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my wife filed a complaint with the BBB and the next day the manager of the place was ready to clean her shoes with his tongue.

Making good on the `lifetime warranty' memory very well may cost the Chip Merchant money, so the results are quite likely to be very different.

So, I suspect you're just being a naysayer.

But, either way, it costs nothing to file a complaint, and it may have positive results.

For example, you may remember this fiasco a few years ago, where Best Buy sold a bunch of GF4 Ti4600 cards for $139, but wouldn't deliver them. The BBB was contacted repeatedly, and did nothing, even though this was exactly the sort of case where one would have thought that they should have done something. The many complaints made weren't even showing up on as complaints against Best Buy on the BBB site, when they certainly should have (even if the complaints were without merit, which they were not.) Remember, it's the business who pays the BBB, and the BBB is a business looking to make a profit like any other, and their #1 duty is to their customer (the company), not to you.

Is this just another excuse to dislike a major corporation because they obviously hired a moron?

You mean like this? No. Please god no. I think it's widely acknowledged that this is much better.

And of course they can't make it an 1/8" bigger, then it might look like this!

FWIW, I have an XBox and it's good at what it does, but that initial controller design was hideous. Despite what test audiences may say.

Ok so they hate me. Big fucking deal what are they going to do - refuse to sell me something? Act rude? Be hard to track down a sales rep? Not take my money?

Yeah, they'll probably just cancel the pre-orders like they have before, and then have you arrested if you try to pick up your oder.

Best Buy has its customers arrested for such heinous offenses as trying to get the advertised price on an item.

If you want an Aiero, get it somewhere else.

You can't just go around making claims like that!

Atleast, not without backing it up!

-r

You can't just go around making claims like that!

Atleast, not without backing it up!

-r

"In reality, all people want out of SSL is encryption. The decision to trust the business in question is always going to be the customer's and that decision will not be influenced by who signed the cert."

This just begs the question...why? Why doesn't the BBB or some similar consumer protection group issues certs? None of the certification authorities mentioned in this thread give a damn about consumers, and that's no great secret. So if I see a verisign cert, your right, it has no bearing on the quality of the merchant...but if I see a BBB cert, I could reasonably assume it's not some fly by night rip-off artists.

(Before you even say it...yes, I know the BBB is funded by retailers, and has ignored consumer complaints in the past.)

Talk about the pot calling the kettle black...

You speak as if the Better Business Bureau is some sort of stand-alone group that has some sort of teeth to it. Do you know who pays their bills? The big companies that you want to complain about. If you want to see the BBB at "work" check out this page detailing the ongoing hassles with Best Buy and the GeForce 4 debacle.

Forget about the BBB.

The worst part of this all is that the "new" price of $399 is horrible. They are also trying to shirk with a $30 coupon. Link below.

Here are a few links to show you how to find a deal on this card, Vision Tek part number 30001522 :

Pricewatch Search for 30001522

Tip on searching Pricewatch (my favorite); the url format is: [http://brook.pricewatch.com/search/search.asp?cri teria=item_criteria_here]

Streetprices Search for 30001522

Pricegrabber Search, I don't like Price-grabber, but its here to show that even a crappy Shylock engine is better than Worst Buy ©(TM)®.

BEST BUY charged with FRAUD:
Best Buy & HRS Credit Insurance Fraud to their customers. Big Ripoff Scam!

Story also covered here:
http://www.theinquirer.net/10020202.htm

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/54/24005.html

http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/19176/

http://courses.wcupa.edu/jredingt/BestBuy.htm

http://www.hardocp.com/

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/archive/24041 . tml Worst Buy Highway Robbery Inc. Trying to give only $30 bucks for mistake.

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/articles/bes tbuy_gf4deal.html

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/articles/bb_ arrest.html

http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2002/4/24/11357/3033 .

I have had horrible experience with them as well. I won't even go into it, but they tried to do something fraudulent and were obstinate about owning up to it.

The worst part of this all is that the "new" price of $399 is horrible. They are also trying to shirk with a $30 coupon. Link below.

