Slashdot Mirror
Domain: doubleclick.net
Stories and comments across the archive that link to doubleclick.net.
Comments · 164
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In defense of $5 CPMForgive the cross-posting, but I made the following comment in reply to FortKnox's journal:
Slashdot is NOT adding popups. They are just adding normal ads like the skyscraper and the big square display ad . Normal ads you see everywhere else, and that already run on Newsforge and other OSDN sites.
These ads run from $90 per thousand (megabanner , one month) and $24 per thousand (below the fold , 1 year). Of course these are list prices, minus potentially deep discounts.
But what of subscriptions?
The slashdot subscription service can be viewed another way: you're buying ad banners for $5 per thousand! (Actually, it's more like $5 per 2000 or 3000, since most pages have several ads.) You're just buying blank space, or absence of ad banners, not actual banners.
Now this is a deep discount by any measure. Is it above the marginal cost of serving the pages? Yes. But is it also lower margin than serving ads? ABSOLUTELY. So the economics are interesting: now, in a period of crappy ad sales, $5 per thousand is a hell of a lot better than $0 (which they get for the Sourceforge ads); but if ad sales pick up, the opportunity cost of giving members such a cheap way to avoid ads could be substantial.
So I actually think slashdot is doing us a favor by setting up the subscription system. And if they tell us fuck you in the process, who cares? It's still a better deal than the alternative.
----
Followup comment: Look at the economics! Slashdot's subscription system may not be the best user interface (I certainly think all you can eat is better, even if it's not the best financial deal for the buyer, because you can set it and forget it) but it is the fairest I have ever seen. Don't like an ad? Pay not to see it, at a discounted price. I don't see how much fairer it could be.
And it's a smart move for the Slashboys because they need the revenue from bigger ads, and if even a few subscribe, it's another revenue stream, which is better than X10 and Casino-On-Net.
Of course people can run junkbuster. And people can take slashdot
The point of this is to allow big ads on the front page, like skyscrapers and square displays. That's what ad buyers want (newspapers and magazines have had display ads of even larger proportions for over a century). And remember what CT said: 82% of readers don't comment - many don't even click through to the stories! So front page ads reach these users.
Without subscriptions, the hue and cry would have been even louder. So by doing it this way, they gave people an alternative; sent pageviews through the roof on a HOF story; and will get some revenue out of it. Makes sense to me.
----
Following up based on this discussion: I do think all-you-can-eat would be better, and I suspect that
The big problem now is that the ads look weird because the layout hasn't been fixed yet to accommodate them. This too shall pass. Frankly I rather like the ads (notably the IBM ones) - bring 'em on! (I will subscribe however, when I get around to it.)
-
In defense of $5 CPMForgive the cross-posting, but I made the following comment in reply to FortKnox's journal:
Slashdot is NOT adding popups. They are just adding normal ads like the skyscraper and the big square display ad . Normal ads you see everywhere else, and that already run on Newsforge and other OSDN sites.
These ads run from $90 per thousand (megabanner , one month) and $24 per thousand (below the fold , 1 year). Of course these are list prices, minus potentially deep discounts.
But what of subscriptions?
The slashdot subscription service can be viewed another way: you're buying ad banners for $5 per thousand! (Actually, it's more like $5 per 2000 or 3000, since most pages have several ads.) You're just buying blank space, or absence of ad banners, not actual banners.
Now this is a deep discount by any measure. Is it above the marginal cost of serving the pages? Yes. But is it also lower margin than serving ads? ABSOLUTELY. So the economics are interesting: now, in a period of crappy ad sales, $5 per thousand is a hell of a lot better than $0 (which they get for the Sourceforge ads); but if ad sales pick up, the opportunity cost of giving members such a cheap way to avoid ads could be substantial.
So I actually think slashdot is doing us a favor by setting up the subscription system. And if they tell us fuck you in the process, who cares? It's still a better deal than the alternative.
----
Followup comment: Look at the economics! Slashdot's subscription system may not be the best user interface (I certainly think all you can eat is better, even if it's not the best financial deal for the buyer, because you can set it and forget it) but it is the fairest I have ever seen. Don't like an ad? Pay not to see it, at a discounted price. I don't see how much fairer it could be.
And it's a smart move for the Slashboys because they need the revenue from bigger ads, and if even a few subscribe, it's another revenue stream, which is better than X10 and Casino-On-Net.
Of course people can run junkbuster. And people can take slashdot
The point of this is to allow big ads on the front page, like skyscrapers and square displays. That's what ad buyers want (newspapers and magazines have had display ads of even larger proportions for over a century). And remember what CT said: 82% of readers don't comment - many don't even click through to the stories! So front page ads reach these users.
