we have to sit quitely in some zoo cage, otherwise our current zoo keep will throw us out and get a new zoo exibit. But then we can leave one zoo and go to another zoo. But most of us still need to live in zoos, but we can still dream of the day, we can run free from the need for any zoos.
"After a while you would become depressed because your money is the wrong color. man have simply not evolved to be happy. depression is clearly not a new fad. People hated their jobs in the 12th century and still do."
:) ... while its still a cage, the new surroundings may make it feel like a better cage.... that is, until you can find a way to live without the need of a cage... I'm still looking for the answer to that one, like most people. :)
An alternative interpretation would be, a job acts like a cage (retricting what you can think and do) and a caged animal feels depression, at lack of freedom. So its not that people are or are not evolved to be happy, its that people are not evolved to be caged in a job.
Sounds like its time you found a new cage!
"It's just not good for business."
I find this discussion yet annother interesting insight into the (lack of) ethics of some company bosses. I've often found to my surprise, the ethics of sales people, marketing people and bosses are at times very different from that of programmers and other workers in a company. Some time ago Slashdot discussed "Ethics in IT" and its interesting how it fits with this discussion. Here's the link, it gets interesting how much it fits this discussion, once you get to the part that discusses how some bosses lack of empathy towards others...
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=448546&cid=22377570
Some bosses have contempt for other people, so considering doing this kind unethical business behaviour, is well within their usual thinking.
"The other problem is that, once you put the mechanisms in place that endanger freedom and privacy, they will be misused."
Sadly that's very true. Unfortunately the lessons of history have not been learned by enough people. Looks like the world is seeking to repeat the mistakes of the past. Freedom and democracy are constantly undermined by a minority of people in power for their own gain. Its just a matter of time and how far we are going to let them all game the system, to push the excesses ever more unfairly in their favour. After all, its not as if they are robbing hundreds of billions of tax payers money to keep their rich lifestyles while millions risk loosing everything.
People who seek power over others, therefore seek information to gain power over others. Its been happening for centuries, in every country. Over the past few decades its become known as "Opposition Research". Here's just a short example of how government after government, in the US from the 1940s, used "Opposition Research" to seek ways to manipulate people.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opposition_research#Opposition_research_conducted_from_the_White_House
Manipulating people (and so finding ways to apply pressure over people) is simply part of the game, when someone is seeking to gain power over someone else.
This is why total Big Brother information control is so dangerous. Its going to allow the people in power to automate ways to profile opponents and then allow them to automate ways to make life difficult for the groups which oppose the point of view of the group in power. This is why centuries ago votes were made in secret, to prevent the ones in power, from seeking to influence the voters. Yet the power seekers are forever seeking to game the system to gain ever more information on peoples opinions. Now the ones in power are building automated systems to influence people. Throughout history its been shown time and time again that the ones in power become ever more corrupt over time without any feedback on how they are behaving. Its been show so many times through history.
Scanning: "Where is the "+1 Really Scary" mod when you need it"
[Ministry of Truth Infosearch Webbot Alert]
1. Status: Online comment profile indicates political decent.
2. Reaction: Ministry of Love drugs appear to be ineffective.
3. ???
4. Newspeak: Your comment has been reported to the Thought Police and Room 101 is being prepared from your arrival.
"Blogs shift power from broadcasters to individuals"... yes thats good, but advertisers are also using misinformation on blogs, to create so called Flogs. So how many popular blogs are really Flogs? ... However many it is, they are definately trying to game the system, to get popular blogs which are really just flogs.
Advertising + Blogs + advertisers_with_no_ethics = Flogs
http://adage.com/smallagency/post?article_id=113945
e.g. "Sony and agency Zipatoni have come under fire for one of their marketing tactics for the Sony PSP. Sony has added its name to a growing list of flogs [fake blogs] including McDonald's, WalMart and Lonely Girl 15, that are being called out by consumers. This isn't the first time Sony has been caught and questioned about the ethics of its marketing practices."
"like unlocking car doors with a tennis ball".
Its much easier with a cricket ball. Just use it to break the window.
"For it to function you'd have to have cooperation with ALL governments around the world"
... what's even more disturbing, is that a world which is free and equal is a Dystopia to people who seek power over others. They seek more power than others. They seek more money than others. They seek to be the centre of attention. So a world which is free and equal is a dystopia to the ones who seek power and their Utopia is Big Brother where they are the ones in control of Big Brother.
Cooperation isn't required. All they need is common ground to allow common ideas through. The common ideas are what is best for people in power and how to maintain power over the people they rule over.