Here are a few links to show you how to find a deal on this card, Vision Tek part number 30001522 :

Pricewatch Search for 30001522

Tip on searching Pricewatch (my favorite); the url format is: [http://brook.pricewatch.com/search/search.asp?cri teria=item_criteria_here]

Streetprices Search for 30001522

Pricegrabber Search, I don't like Price-grabber, but its here to show that even a crappy Shylock engine is better than Worst Buy ©(TM)®.

BEST BUY charged with FRAUD:
Best Buy & HRS Credit Insurance Fraud to their customers. Big Ripoff Scam!

Story also covered here:
http://www.theinquirer.net/10020202.htm

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/54/24005.html

http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/19176/

http://courses.wcupa.edu/jredingt/BestBuy.htm

http://www.hardocp.com/

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/archive/24041 . tml Worst Buy Highway Robbery Inc. Trying to give only $30 bucks for mistake.

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/articles/bes tbuy_gf4deal.html

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/articles/bb_ arrest.html

http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2002/4/24/11357/3033 .

I have had horrible experience with them as well. I won't even go into it, but they tried to do something fraudulent and were obstinate about owning up to it.

The worst part of this all is that the "new" price of $399 is horrible. They are also trying to shirk with a $30 coupon. Link below.

Here are a few links to show you how to find a deal on this card, Vision Tek part number 30001522 :

Pricewatch Search for 30001522

Tip on searching Pricewatch (my favorite); the url format is: [http://brook.pricewatch.com/search/search.asp?cri teria=item_criteria_here]

Streetprices Search for 30001522

Pricegrabber Search, I don't like Price-grabber, but its here to show that even a crappy Shylock engine is better than Worst Buy ©(TM)®.

BEST BUY charged with FRAUD:
Best Buy & HRS Credit Insurance Fraud to their customers. Big Ripoff Scam!

Story also covered here:
http://www.theinquirer.net/10020202.htm

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/54/24005.html

http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/19176/

http://courses.wcupa.edu/jredingt/BestBuy.htm

http://www.hardocp.com/

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/archive/24041 . tml Worst Buy Highway Robbery Inc. Trying to give only $30 bucks for mistake.

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/articles/bes tbuy_gf4deal.html

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/articles/bb_ arrest.html

http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2002/4/24/11357/3033 .

I have had horrible experience with them as well. I won't even go into it, but they tried to do something fraudulent and were obstinate about owning up to it.

I had a similar Problem with Buy.COM and there was a class action lawsuit and 3 years later I got a $60 coupon for my troubles. I would have liked to have gotten a $50 Hitachi monitor for th $163 dollars they promised it for.

It has been committed in history FORVER, here:
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&frame=right& th=5c9f98e92d07422b&seekm=36C0A7EF.7AF4%40uclink4. berkeley.edu#link1

I have had horrible experience with them as well. I won't even go into it, but they tried to do something fraudulent and were obstinate about owning up to it.

The worst part of this all is that the "new" price of $399 is horrible.

Here are a few links to show you how to find a deal on this card, Vision Tek part number 30001522 :

Pricewatch Search for 30001522

Tip on searching Pricewatch (my favorite); the url format is: [http://brook.pricewatch.com/search/search.asp?cri teria=item_criteria_here]

Streetprices Search for 30001522

Pricegrabber Search, I don't like Price-grabber, but its here to show that even a crappy Shylock engine is better than Worst Buy ©(TM)®.

BEST BUY charged with FRAUD:
Best Buy & HRS Credit Insurance Fraud to their customers. Big Ripoff Scam!

Story also covered here:
http://www.theinquirer.net/10020202.htm

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/54/24005.html

http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/19176/

http://courses.wcupa.edu/jredingt/BestBuy.htm

http://www.hardocp.com/

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/archive/24041 . tml Worst Buy Highway Robbery Inc. Trying to give only $30 bucks for mistake.

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/articles/bes tbuy_gf4deal.html

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/articles/bb_ arrest.html

http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2002/4/24/11357/3033 .