Without subscriptions, the hue and cry would have been even louder. So by doing it this way, they gave people an alternative; sent pageviews through the roof on a HOF story; and will get some revenue out of it. Makes sense to me.
----
Following up based on this discussion: I do think all-you-can-eat would be better, and I suspect that
The big problem now is that the ads look weird because the layout hasn't been fixed yet to accommodate them. This too shall pass. Frankly I rather like the ads (notably the IBM ones) - bring 'em on! (I will subscribe however, when I get around to it.)
-
VA Is DyingJust three days ago, I subscribed to OSDN's (formerly known as Andover.net; a subsidiary of VA Software formerly known as VA Linux formerly known as VA Research) Freshmeat Update newsletter. However, I quickly found out that spending half a minute per day reading about new open sores warez is a waste of my valuable time; hence I decided to unsubscribe. Luckily, I was too lazy to do it yesterday or else I would have missed this wonderful ad that came with the newsletter this morning, instead of the usual ad for Thawte's SSL Guide:
--
Mind altering substance from Microsoft.
Microsoft® Visual Studio®
has arrived. Will the old way of programming
survive?Click to find out:
www.msdn.microsoft.com/vstudio
--
It seems that the Visual Studio banner ad [doubleclick.net] was not a single occurence, but rather part of a prolonged advertising campaign by Microsoft on the VA sites.Hopefully, this means that VA are running short of cash, need every dollar they could possibly get their greedy hands on and their end is nearer than I would have ever hoped. Hopefully, this will also mean that $lashdot won't be around much longer and the pimply-faced slashbots will finally use some real software [microsoft.com] instead of that open sores crap [kdevelop.org].
P.S. I liked this part in MS' ad the most: "Will the old way of programming survive?". LOL.
Troll 28 of 131 from the annals of the Troll Library .
-
VA Is DyingJust three days ago, I subscribed to OSDN's (formerly known as Andover.net; a subsidiary of VA Software formerly known as VA Linux formerly known as VA Research) Freshmeat Update newsletter. However, I quickly found out that spending half a minute per day reading about new open sores warez is a waste of my valuable time; hence I decided to unsubscribe. Luckily, I was too lazy to do it yesterday or else I would have missed this wonderful ad that came with the newsletter this morning, instead of the usual ad for Thawte's SSL Guide:
--
Mind altering substance from Microsoft.
Microsoft® Visual Studio®
has arrived. Will the old way of programming
survive?Click to find out:
www.msdn.microsoft.com/vstudio
--
It seems that the Visual Studio banner ad [doubleclick.net] was not a single occurence, but rather part of a prolonged advertising campaign by Microsoft on the VA sites.Hopefully, this means that VA are running short of cash, need every dollar they could possibly get their greedy hands on and their end is nearer than I would have ever hoped. Hopefully, this will also mean that Slashdot won't be around much longer and the pimply-faced slashbots will finally use some real software [microsoft.com] instead of that open sores crap [kdevelop.org].
P.S. I liked this part in MS' ad the most: "Will the old way of programming survive?". LOL.
This troll was reposted from the Troll Library without permission of the original author. If you object to this post, or if you wish to add your troll to the Troll Library, please reply to this message.
-
!!!
Microsoft is advertisng on slashdot, no joke! Heres the truth
-
VA is dying
Just three days ago, I subscribed to OSDN's (formerly known as Andover.net; a subsidiary of VA Software formerly known as VA Linux formerly known as VA Research) Freshmeat Update newsletter. However, I quickly found out that spending half a minute per day reading about new open sores warez is a waste of my valuable time; hence I decided to unsubscribe. Luckily, I was too lazy to do it yesterday or else I would have missed this wonderful ad that came with the newsletter this morning, instead of the usual ad for Thawte's SSL Guide:
--
Mind altering substance from Microsoft.
Microsoft® Visual Studio®
has arrived. Will the old way of programming
survive?Click to find out:
www.msdn.microsoft.com/vstudio
--
It seems that the Visual Studio banner ad was not a single occurence, but rather part of a prolonged advertising campaign by Microsoft on the VA sites.
Hopefully, this means that VA are running short of cash, need every dollar they could possibly get their greedy hands on and their end is nearer than I would have ever hoped. Hopefully, this will also mean that Slashdot won't be around much longer and the pimply-faced slashbots will finally use some real software instead of that open sores crap.
