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I never quite understood this; can't you compile FF2 on your Fedora?

Yes, I suppose I could do that, or I can grab a development rpm version, but that isn't the point. FF2 has been out for a couple months now and is quite nice and stable.

Instructions here

Reasons here

Legal reasons and upgrade to FC7 reasons are what's in the way, and the FC team feels that FF2 should really have been FF1.5.1 and it was just a marketing ploy to rename to FF2.

I don't want to run FF2 in parallel to FF, I want my system to have FF2 on it.

I disagree with the maintainers here, and I've been mulling a move to Ubuntu because of it.

From the article:

I placed this client on a number of torrent files that I suspected were monitored by BayTSP (For my own protection I don't want to identify the torrents used for this research. I used the fact that NBC is a client of BayTSP to find trackers.

I'm not agreeing with the media companies here, but it's not as draconian as you are making it out to be.

Is anyone still running 1.5.0? I thought the auto upgrade had handled that months ago.

Fedora has no plans to officially release a 2.0 for FC6:

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Firefox2

"Fedora users will be to stay with Firefox 1.5 and wait for the Firefox 3.0 update"

That's left me a bit annoyed personally... I like the changes to FF2...

You can find a solution(s) to your problem at one or more
of the following locations:

http://www.centos.org

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/

http://en.opensuse.org

http://www.opensolaris.org/

http://www.ecomstation.com/

http://www.redhat.com

http://www.reactos.org/en/index.html

http://www.debian.org/ports/hurd/

http://www.openbsd.org/

http://www.freebsd.org/

http://www.netbsd.org/

http://www.dragonflybsd.org/

http://www.osfree.org/doku/en:start

http://www.skyos.org/

http://www.freeos.com/

http://www.minix3.org/

Added to bypass the stupid slashdot lameness filter which apparently doesn't like a post full of links. WTF is wrong with the
stupid lameness filter? Jeez, what does it want, for us to type paragraphs of meaningless drivel just to get past the lameness filter?
Sheeesh. OK, this is really stupid. Why don't ajfajf al;djal a fa fa lkdf jaa fal ja;ljf af af ajf;lajf alfjalf a fjal;fjafl; jaflakjf af;laj
jalkfaj fjf af af fajjjajal jajfa f afjdlakej2233 2235t2352 dsfalkfjal f 222j2 afdkja f23 2 2 2t2352322 233252352 2323232.

It's cool that Fedora is sharing this stuff openly. It would be great if you could also be upfront about the plans for FC7. Which variant of these FC7 Metrics proposals have you decided on going with?

Q. When creating a guest the message "Invalid argument" is displayed.

A. This usually indicates that the kernel image you are trying to boot is incompatible with the hypervisor. This will be seen if trying to run a FC5 (non-PAE) kernel on FC6 (which is PAE only), or if trying to run a bare metal kernel.

I thought full virtulization required hardware support ala HVM

How does KVM get around this ? What am I missing ?

With two more betas to go before the summer, Bletsas was unfazed by the glitches. He also called the current state of the software "barely useable," but again was confident that it would be where it needed to be by launch.

There are a few places out there with scripts that will build a distro from FC.

I belive that the intention is to use Pungi to build the isos for the newly merged fedora releases. Since this tool will be public then interested groups will be able to build their own images containing a custom set of packages.

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/7

Google (ubuntu hardware compatibility) didn't turn up much. Where is this list of laptops that are known to work with, say, Ubuntu? Even if I try Fedora instead, what if none of the laptops on Fedora's HCL are on display at any local brick-and-mortar retailer? I don't want to waste 1,000 USD on a mail-order laptop just to find that I can't stand its internal keyboard.

Like buses or trains?

http://torrent.fedoraproject.org/torrents/Zod-live cd-1-i386.torrent

Red Hat is important in only one way, from what I can see: they make Linux a commercial venture. Other than SCO, I don't think anybody has done a worse job from that perspective, either. Ximian, eventually bought by Novell, at least contributed to the development of Evolution and other GNOME software. Corel got into the Office for Linux market at a time when the biggest complaint about Linux was that there were no good applications available. IBM has contributed to the idea of commercial Linux more than anyone I can think of, both in terms of GPL-ed contributions to the codebase, and as a vendor promoting Linux-based solutions. Red Hat has been a purely profit-based venture, sacrificing the quality of the free distribution to make a few extra bucks.

Right, because Red Hat has never contributed anything to the community:

http://sources.redhat.com/projects.html

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/RedHatContributions

Fedora isn't perfect, and RH did make - IMO - do a poor job of transitioning from the "old" RHL series to Fedora, but to suggest that they don't
contribute anything to Linux and OSS is just ridiculous.

Ximian (Novell) has been important for Gnome and Suse (Novell) have been important for the kernel. But they are far less important than the others together.

Red Hat has developed most code for the linux distros. They are active almost everywere. Red Hat and Sun together has arguable been the two most important contributors to Gnome 2.x. Sun helped develop the HIG and accesability framework. Red Hat developed HAL, Network manager, and a lot other things.