I had a similar Problem with Buy.COM and there was a class action lawsuit and 3 years later I got a $60 coupon for my troubles. I would have liked to have gotten a $50 Hitachi monitor for th $163 dollars they promised it for.

It has been committed in history FORVER, here:
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&frame=right& th=5c9f98e92d07422b&seekm=36C0A7EF.7AF4%40uclink4. berkeley.edu#link1

I have had horrible experience with them as well. I won't even go into it, but they tried to do something fraudulent and were obstinate about owning up to it.

The worst part of this all is that the "new" price of $399 is horrible.

Here are a few links to show you how to find a deal on this card, Vision Tek part number 30001522 :

Pricewatch Search for 30001522

Tip on searching Pricewatch (my favorite); the url format is: [http://brook.pricewatch.com/search/search.asp?cri teria=item_criteria_here]

Streetprices Search for 30001522

Pricegrabber Search, I don't like Price-grabber, but its here to show that even a crappy Shylock engine is better than Worst Buy ©(TM)®.

BEST BUY charged with FRAUD:
Best Buy & HRS Credit Insurance Fraud to their customers. Big Ripoff Scam!

Story also covered here:
http://www.theinquirer.net/10020202.htm

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/54/24005.html

http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/19176/

http://courses.wcupa.edu/jredingt/BestBuy.htm

http://www.hardocp.com/

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/archive/24041 . tml Worst Buy Highway Robbery Inc. Trying to give only $30 bucks for mistake.

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/articles/bes tbuy_gf4deal.html

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/articles/bb_ arrest.html

http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2002/4/24/11357/3033 .

I had a similar Problem with Buy.COM and there was a class action lawsuit and 3 years later I got a $60 coupon for my troubles. I would have liked to have gotten a $50 Hitachi monitor for th $163 dollars they promised it for.

It has been committed in history FORVER, here:
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&frame=right& th=5c9f98e92d07422b&seekm=36C0A7EF.7AF4%40uclink4. berkeley.edu#link1

I have had horrible experience with them as well. I won't even go into it, but they tried to do something fraudulent and were obstinate about owning up to it.

The worst part of this all is that the "new" price of $399 is horrible.

Here are a few links to show you how to find a deal on this card, Vision Tek part number 30001522 :

Pricewatch Search for 30001522

Tip on searching Pricewatch (my favorite); the url format is: [http://brook.pricewatch.com/search/search.asp?cri teria=item_criteria_here]

Streetprices Search for 30001522

Pricegrabber Search, I don't like Price-grabber, but its here to show that even a crappy Shylock engine is better than Worst Buy ©(TM)®.

BEST BUY charged with FRAUD:
Best Buy & HRS Credit Insurance Fraud to their customers. Big Ripoff Scam!

Story also covered here:
http://www.theinquirer.net/10020202.htm

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/54/24005.html

http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/19176/

http://courses.wcupa.edu/jredingt/BestBuy.htm

http://www.hardocp.com/

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/archive/24041 . tml Worst Buy Highway Robbery Inc. Trying to give only $30 bucks for mistake.

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/articles/bes tbuy_gf4deal.html

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/articles/bb_ arrest.html

http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2002/4/24/11357/3033 .

I have had horrible experience with them as well. I won't even go into it, but they tried to do something fraudulent and were obstinate about owning up to it.

The worst part of this all is that the "new" price of $399 is horrible.

Here are a few links to show you how to find a deal on this card, Vision Tek part number 30001522 :

Pricewatch Search for 30001522

Tip on searching Pricewatch (my favorite); the url format is: [http://brook.pricewatch.com/search/search.asp?cri teria=item_criteria_here]

Streetprices Search for 30001522

Pricegrabber Search, I don't like Price-grabber, but its here to show that even a crappy Shylock engine is better than Worst Buy ©(TM)®.

BEST BUY charged with FRAUD:
Best Buy & HRS Credit Insurance Fraud to their customers. Big Ripoff Scam!