P.S. I liked this part in MS' ad the most: "Will the old way of programming survive?". LOL. -
VA is dying
Just three days ago, I subscribed to OSDN's (formerly known as Andover.net; a subsidiary of VA Software formerly known as VA Linux formerly known as VA Research) Freshmeat Update newsletter. However, I quickly found out that spending half a minute per day reading about new open sores warez is a waste of my valuable time; hence I decided to unsubscribe. Luckily, I was too lazy to do it yesterday or else I would have missed this wonderful ad that came with the newsletter this morning, instead of the usual ad for Thawte's SSL Guide:
--
Mind altering substance from Microsoft.
Microsoft® Visual Studio®
has arrived. Will the old way of programming
survive?Click to find out:
www.msdn.microsoft.com/vstudio
--
It seems that the Visual Studio banner ad was not a single occurence, but rather part of a prolonged advertising campaign by Microsoft on the VA sites.
Hopefully, this means that VA are running short of cash, need every dollar they could possibly get their greedy hands on and their end is nearer than I would have ever hoped. Hopefully, this will also mean that Slashdot won't be around much longer and the pimply-faced slashbots will finally use some real software instead of that open sores crap.
P.S. I liked this part in MS' ad the most: "Will the old way of programming survive?". LOL. -
VA is dying
Just three days ago, I subscribed to OSDN's (formerly known as Andover.net; a subsidiary of VA Software formerly known as VA Linux formerly known as VA Research) Freshmeat Update newsletter. However, I quickly found out that spending half a minute per day reading about new open sores warez is a waste of my valuable time; hence I decided to unsubscribe. Luckily, I was too lazy to do it yesterday or else I would have missed this wonderful ad that came with the newsletter this morning, instead of the usual ad for Thawte's SSL Guide:
--
Mind altering substance from Microsoft.
Microsoft® Visual Studio®
has arrived. Will the old way of programming
survive?Click to find out:
www.msdn.microsoft.com/vstudio
--
It seems that the Visual Studio banner ad was not a single occurence, but rather part of a prolonged advertising campaign by Microsoft on the VA sites.
Hopefully, this means that VA are running short of cash, need every dollar they could possibly get their greedy hands on and their end is nearer than I would have ever hoped. Hopefully, this will also mean that Slashdot won't be around much longer and the pimply-faced slashbots will finally use some real software instead of that open sores crap.
P.S. I liked this part in MS' ad the most: "Will the old way of programming survive?". LOL. -
VA is dying
Just three days ago, I subscribed to OSDN's (formerly known as Andover.net; a subsidiary of VA Software formerly known as VA Linux formerly known as VA Research) Freshmeat Update newsletter. However, I quickly found out that spending half a minute per day reading about new open sores warez is a waste of my valuable time; hence I decided to unsubscribe. Luckily, I was too lazy to do it yesterday or else I would have missed this wonderful ad that came with the newsletter this morning, instead of the usual ad for Thawte's SSL Guide:
--
Mind altering substance from Microsoft.
Microsoft® Visual Studio®
has arrived. Will the old way of programming
survive?Click to find out:
www.msdn.microsoft.com/vstudio
--
It seems that the Visual Studio banner ad was not a single occurence, but rather part of a prolonged advertising campaign by Microsoft on the VA sites.
Hopefully, this means that VA are running short of cash, need every dollar they could possibly get their greedy hands on and their end is nearer than I would have ever hoped. Hopefully, this will also mean that Slashdot won't be around much longer and the pimply-faced slashbots will finally use some real software instead of that open sores crap.
P.S. I liked this part in MS' ad the most: "Will the old way of programming survive?". LOL. -
WTF has happened to Slashdot?
With all of Slashdot's anti-microsoft talk, it seems they have no problem advertising for them. I opened up Slashdot this morning and BAM, there was an ad for Visual Studio.net
Don't believe me? Just follow this link to the banner ad -
WTF has happened to Slashdot?
With all of Slashdot's anti-microsoft talk, it seems they have no problem advertising for them. I opened up Slashdot this morning and BAM, there was an ad for Visual Studio.net
Don't believe me? Just follow this link to the banner ad -
BT - A modern stone age famileee
BT must have a whole department working out new ways to appear clueless. It would be funny if they weren't crippling the UK's digital infrastructure while they did it.
They've delayed the roll-out of DSL for years, and now charge nearly double what a comparative service goes for in the US. And a BBC investigation uncovered their deliberate throttling back of DSL speeds to some customers getting the full benefits of the bandwidth.
My fave recent clueless tip from BT is the useful info nugget that
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page lengthening post!