I see a future where Ubuntu and Sun will play a more active role. Even Asianux might start contribute more actively.

Red Hat bought Sistina GFS file system, LVM2 and associated clustering tools acquired for 31 million dollars and Netscape directory server for around 25 million dollars. Both are totally open sourced and given to the community.

Some of their contribution to Gnome:
* pango: originally written and maintained
* glib, gtk+: most primary maintainers and developer work
* metacity: written and maintained
* cairo: written (employee) and maintained
* gconf: written and maintained
* dbus: written (employee) and maintained
* hal: written (employee) and maintained
* gnome-keyring: written and maintained
* NetworkManager: written and maintained
* vino: written and maintained
* gnome-menus: written and maintained
* sabayon: written and maintained
* http://gnome.org/ infrastructure, hosting and bandwidth

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/RedHatContributions

Ximian (Novell) used to be extremly important for Gnome, but their focus seems to be less of desktop infrastructure and architecture this days. Looks like their focus more on Mono and OpenOffice.org and less on everything else.

This is Red Hat's list: http://www.redhat.com/opensourcenow/leadership/dev elopment.html
This is Red Hat's contributions according to the Fedora Project (gives more detail about Red Hat's role in projects) http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/RedHatContributions
This is just another list of different projects: http://sourceware.org/projects.html

A lot of people underestimate how much Red Hat does. They have significantly more code in the kernel than any other entity, they are also responsible for a very large part of the GCC development, and most of the recent big improvements in GCC can be attributed to Red Hat. They also do a ton of dev for Gnome and have done wonderful things with GCJ. People give them a lot of shit, but a lot of OSS development would slow down drastically if they were taken out of the equation.
Regards,
Steve

The modified version of KDE that ships in Fedora 6 is really buggy and unpolished. There's been talk for two years about placing KDE in Fedora Extras so that it will be better supported by the dedicated KDE community, but Redhat seems to keep refusing the help and treating KDE apps as second-class citizens.

Some of the Fedora 6 changes (like taking away MP3 playing capability from KDE music players) are justified on a legal basis, but other changes (like using a 4-year old window decoration and widget styles) are at best the result of ineptitude or at worst a deliberate attempt to make KDE look bad and outdated.

>>Here's what happened exactly... Dear klipp0th, You recently listed the following auction-style listing: 250051615791 - Playstation 3 PS3 Premium w/ Fedora Linux Installed The listing was removed because it violated eBay policy. All fees related to this listing have been credited to your account. We also notified members who placed bids on the item that the listing has been canceled. The sale of unauthorized copies of copyrighted media (including software, video games, music, television programs, ebooks, and photographs) is illegal and not permitted on eBay. "Unauthorized" copies include back-up, pirated, and bootlegged copies. >>And my extremely angry response thus far... Here, I'm doing the work for you. Have your legal department look over these documents in reference to your allegations of illegal/immoral conduct on my part, and ruining a lot of hard work and advertising beyond Ebay itself. Sony's Official Stance: http://www.playstation.com/ps3-openplatform/faq.ht ml http://manuals.playstation.net/document/en/ps3/cur rent/settings/osinstall.html Fedora's Official Stance: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Distribution The only question left is how are you going to make this up to me? How will you compensate me for the huge media attention that my achievment in installing an open source OS on the PS3 got me, how will you replace the 30-something people that were viewing my page when last I checked, and how do you replace the people that had started to bid? You have no idea what I went through to get Linux to work on a PS3, what I went through to composite video of it in action for people to share, and the amount of time I put in building excitement amongst all of the major news sources & blogs about my accomplishment for you to just take it all away. It is the first time I have ever sold anything through ebay, and to do something completely legitimate and even promoted by Sony, just be accused of Piracy by you? As I said...read the links above, then tell me just how you are going to make it up to me. If I could get the entire internet buzzing about Linux on a Playstation 3, you know I'll be the first one to report when a company decides to illegally contradict and oppress the Open Source Community. Check Slashdot's membership totals if you need some numbers on that. And then check Digg, Engadget, Kotaku, Gizmodo, and any of a dozen other news sources, and you'll get the idea... Expecting to hear from you very soon. >>So, think I was pissed off enough? I may end up selling to a famous person in technology world, but we'll see how that goes. I may just keep it after all. But I definitely don't have to agree with Ebay's policies as regards open-source software.I mean, I may be a "noob", but at least I know how to read legal disclaimers and I have a cursory understanding of open-source, which is more than they know. It very well could have been one of the trolls that were hating on me that went to Ebay trying to get me in trouble... If I were trying to sell Linux, that would be one thing, but I was just trying to sell my PS3 and maybe making a little extra for my hard work of getting Linux to install correctly. And as a note, it is almost complete. Everything works now except sound comes out all garbled while the system says there is no soudcard, and there is an error message related to the PMU device, which seems to dissappear whenever I reboot. I have figured out the script that will create the PMU device, but now I need to figure out how to get that command to run upon bootup every time. This is the script: sudo ./MAKEDEV pmu Anyone know how to get that to run every time, so I'm not stuck with an error message upon bootup? And the pmu device is a power management device, and could very well have something to do with my messed up sound, so if I can get the command to run on bootup, then it may kill 2 birds with one stone...