Story also covered here:
http://www.theinquirer.net/10020202.htm

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/54/24005.html

http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/19176/

http://courses.wcupa.edu/jredingt/BestBuy.htm

http://www.hardocp.com/

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/archive/24041 . tml Worst Buy Highway Robbery Inc. Trying to give only $30 bucks for mistake.

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/articles/bes tbuy_gf4deal.html

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/articles/bb_ arrest.html

http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2002/4/24/11357/3033 .

I have had horrible experience with them as well. I won't even go into it, but they tried to do something fraudulent and were obstinate about owning up to it.

The worst part of this all is that the "new" price of $399 is horrible.

Here are a few links to show you how to find a deal on this card, Vision Tek part number 30001522 :

Pricewatch Search for 30001522

Tip on searching Pricewatch (my favorite); the url format is: [http://brook.pricewatch.com/search/search.asp?cri teria=item_criteria_here]

Streetprices Search for 30001522

Pricegrabber Search, I don't like Price-grabber, but its here to show that even a crappy Shylock engine is better than Worst Buy ©(TM)®.

BEST BUY charged with FRAUD:
Best Buy & HRS Credit Insurance Fraud to their customers. Big Ripoff Scam!

Story also covered here:
http://www.theinquirer.net/10020202.htm

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/54/24005.html

http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/19176/

http://courses.wcupa.edu/jredingt/BestBuy.htm

http://www.hardocp.com/

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/archive/24041 . tml Worst Buy Highway Robbery Inc. Trying to give only $30 bucks for mistake.

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/articles/bes tbuy_gf4deal.html

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/articles/bb_ arrest.html

http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2002/4/24/11357/3033 .

I have had horrible experience with them as well. I won't even go into it, but they tried to do something fraudulent and were obstinate about owning up to it.

The worst part of this all is that the "new" price of $399 is horrible.

Here are a few links to show you how to find a deal on this card, Vision Tek part number 30001522 :

Pricewatch Search for 30001522

Tip on searching Pricewatch (my favorite); the url format is: [http://brook.pricewatch.com/search/search.asp?cri teria=item_criteria_here]

Streetprices Search for 30001522

Pricegrabber Search, I don't like Price-grabber, but its here to show that even a crappy Shylock engine is better than Worst Buy ©(TM)®.

BEST BUY charged with FRAUD:
Best Buy & HRS Credit Insurance Fraud to their customers. Big Ripoff Scam!

Story also covered here:
http://www.theinquirer.net/10020202.htm

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/54/24005.html

http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/19176/

http://courses.wcupa.edu/jredingt/BestBuy.htm

http://www.hardocp.com/

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/archive/24041 . tml Worst Buy Highway Robbery Inc. Trying to give only $30 bucks for mistake.

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/articles/bes tbuy_gf4deal.html

http://hypothermia.gamershardware.com/articles/bb_ arrest.html

http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2002/4/24/11357/3033 .

Here's a strange one... we found an Advertisement at BestBuy.com yesterday that proclaimed "VisionTek GeForce4 Ti4600 for Special Pre-Order Price of $129.00..the savings is a $200.00 Value". Normally a "typo" or mistake would be something to the effect of a misplaced decimal point or an accidental wrong price. It usually doesn't consist of adding terms like Special Pre-Order Price and savings is a $200.00 Value, ( since it sounds reasonable $129.00 + $200.00 savings for a card announced that day with no real set price yet ) all over the advertisement. So we did the right thing and CALLED. BestBuy.com confirmed the price of $129.00 twice, at which time they gave us the $200.00 value / saving quotes. After a whole day of ordering, they reneged on the deal and cancelled all orders. The money has yet to be refunded. I have made a sign-up page for all of you that placed orders with Best Buy so that we may get as many people taken care of as possible. I have been in contact with them all day....

I purchased two SNES systems and two N64 systems. One game each. The SNES and Street Fighter II was for my nephew to play at home and at my house, and the N64 was for my niece to play Diddy Kong racing here and at home. Oddly enough, they never wanted more games for them, which I thought was odd.

If I ever have a kid of my own, Nintendo will be the console to buy.