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4 -
It appears Sun is already ahead of us...So I click to "read more" and the first thing I see is this Sun banner.
I'm afraid.
-
And might I suggest...
-
Bzzt. Thanks for playing.Blockquoth the poster:
You own the phsyical DVD, you DON'T OWN THE MOVIE TO DO WITH IT WHAT YOU WISH
Sure I do. I can make a frisbee of the disc. I can watch the movie a hundred times; I can never watch it. I can give it to a friend, I can copy the movie onto VHS to watch at school, I can quote sections for a review.Indeed, copyright law -- especially before the stillborn monstrosity called the DMCA -- recognized that, in creation of a work, an author is vested with certain rights and the public is vested with certain rights. Copyright has traditionally been seen as a balancing act between the public's interest in open sharing of the work, and the public's interest in encouraging other authors to come forward and create.
As noted in Digital Copyright by Jessica Litman, it is only recently that the attitude has begun to shift toward investing "property" rights to the hands of copyright holders. Ironically, this means that almost all of the culture held up as a justification for the current system is actually a holdover from the earlier one.
-
For the love of god, opt outIf you value not being tracked, you really should opt out of Doubleclick's tracking. For those not familiar, they use cookies attached to every ad in order to track which of their member sites you view. If this bothers you just a little, go to
http://www.doubleclick.net:80/us/corporate/privac
y
-- -
Re:Doubleclick may read /.The page was there for two hours after I emailed them about it, but was removed and redirected shortly before this story went up, so I added the link to where it used to be. You can see the "bak" in the URL, which is why I assume it was backup data never intended to stay on the corporate web server.
Jamie McCarthy
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Patented Comments
At this point, it is difficult to assess the exact impact that Shuster's submission will have on the online advertising world.
At this point what kind of an impact will people expect. Not to be sound so "anti" anything, what I will say is, he should have done something long ago instead of waiting 6+ years while DoubleClick built a niche in the market for this service
The DoubleClick patent, which makes exceptionally broad claims regarding the delivery, targeting and measuring of advertising over the Internet, touched off a wave of suits and counter suits between DoubleClick and ad serving rivals 24/7 and L90.
Can someone explain to me how people are patenting free words and actions of a computer language. I don't wanna hear about "Its a nice idea" the underlying factor is, it isn't really an invention, no one physically owns code, why doesn't someone rant and sue for using their code, say Larry Wall sue DoubleClick for using Perl without his prior consent. Sure Larry Released it free, and I can theorize if he knew it would be used by "for profit" companies he would have probably released a professional copy.
Still, Shuster's prior art points to possible problems with the validity of the DoubleClick patent. But given that the DoubleClick lawsuits are currently dormant, is the issue dead?
Why cant this be simple such as a "move your feet lose your seat" solution. Taxpayers spend millions on this bs.The existence of this prior art, together with the November settlement between DoubleClick, and rivals 24/7 and L90, could seriously impede DoubleClick's ability to assert the patent against new entrants into the online advertising realm. This could have a direct benefit for Shuster himself, who is attempting a re-entry into the online advertising field.
Who says this is going to hinder anything, a patent is a patent. I had an idea for a lot of things people have ended up creating and patenting, would that give me the right to sue someone for it, because I was too lazy to capitalize on patenting and copyrights?
Patent Pending -
Re:Big Brother is Watching
Doubleclick is reputed to have amazingly accurate profiles of nearly every American household with internet access.
For "normal" user yes certainly, but all of us here usualy optout, or you can have some cookies filter.
Anyway I don't know really if optout works, as they could use your IP address to collect info on website you go. Anyway I use 127.0.0.1 for doubleclick.net
-- -
User defined ads are a good idea
There I said it. There is a big difference between willingly specifying the ads you want to recieve, your locale, etc. and having the information gathered without your knowlege or consent.
As much as people want adverts to go away without having to resort to blocking software, they wont. Ads as a business model does suck, but they do help pay for some sites.
Ads on the web are a necessary evil, like on TV. However, there are greater and lesser evils.
So, props to the guy for trying to deal with the issue in an open and honest matter. I for one would register interest/locale with ODSN, provided that the data is only used for demographic purposes - and nothing else. I think that being able to have a degree of control over the ads I get served is a good idea. Specifically, voting on ads suckiness, banishing some ("FAWKING DSL" et al) forever, and voluntarily registering my interests.
In addition - why must ads be images? The ad-space would be much better taken up (in my view) with links to "coming soon", "download now!" + feature summary or whatever - rather than crap obviously created by people who wouldn't know good animation if it hit them over the head with a sauce-pan and ran in to a mouse-hole.