Someone above asked about RPMs for Fedora Core. It turns out that Fedora is skipping Firefox 2. They'll stick with the 1.5 updates for now, and upgrade to Firefox 3 when it's released.

This may prove to be a bit of a problem, though, since Firefox 1.5 is only being supported through April 2007, and Firefox 3 isn't scheduled to be released until May. Fedora Core 7 doesn't have a release schedule yet, but based on past trends it'll probably be next summer, giving them plenty of time to pull in Firefox 3.

This leaves them with a choice between jumping from Firefox 1.5 to Firefox 3 in the middle of the release, or backporting security fixes from April on to Fedora 6's EOL.

Anyone wanting to run Firefox 2 on Fedora Core will probably want to just grab the installer from Mozilla and install into /usr/local or someplace. Though if you go back to that first link, they're apparently trying to settle on a general recommendation, either by providing a separate Firefox 2 RPM or getting Firefox 2 into Fedora Extras. Either way, this will probably only help with Fedora Core 5 and 6.

http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=200611021 75508403
"Novell has effectively traded Long-Term Liberty for Short-Term Safety."
- me 2006/11/02

The Primary Goal of the Fedora Project:
Rapid Progress of Free & Open Source Software.

Red Hat engineering invests millions every year in FOSS development. These developers contribute in a great many ways to stimulate growth in the FOSS ecosystem and the community itself. Red Hat makes this investment for three key reasons:

• It makes business sense: A healthy relationship with community builds quality products faster, and with lower expense. It is indeed possible to make money and not compromise on values.
• Perhaps the technology leaders who made many of these key FOSS improvements are best able to support business customers.
• Many of the people at Red Hat believe in the ethical values of FOSS and the benefit that it brings to society.

As long as I work on the Fedora Project, Fedora will never compromise on the essential liberties of FOSS nor will it betray the community. But the price of liberty is not free, nor is it comfortable. And unfortunately, some "leaders" of our community are willing to compromise liberty for short-term convenience. I am disgusted by people like this, and by Novell's betrayal of the community today.

Red Hat supports causes that matter like providing the original seed money for Creative Commons. Or being a key partner in the anti-software patent movement during the miraculous last-minute turnaround at the European Parliament last year. I am proud to be part of an organization that demonstrates such moral and ethical commitment.

But ultimately, Red Hat cannot change the world alone. That is why the Fedora Project exists. We want to enable the community to work together to improve FOSS at a rapid pace, in partnership with the large and consistent contributions from our engineers. We strongly believe that this is the most effective way for the entire FOSS movement to advance. Yes, we made some big mistakes in our community relationship earlier, but we are learning, and continue to improve at an ever accelerating pace.

For these reasons that I urge the FOSS community to support the Fedora Project through volunteer contributions of time and effort. Or if you lack time to contribute, please consider monetary donations toward any of the shared causes that we are fighting for.

Contribute to Fedora
The Fedora Project needs your contributions in many ways. If you know how to make RPM packages, you can become a maintainer in Fedora Extras where you can contribute your favorite FOSS software into the central repository for all to benefit. We have many opportunities for even non-developers to get involved. We need help with things like Documentation, Artwork, or promoting Fedora in the Ambassadors team. Even simply using Fedora, responsibly reporting bugs in Bugzilla, and helping each other helps the entire community.

Donations
The Fedora Project does not need your money[1], but I hope that you would consider donating to one of the major charities that fight for your liber

http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=200611021 75508403
"Novell has effectively traded Long-Term Liberty for Short-Term Safety."
- me 2006/11/02

The Primary Goal of the Fedora Project:
Rapid Progress of Free & Open Source Software.

Red Hat engineering invests millions every year in FOSS development. These developers contribute in a great many ways to stimulate growth in the FOSS ecosystem and the community itself. Red Hat makes this investment for three key reasons:

• It makes business sense: A healthy relationship with community builds quality products faster, and with lower expense. It is indeed possible to make money and not compromise on values.
• Perhaps the technology leaders who made many of these key FOSS improvements are best able to support business customers.
• Many of the people at Red Hat believe in the ethical values of FOSS and the benefit that it brings to society.

As long as I work on the Fedora Project, Fedora will never compromise on the essential liberties of FOSS nor will it betray the community. But the price of liberty is not free, nor is it comfortable. And unfortunately, some "leaders" of our community are willing to compromise liberty for short-term convenience. I am disgusted by people like this, and by Novell's betrayal of the community today.

Red Hat supports causes that matter like providing the original seed money for Creative Commons. Or being a key partner in the anti-software patent movement during the miraculous last-minute turnaround at the European Parliament last year. I am proud to be part of an organization that demonstrates such moral and ethical commitment.