All governments around the world have hierarchical power structures. People who go into political power seek power over other people, in other words, they seek to dictate terms to other people. Seeking to dictate terms to someone else means they seek to push others down below them, so they are in the position of power. The political process acts like a process of natural selection, selecting the most driven power seekers, who seek dominance over others.
Therefore on this basis, the ones in power in each country have in common the desire to seek to maintain control over their people. They do not want their people to threaten their position of power. This means bring in ways to monitor and censor any threat to their power. The people in power seek this, as a good thing, as they see their own actions as good and in their best interests.
This is why moves towards Big Brother are happening across the world, now they are gaining the technology they need, to maintain power. But then each generation of power seekers, have always sought power over people. Its just now they have the technology to do it. But the point is, that desire for power over others, has always been there, with a minority of people seeking to control the majority. In hindsight, this is why George Orwell was able to predict this kind of behaviour. Because what he was describing was human nature and not simply technology. Its not about technology, its about Psychology. No matter how technology evolves and changes, the desire to maintain power will always be there, for a minority of people, who go into a career of seeking power over others. (Either seeking political power, or if they fail at that, they go into Big Business and seek high positions of power in that area instead).
This is why cooperation isn't required. They already have common ground to seek power over others and simply need to bring in technology and ways to allow them to more easily maintain power. Any attempt to tell them they are wrong, is interpreted by them as wrong and they then label it as near terrorist like behaviour. Ironically terrorists are themselves power seekers. They seek to dominate all with their views.
But is this a Dystopia or a Utopia?
Its interesting how one person's Dystopia is another person's Utopia... Sadly it explains why the world is so unfair for everyone. No one will get a total utopia or a total dystopia, as the other side will not allow it. But while the people who seek power are the minority in society, (and they are put in power by the majority), this minority is now gaining the upper hand through technology, used to push the world towards their Utopia. This is why democracy is always under threat of being undermined. I had thought that as my ancestors and people like them had fought so long and hard to finally win Democracy. Then surely as we now have Democracy, we therefore much now just keep Democracy. I didn't realize there are people constantly trying to undermine Democracy for their own gain and so over time, Democracy has to be constantly defended against these people. The people trying to undermine Democracy for their own gain are almost by definition people without empathy towards others. They actually choose to violate Democracy for their own gain.
Democracy only exists if balance is m
"Information wants to be free."
I don't know about free. Anything but free. This is government admiting they expect widespread monitoring of communications. For example, in the case of the UK, that means all business data will be scanned along with peoples emails, so it makes sense that governments and companies with international offices, are going to be worried their internal email documents are going to be intercepted.
Our UK government probably told them its a good idea. ;) ... (That way, the UK can then bring them in, as everyone else is doing it).
"Coherent arguments against filtering also greatly welcome."
:( ...
I would start with Article 12 from this... http://www.un.org/Overview/rights.html
i.e. "Article 12 : No one shall be subjected to arbitrary interference with his privacy, family, home or correspondence, nor to attacks upon his honour and reputation. Everyone has the right to the protection of the law against such interference or attacks."
As for governments trying this sort, the UK is probably in the lead
http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/10/15/2222209
Its interesting how so called free countries are rushing towards censorship, control and out right Big Brother, faster than so called bad countries. The power seekers in each country seem to be treating technology as their dream come true. They can use it to fight for powers previous generations of power seeking leaders couldn't have dreamed possible.
We all need to speak out against this sort of thing before its to late...
http://yro.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=997305&cid=25397001
I don't need a spliff. Thats clearly your thought, so I'll leave that to you, to help you cope with your thoughts. But then suppression of thoughts never lasts. Eventually the truth breaks through, no matter how hard you try to suppress it. So no matter how hard you try to hide from the truth and laugh it off, it always gets found and learned in the end. But then you already know that.
"What a load of vague, existential rubbish."
... Past power seekers could never have dreamed of having this kind of power, yet we are suppose to just trust the current power seekers, when they have already shown they will abuse the law. They even used anti-terror laws against Iceland. Iceland are not terrorists. They have shown how they will abuse the law, even the laws they write! ... yet you want us to just keep trusting them, as they grab ever more power?!
That totally sums up your own post. Your flawed argument, is so weak and vague, its laughable.