-
Clicking this (IDG) link gives IDG Money - ad hit
The page linked to here on slashdot is actually just an IDG frame with an ad on it and another frame that goes through ad.doubleclick.net at this address:
http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;1511675;4485524;j?ht tp://www.infoworld.com/articles/hn/xml/01/01/12/01 0112hnwriting.xml?p=br&s=5 .
To go there without viewing the IDG banner and without generating clickthrough $$$ for IDG, go HERE.
This article is actually an infoworld.com article.
-------- -
Re:Rise of Proxies
Targeted advertising done well also reduces my demand for ad blockers.
WARNING! Do not click this link. Doing so will cause DoubleClick to no longer be able to identify you across your visits to various, unrelated websites, and therefore might infringe on your hopes to receive personalized ads, one day!!!
Don't say i didn't warn you... -
Re:Why isnt this against DoubleClick?
with doubleclick.net, you can easily OPT_OUT of their tracking stuff, just go to h ttp://w ww.doubleclick.net/us/corporate/privacy/opt-out.a
s p?asp_object_1=&
-- -
tough proposition.
i'd be more interested to know how you managed so far. But anyway. First you have to recognize that worst case scenario: dropping the whole thing is an option; it doesn't have to bankrupt you.
Before you get to that point, though you have to answer some questions. "What are my priorities?"
Is your first priority keeping your customer base?
Is it making something viable out of your hobby?
Is it that you keep control of the site somehow?
If you want to learn how some auction sites got to be profitable, any of them who've IPO'd are required to make financial statments available to current and prospective shareholders. So check out eBay's statments, see where their income comes from. Not quite looking at the source code for it... but it may be as useful as a header file. You'll probably see that the business needs to attain some sort of critical mass before it can make money the way eBay does. But look through the publicly available data to see how it works.
You seem to be particularly worried about customers rejecting banner ads. Unless you're billing yourself as "the lynx friendly auction site" or something, you shouldn't really have to worry. It will be something of a pain, and it won't save your site, but it should allow you to recoup some of your money... And i immagine that most banner services already have information on the finer points of joining and billing and stuff.
I don't know. Even if i did, i couldn't tell you, since i'm not an insured professional. But the first step in finding the answer is having a better idea of what you want.
__
alt.geek -
Re:Uhm...
I'm with rotor--
I grew up, as much as anywhere, in a small town in northern Vermont with my grandmother. My siblings and I still own the house, and we vacation there with our families. The town library has an Internet connection--for most of the people in the town that's the only connection they can get.
And they have a serious problem with people viewing porn on the (one) computer. They've turned the computer so it faces the wall--so if you view a bunch of porn sites no impressionable kiddies are watching too. But what they haven't considered is doubleclick.net--when the next user comes along and connects to Hotmail they get a bunch of banner ads advertising pr0n. My niece went to check her Hotmail account and got banners for lesbian pr0n--definitely rattled her.
My sister (who, incidentally, lives inside the Beltway) is now suddenly in favor of a federal agency to Put A Stop To This(tm). My thought is that my sister ought to spend the eight bucks a month necessary to get email accounts for her kids that don't serve banner ads. -
Re:More importantly, demographics
The server logs don't tell you who is coming to the site. Sure, you know that 201.189.67.109 (completely made up) stopped here and you can even do a reverse DNS on it, but the advertisers that pay for banner ads and the corporate marketing types want to know how much disposable income is behind that IP and what they might spend it on. That is why DoubleClick and all want to track you and even correlate you with a name and address, that info lets them classify you and sell your eyeballs to the advertisers. Have you seen the higher prices that they get for targetted ads? Nearly double their normal rate last time I looked.
-
Riddle: Who CANNOT possibly be sued by Amazon?
Who is notorious for their cookies, but cannot possibly violate the "1-click" patent?
These folks of course...
Sreeram. -
Blocking Software
I have been Using a Program called CookiePal for years to control the cookies I allow on my machine in Windows. You can also opt-out of doubleclick. Although if you don't allow them to use cookies it doesn't matter.
The only Banner Ad blockers thatI have seen simply prevent the display of pictures that are standard banner size: x pixels by x pixels. -
Why go through the trouble..Just go to http://www.doubleclick.net/optout/def ault.asp and it will set a blank cookie to disable tracking on your client. If you wanted to, you could setup a proxy for your entire company that would send that cookie for all request.