But ultimately, Red Hat cannot change the world alone. That is why the Fedora Project exists. We want to enable the community to work together to improve FOSS at a rapid pace, in partnership with the large and consistent contributions from our engineers. We strongly believe that this is the most effective way for the entire FOSS movement to advance. Yes, we made some big mistakes in our community relationship earlier, but we are learning, and continue to improve at an ever accelerating pace.

For these reasons that I urge the FOSS community to support the Fedora Project through volunteer contributions of time and effort. Or if you lack time to contribute, please consider monetary donations toward any of the shared causes that we are fighting for.

Contribute to Fedora
The Fedora Project needs your contributions in many ways. If you know how to make RPM packages, you can become a maintainer in Fedora Extras where you can contribute your favorite FOSS software into the central repository for all to benefit. We have many opportunities for even non-developers to get involved. We need help with things like Documentation, Artwork, or promoting Fedora in the Ambassadors team. Even simply using Fedora, responsibly reporting bugs in Bugzilla, and helping each other helps the entire community.

Donations
The Fedora Project does not need your money[1], but I hope that you would consider donating to one of the major charities that fight for your liber

http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=200611021 75508403
"Novell has effectively traded Long-Term Liberty for Short-Term Safety."
- me 2006/11/02

The Primary Goal of the Fedora Project:
Rapid Progress of Free & Open Source Software.

Red Hat engineering invests millions every year in FOSS development. These developers contribute in a great many ways to stimulate growth in the FOSS ecosystem and the community itself. Red Hat makes this investment for three key reasons:

• It makes business sense: A healthy relationship with community builds quality products faster, and with lower expense. It is indeed possible to make money and not compromise on values.
• Perhaps the technology leaders who made many of these key FOSS improvements are best able to support business customers.
• Many of the people at Red Hat believe in the ethical values of FOSS and the benefit that it brings to society.

As long as I work on the Fedora Project, Fedora will never compromise on the essential liberties of FOSS nor will it betray the community. But the price of liberty is not free, nor is it comfortable. And unfortunately, some "leaders" of our community are willing to compromise liberty for short-term convenience. I am disgusted by people like this, and by Novell's betrayal of the community today.

Red Hat supports causes that matter like providing the original seed money for Creative Commons. Or being a key partner in the anti-software patent movement during the miraculous last-minute turnaround at the European Parliament last year. I am proud to be part of an organization that demonstrates such moral and ethical commitment.

But ultimately, Red Hat cannot change the world alone. That is why the Fedora Project exists. We want to enable the community to work together to improve FOSS at a rapid pace, in partnership with the large and consistent contributions from our engineers. We strongly believe that this is the most effective way for the entire FOSS movement to advance. Yes, we made some big mistakes in our community relationship earlier, but we are learning, and continue to improve at an ever accelerating pace.

For these reasons that I urge the FOSS community to support the Fedora Project through volunteer contributions of time and effort. Or if you lack time to contribute, please consider monetary donations toward any of the shared causes that we are fighting for.

Contribute to Fedora
The Fedora Project needs your contributions in many ways. If you know how to make RPM packages, you can become a maintainer in Fedora Extras where you can contribute your favorite FOSS software into the central repository for all to benefit. We have many opportunities for even non-developers to get involved. We need help with things like Documentation, Artwork, or promoting Fedora in the Ambassadors team. Even simply using Fedora, responsibly reporting bugs in Bugzilla, and helping each other helps the entire community.

Donations
The Fedora Project does not need your money[1], but I hope that you would consider donating to one of the major charities that fight for your liber

http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=200611021 75508403
"Novell has effectively traded Long-Term Liberty for Short-Term Safety."
- me 2006/11/02

The Primary Goal of the Fedora Project:
Rapid Progress of Free & Open Source Software.

Red Hat engineering invests millions every year in FOSS development. These developers contribute in a great many ways to stimulate growth in the FOSS ecosystem and the community itself. Red Hat makes this investment for three key reasons:

• It makes business sense: A healthy relationship with community builds quality products faster, and with lower expense. It is indeed possible to make money and not compromise on values.
• Perhaps the technology leaders who made many of these key FOSS improvements are best able to support business customers.
• Many of the people at Red Hat believe in the ethical values of FOSS and the benefit that it brings to society.

As long as I work on the Fedora Project, Fedora will never compromise on the essential liberties of FOSS nor will it betray the community. But the price of liberty is not free, nor is it comfortable. And unfortunately, some "leaders" of our community are willing to compromise liberty for short-term convenience. I am disgusted by people like this, and by Novell's betrayal of the community today.

Red Hat supports causes that matter like providing the original seed money for Creative Commons. Or being a key partner in the anti-software patent movement during the miraculous last-minute turnaround at the European Parliament last year. I am proud to be part of an organization that demonstrates such moral and ethical commitment.

But ultimately, Red Hat cannot change the world alone. That is why the Fedora Project exists. We want to enable the community to work together to improve FOSS at a rapid pace, in partnership with the large and consistent contributions from our engineers. We strongly believe that this is the most effective way for the entire FOSS movement to advance. Yes, we made some big mistakes in our community relationship earlier, but we are learning, and continue to improve at an ever accelerating pace.