Overclockers.com has a lot of helpful hints out there for rolling your own, as well as reviews on prefab stuff. I drilled my own HDD and PS coolers (actually, I brought a case of beer in and watched one of the guys do it for me, but anyhow...)

With a bit of digging, hardocp, hypothermia, and anyone else looking at case mods will probably have a lot of user submitted ideas as well.

If you are running really hot, the Koolance case is probably not for you. I have not tried one of these.

Good airflow in your case helps too. I was able to improve airflow by rounding my SCSI & FDD cables. Look at ducting the air within your case using larger (but slower RPM) fans to move air over trouble spots. Worked for me, but I am not super cooling with peltiers or the likes. I run cooler with the case on and the air ducted, then leaving the case off.

NVidia might have good video cards, but their way of handling themselves really sucks. Check here.

I can only shake my head after reading Hypothermia's summary. Did he have the same conversation he posted on his site? Are the Slashdot posters reading the same thing I read? This is what I saw in that conversation:

Here at NVIDIA we have over 60 people in marketing and unfortunately, someone who thought he was doing the correct thing was not. The contract that is on Hypothermia (sp?) is a document that we use for corporate to corporate promotions.
Translation: Someone here really f**cked up. (Note lack of apology).

Let's say if and OEM would like to do a banner for a show this agreement assures us that we have top billing with that promotion.
Then why is there all this text in the agreement about web sites? What does this have to do with a show?

Whatever you review is whatever you review...we've never asked anyone to pull a review for competitive reasons.
Yeah, but you guys sure have no problem pressuring reviewers into biasing for your card's strengths.

I feel really bad in your situation, because for the last 7 months you have been misled by a non-NVIDIA employee (intern, contractor, etc...). To Hypothermia, who had thought that this was an accurate PR rep, I apologize and for all of the grief/headache this has caused I apologize for that too.
What kind of company allows this to happen? Is NVIDIA such a loose operation as to allow non-NVIDIA employees to use their corporate email? Note that this does not satisfactorily explain Hypothermia's situation, because in the evolution of this whole ordeal Hypothermia clearly states that he spoke to at least two different people.

So this apology means nothing to me because none of Derek's explanations hold water. The apology I see only really applies to allowing someone to impersonate an NVIDIA employee.

All the opinions expressed above do not necessarily represent those of my employer.

I can only shake my head after reading Hypothermia's summary. Did he have the same conversation he posted on his site? Are the Slashdot posters reading the same thing I read? This is what I saw in that conversation:

Here at NVIDIA we have over 60 people in marketing and unfortunately, someone who thought he was doing the correct thing was not. The contract that is on Hypothermia (sp?) is a document that we use for corporate to corporate promotions.
Translation: Someone here really f**cked up. (Note lack of apology).

Let's say if and OEM would like to do a banner for a show this agreement assures us that we have top billing with that promotion.
Then why is there all this text in the agreement about web sites? What does this have to do with a show?

Whatever you review is whatever you review...we've never asked anyone to pull a review for competitive reasons.
Yeah, but you guys sure have no problem pressuring reviewers into biasing for your card's strengths.

I feel really bad in your situation, because for the last 7 months you have been misled by a non-NVIDIA employee (intern, contractor, etc...). To Hypothermia, who had thought that this was an accurate PR rep, I apologize and for all of the grief/headache this has caused I apologize for that too.
What kind of company allows this to happen? Is NVIDIA such a loose operation as to allow non-NVIDIA employees to use their corporate email? Note that this does not satisfactorily explain Hypothermia's situation, because in the evolution of this whole ordeal Hypothermia clearly states that he spoke to at least two different people.

So this apology means nothing to me because none of Derek's explanations hold water. The apology I see only really applies to allowing someone to impersonate an NVIDIA employee.

All the opinions expressed above do not necessarily represent those of my employer.

Look at the second link: Hypothermia.

There's your direct evidence blow by blow.

She is nearly perfect...super hot...and either smart enough to come up with that stuff her self or at least smart enough to hire someone who can (I hear shes really smart though) another perfect woman



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