Besides that, I could never understand why people cared about such things.. After all - would you rather see an ad for something you don't care about, or something that supposedly might be interesting for you? (And no, don't give me "I would rather see no ads at all" - people who create the very sites you are visiting do need to get paid)
-
Way OT, but is Slashdot Hypocritical?Is Slashdot just a little hypocritical? They like to make a big noise about doubleclick, and yet they occasionally have doubleclick adverts embeded in iframes. Other times their cause of the moment is web bugs. Yes, those little 1*1 gifs that track your movements around a site.
Here is a search of slashdot showing the most recent doubleclick articles:
2 DoubleClick 'Web Bugs' On Porn, Medical Sites by jamie on Saturday July 01, @11:30AM EDT 255
2 FTC Asks To Regulate Privacy; Doubleclick Hires PR Team by michael on Sunday May 21, @10:16AM EDT 238
2 24/7 Sues DoubleClick Over Patent by Hemos on Saturday May 06, @04:58PM EDT 128
2 DoubleClick CEO on DMA Board by jamie on Monday April 10, @06:25PM EDT 3
2 DoubleClick DoublesBack by Hemos on Friday March 03, @08:55AM EDT 97
2 DoubleClick Goes On Offensive by jamie on Tuesday February 15, @09:25AM EDT 6
2 DoubleClick Taken to Court by Hemos on Friday January 28, @10:25AM EDT 323
2 DoubleClick DoubleCross by michael on Wednesday January 26, @01:10AM EDT 516
2 Doubleclick's Banner Ad Patent by CmdrTaco on Monday September 13, @07:51PM EDT 224
1 DoubleClick Workaround: IDcide by jamie on Wednesday March 22, @01:05PM EDT 246
I think this fairly solidly establishes the public image of slashdot, but what about underneath the covers?From inside an iframe quite a while ago, and pretty much speaks for itself:
http://ad.doubleclick. net/adi/N815.slashdot/B18726;sz=468x60And then this is what I saw today, and what caused this little outburst:
<NOSCRIPT>
<IMG SRC="http://images2.slashdot.org/Slashdot/pc.gif?/ index.shtml,965143990" WIDTH=1 HEIGHT=1>
<IMG SRC="http://images.slashdot.org/pagecount.gif?/ind ex.shtml,965143990" WIDTH=1 HEIGHT=1><BR>
</NOSCRIPT><BR>
A webbug! Oooohhh, they are so bad. They are evil. But we have nothing against using them ourselves!Further down the same page, conveniently bypassing my ad-filter:
<NOSCRIPT>
<A HREF="http://images.slashdot.org/cgi-bin/adlog.pl? index,line0001en"><IMG SRC="http://images.slashdot.org/banner/line0001en. gif?965143990" WIDTH=468 HEIGHT=60 ALT="Click here."></A><BR>
</NOSCRIPT> This one is probably justified, depending on your opinion on adverts.There is however more rubbish in the source, but since I normally have javascript poop switched off I don't have to suffer it. Here is a quick sample, but don't hesitate to view the source yourself:
document.write("<IMG SRC='http://images2.slashdot.org/Slashdot/pc.gif?/ index.shtml,");
document.write(tail);
document.write("' WIDTH=1 HEIGHT=1>");
document.write("<IMG SRC='http://images.slashdot.org/pagecount.gif?/ind ex.shtml,");
document.write(tail);
document.write("' WIDTH=1 HEIGHT=1><BR>");So the conclusion that Slashdot is hypocritical looks pretty justified. Opinions and comments anyone?
-
Can't trust the government...
Since we can't always count on the government to do the right thing (if we even want them to something in the first place), don't forget about personal measures such as Doubleclick's OptO ut.
There are other measures you can take. Take privacy into your own hands. -
Ready the opt-out link, captain!
http://www.doubleclick.net/optout/def ault.asp
Follow the link above so that DoubleClick will issue you a cookie with the string id=OPT_OUT. This will prevent DoubleClick from doing its "DoubleClickish" tracking and serving, and rather just serve you banner ads straight out.
And, yes, I'm aware of the irony of me making a post like this when my site is full of DoubleClick code -
Re:Opt-Out from Doubleclick! I have allready... :-
The opt-out option from DoubleClick is reasonable for what is does:
It does not stop tracking of visited web pages, it simply stops associating that tracking information with you.