For these reasons that I urge the FOSS community to support the Fedora Project through volunteer contributions of time and effort. Or if you lack time to contribute, please consider monetary donations toward any of the shared causes that we are fighting for.

Contribute to Fedora
The Fedora Project needs your contributions in many ways. If you know how to make RPM packages, you can become a maintainer in Fedora Extras where you can contribute your favorite FOSS software into the central repository for all to benefit. We have many opportunities for even non-developers to get involved. We need help with things like Documentation, Artwork, or promoting Fedora in the Ambassadors team. Even simply using Fedora, responsibly reporting bugs in Bugzilla, and helping each other helps the entire community.

Donations
The Fedora Project does not need your money[1], but I hope that you would consider donating to one of the major charities that fight for your liber

http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=200611021 75508403
"Novell has effectively traded Long-Term Liberty for Short-Term Safety."
- me 2006/11/02

The Primary Goal of the Fedora Project:
Rapid Progress of Free & Open Source Software.

Red Hat engineering invests millions every year in FOSS development. These developers contribute in a great many ways to stimulate growth in the FOSS ecosystem and the community itself. Red Hat makes this investment for three key reasons:

• It makes business sense: A healthy relationship with community builds quality products faster, and with lower expense. It is indeed possible to make money and not compromise on values.
• Perhaps the technology leaders who made many of these key FOSS improvements are best able to support business customers.
• Many of the people at Red Hat believe in the ethical values of FOSS and the benefit that it brings to society.

As long as I work on the Fedora Project, Fedora will never compromise on the essential liberties of FOSS nor will it betray the community. But the price of liberty is not free, nor is it comfortable. And unfortunately, some "leaders" of our community are willing to compromise liberty for short-term convenience. I am disgusted by people like this, and by Novell's betrayal of the community today.

Red Hat supports causes that matter like providing the original seed money for Creative Commons. Or being a key partner in the anti-software patent movement during the miraculous last-minute turnaround at the European Parliament last year. I am proud to be part of an organization that demonstrates such moral and ethical commitment.

But ultimately, Red Hat cannot change the world alone. That is why the Fedora Project exists. We want to enable the community to work together to improve FOSS at a rapid pace, in partnership with the large and consistent contributions from our engineers. We strongly believe that this is the most effective way for the entire FOSS movement to advance. Yes, we made some big mistakes in our community relationship earlier, but we are learning, and continue to improve at an ever accelerating pace.

For these reasons that I urge the FOSS community to support the Fedora Project through volunteer contributions of time and effort. Or if you lack time to contribute, please consider monetary donations toward any of the shared causes that we are fighting for.

Contribute to Fedora
The Fedora Project needs your contributions in many ways. If you know how to make RPM packages, you can become a maintainer in Fedora Extras where you can contribute your favorite FOSS software into the central repository for all to benefit. We have many opportunities for even non-developers to get involved. We need help with things like Documentation, Artwork, or promoting Fedora in the Ambassadors team. Even simply using Fedora, responsibly reporting bugs in Bugzilla, and helping each other helps the entire community.

Donations
The Fedora Project does not need your money[1], but I hope that you would consider donating to one of the major charities that fight for your liber

That URL no longer has the most up-to-date information. Please use a URL from the community site fedoraproject.org like http://fedoraproject.org/static-tmp/.

That is a static page that should load faster than the usual wiki page.

"I tried to address that myth -- the "Fedora is just a trial ground for RHEL" statement"

It's only it is *not* a myth.

I really like Joe 'Zonker' Brockmeier's assertion at http://os.newsforge.com/print.pl?sid=06/04/10/2156 233 : "Fedora founder Warren Togami's "Welcome to Fedora" talk dealt with the history of Fedora, and how Fedora operates. Togami spent a fair amount of time emphasizing how important Fedora is to Red Hat's business, and trying to dispel the notion that Fedora is only a "perpetual beta" for Red Hat's enterprise products. This was tricky, since Fedora _is_ a perpetual beta for Red Hat's enterprise products."

Indeed, the fact that you are trying to hide Red Hat's track on this it's fastly changing my mind about the project: I am one of those that time after time goes with the "Fedora is just a trial ground for RHEL" statement, well, not exactly, since I say "Fedora is THE trial ground for RHEL" (the difference albeit subtile is VERY important), trying to avoid bad temper derivated from the fact that Fedora badly fails at people that approach it under wrong assumptions (you just have to see the comments on this article) and expecting to help those looking at Fedora to take out most benefit from it, but now, I'm seeing you are trying to take advantage after the fact that so much people is using Fedora for the wrong reasons to enwiden your user-base, so expect me counter-acting by saying that Fedora is (partly, at least) a fraud. It still *IS* the trial ground for RHEL but now I have to add: beware, it is a lockin strategy from Red Hat Inc. so newcomers get used on a redhatish platform that will NEVER acomplish production-grade quality so, once you are tied to it you must move into RHEL products for whatever serious enterprises you attempt in the future.