Its a fact that some people do seek power other others. Its a fact that some people seek more attention than others. Its a fact there are reoccurring patterns of behaviour in human nature. Its a fact that Cluster B disorders do exist. HPD and NPD are recognised behaviour patterns. Learn about them or close your mind to them. Be a fool if you wish, as you'll only have yourself to blame, in the long run, if you choose to remain so close minded. Or try learning about Cluster B disorders and history before you stick your head in the sand and say nothing is happening.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Histrionic_personality_disorder
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissistic_personality_disorder
Some of the ones who seek power, choose to undermine democracy for their own gain. Almost by definition they are choosing to show a lack of empathy to others. That is why democracy and freedom need to be defended. If nothing is happening, then what do you call the Slashdot news article today about monitoring all communications?. If this was 50 years ago, people would have been utterly shocked at this news. Now we are suppose to just accept it?
"1. Everyone in power is corrupt and has a disorder that caused them to get there."
... they do. The ones who seek power, generation after generation make the laws and decide what we consider right and wrong ... in law. They make the laws and choose which laws to change.
... Past power seekers could never have dreamed of having this kind of power, yet we are suppose to just trust the current power seekers, when they have already shown they will abuse the law. They even used anti-terror laws against Iceland. Iceland are not terrorists. They have shown how they will abuse the law, even the laws they write! ... yet you want us to just keep trusting them, as they grab ever more power?!
No, not all people in power, but there is a disproportionate amount of them, that seek higher levels of power. Politics acts a natural selection process, acting on the ones seeking to fight for power over others.
"2. We can never trust those in power because to get there they had to have this disorder and became corrupt as a part of the process."
No, but many of them do bias power in their favor at the expense of fairness. The process of seeking power over someone else, in other words, the power to dictate terms to someone else, means that person seeks to push others lower than them.
You show very extreme thinking. Taking things to extremes and then thinking the extreme must be wrong. Its not so extreme. Its far more subtle.
"Where do you people come from? I'll tell me what makes me sick. It's the people like yourself who see ghosts around every corner"
Its blind fools like you, who let these people get away with it all, for so long that, when its finally bad enough for even you to see, then by that time, its too late to stop them. The harm by then, is already done. Try reading some history, if you fail to see the nature of power seeking. I can assure you many of the most successful politicians definitely study political history. They study for years to learn how to gain power and influence over others.
"Face the facts, there will always be corruption and abuse of power. But there will ALSO always be those who don't, or simply through checks and balances mitigate the abuse of power."
Yes there will always be corruption and abuse of power. Thats why people need to defend democracy and stop these people undermining it for their own gain. Also who writes the laws?
"As a people it's our responsibility to speak out (wow amazing that you can even post like this in such a corrupt abusive country isn't it?)"
We can post now, yes. But not in the future, the way its heading, not without repercussions. Freedom and democracy are getting undermined almost continously these days.
"imaginary vast conspiracies"
Be a fool, you'll only have yourself to blame, in the long run. Or try learning about Cluster B disorders and history before you stick your head in the sand and say nothings is happening. If nothing is happening, then what do you call this Slashdot news article?. If this was 50 years ago, people would have been utterly shocked at this news. Now we are suppose to just accept it?
I fear the world we are heading towards. I know just how much contempt and harm Cluster B Personality Disorders are capable of inflicting on others, as they seek to dominate. Unfortunately most people don't understand Personality Disorders, even though everyone one of us meets people with these disorders many times and suffer the consequences. Some Cluster B Personality Disorders are very dangerous people. The thought that they will gain so much power, that no one can tell them they are wrong, for fear of repercussions, is a very frightening thought.
Terrorists are themselves power seekers. They also seek to dominate. Look how far they are prepared to go, to get their views becoming the most dominate in the world. Most of us who don't seek power, are caught up in this power struggle, just as people like us have been harmed throughout history, as the ones who seek power, seek to be the ones who lead everyone.
I've never been interested in politics until really this year, but the changes I've seen even this year have shown me, if we fail to make a stand soon against the power seekers, then we will never be able to make a stand against them again, because in a few years, all forms of communications are going to be monitored and they will use it to control us all.
If you doubt how far its going to go, then read this... http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=997305&cid=25397001
p.s. if you don't want read that, then here's one bit of it...
"Most people don't realize the game people in power are playing. People in power are not so interested in individuals. The ones in power are interested in adding everyone to different lists so they can then control and profiling groups of people, so they can then use divide and conquer tactics, to break groups of people up. The goal is that the fragmented groups cannot then stand and oppose the point of view of the ones in power. That is why they data mine. The lessons of history have not been learned by enough people. Looks like the world is seeking to repeat the mistakes of the past. Freedom and democracy are constantly undermined by a minority of people in power for their own gain. Its just a matter of time and how far we are going to let them all game the system to push the excesses ever more unfairly in their favor."