So DoubleClick will still know that somebody visited the lesbian p0rn site (or whatever the original example was) and it will know the IP address that the request came from (I always go through a web cache that my provider supplies: this provides some degree of anonymity) but it will not know it is "you" and will not be able to associate this visit with the one you made yesterday (and the day before and the day before that,
It's fairly easy to check that the opt-out is working by simply checking the cookies for DoubleClick. If you are using Netscape 4.x and are unfortunate enough to use it on Windows NT, then look for the file:
drive:\Program Files\Netscape\Users\Your User Account\cookies.txt
Search in here for
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Opt-Out from Doubleclick! I have allready... :-)
I thought I'd mention that there is a way to Opt-Out from DoubleClick. I don't really know if they are trustworthy regarding how they've behaved before though... But it seems to be for real. If it weren't and someone would find out - they'd be sued to oblivion...Thank you.
--
"At the end of the journey, all men think that their youth was Arcadia..." -Goethe -
cookiesyou can set junkbuster to reject cookies from the doubleclick domain while allowing others. i used to use this method
otherwise, you can either set your cookie file to read-only so no changes are saved between sessions or write a batch file to delete or copy a default cookie file each time you start the browser.
you can also go to the doubleclick site and opt out of their system. they'll set a cookie that lets them know not to track you anymore. ironic isn't it?
other forms of disruption would be sharing your doubleclick cookie with hundreds of other people, rendering their data useless.
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Conflict of Interest
Hmm. The USPTO is bad, right? Slashdot doesn't like patents applied to technology processes, right? That's funny. You guys seem to be happy.
Just cause a corporation you don't like (DoubleClick) got screwed doesn't make this a Good Thing. C|Net is being just as bad as DoubleClick. In all likelihood, C|Net will just license the patent out and make loads and loads of money. Nothing will change by this.
If, as a community, we're going to be against tech patents, we'd best actually be against tech patents. It's not a selective thing; if the geek community doesn't think that patents should apply to technology processes (Actual technology hardware patents are often times good, but patenting a technology process is silly; prior art is difficult to find but almost always existant, and re-innovation with no interaction with the patented art is common. In today's fast-moving world of technology, patents on processes are silly and frivolous.), then it should stand up against every single one. Just cause DoubleClick got shafted doesn't mean the day has been saved. This is just another process that was patented, and with each process the idea of patenting technology processes is reinforced.
Mike Greenberg -
Re:Who do you want to control you today?
How cleverly put. In other words: "Since we don't believe the industry can control the net, we should be given the authority to do it".
And if this was about "the net" you might have a point - too bad it's not. This is about the harvesting, usage, and sale of personal information and privacy, and it just so happens that the harvest, use, and sale happens over TCP/IP.
- This really not is about "the net". It's about consumer privacy. Consumer privacy issues are independent of medium - Social Security or driver records for sale, credit and medical history available without safeguards.
- The FTC is not saying that the industry cannot self-regulate. They are saying that it is voluntarily deciding against any meaningful self-regulation, instead using legal bafflegab and half-truths to offer the illusion of self-regulation. And you know what? I believe them.
- Put number 1 and number 2 together and you have this: apparently people believe there is a compelling need for consumer privacy, and given the choice the privacy-violation industry isn't offering you decent protection.
So the FTC's argument is simple... if you want privacy, the privacy-violation industry has shown your desires are irrelevant to them, and they will never choose to honor them in good faith. If the FTC is right, then you must either stop being so married to this laughable concept of privacy (next you'll want anonymity!) or you must take choice away from the privacy-violation industry.
The privacy-violation industry was given a chance to prove they wouldn't piss in the well. They've been failing by inches and feet and yards ever since, and we're the ones whose drinking water stinks of urine for it. My privacy is worth more to me than DoubleClick's ability to show me "targeted" advertising, so I'm going to wait, and see, and hope that the FTC contrarians start realizing that they're in place to maintain standards for citizens, not corporations.
-
How to opt outIf you would prefer not to have a unique genetic identifier, simply go to http://www.doubletwist.com/optout/. Your unique identifier will be replaced with the ASCII-to-DNA encoding of "OPT_OUT", and DoubleTwist will no longer track your actions and your descendants individually.
--
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Opt Out Link Fixed
Here is the Opt Out Link fixed: Opt Out!
Off-topic, but good stuff. Get 98lite here and configure your Win98 the way you want! 98lite Worth Checking Out!! -
Re:Opt out
I think you mean this.
-
Opt out
I hope everyone's used the Opt-out link for Double-Click at http://www.doubleclick.net/optout/.
Is there a similar system for removing yourself from 24/7's system? -
Re:18MM PV/Y >> $250K
Check out Altavista's rate card (provided by DoubleClick) here. For banners with section-specific but not viewer-specific advertizing, $30 sounds like about an average rate.