Just a pill:
"In addition to the nine board members, there is also a chairman appointed by Red Hat, who has veto power over any decision." (from http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Board)

That's a *fact*, anything else (...but we will try not to use our veto-power, we are good guys, etc.) are just words.

Do you expect Fedora going in ANY MANNER against Red Hat Inc.'s best interests (like... making it lose the sell of any single RHEL license)?

Anyway, that's really an old thread. I can certainly be wrong, but we can go back to jun 2003 to say what my opinions were back then here http://barrapunto.com/comments.pl?sid=35398&cid=19 9047 or here http://barrapunto.com/comments.pl?sid=41775&cid=30 8108 . Both links are from the Spanish Slashdot "brother". Anyone can judge how wrong I were/am.

Found this in the Release Summary:

Arguably the most useful new feature in Fedora Core 6 are the improvements that have been made to Anaconda, the Fedora installer. At install-time, the user can specify third-party repositories, and if the install is network-aware, Fedora can reach out to those repositories and pull in additional packages. The obvious use case is accessing Fedora Extras, marking Fedora Core 6 as the release that tightens the integration between Core and Extras at install-time.

It doesn't mention updates, but since there's no technical difference between extras and updates -- just a policy on what goes into them -- it looks promising. Once I finish downloading the isos I'll have to try it out on a spare box and see what it does.

Funny, but you can do this:
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/YumUpgradeFaq

Simply use this rpm instead of the one on that site.
http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux /core/6/i386/os/Fedora/RPMS/fedora-release-6-4.noa rch.rpm

Dont forget to do yum update before and after.

To avoid this, check out the schedule - though of course this should be easier to find from the Fedora site's front page...

The modified version of KDE that ships in Fedora 6 is really buggy and unpolished. There's been talk for two years about placing KDE in Fedora Extras so that it will be better supported by the dedicated KDE community, but Redhat seems to keep refusing the help and treating KDE apps as second-class citizens.

Some of the Fedora 6 changes (like taking away MP3 playing capability from KDE music players) are justified on a legal basis, but other changes (like using a 4-year old window decoration and widget styles) are at best the result of ineptitude or at worst a deliberate attempt to make KDE look bad and outdated.

go to http://torrent.fedoraproject.org/

that should have the torrents and should not be impacted by the issues on fedoraproject.org or redhat.com

thanks,
-sv

As someone always comments on Fedora's (and by proxy, Red Hat's) multimedia support, here it is from the horse's mouth:

15.3. MP3, DVD, and Other Excluded Multimedia Formats
Fedora Core and Fedora Extras software repositories cannot include support for MP3 or DVD video playback or recording. The MP3 formats are patented, and the patent holders have not provided the necessary patent licenses. DVD video formats are patented and equipped with an encryption scheme. The patent holders have not provided the necessary patent licenses, and the code needed to decrypt CSS-encrypted discs may violate the Digital Millennium Copyright Act, a copyright law of the United States. Fedora also excludes other multimedia software due to patent, copyright or license restrictions, including Adobe's Flash Player and and Real Media's Real Player. For more on this subject, please refer to http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/ForbiddenItems.

While other MP3 options may be available for Fedora, Fluendo now offers a free MP3 plugin for GStreamer that has the necessary patent license for end users. This plugin enables MP3 support in applications that use the GStreamer framework as a backend. Fedora does not include this plugin since we prefer to support and encourage the use of patent unrestricted open formats instead. For more information about the MP3 plugin, visit Fluendo's website at http://www.fluendo.com/.

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Legacy

Fedora Legacy is still supporting Redhat 7.3 and Redhat 9 with updates. Sure, you can't get support for Fedora Core 1 or Fedora Core 2, but I wouldn't be so hasty to say nobody is doing it.

I could download an application, run it, have it trash my user folder, add some things to my .profile, etc. The truth is that the current 'security' on just about every system out there is a joke if you consider intentionally running a (secretly) malicious application a security problem.

Well, there's at least one project to do this kind of thing, which got taken up by a popular distribution. The fancy security certified OSes have been doing MAC for a long time. Now it's more a case of getting them distrubted and creating profiles for well behaved apps. It's a big project though, as modelling the 1000s of programs in a normal Linux distribution is harder than the 10s of apps a secure government computer might see.

We've got gnome 2.16 in the latest nightly buildes (rawhide) of Fedora Core 6, and it will ship in the final FC6 bits when we release in October

Hopefully you've heard about the Usability SIG that one Fedora contributor recently started. He needs help from the community in getting it off the ground, but if it gets traction it could help solve some of the problems to which you refer. If you'd like to pitch in, you can find the SIG's page here. (The SIG's principal is not a native English speaker, so please excuse any usage oddities there.)

Yes, If I can help you in anyway, feel me to drop me a mail. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/RahulSundaram

Max Spevack is NOT the lead developer. He is the board leader for Fedora. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/MaxSpevack

Can it really be a partnership when one partner retains full legal control?
Sure. Legal administration is many cases handled by a single party. Sun with Openoffice.org , Canonical with Ubuntu and so on. Moreover Fedora doesnt ship any packages with questionable licenses or patent issues as a matter of idealogy and not just legal problems. Otherwise shipping many gratis proprietary packages wouldnt be a issue at all. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Packaging/Guidelines and http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Objectives for details.
Ubuntu's Dapper Drake will be supported for five years. Obviously, Ubuntu does not see the same conflict between cutting edge and stability as RedHat.
In a way they did. Dapper Drake was delayed was six weeks or so for precisely this reason and had explicit goals to not introduce any new features during the development tree Only Dapper Drake is long term supported in all the Ubuntu releases so far and the next release is being done in a very short time with "risky" new stuff to compensate for the lock down in the previous release.

Can it really be a partnership when one partner retains full legal control?
Sure. Legal administration is many cases handled by a single party. Sun with Openoffice.org , Canonical with Ubuntu and so on. Moreover Fedora doesnt ship any packages with questionable licenses or patent issues as a matter of idealogy and not just legal problems. Otherwise shipping many gratis proprietary packages wouldnt be a issue at all. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Packaging/Guidelines and http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Objectives for details.
Ubuntu's Dapper Drake will be supported for five years. Obviously, Ubuntu does not see the same conflict between cutting edge and stability as RedHat.
In a way they did. Dapper Drake was delayed was six weeks or so for precisely this reason and had explicit goals to not introduce any new features during the development tree Only Dapper Drake is long term supported in all the Ubuntu releases so far and the next release is being done in a very short time with "risky" new stuff to compensate for the lock down in the previous release.

For me, one of the things that would move Linux from being a great development machine to a great desktop machine is the inclusion OpenGL based windowing system. The smooth window animation, the ability to shrink all the window to thumbnails for a quick overview, snappy transparency built into every window... These things aren't necessary, but they provide some nice touches that make a user interface feel like home.
What is current plan for AIGLX? Is there going to be more collaboration with XGL? Are you working with NVIDIA to get the needed extensions in their driver so it will work with AIGLX? Do you expect that AMD's purchase of ATI will result in better Linux drivers, that can be used for this project? By what Fedora Core version would you expect to be including AIGLX by default, able to be enabled with the click of a button?

A large portion of the Fedora userbase is made up of women. They are often under-represented within the community, with many people not even realizing how big a share of the community they are. The Fedora Women program aims to improve that representation and to provide a forum for the women of the Fedora Community.

Note the "is made up of women". That's not talking about getting women to use Fedora. It's talking about women already using Fedora.

It also says:

Lady contributors to the Fedora Project can add their wiki homepages to the CategoryWomen category. The CategoryWomen page can be used to locate them, along with other Fedora Women pages.

Note the "contributors". It's not talking about pushing women into contributing. It's talking about women who are already contributing.

It also says:

Women who are interested in working with the Fedora Project can work with Fedora Women to get started. They can also work through the Fedora Mentors project to get assistance for every step. For more information about working with the Fedora Project, see these resources:

Note the "who are interested in working with the Fedora Project". It's not talking about pushing women into getting interested in Fedora. It's talking about women who are already interested in contributing.

So this is not the project to get the girls away from their cooking and sewing, haranguing them into instead developing driver patches even though they'd rather be knitting baby booties, that all too many of the responses seem to be treating it as.

This makes a lot of sense.

And, of course, if something sounds plausible, it must be true....

Men have an inate drive to be creative because unlike women, they are unable to create life.

Are you sure all men have an innate drive to be creative, rather than to, say, sit on the sofa and watch sports?

I don't think we should try to be pushing people into doing things that they don't want to do.

And where exactly is that happening here? The Wiki page for Fedora Women says:

A large portion of the Fedora userbase is made up of women. They are often under-represented within the community, with many people not even realizing how big a share of the community they are. The Fedora Women program aims to improve that representation and to provide a forum for the women of the Fedora Community.

I don't see any "HEY GIRLS CHECK THIS FEDORA CORE THING OUT!" message there - they speak of women already using Fedora.

It also says:

Women who are interested in working with the Fedora Project can work with Fedora Women to get started.

Note the "who are interested" part.

I'm amazed there's no mention of this yet, with all the fuss about XGL and Compiz recently...
The FC development repo (so I assume FC6T1 has it as well) includes AIGLX, a different approach to the accelerated desktop thing. The metacity that comes with Core has support for a few effects (like wobbling windows), but if you want to try the cube and othe compiz goodies, Kristian has an RPM of compiz for AIGLX here. Just install it and voilá: eye candy goodness.

Ubuntu? It's years behind Fedora in case of security... *sigh*

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Security/Features
https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-hardened/ 2006-June/000150.html

I'm not talking about the DVD and MP3 stuff as that is not installed by default in a lot of distros (DVD especially). I'm saying that Fedora has fewer packages available for it than other distros which is why people still run into problems installing stuff on it. eg.