Just because you have fewer visitors than Altavista doesn't mean your rates should be any lower -- it's simply that you have less inventory to sell. $30 CPM for banner ads has been about a market average for the last three-to-four years.
This is my opinion and my opinion only. Incidentally, IANAL. -
Re:Free protection against *all* bad cookies
A much simpler solution is to make the cookie file read-only. If you find a site that is giving you cookies you want to keep, change the permissions temporarily. And remember to opt out of DoubleClick is you don't want to do this.
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How to Opt Out of Doubleclick tracking you
I'm not sure which of the trade rags I got this out of, maybe even one of the Windows-centric PC ones, but you can opt out of Double-click tracking you by going to this page at Doubleclick.
Assuming they actually do what they say
-
perhaps there is something to this...
when i searched for "cock monster" (don't ask why) at altavista, I got this banner which leads to this site.
I was looking for a cookie monster mis-spelling and got a gay pr0n ad from doubleclick. hmmmm.
oh, btw: I'm a minor, so can my parents' lawyers assure that I can afford Stanford and a whole lot more now because I was exposed to pr0n?
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perhaps there is something to this...
when i searched for "cock monster" (don't ask why) at altavista, I got this banner which leads to this site.
I was looking for a cookie monster mis-spelling and got a gay pr0n ad from doubleclick. hmmmm.
oh, btw: I'm a minor, so can my parents' lawyers assure that I can afford Stanford and a whole lot more now because I was exposed to pr0n?
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Re:Direct MailMap makers have been doing this for years, adding a bogus street to their indices or exaggerating the curve of a road in a way that wouldn't affect driving but would pinpoint a data thief. Cliff notes do this, too--making a couple of key errors which will positively glare to an informed reader. (They also insert a few very concise passages intended to lure a hapless student into copying them verbatim.)
Of course, some information can't be seeded this way. A medical diagnostics database, for example, could kill someone by having a bogus disease or treatment in it, and you can imagine what could happen if a metallurgy reference misrepresented the tensile strength vs. temperature curve of a material which found its way into turbine blades.
I do admit we've entered a very sticky set of issues here. I firmly believe that Lexus/Nexus and other such databases have a right to prevent a customer from creating an account, typing
select * from people p
at the prompt, and creating BeARichOldLadysCabanaBoy.com out of essentially stolen data. OTOH there have been some frighteningly successful unjustified cases of Restaurant Guide A suing Restaurant Guide B.
where sex='F' and
marital_status in ('S','D','W')
and age between 55 and 70
and net_worth>10000000
and not exists (select * from felony_trials
where SSN=p.SSN and
crime in ('MURDER', 'CONVICTED MURDER', 'BOBBITIZATION')
and victim='HUSBAND');Here's another question: If I use the Yellow Pages to make a list of local restaurants, and write reviews of everything Asian-sounding, and put an index in the back which includes addresses and phone numbers, is Ma Bell entitled to a cut for my derivative, value-added work? If she is, I see an enormous future in making long lists of things and then copyrighting them. This certainly seems to be working in the patent community.
On the whole, this was a very good article, if only for the questions that it left raised and left unanswered. And I'll be sure to follow eBay's lawsuit against AuctionWatch and Bidder'sEdge. To quote--uh oh--Ashleigh Brilliant, I don't have any solution but I certainly admire the problem.
One final note--if the copyrighting of a collection of data becomes a valid future enterprise, can I go ahead and copyright my name, address, school transcripts, credit history, and the list of every web page I've viewed in the past year? I think this last would be pretty goddamned useful in smacking DoubleClick upside the head violating my privacy.
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DoubleClick disabled the Opt-Out page
Interestingly, it looks like DoubleClick disabled the Opt-Out feature. Try it for yourself.
If you go to the Opt-Out page, and click on the link under "If you would still like to Opt-Out, please click here", you will be prompted for username and password.
It didn't do that 8 hours ago, so something has changed since then. This morning, I was able to Opt Out from my work computer just fine.
What gives?
-= Stefan
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Re:DoubleClick Privacy Statementnetdeals.com is part of the Abacus Alliance.
This is all that shows on the screen without scrolling through the legaleeze (who does that anymore?):
- Please read the privacy policy described here before submitting your chance to win.
NetDeals' Privacy Commitment (scroll down)
To learn more about cookies and how to opt-out of targeted advertising, please click here
Anyway, if you have a DoubleClick cookie and you want to have fun with it, go to netdeals.com and type in the following info:
- Name: Kevin Ryan
Occupation: DoubleClick President
Email: kryan@doubleclick.net
- Please read the privacy policy described here before submitting your chance to win.