Fedora OS + Extras + Livna + Dag (RPMForge) = ~6000 unique packages (ftp://mirror.linux.duke.edu/pub/fedora/linux/core /5/i386/os/Fedora/RPMS + http://fedoraproject.org/extras/5/i386/repodata/ + http://rpm.livna.org/fedora/5/i386/ + http://dag.wieers.com/home-made/apt/)

Mandriva main + contrib + PLF = ~13000 unique packages (urpmq --list | wc -l)

Debian stable = 15490 unique packages (Debian.org)

Gentoo = nearly 11000 in portage (http://gentoo-portage.com/Statistics)

I just installed Fedora Core 4 and 5 (see below) on my daughter's Winbook W235 http://www.winbook.com/notebooks/w/w_overview.html . This is a very nice machine for $900 with a wide screen, DVD writer, 512M, and an 80G drive. It uses an Intel motherboard with the 855GM graphics adapter and 2200 wifi. As you note you'll need to install the Intel firmware, either from Livna http://rpm.livna.org/ or directly from Intel's site on Sourceforge http://ipw2200.sourceforge.net/firmware.php. Once I had the firmware installed, I could configure the wireless card with the included utilities in GNOME or KDE, and I didn't have to play with ndiswrapper or any other kludge.

The screen is more problematic. The 855 (and later 900+) adapters support a number of resolutions, but they weren't recognized by the normal drivers. The screen on this machine is 1280x768, but an out-of-the-box install forced it to 1024x768 which resulted in very ugly fonts. Luckily there's a little utility out there called 855resolution http://perso.wanadoo.fr/apoirier/ that you can load in rc.local and kick the adapter into other modes. Once I installed that, the KDE "Display" control saw the new resolution, and the Fedora desktop looked as nice as the Windows one.

We don't play games on this machine (we're both console types), so I can't speak for its graphics performance. It works great with Xine, though; movies and anime in the widescreen aspect ratio look terrific. Since I run KDE, I use the arts drivers to handle sound; they work fine.

OK, now for the big problem. FC4 installed just fine off the DVD, but FC5 would not install at all. (I've filed a bug report with the Fedora folks.) I finally installed FC5 by installing FC4 first, then running a system upgrade from the FC5 repositories http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/YumUpgradeFaq. This worked fine; it just added a few hours to the installation since yum had to update a couple thousand RPMs.

Finally, here's a hint if you buy a laptop like this one with Windows pre-installed. First, download and boot a copy of the Knoppix live CD or DVD http://www.knopper.net/. Once it's up and running, run "qtparted" from the command prompt. This is a nice graphical frontend to parted that will allow you to resize your partitions without having to buy something like Partition Magic. If you've used the Windows partition at all, I'd recommend running its disk optimizer to push all the Windows files to the front of the partition. Then you can lop off a chunk at the back for Linux.

For the second year, the Fedora Project is participating in the Summer of Code as well.

See this page for more details.

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/OLPC

According to the Foundation page at the Fedora wiki, the Foundation was supposed to do more than that. The first bullet point at the Fedora Project wiki describes the Foundation as "a non-profit entity to organize and manage volunteers." Correct me if I'm wrong, but the OIN wasn't designed to organize and manage Fedora volunteers, so there isn't that much redundancy. In one of the articles about the creation of the Foundation, Red Hat general counsel Mark Webbink says that the Foundation was intended to maintain autonomous control of the distribution: "We feel that we are now at a point where we need to give up absolute control. We built our company on the competence of the open-source community and it's time for us to continue to manifest that." Red Hat is getting rid of the Foundation because no longer feels that it can reasonably "give up absolute control" and OIN is only partially relevant. The truth of the matter is that giving up control would be financially detrimental to the Fedora project as well as Red Hat itself, and Red Hat has realized that non-profit status would limit their potential for contribution. Despite that, Red Hat could still create a board that favors the community rather than their own interests without having to create a foundation at all. In my opinion, Red Hat has dealt with this poorly not because they gave up on the idea of a foundation, but because they revoked the autonomy of the community at the same time. Some people came to the Fedora project after the creation of the Foundation was announced because they thought that they would have the opportunity to determine the course of development. By taking autonomy away from the community now, Red Hat has taken advantage of those people.

You forgot some of the most important ones, namely they coded and maintain the entire 2.6 linux CPU Scheduler and the 2.6 Virtual Memory Manager. Yes, you can contribute a large part of 2.6's great performance to Red Hat. They also wanted an open source Java implementation so they started GCJ to compile java code natively. Open Source runs all the down from the top to bottom at Red Hat, even one of their VP's is the guy who originally coded the GNU C++ compiler. Here are two non-complete lists of other projects Red Hat either entirely codes and maintains, or contributes large portions of code to, keep in mind that they don't list everything: Sourceware Projects and Red Hat Contributions. This move by Red Hat has been given a bad spin by those reporting it, the Fedora Foundation's expenses and other requirements would have killed off Fedora, if anyone read the e-mail they'd see that as it is all clearly laid out including some numbers. Its good to see not everyone is buying into the sensationalist headlines and /. trolls though.
Regards,
Steve